In Three Hopes Dorothea has a line during an expedition where she straight up says she wants to marry a handsome prince or a beautiful princess, which really was the most explicit queer line in either of the games for me.
in the words of my friend, "ingrid is the least homosexual blue lion" and "felix is the most homosexual blue lion despite mercedes being able to s support both byleths"
Overall, I really like your observations here and totally agree with them... except Jeritza. Jeritza is probably asexual in all honesty, with his "attraction" being more aimed at getting killed than getting laid, but the fact that he acknowledges that he's falling in love in 3 houses with Byleth of either gender even though they're not killing him is too much to be overlooked imo. Of course they were slaughtering agarthans rather than slaughtering bussy, but it's romantic in a twisted Jeritza kind of way that makes him bi specifically for Byleth imo. Awesome video though, I just wanted to talk about that one a bit. EDIT: Just want to reiterate that the main point of this is to say that whether Jeritza is asexual, bi, or deathsexual, he's definitely not straight.
I was thinking maybe Jeritza could be a form of demisexual or demiromantic, but DEATHSEXUAL sound metal as fuck so thank you for the awesome new headcanon.
22:26 You are so right about that. For Edie, Shez was written very much as a dear friend rather than a love interest. I like that take more for them anyways, since Shez shouldn't nor needs to take away Byleths relevance to Edelgard. Shez fulfills their own role in the story and does it well, imo.
I appreciate how much time and effort you spent on this analysis. As expected, it's as in depth as ever. For Dimidue (and for Dimitri and Dedue in general): I agree that it's far too close to call. Hopes expanded upon their existing 3H canon. But I think Dimitri got way more gay in Hopes, if that's possible, given his support with Yuri, how much more involved Felix and Dedue are in his arc now, plus Sylvain is more focused on Dimitri too. And of course, Ashe is a royal knight now who is always devoted to Dimitri. For Ferdibert: I agree with your analysis of their different route dynamics. There's obviously a wonderful draw to their CF relationship. But I think their SS "wicked" dynamic is equally fun to explore for the more tragic angle. And of course, can't forget the AU potential where Hubert survived AM with a recruited Ferdinand. For Ingrid: I'll admit that I would have shipped her and Dorothea based on their paralogue alone, but then I unlocked their support conversation and I felt very uncomfortable. I do enjoy Hopes giving Ingrid ship tease with Mercedes, but I still believe that Ingrid is straight. She canonically loved her fallen fiancee Glenn. Ingrid can also choose to never marry in her solo ending in 3H, focusing on her pegasus knights - but I wouldn't necessarily say that makes her a lesbian. She might even veer asexual in unpaired endings. Sylvix (and Felix and Sylvain): 3H and Hopes did very well by both of these characters. Honestly, I already loved them both in Houses so I'm glad that Hopes gave them more attention and focus too. Sylvain also has great chemistry with Yuri and Ashe now, and Felix has always had great chemistry with Dimitri (and now with Dedue in Hopes too). Yuri and Ashe: I'm so happy that Hopes finally gave them a support conversation. I wished they had one in 3H too, and a paired ending. I really liked Yuri's conversations with Dimitri and Sylvain too. And of course, Ashedue is always precious. Ashe is also someone who can easily connect with both Sylvain and Felix too. For Jeritza: I'm honestly inclined to say that his 3H support conversation with Constance is far more romantic than his support with Byleth. But I do think that canonically he's bisexual regardless. I really wish he had a conversation with Hubert tho. For Claurenz: ok I'll admit, it's not overtly romantic or sexual. But it's always been my go to pairing for them both. Probably because it pairs so damn well with MariHilda. But Lorenz is definitely straight, and his support conversation with Marianne, Hilda, Lysithea and Leonie all veer way more romantically overall. Lorenz even has a good support with Mercedes in 3H too. For Rodrigue: I feel like he's the best example of a character who married for duty and responsibilities but who also loved a man from afar. We don't know if it's unrequited, or if Lambert initially married for duty alone. But we do know how important Lambert is to Rodrigue. And their connection has symbolism for their families too: Blaidydd and Fraldarius, Loog and Kyphon, Lambert and Rodrigue, and finally Dimitri and Felix. The shield of Faerghus, indeed.
Although with alphabetical order it would seem Yuri netted the win for 3Hopes, I would like to believe Hopes making Rodrigue playable (and thus exposing everyone to how much of a flame he holds for Lambert) was what tipped the scales in his favor.
I think Hopes tipped the scales in their favor for many reasons. Yuri, Ashe, and Sylvain all got way more subtext overall. Dimitri, Dedue and Felix did too. Rodrigue is playable now. Monica radiates lesbian energy (even if she'd just played for jokes half of the time). Cathmir is practically confirmed again. Linspar even got slightly more romantic this time around. Hopes is just a more fan service game in terms of the support conversations dialogue.
I had no idea when I first decided to go alphabetically how well that would work out, as it wasn't until I was scripting the video that I noticed all the great coincidences that ordering provides: Dedue and Dimitri right next to each other so I don't have to struggle to talk about them separately, Dorothea into Edelgard, Gilbert into Hanneman, Petra as a counterpoint to Monica, Raphael as the capstone of the Deer, and indeed those last four characters who are all such strong wins for Hopes.
One thing drives me insane on this topic is whether or not gay marriage is legal in Fodlan. Byleth explictly marries any of the same gender S supports except for Edelgard, but there are so many paired endings that read like historical queer people making a life together in a place where they can't be out to the general public.
Because same-sex marriage only appears in Byleth's endings I don't take them as worldbuilding commentary so much as the writers continuing to be lazy with Byleth's supports and giving them identical scripts regardless of gender but for a few words swapped out where necessary. Those aside, I'd say that Dimidue and Doropetra come the closest to being publicly-acknowledged couples because they come with the added visibility of Dedue/Dorothea being in essence royal consorts even if that terminology is never used. For Dimidue in particular, the "like family in private" and Dedue being buried with Dimitri suggest a situation where everyone around them understood their relationship but deliberately avoided putting a name on it...which in a roundabout way says to me that there's no gay marriage in Fódlan, in any scenario that doesn't involve Byleth (and even then it's obviously not because of Byleth as a character but because Byleth *is* the player, and the player gets S ranks).
