Since I got to my 30s its crazy how even 20 year olds look like kids. I can't imagine looking at a 12 year old and thinking they look mature for their age. 🤢
@Istuckmyheaddownthetoilet Same, although I'm a woman. I'm quite tall and I was the height I am now as I was when I was 13. My older brother would get me to go into liquor stores for him to buy his grog because he still looked young. I was though probably actually mentally quite immature.
The way Mary's husband confronted Vili as though he was a grown man sleeping with his wife. Not a child who was a victim of sexual abuse. Its so weird.
I almost threw up when I watched his mom’s interview where she basically said she doesn’t hate Mary or think she should go to prison. Then she said her son is very “mature” for his age and that even though she doesn’t think it’s right, she believes they are in love or they wouldn’t have risked being together 🤮 She blamed the school and the police but not Mary. It took her years to finally say that she blames Mary and that Mary ruined her son’s life. I can understand why she felt like she could trust Mary and why she allowed Vili to stay in Mary’s home and go on family trips with them. She said she thought she could trust Mary as a mother and she thought Vili was going to spend time with his friend (Mary’s son). Mary had also taught 3 of her older children so by the time Vili got to 2nd grade, she’d known Mary as a teacher for years. People tend to trust teachers/authority figures and she never thought a grown woman would prey on her child. The police for some reason didn’t tell her everything about what happened when they caught them in the car. BUT I can’t understand why she made so many excuses for Mary in the beginning. Her statements about Mary and how she described her son played a big role in why so many people had sympathy for Mary at the time.
That interviewer is slick as fuck. You can tell he's really manipulative, and he is super good at his job for it. It is a very delicate type of game you play to come off as a friend and get someone who irritates tf out of you to like and trust you and tell you all their secrets. He can see all of her tricks, and see clearly the manipulation by Mary, and he just plays along so damn well and helps her trust him enough to slip and stammer here and there.
This guy really reeled them in by being softer at the start, letting her wiggle out of the father and such, only to absolutely NOT let her wiggle out over "are you fucked up for this, Mary?"
Absolutely! You can see in his eyes he’s just waiting to absolutely eviscerate her. His eyes contain absolutely zero warmth but she’s such a narcissist she didn’t even notice. Fantastic interviewer.
Have you seen the full thing? At some point she gets so insistent that Vili was the aggressor that Vili goes “this is getting weird” and the interviewer goes “This IS weird - MARY YOU WERE THE ADULT, it doesn’t matter” etc
One of the only times manipulation is a good thing, encouraged, supported and endorsed Some others are hostage negotiation and suicide prevention Real Manipulation is an Artform and such a delicate balancing act that requires a higher than average to above average IQ to successfully pull it off Dude was born to manipulate freaks
Grooming a child is NOT a "character flaw" - it's a genuine and deliberate choice to be predatory. She pretty much trapped him and ruined his life and took his youth.
I think the same damn thing! This woman wrecked his childhood, innocence, relationship with sexuality, education, anonymity, privacy, ability to have a normal life, and chance at a career.
@unstablemexican88No. No you cannot. Grooming in itself is a deliberate act. We all know that pedophilia and ephebophilia is wrong. It’s messed up, twisted, abusive and causes life long trauma for the victims. Adults are supposed to protect children, look out for them and guide them. Not groom them. No one grooms a child accidentally, or unintentionally (!) that thought process is very concerning and dangerous.
@unstablemexican88I wish I could say you were wrong but I don’t believe you are. I think a lot of adults are clueless when it comes to how to appropriately interact with children and adolescents.
There's something repulsive about the way the poor guy says he couldn't imagine sexually abusing a thirteen year old while his wife did exactly that to him... wtf.
So true!! At least he seems to have turned out to be a vastly better parent than she was! (Which of course only makes it even more repulsive: this poor child was forced to be a parent before he was even out of middle school, yet he stepped up as a parent and seems to be as disgusted and horrified as any normal parent by the thought of one of his own kids going through what he did. Whereas she, OTOH, seems so totally unconcerned about his feelings and drastically less mature than him that it's profoundly disconcerting to watch. I can't imagine how more people didn't pick up on her bizarre and unnatural affect before she was outed for raping a child!
I'm so disgusted. She's talking about how quickly time flies and how much you need to appreciate your kids childhood but she took that from him. She took another mother's child. She took his childhood. This is insane. He was just a little kid
It TURNED my stomach when she interrupted the reporter to say 'don't call him a little boy'!!! Ma'am...he was very much a little boy!!! My son is 13 and he is in no way, shape or form ready to be in a relationship, let alone be a father. He is very much a little boy, just like villi was
Right! Just because she thought that Villi was physically mature for his age and that she thought of herself as a "dainty, attractive woman," she thought she's not a pedo when she clearly was. 🤢
And then tried to justify it by saying "Well 13 year olds can be tried as adults go to prison! So what's the difference." Even though for the majority of cases in the majority of states that is not even remotely true
listening to her talk i was stunned like. what are you actually saying theres too many ums and erms for her to even get her baseless and meaningless points across + (edit:) the number of pointless tangents augh!! vili’s discomfort!!! shut up !!!!!
Mary reminds me of my mother when she is drunk. She thinks she is making perfect sense, but everyone around her is thinking, "this woman is fucking bonkers."
She reminds me of my sister when she's sober... To my knowledge the youngest person she has groomed was 17, but it's still a crime. Wish I could get her locked up. Edit: I didn't include her two younger sisters (she's the eldest) she molested me at 6, and we're still not sure what happened with my other sister because she killed herself before saying much. We do know that she passed Amelia off to her adult boyfriends when Amelia was a teenager, and attempted threesomes with her.
My mum ( in a cult) thought it was a great idea to let me be picked up by a 28 yr old man for the weekends when i was 11. -Behave now, he will become the perfect husband , from a very important family! That, was her "logic".
I truly adore this interviewer. He has so much empathy for Billy, never puts words in his mouth or asks leading questions. He allowed Mary Kay all of the time in the world to explain herself without letting her take over the interview.
such a good balance between calling out her bullshit when shes answering dishonestly and letting her answer without being manipulative or overly accusatory. hes so straight to the point and quick its night and day compared to her meandering word salad
I'm a teacher. One boy in my class, the same age as Villi was, kept trying to hug an kiss me at the end of the lesson, I stopped him, and after he left I immediately contacted his parents to arrange a meeting. The boy was on the spectrum and was well known to be overly affectionate with near strangers an his parents were overjoyed that he finally had a teacher who was open with them about it. Which is terrifying to me as it implied other had said nothing. Now this student and I salute each other at the end of class and this seems to work. Mary Kay absolutely disgusts me, how anyone can abuse a child in their care is beyond me.
Exactly. Thanks for sharing. I think many teachers have experienced something like this and they know the complicated psychology and inner workings of a child, and SHOULD be jumping in to HELP and protect them, as you did. Mary Kay is an absolute monster.
Villi basically admitting that he didnt have good memories, almost traumaic memories, while she laughs about it all. Just watching the realization in his face that hes been a victim and is a victim that married his predator is the most heartbreaking thing I've seen in a while....
An adult having sex with a child will always be wrong no matter the gender. It’s extremely troubling how people view this relationship. She ruined that poor boy. She changed what his life would’ve been. She robbed him of everything. It’s disgusting.
@@stard9864 If you watch the documentary she made (and of which this interview is a promotion of) she blames the other female teachers who did the same thing AFTER her... but she genuinely seems to think there were no such laws before her case. It's mind boggling.
Kudos to that interviewer. He did well buttering them up and almost making it seem like they were a normal couple and then went seamlessly into the tough questions without backing down which had the lady completely off guard
I think she is referring to a summer art course they both took at some college, outside of their normal school. But yeah she definitely tries her damn hardest never to mention that he went to the school she taught at and that he was fricking 12.
Billy the club! Billy the Stud. Methinks some white boys are jealous that a 13 yo brown boy scored with a hot white woman out of their league. Billy don't need no hyper moralizing white American liberals to save him. Get your own lives. If she came on to me when I was 13 I would say YES YES YES and got rid of the Sears catalogue I was using.....who gets to decide what is sexual abuse to Billy? Billy has no say because he's a naive brown boy in need of saving. It's just another form of latent racism.
It breaks my heart that Vili says that he’s not trying to play the victim because it makes me suspect that Mary has told him on multiple occasions that he wasn’t the victim. She was.
I very much agree. The way she was pretending to be converned that the child would be arrested for their "relationship" made me immediately think she repeatedly manipulated Vili by telling him he could get in trouble for what he was doing with her. Sick how these predators twist the minds if their victims!
Really disgusting to see her talk about how her kids are graduating high school, going to college, leaving the home, experiencing new things and growing up. Meanwhile her victim is sitting right next to her, silently. He was robbed of those same experiences his children are going through, because of her, and he’s supposed to guide them through it as if he can offer advice from experience.
@@Ireallywantedthatuniquehandleexactly what I was thinking. She too busy being a predator to be there to watch her previous children grow up. Her actions humiliated and traumatized them.
I am so, so, so pleased that Villi divorced Mary before she died. I’m glad that she didn’t get to leave this world with that power still in her grasp. She’s disgusting, and that poor man needs all the support he can get after a literal lifetime of grooming.
@@It-is-me...Melsie It's also difficult because their mom was an unstable pedophile. Judging by her character and what she did to this poor guy, I highly doubt the love between her and _any_ of her children was there. If this was my mom, i'd be ashamed and appreciate her passing. All her kids are victims here as well, and it's unfortunate they have to live the rest of their lives without a mom, but it's safe to say they're better off.
@@simpleshoes She didn't have the ultimate control of her life. Villy has the ultimate control now because he's free of her and able to heal, process, and raise their children in a healthy manner. Hopefully.
In other news, the poor guy got lambasted by Adele for not checking her tracks before an interview plugging her album. There were apparently mitigating circumstances for his crime. His apology is both a little cringe for his groveling, and admirable for his eloquence.
Rockstar? Do you know what a rockstar is? Why not just he's great he's a legend he's super at his job. But Rockstar???? If that's a rockstar for you, You must have never seen a real Rockstar I guess.
The absolute horror you must feel watching your children turn the same age you were, and realising you were a child yourself, and a victim. Imagine dropping your young daughters off at school, seeing their teachers standing in the playground, so different in their adulthood, and realising, I was once so small. I was once that child at school. And the teacher took advantage.
@@kataminedj well.. yeah. He and his children, at least his first is 12 years while Mary was 34 when she got with him. Or at least in her 30s. So basically a decade more lol.
As a Māori (New Zealand indigenous) I am disgusted at how she saw this child as mature. It's just genetics that make us islanders "bigger". How did she become a teacher with such a lack of knowledge? Especially the fact that she's from Australia, a country right next to the pacific islands.
I think racism may have been a factor here. Non-white children are often adultified in the racist mind, and sexual and /or violent motivations are projected onto them.We white people often have more racist prejudice than we like to admit, even to ourselves.Becoming aware of that and working to change one's own preconceptions is an effort that a lot of people don't want to do, especially when no awareness is present that the problem even exists. When a white person is called out for saying or doing something racist, the first and most common reaction is defensiveness, even a reversal of victim and offender: "How dare you hurt my feelings by calling me racist? I am a good person, so I can't be racist, you are the bad person here!"
@@gozerthegozarian9500unfortunately i believe this to be the case in her mind he is mature and “in control” and she cites his heritage and size, but anyone with a brain knows despite his ethnicity, he is a child with no control and a child brain.
@@lame-bj2nq, it was an excuse on her part and BIPOC children are at higher risk of SA than white children The National Black Women's Justice Institute reports that Black girls are more likely to experience harassment than any other group of children Any reason given by the abuser is just an excuse, and racism can play a role in how other adults respond to the situation
I don't know about her excuse because he looks like a child, like a really young child to me. He might have been taller or whatever but his FACE was babyish and I can't imagine she looked into that face and thought about sex. To me he looked his age. She was a disgusting person.
She stumbled over the question about her family because she realizes she has done something even worse than what her father did, and she is too narcissistic to admit it, especially on camera.
Totally. Not only does she refuse to admit any type of fault in the commission of her crimes, after seeing this, I really think that she's the type who never admits any fault for anything - ever.
Yes, I picked up on that too. She’s very hesitant to give any details regarding her family and upbringing because she doesn’t want any of she says to come back up in the interview later. Very much trying to control the narrative
her whole deminor is so disgusting for many reasons but just the way she talks and strains herself so hard just show how little is going on behind those eyes
For someone who went through something so traumatic and to also have to be around someone like her every day, it’s surprising how concise he is. I imagine it’s nightmarish to be around her.
