Synology REQUIRED HARD DRIVES - Everything you need to know
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- Опубліковано 7 сер 2024
- This video goes over everything you need to know to tell if you Synology requires any hard drives, or just synology branded drives. This also goes over what the experience is, especially in regard to the new DSM 7.1 update.
#synology #NAS #HardDrives
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You shouldn't go "back and forth" on how you feel about Synology forcing hardware choices on users. All they would have to do to protect their users is to display a big warning during installation but then accept the hardware and operate as normal. Keeping a list of recommended (tested) drives would be sufficient. Issues due to incompatible firmwares should be extremely rare and Synology cannot even guarantee fault-free operation even for their Synology-branded drives. If there were a foolproof method to avoid firmware bugs, everyone would use it! Make no mistake, this is about making money, not about keeping users safe, as the latter could easily be achieved without enforcing certain hardware. Synology's past practice of flagging volumes as "critical" was unacceptable and the current "warning" approach is not much better.
I think the difference is they recognise that they should not allienate the Home User or Small/Home Office Market with this constraint, and are now (more lightly) applying pressure to have larger (probably managed) Enterprise installs use their drives. Increased vertical integration and increased ongoing cashflow on hardware which is often a once in a few years purchase.
@@michaelrobinson9643 It alienates me as a home user if a company uses questionable business practices regardless at what level it does it. It is not unlikely that if Synology sees this working at the Enterprise level that the next lower tier will be next to receive the same treatment, and so on.
This sleazy approach is introduced by synology at the worst time. Competitors are becoming more numerous, and are turning towards the consumer by introducing high-speed net and usb ports, flash storage units, allow installing custom OSes without giving up warranty. Synology is attempting vendor-lock, profiteering from it massively (I mean, just look at their high-speed network card and memory prices), actively hindering use of third-party USB network adapters (which is probably one of the two reasons why they're not including fast USB ports on their systems, the other being "it's cheaper and they'll still buy it, cause we rock").
exposing all of this is a good thing, thanks. This video was posted one year ago. I just bought a DS423+ and had no warnings about the 4 drives i put in it that are not in the compatibility list. I started running it with DSM7.2 so I guess more changes happened.
Think they’re taking a cue from the large enterprise players such as Dell. Only difference is when you pay an absurd amount for drives from dell, they come with a support contract. When the drive fails you will have someone at your doorstep with a new drive in X hours to replace it. Synology does not have this
Edit to add:
Wonder if their intel-based 6 bay, the XS model fits your description. I really hope so but I feel it will also require their drives at some point
I'm fine with recommended drives with some additional features, but not validating external drives even a few main brands means i am not even considering Synology
Don't forget, the synology drives are #3 rated Toshibas at TWICE the price of #1 & #2 rated WD and Seagate.
Twice the price for third rate, and no benefit.
08:53
DATAHOARDERS: "AM I A JOKE TO YOU?"
I had a series of IronWolf where the swapped the versions of firmware to a non-tested version so some drives are working and others same model don't offer the IronWolf tests. I'm running Exos in the main unit. But with the firmware its not like they were updating other firmwares anyway
Thanks for clarifying this for us.
So to be clear... If I get 1522+ or 923+ and put Ironwolf 8TB which IS on the compatibility list, I would not get orange warning and everything will be green?
If Synology hard drives weren’t so expensive I wouldn’t have a problem with this but Synology branded hard drives are double the price for the same capacity WD Red or Seagate IronWolf drives
Yeah, when they first came out they were only ~$50 more than the equivalent ironwolf pro. They were no big deal then! But since then the ironwolf price has dropped by almost 50% and the synology hasn’t moved!
Thanks for the update.
Question:
Does Synology prefer the use of Synology (Toshiba) HDD in the 8 Bays or less units even though other approved brands are recommended?
My recommendation is for people who have the option between synology and another brand, and they are the same price then go for the Synology. They will just work, and you don’t run into an issue if you have to go to support
@@SpaceRexWill thank you for your advice.
As I always say it, you have the best beard! Haha Love it Mr. Space Rex! :)
I'm beginning to second guess the ordering of a four port Synology NAS/DAS
They don't do DASes, though, iirc
Otherwise agree
Hello everyone!🙃
I want to order DS1821+ and 4 exos x18 18tb drives (ST18000NM000J) and on my suprise they are not on compatibility list...
Will that work?
Will I have red, orange or green warning?
