DSP completely transformed my audio. Only using it on my sub but it makes an amazing difference. I have a homemade 12" Adire Shiva sub with a 250w Class D amp and didn't know what I was missing until I got a mic, REW and a miniDSP 2X4 HD. Now I'm flat from crossover down with a 3dB roll-off at 20 Hz and the DSP tamed a LOT of peaks in the sub's response. When I built this sub twenty years ago I had planned on building a Linkwitz Transform to at least get lower extension (it's an acoustic suspension design) but the DSP has completely taken all the work out of the process.
I want to try DSP on my OSD Trevoce 12s soon. So far I just put my Onkyo sub crossover at 50 HZ and most movies sound Awesome. But if I'm not getting the 20-25 HZ I could be missing out Big time
Finally got the OSD Trevoce 12 sounding Awesome with Deep bass. Had to remove the LFE cable and use the Dual unbalanced RCA (Red & White). Onkyo Crossover at 50 HZ, LFE set to Off. Subwoofer knob crossover all the way Up to 200 HZ (Bypass method). Now it hits very hard and deep but just with the big action movies for Bass. Most movies you want the AVR at 80 HZ which will also be the THX level on my Onkyo THX Dolby Atmos receiver TX-NR696 for $349. No Speakers just subwoofer. Using Soundbar with my TV for the 9 speakers Atmos sound
So you guys do know each other... Lol. I was telling Youthman about your video review showing the Frequency Graphs. I'm buying Apple iphone then iWoofer app works better.
I like the look of the Passive Radiators. Then again I love Dayton Ultimax subs so that style has grown on me. Off topic, but I'm moving my Ultimax 10 to a new box that's using 3 Dayton 10" passive radiators. Hopefully going to blow me away with the crazy 19Hz tuning I've built it for.
might get one for Christmas :) 😃 I'm going for the 10inch one because 8 inch subs don't really get that low as a 10inch and the 8inch has a smaller surround that 10 looks like it has a lot of xmax
Get $200 off when you use the code "Joentell20" Buy the Trevoce DSP 12: bit.ly/OSDTrevoce12DSP Buy the Trevoce DSP 10: bit.ly/TrevoceDSP10-OSD Buy the Trevoce DSP 8: bit.ly/OSDTrevoce8DSP My Subwoofer Leaderboard: bit.ly/subwooferleaderboard
Seems like the 8” sub would compliment the Klipsch Fives nicely. Thoughts? I don’t want to spend $800 on a micro sub and the SVS1000pro might be too much for the Klipsch?
Really like the Trevoce lineup for my 11 x 22 x 7 ceiling, multipurpose room. I'm not sure what the speakers were rated at when you made this video, but like that you gave low frequency expectations with DSP for each! 2 years later the OSD site rates them all down to 20hz...is this accurate or VooDoo marketing? BTW, using RSL mtm's for a 5.2.2. Thanks for any help, really enjoy your channel.
Hi Joel. I’m will be retiring soon and will go back to the Philippines. I’m planning to build a decent home theater in my living room. What subwoofer would you recommend both fir movies and music. Note: I don’t have a dedicated home theater room. It will be on my open space living room. Hope you can help me with your suggestion. More power.
I have some of the subs I've reviewed here at bit.ly/subwooferleaderboard Those are ranked from highest to lowest. Take a look at some of those and see which you think is best for what you're trying to do.
Joe i bought the audessy app and i was waiting for someone to show how to use it youtman done a nice job but he dident say you had to start at the beginning eg setup it took 4hrs ireset my marantz sr 7013 but what a difference
No DSP keep the Crossover at 40-50 HZ unless using LFE then Receiver could be 80 HZ or lower depending if Onkyo or Denon, etc. I prefer no LFE cable as my receiver has No Speakers connected Only Subwoofer
OSD Trevoce 12s are the Bare Minimum for a proper Home Theater experience unless you live in an Apartment or neighbor too close and will complain. Actually 15" Subwoofer is the real movie theater type experience. One day i will get Stereo Integrity 18 Or 24 Woofer which is 100 Pounds, No Box. Plays 5 HZ.
I think the Break-in period is about 3 months as it just turned into Beast mode last 2 weeks. Otherwise my Onkyo receiver is working better with the subwoofer.
Hello there, an ASR friend reporting :), Is it possible you could expand on the DSP process/app or provide measurements on how you got 20Hz?? It's just the user manual shows the DSP possibilities are amazing, way beyond what you could get with an SB1000 PRO. On paper, the manual looks like pure bliss but would be better to correlate all that info with actual real-world results measurements.
