2:32:00 The Tourney at Harrenhal would be a PERFECT stage play. As a poetic nod, it could even follow the Aristotelian unities by basing it only on the final day of the tourney and have the driving action be the identity of the mystery knight. Though personally I'd prefer the entire sequence of events with several settings like the godswood, tourney grounds, a castle interior, and various camp tents.
Well I finally did it. I’m caught up. I found this channel about a year ago and had seemingly thousands of hours of content. Now I’m “live”. Bittersweet. Thanks for the content during lockdown.
I think I'm approaching the bottom of the well of his videos, finally. I'm really worried about that bittersweet feeling when I finally run though "all the rest of it."
I'm surprised no one pointed out how much of Venetian history Martin used for Braavos (just like Hadrian's Wall inspired the Night's Watch) The lagoons, the canals, the financial might, the reliance on sea power and an Arsenal capable of building warships at scale, even the keyholders are all echoes of Renaissance Venice!
Thank you so much for making that point about Syrio Forel. I also can't imagine that he would only disable Trent and then run away. And even supposing he thought he killed Trent, I think he would have tried to find Arya.
Ahhhh I was actually awake for long enough last night to watch this, but I didn't have the alerts set correctly for some reason. Oh well, I'll enjoy it with breakfast instead.
As always, great topic! If I may make a suggestion, probably it would be interesting to make a live chat with a topic like "finances of westeros", similar to "justice in westeros". The Iron bank and its policy on supporting and expectation debts is very interesting and probably will be interested for more people.
Doesn't the motive of the Iron Bank trying to collect their money from the Iron Throne automatically put them into opposition to Winterfell? If the Seven Kingdoms fall apart, there is no longer an Iron Throne, then who would they collect from?
If the Sealord did shelter the refugee Targaryen kids, and broker the Dorne betrothal, then it makes sense to place a set of eyes (perceptive eyes!) in King's Landing as close to the Red Keep as possible, to generate intelligence on the present Baratheon/Lannister regime. A former First Sword picked for his situational awareness would be ideal.
For a number of years I had you confused with another channel and cringed every time you showed up in recommendations. About a year or two ago, you were a guest on a live stream and I was like hey this guy is great he's not the person I was thinking about. Ive sinced watch a lot of your back catalog and you are one of my favorite channels for this genre. I thought once the show ended, with WoW still unreleased the GoTTubers would all just die off or start doing Top 5 Starks! type vids. Youve keep pushing out the content and its still interesting. Amazed you can go on for 2 hours and it doesnt feel like you are necroing threads from the ASoIaF. Ive really enjoyed all of these
Hey Robert long time listener. I know you'll probably never see this but I just wanted to take the chance to put a bug in your ear about a possible project. I've noticed lately that iceberg style videos are becoming popular again and clever me I also noticed that our wonderful community doesn't have any so tldr you should make an asoiaf iceberg video!
Unless Syrio was Jaquen hes positively dead. He died in accordance with his values as First Sword. As we learn to our sorrow, there are far worse fates than that in GRRM works.
Regarding the Dani in Braavos affair; I would be interested to hear how you think about Prestons "page of lies" series, where he adresses this and related issues. I myself are in between seats on this...@indeepgeek
Preston is hopefully trolling, because the idea of fake Dany has been debunked, and the narrative theme loses it's potential if Dany has some ridiculous back story. Why would George write something so convoluted that meets an end with no meaning? It's conspiracy hunting for content on Preston's behalf
@@marting1984 Of course, making up theories and essential bullshitting together a story must be most fun a dedicated fan could have with an authors story. It is fair game (for me), well entertaining too, so I like to watch these videos. I am sadly not deep enough into the asoiaf background and lore, so I lack the ability to debunk or second any such theory; Robert for example knows the story well so he could probably see Prestons train of thoughts and respond while backing his opinion up properly with book facts. As far as I am concerned it could make sense that Dani is not a pure Tagaryen in that sense as it would be the exact opposite to John, who is living as a nobody/bastard while she has all the rage and name whilst being "less"; essentially stating that your heritage is not as important as the way you carry yourself. But I am really not that good in analyzing that kind of stuff and more of a bumbling bystander. Thank you for the answer anyways, will have a good thought about it.
@@Bloodredswan Preston mentions in his first or second video, the thread he got the idea from. I believe. Anyway, I comment on that first or second video about where to find that thread and the name of the user that debunks Preston's claims. If you go back and find my comment, you can then follow the link. And I mention what pages to read to find the best parts of the debate. It's a long read, so maybe make yourself a coffee or something.
