Fountain Hooks Timestamps 25:55 - There's the hook, Hao! Brought all the way back to the base! Cleaned up by the fountain. 32:52 - There it is, yup! Banana going for a ride on the Dendi Express. Welcome, to the well. 36:27 - Dendi is gonna try it again, can he? Got him that time. See you in the base, Mu. Welcome home! 47:54 - Ohhh he got him!! He got him! 49:25 - There we go, the hook! Got him. SanSheng taking the long ride to Shanghai. Welcome home. 56:19 - Navi... He got him! One more! This is what you call "One for the Road".
This is the Navi I loved, this is the Navi I cheered, this is the Navi I remember. But today, I am not so sure anymore. I hope one day Navi comes back to this level of excellence, and then I will love, cheer and re-remember!
Omar Joseph Yep, I am very disappointed of Navi in group stage. I've been a Team Secret fan since Puppey and Kuro left Navi and im not regretting. What a team. #dreamteam
Omar Joseph I would be happy if Navi is in Top 8 this year. They have been struggling for a longtime and realistically that what we can hope for. I would still watch their game since I WERE a fan, but I wont be VERY excited like, if I watch a Secret game for example.
Probably the best played game I've ever seen. Navi got completely outdrafted and just played out of their minds. Funn1k was hitting insane shackles all over the place. Kuroky got a ton of great impales, the timing between Dendi and Puppey was iffy, but when it mattered they made fantastic plays.
1987retroman Dendi was awful in the game but it doesn't matter how many times you miss when landing a fountain hook at anytime is a guaranteed kill. It's a no risk high reward play and I'm glad it was removed from the game. Tong Fu played better but not banning Pudge after seeing Chen was a bad move.
I couldn't really disagree more, though I am glad it's out of the competitive scene. Navi didn't really have a pick/fighting lineup. The fountain hook is also a very risky play since if Tongfu decides to take a fight after a missed hook its 4v5
+Disen Fountain hooks are high risk high reward. Professional players are too hard to properly hook and when it misses, that it one guy out from the teamfight.
That was a CLASSIC game! Who didn't like that one (regardless fan of who he is), dont have a clue about Dota. Just amazing game series, we can be happy to witness that kind of epic shiat :)
Im watching this in 2018, trying to remember and compare what navi was and what navi is today. A team that has shaped the history of dota now seems to be a team fading and losing their relevance to the game today. It warms my heart to watch this yet it also makes it bleed...
I have been playing DotA for 7 yrs now still remember the emergence of this game . Na'Vi you have made DotA 2 what is in 2017. Your sportive brilliance and innovation have amazed the world! The true GODS OF DOTA!
The combo is an overpowered glitch that ruins the game. With game breaking glitches like fountain hook, dota 2 will never get ahead of lol. Fuck Navi, bunch of useless cheating dweebs.
Derp Herp its not cheating, its tactic. If theyre cheating, they shouldve used some kind of software. And if youre scared of dendi playing pudge,why not just ban pudge.
After I saw how Loda threw a fit about those fountain hooks, I was expecting the hooks actually worked ALL the time. Looks like it was something that's very hard to do.
Ya IKR! I think some 30% of the fountain hooks worked this game, and every time it didn't work, it just felt like Tongfu had so much space on the map to do whatever they wanted. But hey, if those 30% fountain hooks lands on Aegis Gyrocopter, then who cares about all the other failed ones?
STFU with all those ft hook....thats why they are called Natus Vincere !!! we all love NaVi...the game play they show to us not the common 1 used by others...keeping 1 carry farm and be a hero at the late game ? well it's fail though !! Natus Vincere Rules !!
Everybody loves NA'VI even when they lost the final against Alliance. I hope to see again that Chen+Pudge Combo if the team of dota and valve put again that bug in the future :3
SweetZombiJesus it's true, many don't get it but it is not a bug, you hook someone and you get teleported along with your hook and at the end of the hook is the hooked hero which, obviously, comes along. it makes sense. i actually feel bad they removed it. i'm tired of all the crying and bitching, this shit ain't easy to pull i mean proffesional players in the greatest e-sports event can't do it right sometimes, even they fail, now think about doing this in pub games with regular players. ppl bitch that they won because of it and it sounds like it's so easy any noob could do it, but i respect them even more for giving us such an amazing game/show, out of the ordinary! Na'Vi is awesome!!
Well u say this fountain hooking is a nice thing but navi fans cry about splitpush splitpush is much more skill dependend cause 1 hook to fountain changes a game conpletely even he missed so much hooks thats what u call skill? Its his best hero so its not that hard even in pubs u could do this quite easy
Guys, don't say Na'vi are noobs just because they did that. I know, it's too overpowered, but, why don't you blame other teams for playing heroes that are OP? A lot of heroes are so OP in DotA, you just push a button and then you rampage. And fountain hooking isn't so easy to do. You have to synchronyze so good, you must not hook to early or to late, and it's easy to move arount to counter it. It's just a mechanic, (like most of us said, a bit overpowered) but it was in the game.
