0:55 Which TWM are you using right now? 3:03 Which TWM is the best? 4:12 Which TWM is the best for beginners? Which is the easiest? 6:08 Is a TWM worth it, specially to a non-programmer? 8:08 What is the most customizable TWM? 9:00 I Heard that Python is slow and sucky. So why do you like Qtile? It must be slow, right? 11:15 Does using a TWM make a terminal multiplexer obsolete? 12:15 Are there any other TWMs that have tabbed layout? 14:28 All TWMs look the same. So what's the differences between them? 16:00 Can I get a prencofigured TWM? 18:18 Thanks Patreons
Turning on the Android 10 live captions was pretty funny this video. My favorite part was "you don't need to be a programmer to use Italian window managers"
Qtile is built on top of Qt, so it's at it's core just a bunch of C++ calls. It's true that python itself is slow, but it's interoperability with C/C++ makes it about as fast as you want it to be (given you want to take the time to write the underlying C/C++ which can be tricky at times). Numpy is a perfect example of this.
@barutaji nothing, if you want to take the time to wire up your C++ to python to make it more script friendly I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I worked on a project where we did that to offer a more familiar interface to the engineers who used the product.
@@LusidDreaming The idea is that you can make small modular pieces of the heavy processing in C/C++, then use python to glue then together to make them do what you actually want (which can be less straight-forward to program correctly, and much easier for the computer to process, which is where python shines). Or you can use libraries that have already done the C/C++ part for you. Again, see numpy. Or Tensorflow. Or any of hundreds of other libraries.
I've been telling this since like, forever: you're not meant to write code in Python, you're meant to call other code. If there's a computational bottleneck and that's in Python, you're dead.
I accepted your challenge. I switched from Windows (over 20 years of Windows desktop experience) to my first Linux PC and my window environment is Xmonad & Xmobar. :) It works fine. Xmobar consumes more RAM than Xmonad. :)
The question about " being slow" is funny. Comes up in a lot context/topics. From a programmer, (runtime) speed of languages rarely actually matters for a few reasons: 1 - Few programs really run your process at high CPU % for any length of time. Or more precisely, few programs actually need to run a high # of operations in the context. Things like I/O doesn't matter (because your OS/harddrive is going to be the limiting factor for i/o, or the change of context if you do a high # of i/o ops for small files). 2 - how the thing if program will matter much more as a 1st approximation than actual runtime performance of the language. Things like using caching or not, minimizing or batching calls to external contexts and just generally using a more efficient algo (e.g. something that runs in O(1) vs O(n)) will matter much more.
Don't be too harsh on people. I think, most of the time when someone asks "What's the best blank?". They're asking what's the simplest, most powerful, flexible,etc ... Blank. Like, someone says I use blank to do this. Then, someone says if you use blank, instead of doing 10 things to do that, you only have to do 5. Stuff like that. You ARE correct, most of the time, it IS just personal preference. Guess, easiest way we can respond is "For a noob, I might recommend blank and for everyone else it's personal preference.". Then, if we wanted, we could recommend a small list for them to UA-cam.
Derek, I sometimes have no idea on something linux and lately it's DistroTube video's I go to since unlike other video's Derek speaks proper english super clearly and you explain why and what about what you recommend and even in an distro installation you give the step by step like when you did an Arch install so I not only saw Arch installed by an explaination on the steps that you did not "just do this" and that's it. Your channel educated the users that need real answers to common stuff no one gives a clear answer to or you find a site with code and not discription of what is happening or how the code works together. You look intimidating at first sight but after listening to you we realize you might be the most helpful person out there for taking the mystery out of basic and not so basic functions of linux and making them simpler for a person that is not an expert to actually use and become a more functional user and expand our skill sets. Keep up the great work, I always look for the distrotube video's since I actually get my questions answered and likely will learn more by the end of your video's.
This is Beauty of open source software it allows to create your OWN config with some sense of simplicity. It respects everyone choice which makes questions like "which is best" redundant. You make your system yours. On contrast it might not be easy for up and running but once done it is easy to reproduce.
My progression for TWM's was i3 (disliked it) to dwm (❤️) i have tried other wm's and the second contender is qtile since i like python and i can use different bars with it I found it actually pretty ok to set up! idk why, maybe i just know how to google well XD
This is a very useful video with a great approach to this topic. Thank you. People often have this mindset of looking for "the best" in most large changes they have to make, but what they are really looking for is validation that the choice they would like to make is good value, worth the time investment and respected (or at least doesn't bring shame to the user) among other users. This is true for starting to learn programming (people will often reject for instance Java for this purpose because it's "bad"), making a large purchase like a car or a house and sometimes even when choosing a profession.
DistroTube, Although I've never used a TWM vecause of you, you've definitely reminded me of a TWM's existence or taught me about it and then I went out to try it. Thank you DistroTube!
Tiling WMs are a blessing. I truly am not sure if I can really go back to a floating wm, this is just perfect for me. And the best thing is that it is incredibly easy to port to other PCs if you want (oh sorry, there is no best thing😂😂).
My first TWM was DWM, I had no problems at all. I find the config files actually easier to use than most other configs. Currently I'm using SpectreWM, because it's the only TWM, I could find that handles my six monitors in the way I want, and the config is so bad, everytime I change something, I want a config.c file...
U fall for a fallacy that person on a screen looks at You, no it is not, person is staring at a wall, want to become a wall? DT stares at the topic He talks about, DT is true, don't be a wall, become a lobster!
@@pepijnkrijnsen4 But lobsters are boiled alive. Well, I guess this proves he is a Linux god where one is not proven enough to look at him in the eyes. Boil me now.
My first twm was i3, probably like 95% of people, and then switched to xmonad, it's harder to configure but it works better with scratchpad, layouts and floating windows for me, although I miss a little bit the binding modes of i3. It can be done in xmonad but my skills are not good yet. I stole dt's xmonad configuration, it saved my weeks of trial and error, it just works.
