Seeing depictions of us like this is not surprising. Honestly it's more silly than insulting in this case. At least we've got programmers and creators that make games featuring us in a dignified light. Thank you for this video.
Here's one thing. I don't think they are trying to "depict" anyone, it's literally just inspiration. It's silly on purpose, it's a very adorable game with some heavy story. The whole point of the divide between J-rpgs and C-rpgs is that one is fairly silly, fairly stylized, cutesy with a less table top like system, while the other is just gritty tabletop rpgs for computers.
I think the lack of respect here is more of a reflection on hiw 1st world countries don't really see representing 3rd world countries' histories fairly as necessary, since we're all "primitives"... As a south American, I haven't endured even half of what African and African descendants did, but I can still emphasize
Games featuring South Americans is either Aztecs sacrificing people like primative or mafia cartel styles. Most games are like this though but Japanese games are stereotypical based it’s not racism but more ignorance on the latter just look at street fighter for instance
This is why I'm keeping an eye on indie African, black British, Carribean and black American gaming and animation studios that are aiming to represent us better than this. Have you seen the teasers for the Dawn of Thunder Origin of Sango 3D film? It looks really good.
Have you checked out the Africa expansion for Age of Empires 3 Definitive Edition? I don't know how accurate it is, but it sure is fun and it seems like they really did their home work. It is very new though. It's pretty sad that there are barely any old games that even attempted to portray any region of Africa, or were inspired by it. Basically the only thing I remember was Magic the Gathering. There was a region of Dominaria which was 100% inspired by some African cultures (I don't know which), with Teferi as lead character.
I think the name Kibombo sounds similar to the word "Quilombo", which were the villages maroons in South America (especially the jungles of Brazil) would establish after escaping slavery. The word would survive into Portuguese and some dialects of Spanish as a synonym for "a mess" or a very disorganized/untidy place or situation.
@@FromNothing There's also a movie called Mountains of the Moon from 1990, which features an African kingdom. The trailer is a little cringeworthy, though.
@@8ahau279 Nubia and Kongo are sub-saharan African civilisations, well technically, Nubia is a region, not a civilization, it is a region that had civilisations such as Kerma, Kush, Makuria, Alodia and Nobatia.
@@MichaelClayton64 Of course Kongo is Subsaharan African by any standard, I phrased ambiguously. "They" in my original comment referred to Nubia not to congo, but the way I wrote it, it can be read as including Kongo as well, although that was not theway intended it to sound like. I just ment strictly geographically speaking Nubia is not located south of the Sahara, but in the Sahara.
The only game that kind of tried to portray Africa. Can't believe that no one has tried to do something more accurate and presentable portrayal. For that we have to do it ourselves. Assasin’s creed Origin went a bit in the right direction.
Have you checked out the Africa expansion for Age of Empires 3 Definitive Edition? I don't know how accurate it is, but it sure is fun and it seems like they really did their home work.
Having played that game I have a couple of gripes, especially because Aya and Bayek are the only people in this damn story that wear pants (muh historical accuracy), and that upsets me deeply xD However, they do feature actual african weapons and shield designs, which is cool. Plus the architecture is absolutely stellar. But let's be real, no Assassins Creed is ever going to be featured in "actual" African civilizations. Egypt gets a pass because it is in the Mediterranean and has a lot of influence from Arab and European cultures alike, but to see a "true" and "pure" civilization of Africa, like Benin or Congo, is absolutely never going to happen. At least in the foreseable future. One might hope, that like me and others, people tire of the "medieval-european-inspired fantasy" and start branching out to Arabian themes, which will branch out to pure African. PS: nothing wrong with medieval-european-inspired fantasy. I just want new things :)
If you want a game that has decent african npcs look into Diablo 2 the Zakarim in the third act are biased off of subsaharian Africa. Also note the Paladin who is from Zakarim is black.
Catch me live at: www.twitch.tv/theempirefn Will be live at 11am EST today for a Q&A (without gaming) Also small correction at 2:18, Atekka does indeed have inhabitants in a city with architecture based on Mesoamerica.
I would love to see more videos like this. Like looking at JRPG’s or other games with some folks that have clear African influence or inspiration. You can review them and teach some folks about the real world cultures that are similar or ones you think would be a better choice for representing in the work. I’d love those videos.
I played Golden Sun a long time ago so you'd think I'd remember this but honestly I forgot almost everything about that game. I mostly remember the fun little puzzles and the isometric battles. I only got to play the 1st game which was technically only half the story so perhaps thats why I dont remember it as well. Anyway, I suppose me being the art guy I should be able to analyze that big statue but at the moment I'm drawing blanks :P oh well. The developers probably didnt do much research to begin with from what I can tell.