"You just push a button and you get a rampage" Please tell me about this magical creature because I don't know a single hero that can do that against a decent team.
que bonitos recuerdos, es increíble pensar que ya han pasado más de 8 años, ver estas partidas me hacen recordar parte de mi adolescencia~ muy buena partida, me hizo recordar la emoción de un buen dota
The look on brunos face when maelk was speaking about hating the fountain hook and the fact he said 'deal with it' leaves no doubt that he is icefrog... What a game
Na'Vi aren't Noobs just because they used a 'bug' or a 'glitch' how some idiots call it. They are an awesome team with skill to execute it. And we all want our favorite team to win but we also want entertainment. You idiots don't hear the crowd happy when they did a fountain hook?
yeah, i see that, but they still shouldn't win though. I'ts okay to have showmanship in a tournament like this, but they didn't deserve to go to the finals. I feel bad for TongFu for losing against dirty exploits of a glitch in the game
chr1s657 A glitch of the game? Are you serious? This FEATURE has been in the game since over 5 years. EVERYBODY knew about it. Don't want to play against it? Ban either Chen or Pudge. It's a shame it got removed. I'm not even a fan of navi but saying that the win is unfair is pathetic.
Levin Aadas Fountain hooking is neither a bug nor a glitch. It was a game mechanic that like all others, was "Unintentional" but the developers chose to leave it in. It is not a big and it is not a glitch, it is a "Imbalanced / Overpowered Game Mechanic." It was something that can only be described as IMBA or OP but is still a mechanic. I agree that patching it was the best choice, but nobody can say that Na'vi shouldn't have been allowed to win. The old trick of Naga Sleep and Vacuum was also an IMBA / OP mechanic and not a bug, it was patched and is no longer possible. To take away Na'vis win bcuz of the fountain hook? They'd need to go back to EVERY SINGLE INSTANCE that a team abused something that was OP during a tournament and rework it. The developers accept that when something is truly imbalanced, they will fix it but they will not punish anyone for making use of it. (Bugs are different. If a team used the earthshaker void bug to win a game by moving the fountain, that would probably be different.)
I WENT TO SLEEP THINKING OF WHAT WILL HAPPEN AT LOOSERS BRACKET..AND NOW I WILL WATCH A LIFE-CHANGING MOMENT I'VE MISSED! I FEEL SO PROUD AND ASHAMED AT THE SAME TIME....
Dendi is undoubtedly the best DotA player in the history of the game. The fountain hook is one of the most difficult things to do in the game and it is executed very well by Dendi.
well, we wish to know what they think as fans, like us. We really feel them very close to us cause they think and say what we think, sharing their opinion is good! Greatings from Perú!
Ok, let's get this from the beginning. Each team has a 5 pick/5 ban hero in the start of the game! Chen is Puppey's signature hero, Pudge is Dendi's signature hero, you give an Alch to Xboct who farms like crazy and you already played a game against a Dendi Pudge and got raped. I call it "Not learning from your mistakes tbh", I don't like the playstyle of chinese teams, it's just B O R I N G to watch! Now, to reach the point where fountain hook is a bug, it's not a bug, it excisted since Dota 1and if you have the skills necessary, feel free to use it! It's not a casual game to have fun, it's a fucking international championship with pressure and high stakes, so to execute something so difficult like this in a match that important, you are destined to win. I don't feel sorry for Tongfu, they picked their strategy, Na'Vi picked theirs, best strategy won, end of story. The Pudge hooks stall the game, but when missed, TongFu should be aggressive. They were not aggressive, so they gave time to XBoct to farm/comeback and carry the game. Simple as hell...!!! So chill out and gg wp
Νίκος Βαγ. But you can't complain about NA'VI fountain hooking since it requires the two heroes. You see a Pudge picked by them? Ban Chen. You see a Chen? Ban Pudge. Frankly I think teams should just ban Pudge all the time against Dendi because otherwise they just insta lose lol.
Νίκος Βαγ. With Split pushing it's only one hero, and it's a bitch strategy. It's a "I'm too scared to fight so haha I'm winning the game without fighting while you're actually trying to win the game with fighting" strategy.
I completely understand your mentality about winning using any possible method. As I said - the same people who support the fountain hook will support infinites. And there will always be people who focus all their energy on winning, and who don't have the time to distract themselves with improving the game or changing the game. And then there are people who question, wonder, and who later design the games that become the future of competitive gaming. Ideas built to improve on existing games.
I never really hated them.They are born to win, this strat prooved it.They were able to win the game by any means, also the only ones who ran pudge a lot.Todays pudge is almost extinct, all is lategame and I hate that.
