Kishimoto was a good writer until the War arc. He got too tired and said fuck my series and also fuck female character development. And he didn't know how to write romance and ruined the war arc with a nuke spam fest
@@oboxisreal I feel like they shouldn't all have been the same age. For the konoha 11 to be relevant they have to be at least jonin level each and having everyone from one exam be jonin+ is kinda unrealistic imo.
I think the biggest disadvantage Rock Lee has is that he just doesn't have attacks that are strong enough to damage Gaara. He uses his fist's and not a sharp object or anything of that sort so the sand armor can protect more effectively against Rock Lee. Sasuke doesn't have any sort of technique or raw durability to resist Rock Lee's attack's.
If with only 4 hits Sasuke has Gaara on his knees, that means his attacks are much more powerful than 4th gate Lee, and since Sasuke is outputting that much force he can easily resist 4th gate punches
@@AlexMartinez-cu4dw just because Sasuke can deal higher damage doesn't mean his durability is high enough to withstand 4th gate attacks. The two don't correlate. His durability actually seems pretty low at this point. He literally took damage in the continued gara fight once and was taken down. His curse mark was definitely effecting his ability to take damage. I still think he beats Rock Lee but it's closer than you're made it sound.
@@BusterOlsen if one can output x amount of force with their bare hands, their skin and muscles and bones are unaffected, their body which is made of that same skin bones and muscles logically would withstand a punch that excerpt "y" amount of force, with "y"≤ x in force. And it's also logical that if he was training to be able to punch and kick that strong, he also trained to increase his durability. If you don't want to give the benefit of the doubt then fine, whatever you say
@@AlexMartinez-cu4dw gaara was on the ground and more fatigued from gaaras 4th/5th gate way longer than gaara was on his knees from sasuke, literally the next panel gaara appeared in he was fine with no fatigue starting the full body possession, meanwhile against lee after the reverse lotus, which he lessened the impact of with his sand, couldn't get up and was huffing and puffing for several panels even though he was actively trying to kill Lee. Stop spreading this blatant lie that base sasuke hits harder than 4th gate lee lol. I'm not even sure if sasuke hits harder than base lee. Base lee hit gaara only twice and knocked him on his ass, although gaara showed no fatigue. Base sasuke hit gaara twice and gaara, just like with lee, was put on his ass but had NO signs of fatigue. It's only after the 3rd and 4th blows (double the amount of blows base lee dealt to him) that gaara dropped to his knees, and it was only for a second. He was on the ground after the reverse lotus for a while
I’d actually love to hear about say characters 6-10. It’d be interesting to see where characters like Temari, Kankuro, Shino, Dosu, etc. scale relative to one another
@@rayquan777765555344 depending on the match up he'd probably be top 4, there's a video that goes into the hypothetical of the tournament going thru and the author goes into detail on how they all would do and Shino is pretty high up there
I want to see what/where Shino stacks up in this. Dude was a finalist just like sasuke/ naruto he even followed sasuke and was yo man we up next then he took on those sand invaders so sasuke could go after Gaara.
I think these people are focusing too much on how these characters punch and kick, and ignoring the matchups like Chidori being a very different type of attack than the stuff Lee was throwing out. Neji could probably also break through gaara's defense due to the nature of gentle fist.
@@ImADolphin I agree with the main statement only because, like you said, it deals with internal damage, so if Neji used the gentle fist on Gaara's sand, it would actually stop his mom from controlling the sand and Force Gaara to use his own chakra to control the sand now and try to juggle that with the and armor that takes most of his chakra as stated by Kankuro. Even Six says that it would take 3rd gate Lee at the very least to tag this kid as stated by Lee and Gai, so his reaction speed is insane enough not to get hit by the sand, but his movement speed seems to be relative to that of either weightless Lee or 2nd Gate Lee depending on how you interpret the statement and weightless Lee's speed is enough to out speed Gaara's sand anyway so in a non Biju fight, I'd say Neji has the upper hand
@@foresightmystery9845 It deals internal damage as in internal organs and chakra nodes. I don't see any evidence you can use taijutsu to negate an actual spiritual entity possessing an object. I agree that Neji is faster than Gaara, but I'm not convinced any of his attacks would be able to get through the sand to damage him. He's fast enough to stall for a bit, but he's not winning unless he can actually hit Gaara before running out of chakra.
@@ImADolphin on the contrary, chakra is spiritual and physical energy combined. Gaara's mother's spirit possesses his physical sand meaning her chakra is within that sand, so it can be negated by the gentle fist. For further evidence of spirits being chakra I point to the soul tug of wars throughout the war Arc and Naruto's taming of Kurama, and the addition of Minato, Kushina, and Dan's souls being chakra that enters a body. It's very plausible that he can negate Gaara's mother from controlling the sand shield forcing Gaara to use his own chakra to control it. Let's even say he can't and entertain your idea. You do agree that Neji is fast enough to bipass the sand and we see that Lee and Sasuke both can make contact with Gaara with just the weightless speed, so Neji can definitely stop Gaara's chakra immediately during the fight. Now as far as Gaara calling on Shikaku right after is a different story, but even then, he COUNTERED kyuubi essence Naruto which is something Gaara couldn't even do. Just a bit of kyuubi essence and Naruto broke outta all of Gaara's sand abilities and that's when he was using shikaku's power. Not saying Neji could pull off a win against Shikaku Gaara cuz he doesn't have a giant summon to put him near Gaara's body, just saying that up until that giant awakening point, Neji still has a chance to win before full possession
@@foresightmystery9845 Chakra being spiritual in nature is true, but broad. I don't think it's fair to use that to suggest that any technique that shuts down chakra would shut down anything that's chakra based. We've seen how the gentle fist works, it uses precise pin point movements to slightly alter or stop the flow of chakra though a specific point in the body. You're not using it to completely shut down spirits over such a broad undefined area. You make it sound like Neji would just touch the sand and instantly negate the spirit controlling it, when there's no evidence the gentle fist works that way. What instance are you talking about where Naruto broke out of the sand with Kyuubi influence? He summoned Gamabunta to break out of the sand, didn't he?
Sasuke's feats against Gaara were him with the nature advantage, remember: lightning is effective against earth. So Sasuke would be harder for Gaara to face, hence Sasuke was his hardest opponent as stated by the databooks. I think that under neutral circumstances 5th gate lee would win against Sasuke, although it would be very close.
@@7thhokage87 We have seen wind attacks that use Sand as a component And it would make sense for his Sand to be wind release as he’s LITERALLY the leader of land of wind And he’s the Jinchiriki of Shikaku who uses wind release So there’s arguments to be made for it not being a earth jutsu either Also I asked you to tell me WHERE it’s STATED that Gaara’s sand is Earth Release And instead of giving me ACTUAL evidence to back up your point your just giving assumptions The reality is that we don’t know for sure what release his Sand it. There aren’t any concrete evidence to prove it. It’s just headcannon assumption
Six, love the videos but i gotta disagree on sasukes feats vs gaara being better than lees, specifically you mentioning him hitting gaara 4 times. Lee hits gaara twice then claims that that current level of taijutsu won't be sufficient to take down gaara, so he prompts for the forward lotus, which gaara ultimately substitutes out of to dodge the significant damage dealt by the final blow. Yes, gaara does drop to his knees for a bit after sasuke gets the 4th hit in, but he literally is completely recovered with no fatigue the next page starting the full body possession, guy even questions kakashi stating that he knows that level of taijutsu will not beat gaara so why did he bother to only teach him taijutsu (before sasuke uses chidori). After lee hits him with 4th/5th gate, gaara is obviously much more visibly damaged than he was against sasuke (more cracks covering the entire surface of his body with pieces completely chipped off) and he was more fatigued as well he couldn't even get himself off the ground even though he was actively trying to kill Lee before guy stepped in, reminder that this is after gaara substituted out of forward lotus and lessened the impact of the reverse lotus. So I can't with any faith at all claim sasuke ≥ 5th gate lee in terms of ap and actually believe it. The databook statement is likely either referring to sasukes use of chidori and not his taijutsu, OR Gaaras perception of sasuke being the strongest since that's how he was portayed when gaara first met him (konohas top rookie + member of legendary clan) as well as him seeing part of the training he'd done with kakashi. We also don't know how the shift in his mental state affected his strength so i won't use it as a point, just saying it exists. All in all still a great video and i enjoy the content that's just my 2 cents
Also the argument towards the end about kishimoto wouldn't write sasuke to lose to lee, cmon dog you're literally arguing sasuke wins because plot armor at that point you know that don't work in a vs debate 😭😭
@@kenan-b This is exctly what I was thinking. That entire sasuke point just did not make any sense to me and bringing up the whole kishimoto thing just felt like he was running out of reasons. I love the content but that just made no sense at all
Rock Lee fresh out of hospital (with little to no training) went toe to toe with Kimimaro and put up decent fight.. Those are feats he was capable of during Chūnin Exams. Kimimaro > Low difficulty beat kyuubi amped Naruto + his 100 clones. - Keep in mind just 1 amped Naruto annihilated Haku and his crystal ice mirrors. So it's obvious Rock Lee > Naruto (without tailed cloaks) How does ( Final Exam) - Sasuke stack up to Kimimaro - Compared to Rock Lee - That would determine 2nd place of that list.
Dude Naruto didn't annihilate Haku, you're fucken delusional 😭😭. Haku could've clapped all of team seven by himself but he didn't bc he was fond of naruto and sasuke. They literally state it in the manga 💀
Base lee wasn’t going toe to toe with kimimaro. Kimimaro easily stomped him and it was way easier than it was with Naruto. Drunken lee and 1st Gated Lee were the ones that earned direct praise from kimi.
The argument "would kishi really write Sasuke losing to lee in the final" I mean he did write Gaara besting him, so the question is really would him losing serve the plot? Not only that but being a main character doesn't mean you're immune to defeat, hell a good example of Sasuke not being immune to losing is his first fight with lee, or one of my favorites: him getting rocked by Bee in shippuden. The way I viewed the strongest in the chunin exams would be Naruto, Gaara, Lee/Neji, & Sasuke
I'm going to argue you on one point and say that Lee beats unboosted Sasuke (curse mark probably stomps). I'm not the biggest Lee stan in the world but there's a few arguments that don't sit right with me. The databook statement makes this a pretty open and shut case, so I have to ignore it moving forward, but if you want to just take that as gospel then yes Lee loses and I'm wrong. That's a perfectly valid interpretation imo but there's still some room for doubt in my mind. Saying that Gaara got stronger is pretty speculative. I can't prove that he didn't train at all but it would make more sense for his character, since he's pretty much just coasted on his sand shield and natural talent. The argument of getting stronger through bloodshed is sound, but also completely unquantifiable. Unless I'm mistaken, we only see him kill 3 people. Dosu, and those two randos in the hallway. We have no way of knowing how much this powers him up. There's actually more evidence to suggest that the increase is barely noticeable. Sasuke's speed is compared to weightless Lee, not significantly faster. This Sasuke is still able to connect attacks, suggesting that base weightless Lee would be able to do the same thing. If Gaara got stronger, it was probably not by a significant amount. It's true that Sasuke's 4 attacks got more intense of a reaction from Gaara than Lee's barrage of hits. However, it's possible that this doesn't have anything to do with their respective levels of power. Temari states that Gaara has been getting less and less stable as the Chunin exams have gone on. While this statement comes during the preliminaries, we have no reason to assume that this deterioration of his sanity has stopped. Based on Gaara's behavior during the one month gap, it's safe to say that, if anything, it's gotten worse. By the time he fights Sasuke, he's already ready to snap and transform, and Sasuke's rapid improvement probably just pushed him over the edge. This is a much more believable explanation than claiming that 4 attacks from base Sasuke hurt Gaara more than dozens from 5th gate Lee, which seems almost self-evidently false. (Small point, but saying that Gaara "got up" after the reverse lotus is not at all true. He was on the ground and barely able to move. Lee being scared of Saskuke doesn't mean anything. He's also scared of Neji, who you yourself agree that Lee beats soundly (which I agree with, for the record). Guy's comparisons also don't mean much. Seeing Sasuke replicate Lee's speed so soon after Lee being crippled night have been causing him to think irrationally. Even if we assume he's not, him getting jealous doesn't even mean that Sasuke is stronger. "If these two fight, do you really think he would have Sasuke lose?" This is the only argument I think is outright bad lmao. Does it matter? They didn't fight. To take it to an extreme that's like saying "If part 1 Naruto fought Madara, do you think Kishimoto would have his main character lose?" Maybe that's the reason they didn't fight? Just an idea.
There are multiple things wrong with your argument for one might guy is never implied to think irrationally, Gaara's mental state does not affect the sand, Gaara still got stronger not faster and Lee's opinion is valid. Most of what you said is speculative
@@Redoren966 Even if Guy isn't thinking irrationally that doesn't mean Sasuke is stronger than Lee. It was kind of implied that that's what he was thinking, but it doesn't mean he's right and it's also never made explicit that that's what he thought. I never said Gaara's mental state affected the sand, I said that his mental state affected how quickly he's willing to transform into Shukaku. Saying that Gaara got stronger in everything except speed is being very selective in your interpretation of the facts, and even if it's true it doesn't change the fact that it's completely unquantifiable, and there's no way of showing how significant the increase is.
@@Redoren966 Also saying Lee's opinion is valid implies that you think him being scared of Neji is also valid. In other words, you think Neji beats Lee, which is fine if you think that, but that's an entirely different argument.
