Interview with a Quant from Two Sigma (My brother)

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  • Опубліковано 19 тра 2024
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КОМЕНТАРІ • 868

  • @vectorle
    @vectorle 6 років тому +2557

    4:15
    Virgin Data Scientist: "I've heard a lot of the term 'alpha,' what does that mean?"
    Chad Quant Researcher: "That's typically what my coworkers refer to me as"

  • @TechLead
    @TechLead 6 років тому +3400

    Is this the guy I've been day trading against? I want all the money I lost on oil commodities back.

    • @17teacmrocks
      @17teacmrocks 6 років тому +58

      the vast majority of all trading is done intraday today. we're all day traders.
      the main difference is sophistication level. on one end, you have the basic level retail traders reading 'news' and point-clicking on a website or mobile app. on the other end, you have ppl formulating arbitrage equations and using HJB to solve argmin solutions to these systems.

    • @compassbrian
      @compassbrian 6 років тому +6

      $SVIX$

    • @sergeyegorov7396
      @sergeyegorov7396 5 років тому +5

      Can we talk about it? Do you use HFT?

    • @sergeyegorov7396
      @sergeyegorov7396 5 років тому +5

      Teringventje why do you think that a quant doesn't make money? Do you know the hedge fund Renaissance Technology, James Simons, especially Medallion Fund, or Edward Thorp?

    • @jamiepierce5038
      @jamiepierce5038 5 років тому +5

      Quant researchers look for new pricing models (i.e. by researching). Desk quants and traders are the ones that actually implement these models and make the money

  • @Crux75
    @Crux75 6 років тому +1365

    "this is my quant"
    "what?"
    "MY QUANT - TI - TA - TIVE"

    • @buckliu366
      @buckliu366 6 років тому +68

      Classic

    • @montanacaleb
      @montanacaleb 6 років тому +248

      Look at him, he doesn't even speak english.

    • @Shimshonn
      @Shimshonn 6 років тому +167

      His name is YANG!!!

    • @Friendznco
      @Friendznco 5 років тому +139

      look at his eyes

    • @santa55monica
      @santa55monica 5 років тому +107

      That's racist

  • @suf8477
    @suf8477 6 років тому +1792

    when you think you're pretty well off, being a University of Waterloo alumni, landing a job in FB, growing youtuber/influencer, upgrading from a pre-teen loft bed to a full adult double bed, but somehow, just somehow, theres always that one sibling who seemed waaAYYYyy on another level haha

    • @KP-dd2ci
      @KP-dd2ci 5 років тому +170

      Yes, that brother who graduated top of his class and is likely clearing $1mill at 2 Sig. Tough.

    • @user-pe7gf9rv4m
      @user-pe7gf9rv4m 5 років тому +118

      Ling Ling study stochastic calculus 40 hours every day

    • @gw4583
      @gw4583 5 років тому +16

      I'm only replying to this because I'm about to graduate from Waterloo.

    • @brijeshhota9293
      @brijeshhota9293 5 років тому +5

      @@gw4583 Hey Buddy, I know it's pretty random but I'm actually applying to Uwaterloo as an international student for undergraduate and I really wanna get in. Can you share your social platform contact details so that we can communicate in any ways?

    • @krishrai2875
      @krishrai2875 5 років тому +1

      @@brijeshhota9293 same , are you indian , and can we work in the us if we our international students studying in canada

  • @bluelemonade6200
    @bluelemonade6200 4 роки тому +175

    “Favorite programming language?” “I don’t care”

  • @MattyBeastHD
    @MattyBeastHD 3 роки тому +42

    “I don’t consider myself a genius” - every genius

  • @BigJoeyGomez
    @BigJoeyGomez 3 роки тому +38

    This was equal parts informative and wholesome. The back and forth between these two is great.

  • @joshuajoshua46
    @joshuajoshua46 6 років тому +101

    He said "they can make...", and I thought he was about to 100k. "Then he said "200k with half a mil in bonuses. " ma heart dropped.

