Evergrande has been insolvent for years: Citron's Left
Вставка
- Опубліковано 15 жов 2024
- Citron Research Founder Andrew Left joins the Halftime Report to discuss Evergrande's crisis in China. He discusses the potential implications for the company's employees in China and what he learned trying to short the company in 2012. Subscribe to CNBC Pro to access full episodes of Halftime Report: cnb.cx/3nRmC8v
» Subscribe to CNBC TV: cnb.cx/Subscri...
» Subscribe to CNBC: cnb.cx/Subscri...
» Subscribe to CNBC Classic: cnb.cx/Subscri...
Turn to CNBC TV for the latest stock market news and analysis. From market futures to live price updates CNBC is the leader in business news worldwide.
The News with Shepard Smith is CNBC’s daily news podcast providing deep, non-partisan coverage and perspective on the day’s most important stories. Available to listen by 8:30pm ET / 5:30pm PT daily beginning September 30: www.cnbc.com/2...
Connect with CNBC News Online
Get the latest news: www.cnbc.com/
Follow CNBC on LinkedIn: cnb.cx/LinkedI...
Follow CNBC News on Facebook: cnb.cx/LikeCNBC
Follow CNBC News on Twitter: cnb.cx/FollowCNBC
Follow CNBC News on Instagram: cnb.cx/Instagr...
www.cnbc.com/s...
#CNBC
#CNBCTV
"They were able to keep it going a lot longer than a lot of people thought they would have.." is the story of the entire Chinese economy.
Especially USA.
aye, they couldn't fake it forever
@@nebojsa1976 lol I visit the USA every year. people around the world visit and immigrate there. nobody immigrates to china. oh. just last month? 4th stimulus check for all $1200 and nearly every establishment is hiring people. sure that idiot trump is liable for all the covid deaths due to his negligence, but no economy is riding this out like they are. oh, who's fault is this pandemic again? the world blames china
@@tnh723 are you on drugs??? Are you normal??? Where do you think that money is coming from, you fool? Do you even have any idea how much is spent? Do you know who will return that money and how? You have no brain.
@@tnh723 did the USA organise repatriation flights out of China during the wuhan lock down. If only China was in charge of US borders perhaps the half a million would not have died.
Wow! This guy has the ball to get into a lawsuit in China and stick to his research findings, even it costs him money and time.
Bot much?
man china the máster of stealing, eating pangolins and poluting everything
He has tiny balls.
A good Investment Analyst! It's not the first time it's happened- and probably won't be the last!
In Hong Kong, which has their own court system than Mainland China.
This needs to happen to the Canadian market. No way a 2 bedroom house is worth a million
Look into it, legitimately just as much corruption in Canada as China.
Land value, the house is not worth much usually.
Is that in the capital? In Central London, a 2 bedroom flat (not house) is £1.5M.
@@miriamllamas224 Toronto
Maybe they are very large bedrooms?
I just gained a lot of respect for Left today. Went to court against China... Just proves he backs his research, right or wrong.
I did a report on this year's ago in college. Can't believe it took this long!
Really? For what economics or something?
That’s crazy so did I, I created a model that predicted without government support the company wouldn’t survive past 2018
@@crews9789 how has it survived 3 years without government support? loose debt policies?
@@dodod15419 keeping share price up and raise external funding. Internally create, like the guy said, a lot of balance sheet projects that look good on paper so that investors keep paying for the "growth". If liquidity is not matching anymore, you create a bubble that keeps growing and growing. As soon as you stop creating balance sheet value, investors will sell and your share price crashes. So you are trapped and keep it going until eventually it crashes anyway. That's why it's hard to predict when exactly it comes down, you just know for sure that there is no way out for the company anymore. Unless through a major bail out. But by that time it is not only your current debt that you can't finance anymore, but also any debts coming afterwards, since investors are pulling their money out.
Someone can correct me if Evergrande did it differently. I am not familiar with their "financial reports".
I said something similar about the whole Chinese economy and got trolled big time by a CCP supporter.
"I am banned for 5 years from trading in Hong Kong because of that report"
Lol what a joke
and he had to give 1.6 million HKD to them
Lesson learned: never ever invest anything China
Dummy China own the world lol
most stupid comment ever. just like Merica pure capitalist at the highest with fiat printing press
I made money investing in china. just like US have ENRON , tharenos, Nikola and many more.
