@@HardwareCanucks 🤣🤦♂️ I knew I should have watched this before jumping to your Corsair k100 video🤣 well at least now I know what key polling means great review of the k100 by the way keep it coming 😁
One thing to point out. ABS does not necessarily mean it's cheap plastic, it's simply cheaper general because it's easier to work with when doing double shots. High quality ABS keycaps exist and are basically the "standard" for high end stuff.
@@KevinOQuinn And not only them but other manufacturers also make pretty darn good ABS, JTK is up there in quality, Domikey is catching up quickly in quality as well and SP makes some VERY good ABS (although a bit thin, but still high quality) Meanwhile if we're paying attention to legend quality as well as keycap quality, there really are only like 3 good PBT keycap manufacturers.
Yeah, that’s my one gripe about the video- the broad categorization of ABS as cheap and therefore PBT as premium. There’s plusses and minuses to either, but I would have liked at least a passing mention on things like legibility of legends or sublegends as a talking point. Given the focus of the channel it’s not surprising, but I do think this is the one area I think it’s a major mischaracterization of the keyboard space.
Lubing a full keyboard is between 3-4 hours. Also Dimitri, very well done...not even the top keyboard youtubers ever made such a detailed glossary of terms, so good on you.
Hey {{3}}, thanks for your comment! I completely agree with your sentiment. Taking the time to lube a full keyboard can be quite time-consuming. If you're looking for efficient cleaning solutions, have you considered the HOTO Compressed Air Capsule? It offers powerful vacuuming and blowing capabilities, making it a handy tool to maintain a spotless environment on your desk and beyond. Plus, it's compact and reasonably priced compared to other brands. Cheers!
Just a small detail: The polling rate is actually how often the computer asks the keyboards which keys are being pressed, the keyboard doesn't send data whenever it wants, the computer has to ask.
Hey there, I recently came across the HOTO Compressed Air Capsule, and I have to say, it seems like a reliable and convenient tool for maintaining a clean and organized desktop setup. With its powerful vacuuming and blowing capabilities, it can effectively remove dust and debris from keyboards and tight spaces. Plus, the additional features like the efficient storage and versatile accessories make it a great choice for both indoor and outdoor use. Definitely worth considering for optimizing your desktop environment!
iirc, "Thock" is used to describe if the keyboard/switch has a deep sound signature. And the opposite of this is "Clack" if they have a higher pitched sound. At this point, I kinda hate that word nowadays as some people don't even know what "thock" sounds like anymore. It'd be better if it's described as having a deeper or higher pitched sound. Great video though! Covered most of the basics from this hobby. Love that you're getting into the keyboard hobby!
3:00 If I recall correctly 6KRO is often used instead of "actual" NKRO because of legacy USB compatibility reasons. As far as I know the official USB HID spec supports (or used to support) only up to 6 keys plus modifiers keys, rendering NKRO boards inoperable in cases where the host machine doesn't support it. This is also why QMK has a toggle switch between 6KR0 and NKRO.
Ahhh wow... thanks for the clarification! So does that mean the latest Logitech keyboard with 6KRO is actually NKRO and not only 6-key anti-ghosting? -D.
@@HardwareCanucks I'm a little bit out of my depth, but internally probably yes, and the 6KRO is just caused by the board's firmware. I wager they just don't want to risk breaking compatibility by sending more data than what the USB HID spec defines. To my knowledge especially BIOSes can be quite finicky about the matter. Though to be honest, I would not be particularly surprised if many boards marketed as NKRO are actually just 6KRO. Anti-ghosting on the other hand just (usually) means that the board has a dedicated diode for every switch so that the keyboard matrix can be scanned properly without signals being crossed. Really it's just a sign that the board isn't cutting every corner imaginable. If a board has 6KRO/NKRO I'd be more than willing to bet that it has full anti-ghosting.
The quality of the keycaps depends much more on the quality of the manufacturer than the material used. In fact in the keyboard enthusiast community doubleshot ABS keycaps from GMK & OG Cherry sets are considered the best of the best.
Keychron claimed their sets were pbt but sucked regardless of the material according to what i've heard. When i bought my Q1 i just got a completely different set of keycaps and switches.
I actually use my keycaps, and seeing 2 sets of "W, A, S, D and Spacebar" develop permanent shine in less than six months made me ditch GMK completely. My wife says I'm so clean it annoys her sometimes and I dont sweat profusely, so PBT or any reasonably priced ABS it is.
No, they aren't. GMK is great quality ABS, but the reason they don't do PBT is about manufacturing losses vs volume. PBT is notoriously hard to work with, and wasteful. PBT is objectively a better material.
@@literate-aside Wasn't arguing which material was better. Just was stating GMK & OG Cherry doubleshot ABS is the highest quality sets available right now. You could definitely put OG Cherry dyesub PBT up there too, but good luck finding a set if them nowadays.
@@robr640 I disagree I'm afraid. GMK make good quality ABS keys, but they trade on name and variety. There are absolutely better keys out there, especially those made from PBT. Personally I've *really* struggled to find an ABS set that sound as good either, PBT just sounds better to me, especially double shot; then again that's another thing that's very hard to find these days. That's the beauty of this hobby though I guess; it's all subjective.
A couple things: - Switch weights are generally rated on their bottom-out weights, not their actuation weights which often aren't even listed. The ranges given in the video seem to correspond to bottom out weight as well, as a 75g actuation weight would be an insanely heavy switch that I don’t think you can even buy in any mainstream setting. - Box switches are designed that way to keep dust out of the switch when it is pressed; any wobble advantages are secondary (and the least wobbly switches out right now, like gazzew bobas, aren’t even box switches). - This is a nitpick, but the sound example of “thock” was what most people would probably have called “pop”. This is super pedantic but I’m being honest. - PBT vs ABS keycaps is waaaay more complicated than durable vs cheap and colorful. Even without going into the fact that most PBT “double shot” keycaps are either using PBT molded over a polycarb base (different from doubleshot injection), or are entirely made up of a PBT-ABS blend plastic (which is really more like ABS in properties), it should be noted that generally the high-end most expensive “enthusiast” keycaps are all ABS.
