Inside a Timeguard coolglow nightlight with unusual glow tube.
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- Опубліковано 28 вер 2024
- I remember seeing these in the past. They're a night light that uses a little fluorescent tube as the lightsource. The current limiting is very simple, but the method of initially starting the tube is quite unusual, and very reminiscent of a traditional mercury lamp.
This product appears to be discontinued now, but might still be available online. It's intended for 220-240V use.
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Lighting enthusiast here :)
your mercury lamp sketch is quite good apart from the part of the resistor burning out, AFAIK the resistor is just a fairly normal carbon resistor
what your probably thinking of are safety lamps which will either have 1 of 2 types of mechanisms to extinguish the arc if the outer bulb is broken,
theres the 1st type which uses a SMALL tungsten filament in series with the main arc tube (this Is NOT a self ballast mercury lamp) which will burn out if the bulb is broken, disconnecting the arc tube
the second type uses a spring loaded mechanism as part of its frame so if the bulb breaks it all springs apart disconnecting everything
it is worth noting even without those features a mercury lamp will burn out eventually if run in air, due to the arc tube seals oxidising
(its also worth mentioning the arc tube is made of Quartz to withstand the high temperature and pressure of the arc, rather then explicitly for UVC transmission, that just happens to be a nice bonus feature :) )
I'll never get tired of the "Clive Cap Discharge Tester(tm)".
It could truly be called a 'digital' tester, because Mr Clive uses his digits.
Scientific Test #1: Poke it and see if it bites.
@@DijonFromage In case it wasn't obvious small caps are unlikely to cause any significant amount of capacitive shock. However even small caps can mess up signally through organs which is why you never want a current through you. Thats why its better (although still not really advisable) to discharge through your finger rather than say touching one side of the cap with one hand and the other through the circuit board through your other hand.
@@Furiends I know. Humor.
@@McNair1952 and that's why I was going to say when I first saw the first part of this comment agreed.
My recollection is that traditional fluorescent lamps do not pass much UVC, because their envelopes are made of traditional soda-lime glass. Germicidal lamps generally use fused quartz or some other glass that readily passes UVC.
That, and the phosphor coating absorbs UV, to convert it to visible light.
Wow, I missed these night light so much, I used to have a lot of these with different colors as a child
' "Dumet" is a portmanteau of "dual" and "metal," because it is a heterogeneous alloy, usually fabricated in the form of a wire with an alloy core and a copper cladding.' - Wikipedia. So, no, it isn't a French word, though it looks like one.
It's not in my Petit Robert, I'm guessing the french term might be bimét, a shortening of bimétallique. Or maybe they adopted the English term. But anyway, I'm off on my ducycle with my dunoculars to do some oiseaux watching. ..
@@raykent3211 French Wikipedia gives "Bilame" as the equivalent of "bimetallic strip".
@zh84 I agree, I'm fairly sure it's du-met not du-may
I love when you "digress"... that's where the best information is found!
He's like my junior high geometry teacher. "You know, that angle is about the same as the cellar doors on my parents' old house. When I was 10, someone had left them open, so when I snuck into my Dad's car, and accidentally put it in reverse, it went careening down the steps, making a God awful racket, all the way into the basement. ..."
We made it our mission to get him telling stories every class.
"but we're not going to find out because i'm going to takeittobits" - HAHAHAHA
A ghoulish blue-white shimmering haze reflecting off the otherwise dark walls - so relaxing!
A nightlight that's blueish white? What kind of horrible person thought that's a good idea?
An idiot.
@Rick Delair do you have any proof of that UV leakage and sleep cycle interference? I'm very curious.
@Rick Delair Sleep cycle disruption wasn't even on my mind for the most part, I really just dislike cold light colors with a burning passion lol.
@Rick Delair Sounds like bullshit. Florescent lamps emit more UV than LED lamps
"there's only one way to find out"
I thought he's gonna break it :D and breath in the mercury vapour while doing that.
I was thinking the very same thing :)
I was so tempted to break it, but wanted to keep it intact.
