How-to: Installing a Gotek in a Tandy 1000HX
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- Опубліковано 22 сер 2024
- #septandy #howto
Time for some Tandy love! Let's install a Gotek floppy drive emulator loaded with FlashFloppy open source firmware into a Tandy 1000HX. It's not as simple as it would seem as Tandy went with some non standard things inside of the Tandy 1000HX.
** Please excuse the typos in some of the text in this video. **
Other channels for Sep-Tandy:
Mr Lurch's Things: / @mrlurchsthings
DaveJustDave: / @davejustdave
AkBKukU: / @techtangents
Previous Tandy 1000 EX videos:
Fix and Tour:
• Radio Shack Tandy 1000...
Gotek for the Tandy 1000EX:
• Tandy 1000 EX 3.5" flo...
RAM and CPU upgrade:
• Tandy 1000 EX RAM and ...
More links:
Gotek Floppy Emulator on Ebay: (Should be around $19)
www.ebay.com/i...
Gotek FlashFloppy Firmware:
github.com/kei...
HXC firmware link: (Paid firwmare for Gotek)
hxc2001.free.fr...
Tandy 1000HX System Disks and Technical manual: (including SETUPHX)
www.oldskool.or...
Septandy, I like it. Let's make a whole calendar:
Januatari
Februacorn
Marchintosh
Appleril
MaySX
Junintendo
Julynx
Augusinclair
Septandy
Octommodore
Novamstrad
Decemegadrive
You have not gotten enough props for this comment! This just made my day 💾💽
in the early 80's my boss bought a Tandy HDD .It was huge! He was so proud of it. I think he paid 1000 for it. It had one meg of storage xD
Our family's first computer was a 1000HX. It came with Personal DeskMate 2. In 1987, it was really badass! We used that computer clear up to 1996 when we finally gave in and got a Win95 box.
By dad bought our HX back when I was a little kid, and I inherited it. I've still got mine, and it's my favourite "retro" computer that still gets a lot of usage.
@@BlackEpyon My folks still have it up above their garage. If I had room for it, I'd bring it home and play on it. Some day...
I used to sell these computers,from memory yes deskmate came with it.This brings back memories,thanks for the video.
I used to own one of these exact model computers and can confirm it did in fact come with both dos 2.11 and deskmate on the rom.
Check out the hardware mods on the flash floppy page. Changing the 7 segment display for a tiny oled (you can browse file and folders by name!), adding buttons or a rotary encoder, and adding a tiny speaker for fake floppy noises are all easy.
Awesome Adrian, thanks again for another enjoyable video. Love this channel.
Hello, Adrian ,
This is an another super upgrade to an old machine which make it to stand on its'' sources (with the additional sources which
you added) and be useful.
Yoıu are a very well Computer technician, i am continuing to follow your videos for sometime and this "Tandy serie" is remarkable as
many others which you made.
Thanks for the efforts and keep up the good work. :)
I feel so old as I'm viewing your videos LOL. I think I'm gonna dig in the basement for my first PC (Schneider EuroXT with monochrome orange Hercules monitor). Thanks!!!
'monochrome orange Hercules monitor' - an amdek 310a, perhaps ? loved mine, back in the day. the textured screen was so much more glare-resistant than the ibm green monochrome [5151 ?].
Part of Personal DeskMate is actually located in the 1000HX ROM.
Your original Tandy 1000EX videos are the reason I subscribed, glad to see another machine from the series getting an upgrade! Can you make this one accept those oversized 2.5 MB floppy images as well?
Me too, luckily I love C= stuff too. :-D
As far as I know, the floppy controller on the EX and HX could only accept 360K and 720K floppy drives. If there's a way for the GoTek to get around that, I'd love to know. Personally, I prefer using the floppy drive. I've got a CF adapter board for "hard drive" storage, but I don't like to make things too convenient - it ruins the nostalgia factor for me.
Check out Adrian's video titled "2.5MB virtual disk on a Tandy 1000 EX? (Or any PC or XT)" - he gives pretty specific instructions on how to essentially mount an oversized floppy image using the Gotek.