I'm sorry, I don't know. I don't have the ability to test the actual power. I'm going based on what it says on the back and on their website. I would just play it safe and assume peak.
@@joentell well L/R polk T50s small but pourful metal coned sony 5speakers in1 my centre is the sony KD55AG9 woofer is a kef L/R 1box front back kef sattelites 3 ceiling speakers 40w a mix match but it works i have the sound to each speaker tailored with the curtain
@@joentell everything has more presence atmos stereo everything more controled bass treble is sharper but controled voices in film mutch richer same for singers
@@joentell Check out Bic Acoustech speakers...they are very affordable but punch way above their weight class. Their PL-200 II Subwoofer is amazing for it's $300 cost. It's a ported 12 inch sub with 500 watts peak, 250 watts RMS.
@@joentell I recently bought the PL-980 towers on Amazon for $660...I'm still in total amazement at the quality of these towers at this insanely low price. They are worth every penny and would still be worth it they costed three times the current price.
yeah, that's too bad. I listen to two-channel with my AVR so plenty of ways to adjust phase/delay. I've been tinkering for the better part of 5 months with sub placement and timing and LFE+Main and literally just got things lined up. Can't tell when my 18" monster is even on anymore unless I turn it off while listening carefully. Ignorance is bliss....
@@NakeanWickliff Yeah it's a shame most subwoofer companies don't have variable phase, including REL. I use a preamp and 2 power amps for 2 channel music listening, so there is no timing adjustments in my preamp. I bit the bullet and got some JL's that have 0-280° variable phase adjustment. Once you have the know how on how to dial in phase, you will be surprised in how far out the subs can be out of sync with your mains. Even if your AVR has Audyssey or equivalent it won't get it dead on, but it will be close enough for most people. I have my subs right beside my mains in my bedroom and they are crossed over at 43hz and one is at 90° and the other is at 150°. I was surprised that they would be out of sync by that much. If I didn't have variable phase then my subs wouldn't be in sync with my mains and weird things happen with phase in rooms. I did have the miniDSP 4x10HD and it changed the phase in everything, and not in a good way. Everything seemed out of sync and after months of tinkering, I couldn't never get the system as a whole back in sync. So I ripped it out and gave it to my son. It sounded so much better after I removed it and dialed the phase on my subs manually.
@@dicmccoy Yes, it sucks that once you add anything into the signal chain it can mess up the timing for everything else which means it's time to start all over again. I was amazed at how changing from LFE to LFE+Mains screwed up my frequency response. I'm not sure if timing was changed at all or if it just meant I wasn't time aligned and thought I was since I was only looking at crossover point when I was aligning when I measured. Now that I have everything aligned with Mains getting full signal AND sub overlapping, I'm in heaven. Added a little room curve and I'm good to go. I could never afford REL but I'm happy with my oldschool Klipsch Forte 1's and 18" Dayton Ultimax in a sealed enclosure. I know enough to get in trouble but not enough to want anything more than my Klipsch Heritage speakers. Best $500 spent on speakers besides my Heresy's.
Why do we want a inbuilt DSP into the sub? Audiophiles like separates.. A external sub is the proper placement in our system of a DSP. If you like me cross over at 53 hz. That means that I STILL can room correct my room mode at 73 hz when my DSP is between the preamp and the power amps. Try to do that with the DSP in the sub.. My sub and mains has a 24 db/octave crossover. Try to make a high pass to your mains when you have a inbuilt DSP. Harder.. With the external DSP you can make house curve in the full frequency range. Again not possible with your inbuilt DSP. And a variable phase control that someone said in the comment that there is not.. In my external DSP I have it delayed 0.8 ms. I might have wrong but why buy a DSP for only ~20 to 80 hz sounds like waste to me when it is placed in a suboptimal ;) place in our systems.
It's very simple, my friend...we're in the minority. The average person just wants to plop it down and be good. Most will never measure their response. You have to be really careful showing or viewing any kind of frequency response as it means nothing to anyone but him in his specific room and listening position. I just went hunting for the best location for my sub in my office. I got the exact same frequency response (albeit, with higher output) with my 12in 500wattRMS vs my 18in 1400watt RMS subwoofer! They were rolling off at 35hz and they both play to 18hz easily. It's ALL ABOUT PLACEMENT and TIMING, and in most cases, you're going to need two to get the response you're looking for. These subs aren't for you or me. They're for those big-box retail store shoppers and just beyond.
