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Deadpool only thinks he's interacting with the audience because he's insane; She-Hulk has actually gone into the space between comic panels and effect the stories she's in.
Joe kelly and Nicieza really formed who Deadpool would be as a character and theyre each responsible for some of the greatest runs the character has ever had, Kelly on Deadpool (1997) & Spider-Man/Deadpool and Nicieza on Cable & Deadpool
6:49 It turns out Liefeld has drawn Deadpool's face before he debuted. In a facebook post, Rob posted up some concept art for the characters and the Deadpool one had full drawing of Wade, with some notes plus a small sketch of unmasked Deadpool with a scarred up face. So even before his New Mutants debut hit the stands, the seeds were planted by Rob for some reveal of why Deadpool wore a mask.
It's pretty hard to believe in anything Liefeld claims he did or posts. Dude claims that Deathstroke, Spider-Man and Snake Eyes were never any inspirations for creating Deadpool. Sometimes he claimed that he didn't even knew that Deathstroke existed before creating Deadpool. Liefeld is full of crap.
@@bartoszdulas1703if that's true it's really weird seeing as how Liefeld praises teen titans when they were drawn by George Perez. However, stranger things have happened. It's really hard to say one way or the other since neither one of us are Rob Liefeld.
Reily Brown needs to be in the conversation. During his time on Cable & Deadpool, he started giving Wade more and more branded Deadpool gear to wear, especially in his "civillian" clothes. Wade would also incorporate those elements into his suit, and the famous Brass Knuckles with "dead" on one hand and "pool" on the other became a signature part of Deadpool's arsenal after that run.
Hear hear. Cable and Deadpool is one of my favourites runs on the character. There's nothing groundbreaking, but it did a lot to solidify his character and style. A Murder in Paradise/Who killed Haji Bin Barat is probably my favourite Deadpool story of all time. Really captures the messed up tradegy of his character.
I love when Deadpool is depicted as a jokester who like you said masks his depression with humor. I love how he was written in Rick Rememder's X Force with him out of everyone in the group being completely opposed to killing child Apocalypse and actually becoming like a cool uncle for him.
Deadpool is one of many characters that was originally created for only one storyline, but ended up being the most popular part of the Universe. IE: Popeye Howard The Duck TMNT etc
Sensational She-Hulk was an incredible run and really defined and made the character unique but tbh there hasn't been a run as good since and Deadpool just exploded in popularity which eclipsed the props she deserves.
Deadpool and She Hulk need a team up book already screw deadpool and spider-man give me deadpool and she hulk the fourth wall breaking between the two would be amazing
I think Rob would be a lot more open to admitting that influence if not for the name “Wade Wilson” being grafted on. I think he felt like it had really cruddy implications and wanted to steer away from those
Joe Kelly's run on Deadpool is one of the stand-out runs of the late '90s. There was just so much heart and fun that was missing from a lot of comics published at the time. The Dead Reckoning arc (Deadpool (1998) #23-25) is one of Deadpool's devastating stories. The whole series was building to that story, and the revelations (which I won't spoil here) were a gut punch that I did not see coming. The run up to, and including, Dead Reckoning, are available in the first 3 volumes of the Deadpool Epic Collections, and I highly recommend them Great video and solid research. I thought Fabian Nicieza was being facetious when he was talking about Deadpool, Domino, and Gideon's creation. It's hard to imagine anyone taking Gideon seriously. I was wrong.
Good to see you, Chris. Now that Kayfabe is on an indefinite hiatus, now that we've lost our great historian, Eddy P, we need you now more than ever. Much love buddy 😇
19:45 Harry's line is note-perfect Stan Lee because it was Lee's original dialogue! Likewise, this isn't a clever imitation of Romita's art, it IS Romita's art.
I saw in a birthday cake catalog at my local Market Basket, a design for the Deadpool face emblem as a cake. That tells you how well Deadpool hit with the public.
This is a pretty fair video, love it. I'm really glad that Rob keeps hammering home that he created Deadpool. So many creators just aren't given credit for their work in comics. Otherwise, most people would think Stan Lee created Deadpool. (And this is not to diminish the work Fabian and Joe K did to define DP.)
Liefeld keeps hammering away at he created DP because he’s a no talent hack who just was lucky that others with actual writing & artistic ability elevated his rip-off creation into a memorable character. Rob is trash.
@@traviswilcox3472 Yeah, you seem like a real blast, Comic Book Guy. Nothing says "I'm doing great" like raging over a 30-year old comic 20x on one video.
