The Death and Life of Edith Keeler | Star Trek TOS 1x28

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  • Опубліковано 3 лис 2024

КОМЕНТАРІ • 68

  • @corybanter
    @corybanter 9 місяців тому +13

    Y'know, people make fun of Shatner's acting, but he's pretty amazing in this episode (and pretty much all of TOS).

  • @alangil40
    @alangil40 2 роки тому +16

    "A lie is a poor way to say hello." Great first line from Edith (almost first).

  • @charleyg313
    @charleyg313 3 роки тому +24

    I’M NOT CRYING, YOU’VE JUST MADE THE HEAVENS WEEP THAT’S WHY MY FACE IS WET
    This is very very good.

  • @circuitsandparts
    @circuitsandparts Рік тому +5

    My most favorite episode of Star Trek ever. It alone was true art.

  • @Goremaid
    @Goremaid 2 роки тому +20

    I love Edith so much, and it’s wonderful to see her appreciated for more than just “she knows the boys are in love with each other”

    • @RenTheBarbarian
      @RenTheBarbarian  2 роки тому +6

      Believe me, Kirk/Spock is getting its own dedicated video 😏

    • @joeboxter3635
      @joeboxter3635 2 роки тому

      This is the best ST episode. Yes, it is not quintennial ST, no that has to go to "A Balance of Terror," it is Sci-Fi at its very best. City shall live well beyond Star Trek as a timeless literature.

    • @staticfolk9302
      @staticfolk9302 Рік тому

      There is such a cool feeling generated by the Guardian of Forever. I love the hard core feel they get from staring into the strange wind sound and seeing the Guardian.

    • @cindychristian1700
      @cindychristian1700 Рік тому

      This was close to being my favorite episode. Along with the one with Captain Pike and when Spock fell in love with Sara Beth!😊

  • @jamesdietz29
    @jamesdietz29 Рік тому +4

    The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one... therefore Edith Keeler must die.
    Logic, sometimes it sucks.

  • @LordGreystoke
    @LordGreystoke 10 місяців тому +3

    Ren, Kirk did not cause Edith’s death. She was allowed to die in accordance with how she was meant to die. History’s job is to record what actually happened. It does not pick winners and losers in the game of life. Never forget that.

  • @sara_sah-raezzat5086
    @sara_sah-raezzat5086 3 роки тому +8

    Beautiful work Ren.

  • @TurtleTrackin
    @TurtleTrackin 2 роки тому +7

    The fear of "imminent destruction" is something children of the Cold War lived with every day. At its conclusion, in the 1990s, it was soon replaced by environmental paranoia (in 1990, they were telling us we only had ten years left to save the world), fears of Islamic Fundamentalism (many have forgotten the first World Trade Center bombing in the 1990s) and the era of Tim McVeigh.
    Things are "different now," or are they?
    “I wish it need not have happened in my time," said Frodo. "So do I," said Gandalf, "and so do all who live to see such times. But that is not for them to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us.”

  • @rumrstv
    @rumrstv Рік тому +1

    Edge of the City of Tomorrow. The most haunting of any episode on TV ever! I saw it in it's original broadcast. It always stuck with me.

  • @Iron-Bridge
    @Iron-Bridge 6 місяців тому +1

    Great review. This was before my time but I'm glad there are quality reviews and critiques like yours.
    "History doesn't repeat itself. It rhymes. "

  • @clearsmashdrop5829
    @clearsmashdrop5829 Рік тому +5

    I must have seen this episode a dozen times. It never went click for me that the guy who killed himself with the phaser was the same dude Kirk told to 'shuddup'.

    • @freshdugi
      @freshdugi 7 місяців тому

      And his premature death never altered the timeline. hmmm

  • @rohanmarkjay
    @rohanmarkjay Рік тому +2

    To me the reason why City on the edge of forever was so memorable is because of two main reasons. The excellent script by Harlan Ellison and the magnetic acting of Joan Collins her youth her beauty her magetic sex appeal in the late 1960s with her well spoken lady like English accent seperating her from the rest of the pack in the Star Trek franchise.

  • @tadimaggio
    @tadimaggio 2 роки тому +9

    Even though I've seen "The City On The Edge of Forever" at least a dozen times, I keep waiting for Kirk or Spock to suggest a solution to their dilemma that occurred to me when I saw it for the first time (at the ripe age of 12, when it was first broadcast). WHY DON'T THEY BRING EDITH BACK WITH THEM TO THE 23RD CENTURY? Her disappearance from 1930 would set the historical timeline right again, Kirk would be guilt-free for causing her death, and Edith would get to actually SEE the glorious future that she can only imagine in her own time. I guess the problem would have been that the network didn't want Kirk to have a permanent attachment (although there were any number of interesting plot lines that could have been derived from a 20th century woman trying to adjust to life three centuries in her future.) "Star Trek" might have done for Joan Collins what "Dynasty" was to do twenty years later.
    Also: the United States couldn't have been kept out of World War ll by ANY peace movement, no matter how successful or broad-based it might have been. We got into the Pacific war because the Japanese attacked us at Pearl Harbor, and the European war because Hitler declared war on us a few days later. Once someone attacks you or declares war, the decision to go to war is pretty much out of your hands.

