It's Over
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- Опубліковано 1 чер 2024
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It pains us so much to say this: Liquid will not be at the first CS2 major.
In a battle for the final spot at the Americas RMR, TL unceremoniously fell to Complexity.
The question is: how did these two of the best teams find themselves in sudden death against each other? And did they get screwed over?
Written & Hosted by: Devil Coull (@Fake_DevinCoull)
Edited by: Sebastien Martin-Schultz (@sebdot)
Produced by: Danny Burke (@lurkeyburke)
All footage courtesy of: pastebin.com/FnrDcEER
Music used under license from Associated Production Music LLC (”APM”).
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if elige says the bracket was bad. I'm gunna just have to agree!
You'd better not lock that doccumentary behind a paywall.
NA CS and disappointment. Name a better duo
EU CS and appointment
NA cs and the airport
NA LOL and the airport
NA LOL/DotA and disappointment
Talking about NA like Liquid doesn't only have 2 players actually from NA
4:18 The rule is, if benefits big team (or my team) is good but if benefits small teams (or the teams and I don't like) is bad.
The argument in the video is kind of ridiculous. All teams knew about the format and the format is there exactly to open some room for other teams to get through, else Copenhagen would just have been a ranking-based invitational.
Sorry, but losing two matches and then pretty much saying most of those who got through are trash compared to you is just being a bitter loser
@@Labotohs no, it's not being a bitter loser, Legacy qualified by beating Nouns, MIBR, M80 and losing to Pain, Pain qualified by beating Legacy, Red Canids, ODDIK and losing to Imperial, whereas Liquid got to face both Furia and Complexity, both of the strongest teams in the RMR. This means that Pain and Legacy strongest rival was Imperial and MIBR respectively, but Liquid strongest rival was Furia AND Complexity, so if you think about it it's not being a bitter loser, this system is fucked and doesn't make sense, and I am not even a Liquid fan or NA fan, but look at Legacy or Pain run and I think it is very easy to understand Cadian's comments
@@matiasscallan4885 That would mean that every tournament that has a group of death or random seeding is “fucked”.
Tournament organizers usually set their format regarding on what do they plan the tournament to provide. If the idea is just to have the absolute best in the final stages you usually classify using invitations or use the results of some league system, if that is available.
Just imagine if on every sport that has had a group of death, the eliminated teams went off saying what Cadrian is…
I can agree that it isn’t perfectly fair, though the system was not made to be to begin with, the issue is being disrespectful when impacted negatively by it.
@@Labotohs but in this case we don't have groups or random seeding, just a very bad format. you play according to the seeds, thus, higher ranked teams should have some kind of advantage, so it's pretty unfair for them to play against other higher ranked teams while lower ranked teams play against each other, it doesnt make sense because (i believe) the point of the RMR is to have the best teams qualified. plus, i dont think cadian was disrespectful but honest, because putting all feelings aside if you didn't beat furia or complexity then what can you do against faze vitality or spirit?
NA fans should be happy that complexity made it as they are more NA than liquid and other teams, i think that if it was a liquid vs legacy and complexity vs M80, liquid could have take it
We sure are, but those who live here and enjoy bad weather + long healthcare lines may feel different about it.
Liquid had the better team on paper and better NA talent in Twistzz and NAF other then EliGE complexity’s line up is lacklustre and Halzerk isn’t from NA either.
And NA means Canada and the USA. Not having any Canadians is disappointing being a Canadian CS fan
Exactly
And the guy who owns Complexity lives and breathes CS.
sad m80 didn’t make it through. Thought that would be a dope sticker
Didn’t they have to make it through the challengers stage as well?
@@Drewstir68 nah if you get past the rmr you get into the challengers sticker capsule
Out of most teams in the entire rmr I was hoping M80 made it through because their logo is sick as hell, too bad they didn’t make it, can’t forget about how they had a miracle run though nonetheless
They were literally 2 easy awp shots away so sad
They have only themselves to blame tbh, Legacy is probably the worst team that qualified although I guess they could have gotten ODDIK. But they could have been given Complexity and Liquid.