There is a lot I can say about all this as I was there for a chunk of the original burst. I was hands-on helping draw when Mark took over and already knew Fabian and Bob and was there sometimes when Rob would call going over plot and layouts and when Mark would talk with Fabian. I'll also add that we owe a lot to the first human/humans that made a working wheel. Even though many many many people and designers have designed and added to "What a wheel is, and can do, and even looks like" , if it were not for the original inception, no one else would have had the opportunity to develop it more. Thus, we pay homage and great respect to those who are the originators of anything we so love. Also, as creators, we are so often ....hmmmm... well.... screwed monetarily... and thus must become our own biggest supporters to "will" into existence the right to earn money ,or be left the forgotten fool who gave away their greatest creations (Kirby). I really like Fabian and all the people involved. Rob is just the better salesman. And Marvel and Disney had no problem making him the poster boy for the character as well. They basically handed Rob the "Key to the city" and let him draw Deadpool everywhere and do basically anything he wanted to do in recent years. His work, like it or not, sells big. Marvel perpetuates Rob as much as anyone. But, as a creator myself... it's great to see when they do that for any of us.
When, back then, I first saw the character, on the cover of New Mutants #98, I was immediately drawn to it. That design alone was enough to reel me in.
Great video Chris! I think acknowledgments overlook the differentiation between “creating” a character and “developing” a character. If Deadpool came out fully-formed, it would be one thing. However, Deadpool works as a sum of its parts and on the subtle additions over time. This gets tricky with royalty payments, however it’s crucial to financially compensate those who progressed these characters and developed them over the character’s history.
And yet Liefeld still gets a royalty on every use of Deadpool. Fabian Nicieza is basically the Bill Finger of Deadpool, responsible for most of the character’s canon but always overshadowed by the credited creator like Finger was by Bob Kane with respect to Batman.
This is great. Id love to see a similar breakdown for other characters like Wolverine, Nightcrawler, and more. I was really sad that Claremont was not credited for his contributions to Wolverine in D and W. I may be misremembering and over contributing, but I believe Wolverine wouldn't be the star he is today without Claremont's contributions.
The honest truth about Deadpool's character and success is that is was built by different creative teams over time. You did an excellent job exploring the creators who contributed to the character. Rob Liefeld wasn't the sole creative force behind Deadpool's success, although he created the character. It will be interesting to see if and how he reacts to this video. Great work Chris!
Thanks for another great video. You make a really good point there about how Deadpool benefitted from a succession of creators who were relatively new to comics and had something to prove. The 90's was a time when the comic industry seemed to be overflowing with new talent. I think it may have been the natural process of generational turnover, as a whole generation that grew up reading comics finally got the chance to create them. Sort of like the 70's.
After the bankruptcy, Marvel had to publish - as part of the court deal - titles certain in theory to sell. Ka-Zar, Heroes for Hire, Elektra, Man-Thing, Deadpool, etc. So we have bankruptcy to thank for the 90s Marvel Renaissance.
Rob ripped off good characters to design a pale imitation & only the talent of others made Deadpool & Cable memorable characters. Liefeld is a trash artist & creator.
@@daniel79tj Absolutely NOT end of story. Others made Deadpool popular so credit must be given to them, Liefeld created yet another forgettable character until better writers & artists enhanced DP as we now know him. FACTS.
I'd argue Joe Kelly's major contribution of the 4th wall-breaking humor starts from issue #1, in the first few pages. After receiving a set-up for Deadpool to go after the Hulk, he makes his presence known by singing the opening jingle to the classic 1966 Hulk cartoon. If Deadpool isn't breaking the 4th wall by doing this, it asks a lot of questions about the 616 universe all at once - there was a Hulk cartoon with the same jingle there, too? Deadpool saw it (when? He and Bruce are presumably of similar age!)? Nobody else ever remarks on a cartoon being made about a real figure that is generally regarded as an uncontrollable, destructive force? The absurd nature of these questions immediately tell the reader, "Deadpool is indirectly speaking to you, the reader, by referencing something you know from the real world about this character in the fictional." It's different from the reference to the Sally show as she is not an established character in Marvel already and we can assume her parallel existence (at the time, anyways) without any questions.
Chris you are best at what you do! I have been trying to tell people it is not the Liefeld/Nicieza Deadpool they know and love, it is Joe Kelly's Deadpool they use in comics and movies today.