People learning today what I have always said. I never invest in China.
... you probably don't have more than 1M to invest anyway.. so yeah..
China is where the big boys battle royale
lol ahhh Citron... the ones that announced they shorted GME and started crying about the mean ol' redditors that cost them money.
Also the ones that called Shopify a fraud when shares were about $100. Look at them now. Wonder how much money people missed out on listening to these clowns
Melvin capital was the one that got wrecked by GME short squeeze not citron. Citron bailed Melvin out for a large percent of their ownership.
@@godogs89 you have got it completely mixed up lol. Citron is just one short seller dude who indeed shorted GME at one point. As a well-known short seller he became particularly unpopular following his comments on GME. Melvin is a hedge fund with billions aum. CITADEL bailed out Melvin.
Lol I just wrote something similar with the ending gme goes brrr lol
@@godogs89 yeah you messed this one up guy.
everytime they say theres nothing to worry about, thats when you worry
Wow, what a story! This guy is a hero, unfortunately, he took a spear in the guts from the Chinese state.
also from wsb
Hello I like this guy Left, gets into scrap with HKSE loses, is proven correct, doesn't gloat and still comes up with good solid realistic opinions of what will happen next and to whom. Admirable. m
You're right
That smile at the beginning is like ' I told you so '
“The market can stay irrational, longer than you can stay solvent”. Andrew Left was right, but he was way too early.
@:Jeff W With all due respect sir "IRRATIOMAL"
@@johnpalma7265 Fixed 😄
The market can remain “whatever” longer then you can remain solvent.
Is it "irrational?"
Good one. Zombie since 2008. Also the MSM huge coverage is a major red flag. FUD propaganda.
SEC should BLOCK any IPO without audited statements!
i say let it all burn. There is no price discovery anymore anyway
There never was any in China
So the guy will buy securities at the end, Evergrand’s fate is priced in !
I think he was referring to securities trading in HK, not specifically evergrande ... of course I could be wrong
Thank you for bringing Mr. Left on air today, CNBC. It is certainly a vindication for him, if only in the court of public opinion. It also shows that Hong Kong has long been co-opted by the mainland Chinese operations and backroom dealing, long before the 2014 and 2019 social movements.
Can he re-sue?
Isn’t this the guy who shorted GameStop and lived to regret it?
Can someone correct me…..if Evergrande owed 12 billion in 2012 and now they owe 300 billion, isn’t that an increase of 2,500% in debt? Isn’t that insane?
This was amazing.
I sold all of my China stocks because of the Evergrande bankruptcy. That's too hot for me at first ... 75% of the capital of a Chinese household is in real estate. The government must now try to keep house prices artificially high. How this works is unclear. It can all get pretty panicked because a lot of the Chinese growth of the last few years is going down the drain. 28% of GDP depends on a growing real estate sector that is now no longer allowed to grow. That will be exciting, but for Chinese stocks one can expect turbulent months in which a lot of negative things can still happen. This is not a small story that can be regulated away from time to time. This is a solid bubble in the country's most important industry that has to be popped in a controlled manner and that will also have negative effects on the Chinese stock exchanges because an extremely large amount of capital will be destroyed that is not available for consumption. There is probably less bearish potential for the global economy. But for Chinese stocks, this can lead to some panic selling on the part of Chinese investors. Depending on how the government reacts in the next few months. So I'm only referring to Chinese titles with caution for now. Chinese stocks that are primarily listed in China or Hong Kong, such as BYD, are already subject to high volatility anyway because many people in China play the stock exchange more like a casino. This investor behavior paired with the current uncertainty on the Chinese real estate market can easily lead to panic overreactions where discounts of up to 50% can occur. I prefer to have my money outside at the moment to step back in at low prices when it comes to that.
The real bad news is Evergande's case is fairly typical. There's real estate bankruptcies every day of the week in China.
Where do I have Citron from? There was some negative news a while ago. Or am I confusing them with someone else?
Part of the gamestop drama circa January
@@lisa2948 ah, thanks!
Respect to Citron
They might recover if Citron publicly shorts it
hahaha, true enough. I am guessing a lot of the commenters are learning of Left (Citron) for the first time...so much praise??
hello shitron lol long time no see. still enjoying my GME gains
Trading while insolvent is illegal in Australia. I'm investing family fortune In Evergrande.