@@FromNothing Oh that's why. Did you ever play the DS sequel? Not sure if its as good as the older GBA games but it might be fun too. The studio who made the Golden Sun series mostly just makes Mario Tennis and Mario Golf games now lol. A waste of their talents but ofcourse Mario games sell like crazy so yep. I know tons of random videogame trivia. Before Golden Sun they were involved in making a tactical RPG series for Sega called the Shining series. I don't think theres any African stuff in the Shining series but then again I only played Shining Wisdom and not any of the other Shining games.
@@redspiritmask Yes I played the full trilogy and yeah I'm also aware of the history of the company and it's current ventures. It's current wasted ventures.... :(
Great video. I still need to finish that game. I got to the point where I could sail around the world but got distracted with other games. Great at explaining the game and describing it without revealing any major spoilers. As for the livestreams I personally not a fan of them and rarely do I have time to sit down and listen to them at the exact time you (or any other) stream them. I do hope your live stream takes off as the topics I see look really interesting.
@@tyronechillifoot5573 Well friend, much like Central and Western Europeans' culture was largely and tremendously erased by the Roman conquest, a lot of African culture was erased by Islamic conquest as well.
@@tyronechillifoot5573 there have been a few African fantasy novel movie and TV show adaptations announced but, until I see them myself i won't believe it.
It's great to see people talking about the representation in golden sun, I know it's not always good but it's good to see them trying, I'd love to see a sequel that has a character from there as a main chatacter
I thought it wasn’t that bad of a depiction. In Africa there are small villages and this village has shops and iron working (see the shop with the sword and potion). They have things like pottery and have the giant wood carvings. They are clearly depicted as Iron Age agriculturalists. Could have been worse
There are sword shops and pottery in every city and every village in the entire world though. Even the ones based on Polynesia and the Americas. Also I don't 'think they are depicted as agriculturalists. The only food production I see there is an animal being roasted over a fire.
@@FromNothing To be honest Africans could be depicted as everything from Stone Age hunter gatherers to living in castle Christians and it would be accurate (Ethiopia) A game with a city inspired by Benin would be great with palaces and bronze sculpture and plaques
Very disrespectful depictions which is so often typical of "African" inspired peoples in these games and cinema. No love nor respect is put in these games just stereotypical garbage which would acceptable if done to their cultures.
Hence why we have to represent ourselves we can't wait for Japan or Hollywood to do it they'll obviously do it wrong even if they don't mean to be disrespectful.
I can only guess but Kikombo reminds me of Kiswahili. The ki- suffix identifies languages, not places, but... maybe that's where they got the name from?
Very curious they're the only people called tribal since there's also a Polynesia and Oceania and they typically get a similar treatment. What do they have instead?
Jabari, you're giving Japanese media far too much credit. Their depictions of and research into Sub-Saharan African peoples, cultures, traditions, histories etc has been terrible for the most part. Just look at Soul Calibur 6 world map depiction.
Seeing depictions of us like this is not surprising. Honestly it's more silly than insulting in this case. At least we've got programmers and creators that make games featuring us in a dignified light. Thank you for this video.
Here's one thing. I don't think they are trying to "depict" anyone, it's literally just inspiration.
It's silly on purpose, it's a very adorable game with some heavy story.
The whole point of the divide between J-rpgs and C-rpgs is that one is fairly silly, fairly stylized, cutesy with a less table top like system, while the other is just gritty tabletop rpgs for computers.
You can't just say there are developers showing African civilisations in a good light and not give an example WTH
I think the lack of respect here is more of a reflection on hiw 1st world countries don't really see representing 3rd world countries' histories fairly as necessary, since we're all "primitives"...
As a south American, I haven't endured even half of what African and African descendants did, but I can still emphasize
Games featuring South Americans is either Aztecs sacrificing people like primative or mafia cartel styles. Most games are like this though but Japanese games are stereotypical based it’s not racism but more ignorance on the latter just look at street fighter for instance
You know you can do that?
We have an expression for that kind of mentality here in brazil.
This is why I'm keeping an eye on indie African, black British, Carribean and black American gaming and animation studios that are aiming to represent us better than this. Have you seen the teasers for the Dawn of Thunder Origin of Sango 3D film? It looks really good.
Sango is related to Xango?
Yep I've heard of it and I've mentioned it in my video about Shango.
@@Vlugazoide It's the same god.
@@Vlugazoide yes Xango is Shango aka Sango.
@@FromNothing Ye its close to being released now I'm just waiting for the trailer to drop.