True but Liefeld still created Deadpool. You can’t take that from him. If we take that from them, then we have to Stan Lee’s creations away from him too
@@Linklex7 the only thing Liefeld is responsible for is the basic costume design he just ripped off Spider-Man and Deathstroke the Terminator to do that. Other creators are responsible for creating the character we know and love today
@@eclectExactly on point with Liefeld just ripping off other good characters to “create” a weak version. DP only became super popular when others took their turn on him. Rob is a joke but gets the laugh when he makes others believe he’s the reason DP is a good character, he’s NOT the reason. Deadpool is good in spite of Liefeld.
@ComicTropes Joe Kelly def deserves his flowers, but it should be noted that despite a 3-year run, DEADPOOL was consistently in danger of being cancelled. He 100% gets credit for fleshing the character out, but not necessarily “popularizing” him. To that end, I think Daniel Way gets overlooked. IIRC, he was the first to actually have a hit solo book with the character - relative to how sales had dipped from the ‘90s - and he did it by introducing Deadpool having 2 different dialogue boxes, reflecting his dissociative identity disorder. That aspect of the character didn’t last - perhaps because Editorial deemed it insensitive? - which makes it easy to skip over Way’s contributions to Deadpool himself, but just in terms of being the first writer to write a breakout book that readers didn’t have to worry about disappearing, I think his name should be in the conversation.
I think there was a sort of Zeitgeist about Deadpool at the time. Deadpool started to appear in videogames right in the end of the 2000's, being in Marvel Ultimate Alliance and Marvel vs Capcom 3 as Daniel Way run was ongoing. He was nearly cancelled from Marvel vs Capcom 3 because not popular enough. Three year after that, Deadpool was everywhere and in every Marvel piece of media.
@@ahok1937 Very true. I just wanted to point out that Kelly's run was much like SPIDER-GIRL, constantly in danger of being put down, with fans being told they had to rally behind it if they wanted it to stick around. I think Way's multiple personality gimmick was executed well and added to the humor -- enough that other writers using him in other titles incorporated it into their books, too -- but there is probably some truth to the culture happening to finally coalesce around the character at that time in a way that can't be quantified.
I would argue that he started breaking the forth wall when he referenced being in a fight scene back in his first mini. Great video as usual hope this one does numbers for you.
The best looking Deadpool was the Joe Maduriera mini series. Yeah, Kelly really made Deadpool deadpan. But it took a while. By the mid 2000's is when it really cemented in. Deadpool was one of the few comics that still sold during the comic depression.
That special issue Deadpool #1 with the embossed cover was one of the coolest things I'd seen as a teen. I only had access to the meager collection of comics at my local grocery store in a very small town. But that was a treasure for quite a while. I don't think the store received the rest of the series. I was able to collect Generation X for a while. That first issue with the foil cover was also one of my treasures. Good times!
17:11 I really loved when they even had it there when Wade was dressed as Spiderman. I forgot which comic that was, but Pete was exhausted and was getting chased by someone. Wade switched costumes with Pete and distracted the villain while Pete rested.
This was interesting to watch. I knew that it took a few different writers to make Deadpool who he is, but it’s nice to hear the proper credits. I never knew Mark Waid had written for Deadpool. Also, getting sponsored by a convention is pretty cool.
Those first few mini-series were collected in Deadpool classic vol 1 which came out when i was in my early teens. Bought it with bday money and i was hooked man. Voraciously read everything i could with him in it.
I have a feeling that Liefeld wrote down a background for Deadpool with the character traits of Wolverine, Snake-eyes and Spiderman - so all the superpowers, attitude and background were created solely by him. All those ideas were very popular in the 80s and it makes a lot of sense. The "sad clown element" was dramatized by a lot of Frank Miller characters, specifically Wolverine and everything you cite in "second Year" is taken from Wolverine: Limited Series, by Chris Claremont. Siryn looks a lot like Jean Grey, Wolverine's love interest.
fascinating, nice to see David Nakayamas art in the thumpnail, my first comicbook contact with Deadpool was the Posehn run starting with his marriage, read the older stuff later. Intersting to see that Joe Mad started as a 90s artist, my first contact with his work was Darksiders
I'm not sure if I remember correctly, but I think that Joe Mad mini featured a shot of a character that was then swiped for the introduction of Rob's second most popular creation: Troll. Great episode, Chris!
I remember first reading a deadpool comic cause it was more adult oriented, naked girls, violence, and crude humor. The whole chimichanga, but i ended up loving and connecting with deadpool for the tragic and painful life and depression he suffered from, and his use of humor to mask it. Deadpool is definitely a quality comicbook character, and im glad he got as popular as he did
Deadpool always seems like an X-Men character to me, even though his history shows he's not attached to them that much. I think it's because his pairing/rivalries with Wolverine and Cable work so well. I really got into him with the Joe Kelly series in 1997. I remember picking it up because it was a new series, so I thought it'd be fun to get in on it before having to dig through a ton of old canon. Turns out I had no idea how much stuff he'd been in before, but still, easily my favorite 90s Marvel thing.
