The lizardman fang take id absolutely love to see in the game as it stands the fangs are practically worthless so it would give them some value and realistically the only time you're ever gonna have the amount of gp required for custom raids on an iron is after the gauntlet grind we all know and love. As for the final take on the 2k kc cm cape i feel like this is less an issue in terms of cox itself but in the game as a whole. Take for example the guy who went 30k kc dry at sara for the pet should he have had a pity system in his favor? He had a 0.25% chance of this occurring to him which is unfortunate yet also statistically possible. But here's the thing if a global pity system where to be put into place how do we determine the magic number pity would come into play? Would the players decide? Would it be a factor of time invested? Would it be going x amount of times over the drop rate?
Yeah, I don't like the idea of a global pity system in general, but for CoX specifically the drop rates are just so insane. I did say it was a controversial take though and don't really think it's good for the game for Jagex to start implementing pity systems. That said, if you can get to the front page on the CoX leaderboards and still be missing 3/12 unique items, that says something about your drop rates lol
Completely agree. Crank prayer scrolls to 10% chance each in cms and make cms actually have value. I also agree the 500k is steep especially for irons. If you make it from death coffer, you could use dupes to pay for it and make it worth it as well.
Yeah, that's true it would print purples. But I'd argue if you have people scouting on other accounts they could already do this. And maybe making purples a bit easier to come by at CoX isn't a bad thing since it'd make it more in line with the other raids.
@FCASandChill yes but there is inherently a problem with scouting accounts. I don't have stats so I could be bsing but I would argue that if you bought scouts off wdr or whatever, 75% is botted. That's not good for the game. Also people are paying anywhere from 2m to 5m for a vtv. 500k for 10 vtvs No one is going to care when they can do 5 raids an hour for 1/2 the price as 1.
@FCASandChill but I agree the issue at hand is we have better raid ideals now. Tob and basic layout and no variance and TOA which is good with invocation(not good raid but invos work for it)
@FCASandChill but yes. Making the CL for cox a little more obtainable and *cough* not 1k over cms without solo bow *cough* a little more bearable is definitely needed
To really resurrect CoX they need to buff the unique drop chance, purple chance at ToB is like 11% and at Tombs you can also buff the drop rate of unique without doing anything insane which makes CoX unique drop rate laughable with those 3-4% of unique. Its the only way to make this raid more enjoyable, since most of my OSRS and IRL friends dont even want to hear about Chambers because of the crazy small chance to get an unique drop.
I just started learning COX using your guides on my maxed cb iron. It’s takes me up to 15 minutes to scout a raid (skipping vanguards, vasa, vespula, tekton). Prepping supplies and suiciding (coz I suck) results in 25k points and about a 45 minute raid. The customization NEEDS to be added. The idea of scouting and buying raid layouts is very flawed. From an Iron perspective, 500k is insane. 150k GP would be more appropriate and there should be an option to maybe use duplicate COX items as a money sink to cover fees. The fang idea is an option, but in my 38 solos I’ve only gotten the fangs about twice.
COX scouting should not be changed. Clans and GM players can crank out 3-5 man VTV in 12-16 minutes. They’ll be completing 3-6 raids per hour and would be splitting the 500k between each person. It would be completely broken and purples would flood into the game. At the very least, every single player in a custom raid should have to pay the fee and I think it should be more expensive. Overall, I think this would either be dead on release or way to over powered by just feeding more money into the clans and “elitists” that refuse to learn other rooms or do other rooms because it isn’t “meta”. If there were any change at all, I would prefer to see a “token” drop from the chest that would be untraceable that would allow you to do one custom raid with it.
all they need to do is let irons pay from death coffer. thats it it would cost like 500m to go on rate for a tbow if you really didnt want to do CMs or Scout , a lot of irons will get this and a lot more in dupes over their pvm journey. i dont like the idea of making it cheap so that solo only ironmen can do it without too much trouble. cox has its own unique feel due to the variance , being able to choose the layout is a luxury not a necessity and should be priced as such
this is a good take, solves the ironman gp problem. but if you have dupes on iron you could just transfer them to main and scout the layouts on the main account as well.
