Just to be clear, this is ONE side of the argument. I tried to remove my bias as much as possible as I personally prefer USA-made goods, however, I'm sure it came out. Excited to release the next video in the series on why I think MIA matters.
You sounded like a rep fitness shill def no bias toward usa made. Lol Just kidding love your channel it inspired to me to build a home gym for free. The video was interesting, people do act like you are either giving your money to the US or china in some instances, as you point out that is a misguided point of view.
Good effort! The clips are fantastic. My position is more nuanced; there are plenty good reasons to buy imported, and plenty good reasons to buy local. However, there is one completely specious argument for buying local, and it’s “superior American steel”. Allow me to explain: there’s a higher likelihood of a higher-quality OVERALL customer experience when the retailer isn’t shifting huge parts of their value chain towards low-cost areas. Companies that have their manufacturing base in high-cost areas are then forced, due to simple economic logic, to provide value-add, to charge premium prices to cover their cost base. In practice, that means that Rogue and Sorinex et al, need to provide superior welds, craftsmanship, quality control, restocking data, delivery times, customer service, warranties, etc (and they do). Building brand equity, whether it be thru Crossfit games or the “feel good” message of supporting local business, also helps the customer experience. Notice the absence of steel. That’s because steel is a commodity. There are no value-add margins to it. Steel is the same everywhere. If steel from country A is different than from country B, it’s because one of them isn’t purely steel! It’s what a company does with the steel that differs. Companies that make a decision to set a major part of their value-chain in a low cost country are also more likely to cut costs in other areas: steel thickness, welds, quality control, inventory management, customer service, etc. But both in theory and in practice, it’s possible to have an otherwise-high quality firm choosing to specifically place the most commoditized part of its value chain in a low cost area. Again, notice how none of this is about steel quality. Finally, also notice that I’m making no reference to economic nationalism. Buying your country vs buying imported out of patriotism is a legitimate choice, but it’s not a rational one (literally: it is an emotional decision, not a rational one). It could be correlated to higher quality (see above), which would make it more rational, but correlation doesn’t imply causation. Thanks Coop!
"Made in America" has almost been reduced to just a marketing term. Actually should be "assembled in America". As long as a product is assembled or placed into a kit for purchaser assembly, happens in America, then the term "made in America" can be used.
But then you’re guaranteed consumer protection. If a company is based outside of the US or another similarly advanced country, they can merely tuck tail, change their IP, and keep scamming.
"According to the Federal Trade Commission, “Made in USA” means that “all or virtually all” the product has been made in America. That is, all significant parts, processing and labor that go into the product must be of U.S. origin." Unless I'm missing something here. That's not how it's supposed to be.
@@illwill311 there's qualified and unqualified claims. Qualified being the complete statement "Made in the USA". Unqualified if portions of the product come elsewhere. I.E. Made in the USA with US and imported parts. I'm no expert but reading the official guidelines, there's specific ways in which products are supposed to be labeled.
I remember many years ago when I was working for a company that sells athletic equipment to physical therapists and gyms etc. we were one of the first to start selling Battle Ropes. The ropes were made in China. People complained. But who has made the best rope for (literally) thousands of years? The Chinese! Same with Swedish steel. One of the best steels you can buy but it comes from Sweden. People used to complain that we were importing but sometimes the best comes from other countries. It happens.
Just a point about using automated machines, they will still require a team of engineers to maintain the machines and lines, these machines still require American jobs
True. And I think with more automated manufacturing more will come back to the States as it would make economic sense to. Means more jobs for engineers, technicians, IT, etc who will be American.
The robot argument is like filler songs on an album with one or two hits. Would anyone expect or want construction companies to use hand shovels instead of diggers? How about spoons?
@@MattEngebregtsen well most people who buy american do so because they are trying to support indigenous production. Personally while I try to get as much made in usa as I can, most of my strongman equipment is Titan for the cost
@@MattEngebregtsen I try to avoid buying made in China or micronesian products because their labor laws are basically nonexistent but I do get the money factor. If iphones were made in America or Sweden or japan they would be wayyy more expensive
As an engineer I can tell you that the quality of the product has nothing to do with the country of origin, but the quality processes at the plant. I've had success but also terrible experiences with US manufactured parts. The difference that you most likely see is that chinese manufactured parts can just absorb the cost of tossing out more defective products, therefore additional quality checks cost more than the wasted material. The US most likely has the opposite problem where the additional quality checks cost less than the wasted labor used to make defective parts. REGARDLESS the company itself can dictate the quality checks and processes of their supplier regardless of manufacturing locations and at the end of the day is their responsibility to dictate to the manufacturer. Side note, I've had an absolute garbage experience with the quality of Rogue products made in the USA over the past two months
Exactly this. Someone has to drive to deliver the machine, someone has to assemble the machine, someone has to programme how the machine will work, someone has to maintain it, etc.
Yep. But similar considerations for what about the dock worker that unloads the ship in the USA? What about the truckers? What about the train operators? The warehouse staff to unload? All jobs created in the USA for imports.
This is true to an extent. The point is that these lower skilled manufacturing jobs will disappear and those people will need to pay for education to enter the robots/engineering field. Today's job market is not shrinking so much but rather it is recycling so that there are fewer and fewer good paying low skilled jobs. A certain percentage of the workforce cannot afford to get the education needed to enter the newly formed high skilled high paying job market and this creates a larger gap between low wage and high wage jobs. Also, it may take 1 engineer to maintain a dozen bots where a company used to employ a dozen men for that line.
@@williammelms5139 Agree. I think the bigger issue we're both talking about is that automation is what is taking those good jobs away, not so much oversees manufacturing. All that's left are the box packers and a few robot maintainers.
This is it right here. Rogue gets all this credit for "Make in America" even though a ton of the stuff they sell isn't totally, or isn't at all. Rogue is great quality, and if people care about that for their home gym, go nuts! But many of those same people will turn their nose up at Rep fitness because their stuff is Chinese-sourced and made. But their flat bench is as good and likely better than any flat bench Rogue makes, and considerably cheaper too.
@@chris.ander116 this is good to know, actually. For barbells, I'll look at american made. For everything else, steel quality variance doesn't matter much, so I'll go with the cheaper Chinese options.
@@chris.ander116 There's some not so great steel made in the US too, but chinese steel is in general pretty bad, and almost never up to spec. I would say pay attention to the company and their track record, and you can't go wrong.
Swedish steel ftw. Many Japanese knife makers import steel from Sweden. One of the reasons Swedish steel is viewed so favourably is that Swedish iron ores tend to be more pure than elsewhere, for unknown reasons.
Always buy the best product for your needs at the best price you can get. As a business it means you can buy more things or save money. Then you can provide a better service/product to your client or you can hire more people. If made in America is good then made in your state must be better. Made in your town must be best. Actually, you should make everything yourself. Division of labor is awesome. Celebrate it!
I love supporting rogue and other american made brands but sometimes it comes down to price. I have several titan fitness items that work great for a fraction of the price.
True. It really depends on quality control. Some companies inspect their products before its shipped to the consumer. While others just ship product to the consumer without quality inspection. Then blame the consumer for buying it. Most of the Onnit kettlebells are china made. I bought spotter arms from a company called X-training, and the sizing was off for my squat stand. I had to get a local welder to adjust the bracket. Welder charged me as much to ship it back. So, I kept it.
At the end of the day you get good and bad factories in the USA, and good and bad factories in China etc. What matters more than the country in which it is made is the factory in which it is made, and the quality control methods of the company. I understand the UK jobs argument, but I live in Europe, so I don't give a toss. What matters to me is the quality of product, and to that end, the above applies. Regardless, paying a premium to 'made in the USA' companies does not necessarily mean that money goes to the workers on the floor - more likely that it's padding the pockets of the bosses and shareholders.
Rogue had 1,250 employees in Columbus Ohio. Not to mention all the jobs manufacturing US steel. Truck drivers shipping the steel... etc. How many US employees do Rep and Titan have combined!?