Remember this fella from January with GME
Contagion has started.
Sounds like wishful thinking from one on the sidelines.
@@Mrbfgray 😆
Hope the CCP will punish the boss or the director and doesn't follow the USA handling the Lehman Brother. Where the boss paid a fat bonus to themselves
Equity and bond holders will be wiped out. Wow!
I can't see how the collapse of a 300 billion company has any impact on a country of 17 trillion. It just seems over exaggerated.
A scam is scam, no matter what culture you in.
What about investing in Indian market, experts comments expected...
You know there's a systemic problem when a short seller gets banned for posting quality Due Dilligence.........
It'll be a sight to behold!
That's right. Evergrande has been insolvent for many years. All developers are insolvent. All large firms ars insolvent. The few solvent and profitable firms are being confiscated.
This was amazing🚀
look at yellow freight USA , we do the same stuff but small.
Left do you have a position in GME?
He IS a short seller, so his reporting is kind of 'conflict of interesty.' China using heavy handed legal measures to suppress critical research on Chinese companies sounds pretty par for the course. Just because he made a critical report and now Evergrande is failing, doesn't necessarily vindicate him on the charges of representing information disingenuously.
This is going to make the Enron and Worldcom messes look like a minor event in comparison.... 💸😒😑🙄
Theranos was valued at $10B. Enron held $63B in assets at the end. Theranos had few assets also.
yall redditors had the balls to try and bankrupt this man just because he works at a hedge fund that shorts stocks. but when its a chinese company, yall all praise him. hypocritical asf
6 years???? Tell me again about efficient markets 😂 …
Can you imagine how far a bubble can last …
Holly 💩
Great work citron research 💪
Don’t Stop GameStop Won’t Stop
There's ONLY so long you can kick the can down the road
Sounds like US government debt !
China is going down for the count...How this affects the US is the real question.
HSBC owns all the loans from Evergrande. Thus, all banks will be affected.
Is this the same guy who said GameStop was going back to 20$ and fast? back in january
yes
its happening...
The people that put money down on those properties are in a mess...
Average Chinese...
poor guys.
This is the guy who invested in Lucky Coffee
Even a broken clock is right twice a day. All CCP businesses are fake and frauds
Trying to win against Chaina in Chaina is like asking a fish to climb a tree. 😂
A broken clock is right twice a day. He is a notorious Tesla shortseller
Evergrande is still trading today. What a joke to the world?
Here we go again ! Woo-hoo!
Not according to Left. Been on the sidelines too long and missed out on massive gains much? :D
He was wrong then though. If he said it would go insolvent, and soon, in 2012
Beijing has several options to handle its economy with minimal impact of Evergrande debacle. One sure thing is that Evergrande won't crash hard as CH central bank quietly puts down a standing-by cushion of $40 Billion usd for Evergrande debts alleviation. But, Beijing waits to let the private sector play out the future of Evergrande.
There is no private sector bail out. And China doesn't allow foreign investor into their housing market so Evergrande is screwed.
No way this doesn’t have contagion at least it will domino effect into aus nz canada real estate markets...
Why would it? From what I understand most of the money is chinese money.
Yeah ”no contagion” is what they said about US subprime mortgages and associated securities in 2007. But their government has ultimate power so they may be able to handle it better.
@@kineahora8736 Australia was actually not hit by U.S. sub-prime much because we had little exposure. Things were booming, but it eventually caught up with some of the US companies operating here.
They all cook book. If they tell you they don’t, it’s a lie, everyone knows. Why don’t you think the stock is offered to sell on the market because it’s not worth a penny.
So this is the famous Andy Left
What stoping him counter sueing back ,since it was a fact now.
It's like Elon Musk suing the SEC to try to claw back the fine for his predictive statements about Tesla stock.
Citron Research isent that the guys that said GME would be at 20 dollars?
wall street investment banks , quadrillions OTC derivatives bets, EG is peanut......
But-but-but, CNBC just reported that Evergrande’s problems were solved… so…?
Probably didn't help that his 'report' looks like a little kid's first powerpoint. Couldn't get your logo to match your background, Left?
If someone raise an alarm against a company, you should be ready to short it when its time bomb suddenly explodes!
Wallstreet Bets should announce a short squeeze. Who's paying these prices for Crocs and Generac? RETL et al.? None of these stock prices are justified. Eventually all of them will look like CBS Viacom.
