Something tells me that this wouldn't actually hold up in court. It blatantly ignores the spirit of the law and tries to skirt around it based on the flimsiest of technicalities.
I think it's more like when the poor soul gets busted with it, they can say the product they marketed which wasn't a firearm wasn't those things either...
@jfangm How do you reason that? The Arty Luger had a long barrel, adjustable rear sights and a detachable shoulder stock. That sounds very proto-PDW to me
I was actually one of the first 25 people to get one of these back when it was the MP17. I actually got to do a little "R&D" for Alex at Flux. Basically we had a correspondence where I took a dremel and removed material from my MP17 FCU bedding to make an X5 Legion trigger fit and function and gave them documentation of what I did and how much I removed from where. While what I contributed was miniscule, I can technically say that I helped the tiniest bit with the development of what became the Flux Raider. They even gave me a free Raider. My old MP17 started developing a hairline crack in the back of the chassis and I wanted to retire it from EDC to protect it. At the time, Raider chassises were always out of stock and being scalped on gun broker for like $1200-$1600. I reached out to Alex and asked if they could set one aside to let me buy. I didn't hear anything back, but a week later, a freaking Flux Raider just showed up on my porch. I carry mine every day still. It's handsdown the biggest game changer in pistols. I suck with pistols but I can rapidly make head sized groups at 50-75 yards all day long.
Dude I forgot about that! That’s awesome. The Legion wasn’t out yet when we designed the MP17 so we didn’t know they were gonna make the longer flat faced triggers. - Alex from Flux.
@overtimealex69 holy shit dude!! I always meant to tell you thank you so much for the Raider. I actually proposed to my now wife with that MP17, she said yes. We were gonna mail you guys a bunch of cookies and a big thank you card telling you how thankful we were, but everything got crazy hectic right after that because we moved. We both carry ours all the time. We've got a son now that I can't wait to train to shoot my Raider. I know what I did really wasn't much, but I always felt kind of honored to be able to tell people I had like the tiniest contribution to a really sick gun's development. You guys are awesome man!
I suspect it's because of the development of cheap, effective pistol optics. If you're stuck with early-1900s-era pistol sights, having a shoulder stock doesn't really get you much unless you're trying to shoot full auto, which went away in 1934. But a pistol red dot allows for easy hits at 50m+, if you have good fundamentals and take your time. A third point of contact is suddenly a major advantage and allows rapid, decently accurate hits out to 100m or so.
@greggrunschel9814 _"a shoulder stock doesn't really get you much unless you're trying to shoot full auto"_ I disagree. The use of a pistol stock, even before the advent of optical sights, offered several advantages, particularly in terms of *stability, accuracy, and control.* Of course red dots offer significant advantages over iron sights, no question, but the main reason for the success of the Flux pistol-PDW system was mentioned in the video: You can pass it off as an *accessory acquisition* for an existing service firearm, circumventing a lot of procurement bureaucracy.
@ It doesn’t really matter how stable your firing platform is if your sights consist of 3 small black bumps on top of a 7” slide. Iron sights on a long gun of that era were almost always larger, of a different layout (peep, ghostring, etc), and had a much longer sight radius than anything on a pistol. It wouldn’t surprise me if most shooters couldn’t do better than a 2 to 3 FOOT group at 100 yards with an ordinary pistol that had a stock attached. You’ll note that the famous Artillery Luger had custom-developed sights and an extra long barrel to support them.
@@greggrunschel9814 You are too single minded on this topic imo. Increased stability, accuracy, and control are also noticeable on followup shots. Not just in full auto and range.
@@JanFWeh The point is that these pistol stocks aren’t “free”. They make what would otherwise be a relatively small, light, easy-to-carry pistol into a larger, heavier, and more awkward package. They also add steps between “draw” and “fire”, thus slowing down the deployment of what is generally considered an emergency-use “shoot right now or die” weapon. So shrinking 7-yard groups from 8” to 2” is neat, but not worth the trade-off, because most of that 8” group is going to hit the bad guy anyway. Shrinking a 100-yard group from 48” to 12” means you can actually reliably land some hits at that range, which is a new capability and possibly worth the trouble. It’s like how weapon-mounted lights on pistols weren’t commonly used until both LEDs and lithium-ion batteries were invented, because that’s when they got small and bright enough to make the trade-off worth it.
