Never Tap to An Armbar Again (or How Defend Armbars with Leverage)
Вставка
- Опубліковано 30 чер 2024
- Rob Biernacki shares 2 proven methods using leverage to defend against (and hopefully escape) fully applied armbars in BJJ, no gi grappling and MMA. We cover how Vinny Magalhaes survived Fabricio Werdum's vicious armbar at ADCC 2011, the hitchhiker escape, and the technique Roger Gracie used to escape Buchecha's armbar at Metamoris 1.
There's a lot covered here, so if you want to jump ahead then here are the rough sections:
There are a few different sections to this video
- Overall introduction (0:00 to 2:10)
- How to position your body to lessen the power of your opponent's armbar (2:10 to 5:10)
- The hitchhiker escape (5:10 to 6:50)
- How Rob has tested this technique (6:50 to 8:14)
- The limitations of this technique (8:14 to 9:24)
- I try this defense with some limited success (9:24 to 12:58)
- Thumb up or thumb down to defend the armbar? (12:58 to 13:35)
- The Roger Gracie vs Buchecha armbar escape (13:35 to 15:05)
- The critical importance of controlling the shoulder in the armbar (15:05 to 15:51)
- How to train this technique safely (15:51 to 15:57)
Rob's instructionals include:
The BJJ Formula
(www.grapplearts.com/formula)
and The Modern Leglock Formula
(www.grapplearts.com/leglocks) - Спорт
This video makes me so very happy as I am both a scientist and BJJ practitioner :-)
Linda Perrotti i should practice with you
Same here! I was just about to make this comment.
psh, this is old news. Fillipo Vadi, a 15th century Master of Arms, wrote in the first chapter of his treatise on sword fighting:
*If someone would like to know and understand*
*If fencing is an Art or else a science*
*I say that you should note my opinion*
*Consider well my sentence*
*It is a true science not an Art*
*As I will show you briefly*
*Geometry divides and separates*
*With infinite numbers and measures*
*And fills with science his papers*
I just started Jitu Jitsu in may and am on my way to finish a chemistry major this year, so I can almost say this.
Then you should know how ridiculous the science part was 😉
I remember a Black Belt had my right arm in an arm bar!! I didn’t tap!!...Yours truly “Lefty.”
@Bob Mattel This actually made me laugh out loud.
lolololoolol
I find myself wanting the flexibility of shoulder as white belter allows me to escape the blue bell arm bar, but next day after body is calm the shoulder doesn't feel like new and I need my arms to type keyboard on work days 🤣 .... ;)
This is why you pull slack from the arm and pinch your knees, causing the shoulder to be stuck below the elbow, aswell as steering the thumb in an upward position.
Perfect timing on this video. I was just sharing this escape with 2 of my Purple Belts the other night. Thanks for making it easier on their lives! I can now share your video with them so they can review.
Hey folks, I misspoke when I said "insignificant sample size". I meant to say "biased or irrelevant sample" when referring to the validity of using white belts to study what works at the high level. I'm not as familiar with statistics terminology as I could be and when Stephan and I do long shoots I occasionally fuck up technical terminology.
do you believe the goal of teaching white belts bjj is to prepare them for high level bjj or to prepare them for the world?
It would technically be selection bias
I mean if we're inexplicably trying to use science jargon, it would go like this: a "sample" is never significant or not significant (you wouldn't say "insignificant" regardless). Significance refers only to inferential statistical analyses. In social science you can have internal and external validity. You're referring to external validity - that the sample reflects the population. Someone said that the bjj population IS mostly low belts, which is true, but not if your intended population is skilled, higher belts. Also, basically every sample is biased. A true random sample is more rare than a chupacabra-unicorn baby.
polishfish Thanks, I'm still figuring out the difference between mean, median and mode ☺.
A Plus Yeah I need to learn a lot more about statistics, clearly more than a little over my head with the terminology.
Both of those defenses/escapes are 100% on point! I was caught in a fully extended arm bar a couple days ago. He's a 210lb plus purple belt and I'm a 165lb black belt. I had to use every bit of that jiu jitsu science! I did everything in this video and I didn't know this video existed! If you react fast enough you can most definitely escape a fully locked in arm bar.