A year late to it, but I think gay Byleth can also be read as an exception to any norms as they can end up declared the religious leader of Fodlan at game's end. The other characters are still mostly existing in a power structure with family inheritance, which inherently puts focus on marriage producing children, but the church doesn't work on a bloodline. How the church leadership works isn't really discussed as it's actually been led by the same person for 1000 years, but that's it's own subject, as is romantic options with characters who are dragons that can reproduce asexually.
Historians would claim that Dedue and Dimitri were just really close friends maybe even roommates but that compilation of them just telling each other how much they "admire" their conversation partner could not be any more gay.
Dimidue!!!!!! Getting analyzed together!!!!!!!!!!! Be still, my beating heart..! I agree with all your placements for the most part. I think Dimidue especially deserve the “too close to call” category because so much of their interaction in both games was connected to the other? Like Hopes takes a lot of Dimidue stuff from 3H and expands on it (teaching each other their languages, sleeping together in Fhirdiad, always being together) and also a lot of what we see in Hopes just adds some delicious context to Houses (like Dedue’s overprotectiveness stemming in part from Rufus’s attempts on Dimitri’s life) Lemme tell you, I squee’d that whole section. And my god, that line about leaving Fodlan to be mercenaries together????? Maybe Dimidue was the true Ike/Soren parallel all along
This video was definitely an eye-opener. Here are some thoughts: Despite Linhardt/Caspar being my favorite non-MC ship for both in both games, I never really noticed that their support lines aren’t necessarily all that romantic. I also never realized just how vocal Dimidue is about their love for each other, and how often they proclaim it. Honestly that entire segment got me a bit teary-eyed. I also never really thought about Monica and Yuri being bad representation. While I do think Monica is bas representation for lesbians, I do think Yuri isn’t. I see the parallels between him and Niles, but to me Yuri is a very valid and relatively common example of a queer man, especially in contemporary culture. I would just really like the developers to further work on theit LGBTQ+ representation and in the next game, make a queer person that looks more like Balthus, to name an example. And really commit to sexualities separate from the MC. Make a woman that can only be romanced by the female protagonist, rather than both. I feel like many MC-sexual characters in Houses are so because their connection to Byleth runs way deeper than simply love (this is the case for Linhardt, Edelgard and Jeritza more so than for Dorothea, Mercedes and Yuri), but it would be really cool to see a lesbian character that can only marry other women, even considering the MC’s gender. I think many characters that are considered gay, are only mostly attracted to one person. For example, Hapi and Coco share a very deep connection that can easily be considered romantic, but they don’t show any outward attraction to other women. While Hilda is flirty with other women, Marianne is only gay for Hilda, etc. Why I personally always thought Hopes was gayer than Houses, is that it seems like the developers took every popular queer paring and dialed it up to 100 in the second game. I feel like Marianne, Felix, Catherine, Hapi, Constance, etc. aren’t necessarily more gay in this game, it’s just that their respective same-sex relationship is made more explicit and therefore “more canon”. The exceptions being Yuri, Shamir and Sylvain, who are canonically just more gay than they were in Houses.
As much as it hurts me to say, it is true that Claude is as straight as a ruler in 3H and 3Hopes . I think the only gay "subtexts" he has is with Dimitrtri tbh (that makes me very hapy tho). Ironic that he was my gay awakening. Anyway , great video!
Tbh I feel like Dimiclaude shippers make it seem like Claude has more subtext with Dimitri then he actually does. Claude doesn't care half as much about Dimitri in 3H as Dimitri did about Claude in AM. It felt almost one sided, if anything, b/c VW Claude doesn't have an arc about helping Dimitri or Fhirdiad at all. But I know Dimiclaude is fairly popular so I think the fans just wanted more interaction than there was in canon.
@@luceena6165 I think a part of me has just never forgiven Claude in a way. I played AM first and I loved how Dimitri helped out Claude and Derdriu. And then I played VW next and was kinda heartbroken at how little this route cared about Dimitri and Fhirdiad. It felt like Claude just didn't care as much and I felt a bit underwhelmed and disappointed. But hey, VW gave me Claurenz so xD
@@bluesky0474 I sorta understand the appeal of Dimiclaude, but in other ways I don't. I just think that they're not very important to each other, and people who falsely think such tend to minimize other characters instead. Dimiclaude shippers sometimes shaft Dedue and Felix, who actually are important to Dimitri, and this makes me angry as a Blue Lions fan. Likewise, Claude cares way more about Hilda and Lorenz and has actual good conversations with them in VW. I suppose I just think it's fine that Dimitri and Claude are only allies by convenience in AM and AG, rather than BFF or more. I think most Dimiclaude fans ship them in AM and now in AG too. Most of them seem to disregard GW entirely, for obvious reasons. Or they ship an AU of VW where Claude actually does save Dimitri.
@@bluesky0474 Yeah pretty much. They're "allies" in 3H in the sense that they're united against a common enemy (Edelgard, the Empire, the Agarthans). But they're never playable together. They're never that close as friends either. And they're never important to each other. Claude is only relevant to Dimitri's arc because Dimitri needed to focus on saving the living over seeking revenge for the dead. But Claude doesn't really have an arc in VW anywhere near comparable to this, thus it's never important for him to save Dimitri in turn. And it's obviously fanon exaggerated that Dimiclaude is anything more than passing allies in AM and AG.
i love all the work put into this video! there is just one thing i'd recommend changing though and it's the straight box which i feel would be better described as not gay, a lot of the cast you put there can be assumed to be hetero but there's few oddball cases like flayn and lysethia but the main one i wanted to put across is jeritza who i feel has more aromantic bisexual subtext than straight unrelated side note the dimidue section was so lovely aoeifnobgugbsp 😭
While Monica had some much needed characteristics in Three Hopes, I can't help but feel that she's another one of those characters in love with Edelgard. But then again she's royalty and everyone wants to sleep with a Prince of Princess. And why can't Dorothea and Ingrid marry when their supports clearly showed the Dorothea in love with Ingrid by the way she was flirting with her?