Thank you for every answer. ❤
Thanks. A couple of small questions, please? Does the 8-bay rule for using Synology’s drives relate to using say a 5-bay Expansion Unit, such as the DX517 linked to a regular 4-bay main, such as 918+, or are these intended to operate with separate storage pools? I’m thinking of getting an expansion unit to add storage but am unsure how the storage pool operates with that example. Or is the bay-rule limited to 'big' units? Secondly, is the Synology drive a solution to the SMR / CMR drive problem that surfaces a few years ago? Love the vids!
The bays are only internal ones. Meaning an 1821+ with both expansions can use any drives still
@@SpaceRexWill Thanks!
The way they price their expansion units, for a home user it's perhaps worth considering getting a second nas instead. Then you can either separate data between the two NASes or relegate the first to backup the second
Any idea whether the expected DS1823+ will support WD & Seagate drives? I have a DS1817+ and am looking to upgrade soon.
They will. Possibly not officially on the comparability list, at least not at first. But 8 bay NAS and below will only give a single warning, then work perfectly
I just started looking at a new NAS after many years using Synology and found out about the whole Synology hard drive mess. I wouldn’t have even considered looking for a different brand NAS had it not been for this, but aside from building my own there really aren’t that many good choices. Qnap and Asustor were two I might consider buying but they’ve both been hit with ransomeware more than once in 2022 (at least Qnap has) so what does that leave around the same price point?
Honestly the other option is going to be trueNAS as they dont have a web portal so really dont get public facing ransomware. Luckily synology has backed off on the drive requirements to now just being anoying
Anyone out there running a DS 2422+ (12 bay) with Exos drives in it, that can tell me if DSM 7.1 or higher is showing yellow drive warnings?
I took delivery of a DS923+ yesterday to replace my dated DS413. The change was prompted primarily by the added features of DSM7.x. I also intend to use the existing 3TB WD Red drives currently in the DS413, as they are only 3 years old. I use the NAS in a private environment.
As a 923+ could potentially be a 9-bay unit, I am uncertain, whether this upgrade will actually work as planned. I certainly would not put up with the new "certified-drives-only" policy and return the new diskstation immediately. My system is currently backing up to try the switch tomorrow. This outta be interesting...
what is you have extensios bays? like DS1621+ and a 5 bay extension for example.
It’s just 9+ drives in the head unit.
No excuse for lock-in, they make the software, they can fix drive compatibility issues if a drive has a firmware change. Not showing SMART info is criminal.
If they make it hard, I will switch to other brand. Since both are painful anyway. Maybe I should start learning about TrueNAS just in case.
Do all the DS (non enterprise) models only bring up a warning once and operate as normal without any warnings?
Except for the ones with 12 or more bays OR xs units
@@SpaceRexWill thank you so much for your reply! Just one more thing, the warnings seem permanent on the xs models. DS models such as the 1522+ will only show an initial message on setup only?
I think you need to make a t-shirt with the words "And so..." on it 🙂
Still even if it doesn't affect us.. no one wants to support a company that does this. This a huge change for such a small problem.
"Compatible drive type" indicates drives that have been tested to be compatible with Synology products. This term does not indicate the maximum connection speed of each drive bay." This is the note showing on the Synology site specifically for the RS422+. This is a major issue to me before when I am still deciding for an upgrade from my old DS218+. I have recently watched your videos on hard drive and I have already decided to go with EXOS. However, when checking on the compatibility of the RS422+, EXOS were not listed. Not even Ironwolf Pro. Ending, I went to the compatible listed drive (Ironwolf) just to make sure I don't encounter any notification about my drive as it will be a critical storage for me for family files.
Synology is dead for me. This is only for making money. The Synology drives is soooo more expensive. In Greece is double or triple price!!! Thanks Synology for all this years. Time to say goodbye
@SpaceRex ... OT post and I don't know how to contact you with subscriber requests of your channel :D
I wanted to ask you if you have done or could do a Video on using a Synology NAS as a personal Cloud? Including in such:
1. NAS configuration and ROuter config to have access via:
a. Synology Connect,
b. DDNS (or whatever is needed) to connect externally via WAN without using Synology account.
2. PC, Mac, Ph setup to sync files/photos and such, and just access remotely via webpage.
3. Security considerations to manage with open path through WAN and exposure of NAS.
I think this would be super useful as many of us at home could use it to replace a subscription based product like dropbox, Google drive or OneDrive (which has such a crap user interface).
