2 hours each side is about right for me as long as the diagram is between 45 - 58 facets anything above that becomes time consuming for me I still go by what I was taught 180# pre-form, 1200# cut in, - from here my mentor would go to 60k final polish - I personally had too many issues with scratches appearing that were next to impossible to get out on the final polish to the point that I nearly stopped faceting altogether from frustration. It was then that I learned my sequence - 180#, 1200# 3000# on copper pre-polish diamond solved every issue I had and allowed me to see the meet points perfectly, it was the game changer, then 60k diamond on metal type lap. 180 and 1200 are just toppers and fast cutting 3000 is where I spend my time and final polish is what I work to get perfect every time. yes I have 3 different laps but I'm confident in that there will be no cross contamination, as I've found out that solving faceting issues is a pains taking process of elimination, if I had a youtube channel it would be called Cussing 'n' faceting lol thanks so much for the content mate I do really enjoy your vids
I was reading those same forums talking about having to use specific lap progressions, and it took me a long while to realize that lap sequence doesn't matter. The only thing the customer sees is the final polish. They don't care if you had a 3k, 8k, and/or 14k step. If you could go from 360 or 600 straight to polish, do it!
Nice to see that you are getting to where I have always said you have to go. Yes, having a "predictable path to a perfect polish" with only 3 laps has been my mantra for many decades. Of course this has to be backed up by an efficient pre-forming ability (the true "art" in gem cutting) that removes almost all of the material that is going to be removed. This means you are really only laying on the facets on the machine. This must be done by using the pattern of your index wheel to position the facets not reading numbers, and not using a diagram (the enemy of yield a devil's paper) Very fast. For maximum results you need to have a machine that consistently and accurately allows you to remove and re-insert the dops from the quill without any re-alignment. This allows you to work a lot of stones through the cutting/polishing sequence concurrently. The final skill is being able to cut any size/shape stone by eye and mixed in the sequence. In order to do this you need to not rely on the machine for meet points, nor require the stones to be centered on the dop. Once all of this becomes second nature you will find that depending on size and species you can comfortably cut between 5 and 10 stones a day. Not two. Keep up the good work! Steven Dente
600 grit sintered leaves the facet surface satiny smooth with minimal to no pitting. It’s very very easy to go to pre-polish from there. If you cut your facets on a 600 topper lap, the surface of the facet looks a lot more coarse and has a lot more little pits in it. I find a worn 1200 topper leaves the facets a lot smoother with a lot less pitting than a 600 topper though it’s nothing close to the smooth finish of a sintered lap.
sorry becouse I m pretty new and now I m making the order of the machine and tools from sterling but I m making confusion . What kind of laps and diamonds powder do I need ? I m going to buy 100 600 1200 3000 and a zinc or copper ? Can I use only zinc (cheaper) ? or only copper ? Diamond Powders are 0.5 and 1.0 which one is the most abrasive ? Thank you for your time and vids
@@Algoldprospecting I’ve not heard of it. Lots of stones we don’t think of as star stones have very rare specimen that show stars. Martin Steinbeck has books about stars that show really rare ones, such as star tourmaline. Maybe he has rare opals in his book.
@@JustinKPrim oh wow I haven’t heard of tourmaline.I will have to check that out. I’ve always been fascinated with the star gems but cabbed this one on accident.
What about contamination? Wont you end up getting the 3k from rhe outter ring? My problem might be thst im using diamond paste, but its somewhat confusing to me
I believe I have a good set for starting, 360 toper lat, 600 and 1200 syntered , 14500 diamond charged cooper lap, and brand new tin lap. I am planning to charge tin 50000k. Tried cut my first stone citrine, I like it, already love it, but scratches... Is an over cutting can cause self contamination? And my polish, self scratches too.
For your first few stones try something that’s not Quartz. Quartz is hard to polish and 50k on tin probably won’t work. Try garnet or aqua or sunstone when you’re just learning. Save the quartz for later. You need different laps and /or difference abrasives such as cerium oxide.
Would your 600 lap be better described as a resin-lap, rather than a sintered lap as it looks like the bonding medium is resin rather than bronze or copper?
Interesting thoughts. At the moment I have a 1200 sintered, would you recommend still doing a 100grit sintered followed by 1200 sintered? Also, do you ever use cerium/alumina oxide? Or always diamond?
