Hybrid Planetary Gearset Trainer
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- Опубліковано 7 чер 2024
- ConsuLab's EM-200-29 Hybrid Planetary Gearset Trainer is designed to help automotive instructors teach and students to understand the somewhat complex operation of a typical hybrid vehicle drivetrain.
90% of the magic is in the last minute of the video.
nice 😂👍
Damn true
This video explains PERFECTLY how hybrid cars work but it was unnecessarily hard to find. I am no engineer and was just curious how two motors with different speeds are spinning the same wheel. If you add "How hybrid car engines work" to the title or tags it would save other people the hustle. After failed searching on my own, ChatGPT explained to me that it might be this "Planetary Gearset" which caused me to search for that term then found a short video in the recommendation about them from your channel, then I arrived at this video.
An absolutely fantastic piece of engineering, and a very good explanation. Thanks!
Thank you so much!
These hybrids are electric cars with gasoline assist. The main traction motor is geared directly to the drive wheels the same as Tesla (and most but not all electric cars). It is also connected to the ring gear of the planetary gearset. The gasoline engine can provide assistance up through the gearset and the gearset (with the smaller motor) provides CVT action for the gasoline engine. Above a certain speed the engine must start turning (not necessarily burning fuel) due to limitations of the gearset and smaller motor.
At highway speeds the 2 motors mainly work to make the gasoline engine do most of the work (at the optimum rpm). Under these circumstances you can argue that it is a gasoline car with electric assist.
The BEST... explanation on power split device, I have ever found.. THANK YOU so much
Thanks for explaining the transmission in my RAV4 PHEV. So smart and so smooth
The two electric motors work together to produce a superior Constantly Variable Transmission
with much simpler mechanics than in an ordinary IC car,
just this one planetary gear set !
ALL 5 generations of Prius use this same architecture. When I saw explained, I bought a new 2005 Prius.
I still have it. 18 years old, 150,000mis.
Still in perfect running order.
I live in LA. And feel just a little superior when sitting in LA traffic....
still working?
@@CelestialTrieye Yes. Runs perfectly. Everything works. Has never burned a drop of oil.
Needs shocks - the bushings wear.
Not uncommon for Gen 2 with about this mileage.
So, that's going on in my Toyota Auris Hybride!! Thanks for the lesson.
Not quite. On your Auris, the internal combustion engine is on the MG1-side. MG1 is also the one used to start the engine when needed.
the clearest video explaining ecvt on youtube. thumb up!
amazing simplicity.... and this is showing why is so reliable... there is nothing to break...
Thank you!
The engine is the weak link. Unlike the rest of the drivetrain, it needs a lot of maintenance and has a lot of parts that can fail easily, compared to an all electric drive system. Very clever though.
@@egoequus6263 what engine do you mean?
I have a similar idea past 20 days, and i work in, and now , April 2 of 2020 , i see this video, im ungry, but, excelente idea, congratulations. Victor Hugo Klaig, from Argentina.
This is absolutely a masterpiece of engineering.
Toyota hybrid system deserves more credit than just left lane hog Prius
What an incredibly clever system.
Now THAT'S a top tier lvl educational video!!!! Thanks a lot!!!!
Thank you very much!
Just bought my first Prius thanks for this vid!
Nice educational tool. I wish you succeed
A planetary gearset is a 3-way adapter for gears, allowing both the engine and MG2 to drive the car. And it works the other way too, where it allows the engine to output to either MG1 (to charge the battery) or MG2 (to drive the car). To reference another video, MG2 can trim excess energy and return this to MG1, to increase torque. Fascinating how much can be done with this simple setup, and it's a shame that most drivers find these too boring to use.
The one thing that surprises me is that no manufacturer or trainer calls the planetary gearset in these hybrids what it really is , and that is: a differential gearset.
Toyota calls it a "power split device".
They probably do this because some mechanics would get terribly confused if they called it a differential.
Just what I needed to better perceive. Next up to better comprehend would be the data in tables like in a spreadsheet for starters for the engine, MG1, MG2 and wheels RPM's to compare the relationships. What I'd like to know also is and additional set of voltage, current and frequency characteristics for MG1 and MG2 at the various capable RPM's. That'd be stunning.
