What about mounting on some sort of scale so we can get idea of what kind of thrust she has, that way as you do changes to engines, you can see what has best results.
Hell yeah! I plan on building a static test stand soon. Using a load cell out of a bathroom or postage scale, and an Arduino to log the load cell data.
Hey ElementalMaker! Long, long ago I used to make these sugar rockets and I came up with a dimensionless quantity that allows you to scale up to about as large as you want without trial and error. The basic premise is that the ratio of the burning surface area to the nozzle area determines the pressure. I used to use pressed powder (here you're melting it) so our numbers may be a bit different. But I found that: 300 always exploded, 250 exploded 50%, 200 exploded about 10%, and 150 never exploded. The higher the ratio, the more power, but the greater the danger of exploding. I'm sure you can do the math yourself, but here's a quick example. Let's say you drill to depth H, your ID is D, and your nozzle ID is N. To make the calculation simpler, we'll also assume that you drilled all the way to the end of the fuel (otherwise there is a hemisphere of area you need to add). We want to calculate: ( max area of burning fuel ) / ( area of nozzle ) ( area of bore ) / ( area of nozzle ) ( pi * D * H ) / ( pi/4 * N^2 ) ( magic ratio) I'm not much of a youtuber myself, but I've gotten 1" ID rockets to work (using a ratio of 170). I had plans to go bigger, but unfortunately I ran out of space as these went quite high. (For some simple numbers, my 1" rocket used, D=1", H=3.65", N=5/16". Since I left fuel above H, I also had the hemisphere in my area calculation.) I suspect as one goes bigger you may need to go to lower and lower ratios, but that's easy to do in the math. Best of luck! I'd really like to see someone try to go to 2". P.S. When these start to get bigger, making sure to ignite the entire bore is critical. Igniting just the bottom can result in long fizzles.
Either the nozzle composition, or the geometry of it. You have a knife's edge where the 2 pieces meet, but if you were to leave some of the cylindrical shaft exposed in-between that would give you a sturdier exhaust hole. Probably wouldn't need much, 2mm or so should do.
I actually had about 3/16" of cylindrical nozzle region between the convergent and divergent nozzle sections, so I was really surprised to see that amount of erosion. I am also considering that I may have too high a paraffin wax percentage in my nozzle composition, I am going to try knocking it down about 50% to see it that helps limit erosion.
Would you be able to go with out the clay nozzle. And just form it out of your comp. Like we do in black powder rockets. Just thought it would be interesting to see.
@@AtlasReburdened I would also like to see this, though I think with the high pressure and speed of the gasses, it'd just start flinging the glass particles out.
KNSB doesn't have quite the power required for a nozzle-less rocket. I might be do-able with the right motor size and maybe some red iron oxide catalyst, but it wouldn't be as easy as with BP.
They are great to learn on, and they hold resell value pretty well. Before you know it you'll be looking for used South bend lathes for greater precision and capacity. Such a great tool to have!
hello element maker, I to have been working on rocket engines for a few years, I found your videos very helpfull, it helpped slve some problems i had, i dont quite have the machinery like you but i have reach some good results. i'm sure its cold where you are, i do appreciate some of your humor too.
sweet your stepping up to the same specs ,you made me many yrs ago, i believe the cores are 3/8ths ,and my nozzle and core tool are the same piece ,try milling up a 60/30/10 bp mix for bp motors much more thrust and not hygroscopic, those bigger ones really sound mean too,one day Ill post a video of the 1" motors.I use plain ole bentonite clay.not kitty litter ,I got some stuff used for buety masks from a cosmetic supply.its like dust and rock hard when rammed.Dont be afraid to use a 3lb sledge when ramming,I made sleeves out of pvc with slits running length wise and use hose clamps to secure the tubes during ramming ,this way I can beat the snot out of them without bursting them and am sure of solid packing
@@ElementalMaker yeah dude but you should see those things take off they sound like a V2 rocket and fill the street with smoke and can lift a pop can full of sand. the 2/4" are my fav though cuz I get 1/2 thick tubes from Meijers from the produce isle for free. they dont cato ,lol
I've made my nozzles from 60% finely powdered fire clay, 30% finely powdered ceramic grog(available at any ceramic or potters shop) and 10% Bentonite(Kitty litter) as a binder. Then add in about 6-10% of the final mix weight with Gulf cooking wax and blend all together. Works well, compresses great and very smooth, but still experimenting!