@@borismatesin I seem to have forgotten about that video. Thanks for reminding me.
@@BlackEpyon You can use a 1.44MB floppy drive (as long as it's Shugart compatible), you just won't be able to use 1.44MB disks. The Gotek's get around this limitation by configuring the max number of tracks to 255 from 80 and keeping everything else the same. This gives you a 2.5MB DD disk. :D
Gotek's are the greatest! A must for every retro build!
Thanks Adrian, I was able to make a custom floppy cable from a normal cable to use in my 1000TX which has the same power over cable config, now I'm using two non-tandy drives in my system happily!
13:12: “so let’s figure out how power is getting from the motherboard to the disk drives”
My inner Jesse: “WIRE!!!”
I always connect a female connector to the male header when soldering. Keeps the pins aligned and adds some thermal sink to minimize making the plastic shroud thingy from softening. Enjoying @septandy month and think its really cool that you guys teamed up to do themed projects!
Deskmate! my first GUI. I remember being jealous that my families' Tandy 1000 TX wasn't capable of running Windows. I'll never forget it though. We had Personal Deskmate 2 and Deskmate 3.0.5 disks.
All I cared about was the music program. I've still got the HX my dad bought when I was a kid (I inherited it when he upgraded). I think it's still possible to get Windows 1.0 working on the early 1000 models with a little tweaking, but I haven't tried it myself.
My Late Grandma used to have an HX. I remember playing the DOS Version of A Nightmare on Elm Street on it
I think I would have modified the floppy emulator so that the power pins of the ribbon cable connected to the regular power connector through diodes. So that it could be powered directly by the same cable.
Love seeing classic computers get a new lease on life, whatever form it takes. Great video! :D
Adrian, you are doing great videos. I really enjoying watching them. Keep up!
Really enjoyed this video and kudos to you for the SEPTandy idea. Tandy's were extemely common and make a great way to start a retro computing life. I'd love to see some coverage on a GRId system with bubble memory, made by Tandy.
Hi Adrian! Why did you cut off the pins ont the GOTEK? Wouldn't it be easier to desolder/cut this 12V & 5V pins from the GOTEK PCB-side and solder some cables onto that pins directly to the 5V supply on the GOTEK? Then you would not have needed an extra cable! Best regards, Doc64!
Says very little free space. Screen shows 0 bytes free
lol love your videos nonetheless
The ROM only has 64k for DOS, I think, located at E000h. Just enough to run stuff without a DOS boot disk, which was a HUGE thing for a machine with no stock hard drive option. P.COM is the HX menu program.
Cutting the pins is so much easier than cutting the cable! I had to reverse several pins on a floppy cable, took hours with an exacto knife.
Just make a new cable.
Smokey Beige is also my go to retro paint. :) I've done it for my gotek mount for my Atari ST. Side note, Love SepTandy since combining Tandy and four of my favorite retro youtubers makes for a great month!
Its great to see people breathing new life into these machines.
In the 80's I lusted over the CP400 which was a local clone of the CoCo 2 but I was a poor kid.
Blu-tac is for intermediate solderers, I usually just hold parts with my fingers, smell them burning, then run around the building while screaming 😅
That's the only real way to know if the iron is hot enough.
But the question is, are you a beginner or expert? Lol😅😂
Or as I call it, Tantember.
Adrian: I can just use one of these little jumper links to connect the power!
Other Adrian: That’s perfect! I like this idea!
XD
I would have cut the connection between the Gotek PCB and the connector, and use the remains from the connector to connect the +5v power using a jumper wire (removable), so the Gotek can be used without modifying the Tandy at all. 18:30 exactly why I would have removed the pins on the back for all 12v and 5v that are not standard :) [update: that wouldn't have changed the 12v going to the other pins due to the reversal of the connectior... sigh]
The Tandy 1000 line (and other Tandy PC compatible models of that era), like Macintoshes of the 1980s and 90s (up to 2002), have some of the source code of their software in ROM. The Tandy machines had half of DeskMate burned into ROM; Macintoshes had Toolbox, which contained QuickDraw, for displaying the menus, buttons and windows layout on screen. True Fact. And DeskMate was developed by Microsoft. I used to work for Radio Shack for 3.5+ years from 2001-2004. My Senior Manager, who worked for them since 1972/73, told me his recollection and history of Tandy computers and acknowledged these facts.