I mean the manufacturing of steel is automated. Pretty much the jobs rogue has available are lower end jobs. The one ones making a decent amount are the truck drivers and that’s just logistics. Same with Titan and rep, they have to have drivers deliver the products to them from the ship yard. They have to have drivers come get the product to then ship it out. Plus they are much smaller than rogue in general so they will have smaller amount of employees. It’s nice supporting American made but I think it is much better supporting American made smaller shops. Someone like bridge built, or raptor fitness and many more I don’t know. Smaller American made business.
@@ladouceurmatt Rogue is currently paying A minimum of $25 an hour. With plenty of overtime offered, at double time, with benifits! Does that sound low end? Is Rep or Titan paying better wages than that!?
@apple apple My guess is you don't... My guess is you're one of the guys on the Facebook page complaining about how you can't afford Rogue equipment and argue that Titan is just as good.
I understand that people want to support their own economy and purchase products made in their native country so I can accept the ‘made in the USA’ banner in that regard. However, when ‘made in the USA’ is used as a sign of it being of superior quality I cant take it seriously. Outside of the US nobody else in the world thinks that way about US products . If you want the best quality you have to shop globally - The highest quality cars ? - Germany Sports Cars / Clothing ?- Italy Watches? - Switzerland Electronics - China Weightlifting Equipment- Sweden and I could go on . Even leading US brands such as Apple are not made in the USA. Buy US if it makes you feel patriotic but don’t be blind to think that there are not as good or even better products available from other countries. Just wanted to add that there are some fantastic quality products made in the USA - I own Rogue equipment and it is of very high quality . My point is that ‘made in the USA ‘ (or any other country ) is not a given for high quality . The location of where a product is manufactured is irrelevant- it is the design, quality of materials , QC and skill/diligence of the workforce that ultimately produce quality.
The country in which a product is made is not the thing that makes it good/bad. It's the product's design and the QC processes implemented. Pick a good factory in China and keep a close eye on the output and you can rival anything else. Case in point comes with mountain bike gear. ENVE charge a premium for their wheels as they are made in the USA. There are a good amount of complains about shoddy quality and wheels cracking because QC failed to catch the bad ones. By contrast, most of the expertise in mass production of carbon fibre componentry can be found in China and Taiwan. Design in the west, manufacture in the east has worked exceptionally well there.
@@NoxiousNoodles Plus a lot of the quality of a product is down to the business's own vision. Like Titan isn't trying to be an Eleiko-type business where consumers pay up for a premium barbell. They want to undercut the premium products on price and they picked a country with a labor situation that let them do that.
I think another reason people choose to buy american-made equipment is how the workers are treated in other countries. If you had a choice to work for rogue here in the US or whatever sweatshop rep makes their equipment in what would you choose?
Four points made/attempted: 1.) AI diminishing support of Americans 2.) Import companies DO hire Americans 3.) Not wanting to support the CCP 4.) "Made in the USA" ≠ top quality The first point is moot. The argument is against a perception that is hypothetical and abstract in nature, then turns it into a very unfair generalization. Additionally, the component of this point that is about AI is very underdeveloped. AI both helps and harms in some ways, which is another way of saying that things change. It's a manifestation of societal growing pains, and that is okay. It doesn't mean the support provided to your neighbors is truly diminished. The second point is a good point, but the fact that it is legitimate implies why individuals like myself don't care about this point when given the choice between domestic, or foreign sourced products. This point necessitates a value being placed on American labor. If this is an absolutely true value, then it stands to reason that increasing that percentage of American origination from 50% to 100% would be even better! So, fair point, but doesn't necessarily support the argument depending on who your are talking to. The third point, that money paid to Chinese companies doesn't support the CCP, is just wrong. In fact, it appeared that Coop was beginning to contradict himself when making the contrast with foreigners buying from the USA, but backed off because he had to in order to make the point. Nothing in me thinks Coop believes this argument. This was the grasping at straws that happens when you try your best to play devil's advocate. However, it's still a totally invalid and unsound point... The fourth point, that there is excellent quality beyond our shores, is absolutely right. This is by far the strongest point made in support of the complete argument. The examples were appropriate and compelling. For those who prioritize quality, this is the only argument that needs to be made. Customers like myself can always use a good reminder of this. Even more, US companies should always be reminded of this, because none of us should be so loyal to American brands that those brands become content to rest on their laurels. I look forward to the next video, Coop!
Well said as I was most interested in #4. I work in a different field which is aquaculture (fish farming) and I can say the U.S. is light years behind other countries. That being said we do produce high-end technical experts on the subject matter. But we simply do not produce products in this sector. I only mention this because it is short-sighted to assume that if the product is not made in the U.S. then it is inferior. Simply not true. Globalization is a constant struggle to contend with; especially in manufacturing. That being said I do hope that in some sectors it results in somewhat healthy competition, greater innovation, and higher quality products for the end consumer. Thanks for the summary of points.
I love you coop but.... common man. You. Do know that there are people in those factories right? Maintenance, technicians, forklift drivers... what about back office staff? Buyers, transportation, dispatch, clerks, IT, HR, finance. Supervision. Ect... and all the logistics jobs that titan employs are the same for American companies.
I ordered a rogue rack a while ago and it doesn’t even come close to the rep rack I returned it for. Rogue sent it in flimsy boxes that all arrived different days. All 9 boxes were torn apart and almost every piece was damaged. Rep: heavy duty boxes with each piece within the box individually wrapped, zero shipping issues. The rack itself looks amazing, incredible welds and the clear coat is sick. The rogue paint looked cheap. Btw from watching your videos and learning a thing or two, pretty sure the rep and rogue bumpers are made in the same Chinese factory. Look identical
Here's one thing the it doesn't matter crowd overlooks: it's environmentally catastrophic to mine, manufacture, and then ship a bar 10,000 miles to your home in CT, MA, IL, or wherever in the US. The same bar can be mined, smelted, and produced cleaner here and transportation will be a fraction of the distance.
Made in USA but the machine is from Japan and the raw materials are from China. The shipping company is based out of Korea. The guy coding to program the machines is out of India. Made in USA.
Made in America is overblown. If people were aware of how tariff shifts work for the US, they would realize that an upright made in China can still be "made in the US". Ex: I buy a 3x3 square steel tube from China and import into the US. I further work the square pipe by adding holes, therefore I am transforming the HTS of the good from steel pipe to sport equipment. Now that upright is made in the US.
The only thing about my "Made in America" Craftsmen lawnmower is the stickers on it. They literally stick them all over the mower to try and remind you where its made. That thing is the cheapest plastic piece of trash I've ever bought. Pretty sure they put the stickers on it, claim its assembled or whatever here.
I really liked this video and Coop did a great job laying out the issues. I am currently building a home gym and I’m trying to buy American made products. I’m older semi retired and I can afford it. What I don’t like is people who declare that they only by American Made and look down on those who don’t. When I was younger I had to buy whatever I could afford. So if you want to buy American Made and it makes you feel good to be supporting US manufacturing. That’s awesome. But don’t make others feel less than because they choose not to. Great video Coop
One point you got REALLY wrong, I work in pharmaceutical labs and the automation shifted jobs from manual work to electronic work, configuring machines, preventative maintenance, trouble shooting, servicing, programming, etc. you’re whole point about jobs is very misleading. In fact, some of the “new” jobs are higher paying too. Life experience, 18+ years in pharma.
True, but the point of automation is to reduce the cost of human capital. So there are going to be many fewer jobs created than destroyed. Especially considering those jobs created are higher paid. So you're definitely right and it's worth noting but on the grand scale, less jobs
Errr within two minutes you were already crossing yourself... Are you talking about "Made in the USA" or "Made in America"? America is both N and S America combined as one hemisphere... From Canada to Mexico to Peru and Chile....
