Myth vs. Reality: Saloon Girls and Soiled Doves
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- Опубліковано 30 вер 2024
- Myth vs. Reality: Saloon Girls and Soiled Doves
Thanks to Kat, Hanna, and Hailey from Old Tucson for their saloon girlocity!
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Well, after months on the trail, back breaking labor in the mines or laying tracks on the railroad, being able to sit and talk to a pretty girl over a glass of beer for fifteen minutes had to seem like Heaven.
I imagine so. Some also married their regulars.
Oh 😏
Quite a bit of time ago a buddy reported that there was a similar situation he witnessed with guys from a Canadian lumberjack camp. The girls did not have to be pretty and one of the lumberjacks took a Bowie knife to his leg in a dispute over who would get the first turn.Some thing seem to be timeless.
Been there , done that , as a sailor in a Liberty port .
Well , I’ve heard it’s the oldest profession BUT Miss Kitty was a saloon gal ! (Also a business owner)
Thanks Santee for keeping the Sprit Of The Old West Alive !
A young cowboy walks into the saloon.
He sits at the counter and notices an old cowboy with his arms folded, staring blankly at a full bowl of chicken congee.
After fifteen minutes of just sitting there staring at it, the young cowboy bravely asked the old cowboy, "If you ain't gonna eat that, mind if I do?"
The older cowboy slowly turns his head toward the young wrangler and, in his best cowboy manner, says, "Nah, go ahead."
Eagerly, the young cowboy reaches over and slides the bowl over to his place and starts spooning in it with delight. He gets nearly down to the bottom and notices a dead mouse. The sight was shocking, and he immediately barfs up the congee back into the bowl.
The old cowboy quietly says, "Yep, that's as far as I got, too."
LMAO.
Yuck!
Now you boys be nice to the lady's they are just trying to work their way through college... another fine episode thanks
Right!
I was stationed at Ft Bliss back in the late 70's. We used to get to Juarez on occasion. Most of the girls we encountered there were working their way through something...mostly our pay. After a while I smartened up and stayed on the El Paso side of the river. Marginally safer back in the day.
I’m not sure how I stumbled across this channel a couple months ago but I’m glad I did. These videos always brighten my day.
Glad to hear it!
I was 3 years into my college degree before I learned that AG didn't stand for Alcohol & Girls. 😊
Wait...it doesn"t????😉
Seriously what does that AG mean
@@eizabethroberts3991 Attorney General.
@@eizabethroberts3991 Agriculture.
Saloons and dance halls still basically exist today as bars and clubs, and while they're significantly different from each other, there are still a lot of similarities: As it was in the Old West, many altercations, whether physical or verbal, still tend happen at these places. While clubs don't employ dancing girls, I can almost guarantee you that there are women there who will dance with people in exchange for payment (or drinks). There are still many women at bars and clubs that will try to get men to buy them drinks, but rather than do it on an establishment's behalf, they do it for free drinks.
Very similar,. Except free drinks don't put food on the table.
Back when we were about 28, at the mall in Cinci, OH, Hollywood Memories was set up doing pics. You dressed up, men & women, in period clothing for pics on a set of varying decors. 2 of three pics survive in my man cave. I was a cowboy with my own vest and faded jeans. she was what was known as a dance hall floozy. The sepia tone/tin type film made the clothing look older.
That's pretty neat!
My wife and I did one of those. I was a gambler with a top hat, which I held and did not wear and she was a dance hall girl standing me, I was sitting, in the period type photo. I was going through stuff after she died and came across that photo. I was sitting there but she had completely faded out of the picture. I didn't know whether to be scared or mad but I can tell you this, it hurt like hell.
@@ArizonaGhostriders I'll have to show them in a video. I have copies of old western paintings too. Like Remington. And a Buffalo Bill poster from 1900!
@@unionrdr Cool!!
It’s 0619hrs MDT. This video has been up for 18 minutes, and has 222 views. Lots of early morning people or sleepless Old Coots watching: which are you?
Morning person heading towards old coot. The videos have gone up at the same time every Saturday since 2016.
***That clears up a lot of assumptions. As always I love the *Hollywood, video clips, and historical photos, Santee.
The ladies in your town, appear to love their role playing.🤗🎉
a great video
👏🏻☺️🤠👏🏻👏🏻
Glad you enjoyed it, Rhonda!
Hey Santee this was a really good video. You really cleared up a lot of misconceptions. You do such a great job of giving us a lot of information in a short time. I look forward to your videos every Saturday and you never disappoint. 🤠
I appreciate that!