On switch weight, I have seen most tactile switches rated on their actuation or tactile weight, not bottom out. For example, the Halo Ture switches I have are "60g" switches, but if you look at the force profile, after the actuation, they ramp up to 100g at bottom out. When typing on these, you don't bottom out, you just go through the tactile activation, and let the ramped resistance of the rest of the travel resist you bottoming out. They're cool for typing, because your fingers "float" in the middle of the travel when typing quickly. The problem with these switches is when you hold them down for WASD gaming, your fingers get tired and sore. The same is true of Zeal tactile switches, which come in various tactile weights, but they don't have a heavy spring, so you bottom them out, as the tactile point is the highest force part of the travel. I believe linears are all rated on their bottom out force, because unlike tactiles, there is no increased force between the top of the travel and the bottom.
Hey, I recently came across the HOTO Compressed Air Capsule and it seems like a great tool to optimize your desktop setup. It offers powerful vacuuming and blowing capabilities, perfect for keeping your desk spotless and keyboard clean. Plus, it's portable and versatile for other uses. Definitely worth considering! 🖥💨
Before this video I honestly did not know all the knowledge I had accumulated over the years of watching others talk about keyboard. Definitely a passion of mine and a really really good video for someone that has no idea about any of this. It is a pricey hobby but very nice
Thanks for putting this video together! I've always wondered what some of this stuff meant/how it translated into what I should/shouldn't be looking for.
thanks for connecting the custom keyboard community and gaming keyboard community with this. Would've been better if you could have given examples between keyboards custom/prebuilt using the terms you just discussed as both have their pros and cons .
Recently watched your mouse video, clear, concise, no over the top banter about bias. Informative, and entertaining, these videos keep the consumers of these products happy about the choices they can or have made. Well done, deserved sub.
I spent MONTHS looking into all of these terms last year in the process of learning to build my own. WHY U ONLY MAKE NOW?!?!?!! This is a -great- video to make and will no doubt help a lot of beginners on a -very- lengthy road. Goodjob
so f*cking informative ,I tried to learn these terms by reading articles but couldn't wrap my head around them fully, your way of speech and the pics and videos inside this helped alot
Well done covering most of the basics, it's also useful to mention the different keycap side profiles like OEM, Cherry, ASA, Xda, etc that can affect compatibility with some switches. For the stabiliser it's also good to mention the securing method: plate mounted(common) vs screw in(better) stabs. Speaking of the plate there can be many materials: steel, aluminium, brass, FR4, carbon fiber , policarbonate, etc, affecting sound typing feeling. More for the custom side of keebs a bonus mention is the case material like plastic or aluminium and finish options like paint, anodising (some say anno for short), ceracoating, etc. Oh and the GB or group buys that are basically limited in number group preorders with a small window to secure an unit and after that a very very very long wait for them to actually manufacture the things, compile the set and eventually ship it.
Hey {{3}}! Great points you brought up in your comment! The different keycap side profiles, stabilizer securing methods, plate materials, and case options are all crucial factors to consider when choosing a mechanical keyboard. Additionally, group buys can be an exciting way to get unique custom keyboards. Thanks for mentioning these important details! By the way, have you ever tried using the HOTO Compressed Air Capsule for cleaning your keyboard and desktop setup? It's a versatile tool that can definitely enhance your maintenance routine!
FANTASTIC video, now I know even more about mechanical keyboards. You pointed out a problem I started to experience which was multiple key presses being registered on my old keyboard. Weird part is that happened over time, it did not do that for 3+ years but then it seemed like the debounce delay feature started failing. I even replaced the switches and it still did it.
Overall, you covered a lot of great terms for beginners and explained them well. As others have already said, the material of the keycap has nothing to do with the quality of the keycap. There are low-quality ABS and low-quality PBT, and there are high-quality ABS and high-quality PBT. Quality comes from the manufacturing process. The main criticism with ABS is that it will shine, which people view as low-quality, but there are ABS keycaps from the dawn of the keyboard as we know it that still look amazing. From my experience, price = quality for any type of keycap up to the $100 mark. Everything after that will be about the same quality, but you’re paying for extras, unique colors, etc. You explained the double-shot process well. Dye-sub is also a very cool process which can only be done to PBT, since it is more temperature resistant. The legends are made by using a special dye that when placed on the keycap and baked, the dye vaporizes and is absorbed by the plastic, sort of infusing and penetrating the plastic. This is why dye-sub is so much more durable than pad-printed, UV printed, or laser etched keycaps. There is no realistic durability difference between dye-sub and double-shot. ABS cannot be dye-sublimated because it cannot withstand the higher temperatures involved. ABS vs PBT is the greatest debate I’m the community, and will probably always be.
your video saved my first keyboard build the part about optical switches made me check and i found out i ordered optical switches instead of mechanical. that would have been a very bad surprise after waiting 3 weeks for shipping
Wow nice video, thank you for putting so much effort in researching this! You can already tell by the keycaps comment, ABS does not mean cheap. Some manufacture has gotten really good at producing really high quality, color accurate, thick ABS keycaps with minimal warping (Germany's GMK for example). While PBT can be a better plastic material, the manufacturing process for it still need to catch up. Right now, the problems with PBT are: 1. warping and shrinking (More common in doubleshot PBT), 2. color vibrancy (colors on PBT are not saturated in comparison to ABS for this reason), 3. fuzzy legends (To avoid reason 1, manufacture uses Dyesub which can cause major fuzziness). Once PBT manufacturing process catch up, I'd be glad to switch to PBT.