Best and only reliable hybrid drive train, bless Toyota. This video is very educational especially for the journalists that do reviews and have no idea what they are talking about cvt and whinnying noise when under acceleration, there many things that rotate here at different speeds and directions.
Ford had it first, first domestic American hybrid in the USS, and uses the same type of transaxle except they started with more efficient the parallel type instead of the inline motor type, Toyota finally went with parallel in the 4th gen hybrids
@@Iahusha777Iahuah --- what is the Ford system called, and when was it implemented? Do you have a link or reference? thanks
@@Texaca the Ford escape Hybrid had the better parallel system first 1st gen 2nd gen escape and the same generation fusions and the c-max
From what wikipedia says, (I know, not the best source) Toyota and Ford both developed this independently, but it seems Toyota beat them to patents. Once Ford realized this could be a conflict, they approached Toyota about an agreement to not sue each other.
Then Ford contracted with a division of Toyota to actually build the transmissions, which were first in the escape hybrid, and every Ford hybrid model since then, right up to the new Maverick. The Maverick has a new motor motor design though, with angled magnets for greater efficiency, something they haven't put in the escape or previous hybrids.
Toyota uses the Same transmissions in the Prius.
Thank you so much. Finally i figured it.
You are welcome!
Excellent - thankyou. Do you have a feel for how much (if any) less efficient the system would be, if the HV battery was ONLY charged by regenerative braking? (i.e - the ICE was never used for charging).
😳 thx for the very good presentation.
Our pleasure!
Amazing work👍🏽
Thank you! Cheers!
Two motors are provided to provide a continuum of energy through all the modes of operation. MG2 is the larger Motor generator that powers the car using electric energy, MG1 is used to start the engine and by its design [ and the opposite rotational relationship ] creates differences in the rotational relationship between MG1 and MG2. The rotation of the electrical fields and magnets can maximize electrical efficiency [ considering the speed of the permanent magnets and the strength of the field coils ] also providing charging of the battery.
Eehawcbccdkyeeajkdu94r
Thank you, I couldn't figure out how actually the variable speed function works when the petrol engine runs...
Great video
Salute your hard work 💯💥💥💥💥💥💥👏👏👏👏
Thank you, our team worked greatly to realize this product.
Great content♥️
Thank u very much شكرا جزيلا لك
Just a quick question, when you are using MG1 to increase or decrease the ICE revolutions to the wheel (CVT operation) what happens to the torque available at the wheels? Does the torque from MG1 assist in any way the reduction (or overdrive) of the planetary gearset?
Very good product.
Thank you!
What is the power consumption of mg1 when being run clockwise, stationary and counterclockwise?
is Power split device only used in Toyota hybrid system? or Other company use PSD as well for their hybrids?
Nice product. With a pin and a hole you could have be able to lock whatever you wanna lock without needing to hold it yourself
Yes this is something we considered when designing the product, but for educational purposes we ask the students to do so. We have another trainer dedicated to teach just planetary gear sets which has a lock pin for each element.
Much better than the steal band CVT's
Calling it a kind of CVT is misleading. . Cvts are known for having friction surfaces that run against each other in hopes that they won't slip. How much power they can take without slipping is limited. This is direct drive gearing between multiple inputs/ outputs. The electric motor/generators can operate well in a large range of speeds but the engine is kept in a small range of speed to keep it at high efficiency. It doesn't look like it has anything that can slip like other CVTs.
Very nice presentation, and I do drive hybrid vehicle for long time, I still do not get It 😀😀😀😀🤣🤣🤣thank you.
I’m still trying to understand how the speed is variable but this has helped a lot! Thankyou. How does reverse work?
The gear ratio is controlled by the generator motor speed and it will change the gear ratio between the engine to the wheels,
I know you posted this 8 months ago but at least in the Toyota Prius design. Reverse is only accomplished through MG2 electrically. The gasoline engine cannot directly move the car backwards.
Other videos say 3 gear sets are used to vary speed
@Andrew H
It's just part of the basic design. Mg1 is driven off of the engine, and can drive the engine as the starter motor. Mg2 is the big one that provides power to the wheels. The gasoline engine can run while the car is reversing but I don't believe it provides any significant power to the wheels during that process. It can provide electrical power I believe which would then pass right back to mg2. The only time I've ever run into an issue with this is if I was trying to reverse up a extremely steep hill. Sometimes the car will not do it. Keep in mind my car is 14 years old with $409,000 mi on it. It's possible with a newer more powerful in better health Hybrid battery perhaps it could.