Cody's probably going to try this now to see how deep his voice gets when breathing pure mercury.
@@gcewing I'm pretty sure Cody's at least 4% mercury by now, if not more...
Since you can basically backlight a room with 2.5W LED light power, i think they may have recycled these tubes.
Making money of old stock.
is there any datecode on the device/pcb or the tubes?
Or did they just never stop making them identically since 1960 ?
Seeing the pcb beeing fixed manually shows that the work-time must be hellofalot cheaper than better pcbs.
Of course recycle or getting really cheap somehow gets the same,
if all the manufacturers of fluorescent lamps have massive overproduction/large stocks which nobody wants anymore.
Judging by the size i could see two or 4 of these beeing used in old emergency exit signs, or to light single stairs / escape routes from the side...
edit: why does it say "to be used in vertical position only" ??
edit2: does it say 2009 as a year on the pcb ?? LEDs wherenot that cheap/good 10years ago, so a lost fight for the old tech ??
It does say 2009
Looks like a good tube shape to use 7 of them for a numeric segment display.
That's the cutest little glow tube I have ever seen. Then again I haven't seen a lot of glow tubes.
Please don't hesitate with the digressions. Like condiments - not needed but does make it more tasty.
“Verily, verily, I say unto you, Take it to bits!” -Big Clive (probably)
JMC Electromet are the world's biggest manufacturers of Dumet wire. It's made of an Iron core, shrouded in an Oxygen-free Copper sheath, annealed, and sometimes sold as oxidised and can also be Nickel plated. Thanks for an interesting insight, Clive. Might just buy one for the novelty value, despite the awful power factor. It's possible that the epoxy filler in that capacitor had not finished hardening before it was used in the lamp, and that some of it poured out before it finally set. Therefore, it's possible that someone skimped on the catalyst in the mix. Might even have been made on-site, as and when they were needed. JIT manufacture being pushed to the limit!
You have been on my recommended for so long, and i have been watching them now and then. I realized I miss your voice, so here have a sub
I know, right? It's like, his voice is so calm that you want to fall asleep at night, listening to his videos. But, you can't, because they're too darned interesting.
Hah. Maybe if you pick your favorite video, and play it every night.
I wish I'd had a video of him reading Goodnight Moon, when my kids were little. They're grown up now, but maybe it won't be too long till I can watch these videos with grandkids. Never too early to start teaching them about electronics. "Now, Little Byt, we never use our fingers to check if a capacitor is holding a charge, like the nice man does."
Loved the part about the mercury vapor lamps. I work at a school and a couple years ago I got elected to go to the top of the stadium lights and change all the metal halide bulbs (which seem to be almost the same as mercury vapor). They're 1500 watts each and they're absolutely huge and I was fascinated by their construction. Looked way different inside than an ordinary incandescent bulb. Now I know how they work!
The metal halide lamps have a different igniting system. They usually have a module inline that adds a series of high voltage spikes to the current limited supply to strike the lamp.
Seems anachronistic given that pretty much any low voltage lighting is better done with LEDs these days.
I used to have a fluorescent night light which worked very much the same way but it was 120V. It was very effective.
Bigclive, if you are worried about digressing because your explain how the street light work, I learned a lot tho. So your digression is cool. I don't know about other folks aleast I learn something interesting.
1/3 of Clives own Flux Capacitor....
I was just going to say something like that. Agreed.
The 68nF capacitor it's for "feel alive" when you touch the plug just after removing the light from the mains.
I love the way you discharged the capacitors. It would have been even funnier if you had used your tongue.
Thanks for mentioning dumet wire. I looked it up. Very interesting.
Self-ballasted Mercury Vapour lamps are very interesting. I got a few years ago as surplus from a council (they were a cheap way of upgrading tungsten street lights) and they all still work, two outside the house and two in the loft.
@Rick Delair Totally. I have to say the self-ballasted ones are slightly more useful to me as they give off useable light straight away whilst they're warming up, but if I had the option at the time I would've gone for normal mercury vapour lamps with separate ballasts.
