House of the Dragon: The Lord of the Tides - a rambling review
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- Опубліковано 12 вер 2024
- We've got another multi-year time jump and some resulting recasts. This continues to be a sticking point in House of the Dragon for me if I'm being honest. But that said, the stuff that's good this episode is really dang good.
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The tastefulness in this show(like the maid scene in contrast to joffrey and ramsey in GoT) makes scenes like the throne room scene infinitely more impactful. This show is somehow the perfect show to either sip tea or in turn drink beer to in equal parts and I'm here for it.
They should have kept the dark scenes it bring forth human nature which is not moral clean
@@hbsupreme1499 I didn't need to see what happened to the maid though. I got the picture. If too much darkness and violence and is shown on camera it can dull the impact of a more effective and plot relevant moments. Dont need to see every sinful deed myself to believe someones a POS.
@@hbsupreme1499 The gaslighting scene is pretty dark seeing as it’s a woman telling another woman the world won’t believe you. I don’t need an actual scene of a brutal rape to understand a brutal rape happened. The girl’s reaction, in a way, makes it more horrible then seeing the act. As a person who has been raped, the reliving of the violation and never feeling fully clean of it after is way worse and to live in a society where you know you will never get justice would honestly make it way worse. There’s more then enough of the dark side of human nature without having an actress be in a rape scene.
I know people have been comparing Matt Smith's portrayal of the Doctor and Daemon because of the contrasting subject matter (and Whovians pointing out that the Doctor isn't always a good man) But if were talking range, Matt made a name for himself doing a show that always had him monologuing, to a show where he barely speaks and he still commands attention.
what I found chilling about the Queen and the Maid scene was that Alicent has a routine, she has the money, the speech and the abortive tea ready so he has done this several times before, it was horrifying !
the time jumps didn't bother me much because we've had King Viserys' deteriorating health and the kids growing up as a through line. But since we are now in the timeline of the Dance of Dragons now, I'm assuming the time jumps will stop, or at least reduce. I did hear that this time jump will be the last major time jump, so maybe it's the last one?
Also, MY HEART. MY POOR HEART.
Vera has said repeatedly she hasn’t read the books, and they’re right to say that the show should stand on it’s own. Loving these reviews btw!
IDK if you missed it or just forgot to mention it but Viserys did ALL that for RHAENYRA
She came to him and pleaded to him in the night to help her keep the throne he's leaving to her
And he endured all that pain by not drinking any milk of the poppy and walking up to that throne for HER, the director even said that the way the walk was positioned he was basically walking towards her
And he even kept defending her claim till his dying breath and rhaenyra doesn't even know it
I really enjoyed Paddy Considine´s performance in this episode. What an exit for the actor.
This was the most emotional episode in the GOT universe for me. GOT didn’t make me cry, but my whole chest was aching for Viserys this episode and I bawled 😢
Viserys was the LAST rider of Balerion - yes, THAT Balerion. He may not have been a great king but the strength and love he has for his family defined him.
Ser Criston Cole hasn't aged a day. Really enjoying these later episodes of HotD
I did like how they handled the assault.
A. That it was tasteful in terms of filming. The acting from Alicent and the girl was brilliant.
B. The way this one event happened - the confession and Alicent's subsequent confronting of Aemon. It established this as his regular behaviour and laid a foundation about his marriage to be built upon later. It established how Alicent is complicit but not endorsing, and trying to get him to take the responsibility a king needs to. It establishes that Alicent is sympathetic to the victims but not to the point of compromising her son (I did respect her decision, to a point, to not gaslight her about it happening). It establishes how willing her inner circle of staff are to facilitate the cover up. It wasn't a gratuitous event, it was used to estabpish a great many things, whilst dealing with the act sensitively.
Aemond is the eye patch one... The pervy one is Aegon....
@@miss1of2 sorry, my bad
It’s hard being a book reader and wanting to argue a lot of criticisms but can’t because of spoilers
You shouldn’t have to be a book reader to follow the show if it’s a good show it shouldn’t just be highlights from the book. I like that Vera is watching and reviewing reacting from a show-only perspective.
Really liked how they handled the assault, especially because of Olivia Cooke's performance. You can tell it reminds Alicent of her own assault by Viserys. She's realising that her son is no better than his father. It was good to get a litlte of Alicent's POV, which has been sorely missing from the last few episodes. It's probably not a coincidence that this episode was directed by a woman.
