CONFRONTING DEBUNKING: Isaac talks with Mick West about UFOs
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- Опубліковано 15 сер 2023
- There has been a lot of talk about the legitimacy of the existence of UFOs, including the recent congressional hearings. Being highly interested in the topic, I thought it was time to have a discussion with someone who challenges some of my ideas on UFOs, so I sat down for a conversation with Mick West. Mick is an American science writer, skeptical investigator, and retired video game programmer. He is the author of Escaping the Rabbit Hole: How to Debunk Conspiracy Theories Using Facts, Logic, and Respect. He also created the website Metabunk, and investigates and debunks pseudoscientific claims and conspiracy theories such as chemtrails and UFOs.
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I held a TS-SCI clearance for 35 years. Having one doesn’t mean you can’t be a crackpot.
NSA, CIA, DIA, NGA, NRO, FBI, and many others…I worked with them all.
And did they tell you anything weird? Were you in the know?
Well done.
Two reasons I think aliens have not visited us:
1. Advanced civilizations are extremely rare.
2. They are too far away even if they have space vessels capable of light speed.
That's pretty much it. It's a big universe.
The odds are extremely good that there IS alien life out there - maybe even intelligent alien life. If the conditions for life on earth arose naturally, then they'll pop up elsewhere too.
We'll just probably never find them because again, the universe is a big damn place.
Would an advanced alien civilization be limited to our understanding of the laws of physics?
1. That’s an assumption. You don’t know the rarity level of advanced civilisations. (We’re not even certain about the size of the universe much less it’s inhabitants) 2. Our understanding of physics is likely incomplete and there may be other ways to transverse those distances that we are ignorant of.
Two reasons I think aliens have visited us.
1. Deathbed confessions about government coverups.
2. Military video, radar and eyewitness evidence of advanced technology.
yeah if they came they must have detected our radio signals, but we've only been sending them out for 100 years, meaning they mustve been just 100 light years from us. this is inconceivable given how rare intelligent life appears to be. our nearest star alone is 4 whole light years away
Yeah, but... hear me out for a second. What if you're just wrong? It's exceedingly arrogant and naive to assume that we are presently at the pinnacle of scientific discovery. Hell, it was only 100 years ago that Hubbell proved the existence of galaxies beyond the Milky Way. Why are advanced civilizations necessarily so rare and "too far away"? You're making the mistake of anthropomorphizing the UFO phenomenon and looking at it strictly through the lense of the human 2023 generally-accepted paradigm of reality. The wisest of men are acutely aware of that which they do NOT know.
Very good job. Thanks for the content.
excellent
Such an interesting and cohesive interview with excellent questions and satisfying answers. Question everything. Be skeptical.
Mick West is a true national treasure. If more people thought logically and applied the required skepticism to any extraordinary claim, the world would be a MUCH better place. Thank you for this good interview. Thank you, Mick, for everything that you do.
It's alright to be sceptical but don't make shitty nonsense up like swamp
Mick West is a prat. He talks out of his arse.I'm ashamed to be British.
HAHAHA. Mick West is a fool that hasn't debunked a single video in his life.
@@Kitties-of-Doom My hero, well said. I think he well and truly made a complete arse of himself when he tried to debunk the tic tac video. Mick West made a living from making video games. He is no scientist nor was he in the military. He tried to apply his understanding of video gaming to a high tech piece of radar equipment and doubt the word of Commander David Fravor who was the probably the most experienced fighter pilot in the Navy at that time. I saw Mick West on a vid doing a road show attempting to ridicule the likes of David Gruche, Chris Melon, ect. What a fool he is, I'm ashamed to be called a compatriot of his.
@@PeterStone-ch9dw and the idiot never learns. "tic tac is likely a far away airplane" LOL then after that statement /'debunk' because hes so nice and sweet and open to discussion he has an aviation technician by name PJ on his channel. PJ was present on the USS Nimitz during the tic tac in 2004. And like a parent to child whos got his face covered in chocolate and is reaching for more PJ told Mick that it could not be an airplane as it would have to get by 20 radar systems simultaneously including the sophisticated E2 Hawk EYE that picks up drift wood from alt 35 000ft 250 miles away. Mick Nods... and says: yeah ok ( that was 3 years ago) And guess what Mick is still selling regarding the tictac 6 months ago? just recently seen him again . Its like watching a person walk into a glass balcony sliding door thinking its open over and over and over 4 years straight.