Gotta love the saloon girls. Those are couple of talented ones. Excellent episode 😊
Yep!
Thanks again Santee & Co. I was a US Navy sailor and every Liberty port had some sort of bar girl . Reminds me of the song Brandy by Looking glass .
Really? Well, I guess ports are ripe for that money-making venture.
@@ArizonaGhostridersSan Francisco was rife with them, same for New Orleans 😎
@@ArizonaGhostridersAfter a couple months at sea you're ready to talk to a moose
Prostitution is legal in Nye County, Nevada, west of Las Vegas.
Very cool episode Santee! I can hardly wait for the "Dressing the Part" video, especially since you said you weren't going to be modeling any of the outfits! Lol!
Well....wardrobe has a dress....
I don't know Santee, it's be pretty funny to see you try fitting into some of those outfits. I never realized how much more Kitty made than Matt, wow. Thanks for the great new video.
Be safe out there, and take it easy man.
Much appreciated.
This has been the most shocking video Santee has ever done. He actually pronounced Nevada correctly! This Nevadan thanks you from the bottom of his heart. Thanks for the vid!
Our pleasure!
Thank you so much Santee. Always enjoy your videos. Learned a lot of things I did not know about the saloon girls. Have a great weekend. :)
You're welcome, Jim!
Hey Santee , what kind of pistol do you use there . I'm thinking about getting me a Ruger Vaquero . Thanks , have a Great Day 👍
Not sure! I don't think that's even mine.
I do have a Vaquero. Terrific gun. Reliable, strong, and good-looking.
Great episode showing the less seedier side of the seedy side of the old West. The ladies on set were dressed fantastic, a little sassy, and alot of classy. You have a really tough job thar, Pard. 🤠 Hmmmmm. They are never there when I show up. They must know I am in town, I guess. 🧐🤔😊🤣 There is a good book "Entertaining Women" by Chris Enss I just picked up in Tombstone on this very topic i have been reading about actresses, dancers, and singers of the old West. Great read so far and recommend it.
Oh thanks, Joe!
3:36
It's been a while since I've seen Gunless. Might have to go find it again.
It's interesting that dance halls were targeted for closure before the brothels. Might it be because there was more chance of conversation between the customers and the ladies?
Edit: Don't sell yourself short, Santee. The key to making any outfit is confidence.
HAHAH! Well, there ya go. I can pull off a saloon girl outfit.
Thanks for commenting!
These "gentleman's clubs" here in Tulsa have lots of saloon girls that do the exact same thing. No soiled doves though in these places.
ok!
Good video. Have you ever talked about children in the Old West. I remember reading a book called Growing up with the Country: Childhood on the Far Western Frontier by Elliott West. Prof. West wrote also an awesome book called The Contested Plains: Indians, Goldseekers, and the Rush to Colorado.
Not quite yet.
What a great episode. Thanks Santee. I love me those soiled doves. I also love all the views of Old Tucson. I love that place.
Glad you enjoyed it, Ralph!
Santee, Absolutely awesome as always. Don't ever change the way you do your video content because it's Great. Have a blessed week4nd.
Thank You!
Thanks for the history, warts and all.
You bet
These videos always brighten my day.
Good, John!
I was actually at Old Tucson earlier this month. (It was a Monday and you had the day off, otherwise I would have said hi.) I remember giving the bartender an extra $4 so that Dolly could get a drink, as she was talking so much both inside and outside she was starting to sound a little hoarse.
HAHA! Sorry we missed each other.
Girls never wore the facny outfits you see in Hollywood movies. Looking forward to your take on that.
A lot of those were can-can type dresses. However, some photos reveal the dance hall gals did reveal some skin.
Hey, santee, great video. Did the saloon girls look pretty
I think so!
I had always understood that Saloon Girls was a euphemism for prostitutes because "The Code" wouldn't allow movies to portray prostitutes?
Nope. I found newspaper mentions of saloon girls going back to 1863.
Cool! Hard subject to get through, but ya braved it all the way. It’s a bit funny, but all I could think of in both the intro and outro was Russel Crowe chained up in the rain on the steps you were sitting on… Have a great Santeeday!
Glad you enjoyed it!
Worked at a strip club as a kitchen manager/bouncer. The girls still hustle drinks for patrons and sub non alcoholic drinks for themselves!!! We kept a pitcher of chocolate milk in the cooler as well!!! We charged full price to the customer and the girls got a kickback and had a quota of drinks they had to hit!!!
Wow!