You might want to keep an eye out for Milkyway. They are going to become the standard for Dye-Sub PBT. Plus they are even going to unveil a new manufacturing process for dyesub later this year.
I'm not sure if you, yourself, need clarification on those terms you mentioned but in case someone sees your comment and does need help: GMK is just a keycap manufacturer, and probably the most popular in the custom keyboard scene. There are others like ePBT and Signature Plastics. QMK is just a software program used to flash a keyboard or configure layouts. VIA is another popular one. Plates are metal plates with cutouts for switches and stabilizers to mount onto. They go between the PCB and switches, and can modify the feel and sound of a keyboard, depending on material used. Materials can be plastic, like polycarbonate or acrylic or metals, like brass or aluminum. PCBs are, well, the "motherboard" of a keyboard (?). That's what you mount your switches, and usually stabilizers, to actually register key presses.
Thocc isn't a good thing per se. It was a way of describing Topre's unique capacitive switch sound, but in MX switches it's simply the switch bottoming out. Bottoming out used to be considered a bad thing, but it's all the rage now for linear lovers who necessarily lube the switch for smoothness, which also softens the bottoming out sound. Typists generally prefer sharply tactile and clicky switches as they give feedback (called an event) when the switch is activated, letting them avoid bottoming out.
I remember buying my first mechanical keyboard 7 years back, went with a pretty value board. $135 brushed aluminum face plate, and all metal body. Absolutely loved it, I still to this day love it, just wanted something a little different after so many years. I downgraded from a full size to 65% and I was very on the fence about it, but to my genuine surprise beyond the volume wheel I've not really noticed much beyond a lot more room on my desk mat. I originally opted for a cheap $30 65% (didn't want to spend a lot and find out I hated it) and it worked, after 2 months I bought a Drop Alt LP for $100 new in the box, I loved it as well. I guess my point is, don't discount hotswap, some switches are a lot cheaper than replacing a full keyboard. It saves money in the long run, and you get the option to use less traditional switches (like Holy Pandas) which can be borderline impossible to find on a prebuilt keyboard.
keycap profile: the shape of the keycaps, and the overall shape of the keys across the keyboard. individual keycaps can have tops with flat, cylindrical, or spherical cup\s (etc.). the tops can also be square, rounded square, or tombstone shaped (etc.). the skirts of the caps can also be in several different shapes. some keycap sets can be different heights based on what row they are in. switch profiles: You'll mostly run into (what's now called) full size, or low-profile when dealing with MX style switches. there's also taller (up to about 5× the height of modern full size switches, these are ancient in technology terms) and shorter (as low as ¼ the height of full-size) switches out there. And then there's membrane switches.
Gmk set cost more as Gmk needs to pay the designers money, so the quality may not match with the price. You pay for the colour scheme more than the quality.
@@grism01 ABS is in fact a cheaper plastic compared to PBT. The GMK pricing is for the quality of the coloring, text clarity and of course the limited quantity with a touch of the artists cut per sale. So he was not wrong in that. ABS can be done right and GMK knows what they are doing, they dont really have competitors at this time.
Excellent explanation of all these confusing terminologies. Personally I don't care about 90% of these "issues" and think that the keyboard space has really taken it too far. I have to do actual research before I buy a new keyboard nowadays...
Plenty of people have mentioned the keycaps part, and not all ABS being bad and not all PBT being good, so I won't go further on that. What I will say is the description of "thock" without any real explanation of what it means should mean that there should have been some sort of point about not using the word. For anyone who has to answer questions almost daily about keycaps that thock, switches that thock, boards that thock, it gets really tiring having to ask back "ok, what do you actually mean?" every single time. Using the words you mean instead of a nebulous onomatopoeia makes it much more pleasant for anyone who's trying to help you find products that suit your needs. Otherwise though, decent video, does a very good job of communicating the terms to beginners without straying too much into preferences.
Looking forward to phantoms. :) I've been trying to find shinethroughs look like phantoms for a while but getting more variety would definitely be great!
X-Key Rollover is cost-related, it's not so much as the keyboard controller becoming more powerful, as we are still talking about MCUs here. Its more about how the circuit is designed, with key rollovers, additional circuits are needed for differentiation of those keys in a key matrix. Again, its a fine distinction there. 6-KRO is just a cost-driven reason for ensuring the crucial ones are all "rollover"-able
I just bought my first Ducky last month and got the Cherry Silent switches. It's just sooo good; now I need another one! And the SF definitely takes some getting used to.
@@Daniel-dj7fh They're super tactile and satisfying like you'd expect from mechanical, but the keys are pretty silent! There's none of the clicky from a mechanical, but you can hear key travel and bottoming out. I had normal Cherry MXes and my roommate would complain when we games together, even he was like "damn that's quiet."
Me: *Has spent over 2k on custom keyboard builds* Also Me: Hmmm, this looks interesting dw though this is a really good beginner vid, i ofc dropped a like
Custom mechanical keyboard is a big big rabbit hole. From custom once of keycaps to switches and boards. I'm like $2000 AUD deep. Haven't bought a mech keyboard since early 2021
There is also a fine difference between what the manufacturer (or insider) consider premium versus consumer, like the comment about ABS vs PBT, as an ex mechanical engineer, I consider stuff like burr or the presence of imperfection at gates resulting from injection molding process on a keycap, those are true representation of hoe stringent the factories are at controlling their quality
PBT cannot be shine-through. So if keycaps advertized as PBT and they still have translucent symbols - they are made out of both ABS and PBT mix. Moreover ABS have tendency to crack and when you put in and out keycaps too often.