    • @yamcha65
      @yamcha65 Рік тому +10

      there is no real mechanism to bring her back with them though is there? They return to their time automatically it seems once the past was made right as the guardian said would happen. They did not have any device or anything to return to the future with.

    • @ColleenCupido
      @ColleenCupido 8 місяців тому

      Exactly how does Kirk bring Edith back to the future with him??? And you really should know your history accurately before throwing stones. Their was a huge anti-war movement in USA prior to Pearl Harbor, complete with Nazi rally at Madison Square Garden. This Keep Us Out Of European War movement was spearheaded by Charles Lindbergh, the character James Stewart played in Spirit of Saint Louis, and whose Very young son was kidnapped and murdered. We easily could have been kept out of the war, until Hitler achieved his Heavy Water experiments, meaning atomic bomb

    • @tadimaggio
      @tadimaggio 7 місяців тому +1

      ​@ColleenCupido My statements about the US entry into World War ll were and are completely accurate. Hitler declared war on us; NOTHING could have kept us out of the war at that point. Much of the ostensibly anti-war sentiment at the time was in fact pro-Nazi feeling; many Americans admired Hitler, and fully agreed with his persecution of the Jews. Obviously Edith Keeler would never have been pro-Nazi; but the sad truth is that there are times when pacifism fits Spock's statement "She was right; but at the wrong time." One must always keep one eye cocked on the principle articulated by the Russian-American writer Tatyana Tolstaya: "When a man sees a wolf about to devour his child, he does not refrain from taking his gun down from the wall out of a concern over animal rights.
      And if he DOES refrain from taking down his gun for that reason, he is doing the wolf's work."

  • @mcarlkv53
    @mcarlkv53 6 місяців тому +2

    since joan collins and william shatner are still living in 2024 why dont they get together and make a fan episode about how now at 94 years old captain kirk goes back to the guardian of forever and be with edith one last time?

  • @victorpascali5983
    @victorpascali5983 Місяць тому

    Thank you for your review of this episode. Like most everyone else in the Star Trek Universe, it is one of my favorites. I wholeheartedly believe the changes made to the script were warranted. Obviously, Roddenberry, did not have the budget to create this city that Ellison wrote about as well as depicting pirates on the Enterprise also. While Harlan Ellison was a fantastic writer, I believe his depiction of Kirk is flawed. As a passionate Trekkie (Or Trekker), I saw snippets of the interview where Harlan Ellison wrote a script of a person who would do ANYTHING for love. I think casting Kirk in this episode not holding McCoy back and instead, Spock intervening would've really weakened his character. Captain Kirk is an intelligent man who understands the implications of letting her live and has a duty to perform. Again, Thank you for your review and also, your additional insights into current events as well!!

  • @Mark16v15
    @Mark16v15 Рік тому

    I loved Star Trek TOS as a young grade-school boy when it first televised, and this was one of my favorite episodes (along with "Naked Time", which also included time travel).
    But eventually ST got silly with time travel to where they could do it willie nillie, including somehow going too fast around the sun to create the phenomena. The plots really weren't about time travel, but using it as an obvious excuse to save money on sets outside the Enterprise, coincidentally all/most travelling back in time to around 1960s USA (or the 80s with the ST movies).
    When you see the absolute catastrophic damage that could be wrought by someone running into the donut hole of "The Guardian of Forever", that place made Talos IV look like a picnic park, and therefore should have had a permanent Starship presence guarding anyone from even getting close to that planet.
    Wouldn't it have made for a good episode if a plot included someone later going into that time donut, only to be the person who talked a worker into going to lunch with him rather than go up to the sixth floor of the Texas School Book Depository building right before Kennedy was shot? Or defending the place from those wanting to take advantage of the guardian by for example, buying low in the early 1920s, and selling high in September of 1929?

  • @anthony0358
    @anthony0358 3 роки тому +4

    Excellent job. This episode was one of their very best. Very good point about Edith’s story arc. I also thought it was interesting that lKirk begged her not to movie . I think he wanted to get Bones and go back through the portal. Not witnessing Edith’s death. I do regret this added to the plot device of time travel and alternative timelines which I am not a fan of

  • @garyperkovac1002
    @garyperkovac1002 2 роки тому +1

    Nice Review of a top-notch episode. I like the end of this review. The actual 30's depression and unrest are tied with events... right now.

