How to repair, improve and fix Sewage and Sump Pump Float switch reliability
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- Опубліковано 9 сер 2017
- The float switches for sump and sewage pumps are known to fail, sometimes all too frequently. The creator of this video believes the failures are due to the switch contacts in the float not being robust enough for the high motor starting (inrush) currents that are typical with electric motors/pumps and offers a practical and relatively low cost solution. This improved design relies on a motor rated power relay or contactor to control the power to the motor pump. The light electrical load of the relay circuit (relay coil) is triggered/controlled by the new or existing float switch.
A diagram is located here: • Improve pump float swi... - Навчання та стиль
Great idea, thanks for sharing.
Great minds think alike!
"Deluxe Upgrade": I just got done wiring my float to a 30A SPST Magnecraft relay plus a smart power SSR module...
If you care not to ever visit your sump/sewage pump again, consider adding a "Soft Starter" in serie with the 30A relay to drive the pump!! What kills the contactors is really the repeated in-rush start surge.
Having a Soft Starter significantly drops the surge current necessary to spin the pump from dead stop.
On my Zoeller pump, my measured In-Rush Start current went from 32A down to 19A!! Steady Run current being around 8A only.
I believe this will positively save on electric bill, 30A relay life span and pump bearings wear.
Typically you'd want a 9Amp "soft start" (the internal SSR "Alternistors" can handle a huge surge north of 200Amps for couple 60Hz cycles. They are bullet proof) - My pump cycle being only 11secs, I am running a used 3Amp Schneider Starter module I had laying around spare: no problem with my in-rush being around 20A 👍🏻
Wiring diagram: Live goes to SPST Relay then into Starter then out to pump socket.
Should anything fail, I can always plug my pump back directly into AC float sensor.
As my main sump level sensor, I have been using a "Flood Free" module on a stainless steel rod to drive my 30A relay coil (AC float is kept as backup).
I tried adding a cheap 30s delay timer as security cut-off in case the float control should get stuck. (It turned into an relay oscillator using 12DC pwr cube) - So now going to try a $15 digital multifunction programmable module for timing reliability... Preventing a stuck float sensor from burning the pump dry is simple now with separate control and power circuits! Use a cut-off delay timer with NC contact driving main relay coil.
System reliability is only as good as its weakest link: sensors! Capacitive sensors looked promising but may quickly become unreliable in sewage sump application.
Stainless steel floats with a magnetic Reed contact may be an option if properly shielded inside a PVC pipe... anyone with hands-on experimentations ??
Can you do a video? You lost me. Sounds like a good idea 👍
Good idea. I think I'm going to install a contactor on my float switch. Thanks.
I'd like to install a _contractor_ on my float switch...like a robot. 8-) I misread your post at first. *_0
i did something different but like that also i put a back up float on the same pump
Kudos to a great idea!
Is the relay controller pretty much the same as a well pump controller, right? If not, where can you purchase them?
Oops-disregard, I posted prematurely before you got into relay details. Very good info 👏
Once you break the seal on a submerged float switch casing, you introduce the possibility of leaking water into the switch which could be very dangerous creating possibility of electrical shock or worse.. Most plumbers will replace the entire pump and will not mess with submersible components or take on liability. The motor already has wear on it anyway. And you don't want a voltage leak in the pit, even if you GFI protect it. If you are going through bad switches other possibilities are excessive inrush current and something wrong with the motor not the switches.Another reason to replace the motor also. Is it a good pump? Regarding installing additional hardware, clearly you are considering it had better be UL or at least CE approved and proper rated and used as intended.
You sir are the reason for the mess in my underpants.
I've thinking about making something like this, to shut off my washing machine, when the laundry sink is about to overflow. Wife keeps flooding my basement, as either a sock or something falls into the sink, clogging the drain. Need a hefty relay, to handle the current used by a washing machine, especially in rinse and drain cycles. Oh, Water alarms are only good if someone is there, to hear it!
I personally would use an AC contactor for the type of application you've described, not a relay. I can visualize a circuit with a float switch, 24VAC transformer and contactor with 24VAC coil with electrical outlet.
Why do you have to splice it and put a new adapter on if all you need to do is plug it in and install a new one when you got all the other stuff there?