This is the last time jump and now we are at the place with all the characters when shit will hit the fan so to say. I see this season as a lengthy prologue where all the chess pieces move in place so the main story can kick off.
Paddy Considine´s performance as Viserys is so so good. I lost my dad March this year and his performance reminded me so much of my dad´s last week. Also everything so well written.
To the point of the maid who was assaulted - it doesn´t surprise that this episode was written and directed by women as well as the episode where young Rhaenyra had her first sex. Very sensible telling.
And I am afraid the maid is dead or locked away.
Just give Paddy Considine his Emmy now.
Good news is no more time skips now, since the Dance is about to begin. 😉
13:48 Vera, did you ever watch "Curtain: Poirot's last case"? This criticism about Infinity Train made me think of that.
Don’t worry too much about forgetting Aemond; even with the one eye he’s the most deserving to be forgotten. REALLY deserving… still got no clue why Vhagar didn’t simply roast his sorry face either, he doesn’t deserve such an awesome old dragon.
I’m going to just assume the old dragon has dementia, because any other reason for picking a twat like Aemond is inconceivable. Especially after she wasn’t keen to burn her immediately-preceding rider, Laena, and he tries to attack her daughters… Actually, maybe the old wyrm isn’t as cool as she seems, I dunno.
Dragons in this series don't give a shit about who you are as a person, it's implied the connection is magical in some sense, almost like fate.
There are examples in the book of dragons choosing really good people as their first riders only to choose a really terrible person as their next and so on.
Dragons are implied to be extremely intelligent but are completely detached from humanity and it's values
@@Gaby-wi4bx Oh don't worry, I get all that; I just really hate Aemond. I hate to try and avoid using more expletive language and insults because I really respect COG/Vera's want of a positive environment and I want to be more constructive.
But yeah, Aemond is terrible. Like, The Worst(TM).
The series is being truthful to the book as a historical narrative. I am 250 pages in (of 700 pages) and it’s gone from Aegon the Conquerer to Viserys's grandfather covering 50 years. So it’s not so much which houses survive or die but how they play the game. I found the last episode difficult to identify the younger characters but recognised Alicents sons as dicks - the elder (played it literally in a window 😂) for one episode by Ty Tennant (yes David’s son). The scene of the Kings walk to the throne was heartbreaking and for the first time this series I had tears in my eyes followed by the jump horror shock of the beheading. Almost there alongside Ned but we had more investment in his character than here. I am not convinced the lord of driftmark is dead which will cause plenty of drama if he isn’t. Paddy Considine is not an actor I know but he showed his acting chops in this episode particularly under the makeup, prosthetics, mask and cgi. I can see Aemund the second son is going to be a real bastard and truely looking forward to episode 9. Will House of the Dragon live up to the climactic happenings of GoT episode 9s I hope so.
Time jumps. I have actually wondered if they would help in Rings of Power, instead of doing the condensed timline. The problem is you would likely have worse issues of who is the son/daughter of this person. You could partially solve it by using the Riverdale approaching of casting the same actor to play the person's ancestor, or in this case descendant. Though not sure there would be anything to get some folks to not hate that show.
As for this show, I almost wish they had slowed things down and expanded out a bit, so maybe we have one jump mid-season and then at the end of the season, similar to what you suggested have a time jump for the last scene that sets up the Sea Serpent getting wounded, which would set up the next time jump for season two.
I believe there will be no more time skips, or at least I hope so
I don’t like the time jumps. Because I would of loved to see the relationships develope between people a lot more then what we saw. But the show is about the dance, the war if you don’t know what that is. So this whole season is just giving us a back story to the dance. If it helps they have made effort to have the Alicents kids wear Doreen and Rhaenyra kids wear black or black and red. And there only really showing 2 boys on the green sides and 2 on the blacks side. So that should help. We will not have any more major time jumps so the characters shouldn’t change actors anymore. The dance will now begin.
Episode 8 is the last time jump so no more recasts.
Only kids and teenagers have been recast which is smart because it visually indicates time is passing.
It will be better on a rewatch of the show.