Rob is definitely the loudest about his involvement in creating Deadpool but lets be frank...it was the writer Joe Kelly that made the character what it is. Ed's artwork is awesome but is not what I associate with the Deadpool popularity of today.
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Much like Deadpool, Chris knows that he’s in a UA-cam video.
Omg matt draper
Oh god is that matttt my man👍
Matttt and MattDraper are two different UA-camrs but MattDraper has some incredible videos, both about comics and film.
Wow, I like your channel. The videos on Daredevil are so good .
Matttt is the bald one :) @@t.b.g.animation6185
Deadpool: Nobody understands im addressing the audience!
She hulk: You'll get used to it, Kid.
Spidey: Who are you two talking too?!
@@LowellLucasJr. Deadpool & She-Hulk (in unison): -You're a comic book character, Peter!
Spidey: *cries himself to death*
To*
Deadpool only thinks he's interacting with the audience because he's insane; She-Hulk has actually gone into the space between comic panels and effect the stories she's in.
Gwenpool: Have I got a surprise for all three of you!
Cringe
I always point to Joe Kelly for developing DP for what the character is really known for today.
It was one of the Kelly issues that grabbed me as a kid.
Indeed.
Yes I credit him and Fabian Nicieza
Joe kelly and Nicieza really formed who Deadpool would be as a character and theyre each responsible for some of the greatest runs the character has ever had, Kelly on Deadpool (1997) & Spider-Man/Deadpool and Nicieza on Cable & Deadpool
Liefeld did not draw him consistently? YOU DON'T SAY!
It’s almost as Liefeld is not a very good comic artist 😮
@@j.a.weishaupt1748 No way, I've never heard anyone say that before 🤯
to be fair Jack Kirby wasnt that consistent with character details either
@@TheZooropaBaby yeah but i think kirby's art is better than liefeld even when kirby is inconsistent.
We will not tolerate Kirby slander @@TheZooropaBaby
6:49 It turns out Liefeld has drawn Deadpool's face before he debuted. In a facebook post, Rob posted up some concept art for the characters and the Deadpool one had full drawing of Wade, with some notes plus a small sketch of unmasked Deadpool with a scarred up face. So even before his New Mutants debut hit the stands, the seeds were planted by Rob for some reveal of why Deadpool wore a mask.
You actually believe that?
@@MolemanSA Yes
It's pretty hard to believe in anything Liefeld claims he did or posts. Dude claims that Deathstroke, Spider-Man and Snake Eyes were never any inspirations for creating Deadpool. Sometimes he claimed that he didn't even knew that Deathstroke existed before creating Deadpool.
Liefeld is full of crap.
@@bartoszdulas1703if that's true it's really weird seeing as how Liefeld praises teen titans when they were drawn by George Perez. However, stranger things have happened. It's really hard to say one way or the other since neither one of us are Rob Liefeld.
Deadpool's sense of humor and fourth wall breaking reminded me of Ambush Bug.
Reily Brown needs to be in the conversation. During his time on Cable & Deadpool, he started giving Wade more and more branded Deadpool gear to wear, especially in his "civillian" clothes. Wade would also incorporate those elements into his suit, and the famous Brass Knuckles with "dead" on one hand and "pool" on the other became a signature part of Deadpool's arsenal after that run.
Hear hear. Cable and Deadpool is one of my favourites runs on the character. There's nothing groundbreaking, but it did a lot to solidify his character and style.
A Murder in Paradise/Who killed Haji Bin Barat is probably my favourite Deadpool story of all time. Really captures the messed up tradegy of his character.
I love when Deadpool is depicted as a jokester who like you said masks his depression with humor. I love how he was written in Rick Rememder's X Force with him out of everyone in the group being completely opposed to killing child Apocalypse and actually becoming like a cool uncle for him.
Oh, man. I was already excited for Rose City Comic Con, and now I might see you there? Im double excited.
Deadpool is one of many characters that was originally created for only one storyline, but ended up being the most popular part of the Universe. IE:
Popeye
Howard The Duck
TMNT
etc
Deadpool was called the Merc with a Mouth in his first mini series The Circle Chase
I appreciate that you acknowledged that She-Hulk did the humorous 4th wall break trope first
She Hulk never gets enough credit
Sensational She-Hulk was an incredible run and really defined and made the character unique but tbh there hasn't been a run as good since and Deadpool just exploded in popularity which eclipsed the props she deserves.
