This is the most detailed, spot on review and description of this bike. When I rode it, it felt EXACTLY as you described. That's rare. Thank you for a great job reviewing this.
I randomly come across your bike reviews a few times a year and you consistently have the most comprehensive and organized presentation in the bike-media space. Well done as always (now I want that bike!).
I own it and it’s great but the fox dropper post loses air after a short time and is a known problem at pivot HQ. Even after warranty coverage fix still happens. The seat post needs to come all the way up !! Sending it out sucks and my crank bros dropper post on my last bike never had any problems over years.
Amazing review and amazing bike! Pivot is a company that’s not jumping on that bandwagon of lower BB, slacker HTA, and steeper STA like everyone else. Plus you do not have to size up to get the longer reach. Plus they welcome the different wheel sizes, even a mullet configuration. I’m really impressed that Pivot is really thinking of the rider that would love to buy a dream bike and switch out wheel sets to have 2 or 3 types of bikes in one.
That’s incorrect, Pivot run tight , there’s no xxl like Santa Cruz offer. A slacker HTA gives you a safer ride downhill over chunk - a steeper STA gives you better seated sit & spin. Pivot’s sale point is the DW link staying high in its travel over rock and on the climb.
My review of this review channel reviewing the Pivot Trail 42069: (4.75/5) I found this review very helpful as Flow didn’t mind getting into the weeds on every aspect of the bike. As a prospective buyer, I didn’t love the use of cliches like efficient and effective when describing the suspension performance. Almost every suspension brand’s marketing team stuffs those words into their product description like a crackhead loves crack. Thank you for taking the time to put together this thoughtful video. I will be subscribing for future content.
Great review, with a lot of useful insights! I'm still loving my previous gen Trail 429, and can't imagine how anything could be better for the riding I do. It pedals so much more efficiently than my 2018 Trance. Very tempted after this review!
Cheers Sam, glad you dug the review! I've had the opportunity to test all three generations of the Trail 429, and each one has been really impressive. Your current Trail 429 is a ripper, and such a capable bike for its given travel - I fondly recall riding that bike for my first time in Moab for the launch, where we rode Mag 7 and Portal, and the Trail 429 was remarkably capable on such technical trails. It certainly saved my bacon on a number of occasions! [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam the first ride review you guys did of the previous gen Trail 429 at Old Man's Valley in Hornsby certainly helped sway me to buy it when I was looking for a replacement, and I've been very happy with it 🙂
Hello Will and greetings from Ohio, USA. That simply was another fantastic review from you Sir. Maybe its just me, but I think that Pivot looks downright proper, especially in that color. Wow !
Thanks Bill! Glad you enjoyed the video, and really appreciate the feedback! I totally agree with you, the Trail 429 is a sharp looking bike, and I am contemplating the value of my second kidney as we speak 😂 [Wil]
And it comes with batteries 🤣 that did make me laugh. Imagine laying out 18k and being asked ‘would you like some batteries as well’? Great review as always, quality rather than quantity is a pleasure to experience on the Tube
It really feels like when media focuses on the narrative that increased reach equates to effectively sizing up a frame, it really clouds the reality for consumers. Steeper seat tubes close in on those gains a great deal and with some of these reach gains, the effective top tube lengths, which is a better metric for cockpit length, aren't always changing that much at all.
Great review. I know about the concept of import duties/taxes but $3000 US extra? That's obscene. I go through my share of bikes and have even had a couple Pivots but I would NEVER pay that amount of money for a bicycle. I build my bikes from the frame up and as I'm always moving parts around, it saves a fair amount of money. Yet another reason why the 157 Super Boost is a non-starter for me.
What a comprehensive and clear review. I test rode one yesterday in the enduro build and found this review to be pretty spot on. It's definitely the most composed and capable short travel trail bike I've ever ridden. I found it to be super poppy but very stable and predictable at the same time, I could clear jumps comfortably with a fair bit less speed than what I'd need on my enduro bike. One thing I did notice is that I found it quite harsh and a bit jarring on some nasty rock and root sections, That could be down to the wrong shock tuning and tire pressure though.
How would you go about deciding between the standard vs. enduro build - especially if you ride mainly xc trails (Mt. Tam) and are a strong climber who rides with SPD's vs. a flat pedal goggle riding downhiller who mainly takes shuttles to the top....curious as to how you thought the enduro version handled and climbed and if you've ridden the standard version or not. Thanks for your help. Cheers
@@solarnewton if you're more into climbing I'd definitely go for the standard build with fox 34's. Save some weight. Personally I think it's a bit out of place having enduro parts on a short travel trail bike, if you wanted something to ride enduro, the switchblade, Mach 6 or Firebird would be a better choice.
Agreed Bobby - it's so simple, but absolutely brilliant. I wondered if Pivot had a patent on the clip on sag guide, but it turns out they don't - they're just the only ones who use it. Anything that makes suspension setup easier and more accurate is a good thing for sure! [Wil]
Great and thorough overall review! Considering this non-Enduro version to add as a second bike, with different characteristics than my current Mach 5.5. So difficult choosing between this and an Ibis Ripley, but I’m being swayed by this new version.