I've been curious for a long time about this, as someone who hasn't read the books. I've just been running with the assumption that at the rate the time jumps are going, none of the characters currently present will exist in a season or two because of (if not murdered) simply being aged out due to flying through generations. If that's not the case and the cast we've got is largely what we'll be following then that'll be reassuring for long-term engagement.
The previous switch from younger actores to older ones in terms of the kids was done better in my opinion than this one.
I got seriously confused with the switch from Ty Tennant to the new actor for Aegon because to me they look nothing alike and then the new actor for the eldest son seems aged up way too much. He looks like a 35 year old compared to the rest of them.
I agree: they should’ve switched the two Targaryen boys and it would’ve been better.
I'm so glad it wasn't just me having trouble with the changing faces. When Aemond got his eye cut last ep, I actually had a moment of thinking, "finally, a character I won't have any trouble remembering." Then this very next episode I didn't even realize the eye-patch person was him until the dinner scene.
I think that's on you though
@@liul Clearly it's not. It's been a common issue in discussions, and also came up in her video.
i am actually liking it now, its totally about the family as it grows, not those outside of the family, its all about just them at present, we may get a swap out for season 2, where we get to others that stuck their weapons into the storylines. you know when civil war comes, other nations will get involved, new introductions. really looking forwards to what we get, i hope they blow away that last season of stupidity for GOT. This is def a great start.
Buried gays issues aside, this show is slowly winning me over. I kind of share your issues with the time jumps. I feel like only over the last couple of episodes I've been getting the character specificity that I would expect from a show that is mostly a character drama. Now, I'm actually starting to feel invested on Rhaenyra, Alicent and their families. The dinner scene was probably my favorite in the whole season up until now.
Also, I understand that Matt Smith is a treasure and we want him to be on things, and I also understand the limitations of the TV format but the fact that he's the only person that is not getting any older is taking me out of the story. All of the other characters are changing actors left and right, Daemon's own brother looks super old and haggard now and he's just the same handsome man he was when his now wife was a teenager. Call me nitpicky, but I just can't not see it.
Criston Cole being forgotten about lol.
To be fair though older characters like Rhaenys haven’t aged either. They probably could’ve done with a little make up for Matt Smith. We know it wouldn’t be the first time he was made to look older
@@shippendales8543 A couple thoughts. As a cis straight 52 year old, hopefully I have this right. Part of the issue I see is your comment, has yet to appear. So, of the three explicitly gay speaking characters, one was beaten to death, another faked his death so he and the third gay character can be written off, I mean run away together. You don't have to kill characters for the trope to apply.
Another aspect of this is being gay seemed to be the sole point of these characters. With the exception of Laenor, we see almost nothing of the other two except as the gay partner of Laenor. And Laenor didn't have to be gay. He could have been impotent or had some other medical reason to not be able to father children. We get little development of his character, just gay guy who causes the princess to have bastard kids.
Or he could have been gay, but we could have spent more time on developing this storyline and his character. I mentioned above, I wish they had slowed the pace, spent more time with the characters and their stories, had the first time jump mid-season and ended the first season with Laenor's "death" which is partly what motivates his father to go back out and leads to his mortal wound which sets up the time jump we saw today to happen at the start of season two.
If theyvstick to source material, it will be great if you are right, but it still could have been handled better. And the fact that one of the writer/showrunners said he wasn't aware of the trope is troubling in its own way.
@@shippendales8543 I didn't finish the book when I started it back in 2018 and never went back to it, so I'm operating 100% only as a show viewer! If the show will or will not do something in the future, it doesn't change the choices made by the production team for this show and how my judgement of the show is colored only by that. The source material in an adaptation doesn't have to be a cage that the adaptation can't escape.
@@shippendales8543 As an added note as I read the rest of the thread, bury your gays isn't *exclusively* about people dying because they're gay. The heart of the trope is viewing LGBT+ people as more expendable than the cis/straight characters. Now, that is indeed difficult to gauge if the story predominantly features everyone but the lead characters dying, but it's also impossible to give "objective" standards for a trope that is relevant and harmful because of how common it is in media and not necessarily for any given example. What I mean is that almost every specific case of Bury your gays will be open to explanations like the ones you're giving. Most cases of gays being killed will be justifiable for some reason or another. What is truly harmful about this is not what any specific work does, but the fact that there are A LOT of works whose creators *decide* to create in that way.