It’s seems very odd to me to scale Sasuke over Lee almost purely because of Databook statements Sasuke is stated to be as fast a weightless Lee. But Lee can use up till the 5th Gate. So logically Lee would speed blitz tf out of Sasuke if Sasuke only scales to Base Lee but Lee has multiple transformations above this that amp his speed Hell even KAKASHI needed to use his Sharingan just to keep track of 3rd Gate Lee 😂( not even 5th Gate just 3rd) So what makes you think Sasuke with a weaker Sharingan and less experience using it, would be able to keep up with Lee? Also it’s stated that Sasuke using Lee’s Taijutsu was tiring him out. So if even just him using BASE Lee level speed is a stamina drain for him there’s no conceivable way that Sasuke would be able to keep up with Lee. Especially if the fight dragged on long enough Also your claiming that Sasuke should have the durability to tank 5th Gate Lee’s attacks but you failed to provide ANY durability feats to back up this claim. We see that when Sasuke uses Chidori Gaara is able to stab and penetrate Sasuke cutting him in multiple places with his sand. So if Sasuke is being injured by these sand spikes (that have even less sand in them then what Gaara used to crush BASE Lee’s arm) then that should prove that Sasuke does not have 5th Gate + level durability. Sure Sasuke’s AP would be higher than 5th Gate Lee because of his Chidori. But there’s no way in hell that Lee would allow Sasuke the chance to charge up a Chidori like he did against Gaara Especially given the MASSIVE speed advantage that Lee has ( as discussed earlier) Also Gaara was mentally unstable during his fight with Sasuke. At the start of the fight he’s LITERALLY talking to himself😂 And through out the fight we get scenes of Gaara’s team talking about how Gaara is acting strange and going against there plans. So that would effect his scaling during this fight as well I feel like the only way you can get Chunin Exam Sasuke beating 5th Gate Lee in a fight is by using databook statements and weird assTV guides. I just get the impression that your REALLY reaching for arguments here. Cuz if you just look at the feats and statements made in the series it should be abundantly clear that Lee would beat Sasuke in a fight at this point in the show
What makes you think Sasuke gonna let it drag out? Lee was jaw dropped when Sasuke pulled out the Chidori. Sasuke would stand there and let hum charge up. And as for the scaling, just watch Swagkage and SethTheProgrammer's video on Chunnin Sasuke vs Lee🙄
And Gaara always talk to "him"self. And ita was Sasuke who put him in the state, and Sasuke was the only one to make Gaara bleed and get sk desperate that he had to let Shukaku start to take over. And Sasuke STILL injured him after that. Lee never hurt Gaara like that, only his sand armor lmao, Gaara wasnt even brrathing hard against Lee. And base weightless Lee was still getting tagged by Gaara's sand whereas Sasuke wasn't, so Sasuke is already superior to this weightless base Lee you seem to praise so much
I agree with your analysis ma boi, it’s really wonky to say Sasuke beats Lee, and since he said he didn’t really like Lee that much, and presumably he likes sasuke, I’m feeling like Six was a little biased and was trying to find anything to put Sasuke above Rock Lee
Sasuke is in no way fucking Power Cliffing Lee, its just that with what has been shwon and statements, and storyline wise, its implied Sasuke would win. Even the title of the fight was Sand's strongest against Leaf's strongest. Soooo yeah😂 later.
Only thing I disagree with is that Sasuke's AP scales to his defense. We see that he can be damaged by things he can damage, like the sand. This is unless you are talking about his AP in reference to his punches, which are comparable to Lee's, which would invalidate the argument to begin with (i.e. Lee could damage Sasuke). Sasuke still scales above him, but the point still stands Other than that, pretty good video. Looking forward to other projects from you and the other powerscaling goons.
It's Newton's third law, for every action there is an opposite and equal reaction. If Sasuke body was weaker than his attacks, his arms and legs would break/take damage whenever he would use that limb. Lee in 5th gate wouldn't scale to his attacks since he damages himself whenever he throws a punch. In taijutsu 90%> of the time, the recoil hurts the user whenever they use a move that's too strong edit: second -> third
Newton’s laws applies to Physics in our universe It doesn’t work the same way in anime because of the Physics breaking energy coursing through their bodies
@@Shinra0824 the 2nd law of naruto states that you can use life energy to conjure fire from your mouth. So physics isn’t the moooost reliable arguement
Yo would you be interested in either a tier list or power ranking of all the genin in the chuunin exams? Id love to see some more insight on how the 'side cast' ranks up to eachother. I think we all already knew who would be in this top 5, lol
Liked! but I got a few questions regarding lee vs neji, gaara vs lee and sasuke vs gaara. Firstly isn’t there an implication that lee even with the first gate didn’t stand a chance against neji to point where Lee states that the 4th gate(or 3rd) would have been his ace in the hole against him. Also weren’t the gates explained as like a sort of dampener on the body that limits the flow of to much chakra so one move from neji would shut that down assuming this is in character where lee wouldn’t really start off with the 3rd gate? And the gates aren’t a secondary source of power like kurama is for naruto. So he could have won assuming he doesn’t dick around. But if he didn’t gate lee wins assuming neji doesn’t one attack shut that down. Secondly for Lee vs Gaara, lee does more damage to the sand armor than sasuke does which was visibly shown in the manga and he force behind of his attacks were greater seeing as how he hit gaara so hard in the air he didn’t come back down until the end of the reverse lotus, and the point you made with gaara killing people does the blood make the sand harder, iirc so that meaning his armor was harder than it was before his fight with sasuke cause if it was I concede on the AP point for sasuke and lee. Also what do you think of the 1st gate being a 5x increase (if you apply a linear multiplier), guy said that lee could only use 20 percent of his muscle power but in the first gate he could use 100%. Thirdly sasuke vs gaara, I’ve asked this before and it wasn’t addressed sasuke didn’t break through the armor he only cracked it, and from what were shown unless you’ve broken through the sand armor you can’t really hurt gaara all that much. Seth brings up the point that sasuke uses chakra to inflict more damage so wouldn’t that mean his chakra went through the armor to affect him since it physically augmenting his strength didn’t break it either so the only way for it to have hurt his real body is if the chakra had passed through the armor would that be his AP~
Curse mark Sasuke is a threat to Lee and with his Sharingan he’s got the best chances out of anyone to at least see Rock Lee and react to his attacks, he was too quick for Gaara but didn’t have the damage output to finish him. I thought with Chidori he pierced the sand defense and hit Gaara pretty good, I haven’t seen the fight in a long time but I figured that was the whole point of that fight was to show Sasuke has a counter to the sand by cutting through it to hit Gaara instead of trying to beat it down with just Taijutsu. I’m also curious what a Rasengan could do because it’s shown to be stronger than Chidori, would it cut through? Or just blast Gaara out of his shell.
Sasuke beat up a kid who can't throw a punch, it's hard to say how he'd do against a kumite specialist. Weightless Lee's speed didn't impress Neji. If Sasuke's speed scales to weightless Lee, Sasuke can't deal with Neji's Gentle Fist. He just gets negged by chakra points and doesn't get time to charge a Chidori. It's one thing to make narrative arguments, but being a protagonist doesn't make a character stronger
Should Bijuu Gaara really count though. Technically when you look at it, he just took too long to perform that transformation, straight up lost the fight, took a nap and then retook the fight when he can transform right away because his previous long incantation shit was still relevant (I guess). So it's basically same situational type of thing as Naruto with Gamabunta has.
I'd say Naruto was probably the strongest at the time. They were just limited on what they could use becuase of collateral damage. If there were no limitations, I can't see any character standing up to Shukaku or Gamabunta. Sasuke was strong especially if he could use curse mark, but Gaara still mopped him in his bijuu form
@@HC-gm4fo so what you're saying is, if naruto summoned gamabunta to assist him in a fight, gamabunta would simply refuse? Show me the source where this has ever happened? Stop using your head canon bullshit as factual
There are some really rough inconsistancies with this arch of Naruto that make scaling difficult and frustrating. The spirit of what the story wants to convey are typically portrayed in the data books but many of the feats contradict them, the established rules of the universe, or each other at times. For example in Lee's fight with Gaara its shown that gaara has two types of armor and that Lee's tijutsu is based on physical attacks designed to break the body. One armor is a reactive armor that passively protects gaara from most attacks but when it later fails he has an outer shell armor that prevents further impact damage. However, neither of these two types of armor protect gaara from internal damage or sudden changes in inertia and Lee lift kicks gaaras chin twice in the fight with enough force to lift gaara skyward in an instant. Because he was moved, we know some amount of energy was absorbed by the body and the resulting internal damage would likely result in broken cervical vertebra and a severed spinal column. The damage gaara received should have been enough to kill or permanently cripple him for life. But he gets up with no issue after the fight. This means there is a third type of unexplained durability gaara posses that protects his internal organs that's not present in later conflicts (though maybe an argument can be made that the wound he received from Sasuke was healed quickly by the shukaku sand cloak and this durability could be due to being a jinjuriki, but that may be out of reason to explain the severity of wounds that he would have received against Lee). The fact that this durability disappears after this fight entirely means that in order to believe the story one must negate some of Lee's feats and assume they delt less damage than they should have in spite of what was shown.
There’s really no basis to put Sasuke over Lee. Base to base Lee still had the slight speed advantage. This is shown when Guy states that Sasuke was “almost” as fast as Lee without the weights, as well as backed up by the data book which has Lee at a 4/5 in speed vs Sasuke’s 3.5/5. Lee is also physically stronger than Sasuke with a 3.5/5 to Sasuke’s 3/5. When Sasuke hit Gaara, Gaara’s armor cracked and a small piece of armor fell off his face. When Lee hit Gaara, most of his armor on his face fell off. The reason Gaara was out of breath is because Sasuke kept attacked him more than Lee did to wear him out. We have to take into account that Kakashi trained Sasuke for a month straight forming a blueprint on how to beat Gaara. He knew the armor of sand took up more stamina than the automatic shield of sand. Lee on the other hand was learning how Gaara’s techniques worked on the fly. Prep time is a huge advantage for Sasuke. Now in their first fight Lee absolutely bodied Sasuke. Even when Sasuke used his 2 tomoe Sharingan he was helpless. Lee confirms this by saying that even if Sasuke can see his movements it doesn’t matter because his body isn’t fast enough to react to him. That gap is closed once Sasuke finishes his Chidori training with Kakashi. Add that with his sharingan and Sasuke would absolutely be able to keep up with Lee…to an extent. Sasuke can now see and keep up with Lee, but his stamina is nowhere near Lee’s. This was shown when after running around for a few minutes hit Gaara with combos, Sasuke was already breathing hard. That was against a much slower and usually stationary opponent. Sasuke would tire out much quicker against a guy like Lee who can actually still move slightly faster than him. Basically, the longer the fight goes on, the worse it gets for Sasuke. And now we get to the real issue for Sasuke. The 8 gates. We have to remember that the 8 gates are multipliers, just like going Super Saiyan. The very first gate is a 5x multiplier. This is shown when Guy explains that the human body can only use 20% of it’s muscles potential otherwise the muscles would breakdown and disintegrate. The 1st gate gives the user access to 100% of the user’s muscles. The 2nd gate revitalizes the user’s body after opening the 1st gate. From the 3rd gate onward, the user is able to use the Hidden Lotus, and each gate after gate 2 is ANOTHER multiplier. So, I’ll be generous and low ball the gates by saying that each multiplier raises by a factor of 1. Meaning that gate 3 is a 2x multiplier. So, 2 x the 5x amp of the 1st gate is 10x stronger than base. Gate 4 is a 3x multiplier so 3 x the 5x amp of the 1st gate is 15x stronger than base etc. This means that during the Chunin Exams preliminaries when Lee is able to open the first 5 gates that he’s able to achieve a state that makes him 20x stronger than base. Sasuke may have closed the gap base to base, but he wouldn’t be able to react to 4-5th gate Lee. Kakashi needed to use his 3 tomoe Sharingan to see Lee in 8 gates state. To put things into perspective, a stronger Sasuke who still only had a 2 tomoe Sharingan was getting ragdolled by a CM0 Naruto who’s slower than 4-5th gates Lee. Sasuke couldn’t see him or react to him. So, there’s no way Sasuke would be able to react or protect himself against 8 gates Lee. Unlike Gaara, he has no bs way to protect himself (at least until Shippuden). Sasuke matches up better against Gaara because of his Chidori which is a piercing attack as opposed to Lee’s blunt force punches and kicks. We also have to take into account that Gaara was even more mentally unstable than usual in his fight against Sasuke. He became further unhinged once Sasuke started using Lee’s speed and taijutsu. Lee gave Gaara some PTSD shit. There’s a reason Gaara went out of his way to try and kille Lee in the hospital. Lee scarred him mentally. When Sasuke speed blitzed Gaara, Gaara literally pictured Lee and said he’s fast just like that other one. As far as Gaara not turning into a Bijuu after surviving the 8 gates barrage (through bs), there was no reason to transform. Lee was on the ground crawling, he could barely move. And Gaara didn’t get up right away. He was huffing and puffing like the big bad wolf. It took him a little bit to recover, but he is still a jinchuriki. They recover much faster than other shinobi. Base Lee and base Sasuke both were “kicking around Gaara like it was nothing”. The difference is that Sasuke’s combos were done to wear Gaara out, and his speed was needed in order to use Chidori. Now Chidori has more AP than anything Lee has, but it doesn’t matter since Lee wouldn’t be sitting in a sand castle like Gaara. At this point in the story, Sasuke still needs a lot of prep and charge time to use Chidori. No way Lee gives him that kind of time to use it. Basically, what it comes down to is that Sasuke is better equipped to fight Gaara because of his AP, but due to the amps of the 8 gates Lee has the massive speed and strength advantage. It would basically be a replay of their first fight, just at a higher level. But once Lee goes 8 gates it’s GG Brian D. As far as the thinking about what the narrative implied is irrelevant. Naruto and Sasuke are the 2 main characters, they needed a big bad villain to fight at the end of the Chunin Exam arc. It’d be pretty lame if they just fought some random Sand and Sound shinobi. Based on statements, the data book stats, and feats there’s nothing in Sasuke’s arsenal that would keep him from getting mauled by the 8 gates. And I'm sorry, but to say that 5th gate Lee "probably wouldn't even be able to hurt" Sasuke is quite frankly idiotic.
Someone competent needs to debate this. Theres plenty of evidence to draw on whether it be from the sasuke retrieval arc or from lee's showings that can secure him a argument for winning.
Rock Lee loses to Sasuke and he loses to Neji too. Sasuke one shots Lee with chidori, Lee might be a bit faster in 5 gates, but thats not enough to win, as Minato said without sharingan when you move that fast you become tunnel visioned and lose track of whats happening, now most people cant react to attacks that fast so it doesnt really negatively impact Lee that much since they cant react to his speed, however Sasuke in the last round was almost as fast as Lee which is good enough because even though hes a bit slower he has the sharingan which allows him to track Lee and respond to his movements something Lee wouldnt be able to do, all Sasuke has to do is predict the direction Lee is comming at him from and just chidori in that direction and since Lee would be in tunnel vision he wont anticipate the chidori and run straight into it. Thats if Lee can even reach the five gates, as weve seen so far he cant just go straight to 5 gates, he needs to go one by one and Gaara let him do that because he wasnt really there to win he was just there to have his sick fun with pushing Lee to the maximum. Sasuke on the other hand would probably not let that happen and would be actively trying to win at every possibility. Also your commentary on Lee vs Gaara is wrong, Lee couldnt damage Gaara at all, he only put some cracks on his armor thats all, couldnt even break it, the only reason why Gaara was exhaused after their fight was because he was forced to use a lot of chakra to constnatly maintain and repair his armor. So Lee literally acomplished nothing against Gaara apart from forcing him to use a lot of chakra, after Gaara stood up and removed the armor he was perfectly fine. People really overestimate Rock Lee's power.