Great video! loved it!! Also just wanted to say, while Bernie may be straight i think she has a lot of nice interactions with girls, in her supports she seems a bit more comfortable talking or approaching women, specially in hopes... a lot of her male supports were more comedic while her conversations with Marianne, Edelgard Dorothea and Hapi felt more heartfelt to me, also in three houses, Bernadetta has gazed at a flower while saying “She’s so pretty, popular…(exhales softly) dazzling…!” about Dorothea and been made to blush by Leonie, Edelgard, and now Marianne too so yea... take that as you will. its just subtext or even less than that but i thought it might be nice to add :'3
Wow, I did not know that the Knights of Faerghus have so much gay subtext and the men of Leicester being so very straight despite playing both games. I really appreciate you for doing this. Even though I kinda give up on gay romances in Fire Emblem games in general. I wholeheartedly agree with your opinion on Claude, I always feel him as a straight guy who opens for experimentation but always ends up with women at the end. It's so sad to see how straight my favorite house in Three House turns out to be.
I don't know how I feel about your takes on Marienne and Hilda's relationship with each other, BUT I might be biased as The Golden Deer was the first route I took so I could have just been starving for gay content. But I do really think a lot of Hilda's comments (esp what I remember from 3 Houses) skewed flirtatious and authentic in a way that she wouldn't do with men. I also think Raph and Ignatz could've been SO sweet too without that last-minute "no homo but I am gonna boink your sister," moment. And while I disagreed with Claude at first, I think you've swayed me. His lack of closeness with even the main character really does feel v no homo, especially with their whole "WE CAN BEAT EVIL WITH THE POWER OF FRIENDSHIP" thing at the end of his path. As for the other students, yeah I'm in line with all of em.
I won't lie...the moment the artwork with Claude and Lorenz appeared, I fell for the pairing. Despite never thinking about them as anything else but a "political relationship". Can't pretend I couldn't reread things without purposely reading into it after that, in both Hopes or Houses. (I honestly don't think there's more to see in Lorenz and Claude's relationship being more of a focus in 3 Hopes than the lack of "Dedue/Hubert" for Claude in the Golden Deer. He technically had Hilda, sorta, but their relationship wasn't nearly as important as Dimitri and Dedue or Edelgard and Hubert. And it's sad to say, but I do feel out from all the Golden Deer, the only real foil for Claude is Lorenz, so him being chosen isn't too surprising.) Later in the game, the moment the artwork with Claude and Edelgard appeared, I fell for that pairing. Again, something I had never as much as considered. My conclusion was that, somehow, whoever did the artwork was making me artworksexual...or something along those lines. Because, objectively, I can't even say why those artworks somehow triggered shipping within me to begin with. You brought up the difference between the Japanese and English versions in your video, and I think it's kind of a can of worms as Sylvain is hardly the only one having some of his supports reading differently (or just the character reading differently period, Sylvain himself is different in many ways as a person between both versions). Multiple supports differ in their potential queer subtexts. For example, Jeritza feels more aroace in the English version more than straight in my opinion, the Japanese version, however, couldn't be farther away. The dude is the closest thing to explicitly sexual. Just looking at the A support, whereas the English version preferred the more neutral term of "fixation" for what Jeritza feels for Byleth, the Japanese version prefers a phrase that can be understood as being fixated on someone, yes, but more interestingly strongly emotionally attached to someone. The term used to speak of how Jeritza fell under Byleth' spell, in Japanese, has the undertone of "getting attracted, getting charmed, getting captivated". When Jeritza says that he needs Byleth in the English version, what's lost in translation is that the word used has not only bloodthirsty undertones, but also just thirsty period, and generally desires Byleth in both a romantical and sexual way. And all of those words were hardly chosen by accident as at least Byleth can either choose to ask him if he's attempting to seduce or make a move on them (which Jeritza confirms), or telling them they're looking forward to it (Jeritza's sexual need for him being clearly whats nodded at). And if that wasn't enough if you choose the "looking forward" option you have Jeritza telling Byleth to continue polishing their sword arm until then, which in the context means he's expecting a handjob. Honestly, I'm not surprised the localization don't even have anything alluding to this specific part. Personally, it makes me laugh, but, as this can happen in the A-support, I guess it'd be too much for the western mainstream audience. Either way, when Jeritza tells Byleth to not get killed, you again lose the possessive and jealous undertone of his original line. And you're right that Jeritza would have the best orgasm of his life being pierced by Byleth, it's basically what's implied when he's saying he'd be in ecstacy to be pierced by Byleth (literally, for once). It's probably the only part they carried on for the English version of him. And the A-support ends with basically reiterating his possessiveness of Byleth, telling them he won't let them escape no matter what happens (instead of telling them he'll follow them). Don't get it wrong however, the Japanese version isn't just about Jeritza thirsting over Byleth even outside the S-support, he's actually way more gory in his words too, while being way more polite in his speech patterns. He's pretty much one of the typical otome game love interest archetypes in his way of mixing sex and gore. So I guess for Japan it isn't much of a big deal, but I guess toning him down for the English audience made him fit in better with the rest of the cast. Especially since you can have all the gore talk and barely covered sexual undertones without S-supporting Jeritza. Not to mention, he comes out as more than just predatory in his last line as consent is secondary to his obsession for Byleth. And...well, both the West and the East has a thing with portraying LGB people in a predatory manner. Saying that the character is inspired by an archetype more often used in niche games targeting a female audience wouldn't have really helped either, I fear. (as a sidenote, the Japanese S support does offer more emotional intimacy in their exchange than the English one, and sex, again, and the voice actor "acts" turned on and impatient anyway, turned on to have sex that is, so I guess their ending is essentially "Byleth is so good in bed Jeritza changed his priorities despite claiming otherwise" or something; again, Im not surprised this wasn't kept in the English version, even if I personally would have been more entertained, though they could have at least kept Jeritza being affirmative when he says he loves Byleth instead of making it a hesitant question)
Great video! It's so interesting that you the Blue Lions feels like the most gay for you since for me it was the Black Eagles first, Blue Lions close 2nd (rip Golden Deer even though its my favourite house). I do agree though in that Dimitri, Dedue, Felix, Sylvain, Ashe & Mercedes are just so gay in their subtext it's insane. I have to disagree with some of the 'is straight' character readings though since some of them just read as aro/ace/demi to me. Definitely, it could probably be me projecting my own experiences as someone who's demiromantic but is into women (f/f) and surrounds themselves with aro/ace people in same-sex relationships. To use Claude as an example since the other comments have used Jeritza, Claude reads demi-bi to me and his A-supports always feels like the very, very start of an attraction, as oppose to other characters where their A-supports are them declaring their undying love for each other. Claude's A supports always feel like an, "oh! I think I *could* be attracted to them. I definitely care for them and trust them. I want to tell them about the real me and see. " Hilda's, Leonie's, and Lysithea's supports with him comes to mind for this. He reads like someone who knows how to charm people, but in the way that it's a great mechanism to disarm people and deflect questions. As for the bi part in demi-bi, it's mostly definitely because of Byleth. I honestly don't see Byleth much as a self-insert as they are reserved, with no voiced lines in 3 Houses so we're missing on intonations that would have made an impact. So combine that, the reasoning above, and the intimate conversations between them in VW, Claude just feels like a demi character who didn't have the time yet to fully fall into an attraction with one of the characters with the exception of Byleth. Sorry for the essay! Anyway, great video!