@@RP-kr2mg this is an incredibly long discussion. TWMs are way more lightweight, and you can do things incredibly faster. But DEs are better if you dont care about the advantages of a TWMs.
@@RP-kr2mg It's not really about what is better. Plasma is totally awesome and would be my DE of choice, as I absolutely prefer it over GNOME. However, some people might prefer a more minimalist approach. For instance, after almost a year using i3-gaps on Arch, I don't see myself returning to anything that is not a tiling window manager, especially since in the process, I have replaced most GUI applications with terminal applications, and I'm not even done with that yet. And in my opinion, a tiling window manager is a perfect companion for terminal applications and a 100% keyboard-centric workflow. I can only report from my personal experience, but I assume that most tiling window manager users will name similar reasons. In essence, it all breaks down to choice and personal preference. It doesn't mean that anyone deliberately ignores the awesome desktop environment that is Plasma.
Small correction, xmonad has tabbed layout in contrib: XMonad.Layout.Tabbed. If I remember, xmonad tabbed works better with compton than i3. With tabbed i3, the transparency shows another window and tabbed xmonad transparency shows the desktop background.
@@KookoCraft You're exactly right! I'm not quirky! I'm disabled. We disabled people can learn to laugh about ourselves, and frequently do. Also, in the 5 months since I wrote the comment, I have in fact shut up about the topic several times! For real though, if you need to relieve stress by yelling at a stranger on the internet, I get it. A lot of things really suck right now. It'll be ok. You're not alone.
I actually use KDE Plasma as a twm, because I always use the keyboard shortcuts to arrange the windows in a tiling fashion. So I do not need a "real twm" :D
I do the same with Gnome. I mainly work with full screen or half-screen apps, set up with keyboard shortcuts. Then, I use "jumpapp" to instantly switch, again with keyboard shortcuts, between the about 20 apps that I always need. So I never need a mouse to move to apps.
@@fossegrim287 sorry man! i am not a fan boy because i don't agree with everything he says and i think he's cheap in a lot of ways. But that's not why i wrote those comments. I wrote those because i felt irritated by someone just toying around all day and say "getting my WORKFLOW right" "getting WORK done" words. No strong feelings and probably i won't comment something like that in future but i felt like it and i said it.
I am running pop_os and using kde and trying to configure an i3 install. Having a full DE is so helpful in trying to configure a WM for a beginner like myself. Just a recommendation :3
I actually prefer tmux. Since it runs in a background as a service I think only once it crashed on me but had multiple instances of desktop environment crashing and once it happened all terminals and work on them closed... Besides I like that I can connect via ssh from any machine attach tmux and all my work is just where I left it. The only thing that bothers me with tmux is copying to and from it.
I'd like to see the instructional video about how to combine all those (most common) components into a whole thing. Like how do I change login manager? How do I configure a specific window manager in the (?) login manager ? How do I switch desktop environment? How do I take something from one DE and something else from another and use it -- like use Nautilus in GNOME just for example?
I am xfce power user, mono screen all my life, I became intrigued, came about a second screen, vanilla xfce is not good at multihead, can't make second screen a worskpace, I installed awesome, now I will rice it, down the drain goes my productivity, TY.. :p
Log entry: I am integrating awesomewm into xfce for now, solved key conflicts, looking to vim'ify it all, goes smooth so far, love it's dual screen behavior, all good so far)
Right there is no best. But we all have preferences, like we can list of the top 3 favorites or top 5 favorites from our experience with a few of these programs. My top three favorite Tiling Window Managers are i3, bspwm and herbstluftwm. Other Window Managers that I like are pekwm, openbox, fluxbox, and JWM.(Stacking)
I couldn't get i3 function buttons working right on my X1Carbon. I installed Regolith-Linux and it got me jump-started and now I feel like I'm ready to build my own config.
@@razbeats8242 Makes me think of something people in the old school shaving community like to say. Straight edge razors are better, but they also require you to basically make shaving a hobby. If you just want to shave, you'd better turn elsewhere.
@@Anthropomorphic I believe everyone in the world needs some level of computer knowledge to work or study more efficiently and if you're using Linux, you're more than likely going to know more about how things work. It's harder yes but hard != bad.
@@razbeats8242 Sure, though the common denominator between more widely known and adopted systems seems to be that the threshold of entry is fairly low, and there's no real requirement to climb higher. The shallow end, while suboptimal, is viable on its own. Of course, I'm kind of assuming here that wider adoption is desirable, and many would disagree.
The tabbed layout in i3 does not force you to be fullscreen like the monocole layout, so I don't see how they're the same. You could have a set of tabs take up just one corner of the screen, which is super helpful for multiple vim instances, opening multiple PDFs, etc. Not saying xmonad can't do that because I don't know, that's just not what you showed.
The main reason I use the tabbed layout on i3 is that I can click the tabs with my mouse. Can't do that in any other WM. I mainly use the tabbed layout on my second screen to combine Firefox, Spotify/other media players, Discord... basically applications that are primarily mouse-driven. When I'm planning to interact with one of these applications, I'm already using my mouse, so it makes sense to switch between them with my mouse as well. I don't often use the tabbed layout for terminals or other keyboard-driven applications. And of course, as you said, tabbed containers don't have to be fully maximized. You can have one window occupying one half of the screen, and a tabbed container with multiple applications occupying the other half of the screen. It's not at all comparable to a monocle layout.
I think you should. I use qtile as my daily driver and it’s amazing. Even if I have multiple tiling window managers installed I tend to always use qtile.
I would've like to know about tiling window managers that operate using Wayland, instead of Xorg. Been thinking about switching to Sway, but don't know yet if it is worth it.