@@prussianglory4518 I stopped reading at "Lee might be a bit faster in 5 gates". Lol dude you have no idea what you're talking about. The tunneling vision thing only applied to Chidori since you're running in a straight line at high speeds. Sasuke in the Valley of the End fight vs 0 tails Naruto was getting bodied...and 0 tails Naruto is slower and weaker than 4-5 gates Lee.
@@danielisaacs3946 Lol at the valley at the end Naruto only chakra screamed at Sasuke and that pushed him back, then Naruto threw him to a wall and that was their entire interaction, half of their fight in the anime was filler added just to look cool in the animation in the manga a lot less things happen, you cant base your argument on things added to the anime just to look cool Naruto did way more damage to Gaara than Lee with 5 gates, Lee did absolutely nothing his attacks were weak af, you can use youre data books all your want if were going with that Kakashi is omnipotent and solos all of Naruto. Data books arent a good thing to base your arguments on and neither are filler anime scenes, my arguments are only based on whats happening in the canon and what happened in the canon was Lee couldnt even break Gaaras sand armor with all 5 gates. You clearly dont understand how speed and time works and why tunnel vision happens in the first place, it doesnt matter if your going in straight line or however youre going, if your speed increases to abnormal levels tunnel vision always will happen. You are the one who has no idea what hes talking about youre just overrating Lee to make yourself feel good beyond what his feats actually are and what the author intends. Naruto, Sasuke and Neji are all stronger than Lee.
I've never really seen anyone say Neji beats Sasuke, just that it would've been a great fight. But I also don't think you really addressed any argument for why it wouldn't be a stomp for Sasuke. I also think Sasuke's performance is based off of him already seeing Gaara's trouble fighting Lee. I don't think anything Sasuke does compares to even 3rd gate Lee. Chidori piercing Gaara's shield could easily be explained by lightning's elemental advantage over earth.
I’m curious as to your thoughts about a Sasuke vs Lee battle. I do agree with you that Sasuke is stronger but in a full battle, I feel like Sasuke’s Sharinigan would still fail to keep track of Lee’s movements (fifth gate) and I’m not confident that Sasuke could keep up with Lee fighting at that level.
Don’t worry , Sasuke can’t keep up. Sasuke had trouble with enhanced Gaara who is tiers slower than the kyubi red eyed Naruto who speed blitzes Sasuke at the valley. That same kyubi red eyed Naruto is confirmed slower than Drunken lee and 5th gate lee by Kimimaro and his performance compared to kyubi red eyed Naruto.
Great vid, one thing though I hoped you would consider that I never see anyone mention. The gaara vs sasuke fight takes place 1 month after the rock lee fight. And in the manga it’s pretty explicit that gaara has not slept the entire time and shukaku is breaking down gaara psychologically, ie: tricking gaara into releasing him. So when sasuke strolls in and bodies gaara, it’s a garra that is heavily fatigued and mentally nerfed into relying on shukaku. So basically sasuke 4 hitting gaara into submission is more indicative of gaaras fatigue and less indicative of sasukes superiority. And as far as the statement of getting stronger through bloodshed I always interpreted that as a bloodlust fighting amp not strength/AP boost.
In my opinion: Naruto in the finals should be first considering that him with the full Kuybi amp should be stronger than the one that was punching around semi-transformed Gaara also Nejis Ultimate defense was supposed to be stronger than Gaara sand defense and Neji was nearly knocked out by a Single blow from Naruto so even if we keep Gamabunta out of the equation Naruto is first Second in my opinion is Gaara the position between him and the other 3 bellow him are very narrow but im going to give him the edge because he is the most balanced and because he was only losing to Sasuke due to a chakra Nature Disadvantage Number 3 is Lee due to him having the most impressive stats here besides arguably Kuybi chakra amped Naruto while in the Gates Number 4 and Number 5 are Sasuke and Neji due to them having the Best offensive and Defensive weapon respectively in the Group but not being as balanced as the Rest
When jiraiya was wondering if the power was a blessing or curse, hes saying naruto can make it a blessing instead of a curse so the kyubi chakra is lowkey a ninja tool,but yeah
No way is Sasuke beating 5th gate lee, I mean if he lands a chidori he wins but how is he landing chidori, meanwhile lee probably one shots with a punch or two plus he WAYYY faster so hitting sasuke won’t be difficult
Sasuke fanboys and ignorant you tubers would say Sasuke with chidori and sharingan is likely faster or fast enough to counter. 🤦♂️ Due to misconstrued databook analysis. Meanwhile in the actual manga. A stronger version of Sasuke from the valley of the end , in terms of speed wasn’t even noteworthy to base Naruto. Even tho Sasuke was using a full powered chidori and he had his sharingan on. Meanwhile we have a nerfed 1st gate lee having his speed being noteworthy to Curse Mark amped Kimimaro.🥸Same guy who speed blitzes base Naruto and casually stomps his Kyubi eyed form , “IN BASE”. So if a nerfed 1st gated speed is noteworthy to Curse mark amped Kimimaro. Meanwhile a full power chidori sharingan blitz isn’t noteworthy or dangerous for base Naruto. A healthy 5th Gate Lee speed blitzes the crap out of finals Sasuke who is slower than the Sasuke who’s chidori speed wasn’t noteworthy to base Naruto. Finals Sasuke in curse mark form gets blitzed for days.
13:11 yes and also it’s not about how kishi would write it that’s hypothetical u can rlly just compare on their feats and skills and how they would react to each other
I think six just watched seth the programmer's latest video and came to the conclusion that sasuke is stronger than Lee btw swag is also in that video. I am sure six is a massive fanboy and looks up to them as his daddy and mommy respectively.
@@Vid_21 ok even if he does think that way it's not like swag, seth and six have never been in a conversation about sasuke being stronger than Lee I am sure there must have been a video before this or six might have known about their opinion that is all I am saying.
@@Vid_21 the irony about what he’s saying is that swag actually got amps from six for a debate of his, the one against noodles I believe. So if anything, it’s actually swag being influenced by six
@@Vid_21 I agree with u that six is a decent power scaler when it comes to naruto but comparing him with swag come on. Swag is at a whole another level, he has years of experience and creating videos. Swag also has over a million subs. I am not saying that subscribers is equal to quality but still having that many subscribers is insane and it just goes to show that he is beloved and respected by everyone in the Naruto community. Swag is one of the best power scaler's and is also the godfather of all naruto youtubers. He is one of the best content creators ever. Six is more knowledgeable than swag, who decided that? Six is better at debating than swag who decided that? swag and seth are on a completely different level than six it's similar to comparing tenten and sakura with naruto and sasuke of the naruto community.
@@Vid_21 he didn't lost to noodles, swag was holding back and didn't want to fight but debate. It was pain vs kakazu and we all know that pain will no dif kakazu sooooooo. Anyway the point is noodles is an idiot and swag is a beast he doesn't need to be the the best in debating to prove anything he is already the best, swag is the greatest and most respected naruto UA-camr in the universe and that's a fact. He is at the top when it comes to naruto. People like six, noodles, anime wild, barra b and various other naruto youtubers are babies in front of swag.
I guess I'd have to rank them with all their tools and abilities. So 1. Naruto (w/Gamanunta & Red Kyubii Chakra Mode) 2. Gaara (Partial & Full Transformations) 3. Rock Lee (5th Gate) 4. Sasuke (Sharingan & Chidori) 5. Neji (Byakugan) I can see a case for Sasuke being #3 if we factor in the curse seal, especially after he damaged Partial Biju cloak Gaara though.
U were correct until number 3. Finals Neji is above both Finals Sasuke and PRELIMS Lee. His Rotation stands in the same league as Gaara's sand dome which was confirmed in the databook and Rotation's weaker variation (Chakra cocoon) , was stated to be above Sand shield in the Manga. Sand shield >>>>>> Sand armor which pretty much tanked the Gates. So Lee isn't being Finals Neji like he would prelims Neji as he simply can't do anything to his defense. -While for Sasuke , He himself said he was inferior to a Naruto with 2k Clones worth of chakra who is inferior Naruto with Gamabunta summoning worth of chakra which is inferior to the kyubi chakra mode used against Neji in kyubi chakra amounts. It's worth mentioning that Kyubi chakra mode Naruto got another amp of top of that before colliding with Rotation which would push his kyubi chakra levels even further , which Neji still blew away , while off-guard , with a nerfed Rotation. Yea , Sasuke gets stomped by Neji.
...doesn't Sasuke's Chidori Literally counter Garaas Sand at all points? Wouldn't Palm Rotation literally Dispell all Chakra, including Chidori? Hasn't Neji Cucked Lee at all points short of 3rd/5th Gate? So even with all that speed, Neji is still superior to Lee Without the Gates. Lee also has no Nature Release so he can't just burst out an A-Rank Elemental Jutsu to completely counter his enemies nature Release.
I think some things worth mentioning that Six forgot is that Kakashi was rather confident in Sasuke to beat Gaara after learning Chidori, even after he’d seen Gaara outlast and defeat Lee, and Kakashi had been jerking Lee off the entire time. Also probably good to mention that Naruto, even after using Kyubi Chakra and fighting Neji, was getting jealous of Sasuke, and later Jiraiya was able to draw him in but offering “a Jutsu cooler than chidori.” Bringing up the Curse Mark+Sharingan amps prolly would’ve also helped convey to the audience a little more why Sasuke>Lee, as Lee even comments that Sasuke is like his own stats+the Sharingan. Regardless, A tier video
Yea and that confidence was due to chidori which Gai confirms. Gai also confirms that Sasuke is only close to weightless level speed meaning 4th gate lee speed blitzes without issue. Same for curse mark Sasuke since drunken lee , who is slower than 4th gate was said to be too fast by kimimaro. Likewise 1st gate amped lee was also impressive speed wise to a curse mark amped Kimimaro. In regards to Naruto. Curse mark Sasuke himself felt inferior to a Naruto using vastly less chakra than against Neji. That alone puts Naruto in kyubi mode vastly above base and curse mark Sasuke.
Lol not that we’re crying we are just very skeptical to the idea that base sasuke just mops 5th gate lee, like he just survives the 4th gate barrage and the reverse lotus, gets up and just pats off the dust from his black romper unscathed and proceeds to ragdoll or one shot via the chidori.
@@Wicks897 Its stated in multiple Databooks and did more damage to Gaara with 4 hits than Gates Lee did with dozens (which yes, his durability should scale to his AP) it doesn't get more self-explanatory than that.
@@thomaswhite3149 well it’s just left to your interpretation vs mine of the fights. I don’t have the energy to argue right now. It’s late but I get where the arguments for sasuke come from. Just that you can make one for lee.
The only attack that would be a garunteed kill on lee would be chidori, and Sasuke would have to bait lee into it because otherwise lee just dodges it and claps him
Just because they’re in agreement doesn’t mean it’s set and stone arguments can change overtime even Seth admits this. Like the time they thought Kisame beats the 2nd hokage.
@@AskwhoQ your right, but that time was when it was just swag and Seth, now six is here. Also that was a while ago, and it’s still debatable just how strong kisame is.
@@kapitansatoshi7967 I’m saying that just because it’s those 3 it doesn’t mean it’s the end all be all definable answer plus no matter how far in time it is they can still change their opinions.
@@AskwhoQ I’m not saying what ever comes out of their mouths is 100% true, what I’m saying is that a consensus has been made, and this scaling has statements and feats to back it up.
I don't understand including Gaara's Bijuu, which is shukaku taking over entirely, but not Gamabunta which is an extension of Naruto. And when you consider Sasuke started struggling with semi transformed Gaara, but Naruto was able to put down the smack down, even without Gamabunta it's clear he is at minimum #2, or tied with Sasuke for it.
I think saying someone is stronger than someone else is fact because the author would right it that way is flawed. Neji was clearly stronger than the version of Naruto he fought but neji still lost do to main character plot armor. The main characters in Naruto have to win over the side characters. But if you were to put them in a hypothetical I whole heartily believe that 5th hate Lee would clobber sasuke.
I really don't understand why Naruto is so early when you, yourself, said Gamabunta would have made all of the Genin take an L. Also, Neji > Sasuke. 64 palms would have laid out Sasuke. My opinion is this: 5) Sasuke 4) Neji 3) Lee 2) Gara 1) Naruto
Him summoning Gabumanta was a coincidence to say the least when he tried to summon it during the Gaara fight he couldn’t -He also tried in the Sanin deadlock and couldn’t do it either Until he achieved Sage mode, he was never able to summon Gabumanta like that
@@sankeerthkoshy61 What kind of hand canon stuff is that? He can freely summon Gamabunta as long as he's not exhausted like it both instances that you stated. It never once stated he needed sage mode to summon them. If anything, he could summon 3 at a time with Sage Mode.
@@Koby5649 then why didn’t he summon Gabumanta during any of his fights after Gaara and before Pain Such as against Sasuke part 1 -Against the Aktasuki( Obitos and Pains organization) when he fought Kakzu?
In The Manga rlly breaks it down y sasuke is the strongest in the chunin exams ..lee states he’s getting afraid of a weak fatigued sasuke b4 the training & (nerf bcuz he can’t use his sharingen & all his chakra cuz the cm is eating it) ..he didn’t mention that but yuh the konaha crush arc naruto & gaara is the strongest but sasuke was keeping up wit 1tail gaara while fatigued & he beat base gaara wen lee lost to base garra and this gaara got stronger at it stated & he was trying to kill sasuke he only tried to kill lee wen he was crawling away, gaara had to take a nap then rely on Shikoku powers..sasuke was never at full power always nerf if he used the cm then it’s even worse this wat I been saying sasuke stomps everyone in the (chunin exams arc) not konaha crush arc..Black cloak sasuke is the 🐐&
@@Kctyb_ The manga actually breaks down why 5th gate lee would win , not the other way around. Gai literally states that Sasuke in base is only as fast as Lee without weights. Also Sakura and all other genin could easily follow Sasuke’s chidori speed while it wasn’t the same for 5th gate lee. Then we hav the fact that Kimimaro, while amped by partial curse mark level1 , found Lee’s speed with only the 1st gate “impressive” , while lee was nerfed. Same kimimaro in base who easily destroyed a kyubi rage amped Naruto who later went on to easily blitz and manhandle a stronger version of sasuke. This obviously means that a fresh 5th gate lee should easily be tiers faster the kyubi rage amped Naruto who easily destroyed a stronger faster sasuke. 5th gate lee easily beats a much weaker sasuke. Neji and Naruto also beats him so no , Sasuke I wasn’t the goat.