Just watched the whole thing. Great video btw. I just had one question. I understand it would be a similar case as to Monica, placing them in the three hopes category due to shez not being in three houses, but I was curious as to the possible subtext in their character and the differences between male and female she since while a player character, she benefits from being fully voice acted and having unique dialogue in their supports.
I'll be honest, I don't think Monica/Shez support conversation offered anything meaningful. Mainly because it spends so much focus talking about Monica's obsession with Edelgard. Monica only cares about Edelgard and a bit about Dorothea. She doesn't care much about Shez either way.
When I first read this I thought you were asking what I'd think of Shez and/or Monica if they had been in Houses. In which case - Shez would probably get so few interactions that they'd still be a write-off (like Byleth in Hopes), and Monica would definitely be able to S rank male Byleth because IS would never commit that hard to an exclusively same-sex-attracted character where Avatar S ranks are on the table (see also Soleil, particularly in the original Japanese). The results then would be the same. But as to Shez as a character, there really aren't enough noticeable differences in the script based on their gender, and with how open-ended their supports (and the heartfelt letters) are overall it's even harder to get a grasp on what if anything there is worth looking into beyond holdovers from characters who are bi-for-Byleth in Houses, like the Linhardt and Dorothea examples.
It's really interesting that how by your metrics, there's only a 1 character margin. Honestly, they could have written Monica any direction they could have wanted to, since we literally had nothing about her except a few lines saying that she didn't act like Kronya when the latter was in disguise. I really dislike Monica, not as much as 3 Hopes Claude, but she's definitely up there. As for any disagreements in particular... I'd probably put Hilda in 3 Hopes, but that's about it.
oh wow that different pov is interesting to me. i always saw blue lions as the straight house w mercedes n ashe as exceptions n i mainly focused on my lil sapphic adrestian polycule but tht makes sense what you said abt like understanding certain subtext more from experience or w/e but idk i’ll look out for that more in the lion boys when i continue playing
I actually wonder if having a gay relationship end in research, and murders (stereotypes) actually lifts the image of gays in certain aspects, to some extent. Gays and being sissy or extremely effeminate is a harmful stereotype that I think gets dispelled with such criminal machismo, doesn't it? Toxic masculinity, kinda maybe. Also the platonic endings might be romantic, ish. Given that homosexuality is outlawed in most Asian societies (Fire Emblem being a Japanese game). Most of my gay friends are platonic.
Dimitri and Dedue are brothers. There is quite literally no sexual dynamic in their relationship. They are both war orphans who have bonded over deep mutual trauma and shared goals. Its a brotherhood friendship through and through. You've spent too much time online, if you see any poo stabbing subtext here Sir. Not Linhardt though. He calls my Byleth Daddy. Until the timeskip when he suffers completeTwink death.
Can We all agree that most of the characters are bisexual and be done with it? I mean seriously it is so obvious a lot of the characters are bisexually coded or borderline queer-coated that it shouldn't be ignored. I agree if most of your points except one I'm willing to die on this hill on this one Edelgard is 100% queer there's no way in hell she's bisexual I don't care if she's a romance option for male Avatar it still doesn't change the fact that the way she interacts with women compared to men she's one of the gayest characters in the game the only person that does her is Yuri, dimitri and dedue.
Bi people aren't "100% queer"? I wonder what the "B" in "LGBT" stands for, then!😆 More seriously, perhaps "exclusively lesbian" would be a better term for what you meant to say?🤔 (I disagree, by the way, but that's dependent on personal opinion, so you do you.👍)
I appreciate the effort put into this video, good video but also disagree with a ton of the placements as a lesbian. I really don't think Edelgards relationship writing is flat at all with women, I think she has very compelling writing with women and it just is more compelling then any attempt to pair her with men. Feels like a lesbian character who had to be open for a man because avatar sexuality. Also I wouldn't put no evidence of sexuality into straight, I would go like asexual or something for Jeritiza if I was going to ignore paired Byleth ending, which I wouldn't but ya know. Lesbian side of fandom for sure has Beniegard shippers from their supports and Lysethia Edelgard is pretty popular among the BE lesbians. I do think things are there for both pairings.
while Lysithea/Edelgard has its fans, it's pretty much a sisterly bond in-canon. Neither are shown to be attracted to each other and Edelgard treats Lysithea more like a kid sister than she does someone she wants to kiss imo
In Three Hopes Dorothea has a line during an expedition where she straight up says she wants to marry a handsome prince or a beautiful princess, which really was the most explicit queer line in either of the games for me.
Idk, Shamir straight up proposed to marry Catherine in their 3H support xD.
In her support with Edelgard she says she was looking for a Mister *or Miss* Right.
@@wanderlustwarrior oh you might be right, tbh I don't remember too many details from 3 houses
Dorothea's line did not mention gender in the Japanese version.
Instead, the line in Three houses, she desires a female companion in S support.
"I cant put my finger on why... but leonie is the straightest of the golden deer" lmao i think the ending of the 3 hopes shamir paralogue explains it.
I will never recover from how straight the golden deer are 😭
in the words of my friend, "ingrid is the least homosexual blue lion" and "felix is the most homosexual blue lion despite mercedes being able to s support both byleths"
Overall, I really like your observations here and totally agree with them... except Jeritza. Jeritza is probably asexual in all honesty, with his "attraction" being more aimed at getting killed than getting laid, but the fact that he acknowledges that he's falling in love in 3 houses with Byleth of either gender even though they're not killing him is too much to be overlooked imo. Of course they were slaughtering agarthans rather than slaughtering bussy, but it's romantic in a twisted Jeritza kind of way that makes him bi specifically for Byleth imo.