  • @psgary6622
    @psgary6622 2 роки тому +2

    Only God knows how many Edith Keelers there have been in real-life who died or even murdered simply because they were too thrice-damned far ahead of their time.
    How much potential for positive contributions to humanity could they have made had they lived?
    Granted, Kirk did his duty as a Star Fleet Officer and put his devotion to duty ahead of himself and I know from first-hand hard-won, teeth-gritting, brow-knitting experience how often that is far easier accomplished than pronounced.
    not only the loss of the only real love Jim ever knew but also the loss of her potential to contribute to humanity hurt like the hell that he wanted to get up out of there.
    Would a short-story about how Uhura helps Kirk to find a way to save her sound interesting to you?

  • @emroden6670
    @emroden6670 Рік тому

    Love love LOVE the Buffy reference! Another show that keeps me hoping in dark times.

  • @markturner3872
    @markturner3872 Рік тому

    Excellent documentary on a very good episode of Star Trek… Good job

  • @maureencora1
    @maureencora1 Рік тому

    Captain Kirk Like the Norman Conners Song "you are my starship" or "Let's Get the Hell Outta Here."

  • @ColleenCupido
    @ColleenCupido 8 місяців тому

    Attention, here comes truth...the one error in this episode was in 1930, the real Clark Gable was still an unknown in Hollywood. Now...DC Fontana, Star Trek's best writer( D stood for Dorothy, my mom's name).... actually, it was Gene Roddenberry who rewrote Harlan Ellison's script. If we want to get into Philosophy, try Emmanuel Kant very strict moral code as to if Kirk should choose to preserve Edith. As for Edith walking out on a busy street, gosh, maybe she was emotionally preoccupied with Kirk and McCoy knowing each other. The biggie in this episode was Kirk falling in Love was integral to the plot, and not window dressing tacked on. In 1972 author David Ewen wrote the most brilliant book about Star Trek Unrevised. Posing questions such as who are Kirk or Spock going to fall in love with This week? Or, Who are we going to Almost Kill this week? Same logic against giving Marilyn or Tyrone Power decent acting roles, because box office money was #1

  • @davidrohde2636
    @davidrohde2636 Рік тому

    Star treks time travel is not like back to the future. The time travel is alternate timeline people can affect the current timeline and they never just disappear. The worst thing that can happen is what happens to Giorgio in Discovery

  • @arnaudlelievre70
    @arnaudlelievre70 Рік тому

    Edith Keeler's dreams and hopes will be preserved by Kirk, Spock and Doctor McCoy, for the Kithomer Accords.

  • @notmyrealname6150
    @notmyrealname6150 8 місяців тому

    "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the one."

  • @DamePesos
    @DamePesos Рік тому

    That fake "content warning" for Syringes! lol

  • @allanmakela3011
    @allanmakela3011 Рік тому

    Shows come,and go,over the years,this doesn,t,such strong writing,and characters

  • @racookster
    @racookster 3 роки тому +1

    Nicely done!

  • @juliefakkema
    @juliefakkema 6 місяців тому

    great job.

  • @CoolBreezeAnthony
    @CoolBreezeAnthony 2 роки тому

    Shared. This story makes me think about the spiritual aspect of our age.

  • @andrewwilliams9599
    @andrewwilliams9599 3 роки тому +4

    Probably just as well you skipped over the feud between Ellison and Roddenberry. It's been well-documented elsewhere, mainly by Harlan in Harlan Ellison's The City On the Edge of Forever published in 1996. As mentioned in the Wiki entry for this episode, "Ellison remarked afterwards when talking about the Hugo win for the filmed version of the script, 'I would like to be arrogant enough to think that the script was so good that even butchering it couldn't hurt it' and that compared to the other episodes of Star Trek it was 'a pretty good show.'"

    • @RenTheBarbarian
      @RenTheBarbarian  3 роки тому +7

      It reminds me of how Stephen King hates Kubrick’s Shining. No matter how divorced it is from the original work, it’s still a damn good piece of media.

  • @LordGreystoke
    @LordGreystoke 10 місяців тому

    Her fate is not chosen by Kirk. Her fate was already predestined. McCoy had gone back in time and changed what should have been the fate for Edith. Kirk corrected that.

    • @RenTheBarbarian
      @RenTheBarbarian  10 місяців тому +1

      What is fate? Who’s to say that fate didn’t decide for McCoy to go back in time and prevent her death? Why is Kirk’s timeline the correct timeline? Who decides that?

  • @rumrstv
    @rumrstv Рік тому

    You are too much! Thanks!

  • @JulioLeonFandinho
    @JulioLeonFandinho Рік тому

    the way I see it utilitarians are the opposite to the vulcan principle of "the needs of the many"...

  • @TheNeonRabbit
    @TheNeonRabbit 6 місяців тому

    Of course they could have just brought her with them to the future.