The one off fee for ironman. I think to add to it; it shouldn't only be cash based - but can also be item based, like the death coffer. Mainly for the reason that you wouldn't need to spend another 100h + on CG/ other content just for the gp drops.. especially pre max when this money is still needed for smith/fletch/con. The idea of bad luck mitigation seems nice, but truly is not. We could argue that if you implement it at one spot, you would have to implement it at all bosses.. But this would just ruin the game in the sense of "i know i would only need to put x hours into this and i'd be more or less likely to get the drop". Bad luck mitigation shouldn't be added to cox out of two reasons; 1. - You'll most likely spoon other grinds, (dwh - gwd - tob / toa - nex - whv else ) 2. - The % going waay dry is such a small scale (6 people according to your vid that has surpassed the 2k mark) - That adding a bad luck mitigation just based on such a small minority wouldn't make sense.
I just never understood why CoX CM has only ~7% unique when normals 3-4% 😂 they need to buff droprate and change the scaling so it cant be abused. One time payout for choosing scaling and layouts sounds great 25-50m cash
I think CM's are pointless past kits and dust especially if scaling comes out id rather just scale up a raid without alts and do the raids i want, can even prescout good layouts vs the slog of doing CMs where DWH can miss on tekton making it aids and all the other rng shit to make time for the effort and increased points. I used to run duo & trio+2-4s in like 20 min then stopped that and got into CMs which were similar points per hour with a good team and didnt have to use alts though with a good team using alts that had 78+ herblore could use them to prep for olm while the mains ran the raid with more switches to speed it up. CMing took that all away and was less aids and multi-tasking.. The one thing I wish they would change 2k+ cox kc here and dont have olmlet.. I wish olmlet was any chest like the other 2 raids instead of purple only...
Wow no one has ever shared that genius insight before. With a brain as big as yours, you could single handedly solve all of the worlds problems! Why are you commenting on runescape videos?
guaranteed or reduced drop rates devalues this game so much. osrs is meant to be the grindest game and every update the game is getting easier and easier from what is was on release 10 years ago. ironaman especially has devalued alot of this game eventhough jagex promised years ago ironman would not impact updates. you can always quit or become a main if you cant handle the grind.
Be nice if they just made raids uniques 3x more common because the fact that it takes like 950 deathless solos to get a tbow "or was it 1900? i forget" is pretty atrocious. This mediocre raid overstays its welcome in time to complete by raid 300.
The game shits gp out on so many different fronts (slayer/gwd alchs, dt2 onyx bolt drops, revs, battlestaves, cg, rune dragons)and the herb/cons resources you get from the raid are obscene. I literally have nothing to do with my gold beyond 99 cons when I decide to max, bank slots, and nardah herbs. Gold sinks are good. the cm scroll weighting changes you suggested @ 7:12 sound good to me tho
I think the changes are great and the update would be great for the moderate to high level community. Currently people are paying 500k to 5m for layouts in the WDR scouting discord. If you’re complaining about losing money for this you can continue scouting with the regular method.
I have plenty of friends that are Master's and a handful of GMs, I know it exists but I've never heard of anyone using the WDR scouting discord.. 500k is a bit too high imo, esp sucks for ironmen
@@Snufolupogus the point is that this should be gated behind a gold sink or the prices of raids items are going to turbo crash. braindead takes. Alansa is right
That for people who want speedrun layouts though, but normal people won't want to pay 500k for just, a normal chilled layout. This is assuming they changes go through as mandatory and you don't have the option, but I assume it's not gonna be like that? I read the post but I might have missed something.
Yes people who speed run are going to be doing it, but normal people also utilize scouts and such to avoid the randomness and the bullshit that comes with cox layouts. It's just a little ridiculous that everyone has to deal with scouting to find an "acceptable raid". I'd be open to having each customizable slot unlocked after like 100kc i think that'd be a better fix than this tbh@@ChazFoulstone
I agree with buffing purples from cms but pretty much everything else I disagree with. Cox is balanced around being able to react to different layouts and it's what makes the raid unique. I think it would lessen the skill gap and make the raid less interesting if the meta was to do the same every time. If you want to restrict yourself to very specific layouts for whatever reason, that should come with a downside, being either playing an alt at the same time as your main (which means more effort) or spending extra time between raids. A one time fee would be an option but it would have to be quite a bit higher imo. Just getting one dex and being able to have perfect raids every time is overpowered. As for ironman - I mean, it is what you signed up for with the gamemode - you are severely restricted out of end game gear. Makes it all the more impressive if you do manage to grab it. Also your estimates on efficient raids are way off, if you do 2-2,5 cox an hour you are on the average side, not the high level gamer side.