I try to support my country by buying U.S. made goods whenever possible but what frustrates me is how often some U.S. products are simply inferior to products made elsewhere. For example, I recently bought a U.S. flag and I made sure to only shop U.S. made flags. The company proudly noted it was a U.S. made flag and touted its superior quality. I had the flag hanging only for a couple of months but the colors have faded so badly that it looks like it’s been out there for 10 years or more. On the other end of the spectrum are companies like Rogue who make quality products but, in my opinion, charge an obscenely high mark up with insanely high shipping costs. A balance must be struck between quality and price if U.S. manufacturers want to be competitive in the global economy. Just sayin’. ☝️🥴🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
Don’t forget that when you’re working with metal fabrication, it’s safer for the workers when the robots do the work. Heavy lifting, catching your fingers etc in a press...
Coming from a tech nerd here, I don't like that "AI" is being used interchangeably with "Automation". They aren't the same thing. Machine Automation or robotic automation or Automated manufacturing are all better terms for the context being discussed. If you want to get into speaking about AI, let's get Lex Fridmen on here or Elon Musk or Bill Gates or Gary Marcus or *INSERT TECH GENIUS HERE* (of your choice that openly discusses the complexity's of technological advancements around AI). BEYOND THAT NOTE: Fantastic discussion and great content Coop! keep it up! Love the reviews and general insight into equipment quality and value.
Point number 3 is kinda misleading, Coop. No, the money doesn't go directly to the Chinese government, but the Chinese government doesn't allow that money to leave China; if it does, it's only spent on something that directly helps the Chinese and rarely the US. This means that billions of dollars spent on manufacturing and whatnot by US-based companies are billions of dollars trapped in there that isn't being used in America. Think about the number of jobs and economic growth that would occur if that wasn't the case. Recommend reading Stealth War by Robert Spalding if you get the chance. Great book about the subject and explains it better than I ever could. I know it's hard not to buy stuff from China, but whenever I can get the chance to buy American made, I always do. Buying American means you're supporting one of the dwindling numbers of companies that are still producing here, and for me, that means a lot. Honestly, since COVID started, I've only bought rogue (keep in mind I'm a college kid doing army ROTC at school, so I've saved up plenty from that). I could buy way more equipment if I bought from Titan or Rep, but right now is the most important time to support American businesses. Rogue probably doesn't really need my money at the moment; they'd do fine without it lol. But buying from them means the money I spend goes to American citizens and, in turn, leads to more money in our economy and not in China's. BUY AMERICAN BABY
As a U.S. farmer this simply isn't true. They do provide a large purchasing power of our farm-produced commodities which is why the farmers required a bailout in the last 4 years due to the tariff wars. Not trying to be political but just relaying what is seen in the markets with a single move against china in terms of tariffs.
Emmm, I'm a chinese that I 'm comfused that how you prove that ''the Chinese government doesn't allow that money to leave China''. I live in china. I help usa business man produce the product they want. The product quality We made is up to my USA boss how much they paid. And, the money I earned from usa usually I pay back to Usa like the brand new Iphone12. So what's the peoblem? The global economy is running, every one win win.
I made my leg press/hack machine, multi-bench, squat rack and pull down in my garage 37 years ago.Still as good as the day I made it. So kiss my cigar ;)
Robots and CNCs are not AI. But you are correct that computers have taken jobs from people for decades. The real problem is that people have been doing the work of robots since the Industrial Revolution (before there were any). It's a fairly recent phenomenon that robots are becoming capable and cheap enough to replace humans in an increasing number of roles, but the efficiencies computers introduce have made numerous professions obsolete (Remember telephone operators? Remember landlines?). Unfortunately, people haven't changed their perspective on education nearly as quickly as technology has advanced, and so we've seen the regression of our middle class population.
My issue is that why is gym equipment made in the US a big deal to people but the VAST majority of everything else they buy isn’t made here??? Also as time goes on technology will advance and we can’t hold back being more efficient because people won’t be doing it. There will ALWAYS be jobs that we need people for and it’s okay for manufacturing to evolve. Lastly not everyone can afford the higher price tag that comes with American made goods and those people shouldn’t be made to feel bad or priced out.
my Made in China archon swiss bar arrived, couldn’t load a standard training plate on it due to quality control failure (sloppy, malformed sleeve on one side. yay china.
Depends... I wouldn't care if a deadlift jack or bands were made in China..... However, barbells, squats, or things that take abuse needs some quality control. Usually if it's USA made, there is a certain quality control.
So, I have the Lu Xaiojun products... the power bar “which is a stainless steel bar....” and the competition oly bar by Lu Xaiojun. They are are comparable to the Eleiko and Uesaka and superior to Rogue equipment.
People are worried about the (lets be honest- mostly only non European) companies making equipment. Yet it’s the American companies that outsource their labor to other countries to save a buck....personally I don’t care where it is made, I care for quality and price.
You bring good points. Buying from America is normally my first thought when buying large products. But we should do more research to see what exactly is going on.
Except you are leaving out the fact that we don't have a choice on that. There are zero phones that are actually made in the USA. Sometimes we, as consumers, don't have a choice so whenever possible buy American, so you don't support communists. Despite what coop says, you are still supporting the country because of the tariffs and taxes they have on them.
Only thing that could make this video better is if you had real stats for what pieces of equipment are made here or overseas as well as how much $ a “US Made” company puts into the US economy opposed to a company that outsources. Still a great general video with so many different factors to consider! Thanks for the insight Coop!
@@bmstylee Not sure, haven't followed Rogue's kb manufacturing. Personally, I'm hoping Kettlebell Kings find a US foundry for their line of bells, as I like the form factor.
@@FrederickTSchurgerDC it's good to see companies making plates here. Rogue has the new deep dish plates and kettlebells. Now if we can get calibrated plates made here.
@@ClockCutter you get that it's a joke?😂 if you want to act like a smartass, at least be smart enough to type in the words I wrote into google translator😂
I think international trade is important. Exporting and importing in a balanced way. If countries acted in a protective manner and purchase only locally produced goods and services then the world economy would collapse which sound over dramatic but it's true. I feel everyone needs to diversify our supply chains and maybe reconsider helping countries with poor labour laws.
Before watching this I don’t put as much stock in “made in america” but glad he’s doing another video arguing for its merits. Nice Squatober shirt as well
To your point about money not going directly to the government: the difference is that the US government doesn’t own direct stakes in US based companies. More than mere tax revenue, the Chinese government has direct ownership stakes in most or all Chinese companies.
Same here. And I actually was going to buy from Rogue but nothing was available. I luckily stumbled upon Fringe Sports and I love their equipment (Bar, Plates, and Immortal Wall Ball).
Made in America also does not mean made from American materials. Where do manufacturers buy their steel? Or if they buy from local mills, where do those mills buy raw material? Quality has several aspects - how high requirements are, how tight specs are (how much deviation from requirements can be allowed) and how well this all controlled. If requirements and specifications are the same as local companies use for their locally manufactured goods, then, given proper quality control is in place, the quality of local and overseas goods will be equal. There is no magic in it. And of course when buying goods from other countries, people support those countries' economy to a degree. But they also support their own budget. And without ability to buy from China American economy and lifestyle probably wouldn't be so great either. Not everyone can afford Rogue, so they go for Titan. And without Titan, there would be much less strong Americans.
I’ve always had better luck with American made. The quality is always better. American steel is better. The Chinese are known to have poorer quality steel.
That's not true... They may use poorer quality of steel in their products, but they have access to the same type of industrial steel america and all of the world has access to. It's not like we live in the middle ages, where european sword steel was different than japanese steel (actually european steel was far superior in that time). If you buy an AISI420 steel in America nowadays, it's the exact same quality as AISI420 steel from China. Zero difference.
All I'm worried about right now is which company has plates in stock... I have a degree in exercise science, not economics or business. I wont pretend to understand how supply lines and microeconomics work. What I do know is that everyone of us can call/email these companies and get to know a regional representative that will be more than happy to talk to you about their product. I buy strength equipment from companies like Intek and Capps because I've known some of them personally or know someone else who has met them and vouches for their business. If it really means that much to you and you're willing to put your money where your morals are like you claim, then you'll take the time to speak to someone and do the research.