The erosion is good for doing a solid single core. So building these type of motors the fuel burns faster with higher pressures. With your design it's a progressive burn. Meaning the surface area of the fuel grows as it burns. So if you keep the nozzle size the same the pressure will raise really fast and become a Cato. Lot of people don't understand Kn. This is surface area of fuel burning to nozzle area calculation. This is why I went to Bates grains. I can make them a equal burn and then add washers into my rockete nozzles. James Yawn has a Kn calculator. Richard Nakka is a lot of good reading about experimental sugar motors and composits. Jacobs rocketry has motor specs that work good and you can input them into the calculator to get an idea of Kn and pressure. Hope this helps I started making sugar motors after Make magazine had a article about it! Boy was it a learning experience! Good luck, thanks for the vids!
Great info thanks a bunch! I love James Yawns site, he was my inspiration for getting into rocketry way back when he first put his site up. I think I'm going to move into the bates gain world shortly. I need to test all the reloadable cases I made years ago
Do you have oil or petroleum jelly in you nozzle-clay? Maybe rosin as binder? About 2-4% by weight can improve nozzle life. I used a close-fitting sleeve over the rocket-tube when ramming; the clay will upset outward into the paper, but the paper can't do anything expect get compressed between the sleeve and the clay. Old rocketeers trick, part II: assume erosion, estimate 'standard' amount of erosion and make your throat slightly under sized to compensate. Throat erodes, but ends up closer to 'ideal' in the end. I miss making these things...
That was beautiful, I know nothing about rocketry but that nozzle seemed to make a good path for the burning propellant. Even better if it didn't erode away i presume.
Love the vids.. Can u suggest some parts we can use if we dont have access to a metal shop?.. I live in an apartment and im getting bored with small " A,B,C" size motors..
Unfortunately I dont think this is something that can be safely attempted in an apartment given the risk to others. There are rocketry tooling kits for sale online that you could purchase and use, but I would definitely recommend finding a safe area to work before attempting.
Yes,your very right.. i can make the standard r-candy ones but that's about it.. Thanks for the reply and keep making those vids.. Your content is great!... J
you'd be surprised how much the aluminum erodes. i just machined a set of reusable nozzles for a customer to use in 2" i.d. gerbs. the one he sent me for specs was pretty wrecked.
For the nozzle, try “Durham’s Water Putty” to resist erosion. I used it on a few large sugar rockets with great success. It is mixed w water but dries very quickly and u could use your existing setup to form it. But lube the setup first so it won’t stick :)
Instead of bentanite (think it would still work if pure and pressed enough) I've had good results with Dura-Rock or expanding cement, what's the name ?Kwick-crete? and use a washer at the thinnest part of throat.
I bought a bunch many years ago from a guy selling them through a rocketry forum. Not sure where to get them nowadays, but I am sure they are out there.
Absolutely! I have machined many graphite nozzles in the past. Graphite would certainly hold up much better than the bentonite clay / grog mix, but would be a pita to implement in disposable motors like this one.
I am curious who make the "crappy metal lathe" you keep referencing. My google search came up empty. I am getting a workshop setup and a "small" lathe would be nice if you have any thoughts they would be appreciated. Great videos!
Its a Cummins 7x12 mini lathe. Cummins Tools is no longer in business from what I can see, but its pretty much identical to any of the other Chinese 7x12 mini lathes.
I bought a bunch many years ago from a guy selling them through a rocketry forum. Not sure where to get them nowadays, but I am sure they are out there.
On the nozzel erosion I sandwich in a stainless steel washer between the covergent and divergent. This reduces wear to a minimum, it's also a common pratice in many of the larger Dia engines. The only other way is molded JB Wielded top coatings, a big hassle easier preformed on larger nozzles (time consuming)
Ive thought about going with the washer, but given these engines are disposable I am trying to hone in on my nozzle composition to reduce erosion. I am going to try adding some Al2O3 and other various refractories to see if I cant improve the erosion.
May have to go to machined graphite nozzle. Graphite has a huge temperature life and resistance. And yes, I think if the vessel can contain the pressure, the graphite fuel may be the way to go with a machined graphite nozzle. A result from all is still a result! Take care from Oklahoma, Mike and Vee
Mine is about 14 years old and nearing the point of being useless it has gotten so worn out. When I can afford it, I hope to get an old used south bend metal lathe. Overall though, it has been a fun machine to learn on.
@@ElementalMaker awesome. I will keep an eye out on something better but it's the size I really like. So I might just go with one of those and spend some money upgrading it.
@@x9x9x9x9x9 keep an eye out on Craigslist and FB Marketplace. You can probably find one cheap if you check every week or so. I just saw a guy selling one for $125 which would be absolutely worth it.
