Getting back into climbing with my son after quite some time away and looking to build a basic trad rack. Your videos are by far the most useful (and honest) ones out there!! Thanks and keep it up.
Just getting back into my climbing after a long time away, this is basically how I have renewed my rack, basic solid gear. Good sound advice and I like the easy going professional approach to the subject. Subbed.
It's perhaps worth pointing out that a hex of a corresponding size (in its normal placement) to a cam (e.g., gold torque nut vs. gold cam) is about half the weight and about 20% of the cost. Lots of videos online show people with loads of cams and not a single hex. There is a place for hexes, even just based on budget and weight, as a complement to cams. This is even before considering placements that flare out towards the back of the crack, where even a little walking will ruin a cam placement, but a properly set hex can be an ideal fit. Keep up the videos - enjoying them a lot.
Glad you're enjoying them. It's always tricky knowing where to draw the line on a video, so yeah that's a good thing to point out for sure, just didn't make it in to this one! I think I talk about it in my placing trad kit video :)
Nice video, the only thing I'd add is that whether or not you want friends on your first rack might depend where you climb. Lots of places you won't need them, but on Yorkshire or Peak Gritstone, they can be a real confidence booster, and a lot of the easier routes are cracks. Buy a set between between you and your mates and share them even.
I started without hexes but with friends. (In Switzerland we have enough cows with bells). Friends for me are the most useful (espacially when mountainering, so much faster to place and remove then nuts and hexes). That said, hexes have arrived two weeks ago.
Managed some great deals last year and fully racked up two sets nuts dmm and wild country and complete cam and micro cam set from wild country. Covid has been a nightmare but allowed me great nhs discounts just need to get out and scratch them now. Great video. .
I got by in the early days by buying the basics and borrowing a set of cams off a mate. I do think learning to place passive gear is foundation skill but I love the ‘get out of jail’ feeling you get from a hastily placed cam! 😂
100ft of blue 10mm polypropylene rope from B&Q, and a few slings made from the same are all you need for top roping at a crag that has trees at the top ;) Save an absolute fortune using that! (SERIOUSLY DON'T DO THAT). I remember spending the majority of my University student loan on a lead rack, as I was starting off with no gear at all at the time. It IS as you say, and expensive business at first, but you don't need everything all at once!
Brilliant as usual! Could you do a video with putting it in to practice for a beginner and cleaning the trad route after? Just starting out with my little boy and really enjoying climbing and your videos!! Thanks for all your hard work
How do sling draws work? Hexes have a sling, sling draws obviously have them, but when building belays we are always taught that slings are not to be loaded dynamically. I believe sling extensions reduce rope drag and force on gear reducing the risk of the passive protection beong pulled out mid climb. Q) in the event of a leader fall, how can a sling such a 60cm 11mm dyneema sling used between 2 carabiner as a slingdraw hold a fall and not snap under load? Or on a different setting, Q) if slings can't take falls on them, why are they always used for belay stations. Possible A) 2+ bomber bits of gear equalised and belaying in guide mode (not traversing) off the master point, the 2nd falls the belay station doesn't collapse (thankfully). I'm thinking this is due to the rope stretch taking the force enough so that the remaining force transferred transferred equally through the anchors reduces the force sufficiently to not destroy the belay.
Brilliant video as always. I personally would add some offsets nut as well. Very useful in a lot of situations and easy to place. Would you have a couple more slings for the anchor at the top(for places like Symonds yat with lots of trees)?
Glad you liked it! I love offsets and they'd definitely play a part in extended my rack beyond this one. I couple more slings could also definitely be useful! These kind of videos are always tough to get the line right on!
@@JBMountainSkills Totally agree, it's impossible to get the perfect list. Have you ever thought of doing some live video ? Good way for questions/answer about climbing or mountaineering.
Nice one Jez 👍 good solid starter advice. I’d be interested to see how you get on with the nighthawks - having suffered really tech shoes a mate said I don’t need them for anything up to E2 - sure enough I tried them and am hooked ( for all day trad - and yep have done a number of E2s in them 👌👌👌👌)
I'm curious about what you think about tricams for starter kit. Out of all the pro I've used, I've enjoyed using them the most. To me at least, they are pretty intuitive to use (although it does take a bit of practice to place them in a way that they don't get stuck), are super versatile and confidence inspiring.