So back in the day Pistols like Mauser, Luger, and Browning Hi Power had shoulder stock/usually holster thing. Now it has became a bit sophisticated but I'm genuinely surprised how those concept comes back with improvement.
I have had some experience with a Glock brace, and it was mostly trash exactly because of flexing frame issues. Change your grip slightly and zero would walk. I haven't realized Flux have addressed them at material level. Good for them.
This is why I was excited about the new Ruger RXM pistol. Now that Ruger has designed a Glock parts and Glock magazine compatible interchangeable fire control unit, with Magpul as their polymer partner, the next logical step is for them to introduce a PDW “flux” chassis that is Ruger (Glock) based.
I’ve been waiting on them to bring the Glock version back in 10mm since they discontinued it finally taught myself how to CAD and made my own improved version in 9x25 Dillon getting 2500 fps in a concealable package
@ I do, but I haven’t posted it anywhere yet. Hoping to get some ballistics gel soon and do some velocity and ballistics testing with a few different projectiles in q1 of 25. Got a ransom rest and a Garmin. Takes a long time to gather all the crap needed to do safe testing when you don’t have any kind of outside support.
@@michaelturk7237, well, there are a few Glock PDW 3d printed frames out there, there are frames for G26, 19, 17, 34/17L in the USW and Flux Raider style. 😁
The extremely neat technical details on this are superb! This is an especially interesting Mini-PDW, and that spare magazine housing makes for a solid forward grip (despite the disclaimer). Knowledgeable professionals with extensive expertise and experience have provided input to this excellent concept to make it the interesting and unique Mini-PDW that it is. I await your follow up videos with eager anticipation...
I've got a Raider and besides the fast dual mag release/spare mag system, the spring-loaded brace is my favorite feature just because of how fun it is.
@1:03 immediately reminded me of a modern-day rendition of that scene in the "Untouchables" where they wait up in that cabin with shotguns during that sting operation at the bridge.
I love this channel for it's obscure content, non-political and no comercial usage. When I first saw the thumbnail I was a bit skeptical since it's not a "true" forgotten weapon system and I had the feeling there was something over the ordinary here, and it was. Since Ian was quick and upfront that Sig more or less sponsored this video, yet being able to combine product development and cross-interest in the product, I must say this is the best "sponsored" infused gun video I've ever seen. I was skeptical at first but this is so well balanced and put together and rather feeling "buy this awesome thing" that so many other channels do, I met a interesting walkthrough. Well done Ian, this is the best way of doing such "sponsored" videos or whatever you want to call it. You knocked it out of the ballpark while staying true to this channel, bravo! EDIT: Corrected some spelling.
I would almost agree with the title.. the B&T USW with a glock 40 10mm is the best one imo.. a lot of power down range Edit: if Flux made one for the Xten 10mm I would buy it asap
@@samuelgoad7320Oh, it's going away one way or another. The word salad circle jerk has circled back around to unburdon us from what has been. They only get away with what you let them get away with, balls are required.
That's what I think is crazy about us gun laws. I'm Italian and our only restrictions are mag capacity (easily circumbented), full auto and military cartridges (it has to do with 70's terr-ism). I still can't understand why instead of ruining everything for everyone, the US gov doesn't just implement a gun licence like they do for cars, as it's done where I live. This is going to filter out any crazy person and leave only responsible sane owners
With just a little bit of practice, it's freakishly fast. You know all those pro shooters showing how fast their reloads are on UA-cam? Practice for about an hour, and it's that fast.
Finally, a good image of a bracer!! I'd thought that was how they'd look/work, but previously hadn't been able to tell fir certain from the images. Then again, I prefer the bracer concept to the Blake's 7 equivalent with the Federation's guns... Flux/Sig looks good...
The Flux Raider is indeed the best conversion kit ever and i find these conversion kits very fantastic additions. It was very ingenious of Sig to exploit the loophole of ATF's regulations because it doesn't have the specifications of an SBR and is still classifiable as a pistol.
Imagine this is what regular pistols would be in the future. This, USWA1 etc. Like, we had a stocked pistols 100 years ago and now we came back to the same concept.