Looks like your nozzle die can be a little smaller. Good methodology to make it larger to begin with. There is nozzle ratio calculations out there somewhere... I made a die set like this years ago without a lathe...much worse precision but it worked ok. I used brown clay from the earth. Good material. You could add a little aluminum ( for more oomf) to the mix and leave the nozzle the same size. I used to like adding magnalium flake for a cranky rocket. Get an old car water pump housing and drill at it with a large drill....coat them in shellac varnish so they remain stable over time.
the 1lb. (.75") and 3 lb. (1") tooling i make uses half the tube i.d. where the divergent meets the spindle and usually a 1 degree taper over the spindle length.
u kinda missed the oppertunity for a belt unknockliung noise when you said " im gonna polish my shaft now " but other than that great video again edit: at 8:20 xD you missed the oppertunity to say "looks like i just polished my shaft"
I make engines using the same fuel, using 1" grey pvc conduit. I use rockite expanding anchoring cement cast in the tube as my nozzle. I drill three holes in the side of the tube, insert screws through the tube protruding into the sides of where the nozzel will be. Then I cast the nozzle "plug" I cut the screws off flush with the OD of the tube. the screw help to anchor the nozzle I then use my lathe to machine the divergent side and have a custom-made boring bar bit ( a form tool) to do the convergent side inside the tube. Believe it or not, HSS will machine rockite if it is sharp and will leave a nice finish that can even be polished with sandpaper. I have yet had a nozzle erode or blow out. even the cap has yet to blow out. no explosions either.
Why attach it to plywood? wouldnt it be better to use some kind of weight on an arm so that you can calculate the thrust? i dont think it would be too hard to rig something up for that.
through talking with some really experienced pyro guys, its best if you use straight kitty litter in its gravel form, no grinding. you then load it little by little in the tube, ramming it really hard each time then it leaves you with a not as pretty but incredibly resistant nozzle
@@ElementalMaker I did the charcoal foundry thing many, many years ago. Learned a lot, now I used forced air and used french fry oil from a local restaurant. Is it hot? yup, was heating up some bronze to pour and stirring with a steel rod, got distracted only to find the steel had melted into the crucible.
You said you’re in the Northeast, AVE is in B.C. You two NEED to get together and do a video! The two of you would make an awesome duo. Similar jokes too......
Great video. Wosh i jad a small metal lathe like that so i could machine my own tooling because they are mad expensive. I jabe all the stuff right now for pyro rockets. I can make strone rockets and so on amd so forth bit habe no tooling yet. Have all the chems and rocket tubes needed, but no tooling lol. I just happen to have it because i build shells so naturally i have all the chems i would need.
It'd be cool if someone made some stl files for your kit. That way people without a lathe could just 3D print it in plastic. Won't look as nice, but I'm sure it would hold up fine at a high infill setting.
I can definitely put together some CAD files! I'm not sure how well the 3D printed parts would hold up, but if you wanna try I'll make the solid models!
I like rockets in the morning,the evening,fuckit i always like em! btw to make that motor asap(as strong as possible) add some red iron oxide really kicks it, + you got a lil lucky ramming that endplug havin the rocket NOT on the spindle XD that can crack so easily,Thumbs up man,keep em coming, i love rockets!
I like all of your content, and the practical nature of your posts. That being said, You really shouldn't be using a steel claw hammer in your example. I know you are striking aluminum, which is non-sparking. But still, a plastic dead blow would be safer, and would deform your rammers less.
Wheres the fun is just buying everything already made for you? Why not just buy your rockets premade too.... In all sincerity though I am quite familiar with Woodys and they make some very quality rocket tooling.
I didn’t mean any disrespect! You were saying people are always asking you to sell your spindle and rammers. So I just posted that people can find them on woodys rocks.
Loving n learning about rockets , my sons getting into them lol . The only thing is when u try to sound posh ur trying to sound english or like a Londoner, the turm brit is tbh for the true brits welsh n scots :p
Aspirin, potassium perchlorate and red iron oxide...whistle mixture! The aspirin forms a pressure sensitive mixture with the oxidizer, but it has a negative burn rate. The higher the pressure, the slower the burn! Burn rate slows due to pressure, the pressure drops which in turn raises the burn rate, increasing the pressure again. Lather, rinse, repeat. Some mixes scream, like whistling fireworks, others have a low note, kinda like a fart or a roar. Example? Russian Kayatusha rocket battery...the roaring is due to low-pitched whistling: ua-cam.com/video/gcKhS7ly8ig/v-deo.html Some freshly made mixes will whistle/fart/strobe in a loose pile, most the time you need some confinement during burn. Like in the convergent section of yer nozzle! Almost forgot; whistle mixes burn fast, so use an end-burner! A core-burn with whistle mix is an unpredictable flying fire-cracker.