I don’t understand a lot of what you say but your voice and enthusiasm and curiosity just really makes me keep listening regardless :D
I tried the Big Clive discharge method on a strobe light cap once, you only do it once, when I was young and was involuntarily relocated across the room. Happy days.
Ouchies I vaporized the tip of a screwdriver once By acibent but I can't remember what type of device it was and we're in a circuit or whatever but packed a heck of a punch I don't know how much current with it but I'm sure it was over hundreds of amps and not sure what voltage the camp was because it was so long ago I don't even know what time it was but whenever I know it has a ginormous capacitors and I had attempted to discharge but I didn't rise for a discharge from there was an open connection and that was a problem that was vexing media fine white wasn't working. Soap with no words always go from one side to the other and don't rely on any other wiring I learned my lesson.
Strobe light capacitors are about 10 times the capacity. They really pack a punch. Don't ever try it with a camera flash capacitor: OUCH!!!
@@aaronbrandenburg2441 well said Aaron
Ive still got a few old mercury street lights and they dont tend to create a greenish white light but more of a high intensity white light although over time as the phosphor degrades, the green arc tube can be seen more creating that greenish white light.
The old style of mercury street light were 'open bowl' with a holophane glass ring around the bulb to direct the light or something like that but obviously a few rocks and a bit of anti social behaviour ment that those early mbf street lights didn't last very long.
Reminicent of the days when electronics were hobbled together with discrete components and stuffed into a box. Miniaturization was not a primary consideration. It made diagnostics and repair much friendlier.
The Sega Game Gear uses one of those lights for LCD backlight. Wrapped in a very nice reflector.
That's right I have CDs in back lights before I knew Restless like that but been so long ago I'd forgotten.
Bigclive is going to help me pass my electrician school
I wish I was as smart as Clive.
I question that 100 Ohm series resistance. At 240 volts, that would allow spikes up to 2.4 amps when the tube "arcs over". a 1,000 Ohm resistor seems more appropriate, for the low current glow discharge tube.(.24 amps) It might be worth it to put the Ohm meter across that resistor, because sometimes it's difficult to tell brown from red on the 3rd color band, or, if it's a 1% resistor, it's difficult to tell red from orange.
Dunno why, but every time you say "take it to bits" I add a bit of evil laughter in my mind.
thank you for explaining the street lights. I did not know about that!
right clive mate my friend just sent me a link to your Poundland glue gun video and I am now slightly obsessed with your channel aha.
Whew, didn't think I would ever enjoy a video about a nightlight
I like your digressions. Keep up the good work.
ahh yes. Gymnasium lights :), never was under one when nobody knew it was broken but seen people with a heck of a sunburn after figuring that out.. think I was 15 or so when that first happened :) Those are protected by a cage usually but sometimes that don't help and not sure if those are different from street lights.
haven't seen one of the above since one from Lights of American CFL nightlight. Missed it ever since .. lasted forever. it just wouldn't give up, outlasted some of the LEDs which rotted out.. wonder what a tesla coil (small one? ) would do to this :O one of the few cool DIY kits out there
What kind of tube is this? Is it fluorescent? Why isn’t there a starter module like a standard fluorescent? I believe there’s more in those modules then in this circuit.
yup, you dont want your earth pin to break off in the socket...
I wonder if that goup in the cap is to seal up audible noise. I had a PC PSU that had a cap that would become audibly noisy when the computer it was in went into particular power states. Took awhile to track it down but when I did I added a little bit of soft epoxy at the base of the cap and it remained quiet until the day it died.
It was singing until the day the power supply died. Hahaha think of the song American Pie.
Have you ever taken a florescent light fixture apart and done a circuit diagram for a unit with two or four lamps. Also include explaining the different end connectors (conductors referred to as toumbstones that can be connected to each other or not). I've found that the replacement ballasts being sold have a terrible suggested circuit diagram that often conflicts with the original ballast. Thanks.
The electronic ballasts are very different to the traditional ones. They often share common connections between tubes.