Stephan, you can always be counted on for quality content. Really interesting analysis of the biomechanics of the arm bar. Thanks for what you do for the BJJ/grappling community!
Thank you for the video. Awesome content. Stephen seemed amped up - possibly excited to be doing the video with you; and you transition him smoothly to the next explanation. Reminds me of good wrestling positioning. Great stuff; look forward to testing out.
Wonderful video, guys!
Great vid and perspectives!
Beautiful technique, wonderful explanation, and great display of comraderie. Love this
Great point about being able to finish by causing significant injury. I've seen many, many people in amateur MMA simply not tapped on armbars and the person applying not had the skill to finish.
Causing real physical damage isn't as easy sometimes as we would like to think. Even when you do cause damage with an armbar a lot of times that don't end the fight. A good example of this is Joe Maiani's fight I have on my channel.
His arm was severely broken early in the first but he continued to fight. At one point he was lifting the arm up and dropping it on his opponent's head. He finished the round and the fight was stopped. This shows the importance of being able to continue even after you have caused real damage to your opponent (or attacker). Damage does not always end a fight. Sometimes it just provides an advantage.
Most ammys are just white belts with less than a year of training.
thank u guys for the free lessons
Escape starts about 5:50
Bless your soul
Great information! Really like the approach to training.
Thank you for this channel
Might be 5 in the morning Stephan but i'm loving the video
excellent video! loved it! can't wait until I try this out, the concept looks legit though! Thankyou kind sir.
Nice video. This guy basically took old Catch wrestling ideas of using scientific principles (i.e. Scientific wrestling) and staying off the back (i.e. not being pinned) and techniques (bridging away) to a new audience under the label of Jiu jitsu. Although nothing new under the Sun, it's still a delightful video for the new generation. Love the no-ego discussion in the end. Good job.
First, thank you very much for putting together this excellent instruction!
A question about something said at 3:00 - "Most techniques taught by jiu jitsu instructors only work on white belts and blue belts. This is what we would call in science a 'statistically insignificant sample size'."
----------
As the vast majority of BJJ practitioners are white belts and blue belts, and the primary purpose of BJJ (other than competition BJJ) is defense against untrained attackers, wouldn't white and blue belts be the most statistically significant sample size?
I don't think he used the right words. I think a more accurate wording would be it's effectiveness. A technique that works against any skill level has more effectiveness than a technique that works mostly against lower skill levels. We need to train for effectiveness vs efficacy . Efficacy being only working in the ideal situation against someone untrained or at a low skill level.
Great content.
Cool! I love it. Thank you so much.
I would like to thank you for this video but also to make some observations which I think you should take into consideration... The escapes you are showing will put the shoulder in great danger, specially if you are not able to move your head underneath the opponent’s hips...this happens often as the opponent only needs to pinch the knees and put a bit of pressure with the calves. If you can’t move the head the escape won’t work. I think rotating the elbow first and trying to put the palm on the chest while rotating towards the opponent (i.e Roger Gracie arm bar scape against Buchecha in Metamor) would be more effective and won’t compromise the shoulder so much. On top of that, if the fight is with gi, it will be even easier to grab the rappel to secure that your elbow is on the safe side.
I hope this comment helps.
Cheers!
They can take my shoulder, but they’ll never take my elbow!!!
This helps!
I totally agree what this instructor is saying I’m a white belt and I don’t want to be learning submissions yet I want to be learning positioning, guards, grips, sweeps, takedowns. Before I move on to the next steps.
These videos make me want to start again.
i've always bridged when hitchhiking, was the way i as taught to do it, and that was like 8 years ago. though the reasoning at the time was not as such to take the pressure of, just rolling over your shoulder is much more explosive and faster than walking the feet round.
i’m not a bjj guy i’m a judoka and honestly the best way to defend from armbars is ether turning your arm so it isn’t in the position for it to break or just fallowing the person that has you in the armbar but i do this too and all it really does is by you some time to think of how to escape and possable get distance
Thanks for the informative technique I’m a white belt with one stripe so far. The shoulder bridging and turn your arm left and push the leg away from your shoulder
Stephan Kesting seems like such a nice guy too. He is talented with Jiu Jitsu, but hard to believe anybody would ever attack him anyway. He is sooo warm and friendly. And brave considering the kidney issues. Great person!!