Na'Vi best team ever highest level of showmaking by pure skill perfect execution of unorthodox tactics and playstye composed by real knoledge of the game plus no fear to play. This team owns numerous legendary series and matches in dota history mostly with Wins. Its funny every player had such unique personality, style and a lot of chemistry, i refeer a lot to TI2 lineup with LightOfHeaven for me one of the best to ever play the game. But i respect and value this line-up with funnik and kuro they made a incredible job keeping up the abdormal high level required to not affect the consistency the team had already achieved.
mainstream dota is the dumbest thing to do on a game like this :D its like:"ok we lose but we play dota with honor." no pro player ever said that sentence :)
Kuroda Kazuki no. u cant say that by a game like dota. ti3 final game navi vs alliance. some ppl call the splitpush combo clever and some ppl say its rat dota ( cause they didnt rly fight 5 on 5) so ur comment is wrong.
Doing a Pudge Hook with Chen is very risky, I Remember spectating this game and commenting how it can backfire and they have to be careful and I remember everyone thinking this might go the wrong way ... then a few key hooks came in and well Damn
TheDanishBully it does make sense, the combo no longer works. If Pudge hooks someone then goes to a new location (blink, force staff, relocate, Chen sendback) The hooked target will be hooked to the location where pudge was when he threw the hook. Please read patch notes.
Fountain hooking and stacking both started out as bugs, but are kept in the game. The pros say it was and so did the creator, it was one of the things that started off as a bug, but ended up being a key mechanic apart of the game. (A fortunate accident one could say)
This is the difference between DotA and LoL...These plays & these games make it absolutely fantastic...There are plays where the money & xp difference doesn't matter...
Yeah a lot of people try this in the pubs that I play and fail horribly. One team did this even when they were ahead and ended up throwing their game away because they failed this a few times. The more it is done the less shock factor it has and people know how to play against it and counter it.
Like many said, fountain hook is definitely not a bug. However, it was very unbalanced before icefrog fixed it for two reasons: 1. the track of the hook shown on the screen is totally a mystery for anyone. So that makes fountain hooks much easier to hit than normal hooks. 2. It is low risk high reward indeed. Some said Tongfu should just be aggressive, but how? Just rush to the highland once Pudge is sent back? No way! You should also notice Navi could use fountain hook in their highland, which could lower the risk even more. Some said you can just ban one of Pudge and Chen, which is true. But any hero that goes too imba will make all the game messed up. That is why Icefrog fixed it at last tho it is fun.
+Bob Jiu i agree with you man, but it's still fun to relieve the moment of hooking someone to the fountain. They should make a mod of making fountain hooks possible again especially now that source 2 has some features to play other maps. just for old times sake Lol.
If you watch closely on the key fountain hook that catches the gyro with aegis Doombringer Doom's Chen no more than half a second after Chen sends Dendi home. The window to execute that was so tiny and it completely decided the game.
Fountain hook takes unbelievable skill and is STILL a huge risk even for the best players in the world. Look at all the times Pudge missed, look at all the gold he spent for tps and the farm lost to walk all the way back and the risk to his towers as they were a man down. Pudge has a 43% win rate in competition it was stated... Dindi is JUST THAT GOOD that he wins 75% of the time. This is a game of teamwork and skill, and fount hooks are a testiment to this teams skill level.
Also, as in the Gladiators of the past, making a grand show is all part of the experience. Did you not hear the crowd go nuts when Dendi gets Pudge? And did you not hear them go nuts with each fountain pull? EPIC!!!
For anyone that thinks that this is a glitch, we use to test of faith with enchant's spear... So yes, as ridiculous as it sounds, this is a combo that TongFu did not ban thus allowing it to happen.
if you guys actually notice, it was like 20% chance to do it right. And there are so many draw back: waste 135 tp gold or time to walk back, chance to get 4 allies killed, waste chen's Teleport to save someone, etc. Also it's not like no way to counter: let units standing in front, fast reaction (blink, force staff or even phase boots) or simple ban 1 of those 2. All I see is this is an hard and risky combo, everyone knew this from TI2
Sickest comeback EVER, I can understand you're butt hurt that a team you supported loses . But even the haters can't deny that the plays made by dendi pudge and puppey Shen had such miraculous communication. It was awesome to watch and even if it's a bug, the timing required to pull those fountain hooks off is incredible hard and to pull them off consistently and on such high prio targets. Props to them for that, so even if you dislike the outcome at least respect the skill required for it.
As I said before, they haven't patched Fountain hooking but merely Chen + Pudge combo. Using a pudge hook to get someone into the fountain is still possible by using Wisp / Kotl who can TP him out of the fountain, instead of Chens TPing him into the fountain.
how does it contradict itself? one ability brings an enemy to your position, other moves your position to the fountain - it's a pretty sweet interaction that works, makes sense and most importantly is NOT ANTICOMPETITIVE (it has counterplay, it's not broken, it takes skill to pull off, etc)
what? the spell description says it'll put you in the place you were 5 seconds ago, if you buyback and timelapse you'll go to the place you were 5 seconds ago - back in the fight
I think he is the best pudge player on the competitive scene. He has a 78% win rate on that guy and is the only person that would play it on a semifinal of ti3!