Awesome video though, I just wanted to talk about that one a bit.
EDIT: Just want to reiterate that the main point of this is to say that whether Jeritza is asexual, bi, or deathsexual, he's definitely not straight.
you can be asexual and still experience romantic attraction.(be it straight, gay or bi) those two observations don´t really contradict one another.
I was thinking maybe Jeritza could be a form of demisexual or demiromantic, but DEATHSEXUAL sound metal as fuck so thank you for the awesome new headcanon.
I'm loving so many of these pairings! That Dimidue dialogue though! Wow! 🥰 What a fun and thoughtful analysis! 😄
22:26
You are so right about that. For Edie, Shez was written very much as a dear friend rather than a love interest. I like that take more for them anyways, since Shez shouldn't nor needs to take away Byleths relevance to Edelgard. Shez fulfills their own role in the story and does it well, imo.
I appreciate how much time and effort you spent on this analysis. As expected, it's as in depth as ever.
For Dimidue (and for Dimitri and Dedue in general): I agree that it's far too close to call. Hopes expanded upon their existing 3H canon. But I think Dimitri got way more gay in Hopes, if that's possible, given his support with Yuri, how much more involved Felix and Dedue are in his arc now, plus Sylvain is more focused on Dimitri too. And of course, Ashe is a royal knight now who is always devoted to Dimitri.
For Ferdibert: I agree with your analysis of their different route dynamics. There's obviously a wonderful draw to their CF relationship. But I think their SS "wicked" dynamic is equally fun to explore for the more tragic angle. And of course, can't forget the AU potential where Hubert survived AM with a recruited Ferdinand.
For Ingrid: I'll admit that I would have shipped her and Dorothea based on their paralogue alone, but then I unlocked their support conversation and I felt very uncomfortable. I do enjoy Hopes giving Ingrid ship tease with Mercedes, but I still believe that Ingrid is straight. She canonically loved her fallen fiancee Glenn. Ingrid can also choose to never marry in her solo ending in 3H, focusing on her pegasus knights - but I wouldn't necessarily say that makes her a lesbian. She might even veer asexual in unpaired endings.
Sylvix (and Felix and Sylvain): 3H and Hopes did very well by both of these characters. Honestly, I already loved them both in Houses so I'm glad that Hopes gave them more attention and focus too. Sylvain also has great chemistry with Yuri and Ashe now, and Felix has always had great chemistry with Dimitri (and now with Dedue in Hopes too).
Yuri and Ashe: I'm so happy that Hopes finally gave them a support conversation. I wished they had one in 3H too, and a paired ending. I really liked Yuri's conversations with Dimitri and Sylvain too. And of course, Ashedue is always precious. Ashe is also someone who can easily connect with both Sylvain and Felix too.
For Jeritza: I'm honestly inclined to say that his 3H support conversation with Constance is far more romantic than his support with Byleth. But I do think that canonically he's bisexual regardless. I really wish he had a conversation with Hubert tho.
For Claurenz: ok I'll admit, it's not overtly romantic or sexual. But it's always been my go to pairing for them both. Probably because it pairs so damn well with MariHilda. But Lorenz is definitely straight, and his support conversation with Marianne, Hilda, Lysithea and Leonie all veer way more romantically overall. Lorenz even has a good support with Mercedes in 3H too.
For Rodrigue: I feel like he's the best example of a character who married for duty and responsibilities but who also loved a man from afar. We don't know if it's unrequited, or if Lambert initially married for duty alone. But we do know how important Lambert is to Rodrigue. And their connection has symbolism for their families too: Blaidydd and Fraldarius, Loog and Kyphon, Lambert and Rodrigue, and finally Dimitri and Felix. The shield of Faerghus, indeed.
Although with alphabetical order it would seem Yuri netted the win for 3Hopes, I would like to believe Hopes making Rodrigue playable (and thus exposing everyone to how much of a flame he holds for Lambert) was what tipped the scales in his favor.
I think Hopes tipped the scales in their favor for many reasons. Yuri, Ashe, and Sylvain all got way more subtext overall. Dimitri, Dedue and Felix did too. Rodrigue is playable now. Monica radiates lesbian energy (even if she'd just played for jokes half of the time). Cathmir is practically confirmed again. Linspar even got slightly more romantic this time around. Hopes is just a more fan service game in terms of the support conversations dialogue.
I had no idea when I first decided to go alphabetically how well that would work out, as it wasn't until I was scripting the video that I noticed all the great coincidences that ordering provides: Dedue and Dimitri right next to each other so I don't have to struggle to talk about them separately, Dorothea into Edelgard, Gilbert into Hanneman, Petra as a counterpoint to Monica, Raphael as the capstone of the Deer, and indeed those last four characters who are all such strong wins for Hopes.
One thing drives me insane on this topic is whether or not gay marriage is legal in Fodlan. Byleth explictly marries any of the same gender S supports except for Edelgard, but there are so many paired endings that read like historical queer people making a life together in a place where they can't be out to the general public.
Because same-sex marriage only appears in Byleth's endings I don't take them as worldbuilding commentary so much as the writers continuing to be lazy with Byleth's supports and giving them identical scripts regardless of gender but for a few words swapped out where necessary.
Those aside, I'd say that Dimidue and Doropetra come the closest to being publicly-acknowledged couples because they come with the added visibility of Dedue/Dorothea being in essence royal consorts even if that terminology is never used. For Dimidue in particular, the "like family in private" and Dedue being buried with Dimitri suggest a situation where everyone around them understood their relationship but deliberately avoided putting a name on it...which in a roundabout way says to me that there's no gay marriage in Fódlan, in any scenario that doesn't involve Byleth (and even then it's obviously not because of Byleth as a character but because Byleth *is* the player, and the player gets S ranks).
@@gascon-en-exil Thank you, that makes sense. Headcanon accepted.
A year late to it, but I think gay Byleth can also be read as an exception to any norms as they can end up declared the religious leader of Fodlan at game's end. The other characters are still mostly existing in a power structure with family inheritance, which inherently puts focus on marriage producing children, but the church doesn't work on a bloodline.