Dr. Doom met Stan Lee and Jack Kirby 16 years before She-Hulk existed. They just didn't make it a constant trait for him.
@@simpleanswer8954 was it played for comedic effect?
Deadpool and She Hulk need a team up book already screw deadpool and spider-man give me deadpool and she hulk the fourth wall breaking between the two would be amazing
Kudos. A masterclass in objectively and respectfully dissecting the evolution of a character.
Marv Wolfman and George Perez should get partial credit for Deadpool lol
Special Thanks at least!
I think Rob would be a lot more open to admitting that influence if not for the name “Wade Wilson” being grafted on. I think he felt like it had really cruddy implications and wanted to steer away from those
And Steve Ditko!
That Amazing Spider-Man #47 time travel issue was hilarious 😂.
@fishin4bass2002 It's issue #11 from Deadpool vol 1, 1997
Joe Kelly's run on Deadpool is one of the stand-out runs of the late '90s. There was just so much heart and fun that was missing from a lot of comics published at the time.
The Dead Reckoning arc (Deadpool (1998) #23-25) is one of Deadpool's devastating stories. The whole series was building to that story, and the revelations (which I won't spoil here) were a gut punch that I did not see coming. The run up to, and including, Dead Reckoning, are available in the first 3 volumes of the Deadpool Epic Collections, and I highly recommend them
Great video and solid research. I thought Fabian Nicieza was being facetious when he was talking about Deadpool, Domino, and Gideon's creation. It's hard to imagine anyone taking Gideon seriously. I was wrong.
Good to see you, Chris. Now that Kayfabe is on an indefinite hiatus, now that we've lost our great historian, Eddy P, we need you now more than ever. Much love buddy 😇
sigh, those Joe Kelly comics were WONDERFUL when release. Great video
There's actually collected editions of Joe Kelly's run as well as Circle Chase currently in print. Check them out if you can.
Reading the Joe Kelly run was what turned me from a casual fan into a legit proper Deadpool fan.
The circle chase is one of the best comic mini series of all time and to me really established the character.
19:45 Harry's line is note-perfect Stan Lee because it was Lee's original dialogue! Likewise, this isn't a clever imitation of Romita's art, it IS Romita's art.
I saw in a birthday cake catalog at my local Market Basket, a design for the Deadpool face emblem as a cake. That tells you how well Deadpool hit with the public.
Rob Liefeld shaped Deadpool as much as Bob Kane shaped Batman.
This is a pretty fair video, love it. I'm really glad that Rob keeps hammering home that he created Deadpool. So many creators just aren't given credit for their work in comics. Otherwise, most people would think Stan Lee created Deadpool. (And this is not to diminish the work Fabian and Joe K did to define DP.)
Liefeld keeps hammering away at he created DP because he’s a no talent hack who just was lucky that others with actual writing & artistic ability elevated his rip-off creation into a memorable character. Rob is trash.
@@traviswilcox3472 Hope things get better for you, bud. Cheer up.
@@hunkykitty I’m great, any & every chance to speak out on how pathetic Liefeld is makes me & so many others happy.
@@traviswilcox3472 Yeah, you seem like a real blast, Comic Book Guy. Nothing says "I'm doing great" like raging over a 30-year old comic 20x on one video.
There is a lot I can say about all this as I was there for a chunk of the original burst. I was hands-on helping draw when Mark took over and already knew Fabian and Bob and was there sometimes when Rob would call going over plot and layouts and when Mark would talk with Fabian.
I'll also add that we owe a lot to the first human/humans that made a working wheel. Even though many many many people and designers have designed and added to "What a wheel is, and can do, and even looks like" , if it were not for the original inception, no one else would have had the opportunity to develop it more. Thus, we pay homage and great respect to those who are the originators of anything we so love.
Also, as creators, we are so often ....hmmmm... well.... screwed monetarily... and thus must become our own biggest supporters to "will" into existence the right to earn money ,or be left the forgotten fool who gave away their greatest creations (Kirby). I really like Fabian and all the people involved. Rob is just the better salesman. And Marvel and Disney had no problem making him the poster boy for the character as well. They basically handed Rob the "Key to the city" and let him draw Deadpool everywhere and do basically anything he wanted to do in recent years. His work, like it or not, sells big. Marvel perpetuates Rob as much as anyone. But, as a creator myself... it's great to see when they do that for any of us.
Liefeld Sucks.. the end.