No, Dota is a game about using whatever means exist at your disposal to win the game. This can be done for instance through getting levels, items and pushing, but it can also be done through tricks like this. And this trick can be countered, through positioning mainly, and it's pretty hard to pull off so it's not game breaking anyway. In any case you can just ban out Pudge or Chen and then it can't be done at all.
Without the fountain hook navi would lost it but they know what to do. They defed it and xboct farmed and farmed in this time and so they won. That is not lame that is tactik if u have no options. Puppey best captain !!!
People don't realize that it's basically a high risk ability for a high outcome. If he misses, he's not longer part of the team fight. If he hits someone, it's still a 4v4.
this reminds me that years ago when i watched a game of Manchester United vs Liverpool, and the 3 commentators were one side-ly supporting ManU, and everything they said were for United. as an audience i was feeling very annoyed. i truly believe commentators should be as neutral as possible and give impartial opinions cuz there are audiences for both sides.
its not really abusing its just really good synergy between both of the heroes like the naga+dark seer combo back in the last international. Its nothing that needs to be nerfed cause its actually really hard to execute.
![[RU] The International 2024 - Finals](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/putSC1vp3Rs/mqdefault.jpg)
Fountain Hooks Timestamps
25:55 - There's the hook, Hao! Brought all the way back to the base! Cleaned up by the fountain.
32:52 - There it is, yup! Banana going for a ride on the Dendi Express. Welcome, to the well.
36:27 - Dendi is gonna try it again, can he? Got him that time. See you in the base, Mu. Welcome home!
47:54 - Ohhh he got him!! He got him!
49:25 - There we go, the hook! Got him. SanSheng taking the long ride to Shanghai. Welcome home.
56:19 - Navi... He got him! One more! This is what you call "One for the Road".
Tongfu played perfectly by the book. But Na'Vi was like "We reject your reality and replace it with our own." What a way to win...
watching this again months after, still such a pleasure to watch :)
You're not alone Bro!
Yeah, I Still Watch This Game
Really unbelievable comeback...it's like AC Milan vs Liverpool in 2005.Haha..nice one Na'Vi!!!
Watching this live was the best thing ever
Still watching in 2021
This is the Navi I loved, this is the Navi I cheered, this is the Navi I remember.
But today, I am not so sure anymore.
I hope one day Navi comes back to this level of excellence, and then I will love, cheer and re-remember!
Zymh they are throwing every fucking match in ti5 its so fucked up
Omar Joseph Yep, I am very disappointed of Navi in group stage.
I've been a Team Secret fan since Puppey and Kuro left Navi and im not regretting. What a team. #dreamteam
Zymh yea me too, but i kinda want navi to at least get a high ranking in ti5 :/ they should try their best its ti lol
Omar Joseph I would be happy if Navi is in Top 8 this year. They have been struggling for a longtime and realistically that what we can hope for. I would still watch their game since I WERE a fan, but I wont be VERY excited like, if I watch a Secret game for example.
Zymh yea true
2020 still watching this
Legend forever legend
122 dislikes from Loda =/
hahaha definitely
hahahaha you're right
Came here after watching fountain hook documentary
me 2
youre not alone
Same as me
yeah me to
same
Probably the best played game I've ever seen. Navi got completely outdrafted and just played out of their minds. Funn1k was hitting insane shackles all over the place. Kuroky got a ton of great impales, the timing between Dendi and Puppey was iffy, but when it mattered they made fantastic plays.
How about XBOCT? Haha
No diving!
1987retroman Dendi was awful in the game but it doesn't matter how many times you miss when landing a fountain hook at anytime is a guaranteed kill. It's a no risk high reward play and I'm glad it was removed from the game. Tong Fu played better but not banning Pudge after seeing Chen was a bad move.
I couldn't really disagree more, though I am glad it's out of the competitive scene. Navi didn't really have a pick/fighting lineup. The fountain hook is also a very risky play since if Tongfu decides to take a fight after a missed hook its 4v5
+Disen Fountain hooks are high risk high reward. Professional players are too hard to properly hook and when it misses, that it one guy out from the teamfight.
That was a CLASSIC game! Who didn't like that one (regardless fan of who he is), dont have a clue about Dota. Just amazing game series, we can be happy to witness that kind of epic shiat :)
25:52
32:50
36:26
47:50
49:24
56:15
thank u my friend
09:35 Game Starts
Nice
ID ?
Esa denegada de pudge dios....
Im watching this in 2018, trying to remember and compare what navi was and what navi is today. A team that has shaped the history of dota now seems to be a team fading and losing their relevance to the game today. It warms my heart to watch this yet it also makes it bleed...
