Are Catholic Churches Really Prettier?
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- Опубліковано 3 жов 2024
- Thrsdy shows Matt a video that is targeted at protestants for having ugly Churches. Matt and Thrsdy talk about the issue with Catholic Triumphalism.
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Renovating our large chapel at the school where I work. It's going to be handsome and packed with symbolism!
That's great 👍 I hope it goes well, Lord willing 🙏 😊
A Protestant who came to Mass with me in our little country timber church said afterwards ‘there is something there that you have’. This something was the presence of Christ in the Eucharist which isn’t in their churches. When I went discerning with God about which denomination I should belong to - I was surprised by how empty their churches felt. It hits me now whenever I enter a Protestant church. The Presence is real and we absolutely should appreciate it no matter what the church building is like!
Well stated! ♡
I grew up devoutly Southern Baptist. They believe Christ abandoned the Church; that he was with them always, even until the end of the day.
As a lifelong Protestant who joined the Catholic Church on Easter Vigil 2024, I have seen some Catholic Churches as "ugly" as a Protestant church, but I've never seen a Protestant church as beautiful as even an averagely beautiful Catholic Church. I'm the "enthusiastic convert", so take that for whatever it's worth.
'Fresh legs' win...welcome home. ♡
Trinity Lutheran Church
St Pauls Cathedral
@etheretherether I'm not sure what trinity lutheran church you're referring to, but St Paul's is just a reconstruction of a catholic church that the anglicans stole, like most of the best protestant churches.
@@Ragnarthecat Trinity is in Detroit, it was built be Lutherans.
By that logic many beautiful Catholic churches where built by the Orthodox. But you and I both know that's not how schisms work ;)
The Catholic Church should have skipped building churches in the 1970s.
Look man, it was the 70s, they experimented.
It's the same with music. Every time I hear a song that sounds like it just doesn't belong in the Catholic Mass I look for the date it was published in the hymnal, it's almost always from the 70's.
As a german, I 100% agree. It`s crazy what ugly churches we still have today from that era, just google "Mariendom Neviges", you will likely get nightmares.
@@gordo608’60’s too, and into the ‘80’s.
@@jimferris9447I mean the NO was only promulgated at the end of the 60s so I think it’s fine
When I converted, I felt so angry at being robbed of my heritage, and once more when I discovered the Latin Mass.
As a Protestant to Catholic convert, I find myself seeing that Catholic triumphalism in some of my interactions but usually coming from a sentiment of “No you don’t understand what you’re missing out on and have been deprived of all your life.” It’s hard seeing family not care about their faith when I’ve been so graced by God to be welcomed into the fullness of His Church.
We can be proud of our churches because churches were built to praise God .
We don't deserve beautiful churches. But God does. The tabernacle does. Why would we ever build a tabernacle out of anything besides solid gold when we truly understand what is being housed
This. And protestantism is a beacon of perdition for the souls, and with a perfect hatred it shall be hated. I have zero shame of exalting the Alliance and Pathway God Himself has let us with His Own Blood, for our Salvation, and on the contrary, how much holy indignation must the protestant demons raise, when they are set to destroy the Name of the Lord and of His Family by their unholy, profane and macabre presumption.
I don't make fun of Protestants, but if they make fun of the Catholic faith, i make fun of their doctrines and churches.
Thrusday is so efficient with his time he can get 40 hours out of his day. Well done. A true Ling Ling prodigy.
Ling Ling! 😂🎻🎻
I came here to make this comment but see you beat me to it! 🤣 Thrsdy, the Ling Ling of producers!
@@doateacher6492 Is his name really spelt "Thrsdy"? His parents hated vowels or something?😅
@@mofumofutenngoku IDK but that's how it's spelled in the description 🤷♀
His name isn't actually Thursday, it's a nickname alluding to Chesterton's The Man Who Was Thursday 😊
The methodist church I grew up in was gorgeous. My current parish isn't ugly but it's nothing outstanding. I'm here for the Eucharist. If I only cared about going to church in a beautiful building, I would not have chosen my local Catholic church.
Methodist here. The church I've attended all my life was built in 1837. A Catholic friend of mine has mentioned on several occasions how much prettier my church is than his 1970's-era Catholic church (that's admittedly a low bar, but my point stands, lol).
Can Thursday be a guest on the show for a three hour episode? Let’s hear his story!
Reverting to Catholicism feels like being introduced to a heritage that had been cruelly denied beforehand.
My parish church is absolutely gorgeous. And so are most of the Catholic Churches in our town. I’ve also noticed a lot of churches are getting upgrades - the town my husband went to college in has had 3 churches renovate in the last decade and they’re beautiful!