That is why I would attack him!
When the arm is already extended rather than transferring to an arm wrestle position this will turn your arm into a bag of leaves, but I think the shoulder dropping suddenly is good to add somewhere in the regular hitchhiker method.
Keenans video studying Craig Jones armbar vs Gordan Ryans armbar is great on how to defeat this defense
i once did something out of instinct. dude was trying to separate my hands to do an arm bar, as we were struggling, i started rotating with my feet, so when my arm was isolated i had already rotated enough that his body was no longer perpendicular to mine but rather parallel. he was still holding my hand but the pain wasnt much,i freed my hand. dont know if he was bad or im a bjj genius xD
I super super agree that attacks should come after defense.
First off , I always struggled to get this to work due to teaching my guys to drag in with the heels and transition to heel kicks if the armbar fails.I pulled it of occasionally on them but as we were training for fighting rather than sport, the experienced folks would have messed me up.The other thing to note is that it doesn't work against a balistically applied armbar against the thigh.In summary, good for sport, not so great against someone who wants to hurt you.
I practice BJJ and study science. The reference made me happy :)
@3:02 It's not "a statistically insignificant sample size." It's a valid technique with limited generalizability.
Many people want to start their training by first learning self-defense techniques that work against untrained opponents. That's a smart place to start, especially if those techniques are easier to learn and there's some chance that the student will stop BJJ training before earning a purple belt.
Not everyone trains BJJ for sport.
Hopefully, this helps... The reason why Rob didn't tap, but Stephan felt more pressure was because of the alignment between Stephan's hips and feet were under his shoulders almost as if when their two bodies connected (in a typical arm bar) it looks like a cross, but if you look closely you'll see Rob tries to slightly shift his angle so that his hips and feet are almost aligned with Stephan's, almost horizontal. Which makes the arm slipped out from the "vice-like" clamp that usually occurs.
This guy is saying the truth. Most dont know how to really break an arm
(or listen to Rob explain scientific theory). Good video, though to discuss Rob’s thoughts about not using simplified theories (i.e. basic triangle from guard). That is that in science, that is exactly how we teach. You don’t teach quantum theory or string theory to beginners who don’t even know what the basic concept of what an electron is or the general properties they typically exhibit. You teach them Bohr’s model first, electric flow and then if appropriate you move on to more complex theories, they layer on top of each other. The simplistic layers (moves that work only on white/blue belt) can be still valid and utilised as well, in engineering we still use F = ma which is true for all intents and purpose at non relativistic speeds but the equation breaks down at high speeds, so bridges, machinery and the majority of engineered products in the world are made with ‘scientifically’ incomplete theories ( another word is abstractions, if you know some computer science theory) but they work well. They might not go up against higher level, more specialised problems (black belts) like gps systems on satellites which need to take into account the time dilation, but that is only a small component, the superstructure of the satellites will still be calculated and designed with F = ma. There are different levels of abstraction and typically you do want to teach the high level stuff (high abstracted, basics, like triangle from guard) first before going in the trenches and getting the finer details. It’s a mixture of pedagogy and abstraction, building confidence and small masteries furthers interest and learning. Not sure if you have been looking into it or have talked about it before, but look into metacognition, and the pedagogical theory behind, getting student to understand how they learn best and for them to use that understanding to increase their learning. I guess it is a little different though as you are also considering safety, but to build on the science based approach discussion, I just wanted to add some further points.
EtherealWinterWind nicely done
EtherealWinterWind While I completely agree with not trying to throw advanced theories at basic practitioners, I don't view posture as an advanced theory and the triangle as a basic theory. I view it the other way around.
If a practitioner doesn't understand the basic theory of posture and how to break it before attacking, then the triangle becomes a non functional technique because people attack it in a way that doesn't work on practitioners who understand the basics of posture.
Hopefully that clarifies my point in a way I was unable to do on the fly when talking to Stephan in this video.
I love this dudes philosophy toward jujitsu
badass 🥋
It works!!...I could feel my arm leaving the body!!!
While I don't think you can stay in that "sideways-half-hitchhiked" position indefinitely it certainly buys you enough time, like Stephen said, to complete the actual escape. So I still see a lot of value in this.