@@grape123 Yeah, I imagine it was really difficult to have a productive conversation with her when they had a problem that needed to be communicated through
My abuser (female) did this when confronted abuse the abuse. Refusing to answer direct questions and talking circles are signs of guilt and manipulation. My abuser had a personality disorder and manipulation was her forte.
He was a child who was taken advantage of and was manipulated into believing the situation was normal If you think that nothing bad has happened, you'll give clear answers to try and get to the truth She was a predator who knew that what she was doing was unethical and illegal She used language to obscure the truth and confuse her listeners
The fact that Vili says at as a 35 year old man if the roles were switched he wouldn’t be doing what she did. That he can’t fathom looking at a 13 year old girl that way. Mary saying “it never crossed my mind. I never did it.” What??? You made him a 14 year old father
She did it, She did time for it and she continues to justify her views and how their situation is " different". Good Lord, my brain hurts. As if it justifies all wrongdoings just because they're married (?)
Kids have crushes on adult figures. It’s totally normal. But because that is so common, we who work in education need to be EVEN MORE careful about how we interact with students. The fact a student may be thinking of us in that way is a reason for us to put more, not less, boundaries
But like how is that normal? Why is that so common? It shouldnt be. Just bc roles are reversed doesnt make it right. If adults need to stay away from kids it should be vice versa. If this type of relationship is wrong then kids still shouldnt get a pass to feel that way about adults either. I will never understand that logic. Your excuse may be "oh theyre just kids theyre immature and they dont think things through" Still, all aspects of this type of relationship is wrong and the child then needs to be encouraged and taught that it is wrong. Dont excuse it on their end either
@@0inspirationalheart0kids love anyone who will show them an ounce of love , they don't know the intentions behind a starnger's affections . Kids aren't complex like adults they don't have ulterior motives . Yes as parents we must talk to them n teach them what's right n what's wrong but you cannot blame a child if he/she has an innocent crush on someone older, the crush is just plain adoration n nothing else but adults no way adults know better so that is why kids should not be blamed
@@0inspirationalheart0 They're JUST KIDS. It IS normal for kids to feel more from people who gave them things they naturally desire. For example, putting aside looks, little girls will be attracted to reliable and capable men because women in general seek for partners that are reliable. little boys will be attracted to the gentle, kind, and loving women, because they naturally seek partners who are nurturing and soothing to them. It's a part of them growing up to start feeling up those feelings. It's NORMAL for them but what's not normal is for the adults to RECIPROCRATE IT!!!! In the end, these children will grow up and become adult, so it's okay for them to be attracted or attached to adults because that means their minds are healthy and open to changes. On the other hand, ADULTS can't be attracted to children because ADULTS remain ADULTS, there's NO REGRESSION for adults. Such a very normal example. Me. When I was a middle-schooler, I was attracted to a fellow middle schooler. This is normal. But I was also attracted to adult men who look handsome and successful, This is normal. But when I grow up, I STOPPED being attracted to middle schoolers and see them as cringe little boys. See? This is called the normal growth of a state of mind and attraction. If you try to limit children on who they should be attracted/having crushes to, you're just going to let them like only people from the same age? Are you trying to stunt them? Are you stupid? Are you trying to create pdfile experimentally?
This woman was insane. She talked over him the whole time, rambled on about nothing, and it just felt like she shot daggers at Vili every time he had his own thoughts about anything. The fact that she never admitted what she did was wrong is disgusting. Vili suffered so much bc of this woman. The saving grace is that she's gone now.
*I mean, your LITERALLY spot on with this comment. She claimed It was true love, yet some of her quotes and demeanor prove other wise. Like when she said “He asked for It” It’s quotes like this, that are EXTREMELY problematic, because one, your trying to make It seem as If he abused you, not that it was consensual, which is funny because you said earlier that it was (It Isn’t if that’s the case.) And two, someone who ACTUALLY loves another person would NEVER say this. 🤷🏽♀️*
Exactly right! Her going on about how she's been evaluated 4 times and has zero characteristics of a pedophile is laughable. She was so delusional it's insane.
The fact that she spoke for 99% of the interview is already telling enough. At no point did Villy validate her points or even try to argue with what she was saying, he has completely given up.
this is so messed up, if this was gender reversed people would be unrelenting its sickening really she broke this guy and has controlled him since he was a child
@@kuzz1191i mean people already are unrelenting evidently by how people have reacted to the situation. She only kinda “gotten away with it” cuz of the loophole
She tried to verbally punish the interviewer for asking very straightforward questions because asking them straightforwardly makes her look bad. The narcissism level with her holy shit.
That interviewer was so good! Wow. He came off as very ignorant and passive at the beginning, but near the end, he was asking pointed, direct questions about her pedophilic urges and monitoring Vili's state as well. He did it all without raising his voice or stooping to her level. This was more of an interrogation than anything.
Yes, I felt the same way when the interview started off, but near the end his questions were so good. You could really see how he made her feel relaxed and safe but steadily his questions took her off kilter. He's a damn good at his job.
I remember they did another interview that took place in their house, not a studio. I remember Villi saying what she did was wrong. Did I imagine this or has someone else seen that? I think it was on 60 minutes too
I really appreciate you highlighting cases like these in which women are the abusers. I dealt with grooming as a little girl by an adult woman. It's taken me a long time to understand and come to terms with what happened. That what happened was, in fact, grooming and sexual harassment. Hearing stories like these is so important to lessen the stigma and to educate people with outdated thoughts and feelings like (unfortunately) most of these adults in this victim's life.
The interview between them was so uncomfortable. Not only is there noticeable dissonance between Mary Kay and Vili, but Mary Kay was all over the place the entire time. She goes on long and bizarre tangents when answering simple questions. The religious heritage speech she went on to avoid talking about her father was especially uncomfortable to watch.
Being a man who was once raped as a boy, it IS rape. Why do I *have* to listen to the "well where was she when I was 12?" or "damn, lucky kid!" like no, I was not lucky, I still wake up crying my fucking heart out. I refuse to turn to substance to cope but it's so fucking hard to not want to, ya know? Therapy, years of pain, relationship struggles, sex life issues, and the worst form of trust issues trauma can give you all from the worst moment my mind chose to repeat and remember. I only liked her because she was older and giving me attention my mother couldn't give me. I still feel it. why.
I'm so sorry you had to go through that, and you continue to be assaulted with every stupid comment. I think a lot more men and boys go through it and never talk about it. One of my husband's friends once talked about having been SA'd by a neighbor, and I was so surprised because he's this 6'4" man now, but he was 10-14 back then and just a kid. It's sick so many think it's ok to brush under the rug ir joke about!
I'm so sad that happened to you. Stay strong. You deserve better. I'm sorry people make those sick comments to make you have to relive your trauma. People suck.
I'm so sorry, my heart is broken for you. I send you all of my love and I hope one day very soon you can fully heal and not feel that pain anymore. You deserved so much fucking better!! You are so worthy of all good and beautiful things. Substances ultimately don't help and end up making so much shit worse, I know first hand. Hang in there bud, you're not alone and people do care. You are loved. ❣️
Her saying "he wasn't prepubescent so he wasn't a child" and "but thirteen year olds are having sex with thirteen year olds" but then refusing to acknowledge that she's saying kids of any age are fair game for adults as long as they've gone through puberty is so mind bogglingly disgusting
Also, the rate of sexual activity in 13 year olds is pretty small. 3% of 13-year-olds reported having sex in the US in 2013. That is a very small number
Mary saying her victim was the aggressor makes my blood boil. Mary is absolutely a predator. This case is tragic, but it'll never not shock and disgust me that they're still people who say boys and men can't be victims of SA.
Even if he tried something with her, it was her responsibility as the adult to put an end to it, report him or something. I don’t believe he was the aggressor. She was manipulative.
@@chavaspada Seriously?… look to point it out, Misato merely kissed Shinji before shoving him into that elevator was the kiss scene awkward yeah, but it had no intention behind it. It was merely how she dealt with tough times or maybe her emotions.. Anyway I stand by my comment in the true crime case this video is about.
And what's crazy is that although not ALL THE TIME, a great portion of those 13 year olds having sex with other 13 year olds are only replicating things they've seen or experienced themselves. They tend to be hypersexual, and this is solely a response and replication of what they've gone through because they think its NORMAL. So her using this to justify her own disgusting behavior is even sicker
She does actually make a good point about child marriages, but comes to the wrong conclusion in an absolutely wild way. More than half the states in the US allow someone over 18 to marry children, in some places from as young as 9. There have been many attempts to repeal these laws but there has been significant push back from churches and Republicans alike. But instead of thinking "oh my god, it's terrible that my country has a child rape loophole, we should do something" she's angry that she got caught before being allowed to use the loophole to continue raping a child
I can appreciate the fact that you continuously referred to Vili as a child. Because that’s exactly what he was. Until you reach the age of majority you’re a child. Mary acting like he was some beast and she was the damsel in distress unable to fight him off really ticks me off. I’ll be 30 this year and I cannot fathom being with someone 10 years my junior let alone 21 years my junior. Disgusting.
The age difference isn't what I find disturbing. What I find disturbing is that when they initially started having a sexual relationship, he was a 12 year child and she was in her thirties. That is WRONG.
And there is a specific word for predators who are attracted to pubescent children. I wonder what she would say if asked if she's a hebephile? Some children start puberty at only 8 years old. Its ridiculous to say they aren't children anymore.
He's letting her drown herself at the "when did you first meet him" part. She's really bad at this, but I noticed right away what she's trying to do. She's doing more than distancing herself from him as his teacher, she's softly trying to imply he was much older. That's why she mentions that she was happy because he wasn't her student anymore and that she got to see him in college. She's trying to reframe it so the issue is that she was his teacher, not that he was a minor, and she can quietly hide that by just leaving out how old he was. Even when she says there were legal issues and ramifications. If you just put this on for someone who didn't know you'd just be thinking it's nasty she dated a college student that she knew as a kid.
Omg the interviewer is doing this so masterfully: no judgement, just this curiosity and neutrality, no insinuation of shame or guilt. He let her do it to herself. Reminds me of the interview of Prince Andrew after his buddy Epstein was caught.
The "I didn't expect to get pregnant" line is just too funny. I like imagining that she genuinely has no idea how her first four children came into this world - that she believes it's nothing more than random chance. lol.
Poor Villi, imagine thinking you had a fairytale love story to find out that you were abused and then you find out the person who did it is the mother of your children and she's completely insane. I can't imagine his confusion, even now. I think he saw his girls turn 13 and he was like wait wait... oh.....no
Particularly when she says" its not the same" when Vili states that as a 35, that there is no way he'd be comfortable being attracted to a 13 year old. He's clearly disgusted by the thought.
There’s many instances of people who only totally grasp their trauma by seeing their kids reach the age they were when they got assaulted. It’s very sad. Very very sad.
@@rucca2008 8 is indeed a little boy. But he was 13 when she abused him, which isn't a little boy. She's a disgusting pig, I get that, but let's tell it like it is. He wasn’t a little boy, or a child, or an infant, or whatever, when she abused him.
You can tell nobody sat down with him to explain what happened. He was likely never provided therapy as it seems he doesn't really understand that she abused him ruining him and HER family. It seems that he had to come to terms with that later in his life but his ideology is still muddled with "I loved her" "we loved each other" etc. He was raped, molested and TRAPPED by this women she should have rotted in prison for what she did to him. Society gave his abuser a second chance to continue to abuse and ruin his life. I hope he has found some peace in her absence.
Editing really is powerful! I watched this interview when it first came out, and the majority of what you showed here is not included in the official posted interview. I knew she was crazy, but this video truly shows how deluded and narcissistic she truly was! Thank you so much for showing the full interview and calling out her BS. Also, I LOVE when you get enraged at the situation and your language reflects it! You're always so matter-of-fact and straightforward when presenting a case, so when you use strong language that reflects how you feel about the information you're sharing, I love it! I think often times with true crime channels, the presenter is seen as a news reporter, giving the facts of a case, but not showing any emotion that reflects how they feel about the situation. So when you get animated and show how disgusted you are, it sets you apart, and I appreciate that. 💙
The interviewer does a great job at remaining calm and professional and yet his little glances and facial expressions say everything we are all thinking
Yes, and when he said “well that’s a topic for another discussion” or something along those lines, I giggled. Subtle way to tell her to shut the f*ck up.