I'm surprised Martin gets so sensitive about being asked about Syrio. If you're a writer and leave something ambiguous you can't be made when people come up with conclusions that counter what the writer thinks happened. Maybe if he didn't want us to make up our own conclusions he should have.
i think you missed the point. it was implied he died, and yall just refuse to believe it. he isnt sensitive, hes sick of wannabe experts trying to find something that isnt there, and he cant outright tell you to give up and move on without looking rude. he loves the speculation and discourse, but people now get mad he takes too long to finish a book and prvide answers, but he is still getting asked shit like this.
Hold on, if Syrio wasnt killed, he would have been thrown into the black cells Then he may have been picked up by Yoren Which means, he could be Jaqen EDIT= Nah, the timeline doesnt quite fit, does it?
I don't quite buy Littlefinger being the one responsible for Jaqen's presence in KL. Given that the FM are notably effective (and expensive), why would he bother with putting it in Joffrey's head to have Ned executed? Why would shrewd, business-minded LF shell out a mountain of money to have Ned killed, only to simultaneously plot to have it done for free? Hiring a FM necessitates no contingency plan, and LF would know that. It wouldn't make any sense for him to be behind both plots. I 100% believe he convinced Joffrey to have Ned killed. A shocking public execution of Ned plays exactly into LF's goals. A quiet assassination somewhere in the Riverlands not so much. Cersei is definitely the one who hired the assassin. Later, in AFFC, she tries the exact same thing (only this time with a Kettleblack). Promise to send him to the wall, have him killed before he can talk. It would be just like Cersei to not only try the exact same outlandish assassination plot twice, but to have it fail spectacularly both times as well.
Ned being murdered wouldnt advance anything unless it was pinned on the Lannisters. I think Jaquen is more of an agent/spy than an assassin. He's not at the Oldtown to kill anyone but to acquire something
@@larryhinkle9390 Cersei would have every reason to want Ned dead because he knew that her children were illegitimate, but she would want it to look like a random killing by some unknown violent criminal en route to the wall. Littlefinger benefited from the chaos that ensued after the surprise execution more so than Ned's death itself.
@@ballisstrife yes cersai had the motive. I meant for LF. Murdering Ned wouldn't have done anything for LF. I don't think cersai would spend the money either. She'd just give the sharpened tooth guy a a gold dragon to off him on the trip. I just don't think jaqen was there to kill anyone. He seemed to have mission. He could have gotten away but didn't
@@larryhinkle9390 Cersei is shown to be an incautious spender, I wouldn’t put it past her to go all in on something this important to her (not just the safety of her children but also the power that comes with their legitimacy). We’re definitely in agreement that LF didn’t hire Jaqen though
@@ballisstrife I think she might try seducing someone to do it or just send her boy toy. I dont think there was actually time between Ned's confrontation and his "judgement" to send a message to Braavos and get an assassin. Could be wrong but I thought she was against the execution. Could have just not wanted the political fall out but book cersai really isnt that good at that. But the beheading would have worked out better for her than sending him to the wall. IMO she would have had to have set the plan in motion while Ned was still investigating. Also the only way LF could have afforded it is if he embezzled from the crown. I mean he was already doing that but some one like Ned would have to have been pricey. LF could have just bribed locals. He had no need to make it look like an accident or natural. He would never be blamed or suspected.
If House Of Dragons is successful , HBO will contract GRRM for more shows. And that will hinder GRRM from writing the main story. So I am not gonna watch it. I hope it bombs.
Very interesting discussion! Hadn’t thought a lot about Braavos, lots of excellent stuff to think about when i re-read the books 👍🏻👍🏻
I watching this while cooking. Bravos is my favorite of the free cities, I’m hyped up for this
I do that regularly, it's a great companion for solitary work because of all the active chatter he has with everyone in the livestreams.
So happy to see this! Braavos has always been one of my favorite locations in ASoIaF. Reminds me of fond memories in Amsterdam.
Man, I hate missing streams. Listening a day late but enjoying it nonetheless.
2:32:00 The Tourney at Harrenhal would be a PERFECT stage play. As a poetic nod, it could even follow the Aristotelian unities by basing it only on the final day of the tourney and have the driving action be the identity of the mystery knight. Though personally I'd prefer the entire sequence of events with several settings like the godswood, tourney grounds, a castle interior, and various camp tents.