I keep going through switches, Ive tried several different ones. Will this help to avoid burning out the switch? My pump has never failed, but this seems to help control the power to the pump, I need to figure out why I am burning out the switches?
Like I said in the video, the switch INSIDE the float is not heavy duty. My heavy duty solution places only a very light load on the float switch thereby improving the overall reliability of the pump control
i had the same problem but hooked up 2 float switches to one pump at differnt levels if one failed the other one kicks in gave me a piece of mind
You must be a EE. If anyone wants to get fancy with their sump pump setup, you can add in an alternating relay with a second float and pump. Part number is: ALT-115-X-SW.
Yep, Purdue EE .... a long time ago! Wow, that's a pricey item.
YuDaMan it’s a lot cheaper than a Zoeller SmartPak residential alternator!
@@jessiebauer816: that's for sure!
How did you wire the relay inside the electrical box?
Thanks for the clarification. The video explained everything well except when it came to how the relay needed to be hooked up. In the meantime I did some separate reading and figured out on my own what the NO, NC and com terminals mean, but showing the inside of the electrical box and how you hooked up each wire to the relay would have been very helpful. I'm an engineer so I have the capacity to understand what's going on, but haven't dealt with relays before.
why would anyone ever use a relay float if it keeps failing, i dont understand?
Because the original manufacturer makes the pumps as inexpensively as possible and some but not all only care about the warranty period. They are compact and generally work ok .... until they don't. The relay solves the weakest link in the control system.
Do you have a wiring diagram of the process.
Dan, I have created a sketch for others. How do you want me to send to you?
@@YuDaMan send via email. ddmicare@gmail.com thanks
I seem to have thrown away the sump pump packing box. I have no clue what was supposed to be in it. The electrician did a lousy job and the pump doesn’t start and stop automatically.
Wind guard...
What?😱
My issue is the floats fill up with friggin water!!
If that is really happening then there is a real risk of someone getting shocked or electrocuted! You should get this taken care of ASAP.
@@YuDaMan It’s hooked up to a GFCI so it puts a standstill to that.. High water alarm goes off, then that float fills up with water as well... New floats is the only fix.. I put RTV silicone all around them a few days before I changed them.. So far- so good...
@@mlke4258 that's my problem when I shake my float I hear water and it drips out slightly when turned upside down. I'm mystified as to how this could happen.
@@willb.9225 comes through the cord.. When I replaced mine the last time- I went around the edges, and around the cord with obnoxious amounts of RTV silicone... That was this past November... Still working.. 🤞
@@willb.9225 I think it’s worth noting these are the everbilt ones from home cheapo... If you order the pricier ones(red ones) they are made to a much higher standard of quality...
Any sump pump needs to be Installed on a GFI and seperate breaker. also if your place goes up in flames because of it. Your home owners insurance will not pay for out for any damaged caused by it. esp if you have it Jerry rigged. I've been a home inspector for 8 years along with our depts arson/Fire investigation unit for 13 years...
U dont understand what was proposed here mr inspector and like most city inspectors u are ignorant of electrical interfacing to take the load off the primary control element,the float.D Steele electrical Tech for 44 years.
@@danielsteele7544 Going by your grammar snd spelling.Etc..I doubt you have over 44 years experience. Also any one with common knowledge to which you seem to lack. Knows that a sump pump goes onto its own dedicated line and if smart enough one with a GFI. And again if smart enough you'd know why it should be a GGI outlet.
👍👈 🫵 are awesome 👌
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂Not helpful to me at all, but I'm sure it is to someone
This video is terrible in my opinion for a number of reasons:
1. You completely omitted showing how you installed a new float to your sump pump. The float on mine comes out of the pump, into the water, and then up to a plug with a piggyback outlet on the back of it that plugs into a receptacle on the wall.
Replacing the float would not be a simple fix for anyone besides maybe a real electrician because whatever you do is going to be below water at some point. So doing that correctly is crucial. And you didnt show how you did it at all or thoroughly describe what you did.
2. You mention relays, switches, contacts, and controllers without showing each one and describing the function of each one. So again, you would need to be an electrician or electrical engineer to understand all the stuff you were talking about.