YES. Oh my god I was jolted by the disgust that read in his eyes after MK would laugh something off or nonchalantly reference something, or when he asked her a question, how he had to frame it innocently- he was connected to the truth and he had the right view of her.
She is would’ve probably made this about something pure like love and romance and how she’d support that because “kids should experience love” deflecting the focus from the main aspect: predators preying on children. I can already picture that because she’s working so hard to look good and she’d probably think saying this would serve that purpose too.
I think you’re giving her more credit than she deserves. She’d probably refuse to answer the question coherently and then nonsensically ramble in a totally different direction.
It wouldn’t have mattered to Mary. She would’ve said it’s not the same thing. Vili also said that if they switched roles, he couldn’t imagine at his age of 35 being romantically interested in a 13 year old. The reporter asked if it hurt Mary to hear Vili say that and she looked confused and said it’s not the same thing. She will always find a way to excuse what she did.
she reminds me of Jodi Arias with the way she talks in the interview, going on wild tangents off the back of perfectly simple questions. she's so desperate to come across as normal and relatable that she shoots straight to the uncanny valley.
I cannot BELIEVE there isn't a law that stops a pedophile from marrying a victim. If a person has been arrested for molesting a child and a part of that sentence is no contact why in the world wouldn't we uphold that rule for the rest of their life. The power imbalance and history of abuse doesn't stop once the victim is an adult.
Yeah, that's insane when you think about it. You should not be able to marry the person you abused. This whole thing is so awful and disturbing. The way she talks is so cringe. Really sad too.
This is a sick case but the kid became an adult. I don’t see how you could apply such a law that would prevent him from marrying her. That would be a slippery slope. People should really think through all implications ramifications before suggesting silly laws.
@@robertjones8598 its not a silly law... grooming is a crime. The whole point of grooming is to abuse and tie that child to you until you can legally or otherwise get your hands on them. Why is it okay for them to get their way just because their victim is now of age? I don't see how a law against a pedophile being allowed to marry a victim would be a "slippery slope" where do you think its gonna slip exactly? There is absolutely no benefit to allowing pedophiles more access to their previous victims. Frankly im concerned you think its silly to stop them from further victimizing these people. We make actually silly laws about what adults can and can't do with their bodies all the time to protect unborn children but don't make adequate laws to protect ones that are already here. I don't really care if its "unfair" to a pedophile or brainwashed victim that they can't be together, victims need to stay away from their abusers to heal and gain proper perspective on the situation. Take it from someone who's been through it. NOTHING is worth a victim being harmed further.
@@jojocaitlin8508 because they’re adults. Maybe just push for life sentences for offenders to limit access, but you don’t solve things by restricting the rights of the victim once they’ve reached age of majority even if we think they should stay was from the person. Anyway, it’s a slippery slope and if you don’t see that then ok.
She’s absolutely delusional and he looks like he lost the battle for happiness a long time ago and now is just going through a absolute miserable existence
Before this I watched a video about a guy who had CP on his PC. He got 12 years (and rightfully so). This woman sleeps muliple times with a minor and gets 6 months. Total BS
@@jenniferburton7044I do wonder if he left her because he finally accepted what she did was wrong, or if her apparent bad personality and controlling behavior finally got to him.
"this 13-year-old was so mature!" is crazy. I met this guy in one of my college classes and thought he was kinda cute. He looked my age and was much taller and bigger than me but I found out he was a highschooler and it immediately changed how I saw him. Whenever we interacted for classwork or anything else in class, it was so obvious that this kid was still that, a kid, no matter how he looked, how smart he really was, or whatever. And that killed any interest I had in him because kids/teens are so impressionable that as an adult you have to be the one to set boundaries. I was 19 and knew that. She definitely knew that too.
110%. When I was 23, my older coworker got her son a job at our workplace. He was handsome, 6'2", had a voice as deep as my dad's, and was so mature that I assumed he was around my age. Once I found out he was only 17, I was disgusted with myself despite only admiring him from afar, and THAT'S the reaction anyone should have. From then on, I could only see him as a KID, because THAT'S WHAT HE WAS.
Same thing with me although the guy who was interested in me was fresh out of school and just started college. He just turned 18 and I was 23 at that time and met in college. He told me his feelings but I had to make sure to cut the relationship early. Even the difference was Wierd to me although he was an adult (at least according to German laws).
tf, so how was he in a college class? & that'd still make him what 17, 18? there is basically no difference from that to 19. I'm 29 & still feel like I'm 18.
That analogy at the beginning is so perfect. So many people blame child victims of sexual abuse especially for what happened to them and I feel like comparing it to giving in to a child wanting to drive a car puts it into perspective so well
I will never understand people who will think it's ok cuz, "The child asked." Like, any sane adult wouldn't let a 12 year old drive on the road, much less ANOTHER person's child. No matter how much a kid begs to eat rat poison, you don't give it to them and in fact you keep it far away from them. If a child begs to bring home another child after other child's parent already said no, you say no and that you could get in trouble if you took said child. I'm convinced they're almost all the same people who say gentle parenting is "letting your kid get away with stuff and never saying no." I can just feel it
How she keeps calling her manipulation and rape of a teenage boy "my situation" is crazy. She spent her life convincing herself what she did was fine knowing the whole time it was abuse.
Exactly! It's so obvious how much she KNOWS how wrong what she did is. And yet, she keeps insisting on denying it because she couldn't give two sh*ts about it being wrong or right. All she ever cared about was having full control of this boy. And she did. Despite everything the law did to stop her. Which just goes to show how dangerous grooming is, and how long lasting its devastating effects are. So sad and heartbreaking, tbh. He was so vulnerable:(
It's so disturbing to me that to this day, this case is made a joke. A male child being groomed is not him getting lucky - it's assault. Thank you for covering this case, Dreading.
Also getting “lucky” would imply the desirability of the other potential partner. Or at least they would need to be an attractive person physically or at least not look like their grandma.
At least the media has gotten on board the last few years, you see new articles every week in the news about female teachers and coaches abusing young boys. Most are not okay with it anymore.
“To this day” The vast majority of people call it for what it is….predatory af. Anytime this case is covered, 95% of the feedback is always saying what a monster she is, & that he’s been a victim of hers since he was a little boy. If anything, society takes male victims more serious than ever before. It’s sad it took as long as it did, but you’re never going to rid the world of everyone with trash opinions. Villi is FINALLY getting the support from the general public that he should’ve gotten all along
The thing that continues to be gross to me is that she keeps throwing poor Villi under the bus. She’ll blame him, a CHILD, up and down before taking accountability
That interview is such perfect evidence of why these relationships are illegal--their dynamic is SO terrifyingly unhealthy. He has no power with her because he's known her since he was EIGHT and she was his first everything, and her being an adult through all that just makes the power balance a nightmare. She had that poor man completely manipulated his entire life. He can't even fully face his messed up it is here because he's got to balance that he loves his children against the fact that this woman is a predator who completely took advantage of and groomed him. I'm glad he separated from her and hope he's healing now because wtf
The fact that she admitted that the only course of action she would have taken differently would have been to hire a different attorney is extremely telling. She actually believed that she was somehow wrongfully accused or coerced by law enforcement. She showed no remorse at all for her heinous actions. She even had the audacity to try and gain sympathy near the end, tearing up and claiming that she "always did her best." It is honestly nauseating to hear her dismiss the severity of her crimes or flat out deny them. When her victim explains that, as an adult in his 30's, he would never be attracted to a 13-year old, she is asked if it stings to hear him say that given their situation. She responds by scoffing and claiming that it is not the same. It is exactly the same. How insane must you be to not see that?
It’s sick how she thinks it’s a cute and appropriate story to tell about him hiding in the closet while also covertly trying to show that HE was the one who was interested in HER. Ummmm he was a KID!
The closet story was from second grade. So gross.. Mary was also jealous of other 8 year old girls passing him notes. 8 year olds are not interested in the way shes hinting at. Her entire awful justification is "he wanted it to as a 13 year boy that experienced puberty" okay... still not right but then WTF was with the 2nd grade stuff? just awful.
@BrittneyGray Exactly! Like…once Vili brought up the classroom closet subject, she went out of her way to make sure the story of his wanting to look up her dress was told. She’s latching onto a story from when he was 8-years old in order to establish that HE’D wanted HER all along! So bizarre.
I'm sorry you were mistreated in that way. Children deserve to be safe, and protected. I hope you are able to heal yourself, and realize that it wasn't your fault.
Mind you, she managed to slip through the cracks during the me too movement. Just this year there have been several female teachers that were caught having relations with their minor students, and no one has said a word.
You can see the lost, confused, and hurt little boy in his eyes. He needed someone to protect and support him. He wanted acceptance and love. Instead he was robbed of his life, his innocence, and abused.
NARSSASISTS ARE ALWAYS RIGHT NO MATTER WHAT... I'M JUST GLAD HE'S FINALLY DIVORCED HER... HOPEFULLY HE'LL FIND *REAL LOVE* WITH SOMEONE WHO'S CLOSER TO HIS OWN AGE ~~> HE DESERVES TO BE TRULY LOVED BUT NOT BY AN ANCIENT FUCKIN BATTLEAXE LIKE HER 👵🏼 🧟♀️ 👀
But I also think he’s very smart. He made valid criticism about the way he was treated during the trial. A lot of victims say this. There’s no care. I believe that if he was treated the way he deserved, with respect and care, that he would’ve realized the truth about his situation much sooner. I bet the cops and investigators around him didn’t see him as a victim but rather as a “naughty” boy dating an older woman. That’s their mentality.
If only more people were able to see this in the repeated situations today. Especially the judiciary systems. They fail so many children in this similar situation.
Her getting upset when the interviewer says Vili was a little boy, and then saying he wasn't a little boy because some 13 year olds get incarcerated is so shocking and vile. She took Vili's autonomy, privacy, and formative years, but not his whole life. I hope Vili finds peace and joy, and that her soul is never at rest.
Yeah also notice how that statement implies that Vili was not innocent by her reasoning. She compares Vili to 13 year olds that are incarcerated (literally) which is hysterically poetic irony considering that he basically became her prisoner
He is in a relationship and had another baby girl in 2022 he also became a grandfather last year. Even though they were divorced he supported her and took care of her during the last few years of her life seems like a really good guy😊
was literally yelling at my screen while throwing my head & hands in my blanket. oof, this was a hard watch. amazing work from dreading, though. as always!
Villi looks so uncomfortable when she speaks, she was clearly mentally ill. She makes very little sense and doesn't act like an adult let alone an educated one. She ruined his life and so many adults failed him.
You can see it in his eyes. It's so sad that he had his childhood stolen from him and later realising how deeply she hurt him. Just the conflicting emotions he likely has about his offspring, conceived *through R•••* but raised with love (even if that love was incepted through manipulation by his abuser), must be torture to ponder. I hope that he has been able to come to terms with what he was put through, and I hope that he will get to discover how wonderful a _genuinely consensual_ romantic relationship can be.
This woman is a text book predator. She knew what she was doing. She was a grown adult, mother of 4, wife and highly educated professional. She didn’t respect his boundaries then and she also didn’t respect his boundaries 20yrs later in that interview. No one accidentally or unintentionally grooms a child. She actively went about this, she planned meet ups in secret, she facilitated a relationship between Villi and her eldest son so she could have legit excuses for Villi staying over at her house. And of course like a true predator and narcissist she tries to paint herself the victim and as if she did something heroic and amazing that she plead guilty to what she did. Which was statutory r@pe of a child. She is a sex offender, a predator, a child abuser. She should’ve had a much much lengthier sentence in jail. The fact that she was free to groom him, steal his childhood, his adolescence, and a lot of his adult life due to her sick, twisted and selfish actions. The huge manipulation that occurred throughout his life is just tragic. I feel so, so bad for him and all of Mary’s children.
Narrators, both brothers narrate these videos. If you listen you can hear the differences in the tone of voice, and one is more harsh and sarcastic in his words.
She wants to respect the intelligence of the audience and then just continues saying absolutely batshit crazy things. There isn't anyone in the audience that feels respected by this stupid woman. Goddamn she makes me feel like my ears are bleeding
bro the second she answers the question, "what makes you an A at teaching?" she responds, "being well attuned to good listening.." and Vili looks away with what looks like such a dissociative stare that I FELT THAT
The thing that is most appalling by this case is the fact they did not protect his identity, so from that point where it was exposed he was literally given no chance.