Garry Tonon had one of the craziest arm bar escapes ever vs Kron
Not so on the triangle setup I know another pro mma guy (more of jiujitsu guy) used that method for setup for triangle as well as I did when I competed. I always change it up but probably the best way for me.
that thumbnail is hilarious
Thats how my instructor teached me the armbar From the beginning: Keep Ur Heels tight to the body and the Neck and Pinch Ur knees together. This greatly reduces the amount of leverage needed for the Tap. Noone ever hitchiked Out that in my experience,but im Not a blackbelt lol
I think this is dangerous, I'm just gonna tap
I agree in training tap. But if you get in trouble in the streets you will have to get out.
Due not attempt this on your own, because this is advanced Black Belts level training and advanced body stretching techniques done properly and this isn't for people who learn from videos or are new students to grappling arts. There are secrets and levels to every martial arts techniques and only serious trusted life long students learn these techniques and tricks, there's a million counter techniques to every technique, im exaggerating, but you get it and these counter techniques will be so simple and easy, now you know why all the stretching is so important and why other arts like Chinese monks can stretch like a pretzel and are crazy flexible. Don't get your arm broken trying to copy this learn from a master.
张力 I tapped watching.
u can always tap, my dojo, isnt full of idiots that yank and try and hurt you, i known i am not trying to hurt someone.. if i go slow and they dont tap, ill hold but not going to break someones arm, ewww.
Some techniques require many factors to be considered, usually if someone is bigger and stronger you have to play a bit dirty, or just be smart and avoid those situations. be smart about it and you should be fine, avoid if possible, prevention is always best if possible, if not tap out no need to be macho and lose a limb or life.
How do you confront the situation where some one is new and do not know where where to stop ore may use to mutch force to fast?
He just basically said that this technique is based on body type. Which makes his original idea about belts and not getting that original triangle sort of mute. The idea of jiu-jitsu is that it is really based on your body type. I've seen that push triangle get hit all time by lanky people when their fighting shorter stubby people at the same weight. Basically, jiu-jitsu is not about biomechanics, it's about your own individual biomechanics. I really do believe that you grow faster when the head instructor is your body type because he understand your strengths and weaknesses. Long lank guys have a completely different game then short stubby guys.
Lift the wrist with tension above the shoulder. Trap in the middle of the legs. Squeeze the knees together and break the arm
That’s a dangerous game
How do I get in touch to come learn a week of skills! I've been doing bjj for 9 months now
Great video, but some of the science speak seemed a bit off to me. If you're looking at white belts/ blue belts as a sample size it's not statistically insignificant. You would assume that this group is the largest, so it's the most statistically significant. You could argue that black belts are anomalies. So, results from black belt on black belt matches can be ignored because these specific tests aren't necessarily representative of the general population ... or do I need to go back to school?
Jacob Leslie If the hypothesis being tested is what works at the higher levels to create good BJJ, then the results from white and blue belts are irrelevant. I may have phrased my point inelegantly, but that was the idea I was presenting.
Oh, absolutely! If you're testing for what works on black belts they should be excluded from the sample, but that's not the same as being statistically insignificant.
Jacob Leslie Agreed, I used the wrong term, I'm still learning statistics jargon and I screwed up.
Jacob Leslie exactly. I stopped listening to him after that. He doesn’t understand the basic definition of sample size vs a more accurate sampling method. He sounds like your typical dude who took one tangentially research-based class at uni and thinks he understands everything about the scientific method- then proceeds to misuse almost every term.
Anybody can become a black belt though
Ugh, had to stop at “statistical inference.” Yeah, everyone knows BJJ is a chess game involving biomechanics and other physics principles. Just too pedantic for me. Stephen summed it up with his “so I just rotate my shoulder and turn on my side.”
Yes.
We were taught to pull our heels in tightly, squeeze our knees together very tightly and control the hand pointing the thumb to the ceiling when attempting to finish our opponents in an arm bar trapping the elbow just below our knees. Applying pressure on the elbow between our legs with the thighs not their shoulder against the hips. Wouldn't proper technique nullify this escape?