How the church leadership works isn't really discussed as it's actually been led by the same person for 1000 years, but that's it's own subject, as is romantic options with characters who are dragons that can reproduce asexually.
I can't believe Claude isn't bi... But you're right... But in my heart he is
Historians would claim that Dedue and Dimitri were just really close friends maybe even roommates but that compilation of them just telling each other how much they "admire" their conversation partner could not be any more gay.
Dimidue!!!!!! Getting analyzed together!!!!!!!!!!! Be still, my beating heart..!
I agree with all your placements for the most part. I think Dimidue especially deserve the “too close to call” category because so much of their interaction in both games was connected to the other? Like Hopes takes a lot of Dimidue stuff from 3H and expands on it (teaching each other their languages, sleeping together in Fhirdiad, always being together) and also a lot of what we see in Hopes just adds some delicious context to Houses (like Dedue’s overprotectiveness stemming in part from Rufus’s attempts on Dimitri’s life)
Lemme tell you, I squee’d that whole section. And my god, that line about leaving Fodlan to be mercenaries together????? Maybe Dimidue was the true Ike/Soren parallel all along
This video was definitely an eye-opener. Here are some thoughts:
Despite Linhardt/Caspar being my favorite non-MC ship for both in both games, I never really noticed that their support lines aren’t necessarily all that romantic. I also never realized just how vocal Dimidue is about their love for each other, and how often they proclaim it. Honestly that entire segment got me a bit teary-eyed. I also never really thought about Monica and Yuri being bad representation. While I do think Monica is bas representation for lesbians, I do think Yuri isn’t. I see the parallels between him and Niles, but to me Yuri is a very valid and relatively common example of a queer man, especially in contemporary culture. I would just really like the developers to further work on theit LGBTQ+ representation and in the next game, make a queer person that looks more like Balthus, to name an example. And really commit to sexualities separate from the MC. Make a woman that can only be romanced by the female protagonist, rather than both. I feel like many MC-sexual characters in Houses are so because their connection to Byleth runs way deeper than simply love (this is the case for Linhardt, Edelgard and Jeritza more so than for Dorothea, Mercedes and Yuri), but it would be really cool to see a lesbian character that can only marry other women, even considering the MC’s gender.
I think many characters that are considered gay, are only mostly attracted to one person. For example, Hapi and Coco share a very deep connection that can easily be considered romantic, but they don’t show any outward attraction to other women. While Hilda is flirty with other women, Marianne is only gay for Hilda, etc.
Why I personally always thought Hopes was gayer than Houses, is that it seems like the developers took every popular queer paring and dialed it up to 100 in the second game. I feel like Marianne, Felix, Catherine, Hapi, Constance, etc. aren’t necessarily more gay in this game, it’s just that their respective same-sex relationship is made more explicit and therefore “more canon”. The exceptions being Yuri, Shamir and Sylvain, who are canonically just more gay than they were in Houses.
As much as it hurts me to say, it is true that Claude is as straight as a ruler in 3H and 3Hopes . I think the only gay "subtexts" he has is with Dimitrtri tbh (that makes me very hapy tho). Ironic that he was my gay awakening.
Anyway , great video!
Tbh I feel like Dimiclaude shippers make it seem like Claude has more subtext with Dimitri then he actually does. Claude doesn't care half as much about Dimitri in 3H as Dimitri did about Claude in AM. It felt almost one sided, if anything, b/c VW Claude doesn't have an arc about helping Dimitri or Fhirdiad at all. But I know Dimiclaude is fairly popular so I think the fans just wanted more interaction than there was in canon.
@@l.n.3372 Honnestly I can't disagree lmao
@@luceena6165
I think a part of me has just never forgiven Claude in a way. I played AM first and I loved how Dimitri helped out Claude and Derdriu. And then I played VW next and was kinda heartbroken at how little this route cared about Dimitri and Fhirdiad. It felt like Claude just didn't care as much and I felt a bit underwhelmed and disappointed. But hey, VW gave me Claurenz so xD
@@bluesky0474
I sorta understand the appeal of Dimiclaude, but in other ways I don't. I just think that they're not very important to each other, and people who falsely think such tend to minimize other characters instead. Dimiclaude shippers sometimes shaft Dedue and Felix, who actually are important to Dimitri, and this makes me angry as a Blue Lions fan. Likewise, Claude cares way more about Hilda and Lorenz and has actual good conversations with them in VW. I suppose I just think it's fine that Dimitri and Claude are only allies by convenience in AM and AG, rather than BFF or more.
I think most Dimiclaude fans ship them in AM and now in AG too. Most of them seem to disregard GW entirely, for obvious reasons. Or they ship an AU of VW where Claude actually does save Dimitri.
@@bluesky0474
Yeah pretty much. They're "allies" in 3H in the sense that they're united against a common enemy (Edelgard, the Empire, the Agarthans).
But they're never playable together. They're never that close as friends either. And they're never important to each other. Claude is only relevant to Dimitri's arc because Dimitri needed to focus on saving the living over seeking revenge for the dead. But Claude doesn't really have an arc in VW anywhere near comparable to this, thus it's never important for him to save Dimitri in turn. And it's obviously fanon exaggerated that Dimiclaude is anything more than passing allies in AM and AG.
Damn how did I not see the fisting innuendo with Raphael and Felix 💀
i love all the work put into this video! there is just one thing i'd recommend changing though and it's the straight box which i feel would be better described as not gay, a lot of the cast you put there can be assumed to be hetero but there's few oddball cases like flayn and lysethia but the main one i wanted to put across is jeritza who i feel has more aromantic bisexual subtext than straight
unrelated side note the dimidue section was so lovely aoeifnobgugbsp 😭
yes a lot of these people aren't gay but that doesn't mean they're straight, Jeritza being the most prominent
Dedue and Dimitri, Felix and Yuri being the longest sections
obsessed with the faerghus Great Gay Polycule and absolutely yuri should be there too
While Monica had some much needed characteristics in Three Hopes, I can't help but feel that she's another one of those characters in love with Edelgard. But then again she's royalty and everyone wants to sleep with a Prince of Princess.
And why can't Dorothea and Ingrid marry when their supports clearly showed the Dorothea in love with Ingrid by the way she was flirting with her?
Great video! loved it!!