Then one day, I saw a new very interesting workstation in the computer lab. Very graphically GUI ... and it called "NeXT Setp".. Yes, the workstation was the NeXT Unix workstation. Many years after that, I 'emulated' the feeling with OpenStep window manager on Slackware Linux.. Then, I tried as many window managers as possible, including a very rare "Text window manager;; TWin. Yes, we can make text console as windowig UI. Then after I found GNU Screen, I stopped looking anymore.. :) Personally, I prefers tiny lightweight window manager, such as, lwm, aewm, tinywm, swm, ... and I loves evilwm. until today . :)
I moved from i3 to qtile a while back and I"ll be honest, I kinda miss the tabbed layout. You know the columns layout that qtile offers? That's closer to how I used the tabbed layout than the max layout demonstrated here. What that person was talking about has more to do with the tree-like structure i3 uses to contain its windows within containers and subcontainers, and then apply the tabbed layout to a subcontainer for a cleaner look while also keeping everything you immediately need in one workspace.
I've been using i3 for half a year. Although it's completely next-level experience from floating window managers, I can see its flaws. I'm looking to switch to either DWM or Awesome. I've tried st from suckless, and actually used it for a while, but switched to kitty, because it was either buggy and "fix it yourself" approach wasn't really for me. Therefore I'm afraid of using DWM. Is it still worth tring DWM before Awesome?
It's worth trying both dwm and awesome. Both are good and awesome was originally a fork of dwm. If you want suckless, go dwm. If you want "everything and the kitchen sink included", then awesome is what you want.
Well DT, as you said you are UA-cam personality so you need to accept that a lot of people want to copy you, that comes with fame. I get your point, but it is what it is.
I tried many window managers, and I prefers eveilwm; tiny stacking window manager. Bery small, fast and versatile. Not need to use mouse to operates. Thank you.
Really enjoying you content please keep it up. Could you do an episode about making youtube videos on linux? Easiest screen capture, audio, editing, etc software? Or maybe your process for your videos?
@DistroTube When editing /etc/pacman.conf and adding the line ILoveCandy we get a Pacman (represented by C and c) eating dots. My ? is: Can Pacman (C and c) be changed into real Pacman icon? Thanks and thanks for the videos. All the best!
I've been using Arco Linux to try out different environments/managers because it has such an easy way to install them with it's tweak tool. It's a bit too rolling for my taste so I'm fine with using it for exploration.
I actually used DWM as my first tiling window manager. And from just laziness I didn't change it to anything else. I tried i3 but didn't like the tree structure.
I wish I had a use case for a tiling WM. Sitting in front of a 28" 4K screen and not liking pretty much all windows in fullscreen ... I would end up configuring all windows to float or use dozens of "padding windows" to resize other windows.
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What do you mean by dwm is not usable out of the box? Pretty much the only thing that has to be changed is in the key bindings, changing Alt to Meta. After that, dwm is perfectly usable, no need to patch it at all (unlike st).
Hey DT. I use i3 and often use tabbed layout in split layout. You said "tabbed layout is just a monocle layout with tabs on top". Can I split and tabbed in other window manager?
I am trying to find a right way to configure Awesome WM on Manjaro KDE. While I read that KDE plasma is integrated extensively on vanilla Manjaro, wanted to know some basic steps to follow to configure it on my desktop
When you say Qtile appears to be just as fast as other wms, is it because it is configured minimally? I have a feeling the Python backend may not scale well when a lot of stuff is added to Qtile's config as compared to adding the same amount of customization to other wms.
I have wanted to get into qtile for a couple of weeks now but no matter if I try it on Debian or Manjaro or pure Arch I can't get the default config to work. If I try to start qtile with the default config it tells me that there is an error in the config file. If I try to run that file from CLI with Python it looks to me as though it is calling out some methods which the libraries do not contain. I haven't had time to dig into that and wind up going back to XFCE just to get things done. Anyone else have issues with that?
Tmux is very useful to avoid having bloated and big terminal emulators but also having those tabs on tmux and having the saved sessions in it, so I really can't see myself not using it, it's specially useful when you wanna search for error messages and correct them on the same screen
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Luke Smith made me switch to DWM and I have been unable to use anything ever since. I feel like there's a slight delay between pressing a button and something happening in awesome. Also it's a bit annoying that the good WMs usethe most annoying configs. C code that you have to compile into the binary, haskell and Lua. Might try out qtile at some point though.
I think you misunderstand the utility of the i3 tabbed layout. When your windows are full screen, it's not useful, it's superfluous, like you demonstrate. Where it really shines is when you already have the view split. I will describe an example. Part of my job requires answering phones, and the phone interface is a web page. On a small window that takes up maybe the right 15% of the screen, I keep the phone system web page open. The other 85% of the screen I use 5 tabbed windows: - Browser for ticketing system and research - Chat client - Remote Windows machine for applications that I need that can't be installed on Linux - Notes - File browser The tabs at the top of the left split allow easy access to any of these windows, while still allowing the phone system window to remain open on the right side of the screen. One other thing that probably many people do not know is that you can split windows inside a tabbed view. This is useful for like keeping many windows open but only one of them focused, taking up the full screen, but then still having the ability to open a split on that window while leaving all the others on their own tabs out of the way. I find myself using this often when needing to reference a web page and open terminals but I still have other web pages open in their own windows that I don't necessarily want to close, but I don't want to have on the screen at the moment.
DT, I tried deleting my KDE for an I3 tiling window manager and I screwed up my install because I didn’t know what files you needed before you install any tiling window manager and deleting your DE.
Out of the box, yes you are correct. If you want to change it (aesthetics wise or even removing it if that is your thing), all you need to do is look for the "task list" in your configs. By default it is in the rc.lua file at lines 157 - 169 (and then implemented into a wibox at line 183). In a majority of the reddit rices, most people split the rc.lua file into separate config files so you just need to do a little looking to find it if you go down that path and download the dotfiles.