Hurry and tell that slackass Werdum. Dude is obvs missing fundamentals. Same thing with all Garry Tonon's opponents. 👍
Shuts down the ability to rotate completely. Where the head goes, the body follows. I was taught the same way you were and nobody ever hitchhikes out.
Here is how I would do it. Instead of trying to pull out of the armbar, I would push into it and move the higher leg so that you would end up in guard.
*triangled
That move only works when your arms are clasped. The legs are too strong with only one arm, and like A Plus said, you'll get triangled.
Is crossing your leg the right technique. My instructor said we must pinch our knees together
If the person executing the armbar squeezes tight on the arm with their thighs, I don't think the "hitchhiker" escape works. Note Stephan had his legs loosely apart every time when Rob escapes. Can it work if the thighs are squeezing?
Wen briging with the arm bar follow and bend elbows seems to follow space and gve room for sholder and scopla to tuck under scopla at sholder
A better way than the sport version of doing this is to put the left (leg nearest the top of the head) leg over the shoulder as done but then put the right leg over the left and arm/shoulder with the foot under the head at the neck and the left leg over the right creating a better. This puts a compression lock on their neck and prevents biting on your leg if they are so inclined
The best trick to never tap is to take PCP before you roll. Disclaimer: you might die or possibly something worse.
Is this easier said then done? because rarely have I seen people escape armbars (especially at UFC ). I'm just left screaming at the TV... but then again some mma fighters don't really focus on JJ
No there is no easy solution to escaping deep submission attempts. Rob is just demonstrating a last ditch concept for surviving an arm bar attempt when you have already made several mistakes that led you to be in that position in the first place. Keenan Cornelious has used this defense several times if you want to find footage of this technique being used heres one video:
ua-cam.com/video/jeBnpwghh8Q/v-deo.html
There's dozens of simple counter techniques in all martial arts including jujitsu and judo, that most and some martial arts trainers and MMA trainers along with Gracie students that don't know secret counter moves masters don't teach and that's a fact and i would bet a million dollars Gracie family didn't teach secret techniques to their non family students and kept secret techniques to beat challenges, to keep the Gracie name and honor of being dominated in grappling.
So far I haven't come across anything in JJ that wouldn't be easier said than done
Took Rob 40 seconds to piss off all the 10th planet conspiracy theorists
Ro'ee Orland he's right
The CIA created that word to discredit those seeking the truth.
So since you love copying their words why don't you go work for the CIA mafia.
Starts at 1:50, then again at 5:14
It's a good technique. The counter is to change the fulcrum to the leg/thigh
Jay Farber or finishing the armbar on top if you are doing an armbar from mount
Yo!!!!!! At about 2:24 when he asked Stephan to apply pressure his elbow is hyper extending the other way.
Martial Lashley he has real flexible arms, I don't think he realizes that play a much bigger part than most of what he saying. I've applied armbar to guys who it seems are just double jointed and unless I lock there wrist in my armpit and wrench it they ain't gonna tap for shit I'm like bro your elbows aren't normal cause normal people would say what Steven said I feel pressure here I'm gonna tap
15:47
why cant the victim use his right leg and step on his opponent face(try to reach for the eyes)?
if the opponent blocks the legs, he release his grip for the arm bar
If only Tim Silvia had seen this before fighting Mir.
Hey is that the dude from Nanaimo?
Dangerous tittle
Even if it turns out that practicing this is terrible and dangerous in a class setting, it's good to know in self defense. You can attempt to escape when it's your only chance, and you won't be as surprised if someone has this defense. Still I'm leery about the idea of 'let them yank on your arm a bit just in case because you might be able to escape.'
But I think that's kind of what you're saying.
I learned this by my teacher
Just imagine Ronda Rouse opponents using and knowing this simple counter she wouldn't be champion and so famous, she would actually need more techniques to submit opponents, it's funny Ronda made her name from the Arm Bar and defeated numerous fighters and all they needed to stop that move was this simple flexibility counter, crazy isn't it.
Your elbow was also not under your rib cage not geyting you high enough to disable the fulcrum and releaving the breaking preassure
I see that shoulder getting messed up on that roll away.
Try this.... the arm thats being arm bared grab the tendon on the inside of your knee and lock it down pinching your leg closed. now use your free arm push the legs off. It buys more time with less risk
Also by biting the leg, you can free yourself, I saw in a couple of movies.