  • @tigerrx7
    @tigerrx7 6 років тому +22

    David you’re my new role model, so smart yet so chill! I happen to like the humble bragging too

  • @Dgsrgv
    @Dgsrgv 5 років тому +27

    this guy is a mastermind at creating his videos. Im impressed. After all he is a data scientist. His able to collect statistics from his viewers in the form of their comments/opinions and analyze them before making his next videos and hes done a great job at it. As for the structure of his contents, i give a thumbs up. He never tells his viewers why he is depressed, but leaves the viewer wondering when he tells them he quit his job at the end. He played us good. its all a "chess game"

  • @mdougf
    @mdougf 4 роки тому +20

    Joma, thanks man. This is a great interview. Truly from the perspective of somebody interested in becoming a Quant, you truly ask all of the right questions. You're great at what you do. Thanks G

  • @byteaesx1373
    @byteaesx1373 5 років тому +51

    Having a good brother like yours is priceless.

  • @leeritenour
    @leeritenour 6 років тому +607

    If you listen to David with your eyes closing, you would probably think that was Elon Musk talking.

    • @RAJohnson713
      @RAJohnson713 6 років тому +41

      yes! i was gonna say the same thing. He pauses a lot like Elon

    • @KP-dd2ci
      @KP-dd2ci 5 років тому +52

      You deserve a job at 2 Sigma for that observation. Nailed it.

    • @Riler12456
      @Riler12456 5 років тому +7

      Hold shit lol just noticed

    • @georgemavimbela
      @georgemavimbela 5 років тому +1

      true I fully agree

    • @timqiao8293
      @timqiao8293 5 років тому

      Yi-hsiu Lee holy shit i just realized

  • @leeritenour
    @leeritenour 6 років тому +10

    It's always great to see such diversity even in one family. At the end of the day, it's not about which brother is better or smarter. It's how you complement and support each other. I think Joma is doing a great job on his own path right now. Life is a journey to find one's destination. Just keep on moving, Joma!

  • @chukwuka-steveorefo1812
    @chukwuka-steveorefo1812 6 років тому +19

    Great upload Joma, very insightful!

  • @farinzahanmoon8580
    @farinzahanmoon8580 6 років тому +34

    The reason I love this series so much it gives me so much new and interesting information I would have otherwise not known. Really great initiative, even if the vids are lengthy, they really give you great insight and knowledge. Keep it up Joma oppa!

  • @terenterenteren8301
    @terenterenteren8301 6 років тому +5

    I really enjoyed the interview . Thanks for putting this out. Quality content.

  • @ay920
    @ay920 6 років тому +10

    Wow. Love you guys' brotherly love. Your parents must be very proud of you both.

  • @jammy2003
    @jammy2003 6 років тому +145

    David seems to be a more polite and quite guy as opposed to Joma, but hey they both doing great with their careers, so thats cool!

    • @tristenallen4983
      @tristenallen4983 3 роки тому +4

      Is it just me that can hear some Elon Musk in his voice?

    • @mistahozzy
      @mistahozzy 3 роки тому +1

      Yeah I’d hate to be the broke brother tho

    • @UrbanMatts
      @UrbanMatts 2 роки тому

      @@mistahozzy lmaoo

  • @WeAreOnePiano
    @WeAreOnePiano 3 роки тому +353

    Are these guys actually brothers? Joma literally knows nothing about him lmao

    • @hanhai8515
      @hanhai8515 3 роки тому +146

      he is joking, he is acting like he doesn't care so his brother's accomplishments are not that intimidating

    • @tbcfrankee
      @tbcfrankee 2 роки тому +31

      seems pretty normal to me. all i know about my brother is how old he is

    • @renesh
      @renesh 2 роки тому +3

      @@tbcfrankee bruhh

    • @DieLazergurken
      @DieLazergurken 2 роки тому +5

      @@hanhai8515 is this the 3rd layer of irony or haven’t you caught the 2nd layer?

  • @wajdanali1354
    @wajdanali1354 11 місяців тому

    Loved this video man. Glad to see brothers acknowledging each other. God bless !

  • @effy1219
    @effy1219 6 років тому +52

    the tech side creativity has been well explained here, he's cool, this episode kills

  • @alrod9535
    @alrod9535 3 роки тому +2

    Super informative! Keep up the great work guys. Love the variations of Java the Hutt pop ups during the interview. Hysterical.

  • @mathiaspiletti5871
    @mathiaspiletti5871 6 років тому +100

    Joma, this interview was so fruitful, that a 8 hours version, would be appropriate next time we have your brother on the 'show'!