Pretty soon we could be approaching material technologies that lets material to be folded like cloth while being rigid when desired. This would allow for very compact supports and braces (stocks). Could make pistol stocks very popular.
back in my day you got a MechTech and you liked it! I knew some cops that unironically carried a MechTech in the trunk of their patrol car because they were not allowed to carry carbines, rifles or shotguns at all. this was the early 2000's when that was more common, and i think most PD's at least allow a trunk shotgun now
Yes, it is that stupid. In the experimental aircraft world you cannot register an amphibious aircraft if it can take off on water and land on earth, or vice versa, the legal solution was to put a “do not operate in flight” placard on the retract switch. The FAA and DOT were fine with that
@@lostinthedesert6149 Yet more evidence that the American legal system is completely ridiculous. Does "spirit of the law" mean anything in your country?
Mr Ian, we've this expression where I'm from, instead of saying inshala we'd say "mog het troffen". It fits perfectly in that part of the narrative. It could be translated as "let it strike where it may". Thank you for your hard work. From South Africa.
To be fair, they ended up winning with the brace, and it being in such common use with AFT deciding to suddenly classify them all stocks gives us a good shot at killing off SBR laws. Sig's been a good partner in the 2A fight.
A buddy of mine has a Flux Raider, and it genuinely is a *very* well thought out system. It looks kinda gimmicky at first glance, but it's really, *really* good.
"If something like the Flux Raider had been around for the 1911, we probably would never have gotten the M1 Carbine." ...Huh. I can't find an argument against that.
Gun Jesus doing an in depth review of the raider is really cool. I'd love to have one of these things but I'm not paying $500 for one. Regardless, nice piece of hardware
To Mr. McCollum, there was something I had wanted to get your thoughts on for some time now, even though it's completely irrelevant to this video. As you know, the world's first bolt action breech loader, the Dreyse, was released in the early 1840s and fired an acorn shaped bullet at about a few hundred yards. Then you have the Minor ball, which was a comical shaped bullet that could fly several hundred yards. It can therefore be said that when it was released, the Minie rendered the Dreyse's bullet obsolete since it could fly farther. However, all rifles that could fire a Minie were percussion cap muzzleloaders which were commonly used for about a couple of decades. Even though it would be years before it saw major use, when the Dreyse was released, given it was a bolt action breechloader, it made all the Minie rifles obsolete before they were even made. Interesting, isn't it?
Have one of these that I built before they started offering the Raider X Legion and registered it as an SBR (My first NFA item). Love this thing. Great Backpacking gun or for around our camp on a sling. Standard Sig320 Slide Harrington Arms 2port Comp TLR-1 Light Holosun HSHS403 Red Dot Tactical Development Front sight replacement Charging handle Also got two sets of Mags. 2 20s and 2 30s
I have had a Flux Legion for a couple of months now and like it. I should have waited to see if they will release a suppressor ready model - it SUCKED to have to buy a new slide and barrel, and then to have to remove the rear sight to make it work with a can. Having said that, I had no issues with shooting it suppressed. I shot 250 rounds to break the gun in, added a TBAC Fly 9, and it worked with zero problems. I am a bit suspicious of all the plastic, especially the rail interface with the red dot, Aimpoint T-2, but so far no worries. It probably isn't for everyone, but if it is your thing, you will like this.
Last time I was this late, KelTec combined RFB rifle with CP 33 pistol as BullpupRoni, with the pistol being attachable/detachable and working as a trigger/selector for the main rifle too. 2 in 1 from the KelTec crackheads.
Seems to me like they would really want to put a "special" fire control group into one of these for things like VIP protection, and the high-speed low-drag operator types would probably like that too, because you never know when a situation is gonna devolve to the point you'd need something like this, and it's a lot better (if only by being lighter) than existing offerings like the G18 (with or without stock) and Berretta 93R.
There's a development step you missed. Between the 3D printed MP17 and the Raider X there was the MP17 Raider. It had minor cosmetic and ergonomic differences, such as a textured grip, no cutouts behind the safety, Coyote brown color, and I think less flaring in the mag well. The development from the MP17 Raider to the Raider X was done after Flux received feedback from guys in the 10th SFG out of Carson.
Remember when everyone thought the military was going to change to 40 S&W? When we absolutely had to have 1 pistol that could be both calibers & a dozen different frame sizes? Yeah. We got 1 horribly flawed Sig pistol and none of the rest. Another accessory for the Sig the govt isn't going to buy more than a handful of, then forget. We already have better options.
Legalese: "It's not a grip, it's a magazine warmer for those long winter nights at the range"
Lol under rated comment 👏
Something tells me that this wouldn't actually hold up in court. It blatantly ignores the spirit of the law and tries to skirt around it based on the flimsiest of technicalities.
@@no1DdC Don't worry, I watched My Cousin Vinny, it's completely legal.