If you're interested in some very detailed teardown and theory of operation videos I would check out Weber automotive on UA-cam. That is a automotive technical college in Ogden utah. They specialize in hybrid and electric vehicles. He has a great series on several different Prius generations. And does a good job explaining how the transmission operates. As well as other systems.
Generally speaking you don't really need that much power in reverse. And you never go fast enough to really need the gas engine for help. Mg2 is pretty close to 50 horsepower which should be more than enough to take care of any needs the car should normally run into.
This is a very good demonstration, however the most important part which is the last minute of the video was not shown in detail.
Wow Very Nice
Many many thanks
in electric mode only, when MG2 is operating, we convert Electric from battery to mechanical(via MG2), which rotate ring gear of PSD, driving the wheels. But in that process, since Engine is off (Planet gear is at rest), the Sun gear rotates, transmitting power to MG1.
Question
What does MG1 do with that power?
Does it act as generator and convert it back to electricity?
If yes, then is it valid to think that some energy is lost, in this process? Because we convert electric to mechanical and again to electric (unnecessary for MG1) and losses may occur here?
Patil Shubham I’m pretty sure that MG1 is spun up but no power is generated because there’s no load on its windings. It’s basically a tiny flywheel in electric only (not reverse) mode.
Where can I get this demo device? I have a presentation coming up on toyota hybrid and I am looking for demo devices.
Email your request to sales@consulab.com
Ausgezeichnet 👍👍👍👍
Well played
it's not any dynamic ratio on a tranmission??
That's genius for a hybrid system.
It really is elegantly simple.
@@Consulab And very robust, and most likely a lot more reliable than automatic, manual and CVT transmissions, it's simpler too.
Please kindly explain that the starting off the vehicle is achieved by the engine or by the motor? What is the job of the generator and the motor in a hybrid vehicle? As far as I see the generator takes the energy from the engine
Thank you!
Starting off from a standstill the large electric motor drives the wheels (MG2). Each of the motors can also be a generator depending on circumstances.
How do you calculate the power/ torque output? Considering you have 3 different power inputs....how do you calculate that?
If you know the power output of each of the three power sources, ideally, the power output is simply the sum of the three power inputs. In reality, there will be some losses due to bearing friction and gear inefficiencies. Any time a motor/genset is in generator mode, its power counts as negative.
Toyota really advanced the entire evolution of the automobile with this. Why EVERY car hasn't replaced its automatic trans with a HSD by now is a mystery. Everyone thought they'd fail in the early 2000's. Everyone was scared of the batteries, lol. Manufacturers are phasing out a lot of vehicles these days in favor of JUST SUV's or JUST EV's. Well, phase out automatic trannies on cars that obviously benefit from HSD. Trucks that tow stuff can be left alone, but Allison needs to make a badass HSD for towing.
>Why EVERY car hasn't replaced its automatic trans with a HSD by now is a mystery
Because gov't incentives for hybrid cars mostly disappeared in the US. In an ideal world tax credits would depend on emissions instead of having a hard cutoff, but we don't live in that world.
@@NavinF indeed, we live in a world that doesn't reward the BEST or more innovative design, but the one that gives more control to those in power.
@@CelestialTrieye You're confusing incompetence with malice
@@NavinF I can't count how many times I have heard that. I can assure you, I am not.
THANKS FOR THE ANSWER. Could you explain me another think…. The reverse gear has made to invert the phases in the MG2...Is it correct?? If so, this means that the revers gear has made only in electric mode...is it correct?? If so, could you explain me the action of engine motor while the electric motor is doing the reverse gear?? Since usually this happens just you start with the cold engine?? Thanks in advance
In case you haven't yet received an answer to your question, I thought I'd give it a shot. It's actually MG1 (2nd gen Prius transaxles anyway) that handles reverse. For a really good explanation and demo, have a look at this video from Weber State: ua-cam.com/video/ZmHpSyTsfm0/v-deo.html
Cheers!