  • @MoSAidaIrish
    @MoSAidaIrish 6 років тому +84

    More of this content plz 🙏

  • @lulouisehan4134
    @lulouisehan4134 3 роки тому +4

    Very real and relaxing conversation, love that. Just be yourself and don't have to be smarter or what

  • @Mayor1248
    @Mayor1248 3 місяці тому +28

    Should I give up on Trade?
    What should I do?
    How may I do better?
    What I'm I doing incorrectly?

    • @Mayor1248
      @Mayor1248 3 місяці тому

      here is my problem I have been making losses trying to make trade. I thought to trade demo is just like the real..can anyone help me out or at least tell me on what to do.

    • @maureen...
      @maureen... 3 місяці тому

      I always advice new members to have an orientation on how it works before getting involved. Trade offers more benefits than just holding.

    • @maureen...
      @maureen... 3 місяці тому

      Kate Floretta
      Face book

    • @user-uy8yt7ku4w
      @user-uy8yt7ku4w 16 днів тому

      @@Mayor1248 stop gambling. If you wan't to make money, get a Quant job. Or any other high paying job really. And invest what you have after your expenses in some ETFs and large trusted companies, long-term. You will NEVER make that much money gambling on a stock market, even you're good, the odds are against you.

  • @hamidehshahrabi5553
    @hamidehshahrabi5553 5 років тому +10

    your brother is so cool. first he seemed shy but is so well-spoken

  • @DewTime
    @DewTime 6 років тому +721

    You must have good genetics. You and your brother are both pretty smart and successful. Now we need an interview with your mom and dad.

    • @OFNBW
      @OFNBW 5 років тому +75

      Nurture > Nature. I assume it's upbringing.

    • @DewTime
      @DewTime 5 років тому +91

      a day in the life of a heroin addict
      People say nurture matters more because it makes themselves feel good. It’s what’s called virtue signaling. Genetics accounts for 80% of outcomes. All you have to do is look at twins separated at birth to understand this. Even with different upbringing they end up with the same interests in life and success outcomes.

    • @OFNBW
      @OFNBW 5 років тому +6

      What about Muslims or members of other cults? Do you think your average non-Muslim Feminist would support an oppressive regime that practices Sharia Law? Virtue Signaling supports nurture more than nature, lol.

    • @uttamo7
      @uttamo7 5 років тому +39

      it's called working hard

    • @user-ti9zc1xv2b
      @user-ti9zc1xv2b 5 років тому +88

      Dew Time Genetics is the bullshit excuse people like you use to be failures in life.

  • @imhellag
    @imhellag 6 років тому +33

    I just read "Flash Boys" and this is an awesome interview! Super elite level stuff.

  • @iCavity
    @iCavity 6 років тому +27

    Hey Joma, I've been watching your videos and enjoying them very much. I'm currently an Applied Math econ minor at UCSD and I've been losing hope at being a quant but after watching this video I realized there are still many things I can do to strengthen my skillset. I just wanted to say thanks for this video, it helped me out a lot!

    • @insafidris2366
      @insafidris2366 Рік тому +1

      it's been 4 years, how'd it go?

    • @iCavity
      @iCavity Рік тому +2

      @@insafidris2366 i actually made a career change. worked as a business analyst for a year and im now a data scientist

    • @insafidris2366
      @insafidris2366 Рік тому

      @@iCavity oh nice, what made you change? i mean i'd still have asked why quant if otherwise

    • @iCavity
      @iCavity Рік тому +2

      @@insafidris2366 I decided to change careers because I started to think about work life balance and realized that the Finance industry was not for me.

    • @insafidris2366
      @insafidris2366 Рік тому

      @@iCavity it's been very long, completely missed it but what do you do now if I may ask?

  • @emanuelebarbato
    @emanuelebarbato 6 років тому +2

    This channel is gold! Thank you joma.

  • @sunnyday12131
    @sunnyday12131 4 роки тому +17

    we can feel that you two are so close to each other and support each other, and joma, it's really nice to have a big brother as a life model for you, you two are both very smart and gentle!

  • @1travel29
    @1travel29 2 роки тому +2

    Hey Joma, thanks for the interview episode. I just wanted to say, seeing you guys succeed helped me in deciding to go to the University of Waterloo for my undergrad

  • @ramazanushpayev2893
    @ramazanushpayev2893 6 років тому +7

    Great interview! Very personal and insightful.