I'd definitely paid more attention in science class if we were doing shit like this!
What about mounting on some sort of scale so we can get idea of what kind of thrust she has, that way as you do changes to engines, you can see what has best results.
Hell yeah! I plan on building a static test stand soon. Using a load cell out of a bathroom or postage scale, and an Arduino to log the load cell data.
Hey ElementalMaker! Long, long ago I used to make these sugar rockets and I came up with a dimensionless quantity that allows you to scale up to about as large as you want without trial and error.
The basic premise is that the ratio of the burning surface area to the nozzle area determines the pressure. I used to use pressed powder (here you're melting it) so our numbers may be a bit different. But I found that: 300 always exploded, 250 exploded 50%, 200 exploded about 10%, and 150 never exploded. The higher the ratio, the more power, but the greater the danger of exploding.
I'm sure you can do the math yourself, but here's a quick example. Let's say you drill to depth H, your ID is D, and your nozzle ID is N. To make the calculation simpler, we'll also assume that you drilled all the way to the end of the fuel (otherwise there is a hemisphere of area you need to add).
We want to calculate:
( max area of burning fuel ) / ( area of nozzle )
( area of bore ) / ( area of nozzle )
( pi * D * H ) / ( pi/4 * N^2 )
( magic ratio)
I'm not much of a youtuber myself, but I've gotten 1" ID rockets to work (using a ratio of 170). I had plans to go bigger, but unfortunately I ran out of space as these went quite high. (For some simple numbers, my 1" rocket used, D=1", H=3.65", N=5/16". Since I left fuel above H, I also had the hemisphere in my area calculation.) I suspect as one goes bigger you may need to go to lower and lower ratios, but that's easy to do in the math.
Best of luck! I'd really like to see someone try to go to 2".
P.S. When these start to get bigger, making sure to ignite the entire bore is critical. Igniting just the bottom can result in long fizzles.
Holy smokes thanks for all the info! Very good formula threre as well!
@@ElementalMaker I've been waiting years to dump this on someone's sugar rocket videos and I figured you'd have the best chance at using it.
Either the nozzle composition, or the geometry of it. You have a knife's edge where the 2 pieces meet, but if you were to leave some of the cylindrical shaft exposed in-between that would give you a sturdier exhaust hole. Probably wouldn't need much, 2mm or so should do.
I actually had about 3/16" of cylindrical nozzle region between the convergent and divergent nozzle sections, so I was really surprised to see that amount of erosion. I am also considering that I may have too high a paraffin wax percentage in my nozzle composition, I am going to try knocking it down about 50% to see it that helps limit erosion.
Would you be able to go with out the clay nozzle. And just form it out of your comp. Like we do in black powder rockets. Just thought it would be interesting to see.
I wonder if you could toss a small percentage of finely ground glass or a metal oxide into the nozzle mix and get one that sinters instead of melting.
@@AtlasReburdened I would also like to see this, though I think with the high pressure and speed of the gasses, it'd just start flinging the glass particles out.
KNSB doesn't have quite the power required for a nozzle-less rocket. I might be do-able with the right motor size and maybe some red iron oxide catalyst, but it wouldn't be as easy as with BP.
The flooring guys were nice enough to leave me two 12'x4" tubes, 1/4" thick walls... Good video! Great Tips. ..hey i got the same lathe..
Great video and humorous commentary, thanks!
P.S. Be careful when polishing your rod, sometimes they will go off in your hand when doing that...
I finally got a cheap harbor freight lathe for this. Now to spend a month learning how to use it. Great video by the way!
They are great to learn on, and they hold resell value pretty well. Before you know it you'll be looking for used South bend lathes for greater precision and capacity. Such a great tool to have!
hello element maker, I to have been working on rocket engines for a few years,
I found your videos very helpfull, it helpped slve some problems i had, i dont quite have the machinery like you but i have reach some good results. i'm sure its cold where you are, i do appreciate some of your humor too.