I actually love the idea of increasing the points for some rooms to make scouting less incentivized. And yeah good point about the variety being good. I just think the current state of the most efficient way to do cox being scouting repeatedly on another account is not ideal.
lol WHAT? 500k is far too cheap. People who currently pay for scouts and scaling are paying between 2-7m depending on the raid. Scaling is much too cheap, too.
then it just gets locked behind people who bought the 250m down payment and sell scouts to people who don't want to by it. 500k per is better long term for the economy @@at6867
The reason people pay that much is because the current system is so ass to scout, and it's usually just people speed running who pay those fees. People grinding for items definitely aren't paying 2-7M a layout for every raid.
@@FCASandChill I disagree, I think speed runners are the most frequent users but I know that me and friends often pay for scouts just to get a better raid instead of wasting time scouting. 500k is still FAR too cheap, I’d much rather prefer closer to 1m for fully custom, maybe 500k for you to pick how many rooms or if you want to exclude a certain room. I’d gladly pay 500k to never get vanguards again lol
also just scout on your main and give the raid to your iron if you are that pressed about 500k but holy shit this argument is stale. 500k is legit too cheap but yet here we are.
If it's a one time fee, it should be closer to 500-800m. Since if you can complete sub 15 5 mans every raid, there's going to be an influx of items. Unless, it's a one time fee, but solo only.
Ok you're just arguing about being poor right now. I'm sorry but 500k a layout is piss cheap if you've ever bought scouts before. Hard disagree with you, Jagex is doing the right thing by making this a GP sink.
that lizardman fang proposal was based
The lizardman fang take id absolutely love to see in the game as it stands the fangs are practically worthless so it would give them some value and realistically the only time you're ever gonna have the amount of gp required for custom raids on an iron is after the gauntlet grind we all know and love. As for the final take on the 2k kc cm cape i feel like this is less an issue in terms of cox itself but in the game as a whole. Take for example the guy who went 30k kc dry at sara for the pet should he have had a pity system in his favor? He had a 0.25% chance of this occurring to him which is unfortunate yet also statistically possible. But here's the thing if a global pity system where to be put into place how do we determine the magic number pity would come into play? Would the players decide? Would it be a factor of time invested? Would it be going x amount of times over the drop rate?
Yeah, I don't like the idea of a global pity system in general, but for CoX specifically the drop rates are just so insane. I did say it was a controversial take though and don't really think it's good for the game for Jagex to start implementing pity systems. That said, if you can get to the front page on the CoX leaderboards and still be missing 3/12 unique items, that says something about your drop rates lol
Completely agree. Crank prayer scrolls to 10% chance each in cms and make cms actually have value. I also agree the 500k is steep especially for irons. If you make it from death coffer, you could use dupes to pay for it and make it worth it as well.
"especially for irons" lmao
Yep, I love the death coffer idea!
Honestly really good takes man. I love the idea for lizardman fangs being the currency to buy raid layouts.
The fang take was a cool idea but the item thing is a stretch man it’s an rng based game.
Tbh if they just let it come out of deaths coffer it wouldn’t be so bad
Agreed! They nailed it with ToB & ToA. Why wouldnt they just change CoX aswell.
Yep, I love the death coffer idea!
The issue with the buyable raids is printing purples. HLC can do 5 VTV an hour with about a 4% chance for a purple
Yeah, that's true it would print purples. But I'd argue if you have people scouting on other accounts they could already do this. And maybe making purples a bit easier to come by at CoX isn't a bad thing since it'd make it more in line with the other raids.
@FCASandChill yes but there is inherently a problem with scouting accounts. I don't have stats so I could be bsing but I would argue that if you bought scouts off wdr or whatever, 75% is botted. That's not good for the game. Also people are paying anywhere from 2m to 5m for a vtv. 500k for 10 vtvs
No one is going to care when they can do 5 raids an hour for 1/2 the price as 1.
@FCASandChill but I agree the issue at hand is we have better raid ideals now. Tob and basic layout and no variance and TOA which is good with invocation(not good raid but invos work for it)
@FCASandChill but yes. Making the CL for cox a little more obtainable and *cough* not 1k over cms without solo bow *cough* a little more bearable is definitely needed
To really resurrect CoX they need to buff the unique drop chance, purple chance at ToB is like 11% and at Tombs you can also buff the drop rate of unique without doing anything insane which makes CoX unique drop rate laughable with those 3-4% of unique. Its the only way to make this raid more enjoyable, since most of my OSRS and IRL friends dont even want to hear about Chambers because of the crazy small chance to get an unique drop.