Cheers Stephen, thanks for watching the review and for your feedback mate! I can see your dilemma between the Ripley vs Trail 429, given those bikes have a lot of similarities on paper. We don't see a lot of Ibis bikes Down Under, but I'd love to swing a leg over a Ripley at some point to see how it compares. [Wil]
Wow. That price hurts my soul. I'll stick with my Ibis Ripmo. Will you do a comparison vid of the Pivot Trail 429 vs Ibis Ripley? I'd be interesting to see the two brands take on DW Link
The top-end options are insane right? I do like that Pivot uses the same quality of carbon for all of its models though. So unlike Yeti & Santa Cruz, you're getting exactly the same frame all the way down to the Race XT model. The Ibis Ripley looks fantastic and on paper it shares a lot in common with the Trail 429 - if Ibis wants to send us one to test, we'd love to do a comparison between the two! [Wil]
Fantastic review Will. The bikes in this category are all so brilliant this year. Are flow planning on doing any head to head reviews? Would love to see Trail429 vs Stumpy vs Optic. All on the shortlist at the moment and with no one having stock to be able to test ride anything your reviews matter!
Cheers mate! Have you had the chance to check out the full review yet? There's actually a head-to-head comparison in there between the Trail 429 and the new Stumpjumper, which I reckon you'll find pretty interesting: flowmountainbike.com/tests/2021-pivot-trail-429-review/ We'd love to do more head-to-head video reviews, though the timing doesn't always work out - we only get a limited time with each test bike, and it's not often that we have two suitable bikes overlapping. Still, when possible we do our best to provide comparisons in the written reviews, which hopefully provides a bit more info and context for our readers. On that note, you'll find a load more reviews and a lot more detail in each review on the website, so it's worth having a look around when you get the chance; flowmountainbike.com/reviews/ Appreciate the feedback though mate - we'll see if we can't create some more comparative content in the future! [Wil]
Thanks for the well done review! You didn't mention anything about the fact that Pivot uses the Super Boost Plus 157 system. How does Super Boost affect the bike's performance compared to Boost 148 bikes? What edge over Boost 148 riders do Super Boost riders have? Also, is Super Boost Plus 157 gaining in popularity or declining?
Cheers Steve! You're spot on - we didn't dive into the Super Boost setup, along with a few other features and details that we couldn't quite squeeze into the video. There's a heap more info in the full review if you get the chance to check it out: flowmountainbike.com/tests/2021-pivot-trail-429-review/ In answer to your questions though: - Pivot employs Super Boost spacing for a few reasons, though on the Trail 429 the biggest motivator is maximising tyre clearance while keeping the rear centre short and stiff. The wider chainline gives more flexibility for designing the chainstay yoke and lower suspension linkage. According to Pivot & DT Swiss, the wider hub spacing also broadens the spoke bracing angle to build a stiffer and stronger rear wheel. - The theoretical edge of a bike with Super Boost is more to do with the frame design and engineering, rather than a black-and-white difference in ride quality. However, a Super Boost bike and wheel (in theory) can be engineered to be stiffer without a weight penalty. Additionally, tyre clearance is huge on the Trail 429, so that's a relatively clear benefit for the riders who need/want it. - It appears to be getting more popular. Most of the big wheel and drivetrain manufacturers are now offering Super Boost compatible hubs and cranksets. That includes Shimano, which added XTR to its Super Boost range last year (in addition to SLX and XT), and generally Shimano only commits to a standard if it's forecasting significant future demand. As for bike brands, Pivot has been committed since 2016, and Knolly, Evil and Devinci have recently joined in too. As for the bigger brands? Only time will tell, though we suspect next generation e-MTB models are likely to adopt the standard, as the benefits will be more pronounced in that segment. Hope that helps explain Steve, though just shout out if you've got any other questions and I'll do my best to answer them for you! [Wil]
Thanks Paolo! Mick, the co-founder of Flow, is still steering the ship at flowmountainbike.com. Mick hasn't been presenting as many videos lately, but you'll likely have seen the two of us together in the Canyon Spectral 29er video review from late last year. His fellow co-founder Chris actually finished up at Flow about 18 months ago, and I've been trying to fill his shoes ever since :-) [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam well youre doing fantastic Wil! Hope to see you do mtb travel and trail exploration videos as well coz i feel youve got a knack for it! Warm regards to Mick! Been following this channel for longest time! Wish Chris all the best in his new venture!
I was looking at the XO-1 build and its a little under 8 grand USD, also looking at the Yeti 115 T-2 with XO, do you have any preferences?? Some people say the 115 is kind of heavy?
Everything functions properly ua-cam.com/users/postUgkxHL1v1R3NE5x4KiYfyt8dnQmyNYz7qi5L Nothing was damaged in the box aside from a decal on the fork. The decal was missing a piece of a corner but I ended up peeling them off anyways. Assembly is easy BUT make sure you tune up the derailleurs. Both the front and rear need adjusting. I'd advise going to a bike shop but I opted out and put in 10+ hours with the help of UA-cam. Ended up fraying a shifter cable but all in all I learned from the experience. The Brakes work well but the front caliper needs adjusting or at least mine did because the rotor was rubbing against the pads. Make sure you swap out the seat, grips, and pedals. For the short run you'll be fine though. I've read that this bike isn't built yet for hard trails but I just need it for the city. PA has some of the worst roads and being in a mountain this was a great choice. Worth the investment!
Thanks Chris! I rode an early generation Following a few years ago, and it was a ripper, though I've not ridden the latest generation. Would be well keen to try it out! [Wil]
Thanks Roger, glad you enjoyed the review! Those trails are at the La Larr Ba Gauwa MTB Park in Victoria - also known as the Harcourt MTB Park, which is about a 1.5 hour drive north of Melbourne: lalarrbagauwa.harcourt.vic.au/ [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam nice. I’ve ridden the blues west of Sydney. Been to Melbourne. Haven’t ridden Melbourne. Now I know where to pick a bike when I can get there next.