The 100 grit sintered is great for taking off large chunks of Rough quickly. If you’re preforming or Cutting in your first set of mains, this will go a lot quicker. From there you can jump to the 1200 grit sintered. If you try to cut Rough on 1200 sintered, it takes forever. No I never use any oxides. I was never properly trained on how to use them and honestly I haven’t found a use case for them because diamond powder on a tin-lead lap can polish absolutely everything really well and fairly quickly.
Great video 😊. I guess I need a 600 sintered lap. Where can I get one. I took a break from Faceting. I was getting frustrated trying to get rid of the scratches plus cabbing stones in 20 minutes sounds better than hours lol. 😆
sadly, the ones that I was selling are no longer available due to the sanctions on Russia. There are a few others on the market but I haven't tried any of them.
I am also looking for a 6-inch 600 sintered lap. Justin what are the few others that are on market that you haven't tried? If you have a recommendation I'll give it a try
Hi Justin hello from France ! I started cutting like 1week ago and i have already done some stone and my polish on stone is more like ice freezy , we don't see throught . Do u think its because of my polishing step on my copper lap with a 10k diamond paste / oil which is too big grit ? Btw i'm waiting to receive a 60k diamond powder , do u think with the same copper lap and this powder the polish gonna be a lot more mirror clean see through ? If yes , Do u think i stop using my 3000 grit diamond lap for prepolish and just prepolish with copper lap and the 10k diamond paste and switch to final polish on same copper lap with the 60k powder ? Thx for your responses !
@@JustinKPrim Ok thanks , and for the prepolishing i use a 3000 diamond grit topper lap but it remove some materials from the stone , should i use my 10k on the copper lap for prepolish or just use an other lap like tin with a 3000 compounds paste or diamond powder ?
@@guinardalexandre5320 i would get rid of either the 3k or 10k. You only need one. After that go to 60k. 3k is faster, 10k is slower but more controllable. I personally use 8k then 60k
@@JustinKPrim Ok thanks for your advices Sensei :D Someone told me that i can skip the 3000 grit by taking my 1200 grit instead of the 600 to cut and switch prepolish with the 10K paste / polish with the 60k
Great vid! When you say it takes you 2-3 seconds to prepolish a facet on most stones I was just wondering if that also applies to sapphire or do those take a bit longer? If so, how long on average would you say to prepolish or polish a main facet on say a 1ct srb sapphire? I've been using zinc laps for them because I figure they are the fastest, is that what you use? You also mention that your 600 sintered leaves a nicer finish than a 600 plated and I'm wondering if you find it cuts slower than an equivalent grit plated or not. Thanks Justin!
On a bigger sapphire, yes a little longer but a 1ct should still be just a few seconds. I don’t think the 600 sintered is slower as long as you’re preforming on a rough grit first. Cutting in the mains from rough on a 600 sintered is painfully slow.
Ok thank you! Would you say zinc is the fastest polish/prepolish lap material for sapphire because of its hardness or is there something even faster?@@JustinKPrim
Hi Justin. Love your show,can you tell me if the handpiece cutting machine is available in Australia?and what sort of price point.I believe they are made in Shrilanka Thanks John 😎🐈⬛🇦🇺
Brilliant@@JustinKPrim! Thank you for making this video. I was wondering how people can cut so quickly. Currently I am lucky to finish a stone in a day. Granted they aren't SRBs or RBs, but still. I Usually cut 380> 600> Red 600 Lightning Lap> Batt w/3k diamond> 60k diamond. Your videos make a difference. Thank you for being so candid with techniques. Alot of people aren't as open to reveal their secrets. It was great meeting you at the Tuscon USFG. I enjoyed our chat greatly and am really loving your book. Thanks for signing it! Cheers!
Wanna race? 😂😅 Great advice, great idea, I would love a two phase lap with a 600 lldlite resin outer and a BA5T ( or Batt) inner, meanwhile since I prefer the resin lap for pre polish ,I had John ( gearloose) cut aBA5T down to 5 inch and drop it on top of my 600 resin lap - almost the same except your do have to move up and down a little Btw sorry I missed you at Tucson and thank you for your kind thoughts on my recent ordeal
2 fingers for separate applications of slurry. 2 papers towels for two grits of wiping. I’ve been using this system for almost 5 years with no problems.
@@JustinKPrim Fascinating! I'm new to cutting, but can you say a little more about what you're using for your two-zoned polishing lap? What kind of lap is it? What kind of grit/paste/powder do you use?