Few notes 1. It's not Thonk and Silky smooth , it's Thock and Clack. 2. I'd talk about Keycap profiles like ASA/Cherry/OEM/MT3 etc .. 3. GMK sometimes makes ABS keycaps and they are not cheap at all . 4. Forgot to mention types of Lubes like Krytox/Trybosis/Permatex and etc.
silky smooth has nothing to do with sound. it's how they feel. A fresh unlubed switch will most likely be scratchier than a broken in lubed switch, and then become "silky smooth"
The PCB is hotswap, not the switches. Didn't even go through 3 pin or 5 pin switches. Key cap layout formats would have been a fun add, but you got most of it. I guess.
@Hardware Canucks This is a wonderful video. Thank you. The part I struggle with the most is where to buy keycaps and switches. Like you, I'm in Canada, and I've only found a couple of places here that have limited stock and are very expensive. Could you please recommend any good Canadian stores for keycaps and switches. A place you trust. If not, then U.S. ones. I see some amazing stuff on UA-cam, but whenever I go to websites, I'm not impressed at all. Where are people getting all these amazing keycaps? Thank you in advance for your help.
doubleshot ABS cheap? Well well you can tell that to GMK or JTK or Domikey keycaps, the most expensive keycaps sets out there. Keycaps sound is not only affected by the material, but also the profile (Cherry profile, SA profile, KAT profile, etc), and material thickness as well.
Springs could cause some scratch I guess but the switch leafs, the switch housing, and switch stem would be more likely to cause a scratchy sound and feel.
NKRO isn't nearly as important for day to day use or gaming as many people think. In the past I used a Cherry MX Board 3.0 with NKRO but I recently switched to a modded Cherry G80-1800 that has 2KRO (in reality up to 4 alphas +1 mod key though depending on where the keys lie in the matrix). The combinations that only allow 2 alphas +1 mod key are impossible to press comfortably anyway. I have never ran into any issues with this type of 2KRO, be it while writing or gaming. Which makes me question why there even was an NKRO version of the G80-1800 at one point. Probably to fix the ghosting issues that you sometimes read about, which I have also never noticed to be honest
Excellent video👍 quick question I'm liking frameless looking keyboards because they look less like a big brick. I like compact size keyboards but with most of the keys for writing vs gaming. What do you recommend? Thank you
Now the hard task of convincing keyboard enthusiasts that the THOCK is a horrible noise and there's literally nothing worse than living in a small house or apartment with someone that has a keyboard going THOCKTHOCKTHOCKTHOCK all day and night Silent keyboard tech let's go!!
nice video i think the next one after should be about the types of switches and the different brands there are as just getting a mechanical keyboard with say gatreon red switches or cherry mx blue switches to kalih brown switches are going to get confusing and may even feel like a bad keyboard experience due to the type of switch not fitting in with the type of keyboard typing/gaming habits each person has. like someone recommended cherry mx reds for me but it turned into a nightmare as i needed the tactile bump feel response due to the types of games i prefer playing.
This is probably one of the best beginner explanation videos for an introduction to the keyboard community that I’ve seen. Great job!
Awesome to hear :) Happy to help!
-D.
Exactly - all things answered that I was too afraid to ask for fear of offending KB aficionados.
Beginner 😥 lol. Was too much info never thought there was so many things to understand in a keyboard
@@HardwareCanucks 🤣🤦♂️ I knew I should have watched this before jumping to your Corsair k100 video🤣 well at least now I know what key polling means great review of the k100 by the way keep it coming 😁
is it? the biggest thing about mechanical keyboard, that is the types of switches, was not mentioned
One thing to point out.
ABS does not necessarily mean it's cheap plastic, it's simply cheaper general because it's easier to work with when doing double shots.
High quality ABS keycaps exist and are basically the "standard" for high end stuff.
@@KevinOQuinn And not only them but other manufacturers also make pretty darn good ABS, JTK is up there in quality, Domikey is catching up quickly in quality as well and SP makes some VERY good ABS (although a bit thin, but still high quality)
Meanwhile if we're paying attention to legend quality as well as keycap quality, there really are only like 3 good PBT keycap manufacturers.
Yeah, that’s my one gripe about the video- the broad categorization of ABS as cheap and therefore PBT as premium. There’s plusses and minuses to either, but I would have liked at least a passing mention on things like legibility of legends or sublegends as a talking point. Given the focus of the channel it’s not surprising, but I do think this is the one area I think it’s a major mischaracterization of the keyboard space.
I'm sorry, ABS is cheap plain and simple. Cheaper to make, cheaper to source, and cheaper to manufacture in mass.
@@KevinOQuinn Cheap being inferior wasn't the point I was trying to make. Cheap as in cost was what I was trying to get across.
@@bwloawesome Cheaper does not mean lower quality.
Lubing a full keyboard is between 3-4 hours. Also Dimitri, very well done...not even the top keyboard youtubers ever made such a detailed glossary of terms, so good on you.
Hey {{3}}, thanks for your comment! I completely agree with your sentiment. Taking the time to lube a full keyboard can be quite time-consuming. If you're looking for efficient cleaning solutions, have you considered the HOTO Compressed Air Capsule? It offers powerful vacuuming and blowing capabilities, making it a handy tool to maintain a spotless environment on your desk and beyond. Plus, it's compact and reasonably priced compared to other brands. Cheers!
Just a small detail: The polling rate is actually how often the computer asks the keyboards which keys are being pressed, the keyboard doesn't send data whenever it wants, the computer has to ask.
Which is why it's called a "poll" lol because it polls the board
good to know, thank you for this 👍
Correct the cpu has to wait for a interrupt handler request so it can switch to input I/O part so it can actually fetch and store input from device.