People is people... chinese workers also need a salary. It's not like you are burning your money when you buy from China. Besides, how you justify exporting products from the US? The other countries should buy products manufactured in their own land...
I don’t care where ever they are cheaper I buy , the only thing that I have bought was expensive was my rogue equipment but that’s because they ran out of racks for REP fitness racks , A Chinese rack from rep won’t fall to the ground or bent if your not lifting heavy and is only for home use
It's not important. I'm from Canada and could care less. Less and less people are working in those area's. Also it forces competition to make better products
I’m biased towards Rogue, but if you take a look, there’s a lot of products they put out that are not made here in the US. Of course they have a sizable US based business, but even Rogue will import to keep costs down.
I bought the Rep PR 5000 rack. It's nice but it's not Rogue nice. You can definitely tell where they value-engineered certain parts. When possible I try and buy made in the US. The fit and finish tend to be better when made in the US. Cost unfortunately was the deciding factor in this purchase. I payed less at the expense of attention to the finer details. Like I said. It's nice just not Rogue nice.
Kind on topic The more trade you do, the better off you are (IF the goal is to make both counties better, and there is fair policies). You can argue buying from domestic is better for the economy, (think 10k Joe Smiths won't lose their jobs to a mexico plant), but the economy is better off if you produce what you are most effective at. America COULD produce TVs for example, more than Japan, but Japan imports most of their food. America could produce both TVs and grain, but they have to give up a lot of grain to make those TVs. Why not have America produce grain, and japan produce TVs and they trade. there is a effective, better off economy. Even though the US might lose jobs to Japan, the US and Japan are trading money and everyone is better off in the whole.
Quality is largely a function of QC, standards and the tolerances of the spec. It all comes down to money. You can get something made to loose tolerances in the US, cut corners on the QC and still have garbage for fairly cheap. Or if you're willing to put in the work have top quality stuff made in other parts of the world. Let's not forget how the American auto industry got into the mess of their own making and opened the door for the Japanese car companies. But there is a real argument about maintaining an American manufacturing base. But in that case "made in America" is probably less important than making sure parts are made from American Steel.
My comments will be quite simple in answer to Coop’s monologue. In the last 30 years I’ve owned and sold quite a bit of gym equipment for my home gym. Every single time, without fail, equipment from “China” has been significantly inferior. I’m talking about receiving equipment that is rusty, breaking welds on power racks while using around 200 pounds on the rack. Receiving equipment that is slightly bent or distorted. Quality control in China manufacturing sucks, it’s not there. They mass produce as quickly as possible, box the goods and toss them on the ship. I do have some equipment that is imported from other countries other than China, and they meet or exceed American quality. An example is my Werksan weight lifting bar from Turkey, top notch bar. I’m specifically referring to China because that is where most of the imported gym equipment is coming from, and their quality control plain old sucks.
Love the video. Can you review the ew starting strength bar from Texas power bars and compare it to the rogue Ohio power bar? As a do it all basic powerlifting/starting strength program bar
Coop thanks for your honest and actually making a video like this.. I try to purchase only made in America products , but it’s just too hard due to cost and availability making it expensive ..🙆🏾♂️
Even with robots doing the welding, people still need to cleaan off the slag/spatter after, but that requires a labourer not a welder. I just recieved my MG-24 multi-grip bar from rogue, and they didn't clean off most of it before powder coating, even has a few sharp welds poking out, and the spatter is very abrasive if my hand rubs against it.
I am not a total zealot, but I do try to buy American where I can when I see a benefit. I have never owned a Titan rack, but Alan Thrall put the fear in me. Yes, their stuff is packaged in Horn Lake, MS and shipped for (no additional charge), but that’s a far cry from robotics maintained by US workers making products by US workers. So I know Rep says they have American engineers designing their products and just have them manufactured in China. Ok, so it’s partially US-made, but is their quality is high as Sorinex or Rogue? No, and maybe that is fine, but I think many people buy American MANUFACTURING because it is generally synonymous with higher quality due to US labor being more skilled and demanding higher pay for that skill as opposed to slave labor conditions. Your own video about urethane plates and bumper plates in general highlights how these things are made in China because the working conditions are awful. So when we buy plates, we are either buying Hi-Temp crumb or...imported. When I have no choice, it is what it is. Same for phones or computers. There may be some components designed or manufactured in the US, or they may be assembled in the US, but I am not aware of any 100% US made products. Maybe that’s the point you’re trying to make, and that’s ok to educate people (to the extent necessary?) that robots (loose definition of AI) may be doing work you might think a human is doing, but if it’s made here, that’s still more American jobs. It’s still American steel. It usually has a higher QC standard. It costs more; so, it may not be worth it to everyone, but we all have our hills. Closing point: I will not knowingly eat Chilean farm-raised Atlantic salmon. Likewise, I have no interest in Chinese manufactured protein products because the standards are so poor.
Just to be clear, this is ONE side of the argument. I tried to remove my bias as much as possible as I personally prefer USA-made goods, however, I'm sure it came out. Excited to release the next video in the series on why I think MIA matters.
Someone with a biased opinion who can still think rationally enough to make an argument for both sides?! How dare you?!?
@@brianbeckwith1569 🤣 That is bold nowadays!
You sounded like a rep fitness shill def no bias toward usa made. Lol Just kidding love your channel it inspired to me to build a home gym for free. The video was interesting, people do act like you are either giving your money to the US or china in some instances, as you point out that is a misguided point of view.
Dear Mario, when you lost your purchasing power against China due to trade deficit, this discussion will be obsolete.
Good effort! The clips are fantastic. My position is more nuanced; there are plenty good reasons to buy imported, and plenty good reasons to buy local. However, there is one completely specious argument for buying local, and it’s “superior American steel”. Allow me to explain: there’s a higher likelihood of a higher-quality OVERALL customer experience when the retailer isn’t shifting huge parts of their value chain towards low-cost areas. Companies that have their manufacturing base in high-cost areas are then forced, due to simple economic logic, to provide value-add, to charge premium prices to cover their cost base. In practice, that means that Rogue and Sorinex et al, need to provide superior welds, craftsmanship, quality control, restocking data, delivery times, customer service, warranties, etc (and they do). Building brand equity, whether it be thru Crossfit games or the “feel good” message of supporting local business, also helps the customer experience. Notice the absence of steel. That’s because steel is a commodity. There are no value-add margins to it. Steel is the same everywhere. If steel from country A is different than from country B, it’s because one of them isn’t purely steel! It’s what a company does with the steel that differs. Companies that make a decision to set a major part of their value-chain in a low cost country are also more likely to cut costs in other areas: steel thickness, welds, quality control, inventory management, customer service, etc. But both in theory and in practice, it’s possible to have an otherwise-high quality firm choosing to specifically place the most commoditized part of its value chain in a low cost area. Again, notice how none of this is about steel quality. Finally, also notice that I’m making no reference to economic nationalism. Buying your country vs buying imported out of patriotism is a legitimate choice, but it’s not a rational one (literally: it is an emotional decision, not a rational one). It could be correlated to higher quality (see above), which would make it more rational, but correlation doesn’t imply causation. Thanks Coop!
I love how one of the validation points is, "My wife was made in America"
My wife was made in Russia and no I didn't order her in the mail
"Made in America" has almost been reduced to just a marketing term. Actually should be "assembled in America". As long as a product is assembled or placed into a kit for purchaser assembly, happens in America, then the term "made in America" can be used.
Agreed
But then you’re guaranteed consumer protection. If a company is based outside of the US or another similarly advanced country, they can merely tuck tail, change their IP, and keep scamming.
"According to the Federal Trade Commission, “Made in USA” means that “all or virtually
all” the product has been made in America. That is, all significant parts, processing and labor
that go into the product must be of U.S. origin."