@@shalemonkey sure. I really need to make a video about this soon. I have all my laps set up as dual band; batt, copper, zinc, lead. I use 0-5 (8k)micron diamond on the outside and 0-1 (60k) on the inside band. I mix the diamond with sewing machine oil to make a slurry and then spread that on.
@@JustinKPrim Thank you! I would love to see a video on this - not having to reset everything for pre-polish and polish sounds amazing, and I'm looking forward to trying it on my next stone.
I am a gemstone collector, I collected many kinds of stones and I am now learning how to cutting and faceting it. It is very hard to do but I will continue to do it
2 hours each side is about right for me as long as the diagram is between 45 - 58 facets anything above that becomes time consuming for me I still go by what I was taught 180# pre-form, 1200# cut in, - from here my mentor would go to 60k final polish - I personally had too many issues with scratches appearing that were next to impossible to get out on the final polish to the point that I nearly stopped faceting altogether from frustration. It was then that I learned my sequence - 180#, 1200# 3000# on copper pre-polish diamond solved every issue I had and allowed me to see the meet points perfectly, it was the game changer, then 60k diamond on metal type lap. 180 and 1200 are just toppers and fast cutting 3000 is where I spend my time and final polish is what I work to get perfect every time. yes I have 3 different laps but I'm confident in that there will be no cross contamination, as I've found out that solving faceting issues is a pains taking process of elimination, if I had a youtube channel it would be called Cussing 'n' faceting lol thanks so much for the content mate I do really enjoy your vids
I was reading those same forums talking about having to use specific lap progressions, and it took me a long while to realize that lap sequence doesn't matter. The only thing the customer sees is the final polish. They don't care if you had a 3k, 8k, and/or 14k step. If you could go from 360 or 600 straight to polish, do it!
thank you for this.
I have wanted to know this info since I started cutting. Thank you!!!
Nice to see that you are getting to where I have always said you have to go. Yes, having a "predictable path to a perfect polish" with only 3 laps has been my mantra for many decades. Of course this has to be backed up by an efficient pre-forming ability (the true "art" in gem cutting) that removes almost all of the material that is going to be removed. This means you are really only laying on the facets on the machine. This must be done by using the pattern of your index wheel to position the facets not reading numbers, and not using a diagram (the enemy of yield a devil's paper) Very fast. For maximum results you need to have a machine that consistently and accurately allows you to remove and re-insert the dops from the quill without any re-alignment. This allows you to work a lot of stones through the cutting/polishing sequence concurrently. The final skill is being able to cut any size/shape stone by eye and mixed in the sequence. In order to do this you need to not rely on the machine for meet points, nor require the stones to be centered on the dop. Once all of this becomes second nature you will find that depending on size and species you can comfortably cut between 5 and 10 stones a day. Not two. Keep up the good work! Steven Dente
totally agree! thanks for the good advice!
Dude...... You have helped me so much! Thanks for all your insight and hard work
My pleasure. Thanks for watching.
Great info. For recuts and jewelry grade this works great. Competition cutting is a different store.
definitely. For competition cutters, don't follow my suggestions :)
Nice man That was nice and informative.
Amazing, thank you. I also appreciate the ADR.
very helpful for new gems cutter like me .
great work
This helps a lot, I have a 100, 260,1200,3000, then 50k and maybe 100k after but I always found it takes too much time
Terrific vid as always. Need an explanation of how a 600 sintered cuts like a 1,200 plated.
600 grit sintered leaves the facet surface satiny smooth with minimal to no pitting. It’s very very easy to go to pre-polish from there. If you cut your facets on a 600 topper lap, the surface of the facet looks a lot more coarse and has a lot more little pits in it. I find a worn 1200 topper leaves the facets a lot smoother with a lot less pitting than a 600 topper though it’s nothing close to the smooth finish of a sintered lap.
I would like to see you demonstrate the final lap polishing using multiple grits.
check out this vid around the 9 minute mark: ua-cam.com/video/pKR0RNQ9MqA/v-deo.html
sorry becouse I m pretty new and now I m making the order of the machine and tools from sterling but I m making confusion . What kind of laps and diamonds powder do I need ? I m going to buy 100 600 1200 3000 and a zinc or copper ? Can I use only zinc (cheaper) ? or only copper ? Diamond Powders are 0.5 and 1.0 which one is the most abrasive ? Thank you for your time and vids
Great 👍👍👍 thanks 😊
Great info. I have an unrelated question. Does star opal exist. ?The opal I just cabbed looks like it has a 4 ray star.