Damn, I still find it hard to accept so many people can afford bikes anywhere close to the cost of this! I know I don’t race or do crazy riding but nearly all the other riders I see at my nearest trails are on bikes significantly more $$ than mine!!
I know what you mean Simon - I feel exactly the same way when I see all the new cars on the road! Sometimes I wonder how people can justify spending more than $10K on a car, but hey, each to their own. [Wil]
Will, do you think at your/our height that the small would have been a better choice in size? I’ve seen Chris Cocalis talk about riding a medium in this frame, and he’s a taller guy.
Hey Bruce! Personally I found the Medium to be a great fit and I thoroughly enjoyed the handling. The 430mm reach on the Small would be too short for me. However, it'll depend on the rider's dimensions and their desired use case. If you're longer in the legs and shorter in the torso, a smaller frame size may be preferable, particularly if you're going to be doing some XC racing and would like to fit a longer stem. [Wil]
I'm 170cm tall, used to a 26" Klein Mantra so I'm torn between this (Enduro) 429 and the IBIS Mojo4 or the Enduro Trail 429 in 27.5". I really don't want to lose the fast handling of the 26" I'm used to but do want the helpful rollover so I'm thinking 27.5" instead of 29". Your thoughts?
Watched both your reviews of the Trail 429 and the Stumpjumper. I want a bike that is a good climber (both steep and tech) and one I can do long rides with (so the lighter the better). Which one is the better bike for me? Thx!
I'd recommend the Pivot Trail 429 - it's the more efficient pedalling bike, so it's more stable on steep climbs. As for weight, the Stumpjumper frame is lighter due to its simpler flex-stay suspension design (2,280g vs 2,700g). Hope that helps! [Wil]
how much of a difference is the 'race' version from the 'enduro' version, please? Do you think that going 'enduro' on this bike takes away from what the nature of the bike is?? Thanks, nice vid.
Hello there Roger! The Enduro build comes with a Fox 36 GRIP2 fork with 140mm of travel and a 44mm offset. The shock also changes to a Float DPX2. The bigger fork slackens out the angles a touch, and it will also stabilise the steering further due to the shorter offset. On top of that, the GRIP2 damper is superior as far as sensitivity and high-speed control are concerned (though you do give up the lockout over the FIT4 fork). Along with the piggyback shock, I'd expect the Enduro build to feel quite a bit plusher and deeper in its travel. As mentioned in the video, aggro riders will naturally gravitate towards the Enduro build. Does it take away from what the Trail 429 is? Personally I don't think so - to me this is a really versatile and solid bike that offers a fair amount of adaptability via the geometry flip chip and its option to fit different forks and wheelsizes, depending on your preference. There were times where I would have loved the bigger fork, as the suspension quality, frame stiffness and long geometry means you can push this bike pretty hard. I can also see it being setup with a 120mm SID/34 SC in more of an XC/marathon setup too, since it's so efficient and responsive. That said, I've only ridden the bike in the setup you see here - hopefully we can get one in for some longer-term testing to try it out with some different setups! [Wil]
What can I say, I'm picky 😂 Totally agree though - the cable routing should be perfect given this is a premium frame and the quality elsewhere is top-notch. [Wil]
I'd still recommend the Medium for a rider around my 175cm height - the Small gets a lot shorter (425mm vs 455mm reach), so I personally think that would be too short. The stack also gets shorter too, so the cockpit would likely feel quite low/aggressive. [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam What about a rider at 178cm? Do you think a medium would be too small? I currently ride a size large canyon strive which has a 470mm reach with a 640mm stack and honestly it feels a little too long. I'm thinking the 455mm reach of a medium trail429 might be just right?
It really depends on the terrain. For more XC-type trails with tighter corners, the higher position is fantastic - you notice the improved saddle position, and there's more weight on the front wheel for carving turns. The lower position just gives you a little bit more confidence with the front wheel sticking further out ahead, so I'd choose that mode for riding higher speed trails. My local trails aren't particularly steep, so I generally preferred the higher setting for the sharper handling. [Wil]
Good question Alli! There are certainly a lot of similarities between the two - same suspension travel, very similar geometry, both high-end carbon frames with dw-link suspension platforms. However, the Trail 429 does offer adjustable geometry, and it's also both mullet and full 27.5+ compatible. It's also Live Valve ready. I do like that Ibis use a threaded bottom bracket shell on the Ripley though, and it also uses standard Boost hub spacing (not Super Boost like the Trail 429), so that's more appealing for sure. Those comparisons aside, I've not ridden the Ripley myself, so I wouldn't be able to give you an accurate on-trail rundown between the two. Either way, hope that helps! [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam No. If we keep caving to this nonsense it won’t stop. Next year they’ll have the Super Duper Boost! Plus, I have two sets of spare rims that are regular Boost spacing. Great videos from Flow tho. 👍
@@mwinner101 - I hear you on that! I was going to try out our test bike with a lighter set of wheels and tyres for some more XC-based riding, but of course I don't have any Super Boost wheels in the workshop, so that plan was foiled 🤦 [Wil]
I reckon you'd be right Sean, though the Epic EVO is definitely more on the XC side of things - the frame is very light and whippy, and while the rear suspension is progressive, the single-pivot flex-stay design means it performs quite differently to the Pivot's dw-link design. In terms of ride quality, I'd say the Epic EVO is more comparable to the Mach 4 SL with the 120mm fork option. Whereas the Trail 429 is closer to the new Stumpjumper. [Wil]
Did you get to ride the ENDURO model? Curious as to how much more that weighs and how it climbs vs the standard 429 and why one would go for the ENDURO. I ride all over the western US and like climbing (not a flat pedal rider - ex xc racer)so wondering how the ENDURO climbs and performs on classic xc trails - think Tahoe, Downieville, Moab and CO....thoughts? Great review!