Reminds me of my first starter trad rack, got a few more jazzy pieces in it now though. My current thought with working towards my RCI assesment is at what point do you invest in a "Work" climbing rack, allowing you to not use your personal climbing rack for work?
Good question! By the book answer: Straight away so it's use is recorded, inspections recorded etc. Realistic answer: I couldn't afford to do that at first so gradually built up a work rack as I could. A full set of work cams was the last big ticket item!
Found this a great summary, as per usual. Newish to climbing outdoors (past 6 months or so) and crammed a fair amount in and remember the early days and debates with mates for splitting costs (I'm a student as are my mates) about cams but found hexes more than enough in the beginning for bigger features on low grade climbs. Now getting into the end where accumulating cams and more gear (won a cam off a route in glencoe haha). Any advice on first set of half ropes?
Glad it was useful! I have a set of these and think they're great for the price, I've had a couple of sets now. 50m for me and I don't bother with dry treated - unless you have winter climbing aspirations (there's a dry version too). www.outside.co.uk/climbing-gear/ropes-slings/half-ropes/mammut-8-0-alpine-classic-rope.html
Another great vid! Harness wise is this the Black Diamond Solution (designed mainly for sport I think) or the Black Diamond Solution Guide (designed mainly for trad)? The link wasn't working so I wasn't sure! Cheers!
@@JBMountainSkills good to know, I ended up ordering a Solution Guide yesterday, as I'm getting into a bit more trad multipitch, hopefully it's still decent for sports climbing!
Another great video, thank you! you recommend a 50m rope which is WAAAY bigger than some routes I'm planning. I presume that is just to make sure there is sufficient for building a belay, better too long than too short, abseil only half the length of the rope etc.... any further rationale?
Glad you liked it! Yeah so the 50m gives you plenty for belay building, gives you 25m of doubled up ab, gets you to the floor being lowered off sport routes up to 25 and just opens up other routes that you'll no doubt want to do at some point. It's just a decent multi purpose, flexible length :)
@@mrdrprofsteve506 a lot of beginner friendly routes in the UK are 15-20 meters. So if you're topping out (which is often the case), you can get by with a 30. But you'll often be abseiling into (sea cliffs) or out of routes, so a 50 definitely gives you more options. I always recommend at least 60, but I mostly do sport (and not always in the UK). I can think of 3 times in the UK where my 50 wasn't enough.
Good question! 2 can be really useful for self rescue type stuff so I tend to teach to carry two just to form that habit. I also quite like the idea of a 5mm and a 6mm, to give yourself the best chance of a grippy rope - prusik combo.
In cave rescue, we teach that you can build any of the classic rescue systems with two rope grabs, two carabiners, and two pulleys. Put otherwise, "2 grippy, 2 clippy, 2 slippy".
Do you have any issue with making your own slings these days just using webbing and a water knot? That is how I grew up doing it and everyone seems to be using the pre-sewn slings these day which is fine I suppose but I like just buying a role of webbing and making a bunch of slings, e.g. your 240, etc. Is there any reason you can see now not to do that anymore?
@@JBMountainSkills Man... that video was enlightening and was new information to me. I climb with a lot of old school folks who don't know that. Thanks for passing that on.
I lead my first trad route a couple of weeks ago and really enjoyed it but wanted to have my own gear so I don't always have to sponge off my partner in the future. I have a 60m single rope and 15 draws from sport climbing and I've just bought my first set of 11 nuts (limiting the trad rack purchases to one a month for the sake of my bank account). Could you use a handful of sport draws on your harness or do they create too much rope drag? Even for short straight forward routes.
Definitely you could! Just be aware of it and maybe throw in a couple of sling draws. I think my first draws were sport ones, mainly because I didn't know the difference!
Hi Jez, Im just starting out trad climbing (ive got alot of experience sport climbing), Ive had two trad sessions so far, leading HVS and VS, ive felt comfortable with just wallnuts and offsets. Around what grade does cams become essential? looking to get my first E1 this weekend at stanage.
