For a video, you said was going to be "biased"; I found it to be very informative. You outlined the pros & cons of both, very well. Thank you for that. As you stated, the job, dictates the tool. As I do most all of my tech/wreck diving from a boat, I use back-mounted doubles. They sit nicely on my back, and my trim is easy to set and maintain. As I am contemplating getting my cave diving certification after many years of "no frackin way!", I do see myself also being a side mount diver in the near future, because, that will be the proper tool for the job. Thank you for a complete, non-biased video. Dive safe. 🙂
Glad you liked the video sammoyers905. Though I prefer Sidemount, I encourage all divers to use the system that suits their needs, and the system they feel the most comfortable with.
I’ve been doing both for 6 years and recently started ccr P2. I agree with everything you said, I have the steel 80 bm and it’s heavy. I’m 6’2” and 200 lbs. the side Mount feels so much easier in and out of the water…
Glad you liked the video Felipe C H Bertin. Here is a video you may find interesting that may help you out with boat entries in rough seas while diving sidemount. ua-cam.com/video/uKs_i7kzPKg/v-deo.html
Hi Bryan! Thanks for the video. I almost always enjoy watching your videos and find them interesting. This was a good topic. I’m also an instructor and I teach on both twin sets and sidemount, and I agree that both have their uses/strengths. You mention that there’s no “standard” sidemount set up, which is absolutely true. I would bet that a lot of people would like to learn about how you set up your sidemount and tips and tricks. I would also bet that you’ve got similar tips and tricks for settings up reels/spools, which type of lights are better, recreational long hose set up, and many other set up and “hacks” that you know from your long diving experience that would really help divers level up.
Hello Charles Cox, we have made several videos in the past showing how I set up my Sidemount bottles, and we even have a new one coming out on December 16th, showing both my double and single Sidemount set ups. We are traveling down to Cozumel at the end of December, where I will be spending a full week sidemount diving while using one cylinder. Our goal is to make a series of videos on single tank sidemount diving covering topics on balance, trim, and buoyancy control. I will also be adding an accessory series on how I personally set up my reels and SMB's. Starting in 2023, our video format will be changing to more of a series based system, instead of just individual videos. Each topic will be covered over a series of videos, instead of just one video here and there. Stay tuned.
I did backmount twins first and loved it, although an old shoulder injury does make it very hard for me to manipulate the L/H valve. I'm now concentrating on sidemount and find it more comfortable and, as you say, getting perfect trim is so easy. It's like lounging on a sofa rather than perching on a bar stool. Yes it's a pain to keep the tanks in balance rather than just breathing both down together. But as a plus I find if I'm not breathing them down to minima on Dive 1 I can work it to get away with just a single fill and still have enough for an hour or more in Dive 2. I think having both skill sets makes you a better diver and allows you to pick what's best for you on any given dive.
Thanks for sharing this topic and how timely for me. I literally in the lats two days just built my first twins set. I went with back mount Halcyon steel backplate and wing running two steel 100. After five years of diving single steel 100 I came to a need for extended bottom time. Quire a few of my lost item searches are multiple days long consuming larger areas of search or at deeper depths still within recreational no decompression dive limits. That is my need and at first was focused on side mount then landed on back mount considering the type of underwater work I will primary be using the system for. Believe me not looking forward to hauling that added weight of doubles but it should open the opportunity for extended search time under water for me is certain situations. Literally as a bottom feeder woking search patters inch by inch over the floor in marine and cold nasty silty lake bottoms the back mount will likely work for me. I say this now and fairly convinced that I'm not at this time at all interested in tech or cave diving. The diving I will be using twin back mount for will have no over head or penetration. I do see how tossing two side mount cylinder on a tether over the edge of my 14 foot inflatable kayak "rib" would be so much easer than a twin set. However working the bottom having fixed cylinders on back mount is likely a better configuration. That all being said well see how it works out. Believe me diving single steel 100 will still be my go to unless the extended dive time is truly needed. What ever it is we do we have to try some things and be honest with ourselves if its sustainable and suitable for our body type and back... If the back mount turns into too much of a pain for hauling purposes I can easily setup a proper side mount rig and give that a go. Fortunately I still have decent dexterity of my arms so operating my valves should not be problematic for me. Fortunately I have some great dive shop support in my area. One focused on tech and back mount and another shop a long time fan of side mount. All this cold water heavy gear diving here in the PNW compared to holiday diving in Hawaii with an AL80 in a 3 mm shorty in clear 80 F waters is like a walk in the park... 🤣 Well check back in down the road for an update and see how twin back mount has worked for me. Cheers, #SeattleRingHunter
A third option is independent backmount doubles. This provides most of the advantages of both backmount and sidemount systems. Here are several videos on the subject of independent backmount doubles: ua-cam.com/play/PLsuQ0CssSs-cYTmQ4RD82EtS0cCO3exIw.html
Good point, years ago I used to use independent doubles for ice diving or solo wreck diving, when I started using nitrox I ran independent doubles with EAN32 and air and all the new tech divers admonished me on how unsafe that configuration was, the sidemount became the big fad for all the kool kids and gory are essentially independent doubles. Yes, I know the valves are easier to reach but the gas management is another task loading. Now days I use manifolded doubles with isolator for Deep wreck diver and doubles and/or sidemount for cave diving.