I think you might be trying too much to look after your viewers. If they're infantile and impressionable to the point where they'll stick with whatever you use no matter what then it's their problem, not yours. Otherwise, questions like "what you use?" come from trust in your choices and recognition of similar preferences (or maybe just pure curiosity, this one's the most common for me). That is if I liked something that was recommended to me then there's a fair chance I'll like something else that the person recommends to me. Similar logic applies to "what's the best?" questions, if you're asked that chance is they're asking for your personal favorites. It's the most sensible assumption since it's a purely subjective term.
Yes, but I think he answered that. He says he doesn't use just one TWM, he uses so many of them each day. How do you recommend one over the other when each day you use a different one? Also, when asked what is the best is so subjective to the point that what is best for you may not be best me. And who wants the person to come back later saying hey I discovered this or that I thought you said this was the best, why didn't you recommend . People do this all the time to me in the IT world and it aggravates me too. My best is not your best. Leave it at that.
@@DistroTube i mean you can add as many lines as you want after you grokked those 2000 lines no 😏
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I think he's making the point that configuring DWM is literally changing the source code. Also not sure if anyone's dwm ends up being under 2 KLOC after applying all the patches they want 😉
@ the way i see it is that the official version stays under 2kloc, any functionalities you add to it will surely bring it over that limit and your free to do so, but it's als your (or the patch maintainer's) responsibility if those patches break :P *looks at the surf chromebar patch* tldr; the suckless devs only take responsibility for the 2kloc lines you are free to add more :p
Ah, the 'Python is slow' misconception. It's a high-level language that's not as efficient at certain tasks as you point out, sure, but most users/code won't necessarily be performing those tasks. Match that against its ease of use, and it's a very fair tradeoff. I'm biased, though.
6 month old comment, but objectively speaking python, the language, is slow if you're only really using python as basically a bridge for calling C/C++ (or other native) code it's more than fast enough to do the job tho, and in that case ease of use does shine through way more than the .01 seconds spent actually interpreting python code
0:55 Which TWM are you using right now?
3:03 Which TWM is the best?
4:12 Which TWM is the best for beginners? Which is the easiest?
6:08 Is a TWM worth it, specially to a non-programmer?
8:08 What is the most customizable TWM?
9:00 I Heard that Python is slow and sucky. So why do you like Qtile? It must be slow, right?
11:15 Does using a TWM make a terminal multiplexer obsolete?
12:15 Are there any other TWMs that have tabbed layout?
14:28 All TWMs look the same. So what's the differences between them?
16:00 Can I get a prencofigured TWM?
18:18 Thanks Patreons
@Poo Guy hehehe fixed! :)
Thank you
Turning on the Android 10 live captions was pretty funny this video.
My favorite part was "you don't need to be a programmer to use Italian window managers"
Gestures supported very well
@@marcoriggirello4740 hmm?
@@MyurrDurr There's an old stereotype about Italians gesturing a lot when they talk.
@@Anthropomorphic ohh :')
That doesn't make sense. Everyone gestures a lot
@@MyurrDurr It's an especially strong cliche with Italians, though.
ua-cam.com/video/_8hAOxsTpVY/v-deo.html
Qtile is built on top of Qt, so it's at it's core just a bunch of C++ calls. It's true that python itself is slow, but it's interoperability with C/C++ makes it about as fast as you want it to be (given you want to take the time to write the underlying C/C++ which can be tricky at times). Numpy is a perfect example of this.
You may as well just write it in C++ then
@barutaji nothing, if you want to take the time to wire up your C++ to python to make it more script friendly I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I worked on a project where we did that to offer a more familiar interface to the engineers who used the product.
@@KookoCraft why use C++ when you can use a way easier language to work in and modify AND accomplish the exact same thing
@@LusidDreaming The idea is that you can make small modular pieces of the heavy processing in C/C++, then use python to glue then together to make them do what you actually want (which can be less straight-forward to program correctly, and much easier for the computer to process, which is where python shines). Or you can use libraries that have already done the C/C++ part for you. Again, see numpy. Or Tensorflow. Or any of hundreds of other libraries.
I've been telling this since like, forever: you're not meant to write code in Python, you're meant to call other code. If there's a computational bottleneck and that's in Python, you're dead.
I accepted your challenge. I switched from Windows (over 20 years of Windows desktop experience) to my first Linux PC and my window environment is Xmonad & Xmobar. :) It works fine.
Xmobar consumes more RAM than Xmonad. :)
The question about " being slow" is funny. Comes up in a lot context/topics.
From a programmer, (runtime) speed of languages rarely actually matters for a few reasons:
1 - Few programs really run your process at high CPU % for any length of time. Or more precisely, few programs actually need to run a high # of operations in the context. Things like I/O doesn't matter (because your OS/harddrive is going to be the limiting factor for i/o, or the change of context if you do a high # of i/o ops for small files).
2 - how the thing if program will matter much more as a 1st approximation than actual runtime performance of the language. Things like using caching or not, minimizing or batching calls to external contexts and just generally using a more efficient algo (e.g. something that runs in O(1) vs O(n)) will matter much more.
Don't be too harsh on people. I think, most of the time when someone asks "What's the best blank?". They're asking what's the simplest, most powerful, flexible,etc ... Blank. Like, someone says I use blank to do this. Then, someone says if you use blank, instead of doing 10 things to do that, you only have to do 5. Stuff like that. You ARE correct, most of the time, it IS just personal preference. Guess, easiest way we can respond is "For a noob, I might recommend blank and for everyone else it's personal preference.". Then, if we wanted, we could recommend a small list for them to UA-cam.
Derek, I sometimes have no idea on something linux and lately it's DistroTube video's I go to since unlike other video's Derek speaks proper english super clearly and you explain why and what about what you recommend and even in an distro installation you give the step by step like when you did an Arch install so I not only saw Arch installed by an explaination on the steps that you did not "just do this" and that's it. Your channel educated the users that need real answers to common stuff no one gives a clear answer to or you find a site with code and not discription of what is happening or how the code works together. You look intimidating at first sight but after listening to you we realize you might be the most helpful person out there for taking the mystery out of basic and not so basic functions of linux and making them simpler for a person that is not an expert to actually use and become a more functional user and expand our skill sets. Keep up the great work, I always look for the distrotube video's since I actually get my questions answered and likely will learn more by the end of your video's.