I miss Radio Shack :(
@@BlackEpyon Not me. I used to work for them from early 2001 to late 2004. The writing was already on the wall of their shortcomings by the time I left. Micromanaging to the nth degree and penalizing your employees for crappy quotas/sales will no doubt kill your company faster than a nuke.
@@minty_Joe I mean as a consumer. Corporations are corporations. The larger they are, the more corrupt and inefficient they tend to become.
Particularly what I miss was being able to go to a brick and mortar store and pick up electronics parts without having to pay for shipping or wait for the stuff to arrive. I order online now, mostly from Digi-Key, and their shipping is pretty good, so it could be worse. And there's something about feeling the part in your hand and knowing that it will work without having to do half a dozen measurements while comparing a dozen datasheets to be sure you've got the correct part.
@@BlackEpyon Very true. In that case, yes, that was what Radio Shack was best for. Those days are long gone.
Deskmate came with my Tandy 1000 SL. It was very handy for doing my Term Paper in High School.
Another bout of insomnia and a new release from Mr Black. Love the shirt!
Nothing brings back memories more than Moonlight Sonata playing over the Tandy 3-voice sound chip.
I miss my HX.
That music program was my favourite when I was around 4 or 5. I've still got mine.
I can't tell you how much I hate power over the floppy cable. I had never seen that before and tried to put a FD-505 in a Tandy 1000 TX. Unlike the HX though they still had the 4 pin power connectors so I had no idea it was going to be power over floppy. It fried both the FD-505 and the 1000 TX.
This turned out great in the end though! It makes me want to finally get and explore using a Gotek. I wonder if it can do single density with the right firmware...
You've got me wanting to start Trash 80 Thursdays now!
I'm in love with the new intro!
Was just explaining "Radio Shack" to my kids today. Great video!
Yes, there were versions of Deskmate like v1 for the SX, the Model 4, a Xenix version for the Model 16/6000, they had Deskmate 2 for the HX/EX era and then they had Deskmate 3 which took advantage of the enhanced DAC in the L series 1000 machines. This was a nice selling point. I used v2 on my HX a lot and then later MS Works 2.0 for DOS which has Microsoft's TUI. I tried using MS Word for DOS but Works seemed nicer.
I hope you’ve got some more videos in the works. Love your content, and general enthusiasm!
to solder the headers on gotek drives i plug the non solderd pins into a 20x2 pin socket and put it on fhe pins alredy solderd to keep them in place, it makes it very easily solder the pins.
Can confirm that my Tandy 1000 HX included deskmate software on an eeprom chip along with dos 2.11. I also had external 5.25" and 3.5" floppy drives for it though only one could be used at a time.
Love these videos.. always learn something new!
I'd have preferred not to jump power from the FDD, I'd have cut the power pins on the Go-Tec from the circuit-board, and jumped from there to power/ground.
Amstrads have a similar problem in that the Hitachi 3" disk drives use the same power connector as a Sony 3.5" drive, but the 5V and 12V pins are reversed. When I hacked a 3.5" drive into a tatty old PCW9512, I popped the connectors out of the shell and swapped them around, then coloured the plug black using a marker pen to remind me that I'd modified it. The later PcW models with slimline 3.5 drives have the power supplied down the non-standard 26-way ribbon cable, which creates a whole other problem.
Yup. Deskmate was bundled with the systems. One of the big selling points
Very nice project. Good, you didn't kill your machine.
@@adriansdigitalbasement So that was close to a financial disaster. To be honest, I don't like the Gotek-drives. They never fit to the old machines' designs and many people tend to destroy their computer cases to get one into them. I prefer an SD/HDD solution, if possible. Of course, the Goteks are still proper alternative drives. ;)
I wish these were common here in europe. Such a beautifull computer
That "Bluetak" is an unconventional approach -- neat idea, though! -- but, I always wondered why you didn't just use a PCB clamp and some perfboard when soldering; it's really easy to line stuff up that way.