Their logo would be a cool sticker tho
EU "top teams" missing the major: Nobody cares
NA "top teams" missing the major: NOT FAIR! SHITTY FORMAT!
Brazil "top teams" take all the spots: nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!
LOL
legacy and pain are not top Brazil teams lol
Furia & imperial are
For all of James criticism he really knew how to use yekindar and continues to get more than what is expected out of his players to this very day
Jame knew how to use old Yekindar. His form has been pretty bad for quite some time now. Just look at round 19 on overpass, it's an aim issue, not a role issue.
@@ikzv Yekindar wouldn't have to leave if it wasn't for the Russia Ukraine war. I'm ngl, that ruined the whole CIS scene really badly.
@@ManagerStrifeSpirit says it didn't.
@@phawxhunter The spirit team you are talking about took a lot of time to rebuild themselves. In 2022 and 2023, they were one of the notable teams that got screwed by the war before winning Katowice.
yekindar carried liquid the second he joined them, people even thought he was gonna be in top 10 hltv.
He was still the best player on that roster by stats until he picked up the IGL role and has been ass ever since.
1:17 As a fucking brazillian, I can understand your feelings. But brazillian CS is living his best moment IN YEARS! (I think since 2018!) All of these new guys got inspired by LG/SK gaming and this new generation are here just because of it! We need to remember that this NA situation would never happen if the NA teams had won their own games. It's pretty easy to blame other teams that actually did a good job while forgeting their own terrible work. TL and Complexity lost their game against us. And even so, Complexity is going right to legends, wtf! So I think you guys are gonna be fine.
The Complexity story is amazing. Jason Lake buying back the team and then the team making it to the Major is awesome. Having no Canadians there sucks though. Hopefully we see some in the next Major.
The format is unforgiving, especially because the Americas only get 5 spots, so you can only lose one match before being eliminated. However, the b01's were not the problem for NA.
All the b01's between a Brazilian team and a NA team in which Brazil won were really decisive, except for Furia vs Liquid. If the format was a b03, I don't think that Liquid would win against Furia, they seemed completely lost during the tournament. In fact, one can argue that it could be better for Brazil, since MIBR could probably defeat BOSS in a b03 instead of them getting the upset. There was even a chance of ODDIK winning against M80 or Bestia winning against Liquid in the first game.
I would definitely prefer the entire thing to be b03's, given that it was only 4 days due to the region getting only 5 spots, but that would probably hurt NA even more.
I don’t understand how a game this competitive can be running bo1 in what could potentially be its most important tournament so far. Actual joke
SA teams are known for being good at bo1's and failing at bo3's. This format actually helped them. This is why Liquid should have played in the EU RMR, and not NA. They are a team designed around bo3's and gaining strategic map advantages. Something a bo1 does not offer. And they have also been boot camping in EU for quite awhile before they came back to NA for the RMR's. And they stated the competition in NA is just to immature and lackluster.
@@mistwhathat makes no sense europe has been dominating SA and NA for a pretty long time. bootcamping there should give them an edge on the latest metas
wdym only 5 team? 5 team is a lot for that region which can bring 1-2 world tier teams to CS. First America team in the world list is rank13 and next is rank16 team. 3 of those 5 teams who qualify to major aren't even in top30 teams in the world. And tbh there ain't even chance to discuss atm is complexity top10 or not, eu teams atm just that much better.
@@mistwhasay what? Liquid would have gotten absolutely destroyed at the European RMR.
Although maybe they could have gone through due to more slots being available but didn’t Twistzz leave Faze in part because he can go back to NA?
The important is not winning the major, the important is getting in for that sticker capsule money
"how did 2 of the best teams there, end up facing each other in a sudden death". If that was the case they wouldn't be facing each other in a sudden death. Furia qualified 3-0 after playing against both of them. The format is screwed, and both of them should've qualified, but they certainly weren't the best teams out there.