When, back then, I first saw the character, on the cover of New Mutants #98, I was immediately drawn to it. That design alone was enough to reel me in.
Just wanted to say I appreciate the little extra informal conversation segment at the end of these videos.
Another great episode, Chris! Hope you're having a great weekend.
Great video! Very timely!! I never read the comics, so I'm glad to get more history of the character's evolution.
Deadpool # 11 is the funniest comic I’ve ever read. Had me laughing out loud on the bus like a mad man.
That was the first time I laughed so hard because a comic book. Oh boy, those Osbourne hair jokes were amazing 😂
Joe Kelly - One of the best people on Deadpool
Daniel Way - The double edged sword to Deadpool's popularity.
Great video Chris!
I think acknowledgments overlook the differentiation between “creating” a character and “developing” a character. If Deadpool came out fully-formed, it would be one thing. However, Deadpool works as a sum of its parts and on the subtle additions over time.
This gets tricky with royalty payments, however it’s crucial to financially compensate those who progressed these characters and developed them over the character’s history.
And yet Liefeld still gets a royalty on every use of Deadpool. Fabian Nicieza is basically the Bill Finger of Deadpool, responsible for most of the character’s canon but always overshadowed by the credited creator like Finger was by Bob Kane with respect to Batman.
Loved the themed black and red shirt😎
I remember when Greg came in to take over as Mark left the book to follow Rob to Image, as Rob had requested.
No Liefeld, No Deadpool, nuff said!
great video!!! its actually amazing how, compared to other popular characters, deadpool doesnt have any bad main runs!
Fantastic video, Chris! Thank you!!!
Wow, I always credited almost everything (bar the look) to Joe Kelly, but props to Fabien and Mark for adding so much!
Joe Kelly and later, Rick Remender did the most for Deadpool's characterisation development. Before the overexposure kicked in.
Keep it up, Chris. You’re the best!
This is great. Id love to see a similar breakdown for other characters like Wolverine, Nightcrawler, and more. I was really sad that Claremont was not credited for his contributions to Wolverine in D and W. I may be misremembering and over contributing, but I believe Wolverine wouldn't be the star he is today without Claremont's contributions.
The honest truth about Deadpool's character and success is that is was built by different creative teams over time. You did an excellent job exploring the creators who contributed to the character. Rob Liefeld wasn't the sole creative force behind Deadpool's success, although he created the character. It will be interesting to see if and how he reacts to this video.
Great work Chris!
Thanks for another great video. You make a really good point there about how Deadpool benefitted from a succession of creators who were relatively new to comics and had something to prove. The 90's was a time when the comic industry seemed to be overflowing with new talent. I think it may have been the natural process of generational turnover, as a whole generation that grew up reading comics finally got the chance to create them. Sort of like the 70's.
Fantastic video, loved the way you framed Deadpool’s rise to becoming what we know today, I think you charted the exact course very concisely!
After the bankruptcy, Marvel had to publish - as part of the court deal - titles certain in theory to sell. Ka-Zar, Heroes for Hire, Elektra, Man-Thing, Deadpool, etc. So we have bankruptcy to thank for the 90s Marvel Renaissance.
That was no renaissance. Most of those titles tanked after a year and a half. The real renaissance happened in the early 00s with Quesada.
If there was any marvel 90s boom period it was only for the children following the animated shows and fans of the blade movies
@@VuotoPneumaNN it was a return to focus on classic characters after the dumpster fire that was Ronald O Perlman.
@@DCMarvelMultiverse Yeah, but it mostly sucked.
"Creating" and "shaping" are two different things. Rob created Deadpool...the others contributed to shaping him into what we see today.
Rob ripped off good characters to design a pale imitation & only the talent of others made Deadpool & Cable memorable characters.
Liefeld is a trash artist & creator.
@@traviswilcox3472Show some respect to a legend
this, Liefeld created Deadpool end of story.
@@daniel79tj Absolutely NOT end of story.
Others made Deadpool popular so credit must be given to them, Liefeld created yet another forgettable character until better writers & artists enhanced DP as we now know him. FACTS.
@@traviswilcox3472 not really, Liefield is the creator
ive been preaching this for years thank you
I found his humor really ramped up in three issues of Secret Defenders
I'd argue Joe Kelly's major contribution of the 4th wall-breaking humor starts from issue #1, in the first few pages. After receiving a set-up for Deadpool to go after the Hulk, he makes his presence known by singing the opening jingle to the classic 1966 Hulk cartoon. If Deadpool isn't breaking the 4th wall by doing this, it asks a lot of questions about the 616 universe all at once - there was a Hulk cartoon with the same jingle there, too? Deadpool saw it (when? He and Bruce are presumably of similar age!)? Nobody else ever remarks on a cartoon being made about a real figure that is generally regarded as an uncontrollable, destructive force? The absurd nature of these questions immediately tell the reader, "Deadpool is indirectly speaking to you, the reader, by referencing something you know from the real world about this character in the fictional." It's different from the reference to the Sally show as she is not an established character in Marvel already and we can assume her parallel existence (at the time, anyways) without any questions.