@@smashogre4766 so, the point is MG1 is the electric generator? or it can be MG2 too? If it be a generator, what direction it did? at clockwise or counter clockwise? thanks
@@sitinurw706 Both MG1 and MG2 can be motors and generators as needed. They can both spin in both directions.
good day, how can i purchase this? thank you
How can I buy this setup?
Which cars have this setup? would be nice to know. thank you.
Latest Toyota Hybrid motors have this transmission
I don't understand how MG1 acts as gear selector while main power goes from gasoline engine. Can this gearbox work as CVT purely on gasoline engine power without electric support?
No, the battery is kept always in a non-depleted state
please i want the design of the parts
My idea for a diesel hybrid semi trailer or tractor trailer as they call them in the USA is easily done....
Think of an electric motor bolted to a differential with one or two generators on a small turbo diesel engine charging a battery pack with cables running to one electric or two electric motors...
With one generator ran from the accessory drive and one generator ran from the crankshaft....
With no drive shafts directly connected to any differentials...
With regenerative braking of course...
Where i can get that type planetary gear set?
at Consulab.com or you can email sales@consulab.com
how to buy this product?
everything was understandable except the very last part (5'00") where both the internal combustion engine (ICE) is running (at fix rpm) and MG1 is also being running in one direction or the other....in my understanding MG1 main function was to work as generator, (re)charging the batteries and to work as ICE starter from standstill.....the video explanation do transmit the idea that by controlling the direction and speed of rotation of MG1 (and while ICE runs a fix rpm) we can change the speed of rotation of the wheels (= change the speed of the vehicle)....is that right?...but MG1 is the smaller MG...what is MG2 doing in that stage? (it keeps rotating too in the video)....a bit lost...
Electricity doesn't go to the stator of MG2 so it won't join moving the vehicle, but will act as generator and charge the battery.
As their names imply, MG1 and 2 can work as motors AND as generators as needed. You understood correctly how the MG1 is used to produce an effect similar to a CVT transmission. However, this also means that a car with a hybrid system like this (Toyota HSD) will always require the MG1 to spin (or be held in place) in order to move under gasoline power. However, technically the car can move without having a gasoline engine at all.
The electricity to spin the MG1 is drawn from two sources. It can come from the drive battery, in which case the MG2 will just spin freely to minimize resistance. Remember, the MG2 is permanently connected to the wheels, so whenever the vehicle moves it has to spin as well. On the highway, or when driving while battery charge is low, the MG2 will be used as a generator to charge the battery and/or to provide power to MG1.
@@Tuppoo94 Are we to understand then the the energy loss to drive MG1 such that it varies the CVT function is less then the power losses to an traditional geared transmission?. Are we also to understand their are times when Mg1 can be be delivering current to MG2 or the batteries and also be affecting CVT effective gearings? Varied inductance I assume?
Why do they use two motors? Is it possible to make a similar drivetrain with only one motor?
For what purpose? This simulates the gasoline engine and the electric drive motor.
Because one motor is simpler and cheaper
@@roma7485 AKA Honda IMA.....as per Insight, Civic Hybrid...it's an inferior system in practice.
Because it is a model of Toyota Prius, which is hard for some to wrap their head around. And thus this model is here to explain it all.
Honda historically used a single motor unit (the IMA hybrid) as well as Nissan (front motor dual clutch hybrid), both of which ended up being inferior to Toyota's two motor planetary gearset hybrid system. Honda themselves have ditched the single motor IMA hybrid for a new two motor hybrid system (no planetary gearset used however).
In fact Ford employs the same two motor system in the Escape & Fusion hybrid (as well as plug-ins) and recently Chrysler Pacifica e-hybrid being the latest to use this design.
So you mean there's a bunch of wheels and gears and motors and engines and sometimes they turn and sometimes they don't.
Precisely
Is that the same the Ecvt gearbox in my hybrid Lexus…?
Yes, the same style of technology.
5:00 missed opportunity to demonstrate that MG1 has to spin very fast when the engine is running in order to reverse the vehicle.
Yes, that would've been a great moment to show reverse operation. If you've ever seen the scan data MG1 does indeed spin very VERY fast when you reverse the vehicle and the engine is running. Maybe next time!
Please tell me a vehicle name that includes this technology.