Unless I'm missing something here. That's not how it's supposed to be.
@@R.u.x.x i agree that's not how it's suppose to be, but it is. A strong argument is probably what percentage of the product is "made" in America.
@@illwill311 there's qualified and unqualified claims. Qualified being the complete statement "Made in the USA". Unqualified if portions of the product come elsewhere. I.E. Made in the USA with US and imported parts. I'm no expert but reading the official guidelines, there's specific ways in which products are supposed to be labeled.
I remember many years ago when I was working for a company that sells athletic equipment to physical therapists and gyms etc. we were one of the first to start selling Battle Ropes. The ropes were made in China. People complained. But who has made the best rope for (literally) thousands of years? The Chinese! Same with Swedish steel. One of the best steels you can buy but it comes from Sweden. People used to complain that we were importing but sometimes the best comes from other countries. It happens.
I'm sure these comments will be very polite and considerate.
Yeah definitely 🤥
10:50 - shoutout for proper trigger control!
Just a point about using automated machines, they will still require a team of engineers to maintain the machines and lines, these machines still require American jobs
True. And I think with more automated manufacturing more will come back to the States as it would make economic sense to. Means more jobs for engineers, technicians, IT, etc who will be American.
The robot argument is like filler songs on an album with one or two hits. Would anyone expect or want construction companies to use hand shovels instead of diggers? How about spoons?
I would add that robots bring about higher paying jobs as well. To program and provide maintenance.
Exactly or in the name of jobs get rid of the rail roads and pay people to carry everything on there backs.
It's not about quality it's about principle, for most people
those same people will then look at the price and forget about their principles
Garrett ... you right money talks
Agreed, I would have problem buying Swedish or Japanese stuff knowing that the workers are paid fair wages.
@@MattEngebregtsen well most people who buy american do so because they are trying to support indigenous production. Personally while I try to get as much made in usa as I can, most of my strongman equipment is Titan for the cost
@@MattEngebregtsen I try to avoid buying made in China or micronesian products because their labor laws are basically nonexistent but I do get the money factor. If iphones were made in America or Sweden or japan they would be wayyy more expensive
As an engineer I can tell you that the quality of the product has nothing to do with the country of origin, but the quality processes at the plant. I've had success but also terrible experiences with US manufactured parts. The difference that you most likely see is that chinese manufactured parts can just absorb the cost of tossing out more defective products, therefore additional quality checks cost more than the wasted material. The US most likely has the opposite problem where the additional quality checks cost less than the wasted labor used to make defective parts. REGARDLESS the company itself can dictate the quality checks and processes of their supplier regardless of manufacturing locations and at the end of the day is their responsibility to dictate to the manufacturer. Side note, I've had an absolute garbage experience with the quality of Rogue products made in the USA over the past two months
Great insights. Thanks for commenting.
What about the U.S. worker running and maintaining the machines that produce equipment?
Exactly this. Someone has to drive to deliver the machine, someone has to assemble the machine, someone has to programme how the machine will work, someone has to maintain it, etc.
@@amarh111 I was thinking the same thing.
Yep. But similar considerations for what about the dock worker that unloads the ship in the USA? What about the truckers? What about the train operators? The warehouse staff to unload? All jobs created in the USA for imports.
This is true to an extent. The point is that these lower skilled manufacturing jobs will disappear and those people will need to pay for education to enter the robots/engineering field. Today's job market is not shrinking so much but rather it is recycling so that there are fewer and fewer good paying low skilled jobs. A certain percentage of the workforce cannot afford to get the education needed to enter the newly formed high skilled high paying job market and this creates a larger gap between low wage and high wage jobs. Also, it may take 1 engineer to maintain a dozen bots where a company used to employ a dozen men for that line.
@@williammelms5139 Agree. I think the bigger issue we're both talking about is that automation is what is taking those good jobs away, not so much oversees manufacturing. All that's left are the box packers and a few robot maintainers.
Quality over marketing. And "Made in America" is marketing.
This is it right here. Rogue gets all this credit for "Make in America" even though a ton of the stuff they sell isn't totally, or isn't at all. Rogue is great quality, and if people care about that for their home gym, go nuts! But many of those same people will turn their nose up at Rep fitness because their stuff is Chinese-sourced and made. But their flat bench is as good and likely better than any flat bench Rogue makes, and considerably cheaper too.
Union Ironworker here. American made steel is objectively better than Chinese steel. There is no arguement.
@@chris.ander116 this is good to know, actually. For barbells, I'll look at american made. For everything else, steel quality variance doesn't matter much, so I'll go with the cheaper Chinese options.
@@chris.ander116 There's some not so great steel made in the US too, but chinese steel is in general pretty bad, and almost never up to spec. I would say pay attention to the company and their track record, and you can't go wrong.
eleiko the gold standard for Olympic lifting
Exactly. Lots of good products from Europe and Canada, but all the polarized comments US vs China 🤦♂️
@@moneysoles5185 plenty of Euro brands have good value.
Swedish steel ftw. Many Japanese knife makers import steel from Sweden. One of the reasons Swedish steel is viewed so favourably is that Swedish iron ores tend to be more pure than elsewhere, for unknown reasons.
Always buy the best product for your needs at the best price you can get. As a business it means you can buy more things or save money. Then you can provide a better service/product to your client or you can hire more people.
If made in America is good then made in your state must be better. Made in your town must be best. Actually, you should make everything yourself.
Division of labor is awesome. Celebrate it!
People are always commenting about made in America on devices not made in America.
I love supporting rogue and other american made brands but sometimes it comes down to price. I have several titan fitness items that work great for a fraction of the price.
True. It really depends on quality control. Some companies inspect their products before its shipped to the consumer. While others just ship product to the consumer without quality inspection. Then blame the consumer for buying it. Most of the Onnit kettlebells are china made. I bought spotter arms from a company called X-training, and the sizing was off for my squat stand. I had to get a local welder to adjust the bracket. Welder charged me as much to ship it back. So, I kept it.
At the end of the day you get good and bad factories in the USA, and good and bad factories in China etc. What matters more than the country in which it is made is the factory in which it is made, and the quality control methods of the company.
I understand the UK jobs argument, but I live in Europe, so I don't give a toss. What matters to me is the quality of product, and to that end, the above applies. Regardless, paying a premium to 'made in the USA' companies does not necessarily mean that money goes to the workers on the floor - more likely that it's padding the pockets of the bosses and shareholders.
Rogue had 1,250 employees in Columbus Ohio. Not to mention all the jobs manufacturing US steel. Truck drivers shipping the steel... etc. How many US employees do Rep and Titan have combined!?
I mean the manufacturing of steel is automated. Pretty much the jobs rogue has available are lower end jobs. The one ones making a decent amount are the truck drivers and that’s just logistics. Same with Titan and rep, they have to have drivers deliver the products to them from the ship yard. They have to have drivers come get the product to then ship it out. Plus they are much smaller than rogue in general so they will have smaller amount of employees. It’s nice supporting American made but I think it is much better supporting American made smaller shops. Someone like bridge built, or raptor fitness and many more I don’t know. Smaller American made business.
@@ladouceurmatt Rogue is currently paying A minimum of $25 an hour. With plenty of overtime offered, at double time, with benifits! Does that sound low end? Is Rep or Titan paying better wages than that!?
@apple apple My guess is you don't...
My guess is you're one of the guys on the Facebook page complaining about how you can't afford Rogue equipment and argue that Titan is just as good.
@garagegymreviews here’s your answer...we don’t need part 2
What so special about US employees? Titan employees need to eat too. Trade makes people better iff
I understand that people want to support their own economy and purchase products made in their native country so I can accept the ‘made in the USA’ banner in that regard.
However, when ‘made in the USA’ is used as a sign of it being of superior quality I cant take it seriously. Outside of the US nobody else in the world thinks that way about US products .