Her becoming pregnant, in my opinion, was so calculated. Both times. I hope that the inner child of Vili and his two daughters who are ALL victims have found healing.
She is so irritating. Interviewer: “Did you do anything wrong?” Mary: “I’m done with you trying to get me to answer that question >:(“ GIRL, it’s a yes or no question
The way she talks to Vili in that interview, it's still like a teacher/authority figure talking to a child. "Tell him what you told me you were doing in the closet" like, there is such a condescending tone to him.
so much this!!! I feel terrible for Villi :( like it's so apparent how fucked up and abusive the dynamic is even as an adult. the worst part is that if the gender roles were reversed I seriously doubt they would get any interview like this, and if they did the interviewer would NEVER be this friendly and smiling, there would be visible disgust and contempt. It's so horrible that basically because of stereotypes of teenage girls not being interested in sex and teenage boys wanting to have sex with everything that situations like this aren't rape, or that coercive rape is just not understood.
@@AshLilyNekoI would argue that the "friendliness" of the interview is just a pretext, it allowed the interviewer to nudge Mary into a corner with her own answers and deprived her of the option to make herself seem like a victim
I would think he’d have kids that are like still single digits or early teens so it’s just very sad that his youngest is already college aged as he’s so young.
Mary’s performance in this interview is almost Prince Andrew level terrible. I feel for Vili and her daughters, and also her ex-husband and children from that marriage. I hope they all may find peace.
She actually tried to argue that a 13 year old isn't a child just because they are capable of having sex... and she's a mom. And she's bullying the interviewer and trying to shut down the questions when she's the one who wanted to be interviewed... what did she think they would ask her? 😂
I feel like it would’ve still been wrong if she had chosen to pursue him at 18 or whatever the age of consent would’ve been in their state. It’s still predatory even if it’s not illegal, in my opinion, to go after a “freshly of age” people.
@@BigRed1595044exactly. It would still be creepy for a teacher to go after a former student. Or anyone to go after someone they knew as a child. The kid may have had an innocent crush on you and there is still a power imbalance when they are an adult. 🤢 She tried to say it was true love. But I don't believe in that. Find an appropriate love interest.
He just looks so uncomfortable during the interview. I feel like there’s so much trauma and sadness in his eyes and I hope one day he’ll be able to talk about it one day
You're just jealous of her. Think about when you were 14-18 in high school. How many guys more or less sexually harassed you ? How low did your esteem get? Did a guy sleep with you then gaslight you for months ? While others called you a slut behind your back ? how is that better? were you suicidal ? If you were 15 and some man fell in love with you and protected you - would you have been better or worse off ?
@@whitedragoness23 They separated in 2017 and divorced a couple of years later. Soon afterwards she died of cancer. Maybe he's staying quiet out of his respect for his children but I have to think now he'd feel more comfortable to discuss what really happened without her glare.
Ya you can tell he’s still damaged in some way. And you can definitely see that she is totally controlling. When he asked her not to talk about something and then she immediately discussed you can easily the dynamic behind this entire relationship
I’m a middle school teacher. I once had a young boy come into my class during lunch time and “hit on” me. It was one of the most uncomfortable experiences of my life. Thinking about it still makes me laugh in an equally uncomfortable but also bemused way at the silliness of a child trying to play adult. It really is simply impossible to imagine the mindset of this woman, a predator in every way. The analogy at the start of this video really put it together perfectly.
You’re confused and puzzled by the silliness of a child trying to play adult? It’s a pretty common for kids to do this. It’s part of normal development and I think of it as training wheels, but it is the adults job to keep them on the right path and from taking the training wheels off too soon and entering into a very real situation. I agree that it’s nearly impossible to imagine her mindset. It’s completely impossible to empathize with her mindset. Like I know that she loved the attention and how it felt, but what the actual fuck… I don’t get how she didn’t act like you… as in, it’s not a compliment… you shouldn’t even have any feeling about it other than, “oh this silly kid. How cute. Now to send him on his way.”
@@toriagiro9519 I feel like you’re being kinda combative? I wasn’t “confused” I said “bemused” which literally means oh this silly kid like you said. Agree with all you said, wasn’t looking for props.
I haven't watched a lot of UA-cam in a while, but maaaaan have I missed your docs. You get really deep on sensitive topics but it's when you get mad, angry or even annoyed at people and it slips, is when I laugh because YESSS this is messed up and I'm not crazy for feeling this way too. How is she trying to play it off like this?! I watch a lot of crime documentaries, and hands down you're one of my top favourites. Keep doing you, and cheers to your team.
she is so bad at articulating her thoughts, i cannot believe she used to be a teacher
Well it’s probably because she’s trying to manipulate her audience and herself the epitome of delusion
She's probably not used to speaking to adults lol
@@chantelletrembath3345🏆
@@chantelletrembath3345 foul 😭
A lot of teachers are not as intelligent as people would have you believe
Saying a 13 year old looked mature is exactly what a child predator would say... and did say.
And as it turns out what one did say in this case.
Textbook! It’s exactly what they all say.
Since I got to my 30s its crazy how even 20 year olds look like kids. I can't imagine looking at a 12 year old and thinking they look mature for their age. 🤢
@Istuckmyheaddownthetoilet Same, although I'm a woman. I'm quite tall and I was the height I am now as I was when I was 13. My older brother would get me to go into liquor stores for him to buy his grog because he still looked young. I was though probably actually mentally quite immature.
And will continue saying 🤮🤮
EVERY SINGLE ADULT IN VILI'S LIFE FAILED HIM!!! MARY, HER EX-HUSBAND, HIS MOM, THE COURT, HER LAWYERS, ALL OF THEM FAILED THIS CHILD!!!!!
YES!!!!
The way Mary's husband confronted Vili as though he was a grown man sleeping with his wife. Not a child who was a victim of sexual abuse. Its so weird.
I almost threw up when I watched his mom’s interview where she basically said she doesn’t hate Mary or think she should go to prison. Then she said her son is very “mature” for his age and that even though she doesn’t think it’s right, she believes they are in love or they wouldn’t have risked being together 🤮
She blamed the school and the police but not Mary.
It took her years to finally say that she blames Mary and that Mary ruined her son’s life. I can understand why she felt like she could trust Mary and why she allowed Vili to stay in Mary’s home and go on family trips with them. She said she thought she could trust Mary as a mother and she thought Vili was going to spend time with his friend (Mary’s son). Mary had also taught 3 of her older children so by the time Vili got to 2nd grade, she’d known Mary as a teacher for years. People tend to trust teachers/authority figures and she never thought a grown woman would prey on her child. The police for some reason didn’t tell her everything about what happened when they caught them in the car.
BUT I can’t understand why she made so many excuses for Mary in the beginning. Her statements about Mary and how she described her son played a big role in why so many people had sympathy for Mary at the time.
The media...
@@em84c I know. It's disgusting.
That interviewer is slick as fuck. You can tell he's really manipulative, and he is super good at his job for it. It is a very delicate type of game you play to come off as a friend and get someone who irritates tf out of you to like and trust you and tell you all their secrets. He can see all of her tricks, and see clearly the manipulation by Mary, and he just plays along so damn well and helps her trust him enough to slip and stammer here and there.
yeah so true you can see it in his eagle eyes just waiting for her to slip up
This guy really reeled them in by being softer at the start, letting her wiggle out of the father and such, only to absolutely NOT let her wiggle out over "are you fucked up for this, Mary?"
Absolutely! You can see in his eyes he’s just waiting to absolutely eviscerate her. His eyes contain absolutely zero warmth but she’s such a narcissist she didn’t even notice. Fantastic interviewer.
Have you seen the full thing? At some point she gets so insistent that Vili was the aggressor that Vili goes “this is getting weird” and the interviewer goes “This IS weird - MARY YOU WERE THE ADULT, it doesn’t matter” etc
One of the only times manipulation is a good thing, encouraged, supported and endorsed
Some others are hostage negotiation and suicide prevention
Real Manipulation is an Artform and such a delicate balancing act that requires a higher than average to above average IQ to successfully pull it off
Dude was born to manipulate freaks
"He was twelve and she was a mother of four". OOOF. Kudos to the narrator. This really nails the disgusting nature of this all.
AI
Grooming a child is NOT a "character flaw" - it's a genuine and deliberate choice to be predatory. She pretty much trapped him and ruined his life and took his youth.
What really makes me sick is she actually believes it was a love story... I'm glad she is back in hell.
You must be a female
I think the same damn thing! This woman wrecked his childhood, innocence, relationship with sexuality, education, anonymity, privacy, ability to have a normal life, and chance at a career.
@unstablemexican88No. No you cannot. Grooming in itself is a deliberate act. We all know that pedophilia and ephebophilia is wrong. It’s messed up, twisted, abusive and causes life long trauma for the victims. Adults are supposed to protect children, look out for them and guide them. Not groom them. No one grooms a child accidentally, or unintentionally (!) that thought process is very concerning and dangerous.
@unstablemexican88I wish I could say you were wrong but I don’t believe you are. I think a lot of adults are clueless when it comes to how to appropriately interact with children and adolescents.
There's something repulsive about the way the poor guy says he couldn't imagine sexually abusing a thirteen year old while his wife did exactly that to him... wtf.
I think his own kids going through normal teenage years kind of woke him up to how messed up his experience was.
The irony
He watched a documentary because he was wondering if he is a victim of a pDFile...😢😢😢
So true!!
At least he seems to have turned out to be a vastly better parent than she was! (Which of course only makes it even more repulsive: this poor child was forced to be a parent before he was even out of middle school, yet he stepped up as a parent and seems to be as disgusted and horrified as any normal parent by the thought of one of his own kids going through what he did.
Whereas she, OTOH, seems so totally unconcerned about his feelings and drastically less mature than him that it's profoundly disconcerting to watch. I can't imagine how more people didn't pick up on her bizarre and unnatural affect before she was outed for raping a child!
@@maneckineckbeard1749She was a malignant narcissist. I truly believe that. ZERO empathy. For anyone aside from herself.
I'm so disgusted. She's talking about how quickly time flies and how much you need to appreciate your kids childhood but she took that from him. She took another mother's child. She took his childhood. This is insane. He was just a little kid
It TURNED my stomach when she interrupted the reporter to say 'don't call him a little boy'!!! Ma'am...he was very much a little boy!!! My son is 13 and he is in no way, shape or form ready to be in a relationship, let alone be a father. He is very much a little boy, just like villi was
It’s just gross to me… a grown woman being attracted to a CHILD is messed up to my mind… I don’t get this at all. She’s disgusting.
Right! Just because she thought that Villi was physically mature for his age and that she thought of herself as a "dainty, attractive woman," she thought she's not a pedo when she clearly was. 🤢
Wow, listening to this interview was torture.
She doesn't want the interviewer to call him a little boy meanwhile she had a son 1 year younger than him and also in middle school. Disgusting.
And then tried to justify it by saying "Well 13 year olds can be tried as adults go to prison! So what's the difference."
Even though for the majority of cases in the majority of states that is not even remotely true
Not only is she a predator, she's insufferable in a conversation. You can tell she just loves to hear herself talk. Its giving dementia honestly
Narcissistic psychopath vibes
she did die of brain cancer and she was a narcissist psycho
That poor child.
More like narcissism
listening to her talk i was stunned like. what are you actually saying theres too many ums and erms for her to even get her baseless and meaningless points across + (edit:) the number of pointless tangents augh!! vili’s discomfort!!! shut up !!!!!
Mary reminds me of my mother when she is drunk. She thinks she is making perfect sense, but everyone around her is thinking, "this woman is fucking bonkers."
She does sound drunk lol
HAHAHA , mine didnt even need alcohol
She reminds me of my sister when she's sober... To my knowledge the youngest person she has groomed was 17, but it's still a crime. Wish I could get her locked up.
Edit: I didn't include her two younger sisters (she's the eldest) she molested me at 6, and we're still not sure what happened with my other sister because she killed herself before saying much. We do know that she passed Amelia off to her adult boyfriends when Amelia was a teenager, and attempted threesomes with her.
Ha ha
My mum ( in a cult) thought it was a great idea to let me be picked up by a 28 yr old man for the weekends when i was 11. -Behave now, he will become the perfect husband , from a very important family!
That, was her "logic".