Calling Golden Sun old hurts my soul but its true... Goddammit, I want a new one
Have you checked out the Africa expansion for Age of Empires 3 Definitive Edition?
I don't know how accurate it is, but it sure is fun and it seems like they really did their home work.
It is very new though. It's pretty sad that there are barely any old games that even attempted to portray any region of Africa, or were inspired by it.
Basically the only thing I remember was Magic the Gathering. There was a region of Dominaria which was 100% inspired by some African cultures (I don't know which), with Teferi as lead character.
0 AD has got the Kingdom of Kush and they are magnificent!
I think the name Kibombo sounds similar to the word "Quilombo", which were the villages maroons in South America (especially the jungles of Brazil) would establish after escaping slavery. The word would survive into Portuguese and some dialects of Spanish as a synonym for "a mess" or a very disorganized/untidy place or situation.
Have you ever played Civilization 6? It features Sub-Saharan African kingdoms, including Mali and Ethiopia.
I have not played it but I heard about that. Crusader Kings III also has African Civilizations.
Also Congo, Nubia (I know they are not technically sub-saharan), and the Zulu.
@@FromNothing There's also a movie called Mountains of the Moon from 1990, which features an African kingdom. The trailer is a little cringeworthy, though.
@@8ahau279 Nubia and Kongo are sub-saharan African civilisations, well technically, Nubia is a region, not a civilization, it is a region that had civilisations such as Kerma, Kush, Makuria, Alodia and Nobatia.
@@MichaelClayton64 Of course Kongo is Subsaharan African by any standard, I phrased ambiguously. "They" in my original comment referred to Nubia not to congo, but the way I wrote it, it can be read as including Kongo as well, although that was not theway intended it to sound like. I just ment strictly geographically speaking Nubia is not located south of the Sahara, but in the Sahara.
The only game that kind of tried to portray Africa. Can't believe that no one has tried to do something more accurate and presentable portrayal. For that we have to do it ourselves. Assasin’s creed Origin went a bit in the right direction.
Yup.bayak is awesome👍
Have you checked out the Africa expansion for Age of Empires 3 Definitive Edition?
I don't know how accurate it is, but it sure is fun and it seems like they really did their home work.
Having played that game I have a couple of gripes, especially because Aya and Bayek are the only people in this damn story that wear pants (muh historical accuracy), and that upsets me deeply xD
However, they do feature actual african weapons and shield designs, which is cool. Plus the architecture is absolutely stellar.
But let's be real, no Assassins Creed is ever going to be featured in "actual" African civilizations.
Egypt gets a pass because it is in the Mediterranean and has a lot of influence from Arab and European cultures alike, but to see a "true" and "pure" civilization of Africa, like Benin or Congo, is absolutely never going to happen.
At least in the foreseable future.
One might hope, that like me and others, people tire of the "medieval-european-inspired fantasy" and start branching out to Arabian themes, which will branch out to pure African.
PS: nothing wrong with medieval-european-inspired fantasy. I just want new things :)
Age of Empires 2 Africa edition seem alright too.
@@Nerobyrne Unfortunately I've never played that game. I'll check it out on UA-cam
Well... surely could've been better :(
Really liked to learn about the wooden columns though!
If you want a game that has decent african npcs look into Diablo 2 the Zakarim in the third act are biased off of subsaharian Africa. Also note the Paladin who is from Zakarim is black.
Catch me live at: www.twitch.tv/theempirefn
Will be live at 11am EST today for a Q&A (without gaming)
Also small correction at 2:18, Atekka does indeed have inhabitants in a city with architecture based on Mesoamerica.
I would love to see more videos like this. Like looking at JRPG’s or other games with some folks that have clear African influence or inspiration. You can review them and teach some folks about the real world cultures that are similar or ones you think would be a better choice for representing in the work. I’d love those videos.
I played Golden Sun a long time ago so you'd think I'd remember this but honestly I forgot almost everything about that game. I mostly remember the fun little puzzles and the isometric battles. I only got to play the 1st game which was technically only half the story so perhaps thats why I dont remember it as well. Anyway, I suppose me being the art guy I should be able to analyze that big statue but at the moment I'm drawing blanks :P oh well. The developers probably didnt do much research to begin with from what I can tell.
These villages were only in the second game.
@@FromNothing Oh that's why. Did you ever play the DS sequel? Not sure if its as good as the older GBA games but it might be fun too. The studio who made the Golden Sun series mostly just makes Mario Tennis and Mario Golf games now lol. A waste of their talents but ofcourse Mario games sell like crazy so yep. I know tons of random videogame trivia. Before Golden Sun they were involved in making a tactical RPG series for Sega called the Shining series. I don't think theres any African stuff in the Shining series but then again I only played Shining Wisdom and not any of the other Shining games.