@@NakeanWickliff Yes that is probably right. I were taking the thinking one step further. That illustrate how unlogically it is to have a DSP on one driver. Why do we not have a DSP on our midrange woofer.. Or why not a dedicated DSP on our tweeter? It sounds stupid doesn't it? :)
I will never argue that something like a MiniDSP between a preamp and your power amp and subwoofer is superior. The use-case I specified was for people using 2 channel integrated amps without crossovers or DSP for the sub. For example, I have a Yamaha A-S501 that I use for 2-channel. I love it, but it has no options to tune the sub unless the sub has it built-in. Same for the vintage Marantz 2220b I had.
@@AmazonasBiotop But most of us DO have DSP for our midrange, our woofers, and our tweeters. Almost all AVR's have some sort of EQ and many have apps (denon) that allow for PEQ adjustments. Many, however, don't have this for the lower frequencies. That's where the DSP for this sub comes in. Personally I don't like what Audyssey does to my sound so I turn it off but many Love what it does for theirs.
It's not silly to have DSP on one driver if it's your subwoofer since the bass frequencies are are more highly dependent on the room, placement, and relationship to listening position. Even if this are all "optimal" 😉 that doesn't mean your frequency response will be....hence the need for DSP. Yes, you can say the same for all speakers that play below your room's Schroeder frequency, but that's a topic for a different discussion.
DSP completely transformed my audio. Only using it on my sub but it makes an amazing difference. I have a homemade 12" Adire Shiva sub with a 250w Class D amp and didn't know what I was missing until I got a mic, REW and a miniDSP 2X4 HD. Now I'm flat from crossover down with a 3dB roll-off at 20 Hz and the DSP tamed a LOT of peaks in the sub's response. When I built this sub twenty years ago I had planned on building a Linkwitz Transform to at least get lower extension (it's an acoustic suspension design) but the DSP has completely taken all the work out of the process.
I want to try DSP on my OSD Trevoce 12s soon. So far I just put my Onkyo sub crossover at 50 HZ and most movies sound Awesome. But if I'm not getting the 20-25 HZ I could be missing out Big time
Finally got the OSD Trevoce 12 sounding Awesome with Deep bass. Had to remove the LFE cable and use the Dual unbalanced RCA (Red & White). Onkyo Crossover at 50 HZ, LFE set to Off. Subwoofer knob crossover all the way Up to 200 HZ (Bypass method). Now it hits very hard and deep but just with the big action movies for Bass. Most movies you want the AVR at 80 HZ which will also be the THX level on my Onkyo THX Dolby Atmos receiver TX-NR696 for $349. No Speakers just subwoofer. Using Soundbar with my TV for the 9 speakers Atmos sound
Dude that intro was 🔥🔥🔥 Leve a nasty comment below 🤣🤣🤣
I'll take all the interaction 🤣
Appreciate that 👊😎
So you guys do know each other... Lol. I was telling Youthman about your video review showing the Frequency Graphs. I'm buying Apple iphone then iWoofer app works better.
He's the most horrible UA-cam guy for Replying back to comments (my nasty comment) LOL
I like the look of the Passive Radiators. Then again I love Dayton Ultimax subs so that style has grown on me.
Off topic, but I'm moving my Ultimax 10 to a new box that's using 3 Dayton 10" passive radiators. Hopefully going to blow me away with the crazy 19Hz tuning I've built it for.
might get one for Christmas :) 😃 I'm going for the 10inch one because 8 inch subs don't really get that low as a 10inch and the 8inch has a smaller surround that 10 looks like it has a lot of xmax
The Trevoce 15 is coming!
Wow! Thanks for the heads up Dave!
Get $200 off when you use the code "Joentell20"
Buy the Trevoce DSP 12: bit.ly/OSDTrevoce12DSP
Buy the Trevoce DSP 10: bit.ly/TrevoceDSP10-OSD
Buy the Trevoce DSP 8: bit.ly/OSDTrevoce8DSP
My Subwoofer Leaderboard: bit.ly/subwooferleaderboard
@Joe theyve updated them again! Looks like huge value!
Seems like the 8” sub would compliment the Klipsch Fives nicely. Thoughts? I don’t want to spend $800 on a micro sub and the SVS1000pro might be too much for the Klipsch?
Check my subwoofer leaderboard bit.ly/subwooferleaderboard
Is the discount code still valid? Thanks
Can we get the same deal in Canada? If so - I'm getting one!!
Email them and mention me. I'm confident those guys will do their best to accommodate you.
@@joentell Thanks Joe for getting back so quick.
@@joentell Forgot! Will try that and let you know.
Really like the Trevoce lineup for my 11 x 22 x 7 ceiling, multipurpose room. I'm not sure what the speakers were rated at when you made this video, but like that you gave low frequency expectations with DSP for each!