Is Martin party to blame? Sure! I'm plenty critical of him on a lot of things, even if I mostly like his works. But an adaptation doesn't need to be enslaved to the source material. I know a lot of people over on the internet want exactly that. I think they're wrong. Works can be updated for modern sensibilities, and they can also be rid of harmful things that the original author(s) couldn't have accounted for, especially if said works were conceived decades ago. Not doing that is as much of a choice by the show creators as everything else that goes into adapting a book and crafting it into a TV show.
I thought I was doing pretty good on figuring out who the aged-up kids were. I was confused by an early trailer which looked like Matt Smith in his assassin's cloak with an eye patch. I was wondering when and who got close enough to take out Daemond's eye. Now that I see it was adult Aemond, I wonder. Did the directors cast an actor to look more like Matt than Paddy deliberately? They made it pretty clear who the "strong" boys came from.
this episode illustrates the importance of filing a legally legit WILL....even then there are still circumstances that people can challenge the WILL....like a parent cutting a child out of the Will....the child has a birth right in the US to challenge it
I don't think they did a very good job when it came to the actors playing Alicent's kids. They look nothing like the previous actors. Other than the eye patch there is nothing to suggest who these two characters are.
Alicent and her children and Daemon all still seem like monsters to me and I don't think Rhaenyra is any better since she apparently forgives Daemon no matter what he does.
Yeah the time skips make it feel a bit rushed. I would rather it be two seasons and the 6 year skip occur mid season 2 with a week break
And I'm at the point where I'm watching reviews instead of watching the episode. It's just not my cup of tea after the crap with Alisant. That said, cool review.
Nope your assumptions are totally wrong
Um… ok?
@@BreakRoomofGeeks Please ignore or delete this comment and don’t think anything of it
@@BreakRoomofGeeks please trust me on this
@@Condor-gb1xp eco chamber much, yet again this comment diesnt back there claim
@@hbsupreme1499 What?
You can pirate Infinity train. Surprised you didn't talk about the dinner scene or the ending.
Still think that Rhaenyra's side is just as bad? Aegon S.A.'s a woman, cause he's a creepy perv...but then has a problem with Jacaerys and Helaena dancing (quite innocently), even though he normally doens't give a s*it about her. And Aemond waits for his father to leave, so he can instantly antagonize his nephews, he didn't give a flying eff about that heart-wrencing speech. Menwhile, Rhaenyra, despite being in a very bad situation and REALLY needing Rhaenys' support (who now thinks she murdered her son), she at no point even contemplates ruining Laenor's new secret life by telling her that he's still alive.
I... don't think I've painted either side as "the good one" or "the bad one." Granted I focused on Alicent here because I had more to say about her. Also, did I miss a confirmation that Daemon and Rhaenyra even know Laenor's alive and were in on that? Because my read was that Daemon did legit pay the lover to kill him, and it was him and Laenor who planned the escape. My assumption has been that Daemon and Rhaenyra honestly think he's dead.
@@BreakRoomofGeeks You kind of did...a little, when you said that there's no one to root for, which...fair, that's entirely subjective. But the subtext of the show, the intent of the writers are definitely telling us we should root for Rhaenyra's side. I mean, if nothing else...Jace and Luke are most definitely much more well adjusted and less psychopathic than Aegon and Aemond, that's for sure.
As for the other matter, my reading is that Rhaenyra came up with that plan together with Laenor himself and only then told Daemon to set it up with "ser Boy-Toy". Even if that's not so and Laenor was let in on the plan only later, it was definitely always Rhaenyra's plan. In this episode, at the begnning, Daemon and Rhaenyra are discussing whether they can count on Rhaenys' support or not and he says that, even though she took Baella as her ward, she definitely doesn't like the two of them, cause she thinks they...'un-alived" her son. It was just the two of them, so there was no reason to pretend and maintain a charade. Plus, I doubt "ser Boy-Toy" would have come up with this plan all on his own or that Laenor would have agreed to it without knowing it was Rhaenya's wish. In fact, his lover telling him this would have bascially let him think that Rhaenya and Daemon (or at the very least just Daemon) plan on doing him harm. There's no way he would have let them get away with it.