sweet your stepping up to the same specs ,you made me many yrs ago, i believe the cores are 3/8ths ,and my nozzle and core tool are the same piece ,try milling up a 60/30/10 bp mix for bp motors much more thrust and not hygroscopic, those bigger ones really sound mean too,one day Ill post a video of the 1" motors.I use plain ole bentonite clay.not kitty litter ,I got some stuff used for buety masks from a cosmetic supply.its like dust and rock hard when rammed.Dont be afraid to use a 3lb sledge when ramming,I made sleeves out of pvc with slits running length wise and use hose clamps to secure the tubes during ramming ,this way I can beat the snot out of them without bursting them and am sure of solid packing
Yeah not quite to that crazy size, but getting there! I still remember turning that spindle and just thinking how insane it was 😂
@@ElementalMaker yeah dude but you should see those things take off they sound like a V2 rocket and fill the street with smoke and can lift a pop can full of sand. the 2/4" are my fav though cuz I get 1/2 thick tubes from Meijers from the produce isle for free. they dont cato ,lol
@@MrKclo42112 shoot me a video of a few of them! I wanna hear those bad boys blast off!
yeah I want to make some visco rockets too, if it ever stops fucking raining and snows. Im gona have to drain my damn pool again
love these rocket video's, it's inspiring me to make some myself!
Stay safe!
Good to see that you know how to properly take care of your spindle. Too bad the throat got damaged.
As Marvin would say "Where's the kaboom? There was supposed to be an Earth-Shattering Kaboom!" - Marvin the Martian
😂
Yeppers
I didn't say that!
Just plain, old fashioned fun my friend !
Thanks!
8:20. Lmao. I thought you were gonna say something like...."a huge old load of shaft sauce"... but you didn't great video brother
Im loving the rocket videos. Always happy to see you on my video feed. Keep up the great work
I've made my nozzles from 60% finely powdered fire clay, 30% finely powdered ceramic grog(available at any ceramic or potters shop) and 10% Bentonite(Kitty litter) as a binder. Then add in about 6-10% of the final mix weight with Gulf cooking wax and blend all together. Works well, compresses great and very smooth, but still experimenting!
Oh yes! Seeing that lathe brings back memories!
This video turned out to be pretty dang suggestive, what with the polishing of shafts designed for ramming and the white goop being rammed inside
I have no idea what you might be suggesting. This all sounds like normal rocket sciencey stuff to me.
@@ElementalMaker XD
Fascinating!
Hi Elemental. Great video. What is the composition of the nozzle clay mix?
The erosion is good for doing a solid single core. So building these type of motors the fuel burns faster with higher pressures. With your design it's a progressive burn. Meaning the surface area of the fuel grows as it burns. So if you keep the nozzle size the same the pressure will raise really fast and become a Cato. Lot of people don't understand Kn. This is surface area of fuel burning to nozzle area calculation.
This is why I went to Bates grains. I can make them a equal burn and then add washers into my rockete nozzles. James Yawn has a Kn calculator. Richard Nakka is a lot of good reading about experimental sugar motors and composits. Jacobs rocketry has motor specs that work good and you can input them into the calculator to get an idea of Kn and pressure.
Hope this helps I started making sugar motors after Make magazine had a article about it! Boy was it a learning experience!
Good luck, thanks for the vids!
Great info thanks a bunch! I love James Yawns site, he was my inspiration for getting into rocketry way back when he first put his site up. I think I'm going to move into the bates gain world shortly. I need to test all the reloadable cases I made years ago
8:28 I expected toothpaste to be honest. Cake frosting sounds much better though
Any chance you can mount a stainless steel washer in the nozzle so it will not erode?
Another good show!
Thanks Jason!
Is this bentonite clay? Is there any water in it? How can this hold up?
Just asking for a friend😅😄
Do you have oil or petroleum jelly in you nozzle-clay?
Maybe rosin as binder?
About 2-4% by weight can improve nozzle life.
I used a close-fitting sleeve over the rocket-tube when ramming; the clay will upset outward into the paper, but the paper can't do anything expect get compressed between the sleeve and the clay.
Old rocketeers trick, part II: assume erosion, estimate 'standard' amount of erosion and make your throat slightly under sized to compensate.
Throat erodes, but ends up closer to 'ideal' in the end.
I miss making these things...
I'm using about 10% by mass paraffin wax melted into the bentonite grog mix.
Where can one buy dies like the ones in the video if we dont have a lathe?
There's a guy online who sells nice stainless rocket rolling pretty cheap. I think it's woodys rocks or something like that
From what was the propellent made off?
That was beautiful, I know nothing about rocketry but that nozzle seemed to make a good path for the burning propellant. Even better if it didn't erode away i presume.
the purpose of nozzle is to make hot expanding gasses go very fast
@@linecraftman3907 makes sense, like a water hose nozzle focusing the water stream
Love the vids.. Can u suggest some parts we can use if we dont have access to a metal shop?.. I live in an apartment and im getting bored with small " A,B,C" size motors..