A thing I've noticed, looking at churches, and secular buildings. It seems you can tell when the people who built it believed in the living God, and when people who built it believed in nothing, or the metaphorical god. Nobody dedicates 20 years into hand carving an outstandingly beautiful wooden pillar if they think God is a metaphor, or utterly deny existence.
Many old secular buildings built by true believers generate the same atmosphere as the religious buildings from the same era.
Martin Luther would not have agreed with the "church" in the
end of the tik tok clip. Tourists visiting churches I've been working in have asked whether it was a Catholic or protestant church, when the church was built 400 years after the reformation in my Lutheran country.
I'm certainly not someone who lets bishops get away with things. Given that I'm in Germany and the majority of my bishops are currently setting up a second hierarchy. But many outside of Europe don't understand how much the two world wars and the constant battle of ideologies have shattered the faith.
That was no accident, that was political design. And the USA, as the victorious power after WW2, went along with it.
You can't imagine how much propaganda was spread through state schools, universities, and state-controlled media in post-war Europe. And no, there was no opt-out.
I think you're missing the point. I've been to humble Catholic churches as well as her cathedrals for Masses. They all have the holy water fonts at the entrance. They all have the altar of sacrifice. Beside the altar is the Christ Candle. They all have a room for confession. The walls are adorned with the Stations of the Cross. And I always spot the light telling me that the Eucharist is present. And ever church contains rows and rows of candles flickering the requests of the prayers of the faithful. How much beauty do you want?
The hotdog song cracked me up. 😂🤣😅
I go to a NO church and it is basically a Protestant church in looks. Basically it’s an episcopal church design wise. Aka plain and meh
Christians of the world must unite.
There’s a Protestant church literally inside a mall near me. I guess one good thing about that is that maybe someone goes shopping and accidentally hears about Christ and converts 🤷♂️. But still seems very strange.
I do have to say, I think we Catholics have at times overplayed our hands on this one. A lot of Catholics will argue that we're better and more traditional because our churches are more beautiful, our music is better, our liturgies are richer, etc. And I do think that, on average, those things are probably true. But at the same time, many of the original Protestant groups (Lutheran, Anglican, Reformed) do have these things as well. Thus people like Redeemed Zoomer are able to pass portions of Protestantism off as traditional.
As Catholics, we should press the kinds of traditions that really matter. The things that the Protestants can't copy. Because pretty churches can be built by anyone. But apostolic succession? Sacred Tradition? The traditional Seven Sacraments? These are traditions that matter much more than superficial beauty of architecture, music, or even liturgy. And they are things one must leave Protestantism to find.
1:55 Great point about lack of attendance at Mass akin to the Jews losing the holy land. In Jeremiah it actually says, if all you'd done was keep the Sabbath, you would not have gone into exile (and lost the temple).
And then also there are several Lutheran, Presbyterian, Anglican and even Baptist Churches that are pretty gorgeous , they'd be even more gorgeous if the truth was proclaimed and had a few more stained glass depictions, instead of just stained glass, but they are still obviously gorgeous and traditional
I have a few Catholic churches near me, but I drive farther than I have to specifically so I can go to mass in one of the few Gothic revival churches in the US.
This seems more defeatist than humble or undeserving. Ecumenism must be the future because what’s the point of having a Catholic apologist positions if we don’t deserve it and it’s triumphalist.
Triumphalism isn't what you think it is, therefore it doesn't have the effect you think it does. It's arrogant, neither is it Christ-centred, and no one is going to listen to that.
It doesn't mean we shouldn't be firm, it simply means that we ought to remember that CHRIST is the one that wins hearts, and we are merely his instruments.
I think the lack of beautiful church buildings is a more recent development of the times then specific to a denomination can’t speak for all but there are many Protestant denominations with many outstanding beautiful church buildings. Generally they are old not brand new buildings.
So the rule not the exception is...yes. Catholic churches are prettier.
There is nothing wrong with saying that. The church sponsored many of the works of art throughout Europe that people still visit today.
San Diego lowkey has really beautiful Catholic Churches
Fr. Andrew Stephen Damick covered this from the Orthodox pov as well. The "orthobro" triumphalism leaves little room for mission work, where sometimes the church IS in a strip mall, and sometimes the iconostasis is little more than cubicle partitions.
I remember reading an article about the terrible architecture of churches now. It made sense, especially when it seemed everyone was raving about the 'new' Cathedral in Los Angeles. I called it 'the Bunker'.
Thursday is SO CUTE UwU oWO
Should have been Zwingli in that meme
I agree completely with what you say in the video. Especially when a lot of the traditionally minded people, like myself, are so upset with how many churches have been constructed after the Council. Blah blah, it’s not the councils fault etc. etc.