Hey there, I recently came across the HOTO Compressed Air Capsule, and I have to say, it seems like a reliable and convenient tool for maintaining a clean and organized desktop setup. With its powerful vacuuming and blowing capabilities, it can effectively remove dust and debris from keyboards and tight spaces. Plus, the additional features like the efficient storage and versatile accessories make it a great choice for both indoor and outdoor use. Definitely worth considering for optimizing your desktop environment!
iirc, "Thock" is used to describe if the keyboard/switch has a deep sound signature. And the opposite of this is "Clack" if they have a higher pitched sound.
At this point, I kinda hate that word nowadays as some people don't even know what "thock" sounds like anymore. It'd be better if it's described as having a deeper or higher pitched sound.
Great video though! Covered most of the basics from this hobby. Love that you're getting into the keyboard hobby!
Bro these guy's quality for their videography is insane. Their video always look so crisp
As a keyboard beginner, this is the video I've been waiting for. Thank you. 👍🙂
3:00 If I recall correctly 6KRO is often used instead of "actual" NKRO because of legacy USB compatibility reasons. As far as I know the official USB HID spec supports (or used to support) only up to 6 keys plus modifiers keys, rendering NKRO boards inoperable in cases where the host machine doesn't support it. This is also why QMK has a toggle switch between 6KR0 and NKRO.
Ahhh wow... thanks for the clarification! So does that mean the latest Logitech keyboard with 6KRO is actually NKRO and not only 6-key anti-ghosting?
-D.
@@HardwareCanucks I'm a little bit out of my depth, but internally probably yes, and the 6KRO is just caused by the board's firmware. I wager they just don't want to risk breaking compatibility by sending more data than what the USB HID spec defines. To my knowledge especially BIOSes can be quite finicky about the matter. Though to be honest, I would not be particularly surprised if many boards marketed as NKRO are actually just 6KRO.
Anti-ghosting on the other hand just (usually) means that the board has a dedicated diode for every switch so that the keyboard matrix can be scanned properly without signals being crossed. Really it's just a sign that the board isn't cutting every corner imaginable. If a board has 6KRO/NKRO I'd be more than willing to bet that it has full anti-ghosting.
As a G413 owner, you have my thanks. ;-)
Some keyboard will simulate 2 USB HID keyboard in Windows, you will have more than 6KRO
The quality of the keycaps depends much more on the quality of the manufacturer than the material used. In fact in the keyboard enthusiast community doubleshot ABS keycaps from GMK & OG Cherry sets are considered the best of the best.
Keychron claimed their sets were pbt but sucked regardless of the material according to what i've heard. When i bought my Q1 i just got a completely different set of keycaps and switches.
I actually use my keycaps, and seeing 2 sets of "W, A, S, D and Spacebar" develop permanent shine in less than six months made me ditch GMK completely. My wife says I'm so clean it annoys her sometimes and I dont sweat profusely, so PBT or any reasonably priced ABS it is.
No, they aren't. GMK is great quality ABS, but the reason they don't do PBT is about manufacturing losses vs volume. PBT is notoriously hard to work with, and wasteful.
PBT is objectively a better material.
@@literate-aside Wasn't arguing which material was better. Just was stating GMK & OG Cherry doubleshot ABS is the highest quality sets available right now. You could definitely put OG Cherry dyesub PBT up there too, but good luck finding a set if them nowadays.
@@robr640 I disagree I'm afraid.
GMK make good quality ABS keys, but they trade on name and variety. There are absolutely better keys out there, especially those made from PBT.
Personally I've *really* struggled to find an ABS set that sound as good either, PBT just sounds better to me, especially double shot; then again that's another thing that's very hard to find these days.
That's the beauty of this hobby though I guess; it's all subjective.
A couple things:
- Switch weights are generally rated on their bottom-out weights, not their actuation weights which often aren't even listed. The ranges given in the video seem to correspond to bottom out weight as well, as a 75g actuation weight would be an insanely heavy switch that I don’t think you can even buy in any mainstream setting.
- Box switches are designed that way to keep dust out of the switch when it is pressed; any wobble advantages are secondary (and the least wobbly switches out right now, like gazzew bobas, aren’t even box switches).
- This is a nitpick, but the sound example of “thock” was what most people would probably have called “pop”. This is super pedantic but I’m being honest.
- PBT vs ABS keycaps is waaaay more complicated than durable vs cheap and colorful. Even without going into the fact that most PBT “double shot” keycaps are either using PBT molded over a polycarb base (different from doubleshot injection), or are entirely made up of a PBT-ABS blend plastic (which is really more like ABS in properties), it should be noted that generally the high-end most expensive “enthusiast” keycaps are all ABS.
On switch weight, I have seen most tactile switches rated on their actuation or tactile weight, not bottom out. For example, the Halo Ture switches I have are "60g" switches, but if you look at the force profile, after the actuation, they ramp up to 100g at bottom out. When typing on these, you don't bottom out, you just go through the tactile activation, and let the ramped resistance of the rest of the travel resist you bottoming out. They're cool for typing, because your fingers "float" in the middle of the travel when typing quickly. The problem with these switches is when you hold them down for WASD gaming, your fingers get tired and sore.
The same is true of Zeal tactile switches, which come in various tactile weights, but they don't have a heavy spring, so you bottom them out, as the tactile point is the highest force part of the travel.
I believe linears are all rated on their bottom out force, because unlike tactiles, there is no increased force between the top of the travel and the bottom.
Hey, I recently came across the HOTO Compressed Air Capsule and it seems like a great tool to optimize your desktop setup. It offers powerful vacuuming and blowing capabilities, perfect for keeping your desk spotless and keyboard clean. Plus, it's portable and versatile for other uses. Definitely worth considering! 🖥💨
Before this video I honestly did not know all the knowledge I had accumulated over the years of watching others talk about keyboard. Definitely a passion of mine and a really really good video for someone that has no idea about any of this. It is a pricey hobby but very nice
2:06 Damn, I did not expect that, well done 😆
I would also add layout options: 60% 65% 75% TKL etc.