Hello there Mark, I didn't get the chance to test the Enduro spec in the Trail 429 - only the Race spec with the 130mm fork and DPS shock as shown in the review. I'm keen to try out that bike with the longer fork and some more aggro tyres, though I'd also be interested to see what it's like with a 120mm fork in more of an XC/marathon setup. Hopefully we can make that happen in a longer term test - stay tuned! [Wil]
The pricing on some of these bikes is offensive. No doubt this is a high quality, premium bike. But Pivot is completely asleep at the wheel with importer/distributor choice & management. Until the old manufacturer - distributor - retailer model is overhauled & we get a manufacturer-retailer direct model, we will continue to see this sort of utterly ridiculous pricing. The importer/distributors are a disgraceful bunch of fat little piggies that offer almost no value to the supply chain.
Why not compare it to a Marin rift zone carbon? Yes.. i know the marin isn't "top shelf" but it has led the way with geometry and has provided more people with the "latest geometry" than pivot ever will. I love your videos, however a less elitist view and conten would be awesome. 18k for a bike is a joke, lets look at bikes that show the same thing for a 1/4 of the price....
Hullo there Ben! Great suggestion on the Marin Rift Zone - we've actually been trying to get our hands on one to review for a while. It's a great looking bike on paper so hopefully we can get Marin to send us one to test. Regarding your request for less elitist content - have you had a chance to check out any of our other reviews Ben? We're only a small team of two here at Flow, but we still try to cover as broad a range of test bikes, across as many different genres and price points as possible. In the past year we've tested a whole bunch of bikes more value-oriented models such as the Canyon Neuron AL, Polygon Siskiu D6, Norco Sight, Merida One-Twenty, Giant Stance, GT Force, Norco Fluid, Canyon Stoic, Cube Stereo, Giant Trance X and Polygon Siskiu T8. You can check out all those reviews here if you like: flowmountainbike.com/reviews/ Going back to the Pivot Trail 429 shown in this video review - this is a brand new model for Pivot, and they were keen to send us a bike prior to the official launch so we could give it a proper test and review, rather than just writing a news story on it. Hopefully some folks found the review useful and/or interesting, though we appreciate if it didn't tickle your fancy - we'll continue trying to cover as wide a range of bikes and gear as we can. [Wil]
A mountain biker who rides uphill to access the fun of the downhills (which i'm guessing is the majority of riders) would be foolish to spend $8,500 on a bike that didn't have a battery and a motor. I don't care how light and cutting edge this thing is, something like a giant trance x ebike would be way more fun to ride than this thing. For the same price as the base model in this review you could buy an ebike and have enough money left over to pick up a good-quality second hand dualie for your fitness rides.
This is the most detailed, spot on review and description of this bike. When I rode it, it felt EXACTLY as you described. That's rare. Thank you for a great job reviewing this.
This is by far the best review on the 429, such an comprehensive detailed through out😊
I randomly come across your bike reviews a few times a year and you consistently have the most comprehensive and organized presentation in the bike-media space. Well done as always (now I want that bike!).
Thanks very much Ryan, appreciate the feedback! I also want that bike too 🤣 [Wil]
Most clear and comprehensive bike review I've seen. Well done.
Thanks for watching and for the feedback Myles, glad you enjoyed the video review! [Wil]
Now that’s a great trail bike. The max slackness one should be and a decent pedalling weight for all day riding.
I own it and it’s great but the fox dropper post loses air after a short time and is a known problem at pivot HQ. Even after warranty coverage fix still happens. The seat post needs to come all the way up !! Sending it out sucks and my crank bros dropper post on my last bike never had any problems over years.
Amazing review and amazing bike! Pivot is a company that’s not jumping on that bandwagon of lower BB, slacker HTA, and steeper STA like everyone else. Plus you do not have to size up to get the longer reach. Plus they welcome the different wheel sizes, even a mullet configuration. I’m really impressed that Pivot is really thinking of the rider that would love to buy a dream bike and switch out wheel sets to have 2 or 3 types of bikes in one.
Thanks for the feedback mate, glad you enjoyed the review! [Wil]
That’s incorrect, Pivot run tight , there’s no xxl like Santa Cruz offer. A slacker HTA gives you a safer ride downhill over chunk - a steeper STA gives you better seated sit & spin.
Pivot’s sale point is the DW link staying high in its travel over rock and on the climb.
This was an incredibly comprehensive and informative bike review. Thank you.
My review of this review channel reviewing the Pivot Trail 42069: (4.75/5) I found this review very helpful as Flow didn’t mind getting into the weeds on every aspect of the bike. As a prospective buyer, I didn’t love the use of cliches like efficient and effective when describing the suspension performance. Almost every suspension brand’s marketing team stuffs those words into their product description like a crackhead loves crack. Thank you for taking the time to put together this thoughtful video. I will be subscribing for future content.
Great review, with a lot of useful insights! I'm still loving my previous gen Trail 429, and can't imagine how anything could be better for the riding I do. It pedals so much more efficiently than my 2018 Trance. Very tempted after this review!