Format plus the fantastic MR12 format. Absolute perfection
Listen, I love Liquid with Twistzz specifically as he is one of my fav players, but as a Norwegian, I got to cheer for Hallzerk in this instance, and they were the better team, so I am just happy I have 3 different teams with Norwegians on them to cheer for in the major.
Yeah I'm glad for hallserk as I'm pretty sure he'll get benched if col didn't make it
Great vid!! Will you cover Grayhound collapse?
That seeding is fucking insane wtf lmao
Bit disrespectful to Complexity tbh. They’ve clearly put in the time to study and beat Liquid and hone their skills as a team. Sure, it’s sad not to see NA represented at the Majors this year but I wouldn’t say that team Liquid were the better team in any regard. Sure, the format may be new to the teams but it’s the same format for everyone.
The NA CS scene is not a disappointment anymore but a disgrace.
yeah its so bad that eu players couldnt escape the rmr ;)
And the EU isnt? teams like Astralis and Falcons not making it either, being beat by like 9Pandas and freshly formed squads that were nearly destroyed by stabbi. Falcons ditched on ENCE. yet neither of them made it and the teams they left still did. If spirit werent going to the major, We'd literally have a major being one by a 30th place team. Even still this major pickems are going to be a giant gong show.
@@minibeech03 so lets bring up some stats. In world listings Astralis is rank19 and 9Pandas are rank20. Can you see the huge gap there? I can't. And sorry to tell you, but Heroic is rank12 team atm... But then let's check the EU and America gap. Oh first top12 teams are all EU teams, how big disgrace is that!!? Only top12? And btw there's 2 NA teams in top30 of the world. And kinda weird mention Falcons and then talk about freshly formed squads. Do you know when Falcons were found? It's not disgrace to lose world top20 teams, unlike losing to lower than rank30 teams what NA is doing. Can you tell me the American team which would win majors without spirit being there? Since EU have teams like faze, g2 and mouz in pretty good shape with spirit. But sure lets forget about the top teams in the world bcs rank19 astarlis lost to rank20 and rank12 team lol!
@@sasku9044your English is so clunky I’m sure it’s probably your second language but still read your comment outloud if it sounds like word soup it probably is
Game itself is a disgrace with rampant cheating in online qualifiers.
NA crying to Brasil once again
I hope we will get a video about that insane Rainbow 6 Siege tourney finale that just happened
Right, as a 6 year hardcore CS fan I'll put my thoughts out there.
I get that it's a rough format to go through and I agree that it's a little unfair but it's the same system the Europe teams go through. And yes I know they get 3 chances before being knocked out but your competition is less stiff in the Americas RMR. Furia & Complexity are only the comfortably tier 1 teams in the Americas region right now. Whereas you look at a Astralis or GamerLegion who are no doubts capable of tier 1 CS but had to try and beat teams like Ence, Vitality, Mouz, Spirit and Heroic to try and make it. Who are all comfortably tier 1 teams.
The only thing that really messed things up was the seeding system. HOWEVER, when you change your roster not too long before the RMR you gotta expect this kinda thing. Liquid have barely competed in anything so far so they should be seeded low. It makes perfect sense.
The biggest BS moment of all this is the fact Complexity get the Legends spot despite going 3-1. Get Imperial and Furia to BO3 for it makes way more sense. Imagine getting shafted over after winning all your games. The seeding system is a joke in this regard.
Anyway that's my thoughts. Ultimately, Liquid should play better CS to make it and Cadian needs to take claim for not having the team ready to play to the level they should. Especially, if he wants to **** talk the system.