Chris you are best at what you do! I have been trying to tell people it is not the Liefeld/Nicieza Deadpool they know and love, it is Joe Kelly's Deadpool they use in comics and movies today.
True but Liefeld still created Deadpool. You can’t take that from him. If we take that from them, then we have to Stan Lee’s creations away from him too
The Liefeld Deadpool is the one I love. DP is a joke of a character now
@@Linklex7 the only thing Liefeld is responsible for is the basic costume design he just ripped off Spider-Man and Deathstroke the Terminator to do that. Other creators are responsible for creating the character we know and love today
@@eclectExactly on point with Liefeld just ripping off other good characters to “create” a weak version.
DP only became super popular when others took their turn on him.
Rob is a joke but gets the laugh when he makes others believe he’s the reason DP is a good character, he’s NOT the reason.
Deadpool is good in spite of Liefeld.
@@traviswilcox3472 wow, easy with the hate, there is no need to put others down just because you do not like them.
Great episode, Chris! I had one of his early X-Force appearances as a kid.
@ComicTropes Joe Kelly def deserves his flowers, but it should be noted that despite a 3-year run, DEADPOOL was consistently in danger of being cancelled. He 100% gets credit for fleshing the character out, but not necessarily “popularizing” him.
To that end, I think Daniel Way gets overlooked. IIRC, he was the first to actually have a hit solo book with the character - relative to how sales had dipped from the ‘90s - and he did it by introducing Deadpool having 2 different dialogue boxes, reflecting his dissociative identity disorder. That aspect of the character didn’t last - perhaps because Editorial deemed it insensitive? - which makes it easy to skip over Way’s contributions to Deadpool himself, but just in terms of being the first writer to write a breakout book that readers didn’t have to worry about disappearing, I think his name should be in the conversation.
That’s a fair point.
I think there was a sort of Zeitgeist about Deadpool at the time. Deadpool started to appear in videogames right in the end of the 2000's, being in Marvel Ultimate Alliance and Marvel vs Capcom 3 as Daniel Way run was ongoing. He was nearly cancelled from Marvel vs Capcom 3 because not popular enough. Three year after that, Deadpool was everywhere and in every Marvel piece of media.
@@ahok1937 Very true. I just wanted to point out that Kelly's run was much like SPIDER-GIRL, constantly in danger of being put down, with fans being told they had to rally behind it if they wanted it to stick around.
I think Way's multiple personality gimmick was executed well and added to the humor -- enough that other writers using him in other titles incorporated it into their books, too -- but there is probably some truth to the culture happening to finally coalesce around the character at that time in a way that can't be quantified.
I thought the different dialogue boxes were because he somehow fused with Madcap.
@@yowatchieI believe that was a later retcon
Always enjoy your work putting comics in a greater context. I know it must take extra work. Thanks Chris!
Man I'm so glad you coveted this. Long time fan of the comics, the latest movie was alot of fun
Deadpool also appeared in the Secret Defenders series in the 90's.
Great trip down memory lane. Good stuff!
I want a adult animated Deadpool show that has so potential to be awesome man
I would argue that he started breaking the forth wall when he referenced being in a fight scene back in his first mini. Great video as usual hope this one does numbers for you.
You are so well versed!
Joe Kelly did so much for Deadpool’s personality
Awesome video! I’m definitely adding this to my favorites. I just wish you spoke about Daniel Way’s 2008-2012 run. It’s my favorite.
9:49 I swear this looks like a Spider-Man drawing just changed for dead pool lmao
Chris is 100% fair and correct. Well done!
The best looking Deadpool was the Joe Maduriera mini series.
Yeah, Kelly really made Deadpool deadpan. But it took a while. By the mid 2000's is when it really cemented in.
Deadpool was one of the few comics that still sold during the comic depression.
This video was very entertaining and points out a lot of cool issues to read. Thanks! Also congratulations on getting such a rad sponsor for this vid
That special issue Deadpool #1 with the embossed cover was one of the coolest things I'd seen as a teen. I only had access to the meager collection of comics at my local grocery store in a very small town. But that was a treasure for quite a while. I don't think the store received the rest of the series.