I truly adore this interviewer. He has so much empathy for Billy, never puts words in his mouth or asks leading questions. He allowed Mary Kay all of the time in the world to explain herself without letting her take over the interview.
such a good balance between calling out her bullshit when shes answering dishonestly and letting her answer without being manipulative or overly accusatory. hes so straight to the point and quick its night and day compared to her meandering word salad
I'm a teacher. One boy in my class, the same age as Villi was, kept trying to hug an kiss me at the end of the lesson, I stopped him, and after he left I immediately contacted his parents to arrange a meeting. The boy was on the spectrum and was well known to be overly affectionate with near strangers an his parents were overjoyed that he finally had a teacher who was open with them about it. Which is terrifying to me as it implied other had said nothing. Now this student and I salute each other at the end of class and this seems to work. Mary Kay absolutely disgusts me, how anyone can abuse a child in their care is beyond me.
Exactly. Thanks for sharing. I think many teachers have experienced something like this and they know the complicated psychology and inner workings of a child, and SHOULD be jumping in to HELP and protect them, as you did. Mary Kay is an absolute monster.
I love that yall found a happy middle ground! 🫡
God bless you
🫡
That’s because you’re sane
Villi basically admitting that he didnt have good memories, almost traumaic memories, while she laughs about it all. Just watching the realization in his face that hes been a victim and is a victim that married his predator is the most heartbreaking thing I've seen in a while....
Yeah, this could definitely be trauma blocking
Tear jerking stuff man
Seeing this woman ran for political office as uber right winger talking about family values. She was a real piece of work.
@@VerdeLane "like father like daughter", in every quintessential meaning of the phrase 😏
He seems like a beaten man. It’s genuinely sad.
An adult having sex with a child will always be wrong no matter the gender. It’s extremely troubling how people view this relationship. She ruined that poor boy. She changed what his life would’ve been. She robbed him of everything. It’s disgusting.
Literally, she's like a female Humbert Humbert from Lolita.
She hates that there’s equalized laws to hurting a child…is she fucking serious?
@@stard9864
If you watch the documentary she made (and of which this interview is a promotion of) she blames the other female teachers who did the same thing AFTER her... but she genuinely seems to think there were no such laws before her case. It's mind boggling.
I'm stealing your gym music Playlist lol
I wouldn’t call it ‘having sex’ it’s rape
Kudos to that interviewer. He did well buttering them up and almost making it seem like they were a normal couple and then went seamlessly into the tough questions without backing down which had the lady completely off guard
“I mean we went to the same college” WHAT! He was 13 and you enrolled him in an art class! Holy shit
I think she is referring to a summer art course they both took at some college, outside of their normal school. But yeah she definitely tries her damn hardest never to mention that he went to the school she taught at and that he was fricking 12.
@@gggthsboh yeah I know sorry it just shows how out of reality she is that she would have the balls to say that like it makes it ok hahahah
Its awful and disgusting to hear :,(
Billy the club! Billy the Stud. Methinks some white boys are jealous that a 13 yo brown boy scored with a hot white woman out of their league. Billy don't need no hyper moralizing white American liberals to save him. Get your own lives. If she came on to me when I was 13 I would say YES YES YES and got rid of the Sears catalogue I was using.....who gets to decide what is sexual abuse to Billy? Billy has no say because he's a naive brown boy in need of saving. It's just another form of latent racism.
I think she phrased it that way on purpose instead of clarifying his age at the time
It breaks my heart that Vili says that he’s not trying to play the victim because it makes me suspect that Mary has told him on multiple occasions that he wasn’t the victim. She was.
He deserves so much than this and I hope that he knows peace now that she doesn’t walk this earth anymore.
Incredibly sad and disturbing. It's scary having people like her working with children.
I very much agree. The way she was pretending to be converned that the child would be arrested for their "relationship" made me immediately think she repeatedly manipulated Vili by telling him he could get in trouble for what he was doing with her. Sick how these predators twist the minds if their victims!
Yup.
Total narcissistic brainwashing not teaching
Really disgusting to see her talk about how her kids are graduating high school, going to college, leaving the home, experiencing new things and growing up. Meanwhile her victim is sitting right next to her, silently. He was robbed of those same experiences his children are going through, because of her, and he’s supposed to guide them through it as if he can offer advice from experience.
I'm thinking like you!!!!
Not to mention that her prior family, those children grew up in a broken home
was just thinking about this it’s so heartbreaking
@@Ireallywantedthatuniquehandleexactly what I was thinking. She too busy being a predator to be there to watch her previous children grow up. Her actions humiliated and traumatized them.
She had a son literally his same age! That interview was so damning - the dynamic was like a grandma and her middle aged son
I am so, so, so pleased that Villi divorced Mary before she died. I’m glad that she didn’t get to leave this world with that power still in her grasp. She’s disgusting, and that poor man needs all the support he can get after a literal lifetime of grooming.
He was at her bedside when she passed. The bulk of her estate went to him. She had control to the end.
It's difficult because they have kids who loved their mum.
They were separated, not divorced
@@It-is-me...Melsie It's also difficult because their mom was an unstable pedophile. Judging by her character and what she did to this poor guy, I highly doubt the love between her and _any_ of her children was there. If this was my mom, i'd be ashamed and appreciate her passing.
All her kids are victims here as well, and it's unfortunate they have to live the rest of their lives without a mom, but it's safe to say they're better off.
@@simpleshoes She didn't have the ultimate control of her life. Villy has the ultimate control now because he's free of her and able to heal, process, and raise their children in a healthy manner. Hopefully.
Dude who is this interviewer? This guy is a Rockstar. He controlled the interview so well. He challenged her and never backed down.
Matt Doran, Australian reporter.
In other news, the poor guy got lambasted by Adele for not checking her tracks before an interview plugging her album. There were apparently mitigating circumstances for his crime. His apology is both a little cringe for his groveling, and admirable for his eloquence.
This guy has the patience of a saint.
I think he's a regular with 60 Minutes Australia. They do excellent work
Rockstar?
Do you know what a rockstar is?
Why not just he's great he's a legend he's super at his job.
But Rockstar????
If that's a rockstar for you,
You must have never seen a real Rockstar I guess.
The absolute horror you must feel watching your children turn the same age you were, and realising you were a child yourself, and a victim. Imagine dropping your young daughters off at school, seeing their teachers standing in the playground, so different in their adulthood, and realising, I was once so small. I was once that child at school. And the teacher took advantage.
The age difference between Villi and his children is I think less than between him and Mary when they started…
@@kataminedj well.. yeah. He and his children, at least his first is 12 years while Mary was 34 when she got with him. Or at least in her 30s. So basically a decade more lol.
He can't say it because he doesn't want to spark an outburst from Mary, but it's obvious he feels it 😢
Yeah. "And I'm still married to her," would be the final kick in the guts. Horrible.
It's like, when will his torture stop?
As a Māori (New Zealand indigenous) I am disgusted at how she saw this child as mature. It's just genetics that make us islanders "bigger". How did she become a teacher with such a lack of knowledge? Especially the fact that she's from Australia, a country right next to the pacific islands.
I think racism may have been a factor here. Non-white children are often adultified in the racist mind, and sexual and /or violent motivations are projected onto them.We white people often have more racist prejudice than we like to admit, even to ourselves.Becoming aware of that and working to change one's own preconceptions is an effort that a lot of people don't want to do, especially when no awareness is present that the problem even exists. When a white person is called out for saying or doing something racist, the first and most common reaction is defensiveness, even a reversal of victim and offender: "How dare you hurt my feelings by calling me racist? I am a good person, so I can't be racist, you are the bad person here!"
@@gozerthegozarian9500unfortunately i believe this to be the case
in her mind he is mature and “in control” and she cites his heritage and size, but anyone with a brain knows despite his ethnicity, he is a child with no control and a child brain.
@@lame-bj2nq, it was an excuse on her part and BIPOC children are at higher risk of SA than white children
The National Black Women's Justice Institute reports that Black girls are more likely to experience harassment than any other group of children
Any reason given by the abuser is just an excuse, and racism can play a role in how other adults respond to the situation
She's from America...she wasn't Australian nor ever lived there. It's just an Australian interview
I don't know about her excuse because he looks like a child, like a really young child to me. He might have been taller or whatever but his FACE was babyish and I can't imagine she looked into that face and thought about sex. To me he looked his age. She was a disgusting person.
She stumbled over the question about her family because she realizes she has done something even worse than what her father did, and she is too narcissistic to admit it, especially on camera.
My thoughts exactly.
Totally. Not only does she refuse to admit any type of fault in the commission of her crimes, after seeing this, I really think that she's the type who never admits any fault for anything - ever.
Yes, I picked up on that too. She’s very hesitant to give any details regarding her family and upbringing because she doesn’t want any of she says to come back up in the interview later. Very much trying to control the narrative
The difference in how they talk is really something. She talks in circles and never answers any questions while Villi gives clear, concise answers.
her whole deminor is so disgusting for many reasons but just the way she talks and strains herself so hard just show how little is going on behind those eyes
For someone who went through something so traumatic and to also have to be around someone like her every day, it’s surprising how concise he is. I imagine it’s nightmarish to be around her.
@@grape123 Yeah, I imagine it was really difficult to have a productive conversation with her when they had a problem that needed to be communicated through
My abuser (female) did this when confronted abuse the abuse. Refusing to answer direct questions and talking circles are signs of guilt and manipulation. My abuser had a personality disorder and manipulation was her forte.
He was a child who was taken advantage of and was manipulated into believing the situation was normal
If you think that nothing bad has happened, you'll give clear answers to try and get to the truth
She was a predator who knew that what she was doing was unethical and illegal
She used language to obscure the truth and confuse her listeners
The fact that Vili says at as a 35 year old man if the roles were switched he wouldn’t be doing what she did. That he can’t fathom looking at a 13 year old girl that way. Mary saying “it never crossed my mind. I never did it.” What??? You made him a 14 year old father
She did it, She did time for it and she continues to justify her views and how their situation is " different". Good Lord, my brain hurts. As if it justifies all wrongdoings just because they're married (?)
Exactly!
52:59 … her embarrassing him and sharing his traumatic experiences in order to somehow ‘justify’ her perverted actions. It’s horrifying…
Kids have crushes on adult figures. It’s totally normal. But because that is so common, we who work in education need to be EVEN MORE careful about how we interact with students. The fact a student may be thinking of us in that way is a reason for us to put more, not less, boundaries
You not only have a legal obligation to not take advantage, but a moral one as well .
But like how is that normal? Why is that so common? It shouldnt be. Just bc roles are reversed doesnt make it right. If adults need to stay away from kids it should be vice versa. If this type of relationship is wrong then kids still shouldnt get a pass to feel that way about adults either. I will never understand that logic. Your excuse may be "oh theyre just kids theyre immature and they dont think things through"
Still, all aspects of this type of relationship is wrong and the child then needs to be encouraged and taught that it is wrong. Dont excuse it on their end either
@@0inspirationalheart0Because you were abused, I know that language so clearly. You have never forgiven yourself and think it was your fault.
@@0inspirationalheart0kids love anyone who will show them an ounce of love , they don't know the intentions behind a starnger's affections . Kids aren't complex like adults they don't have ulterior motives . Yes as parents we must talk to them n teach them what's right n what's wrong but you cannot blame a child if he/she has an innocent crush on someone older, the crush is just plain adoration n nothing else but adults no way adults know better so that is why kids should not be blamed
@@0inspirationalheart0 They're JUST KIDS. It IS normal for kids to feel more from people who gave them things they naturally desire. For example, putting aside looks, little girls will be attracted to reliable and capable men because women in general seek for partners that are reliable. little boys will be attracted to the gentle, kind, and loving women, because they naturally seek partners who are nurturing and soothing to them. It's a part of them growing up to start feeling up those feelings. It's NORMAL for them but what's not normal is for the adults to RECIPROCRATE IT!!!! In the end, these children will grow up and become adult, so it's okay for them to be attracted or attached to adults because that means their minds are healthy and open to changes. On the other hand, ADULTS can't be attracted to children because ADULTS remain ADULTS, there's NO REGRESSION for adults.
Such a very normal example. Me. When I was a middle-schooler, I was attracted to a fellow middle schooler. This is normal. But I was also attracted to adult men who look handsome and successful, This is normal. But when I grow up, I STOPPED being attracted to middle schoolers and see them as cringe little boys. See? This is called the normal growth of a state of mind and attraction. If you try to limit children on who they should be attracted/having crushes to, you're just going to let them like only people from the same age? Are you trying to stunt them? Are you stupid? Are you trying to create pdfile experimentally?