Lmfao! Banned in HK hahahahahaha!!!
Well done! The truth hurts the CCP yay! 🤣🤣🤣
$300,000,000,000 in debt seeing the number is all it’s digits puts everything in perspective.
This sort of lawsuit things isnt uncommon all over the world, big companies use the legal system to bully individuals
Ask him what about Game Stop？？？
every since lockdown intrinsic valuations went put the window on every single asset. Let all the markets crash and burn
So Citron was about nine years early on it's short.
Stop bringing back Andrew Left. Plenty of people called out China prior to Shitron. We don't want him back.
From $23 to barely $2 a share in 18 months. Andrew gets the last laugh, Evergrande...
I think he will short it, he just can't say on Publicized media....
What did I just watch?
It's the same in India with builders & developers like Jaypee, Lodha group...remember these names.
The comments in here saying Left was wrong about GME... he is financially analysing companies based on fundamental values. GME share price was not backed by anything but hype that drove it up. It was/is overpriced when compared to the current operational values. He shorted it and lost money because he underestimated the hype of investors.
In the case of Evergrande, he saw that the company does not have enough to finance their operations anymore and will eventually go bankrupt. This was clear based on their financial reports and he was not wrong.
GME is based on fundamentals, it was highly undervalued. GME had a bigger cash position than it's market capitalization. Also, GME's profit was based on console cycles which was overlooked by a lot of analysts. This was all in Roaring Kitty's analysis. Educate yourself
@@blackie6050 it was undervalued, but to say that the company is worth 13,42 billion... :D take your education and believe what you want. The company is currently valued by its investors based on market potential, which was overlooked and is now overpriced.
2018 8 billion turnover with a 600 million net loss before covid. They were in the process of restructuring to adjust their business model. People did not invest in a solid company, they invested in potential.
@@mqbq3651 that can be said about any tech start up or growth company. Tesla is not worth it's market cap yet you don't see people complaining about it as much as GameStop. It's simple supply and demand of the companies stock that justifies the companies worth. Similar to rare baseball cards, they're literally made from paper worth no more than $2, yet there's a high demand for them which justifies it's insane prices. Simple supply and demand.
They survived nine years ! This joke thinks that he is vindicated !
Bullsht !
Calm down Citron guy lol......gme goes brrrrr
Everyone knew
Two words: Political risk.
Is this just part of the larger scheme of things?
Do the opposite of what SHITRON says. Buy the stock.
We have a lot of insolvent zombies in the US markets, and it will be great to see the dominoes start to fall.
But the u.s doesn't work on capitalism free market ideas.
Big company's get bailed out
Little people like me when my business struggles I either sink or swim
@@razorblade7408 Socialism for the Rich, Capitalism for the Rest.
Do you know who sold all the land Evergrande built their houses on?....
Well, there you are.
Huge noise. Buy the dip👍🚀
This guy, and poor Chanos, are living testament, that shorting for a living has been a very unhealthy way of life for the past decade... :)
But they are both richer than you and I and 1000 others (and I'm in the US 1%)
@@raylopez99 Well, Chanos is viewed as on old clown for years now, God bless him. And Left as a downright crook, who cannot announce a short position anymore, without the retail monkeys squeezing him out immediately. Citron is a synonym for short manipulation now. He even announced, he's done releasing short reports, he's just too scared. Quite a pityful end to these once known figures. And I'm not talking about how much money have they left (both admitted, they've lost on Evergrande despite being right, btw), I'm commenting on their reputation, and fear they must endure, during this "forever zero" rates market.
Wonder how this guy will do in prison?
China is EVERGRANDE GREAT!
Buy when Others are scared!!!
Ship ever Given from the Evergreen company. Now evergrande. causing trouble Should I care about Everest?
Imagine reditors start buy Evergrand 😳
Bad idea, company gunna fold
rich people help rich people even if they r enemies. scratch my back and i scratch yours but we still be rich in the end together
@carl hartford True, reminds me of Enron and that crooked agricultural products firm in Italy, Permolat or some such. Crooks.
You would think they could afford a stick or something.....
When it comes to the choices of tomorrow and money, money wins. Especially in china.
He wanted to get the truth out 🤣🤣🤣. When short seller lie so much just to get price down. Good for him to get banned.