I was able to collect Generation X for a while. That first issue with the foil cover was also one of my treasures. Good times!
17:11 I really loved when they even had it there when Wade was dressed as Spiderman. I forgot which comic that was, but Pete was exhausted and was getting chased by someone. Wade switched costumes with Pete and distracted the villain while Pete rested.
This was interesting to watch. I knew that it took a few different writers to make Deadpool who he is, but it’s nice to hear the proper credits. I never knew Mark Waid had written for Deadpool. Also, getting sponsored by a convention is pretty cool.
Nicieza layed all the groundwork, especially in Circle Chase, with some seasoning by Waid, and Kelly fleshed it out into who we know today.
This video gave me a deeper understanding and enjoyment for Deadpool, thank you
Dude, props on the Rose City ComiCon sponsorship. That's big. Wish I could attend! Hope you end up at an Ohio con sometime!
Love this as an example that superhero (and villain) characters so often are a collective creation over time.
Great video!!! I was at the height of my collecting when Deadpool first appeared.
Love your videos, please keep them coming!!!
Boy. If I was in your part of town I would definitely go to rose city comic con.
Those first few mini-series were collected in Deadpool classic vol 1 which came out when i was in my early teens. Bought it with bday money and i was hooked man. Voraciously read everything i could with him in it.
Great episode Chris!!!
Keith Geffin's Ambush Bug's personality was breaking the fourth wall long before Deadpool. I'm surprised you didn't note that similarity.
I have a feeling that Liefeld wrote down a background for Deadpool with the character traits of Wolverine, Snake-eyes and Spiderman - so all the superpowers, attitude and background were created solely by him.
All those ideas were very popular in the 80s and it makes a lot of sense. The "sad clown element" was dramatized by a lot of Frank Miller characters, specifically Wolverine and everything you cite in "second Year" is taken from Wolverine: Limited Series, by Chris Claremont. Siryn looks a lot like Jean Grey, Wolverine's love interest.
fascinating, nice to see David Nakayamas art in the thumpnail, my first comicbook contact with Deadpool was the Posehn run starting with his marriage, read the older stuff later. Intersting to see that Joe Mad started as a 90s artist, my first contact with his work was Darksiders
It was Nicieza in 'Deadpool & Cable #2' that first referenced Ryan Reynolds as Deadpool "if he was crossed with a Shar-pei"
fr the best comic youtuber.
I'm not sure if I remember correctly, but I think that Joe Mad mini featured a shot of a character that was then swiped for the introduction of Rob's second most popular creation: Troll.
Great episode, Chris!
wish I was in portland!! have fun at the con! and thanks for another great episode :D
I remember first reading a deadpool comic cause it was more adult oriented, naked girls, violence, and crude humor. The whole chimichanga, but i ended up loving and connecting with deadpool for the tragic and painful life and depression he suffered from, and his use of humor to mask it. Deadpool is definitely a quality comicbook character, and im glad he got as popular as he did
Awesome video. I now have a much better understanding of how Deadpool came to be.
I hope you are doing well, Chris. 💙
I'm was a huge Joe Mad mark back then but Ian Churchill's version was definitely my favorite of the two mini-series
Deadpool always seems like an X-Men character to me, even though his history shows he's not attached to them that much. I think it's because his pairing/rivalries with Wolverine and Cable work so well. I really got into him with the Joe Kelly series in 1997. I remember picking it up because it was a new series, so I thought it'd be fun to get in on it before having to dig through a ton of old canon. Turns out I had no idea how much stuff he'd been in before, but still, easily my favorite 90s Marvel thing.
personally my favorite DP writer of all time is Daniel Way even if he wasn't the first to write him.
Man Ed McGuinness Batman is sick, its like Bruce Timm's but on steroids, so cool he had a hand in sculpting Deadpool into what he is today
Rob is definitely the loudest about his involvement in creating Deadpool but lets be frank...it was the writer Joe Kelly that made the character what it is. Ed's artwork is awesome but is not what I associate with the Deadpool popularity of today.
Deadpool never reminded me of Deathstroke, but always of Spider-Man. Design wise, that is.
Deadpool Vol.1, the five issue collection of a lot of his early appearances, was actually the first comic book I ever bought.
Excellent shirt choice for the video
You're very kind to Rob
Interesting to hear the Joe Kelly details on Deadpool. Gives me hope for his upcoming Amazing Spider-Man.
Back in 2008 when I was 18 years old I got into Daniel Way's version of Deadpool before I knew about the character.