Complexity get the legends spot because they are highest rank between the qualified teams (I forgot if it is HLTV's rank or Valve's rank)
@@Brazio20 But they went 3-1 in the bracket. So dumb that they can place in the 3-6 bracket and get legends
bequiet makes a good pc case
Twistzz left a major winning team for this byw
liquid beats liquid guys omg
same can be said for Astralis they miss there home major have to face 3 t1 teams(spirit, heroic, ence) despite having others teams like estatic, guild etc in there groups
So much iconics moments? I think I will pass it to see that coldzera jumping 4k for maybe millionth time
Super teams don’t work? Who would’ve guessed it
Mad cuz bad basically
Yeah just as much as the format should be tweaked… liquid choked
If you are good as what you claim you are, then you are supposed to win. Don't cry because it is just a massive skill issue.
bequiet! heat sinks are actually sick
It’s all good. New team they need time. We will hold our criticism for a bit.
Been coping for so long. Give it up
nah skullz gotta go
Funny way of spelling "yekindar"@@z3r0_80
Yeah bring in BlameF and get Skullz out of there.
@@headponcho8265 3 months is not long lmfao
4:36 No it isn't, just win the match. All teams play in the same format and have to win their matches.
b01 in mr12 just shouldn't be a thing its way too short, especially during something as important as an rmr
they lost to furia and col... imperial played nrg and m80 legacy played nouns m80 and mibr pain played red canids and 0ddik its a fucking joke
@@z3r0_80M80 recently won a BO3 against Liquid. Even though Nouns and NRG are definitely not in the same level, they are not bad (specially Nouns) considering the NA situation. MIBR was pathetic.
Liquid had a bad seed and I agree with that, but as Cadian said, if they couldn't win against an erratic (my own addition) Furia and Col, they are definitely not ready to go to the Major.
@@z3r0_80 so what? First time ever seeing single elimination tournaments? Luck played a part on who they were matched against but they still had to win. Suppose they had actually got a better seed, at some point they would have got matched against some of those teams again, and then what?
Honest questions, in almost every eSports NA is barely competition?, rocket league, R6, CS...The list goes on, was NA was at the top souly due to the lack of initial diversity?... Honestly I´m a SAM (Brazil) fan so I could not be happier with their success.
It’s Gojover
Zonic -> Falcons: Failed to qualify
Magisk -> Falcons: Failed to qualify
Sunpayus-> Falcons: Failed to qualify
Snappi -> Falcons: Failed to qualify
Maden -> Falcons: Failed to qualify
Twistzz-> Liquid: Failed to qualify
cadiaN -> Liquid: Failed to qualify
How embarrassing.
Total of 5 major wins across both of these teams and these ""superteams"" can't even qualify for one anymore.
Btw Device and Dupreeh also failed to qualify. Meanwhile Fallen and Coldzera make it to the 2024 Copenhagen Major, who would have thought lol
Why tf are you randomly listing Sunpayus, Snappi, Maden and cadian, and then talking about major wins and superteams? One half of your comment has fuck all to do with the other.
@@Frawt Because with all that prestige you would think that they would qualify. But they're so fucking shit that they can't even qualify for one anymore.
You guys should make a video on UMA the first fighting game millionaire after winning Street Fighter 6 Capcom Cup X. He is the ultimate underdog, only unsponsored player, unemployed because he devoted all his time to SF6 in order to win a million bucks.
And because he was unsponsored, he wore his favourite Hololive idol Mio and got noticed when he won, appeared on her stream to receive her congratulations. He then turned down Redbull's tournament because he rather spend his birthday on Holofest 5, he is truly a man of focus and knows what he wants.
But 1 thing in general. You're not the best by beating the 16 seed every time. You're theist because you beat all of them saying that it's more complicated just sends the message that your efforts to be the best don't count for nothing. If wakeup on the wrong side of the bed one day and could not perform on the day just says how much more a player or the the team can improve. you either showy you're the best or show excuses every time you loose.