Good morning santine. Ted from Texas. I remember going to a Civil War reenactment dressing in Cilver War Clothing. I ran into a group of young ladies at one of the Union camps that was called the camp entertainment. An interesting group of ladies. These were women of the profession that was so cold soiled doves. They even had a Madam working with them I got into a discussion about period dress clothing and it brought a whole new light preferred not to remember. When I see you in person I will tell you about it cuz it was a funny story . Thank you santeen
You're welcome, Tenden!
I was at a Civil War reenactment when I ran across a man dressed like the British Col. Fremantle who was an observer with the Confederates at Gettysburg. Most Civil War buffs know the story and he is mentioned in the movie. The man spent over $800 on the period correct uniform and he said he had a duty to get it right. But what I didn't tell him is that Col. Fremantle wasn't wearing his uniform at Gettysburg because he didn't want to give the impression that the British were picking a side. Of course I didn't tell him that. After spending that money and his dedication to "getting it right" there didn't seem any point to it and him walking around dressed like an English aristocrat roughing it would have flew over everybody's head anyway.
@@tomjackson4374 . Over the years I spent a lot of money on my Civil War uniform. I tried to get it as correct as possible . I think I invested well over $1,000 for everything. And of course sidearms to go with it. But at that point I decided I needed a real Civil War piece to carry. That put a dent in the bank account. An 1860 Colt made in 1863
@@ArizonaGhostriders were the prostitutes racist or did they have sex with any man that paid well?
Now I'm wondering if that old story is true of a man in Nevada during the silver rush selling viewing rights to lady's undergarments without the lady in them.
Maybe! Never heard that one.
Thanks for the education. Once again preconception don’t stand up to reality.
Yep
Nice video Santee. I most say some very beautiful scenery there where you work! 🤠🇺🇲
Thank You!
Another great video! Yeah, just say no to the dancehall garb, that looks much better on the ladies 😎
HA!
Great episode Santee! I always enjoy the dance hall show at Silver Dollar City! Have a great weekend! Nice job you have working with all these pretty saloon girls!❤
Thanks 👍
This video didn't disappoint. None of them do.
Aww, thanks.
I bet they needed to get paid well to buy bright dresses. Interesting. I never knew about soiled doves.
Glad you learned somethin'
Didn't a lot of school teachers from back east take up the trade?
Some, and also widows.
Now you know where the money wend at the end of a trail!?!! 😊😉🤠
Yep
After 90 days up from Texas frankly the first dove I saw better not be offended by my lack of bathing!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!🎉🎉🎉🎉
LOL!
It wasn’t that long ago that Deadwood SD still had legal prostitution…
Yeah!
Reminds me of the hostess clubs in Japan.
Oh yeah, it does!
Santee.... you do a dangerous job, I thought at one point that you were going to get slapped.............🤣🤣🤣
Not yet!!
_"Hello, Dolly!"_
I had to, Santee. I predict this video will get more views than usual.
Why? No reason. One video is as good as another. Just a wild guess. 🤠
Thank You! HA!
😆
Makes me yearn for a cold beer and some company 🤠🍺🍺
🥃🥃
Dolly is.........very intellectual. Yes, I would buy her a drink. And then another, and another.....
🥃🥃🥃🥃🥃
history versus hollyweird is fun
It is!!
Hey, what movie was that with Burt Reynolds? 🤣👍
Best Little Whorehouse in Texas
Attaboy!! San T!! It's usually all about the BENJAMINS!! 'Sides, ole Bessie or Lady Bahbahwah done stole them cow-poker's hearts, sose, no way they would cheat onem with town trash!😅😅😅.
😅😅
Things haven't changed a bit...
Except they may smell better now.
Alright Santee, which class would you put Miss Kitty from Gunsmoke, be careful how you answer it, she's got a lot of friends.
She was the proprietor of the Long Branch, wasn't she? So...she was a good lady!
Excellent history lesson as always Santee, have a great week.
Thank you very much.
Thanks for the video Santee!!! Was this filmed at Old Tucson or Mescal Movie Set? Thanks again.
Old Tucson movie set.
Grow day Santee…
Another excellent video… thanks for all you do in making these videos…
My pleasure!
They ain't soiled, only slightly dirty. Great topic, my friend, keep em coming. 😅
But "Slightly Dirty Doves" doesn't roll off the tongue.
Hi there Santina! I discovered your channel about a month ago.
I've been a huge fan of the wild west since I was a child.
I've also been a huge fan of fantasy.
So recently I started writing about a monster hunting gunman.