Unfortunately I dont think this is something that can be safely attempted in an apartment given the risk to others. There are rocketry tooling kits for sale online that you could purchase and use, but I would definitely recommend finding a safe area to work before attempting.
Yes,your very right.. i can make the standard r-candy ones but that's about it.. Thanks for the reply and keep making those vids.. Your content is great!... J
What about machining a nozzle out of aluminum so the exit hole won't erode and will stay the consistent diameter?
That would be possible, but alot of work and expense for a throw away rocket motor.
ElementalMaker true, unless you make a giant rocket powered reusable lawn dart.
you'd be surprised how much the aluminum erodes. i just machined a set of reusable nozzles for a customer to use in 2" i.d. gerbs. the one he sent me for specs was pretty wrecked.
Great video
For the nozzle, try “Durham’s Water Putty” to resist erosion. I used it on a few large sugar rockets with great success. It is mixed w water but dries very quickly and u could use your existing setup to form it. But lube the setup first so it won’t stick :)
I need to try that stuff! Keep hearing great things!
Make a cart wheel and put lots of strontium in the mix for extra effects ;)
Ever heard of a prig launcher?
love your stuff, thanks for the videos
What would you to be doing other than hammering the tip of your shaft?
Instead of bentanite (think it would still work if pure and pressed enough) I've had good results with Dura-Rock or expanding cement, what's the name ?Kwick-crete? and use a washer at the thinnest part of throat.
Do you have a link for the heavy wall tubes?
I bought a bunch many years ago from a guy selling them through a rocketry forum. Not sure where to get them nowadays, but I am sure they are out there.
Hey William, found the seller of the tubes. looks like he still has them! ihaveadotcom.com/cart/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=72_118
@@ElementalMaker, way cool! Going to get a few of these on the way.
Loved it
I didn't know Lucifer was capable of love. This must be some kind of breakthrough! LOL
Yes sir shananigans and things that go boom 💥 are my porn lol
Could you machine your own nozzle, or cast one from a high temp resin? Or is the pressure from the propellant causing the deformation?
Absolutely! I have machined many graphite nozzles in the past. Graphite would certainly hold up much better than the bentonite clay / grog mix, but would be a pita to implement in disposable motors like this one.
Go team ramrod
I am curious who make the "crappy metal lathe" you keep referencing. My google search came up empty. I am getting a workshop setup and a "small" lathe would be nice if you have any thoughts they would be appreciated. Great videos!
Its a Cummins 7x12 mini lathe. Cummins Tools is no longer in business from what I can see, but its pretty much identical to any of the other Chinese 7x12 mini lathes.
Thank you!
New to your channel. You say the shit all men think. You remind me of... Me. Awesome videos
Where do you get your heavy wall tubing ?
I bought a bunch many years ago from a guy selling them through a rocketry forum. Not sure where to get them nowadays, but I am sure they are out there.
1:35 lol too real... My flatmate yesterday summed up
Great vid
Very interesting vid! I really enjoyed it!
Greetings, Professor
Where could you or if you have a blueprint of a rocket-making tool?
If you don't mind.
Thanks in advance
That nozzle looks so good it should be illegal!
Why don't you measure thrust with mechanical scales? Also what about distance ignition charges? Shouldn't be that hard to make
I am going to be making a static test stand soon with a load cell & arduino or raspberry pie to log the data
@@ElementalMaker even better! Excited to see how that will work out (or not)
On the nozzel erosion I sandwich in a stainless steel washer between the covergent and divergent. This reduces wear to a minimum, it's also a common pratice in many of the larger Dia engines. The only other way is molded JB Wielded top coatings, a big hassle easier preformed on larger nozzles (time consuming)
Ive thought about going with the washer, but given these engines are disposable I am trying to hone in on my nozzle composition to reduce erosion. I am going to try adding some Al2O3 and other various refractories to see if I cant improve the erosion.
May have to go to machined graphite nozzle. Graphite has a huge temperature life and resistance. And yes, I think if the vessel can contain the pressure, the graphite fuel may be the way to go with a machined graphite nozzle.
A result from all is still a result!
Take care from Oklahoma,
Mike and Vee
How do you like that cheap lathe? ThisOldTony did a video on one of those and it made me think about getting one.
Mine is about 14 years old and nearing the point of being useless it has gotten so worn out. When I can afford it, I hope to get an old used south bend metal lathe. Overall though, it has been a fun machine to learn on.