This is Beauty of open source software it allows to create your OWN config with some sense of simplicity. It respects everyone choice which makes questions like "which is best" redundant. You make your system yours. On contrast it might not be easy for up and running but once done it is easy to reproduce.
My progression for TWM's was i3 (disliked it) to dwm (❤️) i have tried other wm's and the second contender is qtile since i like python and i can use different bars with it
I found it actually pretty ok to set up! idk why, maybe i just know how to google well XD
This is a very useful video with a great approach to this topic. Thank you.
People often have this mindset of looking for "the best" in most large changes they have to make, but what they are really looking for is validation that the choice they would like to make is good value, worth the time investment and respected (or at least doesn't bring shame to the user) among other users. This is true for starting to learn programming (people will often reject for instance Java for this purpose because it's "bad"), making a large purchase like a car or a house and sometimes even when choosing a profession.
DistroTube,
Although I've never used a TWM vecause of you, you've definitely reminded me of a TWM's existence or taught me about it and then I went out to try it.
Thank you DistroTube!
In qtile, if you use the tasklist widget you can see the names of the opened windows while in max layout and can switch between them using your mouse.
Tiling WMs are a blessing. I truly am not sure if I can really go back to a floating wm, this is just perfect for me. And the best thing is that it is incredibly easy to port to other PCs if you want (oh sorry, there is no best thing😂😂).
My first TWM was DWM, I had no problems at all. I find the config files actually easier to use than most other configs.
Currently I'm using SpectreWM, because it's the only TWM, I could find that handles my six monitors in the way I want, and the config is so bad, everytime I change something, I want a config.c file...
I wish that someday, I get a notification about DT's new video and when I click to watch it, I see him looking at the camera :D.
Man, please do it
If he does that though we will be overrun with fangirls :p.
U fall for a fallacy that person on a screen looks at You, no it is not, person is staring at a wall, want to become a wall? DT stares at the topic He talks about, DT is true, don't be a wall, become a lobster!
@@rochr4 "Don't be a wall, become a lobster" that was deep
@@pepijnkrijnsen4 But lobsters are boiled alive. Well, I guess this proves he is a Linux god where one is not proven enough to look at him in the eyes. Boil me now.
My first twm was i3, probably like 95% of people, and then switched to xmonad, it's harder to configure but it works better with scratchpad, layouts and floating windows for me, although I miss a little bit the binding modes of i3. It can be done in xmonad but my skills are not good yet.
I stole dt's xmonad configuration, it saved my weeks of trial and error, it just works.
I was an i3 user for years and I never used the tabbed layout.
Same here. I get irritated every time I accidentally hit that key combination, and it throws at me some obscure layout 😀 I like i3 though 🙂
Plasma is better. Why act like it doesn't exist and use Wimdow Managers???
@@RP-kr2mg this is an incredibly long discussion. TWMs are way more lightweight, and you can do things incredibly faster. But DEs are better if you dont care about the advantages of a TWMs.
i also dont use tabbed with i3/sway. i dont miss using it.
@@RP-kr2mg It's not really about what is better. Plasma is totally awesome and would be my DE of choice, as I absolutely prefer it over GNOME.
However, some people might prefer a more minimalist approach. For instance, after almost a year using i3-gaps on Arch, I don't see myself returning to anything that is not a tiling window manager, especially since in the process, I have replaced most GUI applications with terminal applications, and I'm not even done with that yet. And in my opinion, a tiling window manager is a perfect companion for terminal applications and a 100% keyboard-centric workflow.
I can only report from my personal experience, but I assume that most tiling window manager users will name similar reasons.
In essence, it all breaks down to choice and personal preference. It doesn't mean that anyone deliberately ignores the awesome desktop environment that is Plasma.
omg i genuinely though you are a programmer of some sort, at least dealing with computer for job. It was mind-blowing and keep up the great content!
Small correction, xmonad has tabbed layout in contrib: XMonad.Layout.Tabbed.
If I remember, xmonad tabbed works better with compton than i3. With tabbed i3, the transparency shows another window and tabbed xmonad transparency shows the desktop background.
"Are you opening programs and then forgetting what's open? I think not." You underestimate those of us with ADHD.
ayy ADHD gang
Ur not quirky stfu
@@KookoCraft You're exactly right! I'm not quirky! I'm disabled. We disabled people can learn to laugh about ourselves, and frequently do. Also, in the 5 months since I wrote the comment, I have in fact shut up about the topic several times!
For real though, if you need to relieve stress by yelling at a stranger on the internet, I get it. A lot of things really suck right now. It'll be ok. You're not alone.
I actually use KDE Plasma as a twm, because I always use the keyboard shortcuts to arrange the windows in a tiling fashion. So I do not need a "real twm" :D
I do the same with Gnome. I mainly work with full screen or half-screen apps, set up with keyboard shortcuts. Then, I use "jumpapp" to instantly switch, again with keyboard shortcuts, between the about 20 apps that I always need. So I never need a mouse to move to apps.
Drink every time he throws shade at luke smith hahahah
lmao
I'd pass out
Please, to you all, stop the paranoia! I've never seen Derek Taylor and Luke Smith engaging in mutual attacks!
@@minhajshovon9789 I think one can learn lots of things with both and, of course, many others.
@@fossegrim287 sorry man!
i am not a fan boy because i don't agree with everything he says and i think he's cheap in a lot of ways.
But that's not why i wrote those comments.
I wrote those because i felt irritated by someone just toying around all day and say "getting my WORKFLOW right" "getting WORK done" words.