If you want the best quality you have to shop globally -
The highest quality cars ? - Germany
Sports Cars / Clothing ?- Italy
Watches? - Switzerland
Electronics - China
Weightlifting Equipment- Sweden
and I could go on . Even leading US brands such as Apple are not made in the USA.
Buy US if it makes you feel patriotic but don’t be blind to think that there are not as good or even better products available from other countries.
Just wanted to add that there are some fantastic quality products made in the USA - I own Rogue equipment and it is of very high quality . My point is that ‘made in the USA ‘ (or any other country ) is not a given for high quality . The location of where a product is manufactured is irrelevant- it is the design, quality of materials , QC and skill/diligence of the workforce that ultimately produce quality.
The country in which a product is made is not the thing that makes it good/bad. It's the product's design and the QC processes implemented. Pick a good factory in China and keep a close eye on the output and you can rival anything else.
Case in point comes with mountain bike gear. ENVE charge a premium for their wheels as they are made in the USA. There are a good amount of complains about shoddy quality and wheels cracking because QC failed to catch the bad ones. By contrast, most of the expertise in mass production of carbon fibre componentry can be found in China and Taiwan. Design in the west, manufacture in the east has worked exceptionally well there.
Highest quality cars, Germany 😂😂😂
Cars- Germany??? That's a joke right.
Electronics- China?? What planet do you live on.
@@NoxiousNoodles Plus a lot of the quality of a product is down to the business's own vision. Like Titan isn't trying to be an Eleiko-type business where consumers pay up for a premium barbell. They want to undercut the premium products on price and they picked a country with a labor situation that let them do that.
@@dylandelong7203 If you had to give it to one country, which would you say?
I think another reason people choose to buy american-made equipment is how the workers are treated in other countries. If you had a choice to work for rogue here in the US or whatever sweatshop rep makes their equipment in what would you choose?
Exactly dude
He doesn't know the difference between automation and A.I
No reason to be pedantic. Coop reviews gym equipment, and in common tongue AI is a broad term.
Next on Garage Gym reviews: Buying from Mom and Pop stores vs Big BOX Stores is OVERRATED?
Spending my money on those hardworking american robots 🤖
Harley Davidson.....americian bike with Chinese parts.
overpriced chynah parts
Four points made/attempted:
1.) AI diminishing support of Americans
2.) Import companies DO hire Americans
3.) Not wanting to support the CCP
4.) "Made in the USA" ≠ top quality
The first point is moot. The argument is against a perception that is hypothetical and abstract in nature, then turns it into a very unfair generalization. Additionally, the component of this point that is about AI is very underdeveloped. AI both helps and harms in some ways, which is another way of saying that things change. It's a manifestation of societal growing pains, and that is okay. It doesn't mean the support provided to your neighbors is truly diminished.
The second point is a good point, but the fact that it is legitimate implies why individuals like myself don't care about this point when given the choice between domestic, or foreign sourced products. This point necessitates a value being placed on American labor. If this is an absolutely true value, then it stands to reason that increasing that percentage of American origination from 50% to 100% would be even better! So, fair point, but doesn't necessarily support the argument depending on who your are talking to.
The third point, that money paid to Chinese companies doesn't support the CCP, is just wrong. In fact, it appeared that Coop was beginning to contradict himself when making the contrast with foreigners buying from the USA, but backed off because he had to in order to make the point. Nothing in me thinks Coop believes this argument. This was the grasping at straws that happens when you try your best to play devil's advocate. However, it's still a totally invalid and unsound point...
The fourth point, that there is excellent quality beyond our shores, is absolutely right. This is by far the strongest point made in support of the complete argument. The examples were appropriate and compelling. For those who prioritize quality, this is the only argument that needs to be made. Customers like myself can always use a good reminder of this. Even more, US companies should always be reminded of this, because none of us should be so loyal to American brands that those brands become content to rest on their laurels.
I look forward to the next video, Coop!
Well said as I was most interested in #4. I work in a different field which is aquaculture (fish farming) and I can say the U.S. is light years behind other countries. That being said we do produce high-end technical experts on the subject matter. But we simply do not produce products in this sector. I only mention this because it is short-sighted to assume that if the product is not made in the U.S. then it is inferior. Simply not true.
Globalization is a constant struggle to contend with; especially in manufacturing. That being said I do hope that in some sectors it results in somewhat healthy competition, greater innovation, and higher quality products for the end consumer.
Thanks for the summary of points.
I love you coop but.... common man. You. Do know that there are people in those factories right? Maintenance, technicians, forklift drivers... what about back office staff? Buyers, transportation, dispatch, clerks, IT, HR, finance. Supervision. Ect... and all the logistics jobs that titan employs are the same for American companies.
I ordered a rogue rack a while ago and it doesn’t even come close to the rep rack I returned it for. Rogue sent it in flimsy boxes that all arrived different days. All 9 boxes were torn apart and almost every piece was damaged. Rep: heavy duty boxes with each piece within the box individually wrapped, zero shipping issues. The rack itself looks amazing, incredible welds and the clear coat is sick. The rogue paint looked cheap. Btw from watching your videos and learning a thing or two, pretty sure the rep and rogue bumpers are made in the same Chinese factory. Look identical
Which rogue rack did you return and which rep rack did you end up getting??
Here's one thing the it doesn't matter crowd overlooks: it's environmentally catastrophic to mine, manufacture, and then ship a bar 10,000 miles to your home in CT, MA, IL, or wherever in the US. The same bar can be mined, smelted, and produced cleaner here and transportation will be a fraction of the distance.
Made in USA but the machine is from Japan and the raw materials are from China. The shipping company is based out of Korea. The guy coding to program the machines is out of India. Made in USA.
People buy Iphones and dont think about it but when it comes to anything else , its a problem
What are your options? There’s your difference.
This video brought to you by our sponsor - Rep Fitness
Made in America is overblown. If people were aware of how tariff shifts work for the US, they would realize that an upright made in China can still be "made in the US".
Ex: I buy a 3x3 square steel tube from China and import into the US. I further work the square pipe by adding holes, therefore I am transforming the HTS of the good from steel pipe to sport equipment.
Now that upright is made in the US.
Ding Ding Ding
“I was made in America... my wife was made in America”
😂
I’m active duty military. I refuse to pay more for supporting my country. I will not pay more for a american made product. Logically makes zero sense.
If we are using robotics in the United States we're hiring engineers and techs to run the machines. So high paying American jobs!
high paying american jobs the work from an aple and a eg
The only thing about my "Made in America" Craftsmen lawnmower is the stickers on it. They literally stick them all over the mower to try and remind you where its made. That thing is the cheapest plastic piece of trash I've ever bought. Pretty sure they put the stickers on it, claim its assembled or whatever here.
I really liked this video and Coop did a great job laying out the issues. I am currently building a home gym and I’m trying to buy American made products. I’m older semi retired and I can afford it. What I don’t like is people who declare that they only by American Made and look down on those who don’t. When I was younger I had to buy whatever I could afford. So if you want to buy American Made and it makes you feel good to be supporting US manufacturing. That’s awesome. But don’t make others feel less than because they choose not to. Great video Coop
One point you got REALLY wrong, I work in pharmaceutical labs and the automation shifted jobs from manual work to electronic work, configuring machines, preventative maintenance, trouble shooting, servicing, programming, etc. you’re whole point about jobs is very misleading. In fact, some of the “new” jobs are higher paying too. Life experience, 18+ years in pharma.
True, but the point of automation is to reduce the cost of human capital. So there are going to be many fewer jobs created than destroyed. Especially considering those jobs created are higher paid. So you're definitely right and it's worth noting but on the grand scale, less jobs
Many individuals in society do not have the intelligence capacity for more complex jobs, or the funds necessary to re-educate.
I never understood why it's more important for people in your own country to have jobs than someone in another country.
Errr within two minutes you were already crossing yourself... Are you talking about "Made in the USA" or "Made in America"? America is both N and S America combined as one hemisphere... From Canada to Mexico to Peru and Chile....