I have been playing DotA for 7 yrs now still remember the emergence of this game . Na'Vi you have made DotA 2 what is in 2017. Your sportive brilliance and innovation have amazed the world! The true GODS OF DOTA!
OMG. This is the first time I watch a competitive game. So marvelous, so incredible. Bravo Navi
this game will be legendary, amount of skill it takes to pull it off and come back vs such lineup, just insane
This was amazing! I was literally at the edge of my chair and rewatching every move! They shouldn't have removed this combo from the game :(
The combo is an overpowered glitch that ruins the game. With game breaking glitches like fountain hook, dota 2 will never get ahead of lol. Fuck Navi, bunch of useless cheating dweebs.
Derp Herp its not cheating, its tactic. If theyre cheating, they shouldve used some kind of software. And if youre scared of dendi playing pudge,why not just ban pudge.
Derp Herp Lol it's not cheating if it's in the rules...
Derp Herp And still every single one of them is better than you at DOTA 5000 times over now sit down good sir
After I saw how Loda threw a fit about those fountain hooks, I was expecting the hooks actually worked ALL the time. Looks like it was something that's very hard to do.
Ya IKR! I think some 30% of the fountain hooks worked this game, and every time it didn't work, it just felt like Tongfu had so much space on the map to do whatever they wanted. But hey, if those 30% fountain hooks lands on Aegis Gyrocopter, then who cares about all the other failed ones?
STFU with all those ft hook....thats why they are called Natus Vincere !!! we all love NaVi...the game play they show to us not the common 1 used by others...keeping 1 carry farm and be a hero at the late game ? well it's fail though !! Natus Vincere Rules !!
Everybody loves NA'VI even when they lost the final against Alliance. I hope to see again that Chen+Pudge Combo if the team of dota and valve put again that bug in the future :3
JoOs Difellatio Chen Magnus TI4?
JoOs Difellatio It was never a bug. Icefrog said it was working as intended. They removed it because so many people complained about it.
SweetZombiJesus it's true, many don't get it but it is not a bug, you hook someone and you get teleported along with your hook and at the end of the hook is the hooked hero which, obviously, comes along. it makes sense. i actually feel bad they removed it. i'm tired of all the crying and bitching, this shit ain't easy to pull i mean proffesional players in the greatest e-sports event can't do it right sometimes, even they fail, now think about doing this in pub games with regular players. ppl bitch that they won because of it and it sounds like it's so easy any noob could do it, but i respect them even more for giving us such an amazing game/show, out of the ordinary! Na'Vi is awesome!!
Well u say this fountain hooking is a nice thing but navi fans cry about splitpush splitpush is much more skill dependend cause 1 hook to fountain changes a game conpletely even he missed so much hooks thats what u call skill? Its his best hero so its not that hard even in pubs u could do this quite easy
Guys, don't say Na'vi are noobs just because they did that. I know, it's too overpowered, but, why don't you blame other teams for playing heroes that are OP? A lot of heroes are so OP in DotA, you just push a button and then you rampage. And fountain hooking isn't so easy to do. You have to synchronyze so good, you must not hook to early or to late, and it's easy to move arount to counter it. It's just a mechanic, (like most of us said, a bit overpowered) but it was in the game.
and it's easy to just ban the damn heroes and completely make fountain hooking irrelevant.
"You just push a button and you get a rampage"
Please tell me about this magical creature because I don't know a single hero that can do that against a decent team.
like riki for exaple?
Shadowgale Shale Huskar
Riki is countered by detection and huskar is completely useless once you get a bkb
This is why I love Navi.. Amazing comeback and awesome hooks.
que bonitos recuerdos, es increíble pensar que ya han pasado más de 8 años, ver estas partidas me hacen recordar parte de mi adolescencia~ muy buena partida, me hizo recordar la emoción de un buen dota
omfg check that game, its a good game to watch, not that shitty ti4 finnals, pls navi comeback with ur good plays like that!
This game is better than all TI4 Grand Finals game between Newbee n VG.
Fate Audax But Tongfu got their revenge in TI4, they don't care if it was shitty or not, they get the money and they are happy :)
this is the reason i've been watching Na'Vi plays for past 2 months! praise the almighty Na'Vi!
47:53
This is when I KNEW I'm witnessing the GOD of dota whose name is DENDI 🤟🔥❤️💥
Fukin' miss you my man 😭💔
I haven't played Dota for years now. Came back just to watch this gem again.
Me too.
my mind was blown when i realised pudge never had a force staff, it was always a three man effort for the fountain hook
This just shows us the tenacity of Na'Vi to get that 'W' as well as how they (quite literally) think outside the box.
im crying seeing dendi and puppey.
Yep(((
Man I love all these commentators!! Such good entertainment!
"DARE WE SPEAK IT, DARE WE WHISPER IT! DARE WE THINK IT! COULD IT BE?!" - AYESEE 2K13
The look on brunos face when maelk was speaking about hating the fountain hook and the fact he said 'deal with it' leaves no doubt that he is icefrog... What a game
33:33 creep "Thank you Dendi"
34:03 creep "So I give u vision Dendi !!"