My son is 13. There is NO way he looks grown up. He isn’t. He is still very much a kid, even though he is physically bigger than me.
Pathetic. You're smaller than a 13year old??
Even if he or another kid looked grown up, a 13 year old isn’t mentally in any evaluative category
My nephew is the same age and I thought the same.
There's also no way your son wouldn't trade places with that kid if given the chance
@@paulbryant8403you’re disgusting
This woman was insane. She talked over him the whole time, rambled on about nothing, and it just felt like she shot daggers at Vili every time he had his own thoughts about anything. The fact that she never admitted what she did was wrong is disgusting. Vili suffered so much bc of this woman. The saving grace is that she's gone now.
*I mean, your LITERALLY spot on with this comment. She claimed It was true love, yet some of her quotes and demeanor prove other wise. Like when she said “He asked for It” It’s quotes like this, that are EXTREMELY problematic, because one, your trying to make It seem as If he abused you, not that it was consensual, which is funny because you said earlier that it was (It Isn’t if that’s the case.) And two, someone who ACTUALLY loves another person would NEVER say this. 🤷🏽♀️*
Mary K LeTurn My Stomach
@@garethglitter5932sounds more accurate.
Exactly right! Her going on about how she's been evaluated 4 times and has zero characteristics of a pedophile is laughable. She was so delusional it's insane.
@@khakachu7778why'd you bold the entire text
She’s so annoying. She knew exactly what she was doing. I’m so disgusted.
She talks so weird. Like she’s drunk or on some sort of medication. She can’t stay on topic at all and just rambles aimlessly.
I wonder if she was a part of the inspiration for the mannerisms of Moira from Schitt's Creek.
@@littlewonderbyrd Great. Now Moira is stuck in my head. 😅
@@littlewonderbyrdEven if Moira drank a barrel of Herb Ertlinger's fruit wine, she would NEVER.
God she’s fucking unbearable to listen to the way she fucking fixes her dentures in her mouth
maybe she has lead poisoning
The fact that she spoke for 99% of the interview is already telling enough. At no point did Villy validate her points or even try to argue with what she was saying, he has completely given up.
Well boys are not supposed to interrupt their mommy. And she is old enough to be his mother and has played that role .
this is so messed up, if this was gender reversed people would be unrelenting its sickening really she broke this guy and has controlled him since he was a child
@@kuzz1191i mean people already are unrelenting evidently by how people have reacted to the situation. She only kinda “gotten away with it” cuz of the loophole
She tried to verbally punish the interviewer for asking very straightforward questions because asking them straightforwardly makes her look bad. The narcissism level with her holy shit.
That interviewer was so good! Wow. He came off as very ignorant and passive at the beginning, but near the end, he was asking pointed, direct questions about her pedophilic urges and monitoring Vili's state as well. He did it all without raising his voice or stooping to her level. This was more of an interrogation than anything.
Yes, I felt the same way when the interview started off, but near the end his questions were so good. You could really see how he made her feel relaxed and safe but steadily his questions took her off kilter. He's a damn good at his job.
Agreed, he’s amazing.
This is standard for Australian journalists. You should see some of the other interviews for child predators done by our journalists.
I remember they did another interview that took place in their house, not a studio. I remember Villi saying what she did was wrong.
Did I imagine this or has someone else seen that? I think it was on 60 minutes too
100% he throws soft ball questions to make her think she’s on her side and to make her stick around.
I really appreciate you highlighting cases like these in which women are the abusers. I dealt with grooming as a little girl by an adult woman. It's taken me a long time to understand and come to terms with what happened. That what happened was, in fact, grooming and sexual harassment. Hearing stories like these is so important to lessen the stigma and to educate people with outdated thoughts and feelings like (unfortunately) most of these adults in this victim's life.
I'm so sorry ❤
The interview between them was so uncomfortable. Not only is there noticeable dissonance between Mary Kay and Vili, but Mary Kay was all over the place the entire time. She goes on long and bizarre tangents when answering simple questions. The religious heritage speech she went on to avoid talking about her father was especially uncomfortable to watch.
It was so bizarre! I had second hand embarrassment, and had to take a break. My anxiety was through the roof!
She looks and sounds like a confused old lady in the interview. Rather demented actually. Poor Villy having to sit through that. ❤️🇨🇦
Not to mention her trying to frame him as a college student taking a college class. Not him being a 12 year old.
@@gbbatman3 🤣🤣🤣🤣 literally but no for real, look out for you
I'm up to that part and i'm cringing
Being a man who was once raped as a boy, it IS rape. Why do I *have* to listen to the "well where was she when I was 12?" or "damn, lucky kid!" like no, I was not lucky, I still wake up crying my fucking heart out. I refuse to turn to substance to cope but it's so fucking hard to not want to, ya know? Therapy, years of pain, relationship struggles, sex life issues, and the worst form of trust issues trauma can give you all from the worst moment my mind chose to repeat and remember.
I only liked her because she was older and giving me attention my mother couldn't give me.
I still feel it.
why.
I'm so sorry you had to go through that, and you continue to be assaulted with every stupid comment. I think a lot more men and boys go through it and never talk about it. One of my husband's friends once talked about having been SA'd by a neighbor, and I was so surprised because he's this 6'4" man now, but he was 10-14 back then and just a kid. It's sick so many think it's ok to brush under the rug ir joke about!
I'm so sad that happened to you. Stay strong. You deserve better. I'm sorry people make those sick comments to make you have to relive your trauma. People suck.
😢 I'm sorry you went through that and continue to go through that.
You did nothing wrong. You deserved attention as well as protection ❤ I'm sorry the trauma has hurt you deeply. You are worthy of love
I'm so sorry, my heart is broken for you. I send you all of my love and I hope one day very soon you can fully heal and not feel that pain anymore. You deserved so much fucking better!! You are so worthy of all good and beautiful things. Substances ultimately don't help and end up making so much shit worse, I know first hand. Hang in there bud, you're not alone and people do care. You are loved. ❣️
Villi looks like he’s disassociating during the interview, it’s very common amongst SA victims
i was thinking the same thing :(
When he says that his dad was married 5 times and has 18 children you can see that he would have been a vulnerable. Predators pick vulnerable kids.
Yep
Her saying "he wasn't prepubescent so he wasn't a child" and "but thirteen year olds are having sex with thirteen year olds" but then refusing to acknowledge that she's saying kids of any age are fair game for adults as long as they've gone through puberty is so mind bogglingly disgusting
Also, the rate of sexual activity in 13 year olds is pretty small. 3% of 13-year-olds reported having sex in the US in 2013. That is a very small number
Did she use the "He's very mature for his age." That would of helped.
This b is nuts.
He could've had a beard like that at 13, he just didn't want to, haters!
At 13 he isn't even finished going through puberty.
She's absolutely vile and a rapist and groomer
@@hannahp1108is there not more recent data than 2013? I would think that number is higher in this day and age.
Mary saying her victim was the aggressor makes my blood boil. Mary is absolutely a predator. This case is tragic, but it'll never not shock and disgust me that they're still people who say boys and men can't be victims of SA.
Even if he tried something with her, it was her responsibility as the adult to put an end to it, report him or something. I don’t believe he was the aggressor. She was manipulative.
your username is ironic considering Misato SAd Shinji
@@chavaspada Yeah I was about to say...
@@kakacoco5 EXACTLY!
@@chavaspada Seriously?… look to point it out, Misato merely kissed Shinji before shoving him into that elevator was the kiss scene awkward yeah, but it had no intention behind it. It was merely how she dealt with tough times or maybe her emotions..
Anyway I stand by my comment in the true crime case this video is about.
Her trying to justify 13 yo and 13 year old having sex to a 13 yo and 34 year old is the same is disgusting.
She almost screwed herself over by trying to explain that there's people who abuse "cases" my brain went oh so you meant to say "children"?
That's the exact line Polanski used for the kid he abused, since she was sexually active, it wasn't rape, utterly disgusting...
repeatedly! and adamantly!
Im sure she thinks about 13 yos having sex alot.
And what's crazy is that although not ALL THE TIME, a great portion of those 13 year olds having sex with other 13 year olds are only replicating things they've seen or experienced themselves. They tend to be hypersexual, and this is solely a response and replication of what they've gone through because they think its NORMAL. So her using this to justify her own disgusting behavior is even sicker
She does actually make a good point about child marriages, but comes to the wrong conclusion in an absolutely wild way.
More than half the states in the US allow someone over 18 to marry children, in some places from as young as 9. There have been many attempts to repeal these laws but there has been significant push back from churches and Republicans alike.
But instead of thinking "oh my god, it's terrible that my country has a child rape loophole, we should do something" she's angry that she got caught before being allowed to use the loophole to continue raping a child
Where do people in the US get married at 9?
I can appreciate the fact that you continuously referred to Vili as a child. Because that’s exactly what he was. Until you reach the age of majority you’re a child. Mary acting like he was some beast and she was the damsel in distress unable to fight him off really ticks me off. I’ll be 30 this year and I cannot fathom being with someone 10 years my junior let alone 21 years my junior. Disgusting.
It' so odd she had that mindset when she had children, and sons, of her own.
The age difference isn't what I find disturbing. What I find disturbing is that when they initially started having a sexual relationship, he was a 12 year child and she was in her thirties. That is WRONG.
And there is a specific word for predators who are attracted to pubescent children. I wonder what she would say if asked if she's a hebephile?
Some children start puberty at only 8 years old. Its ridiculous to say they aren't children anymore.
💯💯💯
The interviewer really played the long game and then waited for his shot
He was a master.
S tier interview. Hook line and sinker
He had so much more patience than me.
Masterful. Truly fascinating to watch…and also realize how horrible I would been as a journalist interviewing a predator 😂
That interview was brutal. Dude is a real pro
Bless the patience of this interviewer. The cognitive dissonance is astounding.
He's letting her drown herself at the "when did you first meet him" part. She's really bad at this, but I noticed right away what she's trying to do.
She's doing more than distancing herself from him as his teacher, she's softly trying to imply he was much older. That's why she mentions that she was happy because he wasn't her student anymore and that she got to see him in college.
She's trying to reframe it so the issue is that she was his teacher, not that he was a minor, and she can quietly hide that by just leaving out how old he was.
Even when she says there were legal issues and ramifications. If you just put this on for someone who didn't know you'd just be thinking it's nasty she dated a college student that she knew as a kid.
@50:15
he also made a funny by asking her ¨when did you mate him?¨ lollolll
Omg the interviewer is doing this so masterfully: no judgement, just this curiosity and neutrality, no insinuation of shame or guilt. He let her do it to herself.
Reminds me of the interview of Prince Andrew after his buddy Epstein was caught.
Omg when he got annoyed she kept talking about music and not teaching…. I got such bad secondhand embarrassment
His face at 1:02... he knows he's got her hook line and sinker
The "I didn't expect to get pregnant" line is just too funny. I like imagining that she genuinely has no idea how her first four children came into this world - that she believes it's nothing more than random chance. lol.
Poor Villi, imagine thinking you had a fairytale love story to find out that you were abused and then you find out the person who did it is the mother of your children and she's completely insane. I can't imagine his confusion, even now.
I think he saw his girls turn 13 and he was like wait wait... oh.....no
It's crazy, hope he is doing well.
😂😂
Particularly when she says" its not the same" when Vili states that as a 35, that there is no way he'd be comfortable being attracted to a 13 year old. He's clearly disgusted by the thought.
There’s many instances of people who only totally grasp their trauma by seeing their kids reach the age they were when they got assaulted. It’s very sad. Very very sad.
It’s nauseating how she keeps trying to distract from the FACT he was a little boy she abused!
What age range is "little boy?"
She met him when he was 8, started abusing him at 13.
@@rucca2008 8 is indeed a little boy. But he was 13 when she abused him, which isn't a little boy. She's a disgusting pig, I get that, but let's tell it like it is. He wasn’t a little boy, or a child, or an infant, or whatever, when she abused him.
Yeah but they're married now so it shouldn't matter
@@geekser750?? What?
You can tell nobody sat down with him to explain what happened. He was likely never provided therapy as it seems he doesn't really understand that she abused him ruining him and HER family. It seems that he had to come to terms with that later in his life but his ideology is still muddled with "I loved her" "we loved each other" etc. He was raped, molested and TRAPPED by this women she should have rotted in prison for what she did to him. Society gave his abuser a second chance to continue to abuse and ruin his life. I hope he has found some peace in her absence.