@@allmight3221 lee wasn’t nurf he had the drugs & after a fight u get stronger & faster ..bee states it so no..they couldn’t see sasuke in base wit no cm nerf cuz the cm is eating away his character wen he use the sharingen and to debunked this dumb argument Lee said he’s scared blue shirt weak fatigued damaged nerf cuz of cm sasuke (b4 kakashi training)
@@Kctyb_ 1st Gate Lee was nerfed when kimimaro praised him. He had just returned from surgery and beyond that both Gaara and lee himself confirmed the speed nerf. Read the manga next time and try to incorporate logic. Lee wasn’t scared of nerfed blue suit Sasuke. He was scared of his potential because sasuke had just performed a partial primary lotus so quickly. Lee was still obviously much stronger and faster since Sasuke needed time to get to lee’s base weightless level speed with training lol. Do U even read the manga bro? Or do u jus look at the pretty pictures? U thought u debunked my argument with such a weak stance? Laudable. 5th Gated Lee speed blitzes finals Sasuke with speed tiers upon tiers faster than the speed which garnered praise from cm1 Kimimaro. Simple logic. Same Kimimaro who in base speed blitzed base Naruto on numerous occasions. Which is something a faster version of Sasuke cannot accomplish on any occasion with Chidori. Yet a slowed down nerfed 1st gated Lee’s speed was impressive to an enhanced version of Kimimaro lol. Meaning a fresh 5th gate lee would be dozens of times more impressive to that same kimimaro lol. Meaning 5th Gate Lee is tiers upon tiers above finals Sasuke in speed and can safely blitz him without sasuke being able to properly defend since he’s slower than 3rd gate lee much less 5th.
@@allmight3221 sasuke beat base gaara & lee lost sasuke beat amp gaara the he’s reacting to gaara 1tail while fatigued, lee losssssttt to base gaara & sasuke is stated to be gaara strongest opponent bye bye
Yo it's only been 3 months wild. your so skilled at commentary. Have you seen sonny boy it's not really a action anime but I think it would be interesting to hear your thoughts on it
13:20 sasuke already lost to lee, and it would def be a tough fight even if lee lost. I imagine it’d go something like sasuke bullies lee a lil, lee uses a gate, sasuke uses his 2 tomoe, sasuke could for the most part foresee a couple gates while lee would be able to predict since it’s his movement, and he’s simply spent more time in martial arts. The dude spars against superior dojutsu in neji, and guy
Saskue lost to Lee before the Chunin exams started. They’re taking about if Black Suit Saskue fought Lee in the Chunin exams finals. And with Sharingan, Lee’s Weightless Speed, and enough attack power to damage Gaara without the gates, Lee would need to be in gate 5 to even stand a chance. It might be even possible that such an intense battle would allow Saskue’s Sharingan to evolve to its 3rd Tomoe mid-fight (Like how he got 2nd in his left eye during his fight with Orochimaru in the forest or when he gains 3rd tomoe during his fight at the valley) and at that point Lee is screwed.
@@jkid1337 Having. Third Tomoe increase is hurting no one. Kakashi needed his more experienced three tomoed Sharingan just tk keep up with 3rd gate Lee let alone 5th. Sasuke is getting speed blitzed because even with three Tomoe he wouldn't be able to physically keep up with Lee. You give Sasuke too much credit.
@@jkid1337 sasuke would not unlock his third tomoe. Sasuke wouldn’t have any strong emotions, unless adrenaline is one :p it’s just a simple fight vs a dude who already wiped the floor w/ sasuke who’s ready for a rematch
@@jayvon221 Lies. If that's the case then why didn't he do that against his life long rival Gai? Because Sasuke had already copied what he needed of Lee. Kakashi only helped him train with Chidori.
Sasuke is faster than base Lee, hits harder than base Lee, and Chidori hits way harder than the 5th Gate does. But saying Sasuke hits harder than 5th gate Lee is a bit iffy imo
@@sherminatoranalysis3429 Not really :/ Even after getting pingponged around by 5th gate Lee, Gaara stood up pretty soon after. He really only did damage to the sand armor, as opposed to Gaara's actual body. Sasuke penetrated Gaara's ultimate defense and injured him so bad he had a panic attack and tried to release the 1 tails.
@@ImADolphin he probably could, both Chidori and the 5th gate take a good couple of seconds to activate, but that wasn’t really my point. There were some people that thought Sasuke’s basic Taijutsu(no Ninjutsu or Chidori) was above 5th gate Lee, which I disagreed with.
You said that said sasuke was stronger than Neji so I wanted to know how you thought the fight would play out Keep in mind that naruto is the most unpredictable character in the show
Sasuke doesn’t even scale above Neji If it’s in the forest Sasuke can hide and test the limits of the Byakugan and Neji’s movement and speed to calculate a precise attack that can take him down in one strike In a open area sasuke gets bodied
People always overlook the fact that 64 palms would shut anyone but Gaara and Naruto down and Naruto's second chakra source is the only reason he won. It could be argued that Sasuke's curse mark would feed him chakra, buuut at that point in the story it wasn't that much of an amp. We see experienced cursed mark users go stage 2 while still having chakra and still not scale over Neji...
My biggest hang up with post training Sasuke him getting beaten down by lvl 1 curse release sakon & ukon. Feel like 5th gate lee beats any of the lvl 2 curse seal sound 4. Maybe even two at once
I think people should REALLY be more precise when analyzing this fights. It goes like this: Gaara > Weighted Lee Weightless Lee > Gaara Simple stuff here. Then Gaara gets a BIJUU amp. He changes his demeanor completely and both Kankuro and Temari state that his inner demon has appeared. casual Shukaku amped Gaara > Weightless Lee Then Lee opens the gates. People are, for some reason, in contrast to the "Sasuke downplay" meta, actually downplaying the damage Lee dealt to Gaara. Gaara had his whole armor pretty much tore up (something Sasuke obviusly was not able to do), he was on the floor, and barely able to turn his head and lift his arm to break Lee's already messed up arm and leg. Yes, granted, after that, his armor was regenerated, and he stood up. This is still more impressive than Gaara having his armor slightly shattered in his face, "huffing and puffing" for a few seconds after him standing up like nothing. Gaara was not amped by Shukaku as he was vs Lee when receveing this damage btw. "But Gaara didn't resort to go Bijuu mode vs Lee" That, far from being in favor of Sasuke, goes in favor of Lee. Gaara can do that (at least in public as we've seen) by generating that sand sphere. He had the stamina and chakra to do it vs Sasuke. He couldn't do that vs Lee, HE COULDN'T EVEN MOVE FOR A WHILE. Plus Lee was already destroyed by his own jutsu. By just using a little sand it was enough to end the fight. What's the conclussion? Base Sasuke (no Sharingan) obviously stomps weighted Lee. Weightless Lee is different. They have the same speed/dexterity, but Sasuke does hit harder and is more versatile with his Jutsu, so Sasuke wins again. 4th gate Lee is a completely different animal. He's definetly blitzing Sasuke and, as established above, no, Sasuke is not hitting harder than this Lee. Lee takes it. Now give Sasuke his Sharingan. It's a 2 tomoe, not enough of a power amp, but gives him his precognition. Is it enough to see Lee's moves? Maybe, but like he said "even if your eyes can see through my moves, if your body can't respond, then what's the point?". He has more survability now, but he's probably still losing. Now Chidori. Chidori > Hidden Lotus (making the statement of Sasuke being the strongest opponent consistent) So if he manages to land it, he wins. Can he? it's hard, Lee's way too fast (Kakashi needed his Sharingan to even register his moves). BUT, with substitution + precog I can perfectly See Sasuke landing it and winning the fight. So, in the end, just giving Lee more credit and addressing this new Sasuke jerk off meta that started months ago lmao.
I don't think I need to voice why Lee is the actual best combatant in the chunin exams when everyone else is proving my opinions which is also their own as well... 5th Gate Lee > Sasuke
I don’t agree, did you see Sakura vs Ino. Sakura is much more powerful. She fought a clan heir. MASTERED THE CLONE JUTSU. Not only that Ino was on a team with Shikamaru which means she is comparable to him. Shikamaru fought temari who is stronger than Ten Ten. Who is on Rock Lees team and can be comparable to him. Rock lee clapped Sasuke, later Sasuke clapped Naruto IN 1 TAIL FORM. This Naruto is much weaker than the Naruto who fought Gaara. This means Sakura is stronger than everyone in the chunin exams. CHANGE MY MIND.
Idk if anyone would agree would this and I admit it might be a stretch but, if you assume that neji could probably fold a weightless lee in terms of speed and power, which I think it’s applied he can. Then naruto with the kyubi amp should be relative to that neji considering he was able to keep up with him in speed and power. That means naruto in his kyubi amp should be around the speed of weightless lee. I might be wrong but what do you guys think? This wouldn’t put him above lee or sasuke but it should show that the kyubi amp was huge for naruto who wasn’t anywhere close to weightless lee speed.
I feel a cool thing that could of happened is Sasuke V.S Rock Lee and they be evenly matched and Rock Lee but the gate caught up to Lee and Sasuke barley won and that drove him closer to going orochimaru but then he went on to lose to garra and then naruto on the roof top
I like how naruto gave us so many strong potential filled characters then at the end of the arc there like nahhh everyone is fodder
Nah I think it’s juice because the Villains got too strong like saskue and Naruto are damn near fodder in there own verse 😭
Kishimoto was a good writer until the War arc. He got too tired and said fuck my series and also fuck female character development. And he didn't know how to write romance and ruined the war arc with a nuke spam fest
@@oboxisreal I feel like they shouldn't all have been the same age. For the konoha 11 to be relevant they have to be at least jonin level each and having everyone from one exam be jonin+ is kinda unrealistic imo.
@@7thhokage87 Naruto isn't about romance, so who cares?
@@cloudj232 eh, some care others don't. But did you agree with everything else he said?
Just realized kabuto is technically one of the strongest that participated lmao
Orochimaru enters the chat
If you count Kabuto he bodys everyone besides Gaara and Naruto with Gamabuta or rage nine tail power. He is near part 1 Kakashi.
@@maffhama872 Orochimaru enters the chat once again
@@HC-gm4fo 😂
True 😅 but I’d still probably say he couldn’t get up from a hidden lotus. Only gaara can.
I think the biggest disadvantage Rock Lee has is that he just doesn't have attacks that are strong enough to damage Gaara. He uses his fist's and not a sharp object or anything of that sort so the sand armor can protect more effectively against Rock Lee. Sasuke doesn't have any sort of technique or raw durability to resist Rock Lee's attack's.
If with only 4 hits Sasuke has Gaara on his knees, that means his attacks are much more powerful than 4th gate Lee, and since Sasuke is outputting that much force he can easily resist 4th gate punches
@@AlexMartinez-cu4dw just because Sasuke can deal higher damage doesn't mean his durability is high enough to withstand 4th gate attacks. The two don't correlate. His durability actually seems pretty low at this point. He literally took damage in the continued gara fight once and was taken down. His curse mark was definitely effecting his ability to take damage. I still think he beats Rock Lee but it's closer than you're made it sound.
@@AlexMartinez-cu4dw
I don't understand how Sasuke hitting hard equals to him having durability comparable to Gaara.
@@BusterOlsen if one can output x amount of force with their bare hands, their skin and muscles and bones are unaffected, their body which is made of that same skin bones and muscles logically would withstand a punch that excerpt "y" amount of force, with "y"≤ x in force.
And it's also logical that if he was training to be able to punch and kick that strong, he also trained to increase his durability. If you don't want to give the benefit of the doubt then fine, whatever you say
@@AlexMartinez-cu4dw gaara was on the ground and more fatigued from gaaras 4th/5th gate way longer than gaara was on his knees from sasuke, literally the next panel gaara appeared in he was fine with no fatigue starting the full body possession, meanwhile against lee after the reverse lotus, which he lessened the impact of with his sand, couldn't get up and was huffing and puffing for several panels even though he was actively trying to kill Lee. Stop spreading this blatant lie that base sasuke hits harder than 4th gate lee lol. I'm not even sure if sasuke hits harder than base lee. Base lee hit gaara only twice and knocked him on his ass, although gaara showed no fatigue. Base sasuke hit gaara twice and gaara, just like with lee, was put on his ass but had NO signs of fatigue. It's only after the 3rd and 4th blows (double the amount of blows base lee dealt to him) that gaara dropped to his knees, and it was only for a second. He was on the ground after the reverse lotus for a while
I’d actually love to hear about say characters 6-10. It’d be interesting to see where characters like Temari, Kankuro, Shino, Dosu, etc. scale relative to one another
I think Kankuro is really good, he’s way more versatile and can fight anyone.
@@sercravenmohead3631 got stopped by Shino
I honestly thought Shinzo would at the least be six
@@rayquan777765555344 depending on the match up he'd probably be top 4, there's a video that goes into the hypothetical of the tournament going thru and the author goes into detail on how they all would do and Shino is pretty high up there
you forgot tenten she would be number 6
I want to see what/where Shino stacks up in this. Dude was a finalist just like sasuke/ naruto he even followed sasuke and was yo man we up next then he took on those sand invaders so sasuke could go after Gaara.
Low key diederas alt skin. Bugs tunnel through gaara sand
He could've been dirty and hid a bug on everyone before the match start
Gaara send sand at him to crush him. Bug clone. Attacks so gaara uses sand to defend. Bugs from clone get gaara. GG.
I think these people are focusing too much on how these characters punch and kick, and ignoring the matchups like Chidori being a very different type of attack than the stuff Lee was throwing out. Neji could probably also break through gaara's defense due to the nature of gentle fist.
The gentle fist is stated to mainly deal internal damage as opposed to external damage.
@@ImADolphin I agree with the main statement only because, like you said, it deals with internal damage, so if Neji used the gentle fist on Gaara's sand, it would actually stop his mom from controlling the sand and Force Gaara to use his own chakra to control the sand now and try to juggle that with the and armor that takes most of his chakra as stated by Kankuro. Even Six says that it would take 3rd gate Lee at the very least to tag this kid as stated by Lee and Gai, so his reaction speed is insane enough not to get hit by the sand, but his movement speed seems to be relative to that of either weightless Lee or 2nd Gate Lee depending on how you interpret the statement and weightless Lee's speed is enough to out speed Gaara's sand anyway so in a non Biju fight, I'd say Neji has the upper hand
@@foresightmystery9845 It deals internal damage as in internal organs and chakra nodes. I don't see any evidence you can use taijutsu to negate an actual spiritual entity possessing an object.