That said, I prefer the beauty of the prettiest Catholic churches as compared to the beauty of the most pretty Protestant or Orthodox churches. Perhaps it’s bias or more appreciation for the theology which informs architectural decisions, but that’s how it is.
In my hometown, the most beautiful church in the whole city is what was once a Catholic Church. Now it's a wedding venue, because the parish sold the building and built a new modernist monstrosity that looks nothing like a church. Now, of the church buildings that remain, the most beautiful are most certainly the old mainline churches that are emptying out. Now the big churches are the ugly Catholic church and two baptist mega churches. These three buildings are each less than 50 years old, and none of them are beautiful.
Triumphalism is not a form of mocking others!
Triumphalism occurs when some great Catholic achievement is made.
For example if your parish builds the only beautiful church in the area, you'll be very exited and proud, and that we call triumphalism. You can additionally have feelings about the other churches, but that's outside the scope.
I really don't care what a church looks like. But then, I see beauty in the old and the new. Many post war churches were already abandoned within 20 years after being built, but even in modernism there was beauty to be found in these new buildings (even in new brutalism). Also we have come to a point that it is costly to renovate the historic buildings and keeping them warm in winter time, and some parishes would have benefitted from the modern buildings. I think it was wrong to have focussed on closing down the new. I am pragmatic in this regard. I get that some people are drawn to a certain aesthetic and ornamental beauty, but not all people care. The more modern churches that are left, in fact, many times have more church goers than the old churches. I can't explain it, but it's not always the case that people are that drawn to this idea of beauty some believe these older buildings hold. And sometimes I even think too much focus on beauty and form makes the soul wander away from the essence. Sure, aestheticism always plays a role, just don't make it a personal obsession for worship. Every church I step into is a place of beauty.
I get what y'all are saying about converts. I'm a new convert myself and am ... quite triumphalistic. ROME LATIN THE POPE THE COUNCILS THE FAITH THE MASS THE TEACHING THE SAINTS THE CHURCHES GLORY TO GOD you know that kind of thing. Lately though I've started to realize that things aren't so sun-shiny as I originally thought them to be.
Sun-shiny or not, it's the one true church instituted by Jesus Himself, so please don't let our stupidity affect your relationship with Jesus.
I love how this person who made this TikTok completely misunderstood Martin Luther. Luther kept pretty churches and icons
Basically if your priest is facing you during Mass, there is a good chance your church looks like the inside of an Applebee's but with a tabernacle that has been shoved into a broom closet next to the restroom.
Not really. I been to older churches like 1700s mission, late 1800s to early 1900s churches and even those churches have Norvus Ordo masses
Yes
Not in my town.
The Catholic Church across the road from my 150 year old Anglican church looks like a daycare. I mean the Anglican church is empty, and the Catholic one is a crappy school building with a round nave because they outgrew the frame building that's now Heavenly Hair
Depends, my Catholic Church is basic
Nobody else heard that fart at 1:48?
That was a cough
Unfortunately the TikTok videos get Luther so wrong. Theological differences aside, German Lutheran churches and even historic American Lutheran Churches look splendid and gothic. The Reformed (calvinist) destroyed traditional churches with anti-image theology. The splendid beauty and statutes of churches were almost lost because of their misunderstanding of the Commandments. Please blame the Reformed and not the Lutherans.
That's right.
The reformed calvinistic and zwinglianic followers went around, plundering Catholic Churches, selling the treasures and burning the paintings.
It was called 'Bildersturm'.
My own Church in Switzerland got plundered twice, once during the reformation and once during the napoleonic wars.
But at least the Church is still there, there has been a Church on that spot for 1600years
3:26 Look I bet this comment won't get pinned or liked, reply and I'll do absolutely NOTHING.
Why doesn't Thursday say his real name? It feels weird...
No u.
As a Protestant, i don't spend my time judging the Catholic church. I focus on eveangelizing atheists, Muslims, Jews and everyone who hasn't encountered Jesus yet. You Catholics have! I am really trying to give grace to you and understand why you focus so much on Christian differences, when we should all be focusing on bringing people to Christ. I don't like this superior attitude that Catholics have. Even if you had ind3ed 100% pure doctrine, it would be by the grace of God, so still no justification in this attitude
You evangelize them to what? To whatever is in your head? Or in your uncle's church head? Where the Dove lies, there are the Children of God. You hate the Sacraments and the Communion of the Saints and dare attribute that to the Holy Spirit? Get in the boat or get devoured in the waters of the World, first by your pride, then by the demons.
@deussacracommunioest2108 i am genuine with my question and indignation. There's no need to insult me. This is exactly the condescending attitude i was talking about..