2 years later the OSD site rates them all down to 20hz...is this accurate or VooDoo marketing? BTW, using RSL mtm's for a 5.2.2. Thanks for any help, really enjoy your channel.
I think 20hz is a bit of a stretch
Hi Joel. I’m will be retiring soon and will go back to the Philippines. I’m planning to build a decent home theater in my living room. What subwoofer would you recommend both fir movies and music. Note: I don’t have a dedicated home theater room. It will be on my open space living room. Hope you can help me with your suggestion. More power.
I have some of the subs I've reviewed here at bit.ly/subwooferleaderboard
Those are ranked from highest to lowest. Take a look at some of those and see which you think is best for what you're trying to do.
Joe i bought the audessy app and i was waiting for someone to show how to use it youtman done a nice job but he dident say you had to start at the beginning eg setup it took 4hrs ireset my marantz sr 7013 but what a difference
What differences did you notice? I'm taking a mini survey. Also, which speakers do you have?
Promo discount code is dead :(
No DSP keep the Crossover at 40-50 HZ unless using LFE then Receiver could be 80 HZ or lower depending if Onkyo or Denon, etc. I prefer no LFE cable as my receiver has No Speakers connected Only Subwoofer
OSD Trevoce 12s are the Bare Minimum for a proper Home Theater experience unless you live in an Apartment or neighbor too close and will complain. Actually 15" Subwoofer is the real movie theater type experience. One day i will get Stereo Integrity 18 Or 24 Woofer which is 100 Pounds, No Box. Plays 5 HZ.
I think the Break-in period is about 3 months as it just turned into Beast mode last 2 weeks. Otherwise my Onkyo receiver is working better with the subwoofer.
Hello there, an ASR friend reporting :), Is it possible you could expand on the DSP process/app or provide measurements on how you got 20Hz?? It's just the user manual shows the DSP possibilities are amazing, way beyond what you could get with an SB1000 PRO. On paper, the manual looks like pure bliss but would be better to correlate all that info with actual real-world results measurements.
More info here in this video ua-cam.com/video/0SxbqVpigoc/v-deo.html. It's using the same software and DSP.
@@joentell Great Thanks !
Is that 800 watts rms or peak?
I'm sorry, I don't know. I don't have the ability to test the actual power. I'm going based on what it says on the back and on their website. I would just play it safe and assume peak.
i cant find iwoofer for android...
Joe thanks for your tip pulling hack the curtain it makes some difference youtman demoed it sound is awsom thankyou
What differences did you notice in your system? Which speakers do you have?
@@joentell well L/R polk T50s small but pourful metal coned sony 5speakers in1 my centre is the sony KD55AG9 woofer is a kef L/R 1box front back kef sattelites 3 ceiling speakers 40w a mix match but it works i have the sound to each speaker tailored with the curtain
Did you ever have Audyssey setup without the curtain? If so what differences have you noticed?
@@joentell everything has more presence atmos stereo everything more controled bass treble is sharper but controled voices in film mutch richer same for singers
@@joentell i have the curtain set to 322 imexperementing
Whoa, a decent 12 inch subwoofer for $500? That is a good deal.
Yeah, I think the TrevoceDSP12 is the way to go.
@@joentell Check out Bic Acoustech speakers...they are very affordable but punch way above their weight class. Their PL-200 II Subwoofer is amazing for it's $300 cost. It's a ported 12 inch sub with 500 watts peak, 250 watts RMS.
@@GSP-76 I've always wanted to check out their stuff
@@joentell I recently bought the PL-980 towers on Amazon for $660...I'm still in total amazement at the quality of these towers at this insanely low price. They are worth every penny and would still be worth it they costed three times the current price.
@@GSP-76 Do you recommend these towers for a 2.1 setup mainly for music listening?
I'll never be able to own one but still watch it 🤣🤣🤣
Too bad there's no variable phase control for us 2 channel music listeners.
yeah, that's too bad. I listen to two-channel with my AVR so plenty of ways to adjust phase/delay. I've been tinkering for the better part of 5 months with sub placement and timing and LFE+Main and literally just got things lined up. Can't tell when my 18" monster is even on anymore unless I turn it off while listening carefully. Ignorance is bliss....