Deskmate was included with my Tl/2 as well. Loved it.
Came up in 2020 for #SepTandy, UA-cam knows what to show me 😁
That version of DeskMate is at minimum 2.x. DeskMate 1.0 was a much more crude-looking text-only interface, with columns for the different file types (text, spreadsheet, database, calendar, etc). Wasn't until 2.x that they went to the GUI-like interface.
As I recall, the 3.x version had a "virtual" display space that was much larger than the monitors of the time, and it would map the space down to the resolution of your monitor. Of course, was almost 30 years ago that I had read about that (I once had the DeskMate Developers Kit).
I've got a couple versions of DeskMate 3.x for my 1000 RSX, but I've never gotten them working properly (probably bad disks, I haven't tried for a while). I could just download the disk images from an abandonware site, but to be honest, I never cared for DeskMate other than for the music program (which I spent hours on as a kid).
Deskmate was included when you bought the 1000HX. I had it with my old 1000HX which was my first computer back in 1988
You know Adrian's made a mistake when you hear the serious voice giving you a warning! We've all done that sort of thing before, and they say you should learn from someone else's mistakes, but it's definitely no fun being that someone else. And those Goteks aren't that cheap either, so I'm sorry to see it happen to you.
Great video. I'll bet you could shim up that Gotek to fill the space underneath without having to 3D print a new front. I'd use a thin piece of wood (a paint stirrer stick is probably close to the right thickness), paint it with your Smokey Beige, then pop it underneath. There'll still be a little bit of a seam showing but it would be less noticeable than that gap.
I wish... I knew how to do this stuff. I've been really wanting to replace the broken floppy drive in my Brother WP 1600Q word processor but at the moment I am too ignorant and incapable! Thank you for making this video, I will continue my information scavenger hunt.
yes.. deskmate came with it... OMG ... i was 10 got one for xmas 1985 !!!... was so pissed it had no HDD while my best friend had gotten a clone that year !!!!!! I am in Nova scotia.. got the 640k ram card controler in bangor maine when i was on vacation to Florida... the Guy at radioshack was surprised i knew what i needed at 1
We have a gotek installed in our 1000 Tl/3. They are super Convenient!
Nice video and nice EEV Blog multimiter
@@adriansdigitalbasement I keep thinking of getting one, but I've got other stuff to spend my disposable income on :P
The MasterCraft multimeter I have works fine for most things, though the 200 Ohm range is a little sticky. I've no doubt that the EEVBlog meter is high quality though with how critical Dave is on quality.
The first computer I gave to my daughter was a Tandy 1000 LX. That gave her a gigantic Head Start in school.
Another fascinating video. Never touched a Tandy box, even less a Gotek (didn't know this even existed). I have learned a lot of new things watching. These Goteks are clever design, really. I always like your clear diction and cool comments, whatever happens. Did you cut out the swearing that burst out when you found out that you had fried the Gotek board?
Great video Adrian... I recently picked up a Tandy 1000sx and am working on a restore video for it for my channel. I think I will add a Gotek based on your video.
I had this one. Yes Deskmate came with it. And it was very nice.
+1 for Thexder, one of my favorite. Was that the Tandy version? That didn't sound exactly like Tandy sound...
@@adriansdigitalbasement Oh ok, maybe it just doesn't translate well over youtube... or... maybe my childhood memory remembers things much grander than they really were :)
Good tutorial, thanks. "Had to register": that's ST Microelectronics for you. And most of the microcontroller manufacturers are getting that way, too.
Great video as always 👍🏻❤️
Now all you need is the Apple II card for it!!!
Our family Tandy 1000 hx came with deskmate 2.
I still have the Tandy 1000HX from my childhood :)
And I still use it for retro computing.
Very well done video. Thanks!
Nice little mod. Goteks are so useful! :)
@Adrian Black
@7:38 Yup, that is one of the big reasons. The other is personal security.