6 years underrated
33:33
wtf 7 years reply if youre still alive
Been a while so had to come back and watch this again :)
Na'Vi aren't Noobs just because they used a 'bug' or a 'glitch' how some idiots call it. They are an awesome team with skill to execute it. And we all want our favorite team to win but we also want entertainment. You idiots don't hear the crowd happy when they did a fountain hook?
yeah, i see that, but they still shouldn't win though. I'ts okay to have showmanship in a tournament like this, but they didn't deserve to go to the finals. I feel bad for TongFu for losing against dirty exploits of a glitch in the game
chr1s657
look at the reaction of the crowd they love it
chr1s657 idiot
chr1s657 A glitch of the game? Are you serious? This FEATURE has been in the game since over 5 years. EVERYBODY knew about it. Don't want to play against it? Ban either Chen or Pudge. It's a shame it got removed. I'm not even a fan of navi but saying that the win is unfair is pathetic.
Levin Aadas Fountain hooking is neither a bug nor a glitch. It was a game mechanic that like all others, was "Unintentional" but the developers chose to leave it in. It is not a big and it is not a glitch, it is a "Imbalanced / Overpowered Game Mechanic."
It was something that can only be described as IMBA or OP but is still a mechanic. I agree that patching it was the best choice, but nobody can say that Na'vi shouldn't have been allowed to win.
The old trick of Naga Sleep and Vacuum was also an IMBA / OP mechanic and not a bug, it was patched and is no longer possible. To take away Na'vis win bcuz of the fountain hook? They'd need to go back to EVERY SINGLE INSTANCE that a team abused something that was OP during a tournament and rework it.
The developers accept that when something is truly imbalanced, they will fix it but they will not punish anyone for making use of it.
(Bugs are different. If a team used the earthshaker void bug to win a game by moving the fountain, that would probably be different.)
that 5 man wipe at 50 mins. must have watched that fight 20 times and its still gold
Navi are my favourite team but I really feel sorry for Tongfu after watching this.
I WENT TO SLEEP THINKING OF WHAT WILL HAPPEN AT LOOSERS BRACKET..AND NOW I WILL WATCH A LIFE-CHANGING MOMENT I'VE MISSED! I FEEL SO PROUD AND ASHAMED AT THE SAME TIME....
Wish we could go back to ti3 when navi was awesome with puppy and kuro
hey its 2018! and i still watch this clip!
Dendi is undoubtedly the best DotA player in the history of the game. The fountain hook is one of the most difficult things to do in the game and it is executed very well by Dendi.
well, we wish to know what they think as fans, like us. We really feel them very close to us cause they think and say what we think, sharing their opinion is good! Greatings from Perú!
Crazy game from Dendi.. Good Game From Na'Vi..
Legends say that Loda is still screaming.
Ok, let's get this from the beginning. Each team has a 5 pick/5 ban hero in the start of the game! Chen is Puppey's signature hero, Pudge is Dendi's signature hero, you give an Alch to Xboct who farms like crazy and you already played a game against a Dendi Pudge and got raped. I call it "Not learning from your mistakes tbh", I don't like the playstyle of chinese teams, it's just B O R I N G to watch! Now, to reach the point where fountain hook is a bug, it's not a bug, it excisted since Dota 1and if you have the skills necessary, feel free to use it! It's not a casual game to have fun, it's a fucking international championship with pressure and high stakes, so to execute something so difficult like this in a match that important, you are destined to win. I don't feel sorry for Tongfu, they picked their strategy, Na'Vi picked theirs, best strategy won, end of story. The Pudge hooks stall the game, but when missed, TongFu should be aggressive. They were not aggressive, so they gave time to XBoct to farm/comeback and carry the game. Simple as hell...!!! So chill out and gg wp
Exactly what I'm saying! You don't like Fountain hooking? Just ban one of the heroes!
Yes, and when you leave Pudge in the pool against Na'Vi, you are always going to be punished by Dendi, he is extremely insane on the hero!
Νίκος Βαγ. But you can't complain about NA'VI fountain hooking since it requires the two heroes. You see a Pudge picked by them? Ban Chen. You see a Chen? Ban Pudge. Frankly I think teams should just ban Pudge all the time against Dendi because otherwise they just insta lose lol.
Νίκος Βαγ.
With Split pushing it's only one hero, and it's a bitch strategy. It's a "I'm too scared to fight so haha I'm winning the game without fighting while you're actually trying to win the game with fighting" strategy.