No one cares about your dumb made up definitions
I try to support my country by buying U.S. made goods whenever possible but what frustrates me is how often some U.S. products are simply inferior to products made elsewhere. For example, I recently bought a U.S. flag and I made sure to only shop U.S. made flags. The company proudly noted it was a U.S. made flag and touted its superior quality. I had the flag hanging only for a couple of months but the colors have faded so badly that it looks like it’s been out there for 10 years or more. On the other end of the spectrum are companies like Rogue who make quality products but, in my opinion, charge an obscenely high mark up with insanely high shipping costs. A balance must be struck between quality and price if U.S. manufacturers want to be competitive in the global economy. Just sayin’. ☝️🥴🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸
Rogue has fairly priced equipment. Sure it’s expensive but it’s worth every dollar
Don’t forget that when you’re working with metal fabrication, it’s safer for the workers when the robots do the work. Heavy lifting, catching your fingers etc in a press...
Coming from a tech nerd here, I don't like that "AI" is being used interchangeably with "Automation". They aren't the same thing. Machine Automation or robotic automation or Automated manufacturing are all better terms for the context being discussed. If you want to get into speaking about AI, let's get Lex Fridmen on here or Elon Musk or Bill Gates or Gary Marcus or *INSERT TECH GENIUS HERE* (of your choice that openly discusses the complexity's of technological advancements around AI).
BEYOND THAT NOTE: Fantastic discussion and great content Coop! keep it up! Love the reviews and general insight into equipment quality and value.
Good rebuttal. Definitely should have disseminated between the two.
@@GarageGymReviews Learn "disseminated" as well
Point number 3 is kinda misleading, Coop. No, the money doesn't go directly to the Chinese government, but the Chinese government doesn't allow that money to leave China; if it does, it's only spent on something that directly helps the Chinese and rarely the US. This means that billions of dollars spent on manufacturing and whatnot by US-based companies are billions of dollars trapped in there that isn't being used in America. Think about the number of jobs and economic growth that would occur if that wasn't the case. Recommend reading Stealth War by Robert Spalding if you get the chance. Great book about the subject and explains it better than I ever could.
I know it's hard not to buy stuff from China, but whenever I can get the chance to buy American made, I always do. Buying American means you're supporting one of the dwindling numbers of companies that are still producing here, and for me, that means a lot. Honestly, since COVID started, I've only bought rogue (keep in mind I'm a college kid doing army ROTC at school, so I've saved up plenty from that). I could buy way more equipment if I bought from Titan or Rep, but right now is the most important time to support American businesses. Rogue probably doesn't really need my money at the moment; they'd do fine without it lol. But buying from them means the money I spend goes to American citizens and, in turn, leads to more money in our economy and not in China's. BUY AMERICAN BABY
As a U.S. farmer this simply isn't true. They do provide a large purchasing power of our farm-produced commodities which is why the farmers required a bailout in the last 4 years due to the tariff wars. Not trying to be political but just relaying what is seen in the markets with a single move against china in terms of tariffs.
Emmm, I'm a chinese that I 'm comfused that how you prove that ''the Chinese government doesn't allow that money to leave China''. I live in china. I help usa business man produce the product they want. The product quality We made is up to my USA boss how much they paid. And, the money I earned from usa usually I pay back to Usa like the brand new Iphone12. So what's the peoblem? The global economy is running, every one win win.
Good points. Also, called automation. And yes it's the way to go in manufacturing.
I made my leg press/hack machine, multi-bench, squat rack and pull down in my garage 37 years ago.Still as good as the day I made it. So kiss my cigar ;)
Thank you, Coop.
Robots and CNCs are not AI. But you are correct that computers have taken jobs from people for decades. The real problem is that people have been doing the work of robots since the Industrial Revolution (before there were any). It's a fairly recent phenomenon that robots are becoming capable and cheap enough to replace humans in an increasing number of roles, but the efficiencies computers introduce have made numerous professions obsolete (Remember telephone operators? Remember landlines?). Unfortunately, people haven't changed their perspective on education nearly as quickly as technology has advanced, and so we've seen the regression of our middle class population.
My issue is that why is gym equipment made in the US a big deal to people but the VAST majority of everything else they buy isn’t made here??? Also as time goes on technology will advance and we can’t hold back being more efficient because people won’t be doing it. There will ALWAYS be jobs that we need people for and it’s okay for manufacturing to evolve. Lastly not everyone can afford the higher price tag that comes with American made goods and those people shouldn’t be made to feel bad or priced out.
my Made in China archon swiss bar arrived, couldn’t load a standard training plate on it due to quality control failure (sloppy, malformed sleeve on one side. yay china.
Depends... I wouldn't care if a deadlift jack or bands were made in China..... However, barbells, squats, or things that take abuse needs some quality control. Usually if it's USA made, there is a certain quality control.
So, I have the Lu Xaiojun products... the power bar “which is a stainless steel bar....” and the competition oly bar by Lu Xaiojun. They are are comparable to the Eleiko and Uesaka and superior to Rogue equipment.
It only matters if you want the economy to be strong and increase the jobs available. Which I guess you don't....
People are worried about the (lets be honest- mostly only non European) companies making equipment. Yet it’s the American companies that outsource their labor to other countries to save a buck....personally I don’t care where it is made, I care for quality and price.
A lot of Rogue stuff is not even made in the USA
You bring good points. Buying from America is normally my first thought when buying large products. But we should do more research to see what exactly is going on.
Direct or indirect support for the CCP is still support.
This whole garage gym thing has turned into an unhealthy relationship with Facebook market place and my wallet ... but it’s SO worth it lol
Great points and research Coop, looking forward to part two.
That $1k lat tower from Titan fitness... Is actually $1300 -_-)
the cellphone/laptop you're using to watch this videos is made in China. so is other 99% of products that you use everyday so stop crying about it.
My Samsung S20 is made in Vietnam! So there!! LMAO
Dam capitalism
Except you are leaving out the fact that we don't have a choice on that. There are zero phones that are actually made in the USA. Sometimes we, as consumers, don't have a choice so whenever possible buy American, so you don't support communists. Despite what coop says, you are still supporting the country because of the tariffs and taxes they have on them.
Only thing that could make this video better is if you had real stats for what pieces of equipment are made here or overseas as well as how much $ a “US Made” company puts into the US economy opposed to a company that outsources. Still a great general video with so many different factors to consider! Thanks for the insight Coop!
You're due to review some of the American Made kettlebell manufacturers that are starting to pop up. Iron Warrior Foundry in SD comes to mind.
New Rogue ones made in Michigan?
@@bmstylee Not sure, haven't followed Rogue's kb manufacturing. Personally, I'm hoping Kettlebell Kings find a US foundry for their line of bells, as I like the form factor.
@@FrederickTSchurgerDC it's good to see companies making plates here. Rogue has the new deep dish plates and kettlebells. Now if we can get calibrated plates made here.
As a german citizen I can say yes, made in America is overrated. In Germany we call it "Deutsche Markenqualität" and I think that's beautyful
What that you've bought in Germany is actually made in the US?
@@ClockCutter in Germany we say "geh doch zum Lachen in den Keller" to people like you and I think that's beautyful
@@lk-ip1xs in America we put people like you who spout random nonsense to strangers in sanatoriums.
@@ClockCutter you get that it's a joke?😂 if you want to act like a smartass, at least be smart enough to type in the words I wrote into google translator😂
@@lk-ip1xs Those are beautyful words, Adam.
Where is the other half video?
I think international trade is important. Exporting and importing in a balanced way. If countries acted in a protective manner and purchase only locally produced goods and services then the world economy would collapse which sound over dramatic but it's true. I feel everyone needs to diversify our supply chains and maybe reconsider helping countries with poor labour laws.
This guy gets it. America doesn't need to make phones if a country is willing to make them in exchange for American stuff
Made in America is supporting you neighbors who make the products. Made in America is keeping our lights on.