@@adriansdigitalbasement Exactly, they did this to themselves.
Thank you for this video. It's very hard to get information about these gotek drives (IMO). I bought one for my Amiga 500 a few years ago. Even though it was already setup I found it difficult to get the drive to write successfully without corrupting the floppy images stored on the USB stick. Also had to use special software to load the USB stick with images. I tend to just use floppies as I have a large collection of Double Density disks.
@Mr T. Guru What type of Amiga do you have?
Really cool ... recently got myself 2 Tandy's as well (tandy 1000 SL and Tandy 1000 TL) that have been sitting on my shelf just waiting to be looked at ... might also join in with this #septandy thing :)
@@adriansdigitalbasement Will reshuffle some priorities then :) Sometimes it seems that the machines I still need to cover keeps on growing ... should probably stop taking in new stuff.
@@adriansdigitalbasement Video is here ua-cam.com/video/m0_pNYdi-GI/v-deo.html ... have footage for 2 more but that will be for #octandy :)
DeskMate was included with 1000 series machines. What you have there is Graphic DeskMate 1, the original v.1 was ASCII graphics, and was just painfull to look at.
Adrian, I'd suggest looking into setting up a Pi-hole device. Just got mine up last night.
If you have Personal Deskmate 2 and the music program, it would be really great if you could make some high quality video of the music program playing back the included sample files. The 1000 TX has a different, distinct sound to the later machines that have the more sophisticated audio hardware.
Dont have a Tandy computer BUT still have a quadrovox amp CD and equaliser !
I hated dealing with Tandy's when I was a teenager trying to extra cash. The proprietary cables, interfaces, and bios made it super difficult to work on. At the time I had no way to acquire a service manual. If I remember correctly they were much more expensive than just building a clone. Now that I am old(er) I am really curious and would like to find one.
The EX and HX machines were actually pretty cheap as a base system, as far as I know, but the issue was the proprietary expansion system. The rest of the 1000 line used normal ISA slots, which made upgrading significantly easier, and they were far cheaper than anything IBM had out. These days, you can get the full 640K RAM going with just a single 512K chip, a socket, and some jumper wires if you're desperate, using the A19 line as the chip enable signal (I've tested this, so I know it works).
I think I'd have gone down the route of making a custom adapter cable, rather than making changes to the hardware. Since you were spray painting the case of the Gotek anyway, couldn't you just cut a piece of plastic to the correct size of the hole in the case, paint it, and fix it over the Gotek? Does the cage allow leeway for moving the Gotek back a bit into the case? There are surely simpler solutions to 3d printing an entire new case for the Gotek! I like the look of the keyboard on that machine. Is it good to type on?
This was a good time for Gotek, now they usually come with an AT32F415 in a QFN32 package. They are less expandable and so far I have not found how to connect a rotary encoder to those new models. Even after flashing them with the latest FlashFloppy, they remain baby carriage, even on an Amiga. On my Amiga 4000, I regularly get a lot of read errors, which was not the case with the earlier models.
Kudos to you guys that keep this old gear computing, but id never attempt anything you guys do w/o a solid Linux machine to do this sort of stuff like flashing firmware. If that Gotek has an ARM CPU, its faster than the CPU...
A HX or EX is still at the top of my dream list,but they’re practically N/A here in Australia.
I had to import my EX from the USA - they are around but no-one wants to sell them.
Adrian Black they are a great machine and were popular here in Aus. The prices have gone up in the last year now that ppl know you can upgrade them.
It was our first home pc in 87. I think most have been thrown out here tho 😢
If you need it, me and another guy on the Vintage Computer Forums were playing around with ideas for a RAM expansion for the EX/HX. You can get a quick and dirty expansion going with a single 512K RAM chip (like the AS6C4008), a socket, and some female jumper wires, using the A19 line as the chip-enable signal. I know Derek was already following that thread.