Hi Adam. Tough question! If you’ve got cams, you’d probably carry them on most stuff and it does depend on rock type a bit too. Personally E1 upwards I’d kind of class them as virtually essential. Best of luck on the E1 👊
It's a tough one! Where to draw the line on these videos is always tricky! I think 8 is enough to get started on a budget, on easier routes, but for sure people will want to up that fairly soon :)
Great Video. One question please on the DMM Torque Nuts. Do you think the new wired version are a better choice or do you still prefer the Dyneema version? Thanks
@@climberly They are a niche gear and usually area specific. Can they still be used in normal trad yes but for a first rack I'd say not needed. Better as a add-on later.
The boy is looking heroic in the breeze behind you 😄
He was on form today!!
I loved the ears flapping too!
i love how the dog was looking at the f15s
Time stamps for later reference:
1:55 helmet and shoes
2:41 rope
3:21 chalk
4:16 cams
5:30 nuts and hexes
6:55 Quickdraws
7:48 slings, lockers, nut key and prusiks
9:42 spare carabiners
Loving Oreo’s ears flapping in the breeze! And another super helpful video for people starting out, keep up the good work! 👍🏻
I love his ears!
Glad you liked it :)
Thanks!
My pleasure!
Great video! I'm so impressed by how chill your dog is. Love it
Getting back into climbing with my son after quite some time away and looking to build a basic trad rack. Your videos are by far the most useful (and honest) ones out there!! Thanks and keep it up.
Very kind, thank you!
It's funny hearing you say that 50m is long enough. Like you said, abroad is much different -- out here in Colorado, USA, we regularly need 70m!
Haha, yeah here in the UK it normally is. One of the places I regularly climb in Spain needs an 80m min though!
Cool video. Love that dog! Wales is great. Tremadog and Gogarth etc. Hopefully lockdown will ease and let us get out again.
Thanks! Fingers crossed!
Jez, great to see you and the boy out on the hill, and a very useful video for those starting their climbing career, thanks and keep it up mate
It's so nice to be out again!
Just getting back into my climbing after a long time away, this is basically how I have renewed my rack, basic solid gear. Good sound advice and I like the easy going professional approach to the subject. Subbed.
Cheers!
It's perhaps worth pointing out that a hex of a corresponding size (in its normal placement) to a cam (e.g., gold torque nut vs. gold cam) is about half the weight and about 20% of the cost. Lots of videos online show people with loads of cams and not a single hex. There is a place for hexes, even just based on budget and weight, as a complement to cams. This is even before considering placements that flare out towards the back of the crack, where even a little walking will ruin a cam placement, but a properly set hex can be an ideal fit.
Keep up the videos - enjoying them a lot.
Glad you're enjoying them.
It's always tricky knowing where to draw the line on a video, so yeah that's a good thing to point out for sure, just didn't make it in to this one! I think I talk about it in my placing trad kit video :)
Great video
Very kind :)
Nice video, the only thing I'd add is that whether or not you want friends on your first rack might depend where you climb. Lots of places you won't need them, but on Yorkshire or Peak Gritstone, they can be a real confidence booster, and a lot of the easier routes are cracks. Buy a set between between you and your mates and share them even.
Just the video I was looking for.
Glad it was useful!
I started without hexes but with friends. (In Switzerland we have enough cows with bells). Friends for me are the most useful (espacially when mountainering, so much faster to place and remove then nuts and hexes). That said, hexes have arrived two weeks ago.
Thanks for sharing!
I’ve not yet even tried trad but watching the pieces placed into cracks seems freaking satisfying - santa please bring my nuts for Xmas
10:19 who's a GOOOOD BOI ?? !!
Most of the time..!
Managed some great deals last year and fully racked up two sets nuts dmm and wild country and complete cam and micro cam set from wild country. Covid has been a nightmare but allowed me great nhs discounts just need to get out and scratch them now. Great video. .
Nice one! Nice to have plenty of kit!
I got by in the early days by buying the basics and borrowing a set of cams off a mate. I do think learning to place passive gear is foundation skill but I love the ‘get out of jail’ feeling you get from a hastily placed cam! 😂
Don't get me wrong, I flipping love cams!! Sharing rack with a mate is a great way to spread the cost too :)
100ft of blue 10mm polypropylene rope from B&Q, and a few slings made from the same are all you need for top roping at a crag that has trees at the top ;) Save an absolute fortune using that! (SERIOUSLY DON'T DO THAT). I remember spending the majority of my University student loan on a lead rack, as I was starting off with no gear at all at the time. It IS as you say, and expensive business at first, but you don't need everything all at once!