It suck and they should stop doing it. It is making me doubt my next upgrade will be a synology (for the first time since 2014)
Time to say goodbye to Synology my friend. This is so wrong... Tottaly Unacceptable
Requiring own brand hdd’s in enterprise storage solutions is normal practice and providing Synology don’t enforce it on their home/soho equipment I’m ok with it.
I like idea of Synology HDDs, the only issue is price. After negative experiences with main brands Seagate, WD, the HDDs market is a bit oligopolic. If i would be able to buy Synology HDDs and SSds for fair price, then i would not even think about any other brand for my Synology NAS.
Yeah, they just did not come down in price with all the other drives! They used to be like $50 more, which was fine. But now, they are almost 2x the price!
Hey there. I’ve taken your advice on a lot the setup processes for my synology diskstation DS1520+ DSM7.0
I’ve used some mismatched drives and everything seems to be working okay. Here’s my problem: I had 2x12tb, and a 8tb as my third. Btrfs, SHR No problems.
Then I added 2x16tb to the pool. Took 3 or 4 days to initialize the new drives - no problems.
Since I’m only at 19% capacity, I though pulling that old 8tb would be cool.
Everything works but now I get nagged that my whole volume is “degraded” and I have “1 insufficient number of drives” since I pulled the 8tb.
I thought it would just re-index and be fine but it’s still nagging me.
Can I just ignore or do I face potential loss?
Thanks man!
Right now you have no data protection. If you loose 1 drive all of your data will be gone
@@SpaceRexWill ugh. I reinserted the other drive and I still have “degraded”status. I guess I just have an expensive JBOD. 🥲
You now need to hit “repair” on the storage pool
@@SpaceRexWill yeah that didn’t work either. Thx
I had a similar issue. I had a drive fail on bay 1. While on the phone troubleshooting with Synology tech support, I was specifically told not to move a drive from a different bay such as #2 into bay 1. I hung up the phone and did it anyway. Doing that degraded the volume on that drive. I had to do a complete rebuild of my volumes when the replacement drive was delivered. Be careful !
Love the video. Synology is maturing. Apple did the same thing. Who remembers Radius Macintosh clones? These decisions are made for product brand protection and market pressure. We will continue to see movement on the storage compatibility list. As for using SSH to mod the list. Yes it works, but I can't emphasize enough that all the risk and penalty fall on your shoulders. Also the list will need to be changed after every DSM update.
What do Mac clones from the mid 90's have to do with anything? I'll spell it out for you: NOTHING.
How on earth is Synology "maturing" by requiring buyers to by Synology branded drives? This is just trying to squeeze every penny out of customers to please stockholders.
@@christopherjames9843 I was just referencing the business decisions companies make. In the case of Apple they opened their closed hardware system. This is the opposite of what Synology is doing by closing the drive hardware. Apple had a lot going on and decided to return their hardware to a closed system. Is it really about making more money? Yup it sure is. So as Synology matures as a company we will see these product lines develop. Open and closed compatibility lists.
@@christopherwood2290 Yes Synology is maturing. We all are maturing, some for the better and some for the worse. I do agree profit is a driver of these decisions.
@@JD-go1nq Just because there were Mac clones doesn't mean Apple opened anything up. Macs were always 100% proprietary hardware design.
Prosumers and Enterprises are inherently different, with much different use cases. They should be treated accordingly. Synology would be willingly giving up a good share of consumer/prosumers if they force us to buy expensive Enterprise drives. For now, I can handle the one time warning as long as they leave me alone and stay out of my wallet. I’ve invested enough in 3 NAS’s and 3 Routers. I need less expensive drives, memory and cache. JMHO 😁
BTW … Tutorial Suggestion … Using Tailscale to set up local to remote Synology NAS’s for scheduled offsite HyperBackups. 😎👍🏻
It's not about buying Enterprise drives. It's about buying overpriced Synology drives.
@@BoraHorzaGobuchul This was over a year ago. Actually now it’s both. They started by cutting the drive options on the plus series, allowed enterprise drives on XS and RS NAS’s, Then started adding their high priced drives. I think doing this for prosumer devices is anti consumer and will cost them in the long run. Instead of learning this they doubled down and let you use NVMe as storage “only” if you buy their expensive low capacity drives. All bad policy to me.
Can we use WD Blue SATA SSD instead of HDD.
The rule is the same for SSD’s as it is for HDD’s
i was thinking about getting Synology DS1522+ , but now im worried that any drive i put in it wont work...