Fang and cm drop distribution is good
I just started learning COX using your guides on my maxed cb iron. It’s takes me up to 15 minutes to scout a raid (skipping vanguards, vasa, vespula, tekton). Prepping supplies and suiciding (coz I suck) results in 25k points and about a 45 minute raid. The customization NEEDS to be added. The idea of scouting and buying raid layouts is very flawed. From an Iron perspective, 500k is insane. 150k GP would be more appropriate and there should be an option to maybe use duplicate COX items as a money sink to cover fees. The fang idea is an option, but in my 38 solos I’ve only gotten the fangs about twice.
500k for a fully custom raid is in no way shape or form prohibitively expensive.
COX scouting should not be changed. Clans and GM players can crank out 3-5 man VTV in 12-16 minutes. They’ll be completing 3-6 raids per hour and would be splitting the 500k between each person. It would be completely broken and purples would flood into the game. At the very least, every single player in a custom raid should have to pay the fee and I think it should be more expensive.
Overall, I think this would either be dead on release or way to over powered by just feeding more money into the clans and “elitists” that refuse to learn other rooms or do other rooms because it isn’t “meta”.
If there were any change at all, I would prefer to see a “token” drop from the chest that would be untraceable that would allow you to do one custom raid with it.
really love the lizardman fang idea! I hope jagex hears our cries! VOTE VOTE VOTE
all they need to do is let irons pay from death coffer. thats it
it would cost like 500m to go on rate for a tbow if you really didnt want to do CMs or Scout , a lot of irons will get this and a lot more in dupes over their pvm journey.
i dont like the idea of making it cheap so that solo only ironmen can do it without too much trouble.
cox has its own unique feel due to the variance , being able to choose the layout is a luxury not a necessity and should be priced as such
this is a good take, solves the ironman gp problem. but if you have dupes on iron you could just transfer them to main and scout the layouts on the main account as well.
I actually love the idea of using death coffer to pay for it. This would change my view completely.
The one off fee for ironman. I think to add to it; it shouldn't only be cash based - but can also be item based, like the death coffer. Mainly for the reason that you wouldn't need to spend another 100h + on CG/ other content just for the gp drops.. especially pre max when this money is still needed for smith/fletch/con.
The idea of bad luck mitigation seems nice, but truly is not. We could argue that if you implement it at one spot, you would have to implement it at all bosses.. But this would just ruin the game in the sense of "i know i would only need to put x hours into this and i'd be more or less likely to get the drop".
Bad luck mitigation shouldn't be added to cox out of two reasons;
1. - You'll most likely spoon other grinds, (dwh - gwd - tob / toa - nex - whv else )
2. - The % going waay dry is such a small scale (6 people according to your vid that has surpassed the 2k mark) - That adding a bad luck mitigation just based on such a small minority wouldn't make sense.
LOVE the fang idea.
Im 1,4k kc regulars all solos, with almost identical c log on cox :D cool to see anither high kcer with same bad luck, haha.
Gokd ljck my man
I just never understood why CoX CM has only ~7% unique when normals 3-4% 😂 they need to buff droprate and change the scaling so it cant be abused. One time payout for choosing scaling and layouts sounds great 25-50m cash
Video started well and then it just turned into this man bitching about not having t bow
The problem with one time fee ist tha only one parso Person needs to pay and others can take the raid
I think CM's are pointless past kits and dust especially if scaling comes out id rather just scale up a raid without alts and do the raids i want, can even prescout good layouts vs the slog of doing CMs where DWH can miss on tekton making it aids and all the other rng shit to make time for the effort and increased points.
I used to run duo & trio+2-4s in like 20 min then stopped that and got into CMs which were similar points per hour with a good team and didnt have to use alts though with a good team using alts that had 78+ herblore could use them to prep for olm while the mains ran the raid with more switches to speed it up. CMing took that all away and was less aids and multi-tasking..
The one thing I wish they would change 2k+ cox kc here and dont have olmlet.. I wish olmlet was any chest like the other 2 raids instead of purple only...
You could just de-iron and buy a tbow for the GM achievements?
Wow no one has ever shared that genius insight before.
With a brain as big as yours, you could single handedly solve all of the worlds problems! Why are you commenting on runescape videos?
guaranteed or reduced drop rates devalues this game so much. osrs is meant to be the grindest game and every update the game is getting easier and easier from what is was on release 10 years ago. ironaman especially has devalued alot of this game eventhough jagex promised years ago ironman would not impact updates. you can always quit or become a main if you cant handle the grind.
@@SryYouFail another iron crying that the game should be balanced around an artificial limit they placed on their account. victim brain
Does the FCAS stand for the actuarial designation?
Yep, I finished my last exam for FCAS around 3 years ago!