Thanks for putting this video together! I've always wondered what some of this stuff meant/how it translated into what I should/shouldn't be looking for.
thanks for connecting the custom keyboard community and gaming keyboard community with this. Would've been better if you could have given examples between keyboards custom/prebuilt using the terms you just discussed as both have their pros and cons
.
Recently watched your mouse video, clear, concise, no over the top banter about bias. Informative, and entertaining, these videos keep the consumers of these products happy about the choices they can or have made. Well done, deserved sub.
In the last year I've been following a number of... keyboard influencers (?)... On UA-cam, and this is by far my favorite primer. Kudos to you sir.
I spent MONTHS looking into all of these terms last year in the process of learning to build my own.
WHY U ONLY MAKE NOW?!?!?!!
This is a -great- video to make and will no doubt help a lot of beginners on a -very- lengthy road. Goodjob
Not only I learnt how to search for the quailities I like in a keyboard but also how to talk to the community and ask for advice.
Thank you so much
so f*cking informative ,I tried to learn these terms by reading articles but couldn't wrap my head around them fully, your way of speech and the pics and videos inside this helped alot
Well done covering most of the basics, it's also useful to mention the different keycap side profiles like OEM, Cherry, ASA, Xda, etc that can affect compatibility with some switches. For the stabiliser it's also good to mention the securing method: plate mounted(common) vs screw in(better) stabs. Speaking of the plate there can be many materials: steel, aluminium, brass, FR4, carbon fiber , policarbonate, etc, affecting sound typing feeling. More for the custom side of keebs a bonus mention is the case material like plastic or aluminium and finish options like paint, anodising (some say anno for short), ceracoating, etc. Oh and the GB or group buys that are basically limited in number group preorders with a small window to secure an unit and after that a very very very long wait for them to actually manufacture the things, compile the set and eventually ship it.
Hey {{3}}! Great points you brought up in your comment! The different keycap side profiles, stabilizer securing methods, plate materials, and case options are all crucial factors to consider when choosing a mechanical keyboard. Additionally, group buys can be an exciting way to get unique custom keyboards. Thanks for mentioning these important details! By the way, have you ever tried using the HOTO Compressed Air Capsule for cleaning your keyboard and desktop setup? It's a versatile tool that can definitely enhance your maintenance routine!
FANTASTIC video, now I know even more about mechanical keyboards. You pointed out a problem I started to experience which was multiple key presses being registered on my old keyboard. Weird part is that happened over time, it did not do that for 3+ years but then it seemed like the debounce delay feature started failing. I even replaced the switches and it still did it.
Overall, you covered a lot of great terms for beginners and explained them well.
As others have already said, the material of the keycap has nothing to do with the quality of the keycap. There are low-quality ABS and low-quality PBT, and there are high-quality ABS and high-quality PBT. Quality comes from the manufacturing process. The main criticism with ABS is that it will shine, which people view as low-quality, but there are ABS keycaps from the dawn of the keyboard as we know it that still look amazing. From my experience, price = quality for any type of keycap up to the $100 mark. Everything after that will be about the same quality, but you’re paying for extras, unique colors, etc.
You explained the double-shot process well. Dye-sub is also a very cool process which can only be done to PBT, since it is more temperature resistant. The legends are made by using a special dye that when placed on the keycap and baked, the dye vaporizes and is absorbed by the plastic, sort of infusing and penetrating the plastic. This is why dye-sub is so much more durable than pad-printed, UV printed, or laser etched keycaps. There is no realistic durability difference between dye-sub and double-shot. ABS cannot be dye-sublimated because it cannot withstand the higher temperatures involved.
ABS vs PBT is the greatest debate I’m the community, and will probably always be.
your video saved my first keyboard build the part about optical switches made me check and i found out i ordered optical switches instead of mechanical. that would have been a very bad surprise after waiting 3 weeks for shipping
Wow nice video, thank you for putting so much effort in researching this! You can already tell by the keycaps comment, ABS does not mean cheap. Some manufacture has gotten really good at producing really high quality, color accurate, thick ABS keycaps with minimal warping (Germany's GMK for example). While PBT can be a better plastic material, the manufacturing process for it still need to catch up.
Right now, the problems with PBT are:
1. warping and shrinking (More common in doubleshot PBT),
2. color vibrancy (colors on PBT are not saturated in comparison to ABS for this reason),
3. fuzzy legends (To avoid reason 1, manufacture uses Dyesub which can cause major fuzziness).
Once PBT manufacturing process catch up, I'd be glad to switch to PBT.
You might want to keep an eye out for Milkyway. They are going to become the standard for Dye-Sub PBT. Plus they are even going to unveil a new manufacturing process for dyesub later this year.
Amazing video! How about a video explaining the custom mechanical keyboard scene? GMK, QMK, plates, PCBs they all get very confusing!
I'm not sure if you, yourself, need clarification on those terms you mentioned but in case someone sees your comment and does need help: GMK is just a keycap manufacturer, and probably the most popular in the custom keyboard scene. There are others like ePBT and Signature Plastics.
QMK is just a software program used to flash a keyboard or configure layouts. VIA is another popular one.
Plates are metal plates with cutouts for switches and stabilizers to mount onto. They go between the PCB and switches, and can modify the feel and sound of a keyboard, depending on material used. Materials can be plastic, like polycarbonate or acrylic or metals, like brass or aluminum.
PCBs are, well, the "motherboard" of a keyboard (?). That's what you mount your switches, and usually stabilizers, to actually register key presses.
Taeha Types has a great video on the anatomy of a custom keyboard.
Thank you Dmitri! We have needed this EXACT video for sooo long now. Love the content my friend
Thocc isn't a good thing per se. It was a way of describing Topre's unique capacitive switch sound, but in MX switches it's simply the switch bottoming out.