You are correct. But over and above that, the wiring diagrams on new electronic ballasts are still confusing when one tries to replace a failing ballast. The colour and number of the wires are not consistent at all. Furthermore, the sockets (toumbstones) used are un-differentciated. So buying and installing a replacement ballast is a bit of a challenge. In my case I found a four bulb failing ballast installed in a two bulb light yet it had worked for many years. The internet is also not very helpful explaining the "how" and "why" in the way wiring should be understood to work. Your channel could help... a lot.
Thanks for your reply. ;-)
Thank you Mr. Clive for the knowledge you share and the entertaining way you do it. Just a thought, you should give away your note pads or at least some pages out of them when they are full. I'd hang a Clive schematic on my way anyday.
That would be an awesome idea did we as a giveaway if somebody send you something they get a notebook.
probe start fluorescent lamp, really unique
I had to take exams in a huge hall lit by mercury vapor lamps and it was really annoying and some flickered.
Imagine the horror if the shutter earth pin broke off in the socket. I imagine the pile of dead people forming in front of your socket.
I saw a shutter defeating adapter at the store and there was at least 46 dead people lying beside it, and it hadn't even been removed from the package yet.
Earth pin? We call it a ground. I like that moniker.
Got something interesting for you : a mcb that is switchable between 100 and 70A. From an old celco( which was speced at 500/phase.
Will leave it at the gate for tattoo... Or feeder 11
you could ajust your frame time to improve the flicker.
Awesome Video!
Interesting about the three electrode ended fluorescent lamp here. Never seen one like that, nor would I ever have considered igniting a tube with an aux electrode like the MV lamps.
Still, I guess producing the tubes like this gives the manufacturer's a bit more freedom as to how they're ignited.
One issue I can think of in this application is using the capacitive dropper might allow pulses of current to pass when the AC changes polarity, potentially darkening the ends of the tube quickly.
If I were designing this unit, I'd probably still use the capacitive dropper, but then rectify the AC to DC, and smooth with a larger capacitor for a shimmer free operation.
I'd certainly take advantage of the aux electrodes for ignition, as they've done here.
Shame about the cold blue color temperature of the tube.
I still use the old fashioned 7w incandescent type for lighting the room at night, and it's warm glow can't be beat.
I can't imagine having a blue or cold white LED as a night light. It would be too eye piercing.
The problem with DC is that one electrode would do all the work. Some of the fluorescent hand lamps worked like that and used to grill the tube at one end.
aaah.. a fresh bigclivedotcom asmr video :D
I replaced a little U shaped florescent lamp in a caravan light fitting and each end (side) had two pins, all 4 pins were tightened into a 4 way connector block but only 2 wires were into the connector block, 1 each end of the lamp. Why would it have 4 pins and only 2 be connected?
That's common. They drive the tubes cold cathode style, which results in a very short tube life.
@@bigclivedotcom that way they can sell you another one at £8 each I suppose!
aie aie the capacitors have discharge resistors :P Was that the capacitor game?
Change the cameras shutter speed so the hopi meter wont flash
(If your using automatic mode, you should change the desk light brightness in a way that makes the flashing stop)
Would it work better (read: has less flicker) if you added 4 diodes to turn the ac into dc for the tube.
if you run this type of tube on dc it would burn out way faster
And the dropper circuit would malfunction, and you'd need a much more complex driver instead.
What is the power factor if the capacitor across the mains is removed?
it ain't a resistive diode? Also, they're using constant heat (or arc wire) to illuminate the tube? the wee little neons I saw in (emergency light backups signs back in the 90's) were a little cold bulb so it stays on many hours compared to an incandescent light, also it was easier to see in a dark room :) apparently were expensive made by Philips or Sylvia. :)
If anyone has any information for a Lincoln when he sings on UA-cam videos put it right here.
It might be possible to change the camera's shutter speed to reduce flicker.
The discharge lamps are available with internal igniter and external igniter. At least the sulfur discharge ones.
rimmersbryggeri I think you mean “Sodium” discharge.
@@elonmask50 Yeah thats what I meant
Thanks. Sulfur lights are the green house ones.