Cheers Sam, glad you dug the review! I've had the opportunity to test all three generations of the Trail 429, and each one has been really impressive. Your current Trail 429 is a ripper, and such a capable bike for its given travel - I fondly recall riding that bike for my first time in Moab for the launch, where we rode Mag 7 and Portal, and the Trail 429 was remarkably capable on such technical trails. It certainly saved my bacon on a number of occasions! [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam the first ride review you guys did of the previous gen Trail 429 at Old Man's Valley in Hornsby certainly helped sway me to buy it when I was looking for a replacement, and I've been very happy with it 🙂
Wow great review. Couldn’t be more detailed thank you
Hello Will and greetings from Ohio, USA. That simply was another fantastic review from you Sir.
Maybe its just me, but I think that Pivot looks downright proper, especially in that color. Wow !
Thanks Bill! Glad you enjoyed the video, and really appreciate the feedback! I totally agree with you, the Trail 429 is a sharp looking bike, and I am contemplating the value of my second kidney as we speak 😂 [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam I hear you brother, but please don't get rid your kidney.☺
Absolute best review Will! Very much considering the enduro option with the 36 fork.... Pivot really put together a great package here..
And it comes with batteries 🤣 that did make me laugh. Imagine laying out 18k and being asked ‘would you like some batteries as well’? Great review as always, quality rather than quantity is a pleasure to experience on the Tube
Cheers mate, thank you very much for the kind feedback! [Wil]
Great bike. Rode it and love it. But $7500 for essentially an XT build is outrageous even in current market conditions.
It really feels like when media focuses on the narrative that increased reach equates to effectively sizing up a frame, it really clouds the reality for consumers. Steeper seat tubes close in on those gains a great deal and with some of these reach gains, the effective top tube lengths, which is a better metric for cockpit length, aren't always changing that much at all.
Great review. I know about the concept of import duties/taxes but $3000 US extra? That's obscene. I go through my share of bikes and have even had a couple Pivots but I would NEVER pay that amount of money for a bicycle. I build my bikes from the frame up and as I'm always moving parts around, it saves a fair amount of money. Yet another reason why the 157 Super Boost is a non-starter for me.
What a comprehensive and clear review. I test rode one yesterday in the enduro build and found this review to be pretty spot on. It's definitely the most composed and capable short travel trail bike I've ever ridden. I found it to be super poppy but very stable and predictable at the same time, I could clear jumps comfortably with a fair bit less speed than what I'd need on my enduro bike. One thing I did notice is that I found it quite harsh and a bit jarring on some nasty rock and root sections, That could be down to the wrong shock tuning and tire pressure though.
How would you go about deciding between the standard vs. enduro build - especially if you ride mainly xc trails (Mt. Tam) and are a strong climber who rides with SPD's vs. a flat pedal goggle riding downhiller who mainly takes shuttles to the top....curious as to how you thought the enduro version handled and climbed and if you've ridden the standard version or not. Thanks for your help. Cheers
@@solarnewton if you're more into climbing I'd definitely go for the standard build with fox 34's. Save some weight. Personally I think it's a bit out of place having enduro parts on a short travel trail bike, if you wanted something to ride enduro, the switchblade, Mach 6 or Firebird would be a better choice.
Why don't all shocks have that cool little sag guide built in!
Agreed Bobby - it's so simple, but absolutely brilliant. I wondered if Pivot had a patent on the clip on sag guide, but it turns out they don't - they're just the only ones who use it. Anything that makes suspension setup easier and more accurate is a good thing for sure! [Wil]
Is there anything the stumpjumper does better than the trail 429 ?
Thanks for the great review
Great and thorough overall review! Considering this non-Enduro version to add as a second bike, with different characteristics than my current Mach 5.5. So difficult choosing between this and an Ibis Ripley, but I’m being swayed by this new version.
Cheers Stephen, thanks for watching the review and for your feedback mate! I can see your dilemma between the Ripley vs Trail 429, given those bikes have a lot of similarities on paper. We don't see a lot of Ibis bikes Down Under, but I'd love to swing a leg over a Ripley at some point to see how it compares. [Wil]
....and the Merida one twenty....with enough change left over for a ute.
What a perfect review! And a very beautiful bike!
Thanks Stam, glad you dug the review - we appreciate the feedback! [Wil]
Wow. That price hurts my soul. I'll stick with my Ibis Ripmo. Will you do a comparison vid of the Pivot Trail 429 vs Ibis Ripley? I'd be interesting to see the two brands take on DW Link
The top-end options are insane right? I do like that Pivot uses the same quality of carbon for all of its models though. So unlike Yeti & Santa Cruz, you're getting exactly the same frame all the way down to the Race XT model.
The Ibis Ripley looks fantastic and on paper it shares a lot in common with the Trail 429 - if Ibis wants to send us one to test, we'd love to do a comparison between the two!
[Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam I'd love to see that, it would be an awesome comparison. Come on @Rowney_sports send the lads a Ripley!
Fantastic review Will. The bikes in this category are all so brilliant this year. Are flow planning on doing any head to head reviews? Would love to see Trail429 vs Stumpy vs Optic. All on the shortlist at the moment and with no one having stock to be able to test ride anything your reviews matter!
Cheers mate!