Before watching this I don’t put as much stock in “made in america” but glad he’s doing another video arguing for its merits. Nice Squatober shirt as well
To your point about money not going directly to the government: the difference is that the US government doesn’t own direct stakes in US based companies. More than mere tax revenue, the Chinese government has direct ownership stakes in most or all Chinese companies.
Where is part 2?
Support our own!USA
I have the Fringe Sport Wonder Bar, and it’s a beast! It’s built like a tank dispute being imported.
Same here. And I actually was going to buy from Rogue but nothing was available. I luckily stumbled upon Fringe Sports and I love their equipment (Bar, Plates, and Immortal Wall Ball).
Made in America also does not mean made from American materials. Where do manufacturers buy their steel? Or if they buy from local mills, where do those mills buy raw material?
Quality has several aspects - how high requirements are, how tight specs are (how much deviation from requirements can be allowed) and how well this all controlled. If requirements and specifications are the same as local companies use for their locally manufactured goods, then, given proper quality control is in place, the quality of local and overseas goods will be equal. There is no magic in it.
And of course when buying goods from other countries, people support those countries' economy to a degree. But they also support their own budget. And without ability to buy from China American economy and lifestyle probably wouldn't be so great either. Not everyone can afford Rogue, so they go for Titan. And without Titan, there would be much less strong Americans.
I’ve always had better luck with American made. The quality is always better. American steel is better. The Chinese are known to have poorer quality steel.
That's not true... They may use poorer quality of steel in their products, but they have access to the same type of industrial steel america and all of the world has access to. It's not like we live in the middle ages, where european sword steel was different than japanese steel (actually european steel was far superior in that time). If you buy an AISI420 steel in America nowadays, it's the exact same quality as AISI420 steel from China. Zero difference.
Lmao the dude was flying at 6:39
Your equipment can be made on China Venezuela or Italy, but the GainZ will be 100% AMERICAN
All I'm worried about right now is which company has plates in stock...
I have a degree in exercise science, not economics or business. I wont pretend to understand how supply lines and microeconomics work. What I do know is that everyone of us can call/email these companies and get to know a regional representative that will be more than happy to talk to you about their product. I buy strength equipment from companies like Intek and Capps because I've known some of them personally or know someone else who has met them and vouches for their business. If it really means that much to you and you're willing to put your money where your morals are like you claim, then you'll take the time to speak to someone and do the research.
In short - "buy local" is harmful and stupid.
People is people... chinese workers also need a salary. It's not like you are burning your money when you buy from China. Besides, how you justify exporting products from the US? The other countries should buy products manufactured in their own land...
Too much sense
I don’t care where ever they are cheaper I buy , the only thing that I have bought was expensive was my rogue equipment but that’s because they ran out of racks for REP fitness racks , A Chinese rack from rep won’t fall to the ground or bent if your not lifting heavy and is only for home use
It's not important. I'm from Canada and could care less. Less and less people are working in those area's. Also it forces competition to make better products
I'm in Canada but a lot of this is applicable here of course. I think that you provide good insight to your viewers on this topic.
I’m biased towards Rogue, but if you take a look, there’s a lot of products they put out that are not made here in the US.
Of course they have a sizable US based business, but even Rogue will import to keep costs down.
Could you buy a workout rack from aliexpress to do a comparison?
I bought the Rep PR 5000 rack. It's nice but it's not Rogue nice. You can definitely tell where they value-engineered certain parts. When possible I try and buy made in the US. The fit and finish tend to be better when made in the US. Cost unfortunately was the deciding factor in this purchase. I payed less at the expense of attention to the finer details. Like I said. It's nice just not Rogue nice.
Kind on topic
The more trade you do, the better off you are (IF the goal is to make both counties better, and there is fair policies). You can argue buying from domestic is better for the economy, (think 10k Joe Smiths won't lose their jobs to a mexico plant), but the economy is better off if you produce what you are most effective at. America COULD produce TVs for example, more than Japan, but Japan imports most of their food. America could produce both TVs and grain, but they have to give up a lot of grain to make those TVs. Why not have America produce grain, and japan produce TVs and they trade. there is a effective, better off economy. Even though the US might lose jobs to Japan, the US and Japan are trading money and everyone is better off in the whole.
Pretty sure Quality and Assurance is not done my robots...support PROUDLY MADE IN USA.
That Titan lat pull down is now 1300 and been out of stock for almost the entire year.
“Hitler explains why America sucks”
My Jeep Renegade was made in Italy........ I've been a Jeep loyalist for decades.... I trust'em.
Quality is largely a function of QC, standards and the tolerances of the spec. It all comes down to money. You can get something made to loose tolerances in the US, cut corners on the QC and still have garbage for fairly cheap. Or if you're willing to put in the work have top quality stuff made in other parts of the world. Let's not forget how the American auto industry got into the mess of their own making and opened the door for the Japanese car companies. But there is a real argument about maintaining an American manufacturing base. But in that case "made in America" is probably less important than making sure parts are made from American Steel.
My comments will be quite simple in answer to Coop’s monologue. In the last 30 years I’ve owned and sold quite a bit of gym equipment for my home gym. Every single time, without fail, equipment from “China” has been significantly inferior. I’m talking about receiving equipment that is rusty, breaking welds on power racks while using around 200 pounds on the rack. Receiving equipment that is slightly bent or distorted. Quality control in China manufacturing sucks, it’s not there. They mass produce as quickly as possible, box the goods and toss them on the ship. I do have some equipment that is imported from other countries other than China, and they meet or exceed American quality. An example is my Werksan weight lifting bar from Turkey, top notch bar. I’m specifically referring to China because that is where most of the imported gym equipment is coming from, and their quality control plain old sucks.
Love the video. Can you review the ew starting strength bar from Texas power bars and compare it to the rogue Ohio power bar? As a do it all basic powerlifting/starting strength program bar
Coop thanks for your honest and actually making a video like this.. I try to purchase only made in America products , but it’s just too hard due to cost and availability making it expensive ..🙆🏾♂️
That Mustache is made in the USA!
Even with robots doing the welding, people still need to cleaan off the slag/spatter after, but that requires a labourer not a welder.
I just recieved my MG-24 multi-grip bar from rogue, and they didn't clean off most of it before powder coating, even has a few sharp welds poking out, and the spatter is very abrasive if my hand rubs against it.
UPDATE: Rogue offered to send me a free replacement and pay for the old one to get shipped back, or a partial refund. Thanks Rogue!
Says made in China isn't bad then compares to Elieko? I got nothing on that one.
Made in America but not by Americans still helps the American economy though
I am not a total zealot, but I do try to buy American where I can when I see a benefit. I have never owned a Titan rack, but Alan Thrall put the fear in me. Yes, their stuff is packaged in Horn Lake, MS and shipped for (no additional charge), but that’s a far cry from robotics maintained by US workers making products by US workers.
So I know Rep says they have American engineers designing their products and just have them manufactured in China. Ok, so it’s partially US-made, but is their quality is high as Sorinex or Rogue? No, and maybe that is fine, but I think many people buy American MANUFACTURING because it is generally synonymous with higher quality due to US labor being more skilled and demanding higher pay for that skill as opposed to slave labor conditions.
Your own video about urethane plates and bumper plates in general highlights how these things are made in China because the working conditions are awful. So when we buy plates, we are either buying Hi-Temp crumb or...imported. When I have no choice, it is what it is. Same for phones or computers. There may be some components designed or manufactured in the US, or they may be assembled in the US, but I am not aware of any 100% US made products.
Maybe that’s the point you’re trying to make, and that’s ok to educate people (to the extent necessary?) that robots (loose definition of AI) may be doing work you might think a human is doing, but if it’s made here, that’s still more American jobs. It’s still American steel. It usually has a higher QC standard. It costs more; so, it may not be worth it to everyone, but we all have our hills.
Closing point: I will not knowingly eat Chilean farm-raised Atlantic salmon. Likewise, I have no interest in Chinese manufactured protein products because the standards are so poor.
Perfect timed video Well played.