  • @wcg19891
    @wcg19891 Рік тому

    Honestly the premise didn’t make sense. We DID have a large peace movement and we’re completely against getting in WW2. Until Pearl Harbor.

  • @julianf.wheeler3665
    @julianf.wheeler3665 4 місяці тому

    Spock, in Depression-era New York City, 1930’s: …Edith Keeler must die.
    When applied to other eras:
    2022: Will Smith must slap Chris Rock.
    2016: Donald Trump must be elected President.
    2004: Janet Jackson must suffer a wardrobe malfunction.
    1997: Vice President Gore must try to dance to Latin music.
    1992: President Bush must vomit on Prime Minister Miyazawa.
    1991: Paul Reubens must get arrested for indecent exposure.
    1986: Wham must disband.
    1981: Microsoft, having worked with Seattle Computer Products (a business in Tukwila, WA) before and seeking an operating system they could modify for the IBM PC, must buy the rights to market the 86-DOS operating system to other manufacturers for US$ 25,000 for a steal from SCP, even though they will later pay $ 925,000 in an out-of-court settlement with them in 1986.
    1979: President Carter must drop out of that 6-mile race.
    1978: William Shatner must perform a spoken word cover of “Rocketman”
    1975: President Ford must fall down those airplane steps.

  • @russellcraddock3529
    @russellcraddock3529 Рік тому

    It would be a interesting twist in the story line to bring Edith back with Spock Kirk McCoy not having Edith to meet with FDR and other members who wanted the US to stay neutral in WW2 wouldn't have worked! Why? Because big business Military industrial complex and Eisenhower put it the 50*s would have found a way to get us into the war! Either by guilt of not helping a close aley doing the correct thing or forcing Japan to take messures of denying oil and exporting goods and services which we did plus highest tariffs possible on goods coming in from Japan! And Japan. Being stupid thinking that Americans. And america would just sit on THIER hands do nothing! Admiral Yamamoto warned Tojo don't get involved in by a delayed notification of the Pacific fleet at Pearl harbor! Went ahead with it anyway! Yamamoto THEN Said Japan will loose. ! Why? Because Japan had awaken a sleepy Lion and a very very very angry Lion !!! As for Hitler he had no choice neither Why? Because Japan had declared war by attacking the US first no formal notice and being in the axis side Hitler had to do it or loose face or being called a liar Japan doesn't take kindly to people or nations who don't do what they say or promise to do! Then it makes Japan government at that time. 1930*s and 4o *s. But would be interesting to see how Edith and Jim would match up. See how Edith would react to. The 23d century!

  • @normal_media
    @normal_media 11 місяців тому

    content warning. Shows things a video game has.

  • @EdieKeel
    @EdieKeel Рік тому

    So weird because my name is Edith Keel

  • @savethedeveloper
    @savethedeveloper 7 місяців тому

    11:30 it's fine, COVID is like the flu now

  • @newtonfine9790
    @newtonfine9790 3 роки тому

    Ren, thank you for that. Please find me somehow, so that we could continue “this” conversation....

  • @ThomasFrey-fv8yi
    @ThomasFrey-fv8yi Рік тому +4

    I watched a few of your episodes. I really like your critique here that is until you started spewing your personal political beliefs. Why do talented creators choose to alienate half their potential audience? Goodbye

    • @RenTheBarbarian
      @RenTheBarbarian  Рік тому +4

      Lmao bye

    • @crystalfairy912
      @crystalfairy912 Рік тому +2

      It’s not alienation. It’s a test of strength and you failed.

    • @michaelhall2709
      @michaelhall2709 Рік тому

      Goodnight, snowflake, goodnight.

    • @robertmartinjr.4537
      @robertmartinjr.4537 5 місяців тому

      Dude stop being so sensitive. The people that share your ideology cram sh*t on everybody daily non stop. You got the gall to act wounded. Man if you don't knock it off😂

  • @kibitznec700
    @kibitznec700 4 місяці тому

    Joan Collins was hot

  • @michaelsmyth3935
    @michaelsmyth3935 3 місяці тому

    Trigger warnings at the start of the show, how did I get so old?
    Kirk and relationships:
    Hedonism also comes into play as well. Kirk and Riker 🫛 🫛 in the pod.
    Should have seen the mud dragging coming. They could NOT tell her. Enough damage was already being done. Allowing an old dude's book to cloud up a simple plot point.
    .....and now it is all about...
    Stayed too long, seems I'm always disappointed when I stay too long.
    I come from the first generation that has virtually no shot at ever being able to retire or own anything. So what? Does it depress me? Grew up in the mid 70s, a societal hell scape compared to today.
    Just keep trying to make it better, be kind, worry and anxiety are energy wasters.
    Live, Love, ....be Kind.