Have you had the chance to check out the full review yet? There's actually a head-to-head comparison in there between the Trail 429 and the new Stumpjumper, which I reckon you'll find pretty interesting: flowmountainbike.com/tests/2021-pivot-trail-429-review/
We'd love to do more head-to-head video reviews, though the timing doesn't always work out - we only get a limited time with each test bike, and it's not often that we have two suitable bikes overlapping. Still, when possible we do our best to provide comparisons in the written reviews, which hopefully provides a bit more info and context for our readers. On that note, you'll find a load more reviews and a lot more detail in each review on the website, so it's worth having a look around when you get the chance; flowmountainbike.com/reviews/
Appreciate the feedback though mate - we'll see if we can't create some more comparative content in the future!
[Wil]
Thanks for the well done review! You didn't mention anything about the fact that Pivot uses the Super Boost Plus 157 system. How does Super Boost affect the bike's performance compared to Boost 148 bikes? What edge over Boost 148 riders do Super Boost riders have? Also, is Super Boost Plus 157 gaining in popularity or declining?
Cheers Steve!
You're spot on - we didn't dive into the Super Boost setup, along with a few other features and details that we couldn't quite squeeze into the video. There's a heap more info in the full review if you get the chance to check it out: flowmountainbike.com/tests/2021-pivot-trail-429-review/
In answer to your questions though:
- Pivot employs Super Boost spacing for a few reasons, though on the Trail 429 the biggest motivator is maximising tyre clearance while keeping the rear centre short and stiff. The wider chainline gives more flexibility for designing the chainstay yoke and lower suspension linkage. According to Pivot & DT Swiss, the wider hub spacing also broadens the spoke bracing angle to build a stiffer and stronger rear wheel.
- The theoretical edge of a bike with Super Boost is more to do with the frame design and engineering, rather than a black-and-white difference in ride quality. However, a Super Boost bike and wheel (in theory) can be engineered to be stiffer without a weight penalty. Additionally, tyre clearance is huge on the Trail 429, so that's a relatively clear benefit for the riders who need/want it.
- It appears to be getting more popular. Most of the big wheel and drivetrain manufacturers are now offering Super Boost compatible hubs and cranksets. That includes Shimano, which added XTR to its Super Boost range last year (in addition to SLX and XT), and generally Shimano only commits to a standard if it's forecasting significant future demand. As for bike brands, Pivot has been committed since 2016, and Knolly, Evil and Devinci have recently joined in too. As for the bigger brands? Only time will tell, though we suspect next generation e-MTB models are likely to adopt the standard, as the benefits will be more pronounced in that segment.
Hope that helps explain Steve, though just shout out if you've got any other questions and I'll do my best to answer them for you!
[Wil]
Everybody forgets about the Devinci Django!
Another sick review by Will and the Flow squad 🤙😎
I have to say, i do also miss the 2 pioneers of this channel, wonder where theyre at?
Thanks Paolo!
Mick, the co-founder of Flow, is still steering the ship at flowmountainbike.com. Mick hasn't been presenting as many videos lately, but you'll likely have seen the two of us together in the Canyon Spectral 29er video review from late last year.
His fellow co-founder Chris actually finished up at Flow about 18 months ago, and I've been trying to fill his shoes ever since :-)
[Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam well youre doing fantastic Wil! Hope to see you do mtb travel and trail exploration videos as well coz i feel youve got a knack for it! Warm regards to Mick! Been following this channel for longest time! Wish Chris all the best in his new venture!
Nothing mentioned about out of the saddle climbing with the longer reach vs V2?
I want to go on a trip after watching this video
Have a nice day
I was looking at the XO-1 build and its a little under 8 grand USD, also looking at the Yeti 115 T-2 with XO, do you have any preferences?? Some people say the 115 is kind of heavy?
Looks so slick 🔥
Everything functions properly ua-cam.com/users/postUgkxHL1v1R3NE5x4KiYfyt8dnQmyNYz7qi5L Nothing was damaged in the box aside from a decal on the fork. The decal was missing a piece of a corner but I ended up peeling them off anyways. Assembly is easy BUT make sure you tune up the derailleurs. Both the front and rear need adjusting. I'd advise going to a bike shop but I opted out and put in 10+ hours with the help of UA-cam. Ended up fraying a shifter cable but all in all I learned from the experience. The Brakes work well but the front caliper needs adjusting or at least mine did because the rotor was rubbing against the pads. Make sure you swap out the seat, grips, and pedals. For the short run you'll be fine though. I've read that this bike isn't built yet for hard trails but I just need it for the city. PA has some of the worst roads and being in a mountain this was a great choice. Worth the investment!
Hi Will, great review. I had just about decided on an Evil Following and now this comes along. Have ridden one and if so how do they compare?
Thanks Chris! I rode an early generation Following a few years ago, and it was a ripper, though I've not ridden the latest generation. Would be well keen to try it out! [Wil]
Where are these trails? They look like spectacular fun.. maybe an MTB vacation some day...
And a great review, thanks!
Thanks Roger, glad you enjoyed the review!
Those trails are at the La Larr Ba Gauwa MTB Park in Victoria - also known as the Harcourt MTB Park, which is about a 1.5 hour drive north of Melbourne: lalarrbagauwa.harcourt.vic.au/ [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam nice. I’ve ridden the blues west of Sydney. Been to Melbourne. Haven’t ridden Melbourne. Now I know where to pick a bike when I can get there next.
Great review. Thanks. Looks very similar to my Tallboy. That I love.
It looks nothing like the Tallboy.
Damn, I still find it hard to accept so many people can afford bikes anywhere close to the cost of this!