Are there any places besides your channel you'd recommend for someone looking to make the gunman, and wild west side a bit more based in reality.
History books are good.
Arizona Ghost Rider can I ask you a question. I have not been able to find out anything about this anywhere.
When I grew up we had a lot of antiques and guns and swords etc and one of the rifles had a broken stock that I was told was broken during a fight with the Indians. My family was in a lot of historical events etc so this was just normal in our house but this rifle had a brass plate that was under the stock just in front of the trigger guard and it had engraved cursive writing on it. There was an initial and a name as I remember with a number under the name. I don’t remember the name but the number I think was maybe 147?
I was told the story of this rifle just like the story behind everything else we had and they called it a:
Brass block Indian rifle and they told me that when Indians were given a rifle (on the reservation?) the rifle was assigned to that person and they logged it? I assume in a register of some sort?
Do you know anything about this?
Thanks for any information you can give me about this.
I don't know, but please go over to the 11BangBang channel and ask them. They may know.
Great video Santee and I always enjoy learning something new with you. Thank you so much.
Glad to hear it!
I guess that was a hard way to make a living but if you have to eat you do what you have to do. From the pictures of the original girls your girls are a damn sight prettier. But if you been on the trail for three months you take what you can get.
I imagine you know a lot of western history. Did you ever hear the story of the gunfight between a madam and one of her girls over a man? I bet you have. This happened in Denver in 1875. The altercation started when Kate Fulton, a soiled dove, got into an argument with her Madam Mattie Silks over a man named Cortez Thompson. It seems Kate thought Mattie was stealing her man and took exception to it. How you steal a man from a prostitute is beyond me. They fell out into the street, both pulled out derringers, and blasted away. But the only person who got shot was Cortez and after both girls had expended their ammunition they fell to fisticuffs. Kate got a broken nose and left town. I guess Cortez wasn't any good after he got shot. I have read that story in about three places and saw a video about it and then I found out that ain't exactly what happened, but why let the truth mess up a good story. I mean they cudda got eat by a T-Rex.
I'll cover that history one day.
First I've heard of hurdy-gurdies (the instrument) in the old west! Now that I have learned something today I can relax and have a beer!
Yeehaw!
SANTEE WATCH IT !! WIFEY WILL FIND OUT !! SHE'LL START CARRYING A BIG STICK !! ANOTHER GOOD ONE !! ADIOS SANTEE
🥃🥃 LOL!
Very much appreciate you NOT modeling the dance hall clothing. Good call. 👌
🥃🥃
Thanks for the video. Hollywood has a nasty way of colouring historical events, and the wild west is no exception.
I totally agree!
Santee there is nothing wrong with moonlighting at night to earn an extra part time income.
Plus trying to dress up as a saloon girl would surely give an appreciation of just how much went into just getting dressed/made up to impress the men.
I know in a lot of dance halls the girls were German. They were also chaperoned by an older German couple who resided with the girls.
Yep
I wonder how many customers at the Dance Hall would try swapping the glasses, drinking the tea while hoping to get the girl a bit looser with the whiskey!
🥃🥃🥃
I was going to say that you needed to explain what a 'soiled dove' was, but after watching the video, I guess you don't need to!
Fallen Angel and Painted Lady are also names they had.
Whoa Nelly... Great job Santee👍😉🆗🤠
🥃🥃
Another great episode, Santee! Definitely need to make it down to Old Tucson some time.
Please do!
Why is UA-cam hiding your videos? I am subscribed but you don't show up.
I haven't heard of anyone else having that problem. Maybe hit the notification bell?
And yet another good one!
Thank You!
Soiled doves? Thats a new one to me 😂
Fallen Angels, Scarlet Women, Painted Ladies...how about those?
Ok make it a few new ones I've never heard then 🤣
That deal if buy the girl a drink is still widespread today…and not just in the U.S.
It is.
No surprise things get rowdy. Alcohol & gunpowder are already a terrible tasting combo but throw in hormones & emotions....yeah it's gonna be bad
Oh yeah. Powder keg!
I've seen plenty of "saloon girls"....... in Korea in the mid 90s. Same concept as described in the video really. Only they were called "Juicy Girls", by virtue of the name of the non alcoholic drink they would get bar patrons to buy; and they were far more expensive than your beer. These girls would engage in conversation, sit on your lap, push all your buttons, and, that's pretty much all they did. Aside from dance on stage to music. In years before my time, they may have been called "Go Go Dancers". There was the rare exception that had a side hustle, but they weren't technically "soiled doves". Seems to me, by whichever name you want to call them (bar girl, saloon girl, juicy girl, etc) they might be the worlds second oldest profession.