No strong feelings and probably i won't comment something like that in future but i felt like it and i said it.
I am running pop_os and using kde and trying to configure an i3 install. Having a full DE is so helpful in trying to configure a WM for a beginner like myself. Just a recommendation :3
I actually prefer tmux. Since it runs in a background as a service I think only once it crashed on me but had multiple instances of desktop environment crashing and once it happened all terminals and work on them closed... Besides I like that I can connect via ssh from any machine attach tmux and all my work is just where I left it. The only thing that bothers me with tmux is copying to and from it.
I'd like to see the instructional video about how to combine all those (most common) components into a whole thing.
Like how do I change login manager?
How do I configure a specific window manager in the (?) login manager ?
How do I switch desktop environment?
How do I take something from one DE and something else from another and use it -- like use Nautilus in GNOME just for example?
Bspwm is the best at sticking to the Unix philosophy. (on non-tiling side, xfce is also good at it)
XFCE can place new windows in somewhat broken tilling manner itself, myth is broken.
@axl Dev are you familiar with unix philosophy?
@axl Dev ah then you are aware of the differences between unix philosophy and suckless.
@axl Dev so you think theres no differences?
@axl Dev my point is they're not the same
I really like Awesome wm. I3 was nice too. But awesome works well out of the box and is easier to config.
Normal hopper: hopps distros
DistroTube: hopps window manager
I am xfce power user, mono screen all my life, I became intrigued, came about a second screen, vanilla xfce is not good at multihead, can't make second screen a worskpace, I installed awesome, now I will rice it, down the drain goes my productivity, TY.. :p
Log entry: I am integrating awesomewm into xfce for now, solved key conflicts, looking to vim'ify it all, goes smooth so far, love it's dual screen behavior, all good so far)
Right there is no best. But we all have preferences, like we can list of the top 3 favorites or top 5 favorites from our experience with a few of these programs.
My top three favorite Tiling Window Managers are i3, bspwm and herbstluftwm.
Other Window Managers that I like are pekwm, openbox, fluxbox, and JWM.(Stacking)
I couldn't get i3 function buttons working right on my X1Carbon. I installed Regolith-Linux and it got me jump-started and now I feel like I'm ready to build my own config.
Does anyone finds weird he is not a programmer and does not even work with computers?
This is the beauty of Linux. You have to learn if you want things done even if you aren't a programmer
if you ask me, he could take a job like that without trouble
@@razbeats8242 Makes me think of something people in the old school shaving community like to say. Straight edge razors are better, but they also require you to basically make shaving a hobby. If you just want to shave, you'd better turn elsewhere.
@@Anthropomorphic I believe everyone in the world needs some level of computer knowledge to work or study more efficiently and if you're using Linux, you're more than likely going to know more about how things work. It's harder yes but hard != bad.
@@razbeats8242 Sure, though the common denominator between more widely known and adopted systems seems to be that the threshold of entry is fairly low, and there's no real requirement to climb higher. The shallow end, while suboptimal, is viable on its own. Of course, I'm kind of assuming here that wider adoption is desirable, and many would disagree.
I love your channel man, I've learned a lot with this video
The tabbed layout in i3 does not force you to be fullscreen like the monocole layout, so I don't see how they're the same. You could have a set of tabs take up just one corner of the screen, which is super helpful for multiple vim instances, opening multiple PDFs, etc.
Not saying xmonad can't do that because I don't know, that's just not what you showed.
The main reason I use the tabbed layout on i3 is that I can click the tabs with my mouse. Can't do that in any other WM. I mainly use the tabbed layout on my second screen to combine Firefox, Spotify/other media players, Discord... basically applications that are primarily mouse-driven. When I'm planning to interact with one of these applications, I'm already using my mouse, so it makes sense to switch between them with my mouse as well. I don't often use the tabbed layout for terminals or other keyboard-driven applications.
And of course, as you said, tabbed containers don't have to be fully maximized. You can have one window occupying one half of the screen, and a tabbed container with multiple applications occupying the other half of the screen. It's not at all comparable to a monocle layout.
I usually suggest i3 as the most suitable tiling wm to start...
Sway. Waybar is in my option just so much better than all the other bars available on i3
Benedict Schlüter i wanted to use sway but is there a way to get a different layout than columns
preferably one like fairv in awesome
Thank you, Derek. I have yet to try Qtile but will in a few months.
I think you should. I use qtile as my daily driver and it’s amazing. Even if I have multiple tiling window managers installed I tend to always use qtile.
@ 03:08 Hey DT! there is no stupid question !
I would've like to know about tiling window managers that operate using Wayland, instead of Xorg. Been thinking about switching to Sway, but don't know yet if it is worth it.
I dig that skull ascii in the thumbnail 👀
Great work 🥳🥳🥳 Thank you 💜💜💜
How do I get those cool looking terminal banners?
I think on his gitlab?
"Qtile is just as fast"
Ah, the "just as good" meme from gun UA-cam.
My first X Window, window manager was twm, in early 1990's. Then I 'switched' to fullscreen GNU Emacs.. :) and stucked in it. :)
Then one day, I saw a new very interesting workstation in the computer lab. Very graphically GUI ... and it called "NeXT Setp".. Yes, the workstation was the NeXT Unix workstation. Many years after that, I 'emulated' the feeling with OpenStep window manager on Slackware Linux..
Then, I tried as many window managers as possible, including a very rare "Text window manager;; TWin. Yes, we can make text console as windowig UI.
Then after I found GNU Screen, I stopped looking anymore.. :)
Personally, I prefers tiny lightweight window manager, such as, lwm, aewm, tinywm, swm, ... and I loves evilwm. until today
.
:)
I moved from i3 to qtile a while back and I"ll be honest, I kinda miss the tabbed layout. You know the columns layout that qtile offers? That's closer to how I used the tabbed layout than the max layout demonstrated here. What that person was talking about has more to do with the tree-like structure i3 uses to contain its windows within containers and subcontainers, and then apply the tabbed layout to a subcontainer for a cleaner look while also keeping everything you immediately need in one workspace.