Lol you say the play style of chinese teams is boring? did you even see TI4. some of the most incredible DotA
good old days (2020)
2019 still actual
Great camera work just as always
fountain hook is probably the most difficult combo in Dota 2
2021 and still watching here❤❤❤
Me too mate
NAVI vs TongFU
NAVI vs Orange
the biggest comebacks in Dota history
IKR
No, best comeback would have to be eg vs ehome in ti6
I completely understand your mentality about winning using any possible method. As I said - the same people who support the fountain hook will support infinites.
And there will always be people who focus all their energy on winning, and who don't have the time to distract themselves with improving the game or changing the game.
And then there are people who question, wonder, and who later design the games that become the future of competitive gaming. Ideas built to improve on existing games.
remember the day when u hated Navi, and now u really want them back.. :)
I never really hated them.They are born to win, this strat prooved it.They were able to win the game by any means, also the only ones who ran pudge a lot.Todays pudge is almost extinct, all is lategame and I hate that.
I dont hate navi. I just wanna say good bye oldman. Good bye
OMG..best early fighting game ever I have ever watch ! keep it up both teams
best team in dota history
Na'Vi best team ever highest level of showmaking by pure skill perfect execution of unorthodox tactics and playstye composed by real knoledge of the game plus no fear to play.
This team owns numerous legendary series and matches in dota history mostly with Wins. Its funny every player had such unique personality, style and a lot of chemistry, i refeer a lot to TI2 lineup with LightOfHeaven for me one of the best to ever play the game. But i respect and value this line-up with funnik and kuro they made a incredible job keeping up the abdormal high level required to not affect the consistency the team had already achieved.
There team have 3 Captain in 2019
Secret Puppey
Liquid Kuroky
Navi XBoct
Still legendary play
At least Fountain Hooking is exciting. Rat DoTA is the most bullshit, annoying, and boring thing to do ever.
Whats exiting about fh
Every objective watcher said after the game 5 allvs navi what a game most called it most entertaibing ever
prime 7
Yeah, it was entertaining until Alliance decided to rat it out like a bunch of dicks.
mainstream dota is the dumbest thing to do on a game like this :D its like:"ok we lose but we play dota with honor." no pro player ever said that sentence :)
TheThreeFantastic
It shouldn't ever be about who wins, it should be about HOW they win.
Kuroda Kazuki no. u cant say that by a game like dota. ti3 final game navi vs alliance. some ppl call the splitpush combo clever and some ppl say its rat dota ( cause they didnt rly fight 5 on 5) so ur comment is wrong.
Tongfu really played so passively here. They had their momentum but chose not to pursue.
yea ti4 was boring as shit
Doing a Pudge Hook with Chen is very risky, I Remember spectating this game and commenting how it can backfire and they have to be careful and I remember everyone thinking this might go the wrong way ... then a few key hooks came in and well Damn
Chen + pudge is such a gay tactic in my opinion and should be banned.
how is this 2 weeks ago, this combo was "banned" like 4 patches ago, It no longer works.
Numb287 wtf are you talking about?
TheDanishBully
NO MORE fountain hook.. u noe understang inglishes?
ArchernarhZ why dont you stfu? and explain to me wtf numb287 is saying.. because clearly it doesnt makes any sense
TheDanishBully it does make sense, the combo no longer works. If Pudge hooks someone then goes to a new location (blink, force staff, relocate, Chen sendback) The hooked target will be hooked to the location where pudge was when he threw the hook. Please read patch notes.
The odds were lower than when Luke Skywalker hit that missile to the Death Star. The force is strong with these ones!
Fountain hooking and stacking both started out as bugs, but are kept in the game. The pros say it was and so did the creator, it was one of the things that started off as a bug, but ended up being a key mechanic apart of the game.
(A fortunate accident one could say)
lucky audience witness one of the best legendary plays in history of dota 2
This is the difference between DotA and LoL...These plays & these games make it absolutely fantastic...There are plays where the money & xp difference doesn't matter...
I watched this live.
Probably the most creative (cheating/buff or whatever its IN THE RULE), absolute magestick.. What a game... What a team NAVI ❤️
What a brilliant strategy from Na'Vi :)
2 Thumbs ups for you guys !!!
i miss this caster panel! :( bring them back! xD
Aaawww, your team lost while Na'Vi went through. It's a good day to be a Na'Vi supporter.
NAVI win or lose internationals have already won the crowds hearts even more if not already.
Yeah a lot of people try this in the pubs that I play and fail horribly. One team did this even when they were ahead and ended up throwing their game away because they failed this a few times. The more it is done the less shock factor it has and people know how to play against it and counter it.
Its 2020 but im still watching this
The Legends
Like many said, fountain hook is definitely not a bug. However, it was very unbalanced before icefrog fixed it for two reasons: 1. the track of the hook shown on the screen is totally a mystery for anyone. So that makes fountain hooks much easier to hit than normal hooks. 2. It is low risk high reward indeed. Some said Tongfu should just be aggressive, but how? Just rush to the highland once Pudge is sent back? No way! You should also notice Navi could use fountain hook in their highland, which could lower the risk even more. Some said you can just ban one of Pudge and Chen, which is true. But any hero that goes too imba will make all the game messed up. That is why Icefrog fixed it at last tho it is fun.