I agree that Neji is faster than Gaara, but I'm not convinced any of his attacks would be able to get through the sand to damage him. He's fast enough to stall for a bit, but he's not winning unless he can actually hit Gaara before running out of chakra.
@@ImADolphin on the contrary, chakra is spiritual and physical energy combined. Gaara's mother's spirit possesses his physical sand meaning her chakra is within that sand, so it can be negated by the gentle fist. For further evidence of spirits being chakra I point to the soul tug of wars throughout the war Arc and Naruto's taming of Kurama, and the addition of Minato, Kushina, and Dan's souls being chakra that enters a body. It's very plausible that he can negate Gaara's mother from controlling the sand shield forcing Gaara to use his own chakra to control it.
Let's even say he can't and entertain your idea. You do agree that Neji is fast enough to bipass the sand and we see that Lee and Sasuke both can make contact with Gaara with just the weightless speed, so Neji can definitely stop Gaara's chakra immediately during the fight. Now as far as Gaara calling on Shikaku right after is a different story, but even then, he COUNTERED kyuubi essence Naruto which is something Gaara couldn't even do. Just a bit of kyuubi essence and Naruto broke outta all of Gaara's sand abilities and that's when he was using shikaku's power.
Not saying Neji could pull off a win against Shikaku Gaara cuz he doesn't have a giant summon to put him near Gaara's body, just saying that up until that giant awakening point, Neji still has a chance to win before full possession
@@foresightmystery9845 Chakra being spiritual in nature is true, but broad. I don't think it's fair to use that to suggest that any technique that shuts down chakra would shut down anything that's chakra based. We've seen how the gentle fist works, it uses precise pin point movements to slightly alter or stop the flow of chakra though a specific point in the body. You're not using it to completely shut down spirits over such a broad undefined area. You make it sound like Neji would just touch the sand and instantly negate the spirit controlling it, when there's no evidence the gentle fist works that way.
What instance are you talking about where Naruto broke out of the sand with Kyuubi influence? He summoned Gamabunta to break out of the sand, didn't he?
Sasuke's feats against Gaara were him with the nature advantage, remember: lightning is effective against earth. So Sasuke would be harder for Gaara to face, hence Sasuke was his hardest opponent as stated by the databooks. I think that under neutral circumstances 5th gate lee would win against Sasuke, although it would be very close.
We’re is it stated that Gaara’s Sand is Earth Release?
@@tyrellturner5602 it's sand, which is made up of Earth. It's basic common sense knowledge
@@7thhokage87 We have seen wind attacks that use Sand as a component
And it would make sense for his Sand to be wind release as he’s LITERALLY the leader of land of wind
And he’s the Jinchiriki of Shikaku who uses wind release
So there’s arguments to be made for it not being a earth jutsu either
Also I asked you to tell me WHERE it’s STATED that Gaara’s sand is Earth Release
And instead of giving me ACTUAL evidence to back up your point your just giving assumptions
The reality is that we don’t know for sure what release his Sand it. There aren’t any concrete evidence to prove it. It’s just headcannon assumption
okay but wind is effective against lightning
@@tyrellturner5602 its wind release and earth release
Six, love the videos but i gotta disagree on sasukes feats vs gaara being better than lees, specifically you mentioning him hitting gaara 4 times. Lee hits gaara twice then claims that that current level of taijutsu won't be sufficient to take down gaara, so he prompts for the forward lotus, which gaara ultimately substitutes out of to dodge the significant damage dealt by the final blow. Yes, gaara does drop to his knees for a bit after sasuke gets the 4th hit in, but he literally is completely recovered with no fatigue the next page starting the full body possession, guy even questions kakashi stating that he knows that level of taijutsu will not beat gaara so why did he bother to only teach him taijutsu (before sasuke uses chidori). After lee hits him with 4th/5th gate, gaara is obviously much more visibly damaged than he was against sasuke (more cracks covering the entire surface of his body with pieces completely chipped off) and he was more fatigued as well he couldn't even get himself off the ground even though he was actively trying to kill Lee before guy stepped in, reminder that this is after gaara substituted out of forward lotus and lessened the impact of the reverse lotus. So I can't with any faith at all claim sasuke ≥ 5th gate lee in terms of ap and actually believe it. The databook statement is likely either referring to sasukes use of chidori and not his taijutsu, OR Gaaras perception of sasuke being the strongest since that's how he was portayed when gaara first met him (konohas top rookie + member of legendary clan) as well as him seeing part of the training he'd done with kakashi. We also don't know how the shift in his mental state affected his strength so i won't use it as a point, just saying it exists. All in all still a great video and i enjoy the content that's just my 2 cents
Also the argument towards the end about kishimoto wouldn't write sasuke to lose to lee, cmon dog you're literally arguing sasuke wins because plot armor at that point you know that don't work in a vs debate 😭😭
@@kenan-b so true lmaoo
That’s pretty good as a contention to the AP point.
@@kenan-b This is exctly what I was thinking. That entire sasuke point just did not make any sense to me and bringing up the whole kishimoto thing just felt like he was running out of reasons. I love the content but that just made no sense at all
Naruto would piece up both of them, lil dude can summon Gamabunta.
Yessss!! Been waiting this video ever since seth posted the vs between sasuke and lee
Biggest plot hole is that the sand village couldn't assassinate Gara
is this comment a joke
Gamabunta isn’t fighting a kid in the chunin exams
Yeah I’m character it doesn’t make sense but power scaling wise naruto stomps all of them
Rock Lee fresh out of hospital (with little to no training) went toe to toe with Kimimaro and put up decent fight.. Those are feats he was capable of during Chūnin Exams.
Kimimaro > Low difficulty beat kyuubi amped Naruto + his 100 clones. - Keep in mind just 1 amped Naruto annihilated Haku and his crystal ice mirrors.
So it's obvious Rock Lee > Naruto (without tailed cloaks)
How does ( Final Exam) - Sasuke stack up to Kimimaro - Compared to Rock Lee - That would determine 2nd place of that list.
He did not put up a decent fight against Kimmimaro. Kimmimaro lightly tapping into the first stage of his curse mark was enough to dominate Lee.
All that proves is that Drunken Fist lee~kimimaro not CE lee the Drunken Fist amps you and even amps him to a level that scares gai
Dude Naruto didn't annihilate Haku, you're fucken delusional 😭😭. Haku could've clapped all of team seven by himself but he didn't bc he was fond of naruto and sasuke. They literally state it in the manga 💀
Base lee wasn’t going toe to toe with kimimaro. Kimimaro easily stomped him and it was way easier than it was with Naruto. Drunken lee and 1st Gated Lee were the ones that earned direct praise from kimi.
The argument "would kishi really write Sasuke losing to lee in the final" I mean he did write Gaara besting him, so the question is really would him losing serve the plot? Not only that but being a main character doesn't mean you're immune to defeat, hell a good example of Sasuke not being immune to losing is his first fight with lee, or one of my favorites: him getting rocked by Bee in shippuden. The way I viewed the strongest in the chunin exams would be Naruto, Gaara, Lee/Neji, & Sasuke
I view it this way. I can't imagine Sasuke hitting 5th Gate Lee with a chidori
Sasuke has a record of performing very poorly against outgoing male characters with 3 letter names ending in 'ee'
Base Gaara gets mid diffed by Neji
@@HC-gm4fo lol base garaa would wash neji but ok
@@tommyinit9263 base Gaara loses pretty bad tbh
Chunin exams scaling provides some of the best discussions in the series
I'm going to argue you on one point and say that Lee beats unboosted Sasuke (curse mark probably stomps). I'm not the biggest Lee stan in the world but there's a few arguments that don't sit right with me. The databook statement makes this a pretty open and shut case, so I have to ignore it moving forward, but if you want to just take that as gospel then yes Lee loses and I'm wrong. That's a perfectly valid interpretation imo but there's still some room for doubt in my mind.
Saying that Gaara got stronger is pretty speculative. I can't prove that he didn't train at all but it would make more sense for his character, since he's pretty much just coasted on his sand shield and natural talent. The argument of getting stronger through bloodshed is sound, but also completely unquantifiable. Unless I'm mistaken, we only see him kill 3 people. Dosu, and those two randos in the hallway. We have no way of knowing how much this powers him up. There's actually more evidence to suggest that the increase is barely noticeable. Sasuke's speed is compared to weightless Lee, not significantly faster. This Sasuke is still able to connect attacks, suggesting that base weightless Lee would be able to do the same thing. If Gaara got stronger, it was probably not by a significant amount.
It's true that Sasuke's 4 attacks got more intense of a reaction from Gaara than Lee's barrage of hits. However, it's possible that this doesn't have anything to do with their respective levels of power. Temari states that Gaara has been getting less and less stable as the Chunin exams have gone on. While this statement comes during the preliminaries, we have no reason to assume that this deterioration of his sanity has stopped. Based on Gaara's behavior during the one month gap, it's safe to say that, if anything, it's gotten worse. By the time he fights Sasuke, he's already ready to snap and transform, and Sasuke's rapid improvement probably just pushed him over the edge. This is a much more believable explanation than claiming that 4 attacks from base Sasuke hurt Gaara more than dozens from 5th gate Lee, which seems almost self-evidently false. (Small point, but saying that Gaara "got up" after the reverse lotus is not at all true. He was on the ground and barely able to move.
Lee being scared of Saskuke doesn't mean anything. He's also scared of Neji, who you yourself agree that Lee beats soundly (which I agree with, for the record). Guy's comparisons also don't mean much. Seeing Sasuke replicate Lee's speed so soon after Lee being crippled night have been causing him to think irrationally. Even if we assume he's not, him getting jealous doesn't even mean that Sasuke is stronger.
"If these two fight, do you really think he would have Sasuke lose?" This is the only argument I think is outright bad lmao. Does it matter? They didn't fight. To take it to an extreme that's like saying "If part 1 Naruto fought Madara, do you think Kishimoto would have his main character lose?" Maybe that's the reason they didn't fight? Just an idea.
This man spittin some logic!
I don’t see Lee beating Neji to be honest
There are multiple things wrong with your argument for one might guy is never implied to think irrationally, Gaara's mental state does not affect the sand, Gaara still got stronger not faster and Lee's opinion is valid. Most of what you said is speculative
@@Redoren966 Even if Guy isn't thinking irrationally that doesn't mean Sasuke is stronger than Lee. It was kind of implied that that's what he was thinking, but it doesn't mean he's right and it's also never made explicit that that's what he thought. I never said Gaara's mental state affected the sand, I said that his mental state affected how quickly he's willing to transform into Shukaku. Saying that Gaara got stronger in everything except speed is being very selective in your interpretation of the facts, and even if it's true it doesn't change the fact that it's completely unquantifiable, and there's no way of showing how significant the increase is.
@@Redoren966 Also saying Lee's opinion is valid implies that you think him being scared of Neji is also valid. In other words, you think Neji beats Lee, which is fine if you think that, but that's an entirely different argument.
It’s seems very odd to me to scale Sasuke over Lee almost purely because of Databook statements
Sasuke is stated to be as fast a weightless Lee. But Lee can use up till the 5th Gate. So logically Lee would speed blitz tf out of Sasuke if Sasuke only scales to Base Lee but Lee has multiple transformations above this that amp his speed
Hell even KAKASHI needed to use his Sharingan just to keep track of 3rd Gate Lee 😂( not even 5th Gate just 3rd)
So what makes you think Sasuke with a weaker Sharingan and less experience using it, would be able to keep up with Lee?
Also it’s stated that Sasuke using Lee’s Taijutsu was tiring him out. So if even just him using BASE Lee level speed is a stamina drain for him there’s no conceivable way that Sasuke would be able to keep up with Lee. Especially if the fight dragged on long enough
Also your claiming that Sasuke should have the durability to tank 5th Gate Lee’s attacks but you failed to provide ANY durability feats to back up this claim.
We see that when Sasuke uses Chidori Gaara is able to stab and penetrate Sasuke cutting him in multiple places with his sand. So if Sasuke is being injured by these sand spikes (that have even less sand in them then what Gaara used to crush BASE Lee’s arm) then that should prove that Sasuke does not have 5th Gate + level durability.
Sure Sasuke’s AP would be higher than 5th Gate Lee because of his Chidori.
But there’s no way in hell that Lee would allow Sasuke the chance to charge up a Chidori like he did against Gaara
Especially given the MASSIVE speed advantage that Lee has ( as discussed earlier)
Also Gaara was mentally unstable during his fight with Sasuke. At the start of the fight he’s LITERALLY talking to himself😂 And through out the fight we get scenes of Gaara’s team talking about how Gaara is acting strange and going against there plans. So that would effect his scaling during this fight as well
I feel like the only way you can get Chunin Exam Sasuke beating 5th Gate Lee in a fight is by using databook statements and weird assTV guides. I just get the impression that your REALLY reaching for arguments here. Cuz if you just look at the feats and statements made in the series it should be abundantly clear that Lee would beat Sasuke in a fight at this point in the show
What makes you think Sasuke gonna let it drag out? Lee was jaw dropped when Sasuke pulled out the Chidori. Sasuke would stand there and let hum charge up. And as for the scaling, just watch Swagkage and SethTheProgrammer's video on Chunnin Sasuke vs Lee🙄
thank you bro, speed alone is too much of a factor. let alone everything else. lee would stomp
And Gaara always talk to "him"self. And ita was Sasuke who put him in the state, and Sasuke was the only one to make Gaara bleed and get sk desperate that he had to let Shukaku start to take over. And Sasuke STILL injured him after that. Lee never hurt Gaara like that, only his sand armor lmao, Gaara wasnt even brrathing hard against Lee. And base weightless Lee was still getting tagged by Gaara's sand whereas Sasuke wasn't, so Sasuke is already superior to this weightless base Lee you seem to praise so much
I agree with your analysis ma boi, it’s really wonky to say Sasuke beats Lee, and since he said he didn’t really like Lee that much, and presumably he likes sasuke, I’m feeling like Six was a little biased and was trying to find anything to put Sasuke above Rock Lee
Sasuke is in no way fucking Power Cliffing Lee, its just that with what has been shwon and statements, and storyline wise, its implied Sasuke would win. Even the title of the fight was Sand's strongest against Leaf's strongest. Soooo yeah😂
later.
You know what I wanna see? Hiruzen Power Scaling during his Orochimaru fight.
OMG finally!!!!! Ive been waiting for this.
But wait no Swag or Seth Colab?
