Speaking following a fairly lengthy bus driving career, there should be several 'safety measures' in place. Firstly, NO double deckers should be allocated to Route 197. Secondly, if the Controller has no choice but to put a decker onto that route, he/she should only give that Duty to a 197 experienced driver and they should also remind the driver of the low bridge and remind the driver that they MUST take a right turn immediately before the low bridge. And thirdly, on the Duty Card there should be a note (in capitals and bold print) at the timing point/bus stop prior to the low bridge that they are now approaching the low bridge and so the driver must turn right. I believe if any of these measures were introduced by Stagecoach or any other bus operating company, then the chances of a 'bus strike' would be eradicated. Keep up the good work Len - and say 'hi' to JH in Control for me - thanks.....
The 197 has been double deckers since it's introduction so downgrading it to single deckers would cause a stir. It's also a pretty long trunk route. A simpler solution would be to swap It's routing with the 410 between Addiscombe and Norwood junction. Therefore it would still serve roughly the same area while not going anywhere near the bridge.
Hitting a bridge is the worst fear you can have driving a decker, it can be easy to forget the top bit if you’re not switched on. I think what contributes to that bridge being hit so many times is as you said the turn you’re meant to take is right on the bridge which leaves the driver zero room for error. We’ve all missed a turn and as soon as we have that’s woke us up cause now we’ve got to get back on route however there you miss the turn and boom you’ve hit the bridge. Hope the driver is ok.
The traffic there also seems quite terrible, or at least it usually is when I pass it. Part of me wonders whether there isn't any illuminating signs because of the bus route itself (and so it would be activating quite frequently, rather than most examples where it's quite rare to see them activating). On a somewhat related note, I'd like to moan about certain vehicles/companies who have/place their vehicle's height and width *behind* the driver, on a board you can barely read safely while moving, which isn't helpful especially when moving at a decent speed...
Driving an articulated lorry with a 15'9" trailer concentrates the mind! I have been doing deliveries on that road for a good few decades now and have seen some very close calls when it comes to making contact with that bridge, what I have seen is quite a few rear end shunts when the over-height vehicles have come to a sudden stop !
I thoroughly enjoy watching your videos. As a Londoner, now living in Skegness, your videos also bring back memories of my time living in Thamesmead but working in Lewisham and Catford. I hope one day you will be able to make Bus Driver POV videos. But your videos show that there is a great deal more to driving a bus, all the paperwork etc.
Getting correct and adequate signage would be a start before any electronic warning system. Signs around the area are small or incorrect according to the Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions.
I think the issue can be solved by stopping double deckers from using Portland Road altogether. Now Go Ahead could just put SD's instead of DD's on the 197 but it's quite a busy and long route so that would now go down well with passengers at all. So I would suggest swapping the 197 and 410 routing between Addiscombe and Norwood Junction so that the DD's on the 197 don't even go near the bridge while still serving Norwood Junction.
Either way is it not a legal requirement to clearly sign any bridge that is in lower than 5m in height? Perhaps they could consider something similar to train with a warning alarm in the cab when approaching a low bridge to alert the driver of the danger.
We have low bride alert on the buses, some dont work though. but I think they will check if this bus alert system was working correctly. Thanks for info
If over height vehicle hits the bridge now, surely the council are partly responsible for not sign posting it? Standard height of a bridge is 16ft 6” If it is dark you wouldn’t be able to tell now low the bridge is.
When you mentioned Croydon Council putting up signs, that is the broke council! I am not a bus driver, though I have friends who are, plus one who works with and knows you. I wonder if the driver has been working on single deckers, and like you said, forgot he was in a double decker? As you said, some drivers go into automatic mode! Network rail must have some part to play since a bridge strike can affect the train services!
Flashing signs may deter some drivers, but not all - the infamous 11'8" bridge in Durham, NC, had traffic lights and an electronic sign that lit up if sensors determined the vehicle approaching was too low, but still regularly got hit. It's since been raised to 12'4" as a result of railway reprofiling, but still gets the occasional hit... As for the missing sign on the one side, I wonder how long ago that side was last struck? It wouldn't surprise me if the local council are reactive rather than proactive, so only order a new sign once the previous one's been hit and damaged, rather than having a spare sign or two in stock ready to replace asap.
I can only think that the drivers mind was elsewhere at the time but there can be no excuse for hitting a clearly signposted low bridge. The sign must have got knocked off in the incident but it should have been replaced by now. The low bridges at Shortlands and at Tulse Hill have electronic warning signs but still get hit regularly by overheight vehicles.
Driving in London is very Stressful looking at different things I can see how this could happen. It's About time they had a good Warning light before the bridgeTelling you , you're over height Not that difficult to install considering.How many cameras are Being put up around london. Especially with health and safety risk assessments need to be looked at again for that bridge.
I think the sign was knocked off because if you go to google maps it shows a sign 3 months ago also that yellow and black stripes have not been replaced since 2008
Speaking following a fairly lengthy bus driving career, there should be several 'safety measures' in place. Firstly, NO double deckers should be allocated to Route 197. Secondly, if the Controller has no choice but to put a decker onto that route, he/she should only give that Duty to a 197 experienced driver and they should also remind the driver of the low bridge and remind the driver that they MUST take a right turn immediately before the low bridge. And thirdly, on the Duty Card there should be a note (in capitals and bold print) at the timing point/bus stop prior to the low bridge that they are now approaching the low bridge and so the driver must turn right. I believe if any of these measures were introduced by Stagecoach or any other bus operating company, then the chances of a 'bus strike' would be eradicated. Keep up the good work Len - and say 'hi' to JH in Control for me - thanks.....