The 1522+ does not have a drive restriction other than drives with known issues (not BS marketing, drives that actually have issues) Pretty much any drive will work with it just fine.
@@SpaceRexWill when i say any drive, i wasnt specific, I am referring to ANY NON NAS type drives.. I have several NON NAS type drives laying around like 3TB seagate barracudas and those are not NAS drives.. just plain desktop drives.. but would see a good use to them in a something like a 1522+
Problem is, when people get hungry, they tend to continue on that path. So now they show a warning, next thing you know with the next dsm update they'll start artificially reducing functionality and blaming it on poor non-synology HDD firmware, and if left unchecked, in a decade they'll send out hit squads to customers who don't buy their drives. In exaggerating, of course, but still.
@@BoraHorzaGobuchul synology claim of non synology drives or firmware is dumbest shit ever, synology does not make drives, they are either seagate or WD or Toshiba, the moment they start making sure only their drives work, will be the moment people will start going to asustor or others like that. I bought a synology a DS1815+ with 8 , 8TB drives NON synology drives, and work perfectly fine. even with the latest DSM.
The oh you're just missing SMART data excuse by them is lame, pure cash grab, I'm fine with limited warranty support but actively hobbling 30+ year old features because I prefer another brand of drives is insulting. Also the big red or yellow statuses depending on version and model are excessive, just do like they used to and pop a message saying this drive is not tested and no warranty until you fix it. Another message for drives tested as incompatible with stronger messaging is also fine since they're not blanket saying no but have actually verified it doesn't work or causes issues.
Time to say goodbye to Synology. All of that is VERY INSULTING as you very well said.
@@G.Menounos yeah I'm running 3 units and I'm keeping an eye out for what will replace them when the time comes. Removing almost everything from USB support was aggressive too (especially if I wanted to just hand the ports over to a VM that knows what to do with specialized devices like say a smart home controller or a scientific instrument)
I’m sorry but I have several 12TB drives and it won’t allow be to add them to a volume.
Thanks for the elaboration on the compatibility issue! 💪
Glad it was helpful!
On my DS1621+ with 3x8 TB IronWolf Pro in raid5 DSM 7.1. the HDDs are fine, nothing critical.
This was only with a specific one of the drives, and a specific firmware that effected the units. It only happened to one person I know directly
In Australia there is a 40% premium for synology drives
That is not desirable, but it's not horrible either. I'm in US. I am considering getting ds1522+ and I was looking at drives just now. Synology 16TB $609 Toshiba enterprise 16TB $260. That's a 134% premium for essentially the same drive. One just has custom firmware and a different label on it.
Thank you for your honesty..... it goes a long way in trusting advise👍
Has anyone heard any rumours about when Synology will release a 20TB drive? I know they just announced an 18TB.
A 20TB drive would be LOUD.
Who cares. It'd probably cost in the range of $1000 - $1200 for a single drive. ASININE.
Seagate firmware comparability issue with Synology NAS units,…..see, this is why we can’t have nice things people. Thanks Seagate.
Can't say that I'm happy with Synology's storage requirement. Up until now I've had nothing but good things to say to clients about them, but this will change things. You mentioned something about a firmware issue with Seagate drives. Some detailed specifics are really needed to know what is going on under the hood. I really want to know what actually happened and why. I remember when HP did this sort of thing with the 9000 and 3000 lines. But there was a big difference though... HP engineers would come in house on their dime when a drive needed a firmware upgrade and perform it themselves. But this high handed posture is a big piece of why I don't work with HP gear any more; my HP clients dried up. As for Synology's compatibility list... I can understand an initial warning when building a volume, but nothing more. Looks like time to look deeper at TrueNAS. I haven't worked with ZFS in years, but it's just as good as BTRFS.
I bought an old unit just because this hd issue
Great summary
Considering how critical data protection and performance for the enterprise and prosumers, I really wish Synology will make transition to ZFS instead of limitation-bound Btrfs.
Ref your 9+ bay remark. I have 12 bays and no Warning on Volumes.
I have DS3622xs+ running 7.1.0-42661-1 with Seagate Ironwolf (non Pro) drives and one quite old HGST (All 4TB). I have SMART data however have no Ironwolf data.
I have NO Warning associated with my Volumes.
I have verified on the Synology page that my drives are NOT on the compatibility list.
I have an 8 Bay Synology Unit that is only on DSM6 at this time so can't use that for any checks.