Editing really is powerful! I watched this interview when it first came out, and the majority of what you showed here is not included in the official posted interview. I knew she was crazy, but this video truly shows how deluded and narcissistic she truly was! Thank you so much for showing the full interview and calling out her BS.
Also, I LOVE when you get enraged at the situation and your language reflects it! You're always so matter-of-fact and straightforward when presenting a case, so when you use strong language that reflects how you feel about the information you're sharing, I love it! I think often times with true crime channels, the presenter is seen as a news reporter, giving the facts of a case, but not showing any emotion that reflects how they feel about the situation. So when you get animated and show how disgusted you are, it sets you apart, and I appreciate that. 💙
it makes me cackle whenever they swear i love it
Dudes eyes during the whole interview with his abuser says everything
His soul is dead. So heartbreaking.
Yeah, he's checking for her reaction to anything he says, like he's afraid if he's performing well enough for her
@sabrina798able This was filmed not long before he left her. Her left her a year before she died.
@@trueCrimeGuruYes So she didn’t make it to 100 years old😂
@@trueCrimeGuruYesi heard he divorced her but then when she got cancer he went back to care for her until she died
The interviewer does a great job at remaining calm and professional and yet his little glances and facial expressions say everything we are all thinking
Yes, and when he said “well that’s a topic for another discussion” or something along those lines, I giggled. Subtle way to tell her to shut the f*ck up.
YES. Oh my god I was jolted by the disgust that read in his eyes after MK would laugh something off or nonchalantly reference something, or when he asked her a question, how he had to frame it innocently- he was connected to the truth and he had the right view of her.
Best question they should have asked, “would you be happy if your 13year old daughter fell in love with their 37 year old teacher?”
She probably would've justified the predation of her own child.
She was morally bankrupt.
She is would’ve probably made this about something pure like love and romance and how she’d support that because “kids should experience love” deflecting the focus from the main aspect: predators preying on children. I can already picture that because she’s working so hard to look good and she’d probably think saying this would serve that purpose too.
I think you’re giving her more credit than she deserves. She’d probably refuse to answer the question coherently and then nonsensically ramble in a totally different direction.
That was asked once in a different interview and she laughs in this weird way like why would we ever think of that?
It wouldn’t have mattered to Mary. She would’ve said it’s not the same thing.
Vili also said that if they switched roles, he couldn’t imagine at his age of 35 being romantically interested in a 13 year old. The reporter asked if it hurt Mary to hear Vili say that and she looked confused and said it’s not the same thing. She will always find a way to excuse what she did.
she reminds me of Jodi Arias with the way she talks in the interview, going on wild tangents off the back of perfectly simple questions. she's so desperate to come across as normal and relatable that she shoots straight to the uncanny valley.
I cannot BELIEVE there isn't a law that stops a pedophile from marrying a victim. If a person has been arrested for molesting a child and a part of that sentence is no contact why in the world wouldn't we uphold that rule for the rest of their life. The power imbalance and history of abuse doesn't stop once the victim is an adult.
I do believe in some states in America a 13 year old can get married if their parents consent.
Yeah, that's insane when you think about it. You should not be able to marry the person you abused. This whole thing is so awful and disturbing. The way she talks is so cringe. Really sad too.
This is a sick case but the kid became an adult. I don’t see how you could apply such a law that would prevent him from marrying her. That would be a slippery slope. People should really think through all implications ramifications before suggesting silly laws.
@@robertjones8598 its not a silly law... grooming is a crime. The whole point of grooming is to abuse and tie that child to you until you can legally or otherwise get your hands on them. Why is it okay for them to get their way just because their victim is now of age?
I don't see how a law against a pedophile being allowed to marry a victim would be a "slippery slope" where do you think its gonna slip exactly? There is absolutely no benefit to allowing pedophiles more access to their previous victims. Frankly im concerned you think its silly to stop them from further victimizing these people. We make actually silly laws about what adults can and can't do with their bodies all the time to protect unborn children but don't make adequate laws to protect ones that are already here. I don't really care if its "unfair" to a pedophile or brainwashed victim that they can't be together, victims need to stay away from their abusers to heal and gain proper perspective on the situation. Take it from someone who's been through it. NOTHING is worth a victim being harmed further.
@@jojocaitlin8508 because they’re adults. Maybe just push for life sentences for offenders to limit access, but you don’t solve things by restricting the rights of the victim once they’ve reached age of majority even if we think they should stay was from the person. Anyway, it’s a slippery slope and if you don’t see that then ok.
I never realized how much I hated Mary Kay Letourneau until I just sat through that interview. She made my skin crawl.
strongly agree
She’s absolutely delusional and he looks like he lost the battle for happiness a long time ago and now is just going through a absolute miserable existence
She's rotting in hell, he's free of her and only 40. Now I mainly feel bad for their daughters.
His only happiness was from raising his daughters. What a sad family
She deserves all the misery she brought on herself. My heart goes out to him but I’m glad he’s free now
Before this I watched a video about a guy who had CP on his PC. He got 12 years (and rightfully so). This woman sleeps muliple times with a minor and gets 6 months. Total BS
She barely lets him speak. And when he is speaking she is giving him a look that says “Don’t you DARE expose me for who I really am”
I think she thinks if she let's him think or speak he will change his mind about being with her!
@@charlisays THIS!!!! And he did finally divorce her!
Eeexactllyyyy
@@jenniferburton7044I do wonder if he left her because he finally accepted what she did was wrong, or if her apparent bad personality and controlling behavior finally got to him.
"this 13-year-old was so mature!" is crazy. I met this guy in one of my college classes and thought he was kinda cute. He looked my age and was much taller and bigger than me but I found out he was a highschooler and it immediately changed how I saw him. Whenever we interacted for classwork or anything else in class, it was so obvious that this kid was still that, a kid, no matter how he looked, how smart he really was, or whatever. And that killed any interest I had in him because kids/teens are so impressionable that as an adult you have to be the one to set boundaries. I was 19 and knew that. She definitely knew that too.
110%. When I was 23, my older coworker got her son a job at our workplace. He was handsome, 6'2", had a voice as deep as my dad's, and was so mature that I assumed he was around my age. Once I found out he was only 17, I was disgusted with myself despite only admiring him from afar, and THAT'S the reaction anyone should have. From then on, I could only see him as a KID, because THAT'S WHAT HE WAS.
Same thing with me although the guy who was interested in me was fresh out of school and just started college. He just turned 18 and I was 23 at that time and met in college. He told me his feelings but I had to make sure to cut the relationship early. Even the difference was Wierd to me although he was an adult (at least according to German laws).
tf, so how was he in a college class? & that'd still make him what 17, 18? there is basically no difference from that to 19. I'm 29 & still feel like I'm 18.
@@sorrowfulvixxx he's a super smart kid but he was 16 when I met him. And it doesn't matter how old you feel, it doesn't make you any younger
Lots of high schoolers are 19. Your attraction to that dude was natural he was probably your age 😂😂😂
That analogy at the beginning is so perfect. So many people blame child victims of sexual abuse especially for what happened to them and I feel like comparing it to giving in to a child wanting to drive a car puts it into perspective so well
Agreed, and it exposes the bias concerning genders.
The car analogy was PERFECT. So many ppl let her get away with blaming him like he wasnta literal child.
I will never understand people who will think it's ok cuz, "The child asked." Like, any sane adult wouldn't let a 12 year old drive on the road, much less ANOTHER person's child. No matter how much a kid begs to eat rat poison, you don't give it to them and in fact you keep it far away from them. If a child begs to bring home another child after other child's parent already said no, you say no and that you could get in trouble if you took said child. I'm convinced they're almost all the same people who say gentle parenting is "letting your kid get away with stuff and never saying no." I can just feel it
How she keeps calling her manipulation and rape of a teenage boy "my situation" is crazy. She spent her life convincing herself what she did was fine knowing the whole time it was abuse.
Exactly! It's so obvious how much she KNOWS how wrong what she did is. And yet, she keeps insisting on denying it because she couldn't give two sh*ts about it being wrong or right. All she ever cared about was having full control of this boy. And she did. Despite everything the law did to stop her. Which just goes to show how dangerous grooming is, and how long lasting its devastating effects are. So sad and heartbreaking, tbh. He was so vulnerable:(
Sounds like Jada Pinkett Smith describing her "entanglement". Monster.
It's so disturbing to me that to this day, this case is made a joke. A male child being groomed is not him getting lucky - it's assault. Thank you for covering this case, Dreading.
Also getting “lucky” would imply the desirability of the other potential partner. Or at least they would need to be an attractive person physically or at least not look like their grandma.
@@CankleCankle No that has nothing to do with it, and she didn't always look like "a grandma"
@@CankleCankleshe was quite pretty when she preyed on him, and was 34 at that time. That being said, she’s a monster.
At least the media has gotten on board the last few years, you see new articles every week in the news about female teachers and coaches abusing young boys. Most are not okay with it anymore.
“To this day” The vast majority of people call it for what it is….predatory af. Anytime this case is covered, 95% of the feedback is always saying what a monster she is, & that he’s been a victim of hers since he was a little boy. If anything, society takes male victims more serious than ever before. It’s sad it took as long as it did, but you’re never going to rid the world of everyone with trash opinions. Villi is FINALLY getting the support from the general public that he should’ve gotten all along
The thing that continues to be gross to me is that she keeps throwing poor Villi under the bus. She’ll blame him, a CHILD, up and down before taking accountability
Yep, everything was his fault. It's WILD.
That interview is such perfect evidence of why these relationships are illegal--their dynamic is SO terrifyingly unhealthy. He has no power with her because he's known her since he was EIGHT and she was his first everything, and her being an adult through all that just makes the power balance a nightmare. She had that poor man completely manipulated his entire life. He can't even fully face his messed up it is here because he's got to balance that he loves his children against the fact that this woman is a predator who completely took advantage of and groomed him. I'm glad he separated from her and hope he's healing now because wtf
Um, she's dead.
@@thereisnosanctuary6184That doesn't make the comment any less true 🤷
But yet she ended up marrying him. I wonder if he knew she threw him under the bus that many times?
The fact that she admitted that the only course of action she would have taken differently would have been to hire a different attorney is extremely telling. She actually believed that she was somehow wrongfully accused or coerced by law enforcement.
She showed no remorse at all for her heinous actions. She even had the audacity to try and gain sympathy near the end, tearing up and claiming that she "always did her best."
It is honestly nauseating to hear her dismiss the severity of her crimes or flat out deny them.
When her victim explains that, as an adult in his 30's, he would never be attracted to a 13-year old, she is asked if it stings to hear him say that given their situation. She responds by scoffing and claiming that it is not the same. It is exactly the same. How insane must you be to not see that?
The child driving on the highway scenario at the beginning of this video was incredibly spot on in putting these situations in perspective. Well done.
thank god i read this i was waiting for the part where she let a kid drive and died or something LOL i didn’t realize it was an analogy
@@comfortmesame i was wondering when theyd get back to the kid driving
It’s sick how she thinks it’s a cute and appropriate story to tell about him hiding in the closet while also covertly trying to show that HE was the one who was interested in HER. Ummmm he was a KID!
The closet story was from second grade. So gross.. Mary was also jealous of other 8 year old girls passing him notes. 8 year olds are not interested in the way shes hinting at. Her entire awful justification is "he wanted it to as a 13 year boy that experienced puberty" okay... still not right but then WTF was with the 2nd grade stuff? just awful.
Yup!!! And just bulldozing over his clearly stated boundary SMH
@BrittneyGray Exactly! Like…once Vili brought up the classroom closet subject, she went out of her way to make sure the story of his wanting to look up her dress was told. She’s latching onto a story from when he was 8-years old in order to establish that HE’D wanted HER all along! So bizarre.
I was 8. Believe me boys don’t feel lucky. It’s unbelievable and confusing and horrifying
im sorry. I've always believed that this should be special for boys too
I'm sorry. 💔
@sarah-ym6re You don't need to point that out.
The amount of grown @$$ men who project their p0rn addiction onto male victims is sickening
I'm sorry you were mistreated in that way. Children deserve to be safe, and protected.
I hope you are able to heal yourself, and realize that it wasn't your fault.
Mind you, she managed to slip through the cracks during the me too movement. Just this year there have been several female teachers that were caught having relations with their minor students, and no one has said a word.
You can see the lost, confused, and hurt little boy in his eyes. He needed someone to protect and support him. He wanted acceptance and love. Instead he was robbed of his life, his innocence, and abused.