Not sure
@@JustinKPrim seriously. Not heard of it?
@@Algoldprospecting I’ve not heard of it. Lots of stones we don’t think of as star stones have very rare specimen that show stars. Martin Steinbeck has books about stars that show really rare ones, such as star tourmaline. Maybe he has rare opals in his book.
@@JustinKPrim oh wow I haven’t heard of tourmaline.I will have to check that out. I’ve always been fascinated with the star gems but cabbed this one on accident.
What about contamination? Wont you end up getting the 3k from rhe outter ring? My problem might be thst im using diamond paste, but its somewhat confusing to me
No everything spins out so contamination is unlikely. I haven’t had any problems in the last 4 years doing that.
Hi I’m trying to buy your book and it seems it is sold out. Is there anywhere else I can buy it? Amazon had it and now they don’t. 😢
@@KAZUMILVR sorry. It’s fully sold out. There are no more.
@@JustinKPrim okay thank you.😭
I believe I have a good set for starting, 360 toper lat, 600 and 1200 syntered , 14500 diamond charged cooper lap, and brand new tin lap.
I am planning to charge tin 50000k.
Tried cut my first stone citrine,
I like it, already love it, but scratches...
Is an over cutting can cause self contamination? And my polish, self scratches too.
For your first few stones try something that’s not Quartz. Quartz is hard to polish and 50k on tin probably won’t work. Try garnet or aqua or sunstone when you’re just learning. Save the quartz for later. You need different laps and /or difference abrasives such as cerium oxide.
Yes, I just have to admit that quartz is not going well.
I will try garnet.
Would your 600 lap be better described as a resin-lap, rather than a sintered lap as it looks like the bonding medium is resin rather than bronze or copper?
No. It’s sintered bronze.
Interesting thoughts. At the moment I have a 1200 sintered, would you recommend still doing a 100grit sintered followed by 1200 sintered? Also, do you ever use cerium/alumina oxide? Or always diamond?
The 100 grit sintered is great for taking off large chunks of Rough quickly. If you’re preforming or Cutting in your first set of mains, this will go a lot quicker. From there you can jump to the 1200 grit sintered. If you try to cut Rough on 1200 sintered, it takes forever.
No I never use any oxides. I was never properly trained on how to use them and honestly I haven’t found a use case for them because diamond powder on a tin-lead lap can polish absolutely everything really well and fairly quickly.
@@JustinKPrim thanks! I’ll have to put the 100grit sintered on my shopping list!
I basically use 3 step cutting for all my stones. Preform on 250 grit, pre polish on 1200 grit and polish with 50k diamond.
Great video 😊. I guess I need a 600 sintered lap. Where can I get one. I took a break from Faceting. I was getting frustrated trying to get rid of the scratches plus cabbing stones in 20 minutes sounds better than hours lol. 😆
sadly, the ones that I was selling are no longer available due to the sanctions on Russia. There are a few others on the market but I haven't tried any of them.
@@JustinKPrim oh man I hope you got extras for your own use. 😂
I am also looking for a 6-inch 600 sintered lap. Justin what are the few others that are on market that you haven't tried? If you have a recommendation I'll give it a try
@@jimmiescott7050 there’s a guy called Boris on Facebook who sells them. Check his out.facebook.com/boris.kolodny.31
@@Algoldprospecting i’ve got two sets. One for America, one for Europe.
Hi Justin hello from France !
I started cutting like 1week ago and i have already done some stone and my polish on stone is more like ice freezy , we don't see throught .
Do u think its because of my polishing step on my copper lap with a 10k diamond paste / oil which is too big grit ?
Btw i'm waiting to receive a 60k diamond powder , do u think with the same copper lap and this powder the polish gonna be a lot more mirror clean see through ?
If yes ,
Do u think i stop using my 3000 grit diamond lap for prepolish and just prepolish with copper lap and the 10k diamond paste and switch to final polish on same copper lap with the 60k powder ?
Thx for your responses !
@@guinardalexandre5320 yes. 10K is not polished. That’s your problem. You need at least 14 K but 60 K would be better.