I wouldnt say that because they couldnt beat furia or complexity that means that they are a disappointment, most people would agree that the top 3 best teams in the region is Furia, Complexity and Liquid so if there only loses were to eachother it makes sense. Also take a closer look at the format and the teams that were in the top 8, out of all of them furia complexity and liquid only played eachother, so one could argue that more than half of the teams that made it from the RMR had an easier seeding than the better teams.
it never even began, brutally over
Yekindar from BEAST to bad player.Incredible
The sentiment of "first and probably only" major in Denmark actually made me a little sad, cause going to a CS major is basically a bucket-list thing for me, but I just don't have the money to pay for lodging for 2 weeks in CPH :(
we need a recap of the six invitational finals
Cadian: "If you can't beat Furia you're not going to be doing much at the major"
Also Cadian: *Lost to Furia* 🤣
They're going home, they're going home
Bruh moment for Twistzzz and unlucky for Cadian
yo great video crazy ending (been here for 3 minutes)
Unfortunate but damn that’s crazy
Liquid couldn't beat Furia or Complexity so their chance at the major weren't that high anyways, DUH
The purpose of a system is what it does. The NA esports industry is an oversized twitch streamer talent agency
its tough being a Liquid fan in general. League, Valorant, R6, and now CS.
A N I M E
N
I
M
E
They lost RWF (being one of the only 2 guilds who actually have a chance at winning it) and AWC in WoW too.
What a menace of a format...
You gotta love these RMRs: making the most exciting teams play against each other in the RMR instead of lwtting us ser that at the major
There were no "most exciting teams" playing against each other at any RMR. The "most exciting teams" are playing each other at the major. Hope that helps, buddy.
They faced each other because of the seeding and nothing else. Everything is by the rules and Liquid were the 2nd lowest seeded team because they reformed their roster. Spirit and Faze could've face each other in elimination match in Europe as well but they didn't. You wanna know why? Because they weren't throwing and playing up to the level everyone expects, meanwhile Yekindar tries to cosplay donk on 11-7 against pistols and cadiaN try to cosplay monesy with his flicks and repeeking, then losing horribly and losing the most vital round of the game.
new to the scene, what is rmr?
@@Ryuno_Ace it's the tournament that determines who qualifies for the major
EU RMR also were scuffed af. No worries NA
Brazilian storm is back!!!
NA and Esport goes together like garbage to a trashcan. We. Are. Trash 😂😭
Bo1's generally suck, Especially in MR12, since winning both pistols effectively gives you tempo and already 4/12 rounds locked in. Its also the seeding and matchups. For example, Furia had to beat NOUNS, TL and COL. Very respectable... Pain had to beat, Legacy, Red Canids, Imperial and ODDIK. Liquid had to play - Bestia, Furia, BOSS and COL. Imperial had to play NRG, M80 and PAIN. Also maybe dont use 3 month old rankings, its not accurate imo.
The fact is just that these roads arent at all the same. Imperial played fine, but no offense, they dumpstered their way to 2-0 and then frankly, dumpstered PAIN Gaming in that last Bo3 (13-5, 13-4, No disrespect to pain I like em).
Main issue: Formatting and Seeding, and Swiss system for 5 spots, makes NO sense whatsoever. Like Swiss System with 2-1 Elimination matches is bad Imo.
I don't watch much pro CS but when he said "best of one" I almost spat out my coffee. That's a fucking psychotic format wtf. I thought Capcom Cup's formatting was bad, this is insane lol.
Similar outcome for GreyHounds in Asia RMR. Any Australians make it through?
This is exactly why we love unfranchised sports.
EU "top teams" missing the major: Nobody cares
NA "top teams" missing the major:
T_T
what top team
gamerlegion?
if youre good you should win your elimination match
poor Cadian :( Seeing his old team qualifying without him despite being on a "better" team on paper... would have loved to see him with a hometown crowd.
comediaN
o jogador mediocre mais largo da historia do cs acha que tem algum direito de abri a boca pra fala da furia e da imperial, merece estar de fora pra aprender a ser humilde
3 and a half months isn't enough for Liquid to realize their potential
ALTHOUGH their current results are far below what a team with their skill floor should be achieving
This new roster with a very unique IGL and roster will definitely need more time to find their identity and roles
20 fucking brazilians had me dying
I look at this liquid the same as the first international roster of Vitality. Im sure that once they all understand each other and click, this liquid will be super strong.