A Toyota Prius
There are quite a few. Check this out:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hybrid_Synergy_Drive#List_of_vehicles_with_HSD_technology
I believe Chrysler/stellanis hybrids, at least the pacifica, now use e-drive which also uses planetary gear sets.
Don't get too good at that, else Toyota will hire you and you'll have to travel to exotic Charlotte or charming Tulsa.
How does neutral work on this ?
I'm curious as well. I don't think it really has a neutral, just doesn't put it in park by locking the gears. Probably releases the clutch on the engine and drops power to MG's to zero. Source : I have a prius and I'm guessing
I wonder if the guy in the video understood what he was talking about?
I certainly hope so!
請問動力流失了多小?
产品功率损失？ 还是现实生活中的车？
Came to life at 4:30! You should've shown different drive modes from the start and the viewer could've figured the rest out!
what is mg2?
MG = Motor/Genset. It means it is an electromechanical machine that can either act as a motor, or a generator, depending on the circumstances. There are two motor/gensets, hence they are named MG1 and MG2.
Definitely it's created by genius not like kind of normal people such as me.
How did they imagine the structure of PSD.
This model does not apply to the first and second generation GM Voltec or the Hyundai Blue Drive
Correct. Because the GM Voltec can run on the electric main motor at 160km/u, and that would in a prius style series hybrid the second generator motor too fast. Different design.
Yes Mark you are correct! This is a very basic version of what Toyota and other manufacturers do, however it is not the configuration you would find in a GM or Hyundai.
Is it just me seeing that planet carrier is in orange?
--- correct.
God damnit I thought they were demonstrating a product they sell, not selling a demonstration product lol.
Good point at 0:20. People who call engines "motors" tend to be unsophisticated mechanics or hicks.
4:59
How much?
please contact sales@consulab.com for pricing!
The Hybrid gear set look simple than Automatic Transmission set gears,
This just focuses on the one gearset that accomplishes the mixing of the power sources. There very well could be additional planetary gear stages if necessary for the design.
bro, im more confused than i was before.
vaginasauruss Me too!
It´s like a rubix cube of gearing. Focus on the logic of it and it will become easier to understand.
It really is a difficult concept to explain even through a video. Hands-on is best! This trainer has helped many students, technicians and teachers experience and "feel" the interaction between the gearsets and when you feel it, you get it.
@@Consulab ---- I'm gonna have to build me one of my own, since I'll never be able to afford one of yours, muchless be able to afford a classroom that teaches anything about hybrids in Texas, which is a Right to Slave Wages State.
The secondary and tertiary education, following High school in this state sucks, unless you are in the top 1%, of the 1%,. Top 5% doesn't count anymore.
.
Thank you for uploading and sharing this demonstration.
@@Texaca Good luck. We've put tons of hours and financial resources into this.
I thought this technology is from Toyota?
volume is so low
how planetary gearset work ua-cam.com/video/ARd-Om2VyiE/v-deo.html This is the video you are looking for
Ora mudeng dul
I believe 90+% of viewers don't understand how it works.
You are right, Sr, the brain is for selected persons only!
and then you have tesla, where there is only MG1 😂
Those drive wheels are way out of alignment.
Yes, they may be a little bit wobbly. They do capture the students attention and help them understand what is going on, so mission accomplished!
But why?
Вроде нормально
Thank you!
A disaster on high vehicle speed , you need energy to run fast the mg1 in order to have a long trasmission ratio
Yes, MG1 may run fast in many situations, including reverse!
@@Consulab I believe I understand current and inductive resistance is used to vary the speed of MG1 thus allowing CVT function. For MG1 to resist rotation such that the gearset achieves overdrive sufficient to attain US intersate speeds for an ICE, often a .8 overdrive or more:
1) Is MG1 still able to deliver current, or is is now demanding current to enforce the over-drive?
2) Is there any state such that the ICE is driving the wheels and MG2 is charging the batteries (since MG1 may not be able to)?
Thanks!
영상 초반 서두가 너무 길다 .ㅋㅋㅋㅋ
Come on! It is Toyota Prius, nothing new....
You are correct, not much new under the sun. Toyota and others have been using this technology for a couple decades already! It is however, still hard for many students to learn. Thus the need for training aids.
Too slow to the Point!!!
whatever, the AT is the best , i don't like any CVT DCT ECVT... they all rubbish !