Brilliant as usual! Could you do a video with putting it in to practice for a beginner and cleaning the trad route after? Just starting out with my little boy and really enjoying climbing and your videos!! Thanks for all your hard work
Glad you liked it!
I'll see what I can do... :)
I’ll second that
Fantastic video and just what I needed 👌🏻
Cheers!
How do sling draws work?
Hexes have a sling, sling draws obviously have them, but when building belays we are always taught that slings are not to be loaded dynamically. I believe sling extensions reduce rope drag and force on gear reducing the risk of the passive protection beong pulled out mid climb.
Q) in the event of a leader fall, how can a sling such a 60cm 11mm dyneema sling used between 2 carabiner as a slingdraw hold a fall and not snap under load?
Or on a different setting,
Q) if slings can't take falls on them, why are they always used for belay stations.
Possible A)
2+ bomber bits of gear equalised and belaying in guide mode (not traversing) off the master point, the 2nd falls the belay station doesn't collapse (thankfully). I'm thinking this is due to the rope stretch taking the force enough so that the remaining force transferred transferred equally through the anchors reduces the force sufficiently to not destroy the belay.
Not destroy the sling
Brilliant video as always. I personally would add some offsets nut as well. Very useful in a lot of situations and easy to place. Would you have a couple more slings for the anchor at the top(for places like Symonds yat with lots of trees)?
Glad you liked it!
I love offsets and they'd definitely play a part in extended my rack beyond this one. I couple more slings could also definitely be useful! These kind of videos are always tough to get the line right on!
@@JBMountainSkills Totally agree, it's impossible to get the perfect list. Have you ever thought of doing some live video ? Good way for questions/answer about climbing or mountaineering.
Exactly what I needed¡
Good to hear!
Nice one Jez 👍 good solid starter advice. I’d be interested to see how you get on with the nighthawks - having suffered really tech shoes a mate said I don’t need them for anything up to E2 - sure enough I tried them and am hooked ( for all day trad - and yep have done a number of E2s in them 👌👌👌👌)
Great to hear you've got on well with the Nighthawks, looking forward to trying them!
I'm curious about what you think about tricams for starter kit. Out of all the pro I've used, I've enjoyed using them the most. To me at least, they are pretty intuitive to use (although it does take a bit of practice to place them in a way that they don't get stuck), are super versatile and confidence inspiring.
For me they don't feature in a starter rack. They can be great, but they are a bit niche really I think. Great that they work well for you though :)
Reminds me of my first starter trad rack, got a few more jazzy pieces in it now though. My current thought with working towards my RCI assesment is at what point do you invest in a "Work" climbing rack, allowing you to not use your personal climbing rack for work?
Good question!
By the book answer: Straight away so it's use is recorded, inspections recorded etc.
Realistic answer: I couldn't afford to do that at first so gradually built up a work rack as I could. A full set of work cams was the last big ticket item!
@@JBMountainSkills my thoughts exactly. Be interesting to see a video on this. Especially your process of monitoring all your kit.
Want to buy me a coffee or the boy a dog treat?! bit.ly/3vhJwab
Or buy a Sling Mountain T Shirt?! bit.ly/3clZ1pc
I can’t wait to climb trad just so I can buy the gear😂 obviously need to get better at sport climbing outdoors first.
Found this a great summary, as per usual.
Newish to climbing outdoors (past 6 months or so) and crammed a fair amount in and remember the early days and debates with mates for splitting costs (I'm a student as are my mates) about cams but found hexes more than enough in the beginning for bigger features on low grade climbs. Now getting into the end where accumulating cams and more gear (won a cam off a route in glencoe haha). Any advice on first set of half ropes?
Glad it was useful!
I have a set of these and think they're great for the price, I've had a couple of sets now. 50m for me and I don't bother with dry treated - unless you have winter climbing aspirations (there's a dry version too).
www.outside.co.uk/climbing-gear/ropes-slings/half-ropes/mammut-8-0-alpine-classic-rope.html
Did you ever get a chance to review those nighthawks? Thinking about picking up a pair for some granite slabs
I talk about them on this one :)
ua-cam.com/video/PJnkL5UzUmU/v-deo.html
Great video 👍
Lock downs that you can't drive to recreation areas?? Wow..