Only thing I disagree with is that Sasuke's AP scales to his defense. We see that he can be damaged by things he can damage, like the sand. This is unless you are talking about his AP in reference to his punches, which are comparable to Lee's, which would invalidate the argument to begin with (i.e. Lee could damage Sasuke). Sasuke still scales above him, but the point still stands Other than that, pretty good video. Looking forward to other projects from you and the other powerscaling goons.
It's Newton's third law, for every action there is an opposite and equal reaction. If Sasuke body was weaker than his attacks, his arms and legs would break/take damage whenever he would use that limb. Lee in 5th gate wouldn't scale to his attacks since he damages himself whenever he throws a punch. In taijutsu 90%> of the time, the recoil hurts the user whenever they use a move that's too strong
edit: second -> third
@@Shinra0824 thats Newton 3rd law actually. The 2nd is F=ma. But it’s just a little mistake.
@@Wicks897 It didn't feel right when I wrote it, thanks for the clarification.
Newton’s laws applies to Physics in our universe
It doesn’t work the same way in anime because of the Physics breaking energy coursing through their bodies
@@Shinra0824 the 2nd law of naruto states that you can use life energy to conjure fire from your mouth. So physics isn’t the moooost reliable arguement
6:04 I honestly thought nobody would ever bring up that feat 🤡👍🔥 good stuff
I feel there's a lot Orochimaru downplay in the community and i want to what people think of it
Yo would you be interested in either a tier list or power ranking of all the genin in the chuunin exams? Id love to see some more insight on how the 'side cast' ranks up to eachother. I think we all already knew who would be in this top 5, lol
Liked! but I got a few questions regarding lee vs neji, gaara vs lee and sasuke vs gaara.
Firstly isn’t there an implication that lee even with the first gate didn’t stand a chance against neji to point where Lee states that the 4th gate(or 3rd) would have been his ace in the hole against him. Also weren’t the gates explained as like a sort of dampener on the body that limits the flow of to much chakra so one move from neji would shut that down assuming this is in character where lee wouldn’t really start off with the 3rd gate? And the gates aren’t a secondary source of power like kurama is for naruto. So he could have won assuming he doesn’t dick around. But if he didn’t gate lee wins assuming neji doesn’t one attack shut that down.
Secondly for Lee vs Gaara, lee does more damage to the sand armor than sasuke does which was visibly shown in the manga and he force behind of his attacks were greater seeing as how he hit gaara so hard in the air he didn’t come back down until the end of the reverse lotus, and the point you made with gaara killing people does the blood make the sand harder, iirc so that meaning his armor was harder than it was before his fight with sasuke cause if it was I concede on the AP point for sasuke and lee. Also what do you think of the 1st gate being a 5x increase (if you apply a linear multiplier), guy said that lee could only use 20 percent of his muscle power but in the first gate he could use 100%.
Thirdly sasuke vs gaara, I’ve asked this before and it wasn’t addressed sasuke didn’t break through the armor he only cracked it, and from what were shown unless you’ve broken through the sand armor you can’t really hurt gaara all that much. Seth brings up the point that sasuke uses chakra to inflict more damage so wouldn’t that mean his chakra went through the armor to affect him since it physically augmenting his strength didn’t break it either so the only way for it to have hurt his real body is if the chakra had passed through the armor would that be his AP~
This is the comment. Thanks for asking without me asking. Hope he responds
This is ass
W
@@vinno5901 lol, thank you.
Curse mark Sasuke is a threat to Lee and with his Sharingan he’s got the best chances out of anyone to at least see Rock Lee and react to his attacks, he was too quick for Gaara but didn’t have the damage output to finish him. I thought with Chidori he pierced the sand defense and hit Gaara pretty good, I haven’t seen the fight in a long time but I figured that was the whole point of that fight was to show Sasuke has a counter to the sand by cutting through it to hit Gaara instead of trying to beat it down with just Taijutsu. I’m also curious what a Rasengan could do because it’s shown to be stronger than Chidori, would it cut through? Or just blast Gaara out of his shell.
“I’ll just play the clip” mean while the clip is Garra just getting ping ponged in the air
Technically Kabuto was in the exams
I’m just saying👀
You're my favorite Naruto content creator to listen to at night because your monotone mumbling acts as white noise and helps me fall asleep.
gotta love seeing some respect for my homie Sasuke.
six's editing is a breathe of fresh air, its so well done
This is so cap everyone knows that tenten was the strongest in the chunin exams bro, massive L
Like bro what is sasuke gonna do to 10000 kunais
@@AskwhoQ yeah exactly
Tenten is literally sage of sSix pATHS
I really enjoyed this one young Six keep excelling homie 🙏
"I personally don't think Rock Lee is all that cool."
Aight Ima head out
Its tru tho😏 lee is a bowl cut dork wearing a green onsie that even jiraya said was lame😂
@@grievingstereo8527 Yes, that's the point. Steve Urkle is a dork too and he's one of most iconic characters ever.
@@grievingstereo8527 Lmao dawg you’re so mean.
Lee's design is based off Bruce Lee
Not after Sauske just magically catches up to him in a month maybe...completely dumb imo
Neji eating all these guys up, they're food, edibles. Smackables.
Sasuke beat up a kid who can't throw a punch, it's hard to say how he'd do against a kumite specialist. Weightless Lee's speed didn't impress Neji. If Sasuke's speed scales to weightless Lee, Sasuke can't deal with Neji's Gentle Fist. He just gets negged by chakra points and doesn't get time to charge a Chidori. It's one thing to make narrative arguments, but being a protagonist doesn't make a character stronger
Man I really wanted Shino to get some shine back then, nice video!
Bro is arguing plot armor
Should Bijuu Gaara really count though. Technically when you look at it, he just took too long to perform that transformation, straight up lost the fight, took a nap and then retook the fight when he can transform right away because his previous long incantation shit was still relevant (I guess). So it's basically same situational type of thing as Naruto with Gamabunta has.
I'd say Naruto was probably the strongest at the time. They were just limited on what they could use becuase of collateral damage. If there were no limitations, I can't see any character standing up to Shukaku or Gamabunta. Sasuke was strong especially if he could use curse mark, but Gaara still mopped him in his bijuu form
You don’t have to stand up to Gamabunta
Gamabunta would not participate at all
Naruto can’t control him at all
@@HC-gm4fo so what you're saying is, if naruto summoned gamabunta to assist him in a fight, gamabunta would simply refuse? Show me the source where this has ever happened? Stop using your head canon bullshit as factual
@@leonardorodriguez690 when he summons him against Gaara lol
The only reason he help was because of his son
@@HC-gm4fo it was clearly in there for comedic reasons, if naruto needed his help he would help lol
@@HC-gm4fo Naruto has plothax
There are some really rough inconsistancies with this arch of Naruto that make scaling difficult and frustrating. The spirit of what the story wants to convey are typically portrayed in the data books but many of the feats contradict them, the established rules of the universe, or each other at times.
For example in Lee's fight with Gaara its shown that gaara has two types of armor and that Lee's tijutsu is based on physical attacks designed to break the body. One armor is a reactive armor that passively protects gaara from most attacks but when it later fails he has an outer shell armor that prevents further impact damage. However, neither of these two types of armor protect gaara from internal damage or sudden changes in inertia and Lee lift kicks gaaras chin twice in the fight with enough force to lift gaara skyward in an instant. Because he was moved, we know some amount of energy was absorbed by the body and the resulting internal damage would likely result in broken cervical vertebra and a severed spinal column. The damage gaara received should have been enough to kill or permanently cripple him for life. But he gets up with no issue after the fight. This means there is a third type of unexplained durability gaara posses that protects his internal organs that's not present in later conflicts (though maybe an argument can be made that the wound he received from Sasuke was healed quickly by the shukaku sand cloak and this durability could be due to being a jinjuriki, but that may be out of reason to explain the severity of wounds that he would have received against Lee). The fact that this durability disappears after this fight entirely means that in order to believe the story one must negate some of Lee's feats and assume they delt less damage than they should have in spite of what was shown.
Why wasn’t gamabunta brought up it’s literally what he learned to do for the Chunin exams and was saving it as a secret weapon
Cause that'll make him above Sasuke lmao. Sasuke fan boys forget the show is called NARUTO lmao.
I have been waiting for this thanks buddy!!!
There’s really no basis to put Sasuke over Lee. Base to base Lee still had the slight speed advantage. This is shown when Guy states that Sasuke was “almost” as fast as Lee without the weights, as well as backed up by the data book which has Lee at a 4/5 in speed vs Sasuke’s 3.5/5. Lee is also physically stronger than Sasuke with a 3.5/5 to Sasuke’s 3/5. When Sasuke hit Gaara, Gaara’s armor cracked and a small piece of armor fell off his face. When Lee hit Gaara, most of his armor on his face fell off. The reason Gaara was out of breath is because Sasuke kept attacked him more than Lee did to wear him out. We have to take into account that Kakashi trained Sasuke for a month straight forming a blueprint on how to beat Gaara. He knew the armor of sand took up more stamina than the automatic shield of sand. Lee on the other hand was learning how Gaara’s techniques worked on the fly. Prep time is a huge advantage for Sasuke.
Now in their first fight Lee absolutely bodied Sasuke. Even when Sasuke used his 2 tomoe Sharingan he was helpless. Lee confirms this by saying that even if Sasuke can see his movements it doesn’t matter because his body isn’t fast enough to react to him. That gap is closed once Sasuke finishes his Chidori training with Kakashi. Add that with his sharingan and Sasuke would absolutely be able to keep up with Lee…to an extent. Sasuke can now see and keep up with Lee, but his stamina is nowhere near Lee’s. This was shown when after running around for a few minutes hit Gaara with combos, Sasuke was already breathing hard. That was against a much slower and usually stationary opponent. Sasuke would tire out much quicker against a guy like Lee who can actually still move slightly faster than him. Basically, the longer the fight goes on, the worse it gets for Sasuke.
And now we get to the real issue for Sasuke. The 8 gates. We have to remember that the 8 gates are multipliers, just like going Super Saiyan. The very first gate is a 5x multiplier. This is shown when Guy explains that the human body can only use 20% of it’s muscles potential otherwise the muscles would breakdown and disintegrate. The 1st gate gives the user access to 100% of the user’s muscles. The 2nd gate revitalizes the user’s body after opening the 1st gate. From the 3rd gate onward, the user is able to use the Hidden Lotus, and each gate after gate 2 is ANOTHER multiplier. So, I’ll be generous and low ball the gates by saying that each multiplier raises by a factor of 1. Meaning that gate 3 is a 2x multiplier. So, 2 x the 5x amp of the 1st gate is 10x stronger than base. Gate 4 is a 3x multiplier so 3 x the 5x amp of the 1st gate is 15x stronger than base etc. This means that during the Chunin Exams preliminaries when Lee is able to open the first 5 gates that he’s able to achieve a state that makes him 20x stronger than base.
Sasuke may have closed the gap base to base, but he wouldn’t be able to react to 4-5th gate Lee. Kakashi needed to use his 3 tomoe Sharingan to see Lee in 8 gates state. To put things into perspective, a stronger Sasuke who still only had a 2 tomoe Sharingan was getting ragdolled by a CM0 Naruto who’s slower than 4-5th gates Lee. Sasuke couldn’t see him or react to him. So, there’s no way Sasuke would be able to react or protect himself against 8 gates Lee. Unlike Gaara, he has no bs way to protect himself (at least until Shippuden).
Sasuke matches up better against Gaara because of his Chidori which is a piercing attack as opposed to Lee’s blunt force punches and kicks. We also have to take into account that Gaara was even more mentally unstable than usual in his fight against Sasuke. He became further unhinged once Sasuke started using Lee’s speed and taijutsu. Lee gave Gaara some PTSD shit. There’s a reason Gaara went out of his way to try and kille Lee in the hospital. Lee scarred him mentally. When Sasuke speed blitzed Gaara, Gaara literally pictured Lee and said he’s fast just like that other one.
As far as Gaara not turning into a Bijuu after surviving the 8 gates barrage (through bs), there was no reason to transform. Lee was on the ground crawling, he could barely move. And Gaara didn’t get up right away. He was huffing and puffing like the big bad wolf. It took him a little bit to recover, but he is still a jinchuriki. They recover much faster than other shinobi. Base Lee and base Sasuke both were “kicking around Gaara like it was nothing”. The difference is that Sasuke’s combos were done to wear Gaara out, and his speed was needed in order to use Chidori. Now Chidori has more AP than anything Lee has, but it doesn’t matter since Lee wouldn’t be sitting in a sand castle like Gaara. At this point in the story, Sasuke still needs a lot of prep and charge time to use Chidori. No way Lee gives him that kind of time to use it.
Basically, what it comes down to is that Sasuke is better equipped to fight Gaara because of his AP, but due to the amps of the 8 gates Lee has the massive speed and strength advantage. It would basically be a replay of their first fight, just at a higher level. But once Lee goes 8 gates it’s GG Brian D.
As far as the thinking about what the narrative implied is irrelevant. Naruto and Sasuke are the 2 main characters, they needed a big bad villain to fight at the end of the Chunin Exam arc. It’d be pretty lame if they just fought some random Sand and Sound shinobi. Based on statements, the data book stats, and feats there’s nothing in Sasuke’s arsenal that would keep him from getting mauled by the 8 gates.
And I'm sorry, but to say that 5th gate Lee "probably wouldn't even be able to hurt" Sasuke is quite frankly idiotic.
Yeah he was smoking that swagkage shit for this video.
Someone competent needs to debate this. Theres plenty of evidence to draw on whether it be from the sasuke retrieval arc or from lee's showings that can secure him a argument for winning.
Rock Lee loses to Sasuke and he loses to Neji too. Sasuke one shots Lee with chidori, Lee might be a bit faster in 5 gates, but thats not enough to win, as Minato said without sharingan when you move that fast you become tunnel visioned and lose track of whats happening, now most people cant react to attacks that fast so it doesnt really negatively impact Lee that much since they cant react to his speed, however Sasuke in the last round was almost as fast as Lee which is good enough because even though hes a bit slower he has the sharingan which allows him to track Lee and respond to his movements something Lee wouldnt be able to do, all Sasuke has to do is predict the direction Lee is comming at him from and just chidori in that direction and since Lee would be in tunnel vision he wont anticipate the chidori and run straight into it. Thats if Lee can even reach the five gates, as weve seen so far he cant just go straight to 5 gates, he needs to go one by one and Gaara let him do that because he wasnt really there to win he was just there to have his sick fun with pushing Lee to the maximum. Sasuke on the other hand would probably not let that happen and would be actively trying to win at every possibility.