I ruptured my pectoral tendon doing this escape
Please don't try that trick when Ronda Rousey applies arm bar on you, LOL!
But it is true, people are different. Some people, you can have a good tight armbar on, causing pain, and they can turn out of it cuz their shoulder joints are like rubber bands. Not my shoulders. injured so many, times, I try to do that, and shred, pop!!
I just did Kesting's Podcast and you guys can listen to it and decide if you hate or like me even more as I am rather blunt. My vid 2 1/2 years ago and interesting enough talk about the same Werdum/Vinny match and same keywords and talking points, shoulder height off mat in relation to fulcrum, bio-mechanics etc on the other side on how to do this better B-mech and dual submission choke ua-cam.com/video/XvZNfxpP0bE/v-deo.html
And more on this armbar and another surprise one hard to defend you likely have never seen from KOB ua-cam.com/video/O9fzg_wYZkc/v-deo.html
For competition these things make so much sense, but if we are being honest wouldn't a lot of submission techniques be defeated by biting in a combat situation. No disrespect, honest question.
I remember seeing Dean Lister pull that one off
Yes, against Xande Ribeiro. Same move...thought Dean was done at that moment.
Cole .S yes!
you teach beginners to submissions so they have a goal when they roll. otherwise they have no clue as to what they are working toward and they lose interest
That was certainly allot of big words
There was a nice bit of aggression between the 2 of them throughout this clip anyone notice?😂
I'm a white belt at a Gracie gym in Brazil, I've been training for a year, at least 3 times a week (still a white belt though). When I was out of my home city, I went to train in another Gracie gym, in Boston, MA. The amount of blue/purple belts that could't apply a proper submissions was astounding. After practice, I asked that for how long they had been training, I found out most of those guys got their blue belt after about 6 months, that's fucking ridiculous. This one blue belt in particular caught me In an arm-bar that I couldn't escape (that's what brought me to this video), but wasn't causing me any pain or discomfort either, I could just stay there for days. He got pissed and started cranking my arm down really hard, but it still didn't make me want to tap. I feel like most of the BJJ school nowadays only want to keep graduating you to the next belt, while teaching you half-assed techniques that won't really work, so they make you really on force, which isn't the point of jiu jitsu.
time to train hitch hiker counter
Rob is probably a smart guy, but he's trying REALLLY hard to make sure other people think he's a smart guy.
RailroadRobber the greatest teachers make things understandable to as many people as possible.
RailroadRobber he’s just explaining things from his perspective of learning and understanding. I didn’t think he was coming across as trying too hard fwiw.
lol that's exactly what I was gonna say, using big words and statistics vocab in a jiu jitsu tutorial video just makes u look dumb n "tryhard"
I think that we need to understand that we can't assume the intentions of someone based on external actions.
For example what is the difference between acting and action?
wouldn't you be pinching your knees together increasing the leverage rather than letting the arm drop all the way to the crotch and then try to apply pressure?
Rob is dead right about not teaching the dangerous moves until the students understand basics. I've seen lots of people give up from injuries. Also, things like Stacking, standing takedowns, mismatched body weight, etc.
Tsyoshi Kozaka x Ricco Rodriguez.
TK escaped 2 monstrous ab's.
Matt Serra x Karo Parisyan.
Matt escaped Karo's ab *RAPID* fast. All "hitch-hiker" escapes.
PS... Knee bar option hiding out somewhere in that 2nd escape? :)
6:24 lmao so aggressive
Yeah it took the other guys breath away. He treated him like a piece of meat
The guy in red‘s not doing the same thing. Nothing against the teacher, but he’s not realizing what he’s doing different, which is he’s getting up completely on the shoulder. He’s not just using his feet the bridge, he’s using his shoulder as well. He’s putting his full arm and her himself while the guy in red put his arm only partly under himself and somewhat on the side. You have to get as high as possible. That’s the point. So put your full free arm under you to elevate your body. And bridge with your feet too.
U got to be fast to escape before that happen
If I do that, my arm is going to get broken. Lol
Less talk ...more doing. I bet if you just did it...we would understand. Generally enjoy your posts...keep up good work!
or you could just fucking listen unlike some low attention span child.