@@no1DdC If the trigger guard was filled in more to prevent the thumb from wrapping around, it'd have a better chance I think.
Yeeah, tell that to a judge.
I wonder how much their legal counsel was paid for "write 'not a grip' and 'not a stock' on there and you're golden"
Not a firearm/fishing weight dispenser coming next year.
Sig: NOT A STOCK. NOT A GRIP.
ATF: 🧐😤😡
Americans: 🥰
I think it's more like when the poor soul gets busted with it, they can say the product they marketed which wasn't a firearm wasn't those things either...
Wonder how much they charged for that advice 😳
Good n' nuff 🤷♂️
Somewhere an artillery Luger is sobbing for not being mentioned here ^^'
I have one. I can consistently hit the 12" gong at 150m
This is more like the P.06 (Navy Luger) than the LP.08 (Arty Luger).
@jfangm How do you reason that?
The Arty Luger had a long barrel, adjustable rear sights and a detachable shoulder stock.
That sounds very proto-PDW to me
This is much closer to Mauser C 96 or Benke Thiemann Folding Luger Stock than arty or navy lugers.
I have plans to buy an 8" upper for my DWM Luger and a couple 32-rd snail drums and have that be my EDC.
Not great plans. Just plans.
Last time I was this early, the weapons were still remembered
Today, on Fading memory weapons
Last time I was this early this joke wasn't overused lol
Oh ahaha
I 'member
@@Harrkin The North Remembers
I was actually one of the first 25 people to get one of these back when it was the MP17. I actually got to do a little "R&D" for Alex at Flux. Basically we had a correspondence where I took a dremel and removed material from my MP17 FCU bedding to make an X5 Legion trigger fit and function and gave them documentation of what I did and how much I removed from where. While what I contributed was miniscule, I can technically say that I helped the tiniest bit with the development of what became the Flux Raider.
They even gave me a free Raider. My old MP17 started developing a hairline crack in the back of the chassis and I wanted to retire it from EDC to protect it. At the time, Raider chassises were always out of stock and being scalped on gun broker for like $1200-$1600. I reached out to Alex and asked if they could set one aside to let me buy. I didn't hear anything back, but a week later, a freaking Flux Raider just showed up on my porch. I carry mine every day still. It's handsdown the biggest game changer in pistols. I suck with pistols but I can rapidly make head sized groups at 50-75 yards all day long.
cool story bro
Dude I forgot about that! That’s awesome. The Legion wasn’t out yet when we designed the MP17 so we didn’t know they were gonna make the longer flat faced triggers. - Alex from Flux.
@overtimealex69 holy shit dude!! I always meant to tell you thank you so much for the Raider. I actually proposed to my now wife with that MP17, she said yes. We were gonna mail you guys a bunch of cookies and a big thank you card telling you how thankful we were, but everything got crazy hectic right after that because we moved. We both carry ours all the time. We've got a son now that I can't wait to train to shoot my Raider. I know what I did really wasn't much, but I always felt kind of honored to be able to tell people I had like the tiniest contribution to a really sick gun's development. You guys are awesome man!
You carry this thing every day? Seriously? A bit overkill
@@TheGhostOfPatrickHenrywipe your mouth.😂
1:03 photo appears only for fraction of a second and immediately disappears
yeah I literally had to go frame by frame just to see the picture in question
Awesome photo, Grayman Co is a great company
A wild badass Ian has appeared!
it's a little reward!
Free jumpscare!
Hes reviewing a future forgotten weapon. In 40yrs he'll be reviewing it again after it's officially forgotten
And he'll still look exactly the same 🤣
*We looped back around to pistol stocks.* 🙌🏼
I suspect it's because of the development of cheap, effective pistol optics. If you're stuck with early-1900s-era pistol sights, having a shoulder stock doesn't really get you much unless you're trying to shoot full auto, which went away in 1934. But a pistol red dot allows for easy hits at 50m+, if you have good fundamentals and take your time. A third point of contact is suddenly a major advantage and allows rapid, decently accurate hits out to 100m or so.
@greggrunschel9814 _"a shoulder stock doesn't really get you much unless you're trying to shoot full auto"_
I disagree. The use of a pistol stock, even before the advent of optical sights, offered several advantages, particularly in terms of *stability, accuracy, and control.*
Of course red dots offer significant advantages over iron sights, no question, but the main reason for the success of the Flux pistol-PDW system was mentioned in the video:
You can pass it off as an *accessory acquisition* for an existing service firearm, circumventing a lot of procurement bureaucracy.