  • @ashtrdvhjhedd
    @ashtrdvhjhedd 6 років тому +601

    Finally a real CHAD programmer on the channel

    • @allanbaal2743
      @allanbaal2743 5 років тому +3

      What's chad?

    • @user-em3bs1wj8q
      @user-em3bs1wj8q 4 роки тому

      What does chad mean? Sorry I'm an english learner.

    • @jackjwalajoshua6
      @jackjwalajoshua6 3 роки тому +6

      @@user-em3bs1wj8q chad is like the opposite of virgin

    • @jgalvan09
      @jgalvan09 3 роки тому +1

      @@allanbaal2743 search SNL chad lol

    • @jgalvan09
      @jgalvan09 3 роки тому

      @@user-em3bs1wj8q search n youtube CHad SNL

  • @user-cx6mw2pg7z
    @user-cx6mw2pg7z 6 місяців тому +1

    Such a comfortable conversion and deep connected brotherhood I see here

  • @sethgrayson2470
    @sethgrayson2470 Рік тому +2

    Great interview and David has a great personality. Enjoyed watching it!

  • @KP-dd2ci
    @KP-dd2ci 5 років тому +2

    Dang... definitely must have been tough to grow up in his shadow as David is uber accomplished and smart. But Joma you have carved out your own piece of the pie, so well done!

  • @orangejmoothies
    @orangejmoothies 11 місяців тому +18

    older siblings do really pave the way for their younger siblings and i am just as grateful for having an older sister who was such a positive influence during my school years despite her being a scary sister LOL im glad joma and his brother could have this time bc tbh it's hard to talk about even stuff like this one on one w/ siblings in general.

  • @boasyntax2081
    @boasyntax2081 4 роки тому +3

    and now joma is paving the way for other tech channels!

  • @ulm287
    @ulm287 6 років тому +1

    Awesome
    Thanks for actually making the video as suggested :)

  • @danguerra3492
    @danguerra3492 Рік тому +1

    Bromance is real here. Good to see brothers respect and love each other.

  • @brianbell9678
    @brianbell9678 6 років тому +349

    Ranked 2nd out of 8 million.
    Not a genius.

    • @mobinrood4986
      @mobinrood4986 5 років тому +6

      Lol, I love the sarcasm

    • @ethanmj4277
      @ethanmj4277 5 років тому +28

      And he only competed against others in the competition, definitely nowhere near 8 million.

  • @baotrantruong4541
    @baotrantruong4541 6 років тому +2

    favorite from the interview series so far! 🙌🙌

  • @rafaelfez
    @rafaelfez 6 років тому +5

    Best Interview of this channel. Bro love respects

  • @olalahe
    @olalahe 3 роки тому +2

    love the bro-mance between you and your brother. You two obviously love and respect each other more than you let it out (asian and all, I know, I know). I think you both are awesome humans in your own ways.

  • @brianlin4044
    @brianlin4044 4 роки тому +2

    Happened upon this video super randomly but was pleasantly surprised. Cool brother (and you)

  • @coachwen9655
    @coachwen9655 3 роки тому +6

    I felt the awkwardness ㅋㅋ and yet sincerity and love between Joma and his brother.
    Sweet ^_^

  • @ALPHADOG1900
    @ALPHADOG1900 5 років тому +2

    Great video guys. Great brotherhood relationship. Love it.

  • @tommyp-c6728
    @tommyp-c6728 6 років тому +1

    YESSSSS! BEEN WAITING FOR THIS VIDEO FOR SO LONG

  • @Sammy-nr2qz
    @Sammy-nr2qz 3 роки тому +2

    What an intelligent pair of brothers. Parents must be proud!

  • @vaibhavchaturvedi9826
    @vaibhavchaturvedi9826 Рік тому

    Beautiful interview! Absolutely loved it and super fruitful. Thanks a lot for such awesome questions.

  • @danielsayajin26
    @danielsayajin26 2 роки тому +4

    Man David is the definition of humble

  • @SummitVa
    @SummitVa Рік тому +2

    Haha. Joma World! I'm a little late (June 21 2022) but man this was the realist brotherly love ever. Great content bros!

  • @domadotomato
    @domadotomato 2 роки тому +2

    Wow this is so human among other tech vlogs I have seen. Subscribed after 5 hrs. of watching.
    PS. Don't worry it's Sunday, I did not watch this to procrastinate, haha.