Mick west helps keep me grounded
@davidbonilla8343 Not sure why you think West has convinced me of anything. Ofcourse there's tons of evidence you spoke of. But not every extraordinary claim turns out to be true.
@davidbonilla8343 Zero evidence!
UFO Argument:
P1: If I see a UFO, then it must be alien
p2: I see a UFO
--------------------------
C: Therefore it's alien
Unsound reasoning!
Excellent interview
This is a great discussion and I haven't heard much about Mick West prior to this interview and I'm relatively impressed by him. Isaac does a good job of finding good people to interview.
At the end Mick West states that he wants to hear from more first-hand witnesses. That's great and all, but it's also true that this statement somewhat discounts those pilots that have given their first-hand testimonials of strange craft during military exercises. I get the point is to legitimize Grusch's information by hearing from those first-parties; it's just that it also seems like West leans more towards discrediting other first-hand accounts that we already have.
SCI or "Secret Compartmented Information." Your clearance does not give you automatic access to anything. You have to provide a job-related justification for the info you are requesting. Being in 'intelligence' does not give you automatic access to anything.
Correct. You must have an authorized need to know.
Actually, it’s Sensitive Compartmented Information.
As far as access…that depends on who you know.
@@jerryboggs428Not always.
Mick West changed me, a big conspiracy believer! I also wish all this UFO stuff were true as well, but I lean more to the truth and facts! Good interview!
That's a good perspective to have toward god and religion, too.
Shite interview.
Data from multiple radars often corroborates visual sightings by multiple people. Now that's a FACT !
@@d.s.5157 Absolutely, the evidence is overwhelming. I would like to see evidence that debunks this issue
@@d.s.5157 that may be truth, but no radar data, radar glitches happen all the time and multiple witnesses are very subjective and not necessary a fact based proof. Let's question our self (for the search of the truth). Is UFO (aliens) the only logical explanation!? 99.9% of the time the answer is NO.
If there were aliens that would be amazing. I don't however understand the low bar for proof that people grasp on to. Show me some good stuff.
I think it's important to distinguish between proof and evidence. There is a whole scale with proof at one end and absolutely nothing on the other. But just because you are not on 100% doesn't mean you are at 0%. It is a common mistake done by skeptics, either intentionally or unintentionally, that if we don't have proof, we don't have anything. That is not how science work.
One more thing, as you said you wanted to see the good stuff. Have you written to your elected representative and demanded that proof be made public if it is being hidden?
@@rasmuslernevall6938but there isn’t even 50% proof on any single supposed evidence. Most stuff is grainy footage or here-say.
@@Fank234 It's more than hearsay. David Grusch have provided very detalied information and documents in closed settings; no one has denied that. And what's more, several 1st hand witnesses have reported to more than one instance of oversight, the ICIG being one of them. And partly because of them the ICIG deemed Grusch's complaint credible and urgent, both concerning reprisals and his testimony. Btw, I have to ask: Would 1st hand testimony change anything for you? Would you be satisfied then?
@@rasmuslernevall6938 none of this means very much in terms of aliens.without being privy to what he has said behind closed doors I can’t really comment. However I doubt very much that anything will come of this in terms of uncovering ufos. I therefore remain sceptical.
"The wise person proportions their confidence to the evidence." - David Hume
No wise people in sight. Just balloons, insulated birds and airplanes
The wise person doesn't discard (multiple) radar data that corroborates multiple visual sightings in an attempt to debunk cases. Sheer arrogance.
@@d.s.5157I didn't discard them. What evidence do you have that such radar data and visual sightings are of alien life? To just assume that it is is sheer arrogance dude.
@@biologicalengineoflove6851 Well historically these sighting were of highly unusual craft performing extraordinary manoeuvres including near nuclear weapons sites over a period of 70 years or more ? How do explain that !