@ It doesn’t really matter how stable your firing platform is if your sights consist of 3 small black bumps on top of a 7” slide. Iron sights on a long gun of that era were almost always larger, of a different layout (peep, ghostring, etc), and had a much longer sight radius than anything on a pistol. It wouldn’t surprise me if most shooters couldn’t do better than a 2 to 3 FOOT group at 100 yards with an ordinary pistol that had a stock attached. You’ll note that the famous Artillery Luger had custom-developed sights and an extra long barrel to support them.
@@greggrunschel9814 You are too single minded on this topic imo.
Increased stability, accuracy, and control are also noticeable on followup shots. Not just in full auto and range.
@@JanFWeh The point is that these pistol stocks aren’t “free”. They make what would otherwise be a relatively small, light, easy-to-carry pistol into a larger, heavier, and more awkward package. They also add steps between “draw” and “fire”, thus slowing down the deployment of what is generally considered an emergency-use “shoot right now or die” weapon. So shrinking 7-yard groups from 8” to 2” is neat, but not worth the trade-off, because most of that 8” group is going to hit the bad guy anyway. Shrinking a 100-yard group from 48” to 12” means you can actually reliably land some hits at that range, which is a new capability and possibly worth the trouble.
It’s like how weapon-mounted lights on pistols weren’t commonly used until both LEDs and lithium-ion batteries were invented, because that’s when they got small and bright enough to make the trade-off worth it.
3:56 "Tossing rounds off inshallah" is my new motto at the range
Lol with the hand gestures as well!?
Gun Jesus confirmed to be gigabased (for the 467th time now)
Ensha Allah. If God (the fake one) Wills it to be. Or if it’s God’s (the fake one) Will.
@@jastrapper190 What fake one?
Allah is just the Arabic word for God. @@LargeBanana
Sig: NOT A STOCK. NOT A GRIP.
ATF: 🧐😤😡
Americans: 🥰
That usage of Inshallah was on point and had me giggling !
Me too lol
Special Muslim Easter egg
@@muhammadowaismalik3451Question: Do Arabic-speaking Christians also use the term in everyday speech?
@@SvenElven Based on something I read a while back it has become more of a cultural phrase in some countries rather than a religious saying.
@@SvenElven Yes, because these words predate Islam.
Future “Forgotten Weapons”
Ian getting ahead of the game.
that reload mag release thingy is actually very cool, impressed!
Welcome back PP-2000 forward grip
It is NOT a grip
So back in the day Pistols like Mauser, Luger, and Browning Hi Power had shoulder stock/usually holster thing.
Now it has became a bit sophisticated but I'm genuinely surprised how those concept comes back with improvement.
Good ideas never die.
We just need to update the law to make it legal
"Not a youtube comment"
"Not a sarcastic reply."
"Not an active viewer, reading these non comments"
Had one for a few years now. Don't use it much but the role as a truck gun cannot dismissed.
Same. It's my current "get home gun."
Top tier backpack gun.
Ben is an awesome guy, good shooter and a good man. I’ve had the chance to hang out a couple times with him.
Thanks brotha 🙏
I have had some experience with a Glock brace, and it was mostly trash exactly because of flexing frame issues. Change your grip slightly and zero would walk. I haven't realized Flux have addressed them at material level. Good for them.
always great to see forgotten weapons review a firearm(chassis) you currently own! I love my raider.
That spring loaded stock and double mag release are some legit party tricks that will actually get this thing sold. Pretty sick.
Edit that comment right fucking now or ATF is gonna drop the hammer. It is clearly not a stock, cant you read?
The 320 is neat, but the 365 flux now that is something I'm seriously considering.
Same. I seriously hope they do a collaboration with Sig for the 365, too.
Standardize a Glock stock on a stock Glock and you get a stock Glock stock.
This is why I was excited about the new Ruger RXM pistol. Now that Ruger has designed a Glock parts and Glock magazine compatible interchangeable fire control unit, with Magpul as their polymer partner, the next logical step is for them to introduce a PDW “flux” chassis that is Ruger (Glock) based.
Gonna happen.
I can't wait for Magpul's version for the RxM
photo was shown for .2 seconds
I’ve been waiting on them to bring the Glock version back in 10mm since they discontinued it finally taught myself how to CAD and made my own improved version in 9x25 Dillon getting 2500 fps in a concealable package
You have Instagram ?! I wanna see that!