Also your commentary on Lee vs Gaara is wrong, Lee couldnt damage Gaara at all, he only put some cracks on his armor thats all, couldnt even break it, the only reason why Gaara was exhaused after their fight was because he was forced to use a lot of chakra to constnatly maintain and repair his armor. So Lee literally acomplished nothing against Gaara apart from forcing him to use a lot of chakra, after Gaara stood up and removed the armor he was perfectly fine. People really overestimate Rock Lee's power.
@@prussianglory4518 I stopped reading at "Lee might be a bit faster in 5 gates". Lol dude you have no idea what you're talking about. The tunneling vision thing only applied to Chidori since you're running in a straight line at high speeds. Sasuke in the Valley of the End fight vs 0 tails Naruto was getting bodied...and 0 tails Naruto is slower and weaker than 4-5 gates Lee.
@@danielisaacs3946 Lol at the valley at the end Naruto only chakra screamed at Sasuke and that pushed him back, then Naruto threw him to a wall and that was their entire interaction, half of their fight in the anime was filler added just to look cool in the animation in the manga a lot less things happen, you cant base your argument on things added to the anime just to look cool Naruto did way more damage to Gaara than Lee with 5 gates, Lee did absolutely nothing his attacks were weak af, you can use youre data books all your want if were going with that Kakashi is omnipotent and solos all of Naruto. Data books arent a good thing to base your arguments on and neither are filler anime scenes, my arguments are only based on whats happening in the canon and what happened in the canon was Lee couldnt even break Gaaras sand armor with all 5 gates. You clearly dont understand how speed and time works and why tunnel vision happens in the first place, it doesnt matter if your going in straight line or however youre going, if your speed increases to abnormal levels tunnel vision always will happen. You are the one who has no idea what hes talking about youre just overrating Lee to make yourself feel good beyond what his feats actually are and what the author intends. Naruto, Sasuke and Neji are all stronger than Lee.
All love Six, Tenten said that bc its 360, before she saw his sand dome or of course anything with shukaku
one word: GAMABUNTA
Naruto stomps
It’s great to see how fast you’ve growing. I subbed when you were at 2k subs and you’re starting to blow up 🤟🏾
I've never really seen anyone say Neji beats Sasuke, just that it would've been a great fight. But I also don't think you really addressed any argument for why it wouldn't be a stomp for Sasuke. I also think Sasuke's performance is based off of him already seeing Gaara's trouble fighting Lee. I don't think anything Sasuke does compares to even 3rd gate Lee. Chidori piercing Gaara's shield could easily be explained by lightning's elemental advantage over earth.
Neji smacks Sasuke
Naruto can summon Gamabunta
@@sercravenmohead3631 sooo. He can’t control him
He does not listen to Naruto at all.
@@HC-gm4fo Yeah but he’s Jiraiya’s boy, gang rules son
@@sercravenmohead3631 that’s funny lol
I’m curious as to your thoughts about a Sasuke vs Lee battle. I do agree with you that Sasuke is stronger but in a full battle, I feel like Sasuke’s Sharinigan would still fail to keep track of Lee’s movements (fifth gate) and I’m not confident that Sasuke could keep up with Lee fighting at that level.
Don’t worry , Sasuke can’t keep up. Sasuke had trouble with enhanced Gaara who is tiers slower than the kyubi red eyed Naruto who speed blitzes Sasuke at the valley. That same kyubi red eyed Naruto is confirmed slower than Drunken lee and 5th gate lee by Kimimaro and his performance compared to kyubi red eyed Naruto.
Great vid, one thing though I hoped you would consider that I never see anyone mention. The gaara vs sasuke fight takes place 1 month after the rock lee fight. And in the manga it’s pretty explicit that gaara has not slept the entire time and shukaku is breaking down gaara psychologically, ie: tricking gaara into releasing him. So when sasuke strolls in and bodies gaara, it’s a garra that is heavily fatigued and mentally nerfed into relying on shukaku. So basically sasuke 4 hitting gaara into submission is more indicative of gaaras fatigue and less indicative of sasukes superiority.
And as far as the statement of getting stronger through bloodshed I always interpreted that as a bloodlust fighting amp not strength/AP boost.
Chunin became just like gennin later on
In my opinion:
Naruto in the finals should be first considering that him with the full Kuybi amp should be stronger than the one that was punching around semi-transformed Gaara also Nejis Ultimate defense was supposed to be stronger than Gaara sand defense and Neji was nearly knocked out by a Single blow from Naruto so even if we keep Gamabunta out of the equation Naruto is first
Second in my opinion is Gaara the position between him and the other 3 bellow him are very narrow but im going to give him the edge because he is the most balanced and because he was only losing to Sasuke due to a chakra Nature Disadvantage
Number 3 is Lee due to him having the most impressive stats here besides arguably Kuybi chakra amped Naruto while in the Gates
Number 4 and Number 5 are Sasuke and Neji due to them having the Best offensive and Defensive weapon respectively in the Group but not being as balanced as the Rest
When jiraiya was wondering if the power was a blessing or curse, hes saying naruto can make it a blessing instead of a curse so the kyubi chakra is lowkey a ninja tool,but yeah
No way is Sasuke beating 5th gate lee, I mean if he lands a chidori he wins but how is he landing chidori, meanwhile lee probably one shots with a punch or two plus he WAYYY faster so hitting sasuke won’t be difficult
Sasuke fanboys and ignorant you tubers would say Sasuke with chidori and sharingan is likely faster or fast enough to counter. 🤦♂️ Due to misconstrued databook analysis.
Meanwhile in the actual manga. A stronger version of Sasuke from the valley of the end , in terms of speed wasn’t even noteworthy to base Naruto. Even tho Sasuke was using a full powered chidori and he had his sharingan on.
Meanwhile we have a nerfed 1st gate lee having his speed being noteworthy to Curse Mark amped Kimimaro.🥸Same guy who speed blitzes base Naruto and casually stomps his Kyubi eyed form , “IN BASE”.
So if a nerfed 1st gated speed is noteworthy to Curse mark amped Kimimaro. Meanwhile a full power chidori sharingan blitz isn’t noteworthy or dangerous for base Naruto. A healthy 5th Gate Lee speed blitzes the crap out of finals Sasuke who is slower than the Sasuke who’s chidori speed wasn’t noteworthy to base Naruto.
Finals Sasuke in curse mark form gets blitzed for days.
13:11 yes and also it’s not about how kishi would write it that’s hypothetical u can rlly just compare on their feats and skills and how they would react to each other
I think six just watched seth the programmer's latest video and came to the conclusion that sasuke is stronger than Lee btw swag is also in that video.
I am sure six is a massive fanboy and looks up to them as his daddy and mommy respectively.
@@Vid_21 ok even if he does think that way it's not like swag, seth and six have never been in a conversation about sasuke being stronger than Lee I am sure there must have been a video before this or six might have known about their opinion that is all I am saying.
@@Vid_21 the irony about what he’s saying is that swag actually got amps from six for a debate of his, the one against noodles I believe. So if anything, it’s actually swag being influenced by six
I agree
@@Vid_21 I agree with u that six is a decent power scaler when it comes to naruto but comparing him with swag come on. Swag is at a whole another level, he has years of experience and creating videos. Swag also has over a million subs. I am not saying that subscribers is equal to quality but still having that many subscribers is insane and it just goes to show that he is beloved and respected by everyone in the Naruto community. Swag is one of the best power scaler's and is also the godfather of all naruto youtubers. He is one of the best content creators ever. Six is more knowledgeable than swag, who decided that?
Six is better at debating than swag who decided that?
swag and seth are on a completely different level than six it's similar to comparing tenten and sakura with naruto and sasuke of the naruto community.
@@Vid_21 he didn't lost to noodles, swag was holding back and didn't want to fight but debate. It was pain vs kakazu and we all know that pain will no dif kakazu sooooooo.
Anyway the point is noodles is an idiot and swag is a beast he doesn't need to be the the best in debating to prove anything he is already the best, swag is the greatest and most respected naruto UA-camr in the universe and that's a fact.
He is at the top when it comes to naruto.
People like six, noodles, anime wild, barra b and various other naruto youtubers are babies in front of swag.
I guess I'd have to rank them with all their tools and abilities. So
1. Naruto (w/Gamanunta & Red Kyubii Chakra Mode)
2. Gaara (Partial & Full Transformations)
3. Rock Lee (5th Gate)
4. Sasuke (Sharingan & Chidori)
5. Neji (Byakugan)
I can see a case for Sasuke being #3 if we factor in the curse seal, especially after he damaged Partial Biju cloak Gaara though.
U were correct until number 3. Finals Neji is above both Finals Sasuke and PRELIMS Lee. His Rotation stands in the same league as Gaara's sand dome which was confirmed in the databook and Rotation's weaker variation (Chakra cocoon) , was stated to be above Sand shield in the Manga. Sand shield >>>>>> Sand armor which pretty much tanked the Gates. So Lee isn't being Finals Neji like he would prelims Neji as he simply can't do anything to his defense.
-While for Sasuke , He himself said he was inferior to a Naruto with 2k Clones worth of chakra who is inferior Naruto with Gamabunta summoning worth of chakra which is inferior to the kyubi chakra mode used against Neji in kyubi chakra amounts. It's worth mentioning that Kyubi chakra mode Naruto got another amp of top of that before colliding with Rotation which would push his kyubi chakra levels even further , which Neji still blew away , while off-guard , with a nerfed Rotation. Yea , Sasuke gets stomped by Neji.
Sage Mode Naruto raids the 5 Kage Summit next
@@LinkedHero your not wrong 😂
5 mins. Raikage just runs away fast. Wait. Come back. And break Naruto like a toothpick
@@ohboi9578 How would the Raikage know about the time limit? And he ain’t no bitch
@@LinkedHero And MS makes you blind. So what?
@@LinkedHero Plenty of time, Naruto characters are fast af at this point.
Lmao, could you imagine if Naruto just summoned Gamabunta? It would have been fucking hilarious.
...doesn't Sasuke's Chidori Literally counter Garaas Sand at all points? Wouldn't Palm Rotation literally Dispell all Chakra, including Chidori?
Hasn't Neji Cucked Lee at all points short of 3rd/5th Gate? So even with all that speed, Neji is still superior to Lee Without the Gates.
Lee also has no Nature Release so he can't just burst out an A-Rank Elemental Jutsu to completely counter his enemies nature Release.
Yes, including the chakra in the sand
naruto one shotting neji is bs
@3rd Way no not really neji in the sasuke retrieval arc tanked an arrow to the chest but got one shotted by naruto
@@moneymankkk5797 I MEANT BY NARUTO SHIT
I think some things worth mentioning that Six forgot is that Kakashi was rather confident in Sasuke to beat Gaara after learning Chidori, even after he’d seen Gaara outlast and defeat Lee, and Kakashi had been jerking Lee off the entire time. Also probably good to mention that Naruto, even after using Kyubi Chakra and fighting Neji, was getting jealous of Sasuke, and later Jiraiya was able to draw him in but offering “a Jutsu cooler than chidori.” Bringing up the Curse Mark+Sharingan amps prolly would’ve also helped convey to the audience a little more why Sasuke>Lee, as Lee even comments that Sasuke is like his own stats+the Sharingan.
Regardless, A tier video
Yea and that confidence was due to chidori which Gai confirms.
Gai also confirms that Sasuke is only close to weightless level speed meaning 4th gate lee speed blitzes without issue.
Same for curse mark Sasuke since drunken lee , who is slower than 4th gate was said to be too fast by kimimaro. Likewise 1st gate amped lee was also impressive speed wise to a curse mark amped Kimimaro.
In regards to Naruto. Curse mark Sasuke himself felt inferior to a Naruto using vastly less chakra than against Neji. That alone puts Naruto in kyubi mode vastly above base and curse mark Sasuke.
Nobara top tier waifu!
Definitely agree that sauske is number 2
tfw you wanted sakura slander but instead you got neji slander.
I was just thinking this morning, “man I want another six video”
Just watching all the people crying about how they refuse to accept Sasuke > Lee is never going to get old.
Lol not that we’re crying we are just very skeptical to the idea that base sasuke just mops 5th gate lee, like he just survives the 4th gate barrage and the reverse lotus, gets up and just pats off the dust from his black romper unscathed and proceeds to ragdoll or one shot via the chidori.
@@Wicks897 Its stated in multiple Databooks and did more damage to Gaara with 4 hits than Gates Lee did with dozens (which yes, his durability should scale to his AP) it doesn't get more self-explanatory than that.
@@thomaswhite3149 well it’s just left to your interpretation vs mine of the fights. I don’t have the energy to argue right now. It’s late but I get where the arguments for sasuke come from. Just that you can make one for lee.
The only attack that would be a garunteed kill on lee would be chidori, and Sasuke would have to bait lee into it because otherwise lee just dodges it and claps him
"Underutilized characters in Naruto" video? Legit only for my guy Shino🤣
Literally, six, swag, and Seth are all in agreement that sauske be above lee. But praise to six for telling it straight.
Just because they’re in agreement doesn’t mean it’s set and stone arguments can change overtime even Seth admits this. Like the time they thought Kisame beats the 2nd hokage.
@@AskwhoQ your right, but that time was when it was just swag and Seth, now six is here. Also that was a while ago, and it’s still debatable just how strong kisame is.
@@kapitansatoshi7967 I’m saying that just because it’s those 3 it doesn’t mean it’s the end all be all definable answer plus no matter how far in time it is they can still change their opinions.
@@AskwhoQ I’m not saying what ever comes out of their mouths is 100% true, what I’m saying is that a consensus has been made, and this scaling has statements and feats to back it up.
It’s not their show so they can be wrong. In this case, they are wrong. Plain and simple
I don't understand including Gaara's Bijuu, which is shukaku taking over entirely, but not Gamabunta which is an extension of Naruto.
And when you consider Sasuke started struggling with semi transformed Gaara, but Naruto was able to put down the smack down, even without Gamabunta it's clear he is at minimum #2, or tied with Sasuke for it.
its crazy. Naruto beat the strongest Gaara. A fully transformed Gaara which was a Kage level feat that Sasuke could never do
I think saying someone is stronger than someone else is fact because the author would right it that way is flawed. Neji was clearly stronger than the version of Naruto he fought but neji still lost do to main character plot armor. The main characters in Naruto have to win over the side characters. But if you were to put them in a hypothetical I whole heartily believe that 5th hate Lee would clobber sasuke.
fact about the 8 trigram 64 palms. neji actually hit 124 chakra points since they do not repeatedly hit the same one repeatedly.