@@d.s.5157 Eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable. And without actual evidence of alien life or craft, drones of governments foreign or domestic will always be a far more likely explanation than aliens because at least we're sure that secret government programs exist.
Yet, the correct answer, however unsatisfying, is "I don't know." Without solid evidence we can't be sure of the explanation. If such things are inexplicable then that means we can't yet explain them, so any attempt at an explanation is mere speculation. And to say, 'I can't explain this, therefore aliens' is what's known as an argument from ignorance logical fallacy. Look it up!
When the US started testing Nuclear Weapons in the atmosphere in the 1940s and 1950s they blew holes through to the fourth and fifth dimensions so now the Aliens can zip back and forth between wherever they come from and Earth as well as sending their drones.
Not really. Unless you have proof, which I'm pretty sure you don't have.
Theory unsupported by evidence.
You do realize that if they are from a higher dimension, then we can't interact with each other like how we interact with things in our 3rd dimension, right?
By far the largest nuclear bomb ever detonated was the Russian Tsar Bomba, and our sun produces literally a billion times that amount of nuclear energy per second, and our sun is a very average or even small star. But no, I'm sure you're right, a nuclear bomb in the 1940s of a few kilotons ripped holes in dimensions but supernova explosions which outshine entire galaxies do not.. 🤣The idiocy on display from the UFO cult is so insane that we really need a whole separate class of asylum for them.
Except UFO sightings have been reported since the 1600s.
I guess you now have to go to a "volcanic eruptions blew holes in the fourth and fifth dimensions" theory.
It's quite obvious the reason alien craft crash into earth is an undesired consequence when using the suns gravity to assist them in a "slingshot" manoeuvre to a more interesting star system. After all, our pale blue dot is a pretty insignificant place to visit in the vastness of space; just knowing it is there, wanting to go and eventually finding it, would be like finding a particular needle in a VERY big cosmic haystack where time and distances must be questioned, just do the calculations. In any case, where are all the museums that should be filled to the rafters with alien fossils and remnants of poorly maintained spacecraft?
Mick West is incredibly British sounding for an American.
He was born in the UK and has been a USA citizen for decades.
Thanks for setting aside the tinfoil hat and staying balanced, sir!
He's British.
He's American now
“Eye witnesses testimony “ will put a person in prison for life.
Hope someone warned David Fravor about that before he gave his eye witness testimony on a bunch of high profile podcasts, not to mention in front of Congress.
Has any LIZ footage stood out as being remotely interesting?
The Chilean navy investigated a plane and found out that there were no planes in the area. West uses that example every interview. What an arrogant man.
lol yeah. He's like " yeah the Chilean UFO was already debunked ...it was actually a plane" so the rest of them are planes too. He's absurd. He got so high on his own supply there is no stopping him now. Can't wait for the disclosure so we can all laugh at him.
Debunkers Crack me up. You have to ignore sooooo damn much. Good luck.
So much what? Yet to see even one convincing bit of evidence.
@@Fank234 There are mountains of "evidence" but what you're really asking for is the smoking gun PROOF. That's what we're all after. The definitive physical evidence does not exist in the public domain. The question is whether it exists in the hands of the government right now. And there is a lot of evidence to suggest that it in fact does.
I mean you have to ignore that some guy I can't name said that something is happening. You have to ignore grainy photos. You have to ignore blurry lights that are right where a plane can be tracked flying at that moment.
Yup you have to ignore so much.
@@SilortheBlade And you have to ignore that an ET technology is advanced enough to traverse the galaxy but flawed enough that a dozen of their craft have crashed on our little blue marble.
If the UFO fanatics had any sense they would embrace people like Mike West becuase he is doing the analysis properly, and they are not. Instead, they whip themselves into a frenzy over a few grainy balloon videos and some anecdotes.
Mick West is a hero for the truth.
Ha!
Promo SM 💕
Mick is so biased he doesn't even know he's biased. just like a religous fundamentalist.
Hes convinced himself that hes a 'skeptic'... he doesnt go by 'debunker' anymore😂😂😂