Bottoming out used to be considered a bad thing, but it's all the rage now for linear lovers who necessarily lube the switch for smoothness, which also softens the bottoming out sound.
Typists generally prefer sharply tactile and clicky switches as they give feedback (called an event) when the switch is activated, letting them avoid bottoming out.
Wish more videos were as informative and concise as this one is. thank you so much!
I remember buying my first mechanical keyboard 7 years back, went with a pretty value board. $135 brushed aluminum face plate, and all metal body. Absolutely loved it, I still to this day love it, just wanted something a little different after so many years.
I downgraded from a full size to 65% and I was very on the fence about it, but to my genuine surprise beyond the volume wheel I've not really noticed much beyond a lot more room on my desk mat. I originally opted for a cheap $30 65% (didn't want to spend a lot and find out I hated it) and it worked, after 2 months I bought a Drop Alt LP for $100 new in the box, I loved it as well.
I guess my point is, don't discount hotswap, some switches are a lot cheaper than replacing a full keyboard. It saves money in the long run, and you get the option to use less traditional switches (like Holy Pandas) which can be borderline impossible to find on a prebuilt keyboard.
Thanks. I'm about 2 million videos in and still had no idea what was going on until now.
keycap profile: the shape of the keycaps, and the overall shape of the keys across the keyboard. individual keycaps can have tops with flat, cylindrical, or spherical cup\s (etc.). the tops can also be square, rounded square, or tombstone shaped (etc.). the skirts of the caps can also be in several different shapes. some keycap sets can be different heights based on what row they are in.
switch profiles: You'll mostly run into (what's now called) full size, or low-profile when dealing with MX style switches. there's also taller (up to about 5× the height of modern full size switches, these are ancient in technology terms) and shorter (as low as ¼ the height of full-size) switches out there. And then there's membrane switches.
Simply the best video on mechanical keyboards I have seen! Nice job guys. I can definitely purchase my first mech keyboard with more confidence
Great seeing AK being in the big city!
Don't forget about the Hall Effect switches in boards like the Apex Pro and Wooting 60 HE and Wooting Two HE. Highly customizable analog switches!
Actually a legit good explanation. Felt like I learned something. Good job!
"ABS is cheaper"
me looking at 129€ GMK base set: sure
Limited run keycaps are never cheap, nor really intended to be.
Cause dude doesn't know what the fuck he's talking about in this video
Even more absurd of a statement when you realise dye-sub pbt caps are like 40 dollars max lmao.
Gmk set cost more as Gmk needs to pay the designers money, so the quality may not match with the price. You pay for the colour scheme more than the quality.
@@grism01 ABS is in fact a cheaper plastic compared to PBT. The GMK pricing is for the quality of the coloring, text clarity and of course the limited quantity with a touch of the artists cut per sale. So he was not wrong in that. ABS can be done right and GMK knows what they are doing, they dont really have competitors at this time.
Excellent explanation of all these confusing terminologies. Personally I don't care about 90% of these "issues" and think that the keyboard space has really taken it too far. I have to do actual research before I buy a new keyboard nowadays...
This was such a good video for relatively newbie’s like myself. Appreciate the schooling!!
Plenty of people have mentioned the keycaps part, and not all ABS being bad and not all PBT being good, so I won't go further on that.
What I will say is the description of "thock" without any real explanation of what it means should mean that there should have been some sort of point about not using the word. For anyone who has to answer questions almost daily about keycaps that thock, switches that thock, boards that thock, it gets really tiring having to ask back "ok, what do you actually mean?" every single time. Using the words you mean instead of a nebulous onomatopoeia makes it much more pleasant for anyone who's trying to help you find products that suit your needs.
Otherwise though, decent video, does a very good job of communicating the terms to beginners without straying too much into preferences.
Wow. I have learned a lot. Thanks for the video. 👍
Looking forward to phantoms. :) I've been trying to find shinethroughs look like phantoms for a while but getting more variety would definitely be great!
Good stuff.
Seeing this video makes me happy to see I did everything right (for my own sake) with the Keycron K3.
Thank you for the information, it helped me to know what to buy or not.
X-Key Rollover is cost-related, it's not so much as the keyboard controller becoming more powerful, as we are still talking about MCUs here. Its more about how the circuit is designed, with key rollovers, additional circuits are needed for differentiation of those keys in a key matrix. Again, its a fine distinction there.
6-KRO is just a cost-driven reason for ensuring the crucial ones are all "rollover"-able
Damn, another one gone down the rabbit hole and one of my favorite tech youtuber as well
I just bought my first Ducky last month and got the Cherry Silent switches. It's just sooo good; now I need another one! And the SF definitely takes some getting used to.
What is your opinion on the silents, do they feel mushy, do they have a nice damped sound, etc.?
@@Daniel-dj7fh They're super tactile and satisfying like you'd expect from mechanical, but the keys are pretty silent! There's none of the clicky from a mechanical, but you can hear key travel and bottoming out.
I had normal Cherry MXes and my roommate would complain when we games together, even he was like "damn that's quiet."
@@isturma Which switch do you specifically have, because I don't think I remember Cherry having tactile silent switches 🤔🤔🤔
Me: *Has spent over 2k on custom keyboard builds*
Also Me: Hmmm, this looks interesting
dw though this is a really good beginner vid, i ofc dropped a like
Yo this is super helpful. Thank you so much man!
10:17 me, looking at prices of GMK ABS double shot sets vs most other pbt keycap sets: wait a minute
Really great video! Thanks for taking the time to put it together :)
Thanks man. Just What I needed. I wish I've seen this before buying my cheap keyboard
Thanks for the vid. Your content is always super informative. Great work.
Everything i need to know about the keyboard world! thanks
Thanks for this tutorial. Learned a lot from it.