Love your videos! Where can I purchase a "HOPI" like yours I live in Canada and googled searched and found none.
I'm not sure. It's a while since I bought it, and it wasn't common then.
@@bigclivedotcom Thanks for the reply. sent you $20 CAD for a Pint or two. Cheers! again thx for informative tear downs.
@@randythompson7572 Thanks Randy. Much appreciated.
This seems like the extra electrode you added to your "Jacob's Ladder " in order to sort of pre-ionize the air...cant remember what you called it
The Gabriel electrode.
Interesting digression. There still are things I don't know. Check off one from my list.
Hi Clive. My daughter makes traditional Japanese "Shoji" lanterns and I used to use very similar tubes to these in the miniature ones.
The tubes I used to get were better quality than these though , with just two wires to each end and the tubulation was in one end not sticking out of the side like that. They were warm white too. I used to get them from CML , but you are quite right , RS and Farnell used to sell them . You could get them in two lengths and buy just the bare tubes or get them complete on a little strip of board pre-wired with the resistors. I just used to run them with 3 x resistors , one main one in series and the two "starting" resistors.
I still have some on the shelf . (They are no longer available , haven't been for some years) . We use LEDs in the Shoji lanterns anyway now.
Also , you are quite right , those nightlight ones use a short filament as the "main" electrode and a single wire as the starting probe. Tungsten filaments make good robust little electrodes , even when they aren't heated as such (other than by the discharge).
How do you know so much about so many things
I find it easy to absorb technical information.
@@bigclivedotcom I found it for many years that's the same way with me by the way I have autism.
you could break off the earth pin all together since it does not serve any purpose in this case unless the "anti child putting stuff in the outlet shutter" is on the ground hole.
actually i suspect you can actually fix the hopi flicker it is possible that there is a capacitor/resistor dropper and single diode to provide a crude ripple laden dc to the leds common pins.
i think you can add a bigger capacitor across the supply for the display to smooth out the dc better.
manufacturers often dont bother to fully filter the power to the led supply as the it lights ok with just a single diode to get crude dc
i suspect why the diode was replaced with a resistor is because bulbs like that dont like dc as they will burn out sooner or electro plate the one end.
that nipple on the tube is a perfect way to let the vacuum off when disposing of crt tubes from tvs.
i have heard older picture tubes can explode more like implode if struck in the wrong way so snapping off the nipple is one of the safest ways to let off the vacuum.
on most tubes the nipple is hidden behind the end cap so you normally dont see it.
the tube here is so small it probably was not practical to put the nipple o the end so they put it on the side
On some/all UK Outlets the ground pin is required to operate the shutters on the live and neutral
datz realy got my atention 😮
So this is working like a cold cathode trigger tube, and that's interesting. You could do experiments with these tubes, in the very early days, trigger tubes were even used for computing. www.r-type.org/articles/art-131.htm
You know if you lengthen the shutter speed of your camera you’ll get rid of the flickering
I will be glad when florescent lights go the way of the rotary phone. They really bother my eyes to a decent degree.
@Rick Delair Yeah but most people won't notice the flicker that florescent lights have. The neurological issue I have with my eyes make me notice it. Kind of distracting. I also find the LEDs easier on my eyes. Though I would prefer the old incandescent lights. Those don't bother my eyes nearly as much. Google Visual Snow. You will be surprised what some people see.
what what..?Big Clive has a mercury vaper?? them Manx Beard Club boys are #ffing hardcore! 👜👜💨👍☣⚡
Packaging = 2W
Back of actual device = 3W
Hopi tester = 1W
Take your pick :)
Wouldn’t running red electrical tape fix the flicker on the hoppy?
That moment you find a board with the 2nd resistor and the 2nd diode right next to each other ...
Timeguard - there was me expecting an epic time travel device :(
It is. It's using components from the 1980s.
@@lwilton agreed I thought maybe it was part of a fux capacitor or set up.
Maybe you should try to put 1.21 gigawatts to that fluorescent tube and see if he can travel back to see his own videos in the making.