I really don't understand why Naruto is so early when you, yourself, said Gamabunta would have made all of the Genin take an L.
Also, Neji > Sasuke. 64 palms would have laid out Sasuke. My opinion is this:
5) Sasuke
4) Neji
3) Lee
2) Gara
1) Naruto
Him summoning Gabumanta was a coincidence to say the least when he tried to summon it during the Gaara fight he couldn’t
-He also tried in the Sanin deadlock and couldn’t do it either
Until he achieved Sage mode, he was never able to summon Gabumanta like that
@@sankeerthkoshy61 What kind of hand canon stuff is that?
He can freely summon Gamabunta as long as he's not exhausted like it both instances that you stated. It never once stated he needed sage mode to summon them. If anything, he could summon 3 at a time with Sage Mode.
@@Koby5649 then why didn’t he summon Gabumanta during any of his fights after Gaara and before Pain
Such as against Sasuke part 1
-Against the Aktasuki( Obitos and Pains organization) when he fought Kakzu?
@@Koby5649 you can say he was tired during the Gaara fight but he tried it during the Sanin deadlock and couldn’t do it
@@Koby5649 also before the Sanin deadlock Naruto wasn’t doing training or anything to feel fatigued to summon Gabumanta
Good video don't know why but nobara avatar kinda fits you lmao
Personally I think that sasuke would have lost to 5th gate lee but I agree with the rest of the list
In The Manga rlly breaks it down y sasuke is the strongest in the chunin exams ..lee states he’s getting afraid of a weak fatigued sasuke b4 the training & (nerf bcuz he can’t use his sharingen & all his chakra cuz the cm is eating it) ..he didn’t mention that but yuh the konaha crush arc naruto & gaara is the strongest but sasuke was keeping up wit 1tail gaara while fatigued & he beat base gaara wen lee lost to base garra and this gaara got stronger at it stated & he was trying to kill sasuke he only tried to kill lee wen he was crawling away, gaara had to take a nap then rely on Shikoku powers..sasuke was never at full power always nerf if he used the cm then it’s even worse this wat I been saying sasuke stomps everyone in the (chunin exams arc) not konaha crush arc..Black cloak sasuke is the 🐐&
@@Kctyb_ The manga actually breaks down why 5th gate lee would win , not the other way around. Gai literally states that Sasuke in base is only as fast as Lee without weights.
Also Sakura and all other genin could easily follow Sasuke’s chidori speed while it wasn’t the same for 5th gate lee.
Then we hav the fact that Kimimaro, while amped by partial curse mark level1 , found Lee’s speed with only the 1st gate “impressive” , while lee was nerfed. Same kimimaro in base who easily destroyed a kyubi rage amped Naruto who later went on to easily blitz and manhandle a stronger version of sasuke.
This obviously means that a fresh 5th gate lee should easily be tiers faster the kyubi rage amped Naruto who easily destroyed a stronger faster sasuke.
5th gate lee easily beats a much weaker sasuke. Neji and Naruto also beats him so no , Sasuke I wasn’t the goat.
@@allmight3221 lee wasn’t nurf he had the drugs & after a fight u get stronger & faster ..bee states it so no..they couldn’t see sasuke in base wit no cm nerf cuz the cm is eating away his character wen he use the sharingen and to debunked this dumb argument Lee said he’s scared blue shirt weak fatigued damaged nerf cuz of cm sasuke (b4 kakashi training)
@@Kctyb_ 1st Gate Lee was nerfed when kimimaro praised him. He had just returned from surgery and beyond that both Gaara and lee himself confirmed the speed nerf. Read the manga next time and try to incorporate logic.
Lee wasn’t scared of nerfed blue suit Sasuke. He was scared of his potential because sasuke had just performed a partial primary lotus so quickly. Lee was still obviously much stronger and faster since Sasuke needed time to get to lee’s base weightless level speed with training lol. Do U even read the manga bro? Or do u jus look at the pretty pictures?
U thought u debunked my argument with such a weak stance? Laudable. 5th Gated Lee speed blitzes finals Sasuke with speed tiers upon tiers faster than the speed which garnered praise from cm1 Kimimaro. Simple logic.
Same Kimimaro who in base speed blitzed base Naruto on numerous occasions. Which is something a faster version of Sasuke cannot accomplish on any occasion with Chidori. Yet a slowed down nerfed 1st gated Lee’s speed was impressive to an enhanced version of Kimimaro lol. Meaning a fresh 5th gate lee would be dozens of times more impressive to that same kimimaro lol.
Meaning 5th Gate Lee is tiers upon tiers above finals Sasuke in speed and can safely blitz him without sasuke being able to properly defend since he’s slower than 3rd gate lee much less 5th.
@@allmight3221 sasuke beat base gaara & lee lost sasuke beat amp gaara the he’s reacting to gaara 1tail while fatigued, lee losssssttt to base gaara & sasuke is stated to be gaara strongest opponent bye bye
Yo it's only been 3 months wild. your so skilled at commentary.
Have you seen sonny boy it's not really a action anime but I think it would be interesting to hear your thoughts on it
Lee would definitely murder Sasuke if he activated his gates. Lee would just be too fast and strong and wouldn't even let Sasuke use his chidori
Sasuke wouldnt even use chidori, its a assasination technique and it isnt a life or death battle,
Damn... we ain't talkin about Shino? Everybody forgot about Shino again, huh? Well he won't be joining you on the next retrieval mission.
If shino was on that mission Sasuke would have been retrieved cuz shino was undefeated in part 1
13:20 sasuke already lost to lee, and it would def be a tough fight even if lee lost. I imagine it’d go something like sasuke bullies lee a lil, lee uses a gate, sasuke uses his 2 tomoe, sasuke could for the most part foresee a couple gates while lee would be able to predict since it’s his movement, and he’s simply spent more time in martial arts. The dude spars against superior dojutsu in neji, and guy
Saskue lost to Lee before the Chunin exams started. They’re taking about if Black Suit Saskue fought Lee in the Chunin exams finals. And with Sharingan, Lee’s Weightless Speed, and enough attack power to damage Gaara without the gates, Lee would need to be in gate 5 to even stand a chance.
It might be even possible that such an intense battle would allow Saskue’s Sharingan to evolve to its 3rd Tomoe mid-fight (Like how he got 2nd in his left eye during his fight with Orochimaru in the forest or when he gains 3rd tomoe during his fight at the valley) and at that point Lee is screwed.
@@jkid1337 Having. Third Tomoe increase is hurting no one. Kakashi needed his more experienced three tomoed Sharingan just tk keep up with 3rd gate Lee let alone 5th. Sasuke is getting speed blitzed because even with three Tomoe he wouldn't be able to physically keep up with Lee. You give Sasuke too much credit.
@@jkid1337 sasuke would not unlock his third tomoe. Sasuke wouldn’t have any strong emotions, unless adrenaline is one :p it’s just a simple fight vs a dude who already wiped the floor w/ sasuke who’s ready for a rematch
@@judgemasterneimaz8260 kakashi didnt need his sharingan to follow lee moves he used his sharingan to copy lee moves to teach to sasuke later on
@@jayvon221 Lies. If that's the case then why didn't he do that against his life long rival Gai? Because Sasuke had already copied what he needed of Lee. Kakashi only helped him train with Chidori.
Rinnegan Obito & 6 Jinchuriki vs. EMS Madara & Kyuubi? Edo Madara would also be a cool matchup
Yea true
Sasuke is faster than base Lee, hits harder than base Lee, and Chidori hits way harder than the 5th Gate does. But saying Sasuke hits harder than 5th gate Lee is a bit iffy imo
He did more damage to an even stronger version of Gaara than the one Lee fought with the 5th gate.
@@ImADolphin he did more damage compared to base Lee, but 5th gate Lee did way more damage than base Sasuke did(not counting Chidori)
@@sherminatoranalysis3429 Not really :/
Even after getting pingponged around by 5th gate Lee, Gaara stood up pretty soon after. He really only did damage to the sand armor, as opposed to Gaara's actual body. Sasuke penetrated Gaara's ultimate defense and injured him so bad he had a panic attack and tried to release the 1 tails.
@@sherminatoranalysis3429 Oh, I didn't read the last part. Why are you excluding the chidori? Sasuke is able to use it against Lee, isn't he?
@@ImADolphin he probably could, both Chidori and the 5th gate take a good couple of seconds to activate, but that wasn’t really my point.
There were some people that thought Sasuke’s basic Taijutsu(no Ninjutsu or Chidori) was above 5th gate Lee, which I disagreed with.
Great vid six
You said that said sasuke was stronger than Neji so I wanted to know how you thought the fight would play out
Keep in mind that naruto is the most unpredictable character in the show
Sasuke doesn’t even scale above Neji
If it’s in the forest Sasuke can hide and test the limits of the Byakugan and Neji’s movement and speed to calculate a precise attack that can take him down in one strike
In a open area sasuke gets bodied
@3rd Way You got to do the most to beat him in the forest lol
People always overlook the fact that 64 palms would shut anyone but Gaara and Naruto down and Naruto's second chakra source is the only reason he won. It could be argued that Sasuke's curse mark would feed him chakra, buuut at that point in the story it wasn't that much of an amp. We see experienced cursed mark users go stage 2 while still having chakra and still not scale over Neji...
@@Blah2000Blah The gentle fist would be a hard matchup for Gaara too.
My biggest hang up with post training Sasuke him getting beaten down by lvl 1 curse release sakon & ukon. Feel like 5th gate lee beats any of the lvl 2 curse seal sound 4. Maybe even two at once
I think people should REALLY be more precise when analyzing this fights. It goes like this:
Gaara > Weighted Lee
Weightless Lee > Gaara
Simple stuff here.
Then Gaara gets a BIJUU amp. He changes his demeanor completely and both Kankuro and Temari state that his inner demon has appeared.
casual Shukaku amped Gaara > Weightless Lee
Then Lee opens the gates.
People are, for some reason, in contrast to the "Sasuke downplay" meta, actually downplaying the damage Lee dealt to Gaara.
Gaara had his whole armor pretty much tore up (something Sasuke obviusly was not able to do), he was on the floor, and barely able to turn his head and lift his arm to break Lee's already messed up arm and leg.
Yes, granted, after that, his armor was regenerated, and he stood up. This is still more impressive than Gaara having his armor slightly shattered in his face, "huffing and puffing" for a few seconds after him standing up like nothing. Gaara was not amped by Shukaku as he was vs Lee when receveing this damage btw.
"But Gaara didn't resort to go Bijuu mode vs Lee" That, far from being in favor of Sasuke, goes in favor of Lee.
Gaara can do that (at least in public as we've seen) by generating that sand sphere. He had the stamina and chakra to do it vs Sasuke. He couldn't do that vs Lee, HE COULDN'T EVEN MOVE FOR A WHILE. Plus Lee was already destroyed by his own jutsu. By just using a little sand it was enough to end the fight.
What's the conclussion? Base Sasuke (no Sharingan) obviously stomps weighted Lee. Weightless Lee is different. They have the same speed/dexterity, but Sasuke does hit harder and is more versatile with his Jutsu, so Sasuke wins again. 4th gate Lee is a completely different animal. He's definetly blitzing Sasuke and, as established above, no, Sasuke is not hitting harder than this Lee. Lee takes it. Now give Sasuke his Sharingan. It's a 2 tomoe, not enough of a power amp, but gives him his precognition. Is it enough to see Lee's moves? Maybe, but like he said "even if your eyes can see through my moves, if your body can't respond, then what's the point?". He has more survability now, but he's probably still losing. Now Chidori.
Chidori > Hidden Lotus (making the statement of Sasuke being the strongest opponent consistent)
So if he manages to land it, he wins. Can he? it's hard, Lee's way too fast (Kakashi needed his Sharingan to even register his moves). BUT, with substitution + precog I can perfectly See Sasuke landing it and winning the fight.
So, in the end, just giving Lee more credit and addressing this new Sasuke jerk off meta that started months ago lmao.
Sasuke was stated to be the strongest opponent that Garra has faced. Accept it and stop crying wanker
5th gate Lee < Base Sasuke 😎
5th gate Lee < Base No bcm Naruto😎
5th gate Lee < Neji 😎
I'm not reading that wall of text
next vid suggestion
post time skip, who is the strongest among the chunin and or jonin?
I don't think I need to voice why Lee is the actual best combatant in the chunin exams when everyone else is proving my opinions which is also their own as well...
5th Gate Lee > Sasuke
And they’d all get smacked by him in a debate so it don’t matter lol
The goat backkkkk
I don’t agree, did you see Sakura vs Ino. Sakura is much more powerful. She fought a clan heir. MASTERED THE CLONE JUTSU. Not only that Ino was on a team with Shikamaru which means she is comparable to him. Shikamaru fought temari who is stronger than Ten Ten. Who is on Rock Lees team and can be comparable to him. Rock lee clapped Sasuke, later Sasuke clapped Naruto IN 1 TAIL FORM. This Naruto is much weaker than the Naruto who fought Gaara. This means Sakura is stronger than everyone in the chunin exams.
CHANGE MY MIND.
Good meme lol
i don't see a single flaw in your logic
Kishimoto really went from a passionate mangaka loving his work to despising it in the end
Sakura not #1 ? This list is rigged smh
Kishimoto would not write that Sasuke would lose, but he would. Lol
I Love this !!!!🌋
in the context you gave I agree. But I feel likw bloodlusted rock lee is still 3rd but Sasuke is 4th. A knife in Lee's hand and Sasuke is Neg'd
I feel like six just says everything swagkage said already but just a week later
Nice video Six.
Finally the video came out
Idk if anyone would agree would this and I admit it might be a stretch but, if you assume that neji could probably fold a weightless lee in terms of speed and power, which I think it’s applied he can. Then naruto with the kyubi amp should be relative to that neji considering he was able to keep up with him in speed and power. That means naruto in his kyubi amp should be around the speed of weightless lee. I might be wrong but what do you guys think? This wouldn’t put him above lee or sasuke but it should show that the kyubi amp was huge for naruto who wasn’t anywhere close to weightless lee speed.
*Orochimaru enters the chat*
I feel a cool thing that could of happened is Sasuke V.S Rock Lee and they be evenly matched and Rock Lee but the gate caught up to Lee and Sasuke barley won and that drove him closer to going orochimaru but then he went on to lose to garra and then naruto on the roof top
W video
Had no choice but to laugh and agree as he proceed not to give us any explanation justifying his #1 pick
I use narrative scaling a lot more thanks to six now
6:20 lmao Lee has wood style