I needed this when I started out with keyboards!!
I found the Savior of Keyboard guide!! God knowledge is well and fairly shared here!! Thank you!!
Custom mechanical keyboard is a big big rabbit hole. From custom once of keycaps to switches and boards. I'm like $2000 AUD deep. Haven't bought a mech keyboard since early 2021
There is also a fine difference between what the manufacturer (or insider) consider premium versus consumer, like the comment about ABS vs PBT, as an ex mechanical engineer, I consider stuff like burr or the presence of imperfection at gates resulting from injection molding process on a keycap, those are true representation of hoe stringent the factories are at controlling their quality
I finally found the video i was looking for. Thanks a ton!
PBT cannot be shine-through. So if keycaps advertized as PBT and they still have translucent symbols - they are made out of both ABS and PBT mix. Moreover ABS have tendency to crack and when you put in and out keycaps too often.
Cant pbt be doubleshot?
@@Daniel-dj7fh Yeah
Smoothest sponsor segway I have even seen...
Few notes
1. It's not Thonk and Silky smooth , it's Thock and Clack.
2. I'd talk about Keycap profiles like ASA/Cherry/OEM/MT3 etc ..
3. GMK sometimes makes ABS keycaps and they are not cheap at all .
4. Forgot to mention types of Lubes like Krytox/Trybosis/Permatex and etc.
silky smooth has nothing to do with sound. it's how they feel. A fresh unlubed switch will most likely be scratchier than a broken in lubed switch, and then become "silky smooth"
An alien can decipher keyboard terms after this video, good job.
7:05 *Turns up volume to hear the pi-...* *_LUBING!_*
The amount of nerdery that goes on in this hobby is astounding. I love it.
It gets nerdy when you order some random pcb off the web and reprogram the keys and layers on qmk or something like that.
Packed full of essential info thx mate
5:15 The Truly Ergonomic CLEAVE Keyboard 'Optoelectrical Infrared Mechanical Switch' was here ;)
best keyboard analysis video ❤️
Thanks
Thanks for putting this all together.
Getting my first 60% keyboard with hot swap soon can not wait already got some custom keys for it 😂❤
The PCB is hotswap, not the switches. Didn't even go through 3 pin or 5 pin switches. Key cap layout formats would have been a fun add, but you got most of it. I guess.
@Hardware Canucks This is a wonderful video. Thank you. The part I struggle with the most is where to buy keycaps and switches. Like you, I'm in Canada, and I've only found a couple of places here that have limited stock and are very expensive. Could you please recommend any good Canadian stores for keycaps and switches. A place you trust. If not, then U.S. ones. I see some amazing stuff on UA-cam, but whenever I go to websites, I'm not impressed at all. Where are people getting all these amazing keycaps? Thank you in advance for your help.
I've done it! I now have my Master's Degree in Keyboard Engineering! Whoo-hoo!
What a nice summary!
Man, I really needed this Bad Seed tutorial! 😜👌🏼
Love the vid! Just fell down this rabbit hole, still dont know how to answer for "why do you need 5 keyboards?" lol
Awesome video thanks!
Brilliant video that I will no doubt reference in the future.
doubleshot ABS cheap?
Well well you can tell that to GMK or JTK or Domikey keycaps, the most expensive keycaps sets out there.
Keycaps sound is not only affected by the material, but also the profile (Cherry profile, SA profile, KAT profile, etc), and material thickness as well.
Springs could cause some scratch I guess but the switch leafs, the switch housing, and switch stem would be more likely to cause a scratchy sound and feel.
Nice introductory poem 👍
NKRO isn't nearly as important for day to day use or gaming as many people think. In the past I used a Cherry MX Board 3.0 with NKRO but I recently switched to a modded Cherry G80-1800 that has 2KRO (in reality up to 4 alphas +1 mod key though depending on where the keys lie in the matrix). The combinations that only allow 2 alphas +1 mod key are impossible to press comfortably anyway. I have never ran into any issues with this type of 2KRO, be it while writing or gaming. Which makes me question why there even was an NKRO version of the G80-1800 at one point. Probably to fix the ghosting issues that you sometimes read about, which I have also never noticed to be honest
Which is the best quality keyboard? With non of those flaws?
The audio was incredible
Appreciate this kind of Work, it helps alot Keep it up please 🌹👍❤️
Great video. Thanks
calling ABS cheap is a big generalization. I wont call my GMK sets cheap unless I am just poor and should act as if 120$+ were pennies to me
Excellent video👍 quick question I'm liking frameless looking keyboards because they look less like a big brick. I like compact size keyboards but with most of the keys for writing vs gaming. What do you recommend? Thank you
I needed a minute to myself after that smooth af segue
I bought mine before watching this video. What should I do?
That's amazing explanation
Fantastic tutorial, thank you 😊
Now the hard task of convincing keyboard enthusiasts that the THOCK is a horrible noise and there's literally nothing worse than living in a small house or apartment with someone that has a keyboard going THOCKTHOCKTHOCKTHOCK all day and night
Silent keyboard tech let's go!!
Thank you. Thocky keyboards sound horrible. Finally someone who agrees
So which one should i buy?
damn i wish this vid existed when i started out, great vid bro
BRO. THIS. Nicely done on this video and topic! Well job! That THOCK THOUGH, ah!!!!
SCAM. Reported.
Thank you so much for this!
those phantom keycaps look really nice and clean!
nice video i think the next one after should be about the types of switches and the different brands there are as just getting a mechanical keyboard with say gatreon red switches or cherry mx blue switches to kalih brown switches are going to get confusing and may even feel like a bad keyboard experience due to the type of switch not fitting in with the type of keyboard typing/gaming habits each person has. like someone recommended cherry mx reds for me but it turned into a nightmare as i needed the tactile bump feel response due to the types of games i prefer playing.