@ I do, but I haven’t posted it anywhere yet. Hoping to get some ballistics gel soon and do some velocity and ballistics testing with a few different projectiles in q1 of 25. Got a ransom rest and a Garmin. Takes a long time to gather all the crap needed to do safe testing when you don’t have any kind of outside support.
Shit, I've been just waiting for the G19 version to be back in stock.
@@michaelturk7237, well, there are a few Glock PDW 3d printed frames out there, there are frames for G26, 19, 17, 34/17L in the USW and Flux Raider style. 😁
Ooh, slick!
I can't wait to see what Magpul brings to the table with the RXM
This might be my first Sig
The extremely neat technical details on this are superb!
This is an especially interesting Mini-PDW, and that spare magazine housing makes for a solid forward grip (despite the disclaimer).
Knowledgeable professionals with extensive expertise and experience have provided input to this excellent concept to make it the interesting and unique Mini-PDW that it is.
I await your follow up videos with eager anticipation...
Boink! I think Ian likes operating that spring release.
I've got a Raider and besides the fast dual mag release/spare mag system, the spring-loaded brace is my favorite feature just because of how fun it is.
01:45...ish, those darn ..."sneaky people"...😂
Heeeey. There is one in display in my local gunstore on the south of Poland. So they're definetly out there around.
Lunch time in England and a good watch ahead.
Same! 🤣👍
@1:03 immediately reminded me of a modern-day rendition of that scene in the "Untouchables" where they wait up in that cabin with shotguns during that sting operation at the bridge.
Great video! Might be useful to include MP17 in the title for those searching for it! :)
hell yeah guns are looking more and more like something from ghost in the shell
Where's Brass Facts when you need him...
Probably watching this video lol
He's probably busy autism'ing over yet another suppressor or LAM.
Thank you Gun Jesus. Here I was convinced my Christmas shopping was done for the year.
Hell yeah Ian! More pdw stuff please!
Just looking at this I already see one potential upgrade.
Make the brace hook reversible for left-hand shooters.
You can buy it with a left handed brace but unfortunately deployment is only on the right side.
Not every expert would go out of his way to say he is wrong. Another reason I trust him.
I love this channel for it's obscure content, non-political and no comercial usage. When I first saw the thumbnail I was a bit skeptical since it's not a "true" forgotten weapon system and I had the feeling there was something over the ordinary here, and it was. Since Ian was quick and upfront that Sig more or less sponsored this video, yet being able to combine product development and cross-interest in the product, I must say this is the best "sponsored" infused gun video I've ever seen. I was skeptical at first but this is so well balanced and put together and rather feeling "buy this awesome thing" that so many other channels do, I met a interesting walkthrough. Well done Ian, this is the best way of doing such "sponsored" videos or whatever you want to call it. You knocked it out of the ballpark while staying true to this channel, bravo!
EDIT: Corrected some spelling.
Skeptical man skeptical!!!! Sceptical is something else entirely
@daldladla yes, that's what I meant now that I read it again. English is not my first language but seems you understood my point anyway :)
The magazine release options on the Raider look pretty slick.
Ben, one of the inventors, has nearly made it to GM in USPSA with one of these.
They're stupidly easy to shoot. A few months ago, a friend shot mine for the first time, and worked it out to 150 yards with no problem.
I like when the stock says "NOT A STOCK" on it.
Been waiting for this video for yeeeeaaars, nicely done Ian!
I would almost agree with the title.. the B&T USW with a glock 40 10mm is the best one imo.. a lot of power down range
Edit: if Flux made one for the Xten 10mm I would buy it asap
They told me via email and in a reddit comment that the Xten version is in the works
Let's hope the NFA stuff on short barreled rifles, short barreled shotguns and suppressors goes away fairly quickly.
Unlikely unfortunately
@@samuelgoad7320Oh, it's going away one way or another. The word salad circle jerk has circled back around to unburdon us from what has been. They only get away with what you let them get away with, balls are required.
That's what I think is crazy about us gun laws. I'm Italian and our only restrictions are mag capacity (easily circumbented), full auto and military cartridges (it has to do with 70's terr-ism). I still can't understand why instead of ruining everything for everyone, the US gov doesn't just implement a gun licence like they do for cars, as it's done where I live.