I know I don’t race or do crazy riding but nearly all the other riders I see at my nearest trails are on bikes significantly more $$ than mine!!
I know what you mean Simon - I feel exactly the same way when I see all the new cars on the road! Sometimes I wonder how people can justify spending more than $10K on a car, but hey, each to their own. [Wil]
Will, do you think at your/our height that the small would have been a better choice in size? I’ve seen Chris Cocalis talk about riding a medium in this frame, and he’s a taller guy.
Hey Bruce! Personally I found the Medium to be a great fit and I thoroughly enjoyed the handling. The 430mm reach on the Small would be too short for me. However, it'll depend on the rider's dimensions and their desired use case. If you're longer in the legs and shorter in the torso, a smaller frame size may be preferable, particularly if you're going to be doing some XC racing and would like to fit a longer stem. [Wil]
I just put money down on a medium. I’m 5’7”. Should I be going with a small?
How it compares to Scott Spark? Pivot has very short chainstays which is not good for a taller riders..
I'm 170cm tall, used to a 26" Klein Mantra so I'm torn between this (Enduro) 429 and the IBIS Mojo4 or the Enduro Trail 429 in 27.5". I really don't want to lose the fast handling of the 26" I'm used to but do want the helpful rollover so I'm thinking 27.5" instead of 29".
Your thoughts?
You’re comparing apples to oranges. Your Klein is nothing like today’s bikes in terms of geometry, technology, etc.
Watched both your reviews of the Trail 429 and the Stumpjumper. I want a bike that is a good climber (both steep and tech) and one I can do long rides with (so the lighter the better). Which one is the better bike for me? Thx!
I'd recommend the Pivot Trail 429 - it's the more efficient pedalling bike, so it's more stable on steep climbs. As for weight, the Stumpjumper frame is lighter due to its simpler flex-stay suspension design (2,280g vs 2,700g).
Hope that helps!
[Wil]
how much of a difference is the 'race' version from the 'enduro' version, please? Do you think that going 'enduro' on this bike takes away from what the nature of the bike is?? Thanks, nice vid.
Hello there Roger! The Enduro build comes with a Fox 36 GRIP2 fork with 140mm of travel and a 44mm offset. The shock also changes to a Float DPX2.
The bigger fork slackens out the angles a touch, and it will also stabilise the steering further due to the shorter offset. On top of that, the GRIP2 damper is superior as far as sensitivity and high-speed control are concerned (though you do give up the lockout over the FIT4 fork). Along with the piggyback shock, I'd expect the Enduro build to feel quite a bit plusher and deeper in its travel.
As mentioned in the video, aggro riders will naturally gravitate towards the Enduro build. Does it take away from what the Trail 429 is? Personally I don't think so - to me this is a really versatile and solid bike that offers a fair amount of adaptability via the geometry flip chip and its option to fit different forks and wheelsizes, depending on your preference. There were times where I would have loved the bigger fork, as the suspension quality, frame stiffness and long geometry means you can push this bike pretty hard. I can also see it being setup with a 120mm SID/34 SC in more of an XC/marathon setup too, since it's so efficient and responsive.
That said, I've only ridden the bike in the setup you see here - hopefully we can get one in for some longer-term testing to try it out with some different setups!
[Wil]
14k and Will is still left wanting! Am I the only guy who thinks that for that money it should be just perfect I mean not a cent to spend!
What can I say, I'm picky 😂 Totally agree though - the cable routing should be perfect given this is a premium frame and the quality elsewhere is top-notch. [Wil]
I couldn’t agree with you more Wil! 14k isn’t just a lot of money it’s a ridiculous amount of money for a bicycle. It should be flawless!!!!
Have you ridden a Revel Rascal or Ranger and how does it compare to those?
I suppose the higher bottom bracket would enable a return to my favoured 175 crank length on a medium ? Ps great review
Cheers for watching and for the question Patrick! For sure - our Medium size test bike actually came with 175mm cranks as stock. [Wil]
So it's a fuel ex with a dw link ? Cool
Im 180cm and last few day traying to decide for M or L. My dealer advise me for L but I ride Pivot Less in M. I do more uphil so😬???
At your height/weight would you recommend the medium or downsize to the small for more playfulness?
I'd still recommend the Medium for a rider around my 175cm height - the Small gets a lot shorter (425mm vs 455mm reach), so I personally think that would be too short. The stack also gets shorter too, so the cockpit would likely feel quite low/aggressive. [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam What about a rider at 178cm? Do you think a medium would be too small? I currently ride a size large canyon strive which has a 470mm reach with a 640mm stack and honestly it feels a little too long. I'm thinking the 455mm reach of a medium trail429 might be just right?
Can you review the trek top fuel?
We'd love to Gustav - great suggestion! We'll see if we can't get one in to test. [Wil]
Low vs Lower - which position did you prefer?
It really depends on the terrain. For more XC-type trails with tighter corners, the higher position is fantastic - you notice the improved saddle position, and there's more weight on the front wheel for carving turns. The lower position just gives you a little bit more confidence with the front wheel sticking further out ahead, so I'd choose that mode for riding higher speed trails. My local trails aren't particularly steep, so I generally preferred the higher setting for the sharper handling. [Wil]
Hey Wil, where abouts are you riding in the video?
Hullo mate! All the riding footage was shot at the La Larr Ba Gauwa MTB Park in Harcourt, Victoria. [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam Thanks Wil.😀👍
19k. That is just absolutely ridiculous.