@@NakeanWickliff Yeah it's a shame most subwoofer companies don't have variable phase, including REL. I use a preamp and 2 power amps for 2 channel music listening, so there is no timing adjustments in my preamp. I bit the bullet and got some JL's that have 0-280° variable phase adjustment. Once you have the know how on how to dial in phase, you will be surprised in how far out the subs can be out of sync with your mains. Even if your AVR has Audyssey or equivalent it won't get it dead on, but it will be close enough for most people. I have my subs right beside my mains in my bedroom and they are crossed over at 43hz and one is at 90° and the other is at 150°. I was surprised that they would be out of sync by that much. If I didn't have variable phase then my subs wouldn't be in sync with my mains and weird things happen with phase in rooms. I did have the miniDSP 4x10HD and it changed the phase in everything, and not in a good way. Everything seemed out of sync and after months of tinkering, I couldn't never get the system as a whole back in sync. So I ripped it out and gave it to my son. It sounded so much better after I removed it and dialed the phase on my subs manually.
@@dicmccoy Yes, it sucks that once you add anything into the signal chain it can mess up the timing for everything else which means it's time to start all over again. I was amazed at how changing from LFE to LFE+Mains screwed up my frequency response. I'm not sure if timing was changed at all or if it just meant I wasn't time aligned and thought I was since I was only looking at crossover point when I was aligning when I measured. Now that I have everything aligned with Mains getting full signal AND sub overlapping, I'm in heaven. Added a little room curve and I'm good to go. I could never afford REL but I'm happy with my oldschool Klipsch Forte 1's and 18" Dayton Ultimax in a sealed enclosure. I know enough to get in trouble but not enough to want anything more than my Klipsch Heritage speakers. Best $500 spent on speakers besides my Heresy's.
It does have a variable phase control knob on the back and controllable via the app. It's not just a 180° switch like some subs.
@@joentell Oh, sweet! That's good to hear! Wish all companies did variable phase control. It should be an industry standard.
Nasty comment. 👎 (I kid, I kid!)
Treutel Crest
Nice.
Why do we want a inbuilt DSP into the sub? Audiophiles like separates..
A external sub is the proper placement in our system of a DSP.
If you like me cross over at 53 hz. That means that I STILL can room correct my room mode at 73 hz when my DSP is between the preamp and the power amps.
Try to do that with the DSP in the sub..
My sub and mains has a 24 db/octave crossover. Try to make a high pass to your mains when you have a inbuilt DSP. Harder..
With the external DSP you can make house curve in the full frequency range. Again not possible with your inbuilt DSP.
And a variable phase control that someone said in the comment that there is not.. In my external DSP I have it delayed 0.8 ms.
I might have wrong but why buy a DSP for only ~20 to 80 hz sounds like waste to me when it is placed in a suboptimal ;) place in our systems.
It's very simple, my friend...we're in the minority. The average person just wants to plop it down and be good. Most will never measure their response. You have to be really careful showing or viewing any kind of frequency response as it means nothing to anyone but him in his specific room and listening position. I just went hunting for the best location for my sub in my office. I got the exact same frequency response (albeit, with higher output) with my 12in 500wattRMS vs my 18in 1400watt RMS subwoofer! They were rolling off at 35hz and they both play to 18hz easily. It's ALL ABOUT PLACEMENT and TIMING, and in most cases, you're going to need two to get the response you're looking for. These subs aren't for you or me. They're for those big-box retail store shoppers and just beyond.
@@NakeanWickliff Yes that is probably right.
I were taking the thinking one step further. That illustrate how unlogically it is to have a DSP on one driver.
Why do we not have a DSP on our midrange woofer.. Or why not a dedicated DSP on our tweeter?
It sounds stupid doesn't it? :)
I will never argue that something like a MiniDSP between a preamp and your power amp and subwoofer is superior. The use-case I specified was for people using 2 channel integrated amps without crossovers or DSP for the sub. For example, I have a Yamaha A-S501 that I use for 2-channel. I love it, but it has no options to tune the sub unless the sub has it built-in. Same for the vintage Marantz 2220b I had.
@@AmazonasBiotop But most of us DO have DSP for our midrange, our woofers, and our tweeters. Almost all AVR's have some sort of EQ and many have apps (denon) that allow for PEQ adjustments. Many, however, don't have this for the lower frequencies. That's where the DSP for this sub comes in. Personally I don't like what Audyssey does to my sound so I turn it off but many Love what it does for theirs.
It's not silly to have DSP on one driver if it's your subwoofer since the bass frequencies are are more highly dependent on the room, placement, and relationship to listening position. Even if this are all "optimal" 😉 that doesn't mean your frequency response will be....hence the need for DSP. Yes, you can say the same for all speakers that play below your room's Schroeder frequency, but that's a topic for a different discussion.
nice
This is my nasty comment and my thumbs down 👎.... Lol JK great video bud.
Appreciate it! 😎
They're not honoring any of your promo codes
They may have expired by now. Have you given them a call?
@@joentell I'll try that next. I just figured your newer ones would work. Thanks
A nasty comment.