This is going to filter out any crazy person and leave only responsible sane owners
@kino_61 Our Second Ammendment says the government can't do that. Shall not be infringed - words have meaning.
If a certain AK guy thing goes through the whole NFA might go away
Ian ALREADY putting the Flux Raider on Forgotten Weapons is DIABOLICAL 😂
9:16. Boiing is the correct term for that function 😉👍
This is sick. What a cool idea with the dual mag release.
With just a little bit of practice, it's freakishly fast. You know all those pro shooters showing how fast their reloads are on UA-cam? Practice for about an hour, and it's that fast.
Finally, a good image of a bracer!! I'd thought that was how they'd look/work, but previously hadn't been able to tell fir certain from the images. Then again, I prefer the bracer concept to the Blake's 7 equivalent with the Federation's guns... Flux/Sig looks good...
The Flux Raider is indeed the best conversion kit ever and i find these conversion kits very fantastic additions. It was very ingenious of Sig to exploit the loophole of ATF's regulations because it doesn't have the specifications of an SBR and is still classifiable as a pistol.
video on the flux 365 when, even smaller package and probably the closest thing to the embodiment of the modern PDW concept with its own IWB holster
Imagine this is what regular pistols would be in the future. This, USWA1 etc. Like, we had a stocked pistols 100 years ago and now we came back to the same concept.
Pretty soon we could be approaching material technologies that lets material to be folded like cloth while being rigid when desired. This would allow for very compact supports and braces (stocks). Could make pistol stocks very popular.
Since it'll always be more expensive than a pistol without a stock, this won't ever fully replace them. It'll always be a niche thing.
Nice to see somebody got it right with this old concept.
That double mag release design is chefs kiss
I finished building out my Raider about 6 months before the flux legion came out
I still love mine though
When he keeps pulling stuff from under the table I was expecting him to bring up a rabbit to the magicians Taa Daa 😁
I got to fire the Flux Legion at GOA'S GOALS media range day back in August and fell in love with it. It was very nice to shoot.
back in my day you got a MechTech and you liked it! I knew some cops that unironically carried a MechTech in the trunk of their patrol car because they were not allowed to carry carbines, rifles or shotguns at all. this was the early 2000's when that was more common, and i think most PD's at least allow a trunk shotgun now
I’m mean it says “not a grip” right on the thing. Which means legally it can’t be one. Lol
Yes, it is that stupid.
In the experimental aircraft world you cannot register an amphibious aircraft if it can take off on water and land on earth, or vice versa, the legal solution was to put a “do not operate in flight” placard on the retract switch.
The FAA and DOT were fine with that
@@lostinthedesert6149 Yet more evidence that the American legal system is completely ridiculous. Does "spirit of the law" mean anything in your country?
@@no1DdC if the law is stupid and pointless, then "spirit of the law" would be "to annoy taxpayers and make their life miserable".
@@vos2693 Plenty of laws like that, but not in the gun law category.
Mr Ian, we've this expression where I'm from, instead of saying inshala we'd say "mog het troffen". It fits perfectly in that part of the narrative. It could be translated as "let it strike where it may". Thank you for your hard work. From South Africa.
I love how, 100 years after deeming it obsolete, we're coming back around to "what if pistols had stocks" again
They have never gone away; always been a few bouncing around in the background. BHP, HK VP-70, etc
8:25 oh yeah, Sig has *never* pushed a new product on shaky NFA legal grounds... Like the Sig Brace... Or the MPX muzzle brake...
Gotta push the envelope. The NFA is a joke.
F the NFA, it should be repealed.
To be fair, they ended up winning with the brace, and it being in such common use with AFT deciding to suddenly classify them all stocks gives us a good shot at killing off SBR laws.
Sig's been a good partner in the 2A fight.
A buddy of mine has a Flux Raider, and it genuinely is a *very* well thought out system. It looks kinda gimmicky at first glance, but it's really, *really* good.
Love that “fight club style” photogram ❤️
haha the single frame photo when he mentioned a photo shoot had me rolling
The great grandchild of the Mauser Broom handle.
3:51 "And you can't just be tossing out rounds 'inshallah' into a crowd" This is my new favorite Ianism
"If something like the Flux Raider had been around for the 1911, we probably would never have gotten the M1 Carbine."
...Huh. I can't find an argument against that.
Great photo!