Another great vid! Harness wise is this the Black Diamond Solution (designed mainly for sport I think) or the Black Diamond Solution Guide (designed mainly for trad)? The link wasn't working so I wasn't sure! Cheers!
Thanks!
This is the regular solution. It's a decent all rounder I reckon :)
@@JBMountainSkills good to know, I ended up ordering a Solution Guide yesterday, as I'm getting into a bit more trad multipitch, hopefully it's still decent for sports climbing!
@@imissclimbing6170 I’m sure it’ll be ace 😊
Another great video, thank you! you recommend a 50m rope which is WAAAY bigger than some routes I'm planning. I presume that is just to make sure there is sufficient for building a belay, better too long than too short, abseil only half the length of the rope etc.... any further rationale?
Glad you liked it!
Yeah so the 50m gives you plenty for belay building, gives you 25m of doubled up ab, gets you to the floor being lowered off sport routes up to 25 and just opens up other routes that you'll no doubt want to do at some point. It's just a decent multi purpose, flexible length :)
Are the routes in the UK generally shorter where a 50 meter rope isnt needed?
@@mrdrprofsteve506 a lot of beginner friendly routes in the UK are 15-20 meters. So if you're topping out (which is often the case), you can get by with a 30.
But you'll often be abseiling into (sea cliffs) or out of routes, so a 50 definitely gives you more options. I always recommend at least 60, but I mostly do sport (and not always in the UK). I can think of 3 times in the UK where my 50 wasn't enough.
Why do you carry two prusiks?
Good question! 2 can be really useful for self rescue type stuff so I tend to teach to carry two just to form that habit.
I also quite like the idea of a 5mm and a 6mm, to give yourself the best chance of a grippy rope - prusik combo.
In cave rescue, we teach that you can build any of the classic rescue systems with two rope grabs, two carabiners, and two pulleys. Put otherwise, "2 grippy, 2 clippy, 2 slippy".
Do you have any issue with making your own slings these days just using webbing and a water knot? That is how I grew up doing it and everyone seems to be using the pre-sewn slings these day which is fine I suppose but I like just buying a role of webbing and making a bunch of slings, e.g. your 240, etc. Is there any reason you can see now not to do that anymore?
ua-cam.com/video/mXe-8GmS08k/v-deo.html
I'm not a fan of knotting it to be honest, would rather something sewn that in my mind is a bit safer.
@@JBMountainSkills Man... that video was enlightening and was new information to me. I climb with a lot of old school folks who don't know that. Thanks for passing that on.
I lead my first trad route a couple of weeks ago and really enjoyed it but wanted to have my own gear so I don't always have to sponge off my partner in the future. I have a 60m single rope and 15 draws from sport climbing and I've just bought my first set of 11 nuts (limiting the trad rack purchases to one a month for the sake of my bank account). Could you use a handful of sport draws on your harness or do they create too much rope drag? Even for short straight forward routes.
Definitely you could! Just be aware of it and maybe throw in a couple of sling draws. I think my first draws were sport ones, mainly because I didn't know the difference!
Hi Jez, Im just starting out trad climbing (ive got alot of experience sport climbing), Ive had two trad sessions so far, leading HVS and VS, ive felt comfortable with just wallnuts and offsets. Around what grade does cams become essential? looking to get my first E1 this weekend at stanage.
Hi Adam. Tough question! If you’ve got cams, you’d probably carry them on most stuff and it does depend on rock type a bit too.
Personally E1 upwards I’d kind of class them as virtually essential.
Best of luck on the E1 👊
Only 8 draws? Certainly for some shorter climbs given the small amount of kit!
It's a tough one! Where to draw the line on these videos is always tricky! I think 8 is enough to get started on a budget, on easier routes, but for sure people will want to up that fairly soon :)
Great Video. One question please on the DMM Torque Nuts. Do you think the new wired version are a better choice or do you still prefer the Dyneema version? Thanks
Anyone who's interested in a starter trad rack is probably already aware they need a rope, climbing shoes and chalk bag. Good video apart from that
what? no tricams?
Not for me, nope
@@JBMountainSkills why not? I find they're super handy, especially in irregular cracks.
@@climberly They are a niche gear and usually area specific. Can they still be used in normal trad yes but for a first rack I'd say not needed. Better as a add-on later.
Thanks!
My pleasure 👊