That might be the lowest power factor I've ever seen
ive seen a dimmer do worse
pe6o991 why is this bad?
@@putrid.p The current is still flowing, even though it's not actually "consumed" by the actual appliance. For such a small, low-power device it may not be overall bad, just bad relatively, but the more appliances do that, and do it heavily, the more the electricity companies have to provision for this "ghost" current, and the more likely they will begin to charge domestic customers for their efforts like they already do, and have to do, for commercial, large-scale consumers.
09:00 DIY people here are using them to expose photosensitive lacquers in PCB making process.
It's not an ideal wavelength for that. They'd be better using UVA tubes.
@@bigclivedotcom Yeah well. I'm not saying it is ideal. I Am saying i know few individuals who are using them. Big advantage probably is cost. You can get this UV tubes for free as a scrap (with balast). Since a lot of cities and villages are changing public lights. Free is hard to beat.
Ah, I remember seeing _kids_ exploding sodium lights in a river when they were smashed - just saying what I saw ;-/
Actually you're supposed to break and get wet as a means to dispose of them for my understand in some cases. Not dealt with them myself.
Strange audio gating going on in this video. Hmmm....
Yeah. Noise gate on the phone I record with. It can't be disabled.
Get a deathdapter when you don't want a fake ground pin breaking in a socket
Warnig! Discharging Caps! Ee ee ee eee ee. Done! :D
Change frame rate.
I miss your goofy clips
I second that and infinity that
I wonder if the capacitors are rejects and they have patched up the yellow. Anything is possible with the Chinese.
I was wondering that myself.
Am I the only one who thought that by 8:50 the diagram had become somewhat vulvic? 😳
I disassembled a dead electric scooter and got a motor a motor controller 2 batteries and a switch and a strange button
eh eh eh eh eh! Well, it's discharged now!
Hack the light with a COB and a LED driver.
Rick Delair tell us how you really feel. LEDs are fine and much safer than white gas camping lanterns.
Very shoddy soldering, upper left corner of the pcb shows the right pin of the capacitor in a suspicious puddle
How´s everyones experience with nightlights?
Over the past decades, incandescents proved to be reliable. Sure, they will fail sometime, but given the low wattage, they last quite a while.
EL nightlights: Utter crap. I never had one surviving more than some weeks. Maybe bad luck.
LED nightlights: Not so much better than incandescent ones. Typically the LED´s are driven too hard, causing the die or the phosphor to degrade. Last no more than 2, maybe 3 years.
Actually fluorescent tube one´s seem to be the most reliable & long-lasting whilst giving out a reasonable amount of brightness. At least for me.
Neon lamp nighlights will run for decades, albeit dim. Just my personal experience.
@Rick Delair found the John Birch Society
Seems to know a lot about throwing stones at street lights.
Repairing the aftermath.
*Chewb.* That is all.
Why is the 1/10 power factor bad?
If the utility company charges for VA (which smart meters can be programmed to do) it will cost 10 times as much to run.
2:44 hahaha
press 2... repeat as needed...
and what would be the reason for people to throw rocks at street lights on a regular basis? I get it that there is always an idiot or two but make it a common thing sounds strange to me.
I guess they look very inviting... I sort of remember the mercury ones being closer to the ground than the sodium ones which would make them more invitingto stone throwers I suppose - probably due to the rather crappy light they put out that just made everything look grey like Clive said.
Well that and disabling it for other purposes be it good or evil
a nightlight that doesn't include a light sensor to know when to turn itself on or off? how useless and silly!
edit: now i understand why street lights always flicker when they first turn on.
Would an LED be colder? hahahah. You'd probably need a heatsink ?
LOL to the extreme
A suggestion... I was looking for... "dodgy" electronic devices. Do a "Dangerously dodgy devices" playlist. Meanwhile I will enjoy you doing inappropriate things to unassuming tronics.
I agree with that playlist also make the weirdest Electronics playlist in also the most overcomplicated Etc. And also the most useless. Also do useless devices for this and I like what John Ward does.
It might have changed color a little if it was allowed to warm up.