Gun Jesus doing an in depth review of the raider is really cool. I'd love to have one of these things but I'm not paying $500 for one. Regardless, nice piece of hardware
To Mr. McCollum, there was something I had wanted to get your thoughts on for some time now, even though it's completely irrelevant to this video. As you know, the world's first bolt action breech loader, the Dreyse, was released in the early 1840s and fired an acorn shaped bullet at about a few hundred yards. Then you have the Minor ball, which was a comical shaped bullet that could fly several hundred yards. It can therefore be said that when it was released, the Minie rendered the Dreyse's bullet obsolete since it could fly farther. However, all rifles that could fire a Minie were percussion cap muzzleloaders which were commonly used for about a couple of decades. Even though it would be years before it saw major use, when the Dreyse was released, given it was a bolt action breechloader, it made all the Minie rifles obsolete before they were even made. Interesting, isn't it?
1:02 So much class
The GRIP ZONE™ has finally met its match.
Grip Zone for straight men
14:40 Jokes on them, that gun can fire without the trigger 😆
Sig: Our 320s keep randomly going off and we owe millions in lawsuits. How can we possibly recover?
Ian McCollum's phone: *rings*
Have one of these that I built before they started offering the Raider X Legion and registered it as an SBR (My first NFA item). Love this thing. Great Backpacking gun or for around our camp on a sling.
Standard Sig320 Slide
Harrington Arms 2port Comp
TLR-1 Light
Holosun HSHS403 Red Dot
Tactical Development Front sight replacement Charging handle
Also got two sets of Mags. 2 20s and 2 30s
I have had a Flux Legion for a couple of months now and like it. I should have waited to see if they will release a suppressor ready model - it SUCKED to have to buy a new slide and barrel, and then to have to remove the rear sight to make it work with a can. Having said that, I had no issues with shooting it suppressed. I shot 250 rounds to break the gun in, added a TBAC Fly 9, and it worked with zero problems. I am a bit suspicious of all the plastic, especially the rail interface with the red dot, Aimpoint T-2, but so far no worries. It probably isn't for everyone, but if it is your thing, you will like this.
Great video as always! Thank you for not upgrading your camera
what a great early christmas present
Ian is the flux between myself and UA-cam.
Æon/Ian same thing 😂
How long until Flux makes you do a video on the Raider 365? I'd love to hear your take on whether it really is concealable.
I would like to do that; just need to get one of them...
Buy an 80% P320 FCU and a jig and you can do it at home! The raider is hard to get but well worth it. I love mine. A real joy to shoot at the range.
I had to go super slow motion to pull up that flash picture you posted. That looks so cool.😂
I wonder if it would be impossible for Anton to add things like this into H3VR.
Cool video regardless, thanks for making it!
Last time I was this late, KelTec combined RFB rifle with CP 33 pistol as BullpupRoni, with the pistol being attachable/detachable and working as a trigger/selector for the main rifle too.
2 in 1 from the KelTec crackheads.
Seems to me like they would really want to put a "special" fire control group into one of these for things like VIP protection, and the high-speed low-drag operator types would probably like that too, because you never know when a situation is gonna devolve to the point you'd need something like this, and it's a lot better (if only by being lighter) than existing offerings like the G18 (with or without stock) and Berretta 93R.
Can't wait for the follow up
Don't forget the sticker to add "Its a grip!" Once you have it registered.
"for legal reason, this is not a grip" "for legal reasons this is a pistol brace" 🤣
Oh good, there's gonna be a range video. I'm curious to see how one would comfortably and efficiently rack the slide on that thing.
There's a development step you missed. Between the 3D printed MP17 and the Raider X there was the MP17 Raider. It had minor cosmetic and ergonomic differences, such as a textured grip, no cutouts behind the safety, Coyote brown color, and I think less flaring in the mag well. The development from the MP17 Raider to the Raider X was done after Flux received feedback from guys in the 10th SFG out of Carson.
looking forward to the next video
Ive been looking at getting one of these. They look amazing and a perfect truck piece.
They are but are they not sbr now? With the brace
@user-vs2vk4ol1y no they are still a pistol since the ruling in texas
Looking forward to the range footage.
That is super cool. Now i want one. I guess i always want one of most everything you cover too but this one is really cool
Remember when everyone thought the military was going to change to 40 S&W? When we absolutely had to have 1 pistol that could be both calibers & a dozen different frame sizes? Yeah. We got 1 horribly flawed Sig pistol and none of the rest. Another accessory for the Sig the govt isn't going to buy more than a handful of, then forget. We already have better options.