@@redspiritmask Yes I played the full trilogy and yeah I'm also aware of the history of the company and it's current ventures. It's current wasted ventures.... :(
These names are very Bantu-like. Prebasal Plosives ( like mb, nt) and open cyllables.
Perhaps "Kibombo" is a reference to the Kikongo ?
Great video. I still need to finish that game. I got to the point where I could sail around the world but got distracted with other games. Great at explaining the game and describing it without revealing any major spoilers.
As for the livestreams I personally not a fan of them and rarely do I have time to sit down and listen to them at the exact time you (or any other) stream them. I do hope your live stream takes off as the topics I see look really interesting.
I believe they were trying to say kilombo! An african fort-camp that was most popular in Angola especially the Imbangala Mercenaries!
I'd love to see a list of the depictions of Africa or african adjacent cultures in videogames...but I have a feeling that'd be a very short list
Can you make a video about African clothing before Islam and colonization
This
Good one.
What does that mean before Islam?
@@tyronechillifoot5573 No influence from Islam no Arabs no Berbers just no influence from them
@@tyronechillifoot5573 Well friend, much like Central and Western Europeans' culture was largely and tremendously erased by the Roman conquest, a lot of African culture was erased by Islamic conquest as well.
With Black Panther being the first big blockbuster movie with a big afro-futurist bent we might end up getting more African fantasy in the future.
So far no considering Hollywood still sees black people as a financial risk
@@tyronechillifoot5573 there have been a few African fantasy novel movie and TV show adaptations announced but, until I see them myself i won't believe it.
I'm thinking the same. I hope so.
@@tyronechillifoot5573 Blame Disney for that
@@GlareBoxTV How
Good imagery
It's great to see people talking about the representation in golden sun, I know it's not always good but it's good to see them trying,
I'd love to see a sequel that has a character from there as a main chatacter
That ain’t “trying”.😂
i love the golden sun games. they definitely have a very japanese form of racism and xenophobia baked in though. :/
It is a reflection on the ignorance of Sub Saharan Africa not only in North America and Europe but in Asia too.
I thought it wasn’t that bad of a depiction. In Africa there are small villages and this village has shops and iron working (see the shop with the sword and potion). They have things like pottery and have the giant wood carvings. They are clearly depicted as Iron Age agriculturalists. Could have been worse
There are sword shops and pottery in every city and every village in the entire world though. Even the ones based on Polynesia and the Americas. Also I don't 'think they are depicted as agriculturalists. The only food production I see there is an animal being roasted over a fire.
@@FromNothing To be honest Africans could be depicted as everything from Stone Age hunter gatherers to living in castle Christians and it would be accurate (Ethiopia)
A game with a city inspired by Benin would be great with palaces and bronze sculpture and plaques
@@markthorn9482 Yes there is alot of diversity but the fact that they they are the only "tribal" people in literally the entire world bothers me.
@@FromNothing what do you think of Africans who still practice tribal traditions. Should they be brought into the 21 century or left alone?
@@soda8736 brought forcibly into the 20th century, it’s guys like that who give us all a bad name and why we are still depicted in a negative light
Very disrespectful depictions which is so often typical of "African" inspired peoples in these games and cinema. No love nor respect is put in these games just stereotypical garbage which would acceptable if done to their cultures.
Hence why we have to represent ourselves we can't wait for Japan or Hollywood to do it they'll obviously do it wrong even if they don't mean to be disrespectful.
@@admirekashiri9879 exactly
A lot of the world's perception of us comes from old American media, which exported many stereotypes into various world cultures.
I can only guess but Kikombo reminds me of Kiswahili. The ki- suffix identifies languages, not places, but... maybe that's where they got the name from?
Intresting but the view of africa will change with time.
That statue at 10:45 - uhhhhhh
So... not at all. Like most of golden sun.
It's literally just a stylistic choice.
Good game, though.
i love this video.
Very good
Wow, forgot about the African-inspired locations
Very curious they're the only people called tribal since there's also a Polynesia and Oceania and they typically get a similar treatment. What do they have instead?
I don't think any outsiders mentioned them at all.
Could be worse look at Resident Evil 5.😂
👍🏿🤠👍🏿
YO WHATUP, WE WUZ JAPANESE TOO MAYNE?
Jabari, you're giving Japanese media far too much credit. Their depictions of and research into Sub-Saharan African peoples, cultures, traditions, histories etc has been terrible for the most part. Just look at Soul Calibur 6 world map depiction.