Also just wanted to say, while Bernie may be straight i think she has a lot of nice interactions with girls, in her supports she seems a bit more comfortable talking or approaching women, specially in hopes... a lot of her male supports were more comedic while her conversations with Marianne, Edelgard Dorothea and Hapi felt more heartfelt to me,
also in three houses, Bernadetta has gazed at a flower while saying “She’s so pretty, popular…(exhales softly) dazzling…!” about Dorothea and been made to blush by Leonie, Edelgard, and now Marianne too so yea... take that as you will.
its just subtext or even less than that but i thought it might be nice to add :'3
im half way through watching this, but i just gotta say this video is delightful. i keep smiling and laughing, well done
Wow, I did not know that the Knights of Faerghus have so much gay subtext and the men of Leicester being so very straight despite playing both games.
I really appreciate you for doing this. Even though I kinda give up on gay romances in Fire Emblem games in general.
I wholeheartedly agree with your opinion on Claude, I always feel him as a straight guy who opens for experimentation but always ends up with women at the end. It's so sad to see how straight my favorite house in Three House turns out to be.
Fódlan is a queer continent, I stan
As a bi person i love the amount of people you can be gay for in 3Houses/Hopes, even if it's only my own headcannon
I don't know how I feel about your takes on Marienne and Hilda's relationship with each other, BUT I might be biased as The Golden Deer was the first route I took so I could have just been starving for gay content. But I do really think a lot of Hilda's comments (esp what I remember from 3 Houses) skewed flirtatious and authentic in a way that she wouldn't do with men.
I also think Raph and Ignatz could've been SO sweet too without that last-minute "no homo but I am gonna boink your sister," moment.
And while I disagreed with Claude at first, I think you've swayed me. His lack of closeness with even the main character really does feel v no homo, especially with their whole "WE CAN BEAT EVIL WITH THE POWER OF FRIENDSHIP" thing at the end of his path.
As for the other students, yeah I'm in line with all of em.
This could have been 3 seconds by just saying “hopes has Monica” Monica has more gay energy then every other game combined
Just about to watch it, but again, thank you very much for your sacrifice O7
46:42 shit cracked me up 💀 her exuberant attraction to women
I won't lie...the moment the artwork with Claude and Lorenz appeared, I fell for the pairing. Despite never thinking about them as anything else but a "political relationship". Can't pretend I couldn't reread things without purposely reading into it after that, in both Hopes or Houses.
(I honestly don't think there's more to see in Lorenz and Claude's relationship being more of a focus in 3 Hopes than the lack of "Dedue/Hubert" for Claude in the Golden Deer. He technically had Hilda, sorta, but their relationship wasn't nearly as important as Dimitri and Dedue or Edelgard and Hubert. And it's sad to say, but I do feel out from all the Golden Deer, the only real foil for Claude is Lorenz, so him being chosen isn't too surprising.)
Later in the game, the moment the artwork with Claude and Edelgard appeared, I fell for that pairing. Again, something I had never as much as considered.
My conclusion was that, somehow, whoever did the artwork was making me artworksexual...or something along those lines. Because, objectively, I can't even say why those artworks somehow triggered shipping within me to begin with.
You brought up the difference between the Japanese and English versions in your video, and I think it's kind of a can of worms as Sylvain is hardly the only one having some of his supports reading differently (or just the character reading differently period, Sylvain himself is different in many ways as a person between both versions). Multiple supports differ in their potential queer subtexts. For example, Jeritza feels more aroace in the English version more than straight in my opinion, the Japanese version, however, couldn't be farther away. The dude is the closest thing to explicitly sexual.
Just looking at the A support, whereas the English version preferred the more neutral term of "fixation" for what Jeritza feels for Byleth, the Japanese version prefers a phrase that can be understood as being fixated on someone, yes, but more interestingly strongly emotionally attached to someone. The term used to speak of how Jeritza fell under Byleth' spell, in Japanese, has the undertone of "getting attracted, getting charmed, getting captivated". When Jeritza says that he needs Byleth in the English version, what's lost in translation is that the word used has not only bloodthirsty undertones, but also just thirsty period, and generally desires Byleth in both a romantical and sexual way. And all of those words were hardly chosen by accident as at least Byleth can either choose to ask him if he's attempting to seduce or make a move on them (which Jeritza confirms), or telling them they're looking forward to it (Jeritza's sexual need for him being clearly whats nodded at). And if that wasn't enough if you choose the "looking forward" option you have Jeritza telling Byleth to continue polishing their sword arm until then, which in the context means he's expecting a handjob. Honestly, I'm not surprised the localization don't even have anything alluding to this specific part. Personally, it makes me laugh, but, as this can happen in the A-support, I guess it'd be too much for the western mainstream audience. Either way, when Jeritza tells Byleth to not get killed, you again lose the possessive and jealous undertone of his original line. And you're right that Jeritza would have the best orgasm of his life being pierced by Byleth, it's basically what's implied when he's saying he'd be in ecstacy to be pierced by Byleth (literally, for once). It's probably the only part they carried on for the English version of him. And the A-support ends with basically reiterating his possessiveness of Byleth, telling them he won't let them escape no matter what happens (instead of telling them he'll follow them).
Don't get it wrong however, the Japanese version isn't just about Jeritza thirsting over Byleth even outside the S-support, he's actually way more gory in his words too, while being way more polite in his speech patterns. He's pretty much one of the typical otome game love interest archetypes in his way of mixing sex and gore. So I guess for Japan it isn't much of a big deal, but I guess toning him down for the English audience made him fit in better with the rest of the cast. Especially since you can have all the gore talk and barely covered sexual undertones without S-supporting Jeritza. Not to mention, he comes out as more than just predatory in his last line as consent is secondary to his obsession for Byleth. And...well, both the West and the East has a thing with portraying LGB people in a predatory manner. Saying that the character is inspired by an archetype more often used in niche games targeting a female audience wouldn't have really helped either, I fear.
(as a sidenote, the Japanese S support does offer more emotional intimacy in their exchange than the English one, and sex, again, and the voice actor "acts" turned on and impatient anyway, turned on to have sex that is, so I guess their ending is essentially "Byleth is so good in bed Jeritza changed his priorities despite claiming otherwise" or something; again, Im not surprised this wasn't kept in the English version, even if I personally would have been more entertained, though they could have at least kept Jeritza being affirmative when he says he loves Byleth instead of making it a hesitant question)
i need more gay content from you
Great video! It's so interesting that you the Blue Lions feels like the most gay for you since for me it was the Black Eagles first, Blue Lions close 2nd (rip Golden Deer even though its my favourite house). I do agree though in that Dimitri, Dedue, Felix, Sylvain, Ashe & Mercedes are just so gay in their subtext it's insane.