I've been using i3 for half a year. Although it's completely next-level experience from floating window managers, I can see its flaws.
I'm looking to switch to either DWM or Awesome. I've tried st from suckless, and actually used it for a while, but switched to kitty, because it was either buggy and "fix it yourself" approach wasn't really for me. Therefore I'm afraid of using DWM.
Is it still worth tring DWM before Awesome?
It's worth trying both dwm and awesome. Both are good and awesome was originally a fork of dwm. If you want suckless, go dwm. If you want "everything and the kitchen sink included", then awesome is what you want.
Very nice video! Thanks DT!
Well DT, as you said you are UA-cam personality so you need to accept that a lot of people want to copy you, that comes with fame. I get your point, but it is what it is.
i started with dwm and it was fine it was my first wm comming from gnome
now i use sowm and it is crazy fast
😁
I tried many window managers, and I prefers eveilwm; tiny stacking window manager. Bery small, fast and versatile. Not need to use mouse to operates.
Thank you.
Never heard of it.
@@GreyDeathVaccine
www.6809.org.uk/evilwm/
or
wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Evilwm
Really enjoying you content please keep it up. Could you do an episode about making youtube videos on linux? Easiest screen capture, audio, editing, etc software? Or maybe your process for your videos?
@DistroTube
When editing /etc/pacman.conf and adding the line ILoveCandy we get a Pacman (represented by C and c) eating dots.
My ? is: Can Pacman (C and c) be changed into real Pacman icon?
Thanks and thanks for the videos.
All the best!
This is a wild offtopic, but I absolutely love his accent. Where is DistroTube from?
valignatev Texas
Python is a great language to learn for beginners. It's not statically typed language. It's interpretive dynamic language.
Nothing wrong with python, it's a fully capable language. People are just stupid.
13:15 well what if I want a "master/tabs" layout? one window on the left half of the screen and one stack of windows on the right half of the screen?
I've been using Arco Linux to try out different environments/managers because it has such an easy way to install them with it's tweak tool. It's a bit too rolling for my taste so I'm fine with using it for exploration.
Hey DT what is the best chocolate? I prefer DarkChocolate.
treetab in qtile is basically a tabbed layout, just the tabs are on the side
I actually used DWM as my first tiling window manager. And from just laziness I didn't change it to anything else. I tried i3 but didn't like the tree structure.
I wish I had a use case for a tiling WM. Sitting in front of a 28" 4K screen and not liking pretty much all windows in fullscreen ... I would end up configuring all windows to float or use dozens of "padding windows" to resize other windows.
What do you mean by dwm is not usable out of the box? Pretty much the only thing that has to be changed is in the key bindings, changing Alt to Meta. After that, dwm is perfectly usable, no need to patch it at all (unlike st).
hey DT how you create the skull i see in the thumbnail of this video ?
Hey DT.
I use i3 and often use tabbed layout in split layout.
You said "tabbed layout is just a monocle layout with tabs on top".
Can I split and tabbed in other window manager?
This guy... master of Computing😂
It's ok to ask for a suggestion, but "the best" is not a question to ask. I love i3wm, but I don't think is the best, it just works for me
And maybe just a video on micro, it's like the vi improved of nano like editors
I use it all the time, it is amazing for scripting and it is suprisingly powerful.
How do u deal with tearing in tiling window managers? Do u use just use picom or do you play with the xorg. conf.d file and add TearFree option?
Compton
@@riseabove3082 let me tell you right off the bat, that is not a great solution.
I am trying to find a right way to configure Awesome WM on Manjaro KDE. While I read that KDE plasma is integrated extensively on vanilla Manjaro, wanted to know some basic steps to follow to configure it on my desktop
xmonad was my first wm. i had no problem.
so i had dont agree with dt.
Whenever I see TWM, I think "Tom's Window Manager" running on X Windows back in the early 90s on Sun/Solaris.
When you say Qtile appears to be just as fast as other wms, is it because it is configured minimally? I have a feeling the Python backend may not scale well when a lot of stuff is added to Qtile's config as compared to adding the same amount of customization to other wms.
@@fossegrim287 So Xorg has an API that window managers call for most of the functions? Is that how it works?
Luke Smith dwm gang where ya at :D?
Luke makes better video than him. Ask me why
Yes. I was memed into dwm, too.
Any1 know how Dt does those graphics in his terminal on startup ? Pls
Go to my GitLab and check the shell-color-scripts repository.
DistroTube ur awesome. Ty 4 reply. Stay safe amigo 👍
Even locally, your X-windows can crash or freeze, or you nay accidentally close the terminal window. But tmux session keeps running.
DT if you could able submissions of closed captions to your videos I'd like to help making them. Thanks!
I have wanted to get into qtile for a couple of weeks now but no matter if I try it on Debian or Manjaro or pure Arch I can't get the default config to work. If I try to start qtile with the default config it tells me that there is an error in the config file. If I try to run that file from CLI with Python it looks to me as though it is calling out some methods which the libraries do not contain. I haven't had time to dig into that and wind up going back to XFCE just to get things done. Anyone else have issues with that?
Same for me
I'm not a programmer but extremely interested in Linux
I use tmux in a floating window (luke Smith idea) and with fuzzy finder.