Interesting.
2:07 Is this where _"...my dance card is full."_ comes from?
Around the same time period, but those were for balls or other social dances.
I quite like the idea of the Myth but did see the reality in Rawhide AZ....😁
You did?
I’m sure Bill Brazelton was hard to pull away from the dance hall.
It was.
From about 5 years ago until now(at least when I found the channel), it’s still apart of my Saturday routine! I’m amazed with how many topics you’ve covered in that time, yet never did anything twice! Many thanks, Santee!
Thank you, Andrew. Much appreciated.
I look forward to your videos each week. Thank you & keep up the good work. 🙂
Appreciated.
Prostitution should be legal in all states. If a man and a woman want to enter into a private contract, money for sex, it isn't the state's business.
It should be taxed and heavily regulated, but legal.
Great episode, Santee!
-Desert Rat Rick
I wonder how it would go over in today's society?
@@ArizonaGhostriders Those of us who are Libertarians would love it!
I'm glad it's legal in Nevada because the money the state gets from it is part of the reason we barely have any taxes
@@adepja I bet!
I'm pretty sure you know what was involved lol
🥃
Great bit of history and thank YOU for not doing the modeling
No worries
very interesting, another awesome job thank you
Glad you enjoyed it
Great job Santee, Bill Brazelton might make some extra drinking money with a BUSTLE on...Wink WInk .
My eyes!!! My burning eyes!
@@ArizonaGhostriders L O L
I wonder how many seamstresses were thought to be prostitutes
Interesting question...
THANKS
You're welcome.
I'd never heard of the phrase Soiled Dove before today.
Glad you learned something! Here's some others: Fallen Angel, Painted Lady, Scarlet Woman.
Santee if you model the clothes
not only will i be forever scarred the world will spin bacwards and come to a stop and then ill forever call you you sandee
🥃 LOL!
Very interestingly informative and inspiring video, I really liked and enjoyed it, I got a lot more inspiration for my old west frontier inspired, lost hidden history inspired, esoteric philosophy , spiritual science and metaphysical video games inspired mythos-archive project' Mysteriarch Mythos: Pixel Pioneers and the polygon realms.
I once again learned even more about the old west frontier, great job, well done and keep up the great work.
I'm definitely going to be adding some dance halls and saloons to the old west frontier island of Tabbantha Isle in my mythos world.
Today I'm working on writing about a artifact in my stories called the Dos Cuneiforum.
I'll be getting further story inspiration from ancient world maps, the pre adamite world and lost history as well as hidden history.
Glad you got something out of it.
@@ArizonaGhostriders thanks.
I just got done getting story inspiration from videos on deep mythology and occult lore and knowledge for my stories and mythos world, which im sure was all allegorical, metaphysical and metaphorical and I'm pretty sure I didn't comprehend a single word of it.
Now I'm getting further inspiration from ancient world maps, hidden lost history and esoteric philosophy, lore and knowledge.
I think I've already fallen down the forbidden knowledge,mythology and conspiracy theory rabbit hole with the videos I just watched.
😨 *Screeeeechhh!_**_______* Santee!! I thought this was a "family friendly" channel?! 😂
😂 Parental guidance is suggested.
😆😆
@Santee. Interesting. Oh, and a critique, and please don't take it the wrong way, but when your intro goes 50-seconds into a video that is only 5 minutes long, I think your intro is too long.
Thank you for your opinion.
intro was only 34 seconds long
Make them drink then we will speak about the rest 😏
Right! LOL!
That was very interesting. I never knew about dance hall saloon girls vs prostitutes. I always though they were the same thing. Makes Miss Kitty's character in Gunsmoke more relistic.
Yeah, she was really a saloon owner and ran some hostess gals.
Your awesome and awesome video be safe out there
Thank you! Will do!
Oh God! I just imagined Santee dressed at a soiled dove! Shoot me now, I can't bare the suffering! Maybe I can stick a toothbrush with clorox bleach on it into my ear and scrub my brain to remove that image out of my mind! 😱😱
Another great video Santee. Keep em coming pardner. 🤠
JT
HAHAH! I used to have the legs for it.
@@ArizonaGhostriders
Some say you still do! 🤣🤣
Have to use a weedeater to shave your legs.@@ArizonaGhostriders
Good video, Santee. Some fine movie clips
Thanks!
No lady dinosaur for T-Rex?
We are still looking.
Oh come on who else is going to wear the yellow apron 😊
Mountain man
Yeah!