So thats the confusing part. As far as I can tell RS/DS does not matter. The only thing that matters in number of bays in the main unit (not including expansion bays)
@@SpaceRexWill I wonder how they treat NAS+Expansion?
Might be more cost effective for some to use a 4-8 bay unit then expand, instead of a 12+ bay unit?
or now you can really just get the unit, and put your own drives in and deal with it
Problem is, they can introduce their "non-succinct drives can kill you, be scared" policy at any time to any device if they feel like it. And since it's obviously the path they chose, I'd be wary of that
:( I just spent days trying to decide on a NAS and now I realize that there is only 1 very specific 16TB model they show as compatible from Seagate. and with a specific firmware that I can't even search for. Absolute crap. wow. One Pro, better 16TB version that is for NAS from Seagate that I like isn't on that list.
You can just put any SATA HDD and it will work fine
@@SpaceRexWill thanks for the reply. I think they have to make this clear if that's the case, especially for newbies. There's already so much to consider and learn, and not wanting to mess up while picking certain hardware is stressful enough. I ultimately ordered a QNAP unit with the drives that I wanted and got a reasonable deal for the storage space.
@@YouGleItbut they don't want to make it clear, that's literally the intent - play mind games with customers to nudge them towards their overpriced own-brand hdds.
Ok so question, I was about to buy a 1821+, and Ihave Exos 18 drives already... that I wanted to put in this one. Yay or nay? Cause you say 8 drives and below should be fine, but can you or anyone else guarantee that once 7.3 hits, or 7.4, they won't just say, ok, so 8 bays, yep, let's lock these fuckers too
And can anyone propose the closest QNAP equivalent of the DS1821+... I saw the one that had 5 3.5, and 4 2.5 drives, and it looks pretty cool, but 5 drives, especially with Raid6, is not enough.,.. I could have lived with 6, but not 5. Thx in advance
Their policy has been 8 since the beginning. They have also been backing off it.
Furthermore they would not make the unit no longer valid, if they were to do it they would say the 1825+ (or whatever) had to use the drives
Dude the RS822+ requires Synology drives. Check you compatibility list.
This is what I was talking about, there are two types. Hard and soft. The RS822+ will give you a soft error
Not sure 8 bay below would get exemption for this HDD nonsense. They already had put bar on DS2422 model and will come down to DS XX23 for 8 bay /6 bay DS models. They are all home users for DS models. Now they will come up with their OEM brand of cameras next year combined with surveillance station as a bundle on the market to get into the security market, even throwing in a camera license to lure you in. The same old trick with their Toshiba made Synology HDD to use on so-called enterprise models.
Dude, it is just a money grab. Nothing more.
Are Synology drives required to use their RAID F1? I am contemplating going with a DS1823XS but do not want to use Synology SSDs. Granted, their info sheet specifies Synology M.2 Drives are required to create F1 volumes on those, but they don't specify if this can be done with non-Synology SATA SSDs. I really wish they hadn't gone down this road as it is just a money grab. All they had to do is put an * and explain that different drive firmware may make drives incompatible. Problem solved. Additionally, they could make Synology branded drives more cost competitive with their Toshiba counterparts. We are a Synology partner, and don't even get a price cut on their drives.
They punch you in the eye but thank them for the following punches being softer...😒
Synology since 2011. This is disturbing, but not surprising.
Money, money, money.
Moved to TrueNAS over this BS. Synology is not an enterprise product, so this makes zero sense.
This....on top of Synology DS series now with AMD ryzen CPUs with NO INTEGRATED GRAPHICS. This is Synology committing suicide. Prosumers and Plex users will be heading to QNAP in droves.
Their drives are way overpriced. I got 18TB WD and they can be had for cheaper and are arguably the same or better. Synology RAM is also way overpriced to comparable RAM from Kingston or Micron, even Samsung. It's a terribly greedy, obnoxious approach and will get them a lot more negative reviews going forward. Just as one example, Amazon reviews for the DS2422+ are pretty bad. "Luckily" my 8-bay DS1821+ only complains about my non-Synology RAM which in-itself is absolute b/s, as if Synology RAM was better. Miserable management decisions. I would never touch their routers or home security or other products etc now that I know how they think and operate. My last Synology device or service, out of principle.
this is untenable and bad biz generally - they should just go no warranty and then provide fail rates like back blaze
The fat cats on their board of directors need a wake up call from the free market, and looks like they'll soon get it, with modern competitor NASes offering fast network cards, fast USB and TB, os replacement, m.2 storage pools. Yay for the free market. It takes time though.