Would like to add about side mounted cylenders on land: While it is a bit more awkward and you have to set up boltsnaps and DRings to mount the necks to y our harness vs just bungee looping them, there is a benefit that the weight of the cylenders is moved central and to your hips. This puts the load only on the knees and hips (like a squat at the gym), vs having the load of doubles pulling backwards on your spine, and having to compensate by leaning forward and straining your back. Ergonomically this puts quite a bit less stress on your body, especially if you are a petite diver trying to shlep big steel high pressure tanks around.
You make a great point David Maruca. When I walk with Doubles, I can definitely feel more stress in my spine. With Sidemount cylinders, the stress is a lot less. For my personal Sidemount system, I get more stress in my upper shoulders, as my harness tends to dig in more. It all depends on how high I have my lower attachment points set. Mine measures out to 14 1/2 inches, which means the weight is pretty balanced between my waist strap and my should D-rings. Thankfully, most places I go Sidemount diving, my walks are very short.
Great video, my answer is a little skewed as I do backmount rebreather and sidemount rebreather. But pros and cons are very similar to OC. For me its what's the best tool for the job. I usually do backmount for deep dives as my sides are open for more bailout gas. Overhead, especially restrictive overhead I use sidemount, also airplane travel with sidemount is easier.
Hello Stefan W, we agree, using the best tool for the job (the dive), is the best option. Personally, though I prefer one over the other, I try my best to be proficient with both, so that I can be prepared for any given situation.
Hello Brian, for me definitely Sidemount. Due to football, my knees and back cant handle the weight of doubles. Also, there’s something to say about two independent systems. I prefer the redundancy. As always, thanks for the great videos!
Glad you liked the video francis bevacqua. The ease of the redundancy system is what does it for a lot of our divers here locally. The ability to see a problem and fix the problem in front of them versus having the problem occur behind their back is what they like the most.
I struggled with this concept, and still do, regarding sidemount vs. backmount. Ultimately for me, because I don't really have any health issues (back, knees, stamina), I chose backmount twinset because it offered a logical step towards carrying a rebreather. I do plan on taking the sidemount course, and getting properly trained to use that toolset, but it seemed that if I am accustom to wearing a lot of weight on my back in the first place, a rebreather will not be any extra physical challenge. Sidemount also comes into play later in the rebreather game, as multiple stage bottles are often required for some types of dives. Since the rebreather takes up tank space on ones back, the stage bottles will have to be sidemounted. Also, I don't typically do small space penetration dives, but rather stay in one area for an extended period of time, extra gas and simplicity of setup made more logical sense personally for me. I already own a backplate, so purchasing a larger wing is no big deal. Finally, I do believe it is up to the individual diver and their needs. Dress for where you are going, utilize the tools available for a successful dive. I am happy to help out other dive buddies in sidemount situations, but I will just about always have doubles on my back.
I like how you worded it JayYoung, "Dress for where you are going, utilize the tools available for a successful dive." This is a great piece of advice.
Very good video. Application does depend upon a persons mission. If you will, the only variable that you did not visit would be limited visibility and possible entanglement could happen when it comes to doubles versus side mount
I didn’t feel it was biased since you really gave fair good points on both. Actually this makes quite interested in learning side mount diving. I live in Australia but will be coming to the US in February to visit my mom. Where are you guys located and do you teach this specialty? I’d love to finally meet you guys other than on UA-cam. Thanks for all the teachings during my almost two years diving your channel has been a great source of knowledge.
I started diving sidemount after I broke a vertebra in an accident. Having tanks on my back was just painful. Even though my back has healed I stayed with sidemount due to its streamline and comfort in the water. It can be a bit more work on the surface. Now that I'm a full cave diver I'm happy I took this path, since it's allowed me to enter more and tighter caves. It's great. Mounting one or more stages is also just an extension of sidemounting. I definitely see the benefit of a twinset on a boat with choppy seas but I'm rarely in that situation so I doubt I'll switch to them. Maybe I'll do GUE fundies some day to at least have experience with both. I rarely walk with my sidemount tanks on to the water. Instead I carry one or two tanks to the shore or cave before dressing up, just like you'd do with a scooter.
Hello Yggdrasil42, thanks for sharing your experience with us. I too suffer from back issues, and much prefer Sidemount for all the same reasons. Unfortunately, at the end of the day, I still have to wear doubles from time to time, so I try to stay proficient with them as well.