@@FCASandChill congrats man. I’m taking MAS-1 Monday
Be nice if they just made raids uniques 3x more common because the fact that it takes like 950 deathless solos to get a tbow "or was it 1900? i forget" is pretty atrocious. This mediocre raid overstays its welcome in time to complete by raid 300.
3x more common might be taking it a bit too far haha, but I agree cox drop rates suck.
The game shits gp out on so many different fronts (slayer/gwd alchs, dt2 onyx bolt drops, revs, battlestaves, cg, rune dragons)and the herb/cons resources you get from the raid are obscene. I literally have nothing to do with my gold beyond 99 cons when I decide to max, bank slots, and nardah herbs. Gold sinks are good.
the cm scroll weighting changes you suggested @ 7:12 sound good to me tho
I think the changes are great and the update would be great for the moderate to high level community. Currently people are paying 500k to 5m for layouts in the WDR scouting discord. If you’re complaining about losing money for this you can continue scouting with the regular method.
I have plenty of friends that are Master's and a handful of GMs, I know it exists but I've never heard of anyone using the WDR scouting discord.. 500k is a bit too high imo, esp sucks for ironmen
The point is you shouldn't have to pay for certain layouts because the way layouts currently are is dogshit
@@Snufolupogus the point is that this should be gated behind a gold sink or the prices of raids items are going to turbo crash. braindead takes. Alansa is right
That for people who want speedrun layouts though, but normal people won't want to pay 500k for just, a normal chilled layout.
This is assuming they changes go through as mandatory and you don't have the option, but I assume it's not gonna be like that? I read the post but I might have missed something.
Yes people who speed run are going to be doing it, but normal people also utilize scouts and such to avoid the randomness and the bullshit that comes with cox layouts. It's just a little ridiculous that everyone has to deal with scouting to find an "acceptable raid". I'd be open to having each customizable slot unlocked after like 100kc i think that'd be a better fix than this tbh@@ChazFoulstone
I agree with buffing purples from cms but pretty much everything else I disagree with. Cox is balanced around being able to react to different layouts and it's what makes the raid unique. I think it would lessen the skill gap and make the raid less interesting if the meta was to do the same every time. If you want to restrict yourself to very specific layouts for whatever reason, that should come with a downside, being either playing an alt at the same time as your main (which means more effort) or spending extra time between raids. A one time fee would be an option but it would have to be quite a bit higher imo. Just getting one dex and being able to have perfect raids every time is overpowered. As for ironman - I mean, it is what you signed up for with the gamemode - you are severely restricted out of end game gear. Makes it all the more impressive if you do manage to grab it. Also your estimates on efficient raids are way off, if you do 2-2,5 cox an hour you are on the average side, not the high level gamer side.
I would rather see them increase points from ice demon and thieving so scouting is less incentiviced
I actually love the idea of increasing the points for some rooms to make scouting less incentivized. And yeah good point about the variety being good. I just think the current state of the most efficient way to do cox being scouting repeatedly on another account is not ideal.
lol WHAT? 500k is far too cheap. People who currently pay for scouts and scaling are paying between 2-7m depending on the raid. Scaling is much too cheap, too.
If it’s a one time payment it would have to be a minimum of 250m I’d say.
then it just gets locked behind people who bought the 250m down payment and sell scouts to people who don't want to by it. 500k per is better long term for the economy @@at6867
The reason people pay that much is because the current system is so ass to scout, and it's usually just people speed running who pay those fees. People grinding for items definitely aren't paying 2-7M a layout for every raid.
@@FCASandChill I disagree, I think speed runners are the most frequent users but I know that me and friends often pay for scouts just to get a better raid instead of wasting time scouting.
500k is still FAR too cheap, I’d much rather prefer closer to 1m for fully custom, maybe 500k for you to pick how many rooms or if you want to exclude a certain room. I’d gladly pay 500k to never get vanguards again lol
also just scout on your main and give the raid to your iron if you are that pressed about 500k but holy shit this argument is stale. 500k is legit too cheap but yet here we are.
If it's a one time fee, it should be closer to 500-800m. Since if you can complete sub 15 5 mans every raid, there's going to be an influx of items. Unless, it's a one time fee, but solo only.
HLC still won't do 4 coxes per hour when they can do 5 man 500 toas for 3x the gp/h lmfao
we've been doing sub 15 5 mans since cox release and prescouting for 4 raids/hr. nothin new
Ok you're just arguing about being poor right now. I'm sorry but 500k a layout is piss cheap if you've ever bought scouts before. Hard disagree with you, Jagex is doing the right thing by making this a GP sink.