  • @laudbentil8184
    @laudbentil8184 5 років тому +3

    Fascinating how you guys connected your initial interests to your current pursuits, even when they've come from different places: detective stories & games

  • @BedroomPianist
    @BedroomPianist 5 років тому +2

    Probably the best interview content and person wise

  • @Bambi_Y
    @Bambi_Y 5 років тому +3

    Inspirational & motivational, thanks! and also for those random Korean/K-pop stuff in your videos.

  • @akshatsharma7339
    @akshatsharma7339 5 років тому +7

    man David is such an honest guy no wonder he's good at math. Joma you're awesome too.

  • @fernandofernandez5354
    @fernandofernandez5354 5 років тому +2

    I am not the guy who tell someone intelligent, but your brother really is. Good for you. Nice family

  • @SVNSET
    @SVNSET 6 років тому +2

    Loved this one. Very insightful!

  • @sjsiouwu
    @sjsiouwu 5 років тому +34

    As someone who also does quant research in developing high frequency statistical arbitrage futures trading strategies I'm honestly surprised he didn't immediately say python or R when asked for his favorite programming language.

  • @pitashen
    @pitashen 5 років тому +4

    I knew I heard the term cegeps somewhere before and then your brother mentioned Quebec... XD Nice interview!

  • @Blodia1990
    @Blodia1990 5 років тому +3

    David "I am not genuis" ...Such a humble dude.

  • @Zay151
    @Zay151 6 років тому

    very insightful! stacked brothers mang

  • @anmol3457
    @anmol3457 6 років тому +39

    I'm surprised that your first question wasn't "how much do you make ?"

  • @Mike-gd2fv
    @Mike-gd2fv 5 років тому +1

    I love your channel! Doing a good job!

  • @inchinaxp8663
    @inchinaxp8663 6 років тому +1

    Awesome interview. Thanks, Joma!

  • @azizmohammed182
    @azizmohammed182 2 роки тому

    Very inspirational. Thanks a lot for the vid.

  • @esentea
    @esentea 5 років тому +7

    Liked the interview a lot. Your bro seems like a very smart guy. It'd be cool to get him on again and made just talk about some other topics. Made a general discussion about data science, machine learning, the future of ML. bitcoin??? and more Q+A

  • @R0ckyRocket
    @R0ckyRocket 6 років тому +1

    thanks man, this interview was very helpful

  • @morganmlambo9515
    @morganmlambo9515 3 роки тому +1

    Talk about brotherly appreciation!

  • @JossinJax
    @JossinJax 3 роки тому +1

    It is sweet that he's interviewing big bro. I would love to interview mine :D

  • @premkumar-jt3rj
    @premkumar-jt3rj 6 років тому +1

    u guys r awesome...stay smart and keep "bro"ing

  • @lennartmanske5172
    @lennartmanske5172 6 років тому +3

    Convert these interviews into a podcast!

  • @booneguy
    @booneguy 5 років тому +5

    That’s genuine bro-love right there!

  • @raghav4296
    @raghav4296 4 роки тому +1

    Came here after watching the startup that he sold episode.. An informative guy who knows what he is doing!

  • @petrolhead8822
    @petrolhead8822 6 років тому +1

    great content man, keep up!

  • @uh6311
    @uh6311 5 років тому +12

    Awesome -- I'm a quant as well, but I specialize in programs for trading equity index futures. Enjoyed listening to your bro!

    • @amritmohanty1937
      @amritmohanty1937 Рік тому +1

      Any tips about how to get into these prop shops. The competition seems pretty harsh.

    • @shannu1927
      @shannu1927 3 місяці тому

      Bro can you help how to automate trades

  • @KhoiThinh
    @KhoiThinh 6 років тому +348

    Jo Ma -> David Ma -> Jack Ma?

  • @Whiteboy7thstGOAT
    @Whiteboy7thstGOAT 5 років тому +4

    Alpha is a measurement of your performance relative to the market return (S&P 500)

  • @zachandbro
    @zachandbro 6 років тому +177

    Joma and his brother have a great relationship

    • @leannabad3839
      @leannabad3839 5 років тому

      Are you the Zachandbro from Justin Escalona's channel?? Lol

    • @rskbug
      @rskbug 5 років тому +13

      He hardly knows his brother. He knows his surname though.