@@ElementalMaker awesome. I will keep an eye out on something better but it's the size I really like. So I might just go with one of those and spend some money upgrading it.
@@x9x9x9x9x9 keep an eye out on Craigslist and FB Marketplace. You can probably find one cheap if you check every week or so. I just saw a guy selling one for $125 which would be absolutely worth it.
@@ElementalMaker awesome! Thanks for the info. Also I did join your patreon btw.
Ever thought about building a fusor? You certainly seem like you could do it, and would be interesting to see your take on it.
I would LOVE to build a fusor some day! I just need a much better vacuum pump and HV powder supply.
I hate it when my shaft is dry and being rubbed. Thanks for the chuckle.
Looks like your nozzle die can be a little smaller. Good methodology to make it larger to begin with. There is nozzle ratio calculations out there somewhere... I made a die set like this years ago without a lathe...much worse precision but it worked ok. I used brown clay from the earth. Good material. You could add a little aluminum ( for more oomf) to the mix and leave the nozzle the same size. I used to like adding magnalium flake for a cranky rocket. Get an old car water pump housing and drill at it with a large drill....coat them in shellac varnish so they remain stable over time.
the 1lb. (.75") and 3 lb. (1") tooling i make uses half the tube i.d. where the divergent meets the spindle and usually a 1 degree taper over the spindle length.
Awesome!
Will you please set off one of the bigger rockets in a future video? With some colored smoke so we can see it in the camera? Thank you so much.
u kinda missed the oppertunity for a belt unknockliung noise when you said " im gonna polish my shaft now " but other than that great video again
edit: at 8:20 xD you missed the oppertunity to say "looks like i just polished my shaft"
Durham's Rock Hard Water Putty makes a good nozzle, and can be found in hardware stores.
fan bloody tastic thanks
Yay thank you!
Polish your shaft and shine your knob...... the joys of manhood 👍
👍
You could use sodium silicate instead of wax as a binder in the nozzle. Also get rid of the sharp edge
Very cool idea!
Rocket polishing?
You don't polish your rocket regularly?
@@ElementalMaker Absolutely! Need to keep it at it's optimum to reduce wind resistance.
I make engines using the same fuel, using 1" grey pvc conduit. I use rockite expanding anchoring cement cast in the tube as my nozzle. I drill three holes in the side of the tube, insert screws through the tube protruding into the sides of where the nozzel will be. Then I cast the nozzle "plug" I cut the screws off flush with the OD of the tube. the screw help to anchor the nozzle I then use my lathe to machine the divergent side and have a custom-made boring bar bit ( a form tool) to do the convergent side inside the tube. Believe it or not, HSS will machine rockite if it is sharp and will leave a nice finish that can even be polished with sandpaper. I have yet had a nozzle erode or blow out. even the cap has yet to blow out. no explosions either.
Why attach it to plywood? wouldnt it be better to use some kind of weight on an arm so that you can calculate the thrust? i dont think it would be too hard to rig something up for that.
Working on an arduino based static test stand right now. Should be able to log the rocket thrust 80 times per second so I'm hoping for some good data
ElementalMaker that should be really cool cant wait to see it!
Don’t let it go to your head, but I love that rocket engine jig. For the record I would totally let go to my head.
Haha thanks John!
I use Armstrong water pudy for nozzles it works well
Yeah that stuff works great as well!
Maybe a Little Powdered Glass in the Nozzel mix ? , Or, Crush-Up old Broken cups or Dishware as a Possible Additive to the Nozzle. Mix ???
through talking with some really experienced pyro guys, its best if you use straight kitty litter in its gravel form, no grinding. you then load it little by little in the tube, ramming it really hard each time then it leaves you with a not as pretty but incredibly resistant nozzle
You should try making a charcoal metal foundry, it can reach nice temperatures and charcoal is cheaper
I had one years ago and they certainly work great! But I just hated dealing with all the ash and embers flying everywhere
@@ElementalMaker I did the charcoal foundry thing many, many years ago. Learned a lot, now I used forced air and used french fry oil from a local restaurant. Is it hot? yup, was heating up some bronze to pour and stirring with a steel rod, got distracted only to find the steel had melted into the crucible.
You said you’re in the Northeast, AVE is in B.C. You two NEED to get together and do a video! The two of you would make an awesome duo. Similar jokes too......
I friggin love your video's, man I'd love to be your neighbor, but I already said that.
Haha thanks man! Glad your enjoying the content!
Could you do a video on making smoke bombs?