I just hope they don't go full roster change too fast.
NA cs teams just cant get their shit together somehow
how can they. it was 1 bo1 to basically decide your fate
O choro e livre amigo, aki é BRAZIL PORRRAAAAAAAAA AAAAAHHAAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA
hell yea, be quiet! lets go
It's Jover
Something pp never talk about regardless th3 BO1s is that if a shitty team ends 3-0, they are still labeled as challengers and not Legends so it kinda evens out (Like how COL ended up as legends and FURIA as challengers)
but that is new. now valve instructs the major organizer to arrange the teams based on the valve rank system that weights more LAN events. that's why furia, imperial, cloud9 and others are not in the legends stage.
first you qualify than they look your position on the valve rank. now how many spots are reserved to each region is something that I don't know because COL is not 8th in the world.
maybe if we get more American teams in the legends stage and playoffs we can get more legends stage spots.
and another thing: this system will work better in 2025 and onwards, because valve prohibited franchise-based events. so there will be no more "invited as partner organization" spots on big LAN events; every spot must be conquered through open and closed qualification phases, but since valve's decision was out of nowhere and they imagined that organizations could have paid their franchise for the current year, they said that the changes would only take place after 2024, but then again, the modifications to the legends stage slots placement was already made in preparation for the end of the franchises.
this is what fucked over a lot of teams this major, and more is to come next major.
@@mths1 the spots on legend stage are determined by how many teams from said region qualified to the playoff stage of previous major. Since in Paris Major the teams that qualified to playoff stage were 1 Americas and 7 European, the legend spots this Major are 7 European teams and 1 Americas team.
Justice 4 Cadian
NA tears, my favorite drink
Just wait till they hear about March Madness. Get over it, win your games
hey now hey now dont say its over
-skullz +Boros There you have it the most agressive cs team
The RMR qualifier needs to be changed
M80 is my favorite in this RMR, but Col with majority NA player is deserve that spot. 😊😊
Nah, it is pretty simple youre either good enough to win it all or filler.
It's Joever
Off-topic: Rainbow Six Siege just had the biggest Six Invitational event ever. Please make a video on it, especially the insane Grand Finals.
As someone who plays chess, a Swiss system makes no sense for a tournament/elimination format. Only reason we use it in chess tournaments is because everyone has to play every round. Also tiebreakers need to be used which also suck
they dont care about format ,they only care about the number of viewers .
Liquid gonna win at some point.
Liquid all the way!
They've actually got a 75% winrate since they started playing together over the past few months, compared to COls 55% over teh same period. And despite people claiming its only because of tier2 teams. They've actually been alot of the same qualifiers over the past couple months. Both were in Blast. Liquid actually made it to upper bracket final in their Blast group in which they only lost to Faze and G2. very unfortunate matchups for their very first event together.
when orgs don't develop a region and help to create new talent, you have the same old guys duking it out 💁
brasil storm, baby
Matches should always be BO3 but liquid has nothing to cry about because they ruined their ranking by kicking out their core. Risk vs reward, you didnt see teams like ITB do that ;-)
joever for the na scene after witnessing the shot that killed na in 2016
Yeah, a win is still a win
its joever
Old Astralis fan here. Welcome back to hell TL fans. LOL
NA CS > NA CS2? Battle of the paraolympians.
I hate the argument about matchups. It’s a competition. Win or go home.
I'm stoked for Col, but furia is the only Brazilian team that could have beat either team.....
Asking as someone who doesn't play CS, when can I watch these majors? Or is there a schedule? How?!
Usually majors are streamed on twitch. HLTV has major schedules I believe.
It starts march 17th.
sad for Cadian
Dont forget the change of race to 16 to race to 13. Less time for a possible comeback
Elige: NA CS is competitive, become stronger
SA: Hold my beer
Guys, Just hope the Brazilians make it to the playoffs to guarantee more places for America 🎉
shhhhhhhh sa>na