@@JustinKPrim Ok thanks , and for the prepolishing i use a 3000 diamond grit topper lap but it remove some materials from the stone , should i use my 10k on the copper lap for prepolish or just use an other lap like tin with a 3000 compounds paste or diamond powder ?
@@guinardalexandre5320 i would get rid of either the 3k or 10k. You only need one. After that go to 60k. 3k is faster, 10k is slower but more controllable. I personally use 8k then 60k
@@JustinKPrim Ok thanks for your advices Sensei :D
Someone told me that i can skip the 3000 grit by taking my 1200 grit instead of the 600 to cut and switch prepolish with the 10K paste / polish with the 60k
@@guinardalexandre5320 for me I hand preform on 360, cut on 600, and polish with 8k/60k. There are other paths but I know this one works
Great vid! When you say it takes you 2-3 seconds to prepolish a facet on most stones I was just wondering if that also applies to sapphire or do those take a bit longer? If so, how long on average would you say to prepolish or polish a main facet on say a 1ct srb sapphire? I've been using zinc laps for them because I figure they are the fastest, is that what you use? You also mention that your 600 sintered leaves a nicer finish than a 600 plated and I'm wondering if you find it cuts slower than an equivalent grit plated or not. Thanks Justin!
On a bigger sapphire, yes a little longer but a 1ct should still be just a few seconds.
I don’t think the 600 sintered is slower as long as you’re preforming on a rough grit first. Cutting in the mains from rough on a 600 sintered is painfully slow.
Ok thank you! Would you say zinc is the fastest polish/prepolish lap material for sapphire because of its hardness or is there something even faster?@@JustinKPrim
@@christopherhoag the traditional material for polishing sapphire is copper. Zinc is possible too but copper is harder.
Thank you!@@JustinKPrim
Hi Justin.
Love your show,can you tell me if the handpiece cutting machine is available in Australia?and what sort of price point.I believe they are made in Shrilanka
Thanks John 😎🐈⬛🇦🇺
I got one from Sterling Gems and it cost $2400USD including shipping to australia
@@bainyshmall perfect response. Thanks.
So by dividing the prepolish/ polish lap you dont finish polish the girdles, right? Must only be a prepolish.
Yes exactly. The girdle stays at 8k but you don’t see much of a difference. The girdle is small and once set, no one can see the polish.
Brilliant@@JustinKPrim! Thank you for making this video. I was wondering how people can cut so quickly. Currently I am lucky to finish a stone in a day. Granted they aren't SRBs or RBs, but still. I Usually cut 380> 600> Red 600 Lightning Lap> Batt w/3k diamond> 60k diamond. Your videos make a difference. Thank you for being so candid with techniques. Alot of people aren't as open to reveal their secrets.
It was great meeting you at the Tuscon USFG. I enjoyed our chat greatly and am really loving your book. Thanks for signing it! Cheers!
Wanna race? 😂😅 Great advice, great idea, I would love a two phase lap with a 600 lldlite resin outer and a BA5T ( or Batt) inner, meanwhile since I prefer the resin lap for pre polish ,I had John ( gearloose) cut aBA5T down to 5 inch and drop it on top of my 600 resin lap - almost the same except your do have to move up and down a little
Btw sorry I missed you at Tucson and thank you for your kind thoughts on my recent ordeal
Not seeing how you prevent cross contamination on two grits one lap....
2 fingers for separate applications of slurry. 2 papers towels for two grits of wiping. I’ve been using this system for almost 5 years with no problems.
@@JustinKPrim Fascinating! I'm new to cutting, but can you say a little more about what you're using for your two-zoned polishing lap? What kind of lap is it? What kind of grit/paste/powder do you use?
@@shalemonkey sure. I really need to make a video about this soon. I have all my laps set up as dual band; batt, copper, zinc, lead. I use 0-5 (8k)micron diamond on the outside and 0-1 (60k) on the inside band. I mix the diamond with sewing machine oil to make a slurry and then spread that on.
@@JustinKPrim Thank you! I would love to see a video on this - not having to reset everything for pre-polish and polish sounds amazing, and I'm looking forward to trying it on my next stone.
CAN I VISIT YOUR OFFICE IN BANGKOK
Sorry, we moved out of Bangkok last year. We’re in Lyon France now. If you want to come visit, send me an email. Justin k prim at gmail
I am a gemstone collector, I collected many kinds of stones and I am now learning how to cutting and faceting it.
It is very hard to do but I will continue to do it
@@KaAtphasouk good luck