NARSSASISTS ARE ALWAYS RIGHT NO MATTER WHAT... I'M JUST GLAD HE'S FINALLY DIVORCED HER... HOPEFULLY HE'LL FIND *REAL LOVE* WITH SOMEONE WHO'S CLOSER TO HIS OWN AGE ~~> HE DESERVES TO BE TRULY LOVED BUT NOT BY AN ANCIENT FUCKIN BATTLEAXE LIKE HER 👵🏼 🧟♀️ 👀
But I also think he’s very smart. He made valid criticism about the way he was treated during the trial. A lot of victims say this. There’s no care. I believe that if he was treated the way he deserved, with respect and care, that he would’ve realized the truth about his situation much sooner. I bet the cops and investigators around him didn’t see him as a victim but rather as a “naughty” boy dating an older woman. That’s their mentality.
Buddy, you just got your 200th like! Also, yes. ):
If only more people were able to see this in the repeated situations today. Especially the judiciary systems. They fail so many children in this similar situation.
@@ninananothat’s the global mentality sadly.
She’s so creepy. Speech patterns, the fake cluelessness, the gaslighting. How could anyone tolerate her? I feel for villi and his daughters.
She passed away so I feel Villi has some peace now. He felt obligated to be with her because how much he loved his daughters..
Her getting upset when the interviewer says Vili was a little boy, and then saying he wasn't a little boy because some 13 year olds get incarcerated is so shocking and vile. She took Vili's autonomy, privacy, and formative years, but not his whole life. I hope Vili finds peace and joy, and that her soul is never at rest.
13 year olds can get sent to jail or juvie if they did something seriously wrong! But they aren’t adults yet.
Yeah also notice how that statement implies that Vili was not innocent by her reasoning. She compares Vili to 13 year olds that are incarcerated (literally) which is hysterically poetic irony considering that he basically became her prisoner
@@jessehutchings And considering _she's_ the one who went to prison, twice, as a grown-ass woman 😂
Savage😂
He is in a relationship and had another baby girl in 2022 he also became a grandfather last year. Even though they were divorced he supported her and took care of her during the last few years of her life seems like a really good guy😊
Blaming the child is beyond sick, literally one of the most common excuses they use
Him saying "I'm not trying to play the victim" while explaining he needed help is utterly heartbreaking.
Victim's don't always know they're victim's.
Her ability to verbally flounder around every question is making me want to pull my hair out.
Yes! Oh. My. Good. Golly. Embarrassment transfer hardddddddd. It was so hard to watch. If it wasn’t dreading.. I don’t know if I could have honestly.
🤣🤣🤣🤣 literally
Don’t do it! She’s not worth it 😂❤xxx
was literally yelling at my screen while throwing my head & hands in my blanket. oof, this was a hard watch. amazing work from dreading, though. as always!
Dude this is blowing my ever loving mind WHAT?!
Villi looks so uncomfortable when she speaks, she was clearly mentally ill. She makes very little sense and doesn't act like an adult let alone an educated one. She ruined his life and so many adults failed him.
You can see it in his eyes. It's so sad that he had his childhood stolen from him and later realising how deeply she hurt him. Just the conflicting emotions he likely has about his offspring, conceived *through R•••* but raised with love (even if that love was incepted through manipulation by his abuser), must be torture to ponder. I hope that he has been able to come to terms with what he was put through, and I hope that he will get to discover how wonderful a _genuinely consensual_ romantic relationship can be.
This woman is a text book predator. She knew what she was doing. She was a grown adult, mother of 4, wife and highly educated professional. She didn’t respect his boundaries then and she also didn’t respect his boundaries 20yrs later in that interview. No one accidentally or unintentionally grooms a child. She actively went about this, she planned meet ups in secret, she facilitated a relationship between Villi and her eldest son so she could have legit excuses for Villi staying over at her house. And of course like a true predator and narcissist she tries to paint herself the victim and as if she did something heroic and amazing that she plead guilty to what she did. Which was statutory r@pe of a child. She is a sex offender, a predator, a child abuser. She should’ve had a much much lengthier sentence in jail. The fact that she was free to groom him, steal his childhood, his adolescence, and a lot of his adult life due to her sick, twisted and selfish actions. The huge manipulation that occurred throughout his life is just tragic. I feel so, so bad for him and all of Mary’s children.
I would just like to say I love when the dreading narrator gets feisty and voices the pure anger and hatred all of us in the audience are feeling 🫡🫡
It's the best!
@@kaldrake2167it really is! When dreading gets mad and starts cussing, I lose my shit.🤣 I’m over here like “YEAH YOU TELL EM.”😂
Narrators, both brothers narrate these videos. If you listen you can hear the differences in the tone of voice, and one is more harsh and sarcastic in his words.
She wants to respect the intelligence of the audience and then just continues saying absolutely batshit crazy things. There isn't anyone in the audience that feels respected by this stupid woman. Goddamn she makes me feel like my ears are bleeding
@@dosdoggies I always forget that bc they sound so similar most of the time!!
bro the second she answers the question, "what makes you an A at teaching?" she responds, "being well attuned to good listening.." and Vili looks away with what looks like such a dissociative stare that I FELT THAT
I saw that!! I actually did a rewind and watched it again lol. Speaks volumes!
@50:15 ẅhen did you first MAte villy?¨ witf lolololol
I honestly expected her to say, "I love my students."
Super normal sentiment from a normal teacher. Super sus from a pedo.
I couldn't believe she said "being self-aware" like what???
@asavapowell7480 meet lol
The thing that is most appalling by this case is the fact they did not protect his identity, so from that point where it was exposed he was literally given no chance.
Her becoming pregnant, in my opinion, was so calculated. Both times. I hope that the inner child of Vili and his two daughters who are ALL victims have found healing.
Correct. In no world does a 34-year-old, mother of FOUR, get pregnant to a 13-year-old, accidentally.
Oh she 100% did it on purpose so she'd always have a hold of him.
Yeah 100%
Imagine all the explaining he has to do when they are old enough to ask these questions about their parents 😢
@@gRinchY-op5vrPoor Villi.
She is so irritating.
Interviewer: “Did you do anything wrong?”
Mary: “I’m done with you trying to get me to answer that question >:(“
GIRL, it’s a yes or no question
The interviewer was so done with her lmao. Every time the camera went on his face he’s like I smell bs. 😂
That interviewer has my full sympathies.
She already knows.
My empathy for the interviewer because I just know sitting in a room with the most insufferable person is mentally draining
This whole case is just a classic example of female privilege.
Him saying, “ I’m not trying to play the victim here” at 1:35:08 is crazy. Like, dude you WERE the victim. You don’t need to play it
I'm glad the interviewer constantly was trying to hold her accountable
The way she talks to Vili in that interview, it's still like a teacher/authority figure talking to a child. "Tell him what you told me you were doing in the closet" like, there is such a condescending tone to him.
so much this!!! I feel terrible for Villi :( like it's so apparent how fucked up and abusive the dynamic is even as an adult. the worst part is that if the gender roles were reversed I seriously doubt they would get any interview like this, and if they did the interviewer would NEVER be this friendly and smiling, there would be visible disgust and contempt. It's so horrible that basically because of stereotypes of teenage girls not being interested in sex and teenage boys wanting to have sex with everything that situations like this aren't rape, or that coercive rape is just not understood.
@@AshLilyNekoI would argue that the "friendliness" of the interview is just a pretext, it allowed the interviewer to nudge Mary into a corner with her own answers and deprived her of the option to make herself seem like a victim
i was thinking the exact same thing. it's so disturbing.
Jesus it's weird seeing them together. He's a normal dad age and she's talking like his old mother, an old grandma.
I would think he’d have kids that are like still single digits or early teens so it’s just very sad that his youngest is already college aged as he’s so young.
Mary’s performance in this interview is almost Prince Andrew level terrible. I feel for Vili and her daughters, and also her ex-husband and children from that marriage. I hope they all may find peace.
Mr "I never sweat" yet caught in a picture of him dancing at a club with sweaty armpit stains 😂
Well she died in 2020 so hopefully he’s had time to come to peace without her looming.
i have to go watch the prince andrew interview now
He looks so uncomfortable and like he is almost repulsed by her.
she CANT be serious. this was the hardest video to watch yet. witnessing the active manipulation of an abuser in real time
“i’m not trying to play the victim here” you were 😞
exactly! that was heartbreaking
It was horrible! Vili was clearly uncomfortable, and she just ignored it.
She actually tried to argue that a 13 year old isn't a child just because they are capable of having sex... and she's a mom. And she's bullying the interviewer and trying to shut down the questions when she's the one who wanted to be interviewed... what did she think they would ask her? 😂
“He was not a child” HONEY a13 year old is still a CHILD whether they’re “prepubescent” OR NOT
I feel like it would’ve still been wrong if she had chosen to pursue him at 18 or whatever the age of consent would’ve been in their state. It’s still predatory even if it’s not illegal, in my opinion, to go after a “freshly of age” people.
@@BigRed1595044fr like that’s still a teenager with a teenage mindset
@@BigRed1595044exactly. It would still be creepy for a teacher to go after a former student. Or anyone to go after someone they knew as a child. The kid may have had an innocent crush on you and there is still a power imbalance when they are an adult. 🤢
She tried to say it was true love. But I don't believe in that. Find an appropriate love interest.
💯. They have so little autonomy. Literally still kids at that point.
@@em84cI wouldn’t be able to get past the fact that I knew the person as a kid.
This gets so depressing at the end when the guy is grown up and under control of this abusive monster.
He just looks so uncomfortable during the interview. I feel like there’s so much trauma and sadness in his eyes and I hope one day he’ll be able to talk about it one day
I think so as well. He has had to grow so fast, it must be something to watch his own children go through their childhoods and moving out.
You're just jealous of her. Think about when you were 14-18 in high school. How many guys more or less sexually harassed you ? How low did your esteem get? Did a guy sleep with you then gaslight you for months ? While others called you a slut behind your back ? how is that better? were you suicidal ? If you were 15 and some man fell in love with you and protected you - would you have been better or worse off ?
I don't see how that is possible while in a relationship with his abuser
@@The_Joy_Finderdidn’t he eventually leave her? They were together for the longest time. She had complete control and wouldn’t let him go.
@@whitedragoness23 They separated in 2017 and divorced a couple of years later. Soon afterwards she died of cancer. Maybe he's staying quiet out of his respect for his children but I have to think now he'd feel more comfortable to discuss what really happened without her glare.
The death stares she gives him whenever he answers a question breaks my heart for him
She sent him a letter from prison telling him she'd cut off his 🍆 if he dated gorls his age
Ya you can tell he’s still damaged in some way. And you can definitely see that she is totally controlling. When he asked her not to talk about something and then she immediately discussed you can easily the dynamic behind this entire relationship
I’m a middle school teacher. I once had a young boy come into my class during lunch time and “hit on” me. It was one of the most uncomfortable experiences of my life. Thinking about it still makes me laugh in an equally uncomfortable but also bemused way at the silliness of a child trying to play adult. It really is simply impossible to imagine the mindset of this woman, a predator in every way. The analogy at the start of this video really put it together perfectly.
I had this 16yo find out I was the new French teacher and he was like “if I knew you were the teacher, I would’ve taken French 😏” BARF
Yeah, kids really be wild sometimes 🫣 so disgusting how much Mary insists on this narrative that she was just powerless to this child’s efforts.
You’re confused and puzzled by the silliness of a child trying to play adult? It’s a pretty common for kids to do this. It’s part of normal development and I think of it as training wheels, but it is the adults job to keep them on the right path and from taking the training wheels off too soon and entering into a very real situation. I agree that it’s nearly impossible to imagine her mindset. It’s completely impossible to empathize with her mindset. Like I know that she loved the attention and how it felt, but what the actual fuck… I don’t get how she didn’t act like you… as in, it’s not a compliment… you shouldn’t even have any feeling about it other than, “oh this silly kid. How cute. Now to send him on his way.”
@@toriagiro9519 I feel like you’re being kinda combative? I wasn’t “confused” I said “bemused” which literally means oh this silly kid like you said. Agree with all you said, wasn’t looking for props.
I haven't watched a lot of UA-cam in a while, but maaaaan have I missed your docs. You get really deep on sensitive topics but it's when you get mad, angry or even annoyed at people and it slips, is when I laugh because YESSS this is messed up and I'm not crazy for feeling this way too. How is she trying to play it off like this?! I watch a lot of crime documentaries, and hands down you're one of my top favourites. Keep doing you, and cheers to your team.