Sure it is, though apparently some people spend that much on handbags and watches 😂
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam True.
Trail 429 v3 or ibis ripley?
Good question Alli!
There are certainly a lot of similarities between the two - same suspension travel, very similar geometry, both high-end carbon frames with dw-link suspension platforms.
However, the Trail 429 does offer adjustable geometry, and it's also both mullet and full 27.5+ compatible. It's also Live Valve ready.
I do like that Ibis use a threaded bottom bracket shell on the Ripley though, and it also uses standard Boost hub spacing (not Super Boost like the Trail 429), so that's more appealing for sure.
Those comparisons aside, I've not ridden the Ripley myself, so I wouldn't be able to give you an accurate on-trail rundown between the two.
Either way, hope that helps!
[Wil]
I’ll pass on the Super Boost bikes.
Not sold on the Super Boost design?
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam No. If we keep caving to this nonsense it won’t stop. Next year they’ll have the Super Duper Boost! Plus, I have two sets of spare rims that are regular Boost spacing. Great videos from Flow tho. 👍
@@mwinner101 - I hear you on that! I was going to try out our test bike with a lighter set of wheels and tyres for some more XC-based riding, but of course I don't have any Super Boost wheels in the workshop, so that plan was foiled 🤦 [Wil]
How do I buy it?
So probably about 2lbs heavier than say a 2021 Epic Evo but with another 10mm of squish front and back
I reckon you'd be right Sean, though the Epic EVO is definitely more on the XC side of things - the frame is very light and whippy, and while the rear suspension is progressive, the single-pivot flex-stay design means it performs quite differently to the Pivot's dw-link design. In terms of ride quality, I'd say the Epic EVO is more comparable to the Mach 4 SL with the 120mm fork option. Whereas the Trail 429 is closer to the new Stumpjumper. [Wil]
@@FlowMountainBikeUA-cam Definitely more appealing weight wise for the amount of travel it offers compared to the old one.
Did you get to ride the ENDURO model? Curious as to how much more that weighs and how it climbs vs the standard 429 and why one would go for the ENDURO. I ride all over the western US and like climbing (not a flat pedal rider - ex xc racer)so wondering how the ENDURO climbs and performs on classic xc trails - think Tahoe, Downieville, Moab and CO....thoughts? Great review!
Hello there Mark,
I didn't get the chance to test the Enduro spec in the Trail 429 - only the Race spec with the 130mm fork and DPS shock as shown in the review.
I'm keen to try out that bike with the longer fork and some more aggro tyres, though I'd also be interested to see what it's like with a 120mm fork in more of an XC/marathon setup. Hopefully we can make that happen in a longer term test - stay tuned!
[Wil]
Pink. Bike Has A NEW in box large. The only one in the country I could find!
Where are these trails
All the riding footage was shot at La Larr Ba Gauwa (Harcourt MTB Park) just outside of Bendigo. [Wil]
Pivot ne fait pas de 27,5"..………? 🤔
19k is silly money for any bicycle.
Ughhh. Super Boost. Why oh why?
They stole the "low/lower" from Intense.
pity it's a superboost, so limited choice for aftermarket wheels
The pricing on some of these bikes is offensive.
No doubt this is a high quality, premium bike.
But Pivot is completely asleep at the wheel with importer/distributor choice & management.
Until the old manufacturer - distributor - retailer model is overhauled & we get a manufacturer-retailer direct model, we will continue to see this sort of utterly ridiculous pricing.
The importer/distributors are a disgraceful bunch of fat little piggies that offer almost no value to the supply chain.
Why not compare it to a Marin rift zone carbon? Yes.. i know the marin isn't "top shelf" but it has led the way with geometry and has provided more people with the "latest geometry" than pivot ever will. I love your videos, however a less elitist view and conten would be awesome. 18k for a bike is a joke, lets look at bikes that show the same thing for a 1/4 of the price....
Hullo there Ben!
Great suggestion on the Marin Rift Zone - we've actually been trying to get our hands on one to review for a while. It's a great looking bike on paper so hopefully we can get Marin to send us one to test.
Regarding your request for less elitist content - have you had a chance to check out any of our other reviews Ben? We're only a small team of two here at Flow, but we still try to cover as broad a range of test bikes, across as many different genres and price points as possible. In the past year we've tested a whole bunch of bikes more value-oriented models such as the Canyon Neuron AL, Polygon Siskiu D6, Norco Sight, Merida One-Twenty, Giant Stance, GT Force, Norco Fluid, Canyon Stoic, Cube Stereo, Giant Trance X and Polygon Siskiu T8.
You can check out all those reviews here if you like: flowmountainbike.com/reviews/
Going back to the Pivot Trail 429 shown in this video review - this is a brand new model for Pivot, and they were keen to send us a bike prior to the official launch so we could give it a proper test and review, rather than just writing a news story on it. Hopefully some folks found the review useful and/or interesting, though we appreciate if it didn't tickle your fancy - we'll continue trying to cover as wide a range of bikes and gear as we can.
[Wil]
Another over-reached mtn bike. Wonder when this trend will reverse
A mountain biker who rides uphill to access the fun of the downhills (which i'm guessing is the majority of riders) would be foolish to spend $8,500 on a bike that didn't have a battery and a motor. I don't care how light and cutting edge this thing is, something like a giant trance x ebike would be way more fun to ride than this thing. For the same price as the base model in this review you could buy an ebike and have enough money left over to pick up a good-quality second hand dualie for your fitness rides.
Meh