I'm that other guy on the Vintage computer forum that @BlackEpyon mentioned. This weekend I decided to suck up my stage fright and made a video about my prototype expansion cards for the Tandy 1000 EX. (This "SepTandy" event was the push I needed.) I've built cards that turn a bare 256k EX into a full 640k+upper memory blocks XT clone,with CF storage, clock-calendar, and serial ports. All without using any ISA slot adapters.
My video includes an overly-lengthy spiel about why in my opinion you don't really *need* the DMA controller, and why, in an unexpected way, you might actually be better off without it. But, sure, if it was easy to add one I probably would have. (But it's not, alas; Tandy used a custom ASIC that combines quite a few parts on the original card.) A big thing on my to-do list is trying to determine if my RAM card is actually compatible with the HX as well as the EX.
ua-cam.com/video/ppOHVnv8tmo/v-deo.html
LOL, ironically I just picked up a 1000HX at VCF MW on Saturday.
I use Ublock Origins and it's great!
Great video and the Gotek works well on my own Tandy 1000 HX. I ended up creating a 3D printed mount that looks like a floppy drive. I posted it on Thingiverse if anyone wants it (search Tandy 1000HD Gotek). I still haven't found matching spray paint color to match the Tandy case though.
I like the Shirt TRS80.
Looking forward to more videos 😁
You know someone is not from EU when they point at cookie info and say it's an add. XD
We are planning on doing this to our Tandy 1000 HX. Unfortunately, ours was damaged in shipping so it does not look as nice as it could but it appears to work fine.
The first programming method seems way more convoluted than the second, where you can just bridge the programming pins plug in an A-A cable and run dfu-util.
Can’t wait for the CoCo vids
very handy!!
I had this exact machine! But we upgraded it to 640k...damn I wish I still had it but my parents gave it to someone when we got our new Packard Bell 60mhz Pentium. Geesh, if I had only known!
Most of us in the vintage computer community have similar stories. "Too old to use, but not old enough to be valuable," is the way it usually goes, and I've gotten rid of quite a few such systems that I'm now kicking myself for ever getting rid of.
My first computer was a Tandy 1000RSX. I wish I had it back.
I happen to have one as part of my collection. Pretty skookum machine once you upgrade it. Just powerful enough to run SimCity 2000, but the AcuMOS video drivers cause Windows 3.1 to take a long time to load for some reason.
I'd like to see someone mount a Nano ITX board in a Tandy 1000HX expansion bay, while keeping the Tandy fully functional. Since the keyboard is a switch matrix with a ribbon cable to the mainboard it should be possible to install a matrix to USB encoder and some way to bypass it so the built in keyboard works with both computers.
I would think that "appliance epoxy" would be a more applicable paint for this job. It's tough and self leveling. Maybe almond or biscuit color?
It's worked on plastic for me. I've used it on some old plastic doorbell casing to make them look new. It seemed to adhere nicely and stayed flexible.
I was using SideKick for the PC AT in 1985.
So Tandy was at least a year too late to the show.
They made shitty everything. That's why the went out of business.
Being surprised by a ton of ads and not using some form of blocker is just...can't think of any other way to say it...very 1997. Do you still use dial up too?
Hi Adrian, Cortex is NOT HxC. Cortex was the first firmware ever out for the Gotek /Amiga floppy Emulation. HxC is a different product and was there before FlashFloppy but after Cortex. HxC is still very much up to date and even better than FlashFloppy on some features, like the display of the foppy images names on screen (OSD)!
It's based on a completely different chip a PIC 18F and started out as a hobby project.
Why cut pins, not the tracks on the Gotek board, and interconnect 5V from the shugart pins to the power connector?
@@adriansdigitalbasement Tip, use some diodes.
You know, instead of cutting the 5V and 12V pins completly off at the front, you could have cut the pins from behind ( on the 45 deg elbow) and jumped the live side of the pins to the power header.
i.imgur.com/QE7IHS9.png
@@adriansdigitalbasement hmm, my thinking was - cut the same pins on the gotek as you did, except from the back. Then make a power connector from one of 5v and ground pins. If you connect that setup to a standard motherboard: you either have the goatek powered from NC (so it just doesn't get power), or you remeber to unplug the mod conector from itself and plug in the regular power cable.