I have to disagree with some of the 'is straight' character readings though since some of them just read as aro/ace/demi to me. Definitely, it could probably be me projecting my own experiences as someone who's demiromantic but is into women (f/f) and surrounds themselves with aro/ace people in same-sex relationships. To use Claude as an example since the other comments have used Jeritza, Claude reads demi-bi to me and his A-supports always feels like the very, very start of an attraction, as oppose to other characters where their A-supports are them declaring their undying love for each other. Claude's A supports always feel like an, "oh! I think I *could* be attracted to them. I definitely care for them and trust them. I want to tell them about the real me and see. " Hilda's, Leonie's, and Lysithea's supports with him comes to mind for this. He reads like someone who knows how to charm people, but in the way that it's a great mechanism to disarm people and deflect questions.
As for the bi part in demi-bi, it's mostly definitely because of Byleth. I honestly don't see Byleth much as a self-insert as they are reserved, with no voiced lines in 3 Houses so we're missing on intonations that would have made an impact. So combine that, the reasoning above, and the intimate conversations between them in VW, Claude just feels like a demi character who didn't have the time yet to fully fall into an attraction with one of the characters with the exception of Byleth.
Sorry for the essay! Anyway, great video!
Did Dedue blush 🥰
Just watched the whole thing. Great video btw. I just had one question. I understand it would be a similar case as to Monica, placing them in the three hopes category due to shez not being in three houses, but I was curious as to the possible subtext in their character and the differences between male and female she since while a player character, she benefits from being fully voice acted and having unique dialogue in their supports.
I'll be honest, I don't think Monica/Shez support conversation offered anything meaningful. Mainly because it spends so much focus talking about Monica's obsession with Edelgard. Monica only cares about Edelgard and a bit about Dorothea. She doesn't care much about Shez either way.
When I first read this I thought you were asking what I'd think of Shez and/or Monica if they had been in Houses. In which case - Shez would probably get so few interactions that they'd still be a write-off (like Byleth in Hopes), and Monica would definitely be able to S rank male Byleth because IS would never commit that hard to an exclusively same-sex-attracted character where Avatar S ranks are on the table (see also Soleil, particularly in the original Japanese). The results then would be the same.
But as to Shez as a character, there really aren't enough noticeable differences in the script based on their gender, and with how open-ended their supports (and the heartfelt letters) are overall it's even harder to get a grasp on what if anything there is worth looking into beyond holdovers from characters who are bi-for-Byleth in Houses, like the Linhardt and Dorothea examples.
It's really interesting that how by your metrics, there's only a 1 character margin. Honestly, they could have written Monica any direction they could have wanted to, since we literally had nothing about her except a few lines saying that she didn't act like Kronya when the latter was in disguise.
I really dislike Monica, not as much as 3 Hopes Claude, but she's definitely up there.
As for any disagreements in particular... I'd probably put Hilda in 3 Hopes, but that's about it.
Bernies here for the aro arces who want to be left alone
oh wow that different pov is interesting to me. i always saw blue lions as the straight house w mercedes n ashe as exceptions n i mainly focused on my lil sapphic adrestian polycule but tht makes sense what you said abt like understanding certain subtext more from experience or w/e but idk i’ll look out for that more in the lion boys when i continue playing
I actually wonder if having a gay relationship end in research, and murders (stereotypes) actually lifts the image of gays in certain aspects, to some extent. Gays and being sissy or extremely effeminate is a harmful stereotype that I think gets dispelled with such criminal machismo, doesn't it? Toxic masculinity, kinda maybe.
Also the platonic endings might be romantic, ish. Given that homosexuality is outlawed in most Asian societies (Fire Emblem being a Japanese game). Most of my gay friends are platonic.
monica is obviously the most straight character in the game 🙄
That Dimidue supercut really took me out just. Man. Man. I hate them this is intolerable
Same... My heart can't take it
3 hopes
Idk, i always viewd leoni as transmasc that hasnt figured it out yet lol
Oh my god
Dimitri and Dedue are brothers. There is quite literally no sexual dynamic in their relationship. They are both war orphans who have bonded over deep mutual trauma and shared goals. Its a brotherhood friendship through and through. You've spent too much time online, if you see any poo stabbing subtext here Sir.
Not Linhardt though. He calls my Byleth Daddy. Until the timeskip when he suffers completeTwink death.
Can We all agree that most of the characters are bisexual and be done with it? I mean seriously it is so obvious a lot of the characters are bisexually coded or borderline queer-coated that it shouldn't be ignored. I agree if most of your points except one I'm willing to die on this hill on this one Edelgard is 100% queer there's no way in hell she's bisexual I don't care if she's a romance option for male Avatar it still doesn't change the fact that the way she interacts with women compared to men she's one of the gayest characters in the game the only person that does her is Yuri, dimitri and dedue.
Bi people aren't "100% queer"? I wonder what the "B" in "LGBT" stands for, then!😆
More seriously, perhaps "exclusively lesbian" would be a better term for what you meant to say?🤔
(I disagree, by the way, but that's dependent on personal opinion, so you do you.👍)
I appreciate the effort put into this video, good video but also disagree with a ton of the placements as a lesbian.
I really don't think Edelgards relationship writing is flat at all with women, I think she has very compelling writing with women and it just is more compelling then any attempt to pair her with men. Feels like a lesbian character who had to be open for a man because avatar sexuality.
Also I wouldn't put no evidence of sexuality into straight, I would go like asexual or something for Jeritiza if I was going to ignore paired Byleth ending, which I wouldn't but ya know.
Lesbian side of fandom for sure has Beniegard shippers from their supports and Lysethia Edelgard is pretty popular among the BE lesbians. I do think things are there for both pairings.
while Lysithea/Edelgard has its fans, it's pretty much a sisterly bond in-canon. Neither are shown to be attracted to each other and Edelgard treats Lysithea more like a kid sister than she does someone she wants to kiss imo