+Bob Jiu i agree with you man, but it's still fun to relieve the moment of hooking someone to the fountain. They should make a mod of making fountain hooks possible again especially now that source 2 has some features to play other maps. just for old times sake Lol.
Oh and the skewer to the fountain would be fun too.
If you watch closely on the key fountain hook that catches the gyro with aegis Doombringer Doom's Chen no more than half a second after Chen sends Dendi home. The window to execute that was so tiny and it completely decided the game.
Kinda surprised how many times dendi got the timing wrong on the hook. He didn't get it out on time, and this happened several times. Practise boysss
Pracitce ur english
Legit and totally not a troll comment right there
Lame
elia brian parctise ur ingrish
Hi 2018 still watching this.
Fountain hook takes unbelievable skill and is STILL a huge risk even for the best players in the world. Look at all the times Pudge missed, look at all the gold he spent for tps and the farm lost to walk all the way back and the risk to his towers as they were a man down. Pudge has a 43% win rate in competition it was stated... Dindi is JUST THAT GOOD that he wins 75% of the time. This is a game of teamwork and skill, and fount hooks are a testiment to this teams skill level.
Dec 2020
Still, the best TI match EVER
Also, as in the Gladiators of the past, making a grand show is all part of the experience. Did you not hear the crowd go nuts when Dendi gets Pudge? And did you not hear them go nuts with each fountain pull? EPIC!!!
The epicness of this match is too damn high.
That's a cool setup they got! The player names with the hero portrait on the outside of their thingy :p
Why ban the fountain hook
For anyone that thinks that this is a glitch, we use to test of faith with enchant's spear... So yes, as ridiculous as it sounds, this is a combo that TongFu did not ban thus allowing it to happen.
if you guys actually notice, it was like 20% chance to do it right. And there are so many draw back: waste 135 tp gold or time to walk back, chance to get 4 allies killed, waste chen's Teleport to save someone, etc. Also it's not like no way to counter: let units standing in front, fast reaction (blink, force staff or even phase boots) or simple ban 1 of those 2. All I see is this is an hard and risky combo, everyone knew this from TI2
Sickest comeback EVER, I can understand you're butt hurt that a team you supported loses . But even the haters can't deny that the plays made by dendi pudge and puppey Shen had such miraculous communication. It was awesome to watch and even if it's a bug, the timing required to pull those fountain hooks off is incredible hard and to pull them off consistently and on such high prio targets. Props to them for that, so even if you dislike the outcome at least respect the skill required for it.
i still watch in 2018
This combo is not a bug. The unit hooked will come to Pudge's position, that's why we build Force Staff for Pudge and make this incredible match
As I said before, they haven't patched Fountain hooking but merely Chen + Pudge combo. Using a pudge hook to get someone into the fountain is still possible by using Wisp / Kotl who can TP him out of the fountain, instead of Chens TPing him into the fountain.
how does it contradict itself? one ability brings an enemy to your position, other moves your position to the fountain - it's a pretty sweet interaction that works, makes sense and most importantly is NOT ANTICOMPETITIVE (it has counterplay, it's not broken, it takes skill to pull off, etc)
what?
the spell description says it'll put you in the place you were 5 seconds ago, if you buyback and timelapse you'll go to the place you were 5 seconds ago - back in the fight
I miss this moment when I was in school watching with friends.. 🥺🥺🥺
I think he is the best pudge player on the competitive scene. He has a 78% win rate on that guy and is the only person that would play it on a semifinal of ti3!
No, Dota is a game about using whatever means exist at your disposal to win the game. This can be done for instance through getting levels, items and pushing, but it can also be done through tricks like this. And this trick can be countered, through positioning mainly, and it's pretty hard to pull off so it's not game breaking anyway. In any case you can just ban out Pudge or Chen and then it can't be done at all.
Na'vi has been around for a long time, they play an exciting game of Dota and get ton's of media coverage....
That's why people cheer for them.
yes. it's always been in the game and every pro player knows it
Without the fountain hook navi would lost it but they know what to do.
They defed it and xboct farmed and farmed in this time and so they won.
That is not lame that is tactik if u have no options.
Puppey best captain !!!
People don't realize that it's basically a high risk ability for a high outcome. If he misses, he's not longer part of the team fight. If he hits someone, it's still a 4v4.
this reminds me that years ago when i watched a game of Manchester United vs Liverpool, and the 3 commentators were one side-ly supporting ManU, and everything they said were for United. as an audience i was feeling very annoyed. i truly believe commentators should be as neutral as possible and give impartial opinions cuz there are audiences for both sides.
its not really abusing its just really good synergy between both of the heroes like the naga+dark seer combo back in the last international. Its nothing that needs to be nerfed cause its actually really hard to execute.