    • @p00ri9
      @p00ri9 4 роки тому +4

      @@rskbug Im p sure he was j joking. He def knew what his brother did.

    • @N0purpose
      @N0purpose 2 роки тому +2

      @@rskbug it's an interview he asks questions for us

  • @swarnaroy4686
    @swarnaroy4686 5 років тому +4

    u must be lucky to have such big bro

  • @samanthambogho1608
    @samanthambogho1608 6 років тому

    THE ROSE!!!!Love the band....lol!Joma Oppa....okay... done now...loved the interview

  • @mikeblackfordFit
    @mikeblackfordFit 5 років тому +18

    well, I changed to a c.s. degree and got back into coding because of how awesome Joma makes data science and coding seem, so he's giving back in some sense.

    • @imli700
      @imli700 3 роки тому +1

      Cool! How are you doing now?

    • @chase.2595
      @chase.2595 2 роки тому

      Hey man, how's life? Did you become a quant?

    • @josephdelgado3619
      @josephdelgado3619 2 роки тому +1

      @@chase.2595 He invented facebook

    • @dontakeshit
      @dontakeshit Рік тому

      @@josephdelgado3619 😂 😂

  • @AndreAndFriends
    @AndreAndFriends 4 роки тому +10

    14 min. The most important part.
    ......you're welcome

  • @kantocoder5046
    @kantocoder5046 4 роки тому +1

    Yellow sticker at 0:06 made my day. Seems like Joma went to Hokkaido, there are many bears.

  • @balajik8473
    @balajik8473 4 роки тому +15

    I literally had chills when Detective Conan Popped up, I was relating myself to the whole interest in Finance and myself I am CS undergraduate.. and Oh Yes I am a Big Fan of Detective Conan , I play as a detective many times!

    • @sceaserjulius9476
      @sceaserjulius9476 4 роки тому

      Are you in india, and will look for jobs as quant here.

    • @balajik8473
      @balajik8473 4 роки тому

      @@sceaserjulius9476 Yes I am in India and I want to work as a quant

    • @omkarojas5633
      @omkarojas5633 3 роки тому

      Hey man, I'm on the same path. Could I maybe talk to you over Linked In.
      My name is Omkar Kanade studing
      At SVNIT in surat

  • @sharbel9624
    @sharbel9624 4 роки тому +4

    in every family u get a calm older brother and a goofy younger one

  • @MrArrex
    @MrArrex 6 років тому +6

    Haven't watched a full video on this channel in a while lol ... Until now

  • @AdamWong
    @AdamWong 6 років тому +16

    We got another VIM boi

  • @benx3365
    @benx3365 6 років тому

    You made me happy !! from Ghana Africa . Jian Yang
    My seconmd silicon valey HBO *JOMA*

  • @Laughbankrip
    @Laughbankrip 6 років тому +3

    You and David have a great relationship 😝 Parents would be very proud

  • @15nicinho
    @15nicinho 6 років тому +32

    Would it be possible to do another day in the life?

  • @roshauntitus
    @roshauntitus 6 років тому +2

    Thank you for the vid

  • @diogomoraes6790
    @diogomoraes6790 2 роки тому +1

    you guys are great, thank you

  • @pati7132
    @pati7132 5 років тому +214

    - ranks 2nd in a state math competition
    - "I'm not a genius"
    wtf

    • @davidgeorge5109
      @davidgeorge5109 4 роки тому +36

      Province not state, respect Canada.

    • @KaesOner
      @KaesOner 4 роки тому +10

      Or just studied his ass off since a young age sacrificing his social life and basic social life experiences.

    • @albroz6731
      @albroz6731 4 роки тому +10

      It's called humbleness

    • @p00ri9
      @p00ri9 4 роки тому +10

      @@KaesOner Thats what all the jealous haters would say. He seems humble more than anything.

    • @nargizhajiyeva3111
      @nargizhajiyeva3111 3 роки тому +3

      @@KaesOner jealous much?

  • @schrodingerscat3912
    @schrodingerscat3912 6 років тому +2

    nice! one a quant the other a data scientist. you guys are on point. you should start a hedge fund together

  • @techworld3043
    @techworld3043 6 років тому +2

    I love it please more videos with your brother