Well I finally did it. I’m caught up. I found this channel about a year ago and had seemingly thousands of hours of content. Now I’m “live”. Bittersweet. Thanks for the content during lockdown.
I'm still catching up....
I think I'm approaching the bottom of the well of his videos, finally. I'm really worried about that bittersweet feeling when I finally run though "all the rest of it."
Dang it! I keep missing these! Looking forward to Braavos. This reminds me of the Traveller’s Guide 😭🙏🏻 days. Carry on, Ser Robert. 📚 📖 👓
I'm surprised no one pointed out how much of Venetian history Martin used for Braavos (just like Hadrian's Wall inspired the Night's Watch) The lagoons, the canals, the financial might, the reliance on sea power and an Arsenal capable of building warships at scale, even the keyholders are all echoes of Renaissance Venice!
Another great Livestream thankyou .
Thank you so much for making that point about Syrio Forel. I also can't imagine that he would only disable Trent and then run away. And even supposing he thought he killed Trent, I think he would have tried to find Arya.
Your voice is amazing.
15mins in... Braavos is the London Paddington Station of Essos.
"All change, all change at Braavos"
Ahhhh I was actually awake for long enough last night to watch this, but I didn't have the alerts set correctly for some reason. Oh well, I'll enjoy it with breakfast instead.
As always, great topic! If I may make a suggestion, probably it would be interesting to make a live chat with a topic like "finances of westeros", similar to "justice in westeros". The Iron bank and its policy on supporting and expectation debts is very interesting and probably will be interested for more people.
Doesn't the motive of the Iron Bank trying to collect their money from the Iron Throne automatically put them into opposition to Winterfell? If the Seven Kingdoms fall apart, there is no longer an Iron Throne, then who would they collect from?
If the Sealord did shelter the refugee Targaryen kids, and broker the Dorne betrothal, then it makes sense to place a set of eyes (perceptive eyes!) in King's Landing as close to the Red Keep as possible, to generate intelligence on the present Baratheon/Lannister regime. A former First Sword picked for his situational awareness would be ideal.
They should totally change the tone for velarions jiurneys and make them like a buffy style motw thing!
🎵 ‘Cause I’m In Deep Geek
And I’m tryin’ to speak
Off the top of my head
About some nerdy topics 🎵
Reminds me of John Adams also securing a loan from Dutch bankers in 1782.
So one of the comments was from Ser Bobbert Ross. I assume the signal of House Ross is 3 Azure happy little trees on a titanium white field.
For a number of years I had you confused with another channel and cringed every time you showed up in recommendations. About a year or two ago, you were a guest on a live stream and I was like hey this guy is great he's not the person I was thinking about. Ive sinced watch a lot of your back catalog and you are one of my favorite channels for this genre. I thought once the show ended, with WoW still unreleased the GoTTubers would all just die off or start doing Top 5 Starks! type vids. Youve keep pushing out the content and its still interesting. Amazed you can go on for 2 hours and it doesnt feel like you are necroing threads from the ASoIaF. Ive really enjoyed all of these
Hey Robert long time listener. I know you'll probably never see this but I just wanted to take the chance to put a bug in your ear about a possible project. I've noticed lately that iceberg style videos are becoming popular again and clever me I also noticed that our wonderful community doesn't have any so tldr you should make an asoiaf iceberg video!
Unless Syrio was Jaquen hes positively dead. He died in accordance with his values as First Sword. As we learn to our sorrow, there are far worse fates than that in GRRM works.
Regarding the Dani in Braavos affair; I would be interested to hear how you think about Prestons "page of lies" series, where he adresses this and related issues. I myself are in between seats on this...@indeepgeek
Preston is hopefully trolling, because the idea of fake Dany has been debunked, and the narrative theme loses it's potential if Dany has some ridiculous back story.
Why would George write something so convoluted that meets an end with no meaning? It's conspiracy hunting for content on Preston's behalf
@@marting1984 Of course, making up theories and essential bullshitting together a story must be most fun a dedicated fan could have with an authors story. It is fair game (for me), well entertaining too, so I like to watch these videos. I am sadly not deep enough into the asoiaf background and lore, so I lack the ability to debunk or second any such theory; Robert for example knows the story well so he could probably see Prestons train of thoughts and respond while backing his opinion up properly with book facts. As far as I am concerned it could make sense that Dani is not a pure Tagaryen in that sense as it would be the exact opposite to John, who is living as a nobody/bastard while she has all the rage and name whilst being "less"; essentially stating that your heritage is not as important as the way you carry yourself. But I am really not that good in analyzing that kind of stuff and more of a bumbling bystander. Thank you for the answer anyways, will have a good thought about it.