Great video. Wosh i jad a small metal lathe like that so i could machine my own tooling because they are mad expensive. I jabe all the stuff right now for pyro rockets. I can make strone rockets and so on amd so forth bit habe no tooling yet. Have all the chems and rocket tubes needed, but no tooling lol. I just happen to have it because i build shells so naturally i have all the chems i would need.
Small Hobby Lathes are Avalable from Walmart -( You'll need a small grinder to sharpen your cutting tools !
It'd be cool if someone made some stl files for your kit. That way people without a lathe could just 3D print it in plastic. Won't look as nice, but I'm sure it would hold up fine at a high infill setting.
I can definitely put together some CAD files! I'm not sure how well the 3D printed parts would hold up, but if you wanna try I'll make the solid models!
I love the video wish I could do what you do lol stay save:D
I love the smell of rocket fuel in the morning!
Do you also do the AVE channel?
I like rockets in the morning,the evening,fuckit i always like em!
btw to make that motor asap(as strong as possible) add some red iron oxide really kicks it, + you got a lil lucky ramming that endplug havin the rocket NOT on the spindle XD that can crack so easily,Thumbs up man,keep em coming, i love rockets!
Inconel?
Try forming the nozzle from waterbased clay and firing it.
You mean water putty? Or modeling clay?
Creek bank clay, the grey stuff.
I like all of your content, and the practical nature of your posts. That being said, You really shouldn't be using a steel claw hammer in your example. I know you are striking aluminum, which is non-sparking. But still, a plastic dead blow would be safer, and would deform your rammers less.
You can buy ALL this stuff already made form “Woodys Rocks”. We make “6 pounders” all the time. And they go a few thousand feet high on black powder.
Wheres the fun is just buying everything already made for you? Why not just buy your rockets premade too.... In all sincerity though I am quite familiar with Woodys and they make some very quality rocket tooling.
I didn’t mean any disrespect! You were saying people are always asking you to sell your spindle and rammers. So I just posted that people can find them on woodys rocks.
@@fineartonfire_5327 LOL I was just kidding around. Woodys is a great site for Pyro tooling
"we don't make mistakes, just happy little accidents"
Dwelve?
Yeah that's a word right 👍
LOL, Keep this video out of the hands of Feminist, as some of them have real bad shaft envie.
Great work!
Did you say "Dwelve"?
Yweah that's ewinglish right?
@@ElementalMaker It sure isn't Spanish. lol. Loved the video. Keep-em coming!
@@esmithiii2003 ¿No hablas Español? LOL
Even the fuse was like “fuck it’s cold.”
LOL truth!
Yess
Loving n learning about rockets , my sons getting into them lol . The only thing is when u try to sound posh ur trying to sound english or like a Londoner, the turm brit is tbh for the true brits welsh n scots :p
God Bless Merica. 💥🚀🇬🇧🇺🇸🍺💥
"....obviously not operator error...."
Okay, senator.
Haha 👍
I've wanted to build my own rocket motors since I was a teenager over a half a century ago and got tired of paying Estes' high prices.
Aspirin, potassium perchlorate and red iron oxide...whistle mixture!
The aspirin forms a pressure sensitive mixture with the oxidizer, but it has a negative burn rate. The higher the pressure, the slower the burn!
Burn rate slows due to pressure, the pressure drops which in turn raises the burn rate, increasing the pressure again. Lather, rinse, repeat.
Some mixes scream, like whistling fireworks, others have a low note, kinda like a fart or a roar.
Example? Russian Kayatusha rocket battery...the roaring is due to low-pitched whistling: ua-cam.com/video/gcKhS7ly8ig/v-deo.html
Some freshly made mixes will whistle/fart/strobe in a loose pile, most the time you need some confinement during burn.
Like in the convergent section of yer nozzle!
Almost forgot; whistle mixes burn fast, so use an end-burner!
A core-burn with whistle mix is an unpredictable flying fire-cracker.
Wow I've only seen the benzoate based whistle comps. Never heard of using aspirin! Crazy cool thanks so much for sharing!
Yay am early af.... Like comment and enjoy the show....
Thank you!
everyone says hes the chemistry AvE, but more appropriately he should be EvE
Huh?
AvE stands for Arduino vs everything
Ahhh gotcha!
@@agentjwa Arduino vs Evil
@@CM-xr9oq lol yeah, i was watching "how to make everything", streams crossed
If you do black powder rockets... try this. Don't use any clay for the nozzle ... just 100% black powder. See what you get.
I've made quite a few nozzleless BP rockets on the large spindle. Work like a charm!
You should have glued it to a pipe with a pressure gauge attached
Check out my other video where I build an arduino load cell static thrust test stand.