Tmux is very useful to avoid having bloated and big terminal emulators but also having those tabs on tmux and having the saved sessions in it, so I really can't see myself not using it, it's specially useful when you wanna search for error messages and correct them on the same screen
Luke Smith made me switch to DWM and I have been unable to use anything ever since. I feel like there's a slight delay between pressing a button and something happening in awesome. Also it's a bit annoying that the good WMs usethe most annoying configs. C code that you have to compile into the binary, haskell and Lua. Might try out qtile at some point though.
i believe you mean anything _else_ :p but yeah dwm is great
what de are you going to use tomorro
Serious question up here:
If every single TWM can be configured as every single other TWM... Why even move away from i3wm?
dark whisperer layouts
awesome has many preconfigured layouts like fairv and i dont know how to get fairv on i3
i would switch to sway (wayland i3)
Cuz i3 sucks
I think you misunderstand the utility of the i3 tabbed layout. When your windows are full screen, it's not useful, it's superfluous, like you demonstrate. Where it really shines is when you already have the view split. I will describe an example.
Part of my job requires answering phones, and the phone interface is a web page. On a small window that takes up maybe the right 15% of the screen, I keep the phone system web page open. The other 85% of the screen I use 5 tabbed windows:
- Browser for ticketing system and research
- Chat client
- Remote Windows machine for applications that I need that can't be installed on Linux
- Notes
- File browser
The tabs at the top of the left split allow easy access to any of these windows, while still allowing the phone system window to remain open on the right side of the screen.
One other thing that probably many people do not know is that you can split windows inside a tabbed view. This is useful for like keeping many windows open but only one of them focused, taking up the full screen, but then still having the ability to open a split on that window while leaving all the others on their own tabs out of the way. I find myself using this often when needing to reference a web page and open terminals but I still have other web pages open in their own windows that I don't necessarily want to close, but I don't want to have on the screen at the moment.
DT, I tried deleting my KDE for an I3 tiling window manager and I screwed up my install because I didn’t know what files you needed before you install any tiling window manager and deleting your DE.
Actually you don't need much xd
You'll miss features from the DEs obviously
Just backup your files and make a clean install
People ask questions like whats the best because they are scared to start with a “bad” WM
4:00
But there is one except about "the best" question, no doubt you won't find a video player better than VLC. :D
MPV
Movie Monad is the best: ua-cam.com/video/NT7IPGA3eXk/v-deo.html
SMPlayer for some, it's the best.
MPLayer.. Period. :)
I don't have time to customize it right now. Already completely behind in uni because of Arch not liking my gpu.
WINDOWS managers
What is that program that gets ran everytime you open the terminal?
Put in .bashrc
### RANDOM COLOR SCRIPT ###
/opt/shell-color-scripts/colorscript.sh random
Only one that loves BSPWM?
Been using it since I decided to try out Arch (about 2 years)
@@peterjansen4826 giggity.
I use stock WM s mostly but I can switch.
Doesn't awesome actually show the open windows in monocole layout in the top bar as tabs?
Out of the box, yes you are correct. If you want to change it (aesthetics wise or even removing it if that is your thing), all you need to do is look for the "task list" in your configs. By default it is in the rc.lua file at lines 157 - 169 (and then implemented into a wibox at line 183). In a majority of the reddit rices, most people split the rc.lua file into separate config files so you just need to do a little looking to find it if you go down that path and download the dotfiles.
GNOME is the best!
U gotta be a 32Go RAM, 1Tb SSD, i9 computer user.
@@edjupp6643 Actually more than 32GB of RAM
@@edjupp6643 128 GB RAM, 10 TB SSD, latest i9 with RTX 2080 Ti.
@@edjupp6643 8g ram N4100 128g ssd run perfectly fine on gnome. 650mo ram on cold boot.
I think you might be trying too much to look after your viewers. If they're infantile and impressionable to the point where they'll stick with whatever you use no matter what then it's their problem, not yours.
Otherwise, questions like "what you use?" come from trust in your choices and recognition of similar preferences (or maybe just pure curiosity, this one's the most common for me). That is if I liked something that was recommended to me then there's a fair chance I'll like something else that the person recommends to me. Similar logic applies to "what's the best?" questions, if you're asked that chance is they're asking for your personal favorites. It's the most sensible assumption since it's a purely subjective term.
Yes, but I think he answered that. He says he doesn't use just one TWM, he uses so many of them each day. How do you recommend one over the other when each day you use a different one?
Also, when asked what is the best is so subjective to the point that what is best for you may not be best me. And who wants the person to come back later saying hey I discovered this or that I thought you said this was the best, why didn't you recommend . People do this all the time to me in the IT world and it aggravates me too. My best is not your best. Leave it at that.
Well, dwm was kinda
my
first wm
14:15 yes
DT I thought you was a sysadmin.
An Arch coffee cup, didn't know those were a thing, kind of jealous now.
www.redbubble.com/shop/?iaCode=u-mugs&query=arch%20linux
I bet after this clip the Lenin looking unaboomer ranting ina woods will come with a dab...
The only bad thing about i3 is the jkl; bindings. It's a pain having to remap everything
yeah, but it takes like 3minutes to change that, so...
wait your saying awesome is more customizable than dwm‽
Uh, yea. There is only so much customization possible when you limit your window manager to being under 2000 lines of code. 😱
@@DistroTube i mean you can add as many lines as you want after you grokked those 2000 lines no 😏
I think he's making the point that configuring DWM is literally changing the source code. Also not sure if anyone's dwm ends up being under 2 KLOC after applying all the patches they want 😉
@ the way i see it is that the official version stays under 2kloc, any functionalities you add to it will surely bring it over that limit and your free to do so, but it's als your (or the patch maintainer's) responsibility if those patches break :P *looks at the surf chromebar patch*
tldr; the suckless devs only take responsibility for the 2kloc lines you are free to add more :p
Ah, the 'Python is slow' misconception. It's a high-level language that's not as efficient at certain tasks as you point out, sure, but most users/code won't necessarily be performing those tasks. Match that against its ease of use, and it's a very fair tradeoff. I'm biased, though.
6 month old comment, but objectively speaking python, the language, is slow
if you're only really using python as basically a bridge for calling C/C++ (or other native) code it's more than fast enough to do the job tho, and in that case ease of use does shine through way more than the .01 seconds spent actually interpreting python code