@@Bloodredswan Preston mentions in his first or second video, the thread he got the idea from. I believe. Anyway, I comment on that first or second video about where to find that thread and the name of the user that debunks Preston's claims.
If you go back and find my comment, you can then follow the link. And I mention what pages to read to find the best parts of the debate. It's a long read, so maybe make yourself a coffee or something.
Is it just me or did the show make the gap that the titan stands on, a bit too wide?
Dani was in Pentos as a child.
I'm surprised Martin gets so sensitive about being asked about Syrio. If you're a writer and leave something ambiguous you can't be made when people come up with conclusions that counter what the writer thinks happened. Maybe if he didn't want us to make up our own conclusions he should have.
i think you missed the point. it was implied he died, and yall just refuse to believe it. he isnt sensitive, hes sick of wannabe experts trying to find something that isnt there, and he cant outright tell you to give up and move on without looking rude. he loves the speculation and discourse, but people now get mad he takes too long to finish a book and prvide answers, but he is still getting asked shit like this.
Hold on, if Syrio wasnt killed, he would have been thrown into the black cells
Then he may have been picked up by Yoren
Which means, he could be Jaqen
EDIT= Nah, the timeline doesnt quite fit, does it?
I don't think Meryn Trynt ever intended to keep him alive. He said, "Kill the bravosi. Bring me the girl."
I don't quite buy Littlefinger being the one responsible for Jaqen's presence in KL. Given that the FM are notably effective (and expensive), why would he bother with putting it in Joffrey's head to have Ned executed? Why would shrewd, business-minded LF shell out a mountain of money to have Ned killed, only to simultaneously plot to have it done for free? Hiring a FM necessitates no contingency plan, and LF would know that. It wouldn't make any sense for him to be behind both plots. I 100% believe he convinced Joffrey to have Ned killed. A shocking public execution of Ned plays exactly into LF's goals. A quiet assassination somewhere in the Riverlands not so much. Cersei is definitely the one who hired the assassin. Later, in AFFC, she tries the exact same thing (only this time with a Kettleblack). Promise to send him to the wall, have him killed before he can talk. It would be just like Cersei to not only try the exact same outlandish assassination plot twice, but to have it fail spectacularly both times as well.
Ned being murdered wouldnt advance anything unless it was pinned on the Lannisters. I think Jaquen is more of an agent/spy than an assassin. He's not at the Oldtown to kill anyone but to acquire something
@@larryhinkle9390 Cersei would have every reason to want Ned dead because he knew that her children were illegitimate, but she would want it to look like a random killing by some unknown violent criminal en route to the wall. Littlefinger benefited from the chaos that ensued after the surprise execution more so than Ned's death itself.
@@ballisstrife yes cersai had the motive. I meant for LF. Murdering Ned wouldn't have done anything for LF. I don't think cersai would spend the money either. She'd just give the sharpened tooth guy a a gold dragon to off him on the trip. I just don't think jaqen was there to kill anyone. He seemed to have mission. He could have gotten away but didn't
@@larryhinkle9390 Cersei is shown to be an incautious spender, I wouldn’t put it past her to go all in on something this important to her (not just the safety of her children but also the power that comes with their legitimacy). We’re definitely in agreement that LF didn’t hire Jaqen though
@@ballisstrife I think she might try seducing someone to do it or just send her boy toy. I dont think there was actually time between Ned's confrontation and his "judgement" to send a message to Braavos and get an assassin. Could be wrong but I thought she was against the execution. Could have just not wanted the political fall out but book cersai really isnt that good at that. But the beheading would have worked out better for her than sending him to the wall. IMO she would have had to have set the plan in motion while Ned was still investigating.
Also the only way LF could have afforded it is if he embezzled from the crown. I mean he was already doing that but some one like Ned would have to have been pricey. LF could have just bribed locals. He had no need to make it look like an accident or natural. He would never be blamed or suspected.
Where could Euron have gotten a dragon egg?
do the possible real world comparisons & science to milk of the poppy
Yea it's morphine/ heroin, best pain killer there is.
@@amandaofhouserobinson6707 i'll take 8
Hey!
:D
32:18
well DID meryn trant survived? if the theories can be trusted, syrio might be an faceless man
If House Of Dragons is successful , HBO will contract GRRM for more shows. And that will hinder GRRM from writing the main story. So I am not gonna watch it. I hope it bombs.