The 197 has been double deckers since it's introduction so downgrading it to single deckers would cause a stir. It's also a pretty long trunk route. A simpler solution would be to swap It's routing with the 410 between Addiscombe and Norwood junction. Therefore it would still serve roughly the same area while not going anywhere near the bridge.
Hitting a bridge is the worst fear you can have driving a decker, it can be easy to forget the top bit if you’re not switched on. I think what contributes to that bridge being hit so many times is as you said the turn you’re meant to take is right on the bridge which leaves the driver zero room for error.
We’ve all missed a turn and as soon as we have that’s woke us up cause now we’ve got to get back on route however there you miss the turn and boom you’ve hit the bridge.
Hope the driver is ok.
What you say is right, no room for error
The traffic there also seems quite terrible, or at least it usually is when I pass it.
Part of me wonders whether there isn't any illuminating signs because of the bus route itself (and so it would be activating quite frequently, rather than most examples where it's quite rare to see them activating).
On a somewhat related note, I'd like to moan about certain vehicles/companies who have/place their vehicle's height and width *behind* the driver, on a board you can barely read safely while moving, which isn't helpful especially when moving at a decent speed...
Driving an articulated lorry with a 15'9" trailer concentrates the mind!
I have been doing deliveries on that road for a good few decades now and have seen some very close calls when it comes to making contact with that bridge, what I have seen is quite a few rear end shunts when the over-height vehicles have come to a sudden stop !
wow
I thoroughly enjoy watching your videos. As a Londoner, now living in Skegness, your videos also bring back memories of my time living in Thamesmead but working in Lewisham and Catford.
I hope one day you will be able to make Bus Driver POV videos. But your videos show that there is a great deal more to driving a bus, all the paperwork etc.
@@Gazza1912 Thanks and I will endeavour to try and get permission for pov videos or I will work out something. Thanks for watching videos
Getting correct and adequate signage would be a start before any electronic warning system. Signs around the area are small or incorrect according to the Traffic Signs Regulations and General Directions.
I think the issue can be solved by stopping double deckers from using Portland Road altogether. Now Go Ahead could just put SD's instead of DD's on the 197 but it's quite a busy and long route so that would now go down well with passengers at all. So I would suggest swapping the 197 and 410 routing between Addiscombe and Norwood Junction so that the DD's on the 197 don't even go near the bridge while still serving Norwood Junction.
Guessing the drivers of both 197's ended up sacked mainly for writing off a company vechile. And obviously putting passengers safety at risk!
Far as I know, it’s usually dismissal
Thought so, good pov on the bridge though enjoyed watching!
@@thatbusdriverguy4182resign and next week drive for another company.
Either way is it not a legal requirement to clearly sign any bridge that is in lower than 5m in height? Perhaps they could consider something similar to train with a warning alarm in the cab when approaching a low bridge to alert the driver of the danger.
We have low bride alert on the buses, some dont work though. but I think they will check if this bus alert system was working correctly. Thanks for info
@ start my driver training next month. Thanks for the reply.
If over height vehicle hits the bridge now, surely the council are partly responsible for not sign posting it? Standard height of a bridge is 16ft 6” If it is dark you wouldn’t be able to tell now low the bridge is.
When you mentioned Croydon Council putting up signs, that is the broke council! I am not a bus driver, though I have friends who are, plus one who works with and knows you. I wonder if the driver has been working on single deckers, and like you said, forgot he was in a double decker? As you said, some drivers go into automatic mode! Network rail must have some part to play since a bridge strike can affect the train services!
Flashing signs may deter some drivers, but not all - the infamous 11'8" bridge in Durham, NC, had traffic lights and an electronic sign that lit up if sensors determined the vehicle approaching was too low, but still regularly got hit. It's since been raised to 12'4" as a result of railway reprofiling, but still gets the occasional hit...
As for the missing sign on the one side, I wonder how long ago that side was last struck? It wouldn't surprise me if the local council are reactive rather than proactive, so only order a new sign once the previous one's been hit and damaged, rather than having a spare sign or two in stock ready to replace asap.
Wow thanks for that info
UA-cam is amazing I didnt even know about that Bridge, just took a look totally blow away. Thanks again
Legally the height should be there so Croydon Council are in the wrong
I can only think that the drivers mind was elsewhere at the time but there can be no excuse for hitting a clearly signposted low bridge. The sign must have got knocked off in the incident but it should have been replaced by now. The low bridges at Shortlands and at Tulse Hill have electronic warning signs but still get hit regularly by overheight vehicles.
Driving in London is very Stressful looking at different things I can see how this could happen. It's About time they had a good Warning light before the bridgeTelling you , you're over height Not that difficult to install considering.How many cameras are Being put
up around london. Especially with health and safety risk assessments need to be looked at again for that bridge.
It’s because those 197 drivers are careless.I’ve seen those Go-ahead London drive fast as well
@jaymarlon7460 I do see some real bad driving sometimes, some ppl not serious when driving
I think the sign was knocked off because if you go to google maps it shows a sign 3 months ago also that yellow and black stripes have not been replaced since 2008
Yeah I thought so, strange they didn’t replace its. Over a month now.
By law the bridge should have the bridge hight sign ?
SURELY there should be a system that DOES NOT allocate a Double Decker to ANY Rail Replacement bus on that route?
Totally unworkable
Reroute the bus via Spring Lane & A222 (Beckenham Roundabout) it's embarrassing what will it take to change the route?