Hello craigblanch2767, here is a video explaining how we attach the shears to our BCD. ua-cam.com/video/em3FMku0bQM/v-deo.html The Shears we use are the Lifeguard Systems. lakehickoryscuba.com/products/lifeguard_shears_sheath
Hello Lars Dennert, it all depends on the cylinders you choose. My steel 80's are only slightly heavier than my aluminum 80's. Also, a diver can choose between soft, aluminum, steel, and heavy steel back plates, which helps with weight distribution as well. Just as a frame of reference, with a 3mm, I rarely use any weight in freshwater, and only 8 pounds in saltwater. With double steel 80's, my weight would be more than needed in a 3mm. Since the buoyancy charatoristics change in aluminum 80's, when diving sidemount in a 3mm, my weight requirements never change. I personally use both soft plates, and steel plates, depending on what my weight requirements are. During work related dives when I need the extra gas, and I choose to use doubles, I am 9 out of 10 times using a Drysuit, with very buoyant undergarments. Thus, the extra weight of the double steel cylinders helps out as you stated. But in a 3mm, I would simply be pinned to the bottom.
@@LakeHickoryScuba Thanks, interesting outcome. Sounds like a warm water 3mm sidemount AL80 with no extra lead and a cold water steel doubles set up with no extra lead might not be that different in total weight, especially if a CF or Kidex plate is used. I realize accessories and other gear may play a part depending on the dive, such as needing Jets with a drysuit over say Quattros with 3mm, but forgetting that.
if I'm teaching an OW course, I'll go backmounted single with a jacket BCD. when I'm conducting an AOW couirse or diving for fun, I dive single-cylinder sidemount with long hose. with single-cylinder sidemount, my air consumption is better due to better hydrodynamics and I can get a little closer to marine life
Hello @hanscap. This specific video was made over several trips to Lake Phoenix. We frequent there quite often. Most of our videos are produced several months in advanced prior to them going live on UA-cam. I truly do not remember when we filmed these segments.
Hi Bryan, I've been looking at switching to sidemount for a bit now. Thank you for the video. I had a quick question about keeping the sidemounts balanced: other than losing the obvious benefits of having two standalone systems, could you not connect the sidemounts similar to the doubles but with a hose system, and breathe them down together (for recreational diving purposes)?
Hello @FFAdventuresOriginal. UTD actually makes a manifolded system that allows you to manifold Sidemount cylinders. www.utdscubaequipment.com/product-page/isolatable-manifold
I think much of the internet is biased towards sidemount due to it being the cool new thing that's big in social media... If you asked me which I thought was better before I had tried either I would have confidently said sidemount... Now I'm not so sure. I've recently started backmount steel twins. As soon as I was able to actually reach the valves (this is the worst thing about twins!) I found them satisfactory and it definitely opened up diving to a completely new level for me. Backmount may be old-school but I don't think it's going anywhere because for most things it just works, no fuss, and it's easy to get into because there's not too many extra skills and the standardisation really helps make things clearer. Although I don't have any experience stage handling with sidemount, I'm pretty sure it's easier to do with backmount. Stage handling is something I have to do relatively frequently so it makes sense to optimise for that. I'm headed towards cave diving so sidemount is definitely in my future, don't get me wrong. I know I still have a few years before I really do anything particularly tight - so it's twins and all their advantages for me in the meantime.
Hello @harambeexpress, there are pro's and con's to each. Even though I have my preference, both Sidemount and Back Mount are tools a diver can use depending on what the dive calls for. Thankfully, a lot of my dives, both systems work great, and I can choose either one based on personal preference and not out of necessity. I encourage divers who can use both tools to continue to practice with both, so they will be prepared to dive that system when the time comes.
To a man with a hammer, every problem is a nail... 🤣Why pick? It all depends as you say, on what the task is... having options is a beautiful thing! I actually dive BOTH sidemount and DOUBLES, but with a twist: I don't use manifolded doubles, I use INDEPENDENT doubles! I refuse to be limited by other people's biases. Sidemount is wonderful on shore dives, and on calm waters. Donning and doffing tanks in the water is a dream! Doubles are great on choppy waters, and when its time to get back on the boat. I like doubles when I'm digging in a wreck or grabbing lobsters. Not having stuff restricting my arms range of motion is very convenient. And yes, getting on trim on sidemount is a dream. I have an independent doubles adapter that allows me to slap those babies on a backplate as fast as the doubles. Advantages: same regulator switching technique in both setups, I can use the same exact tanks and regulators, and I don't have to schlepp those heavy bastards on and off my truck, to the dive shop and on and off a boat. Best of both worlds!
I do both I started with back mount twins after a couple years I took side mount. Each one has it plus and minus getting to valves and donning doffing to me is more difficult. Sidemount switching regs regularly is something I have grown accustomed too but it’s more customizable
Thanks for sharing Ivory Johnson. That is one of the things we hear a lot from new Sidemount divers. They struggle with changing second stages on normal basis. After a little bit of practice, it becomes second nature to them.
I like backmount twin for the freedom of movement, easy to add tanks to the side for long dives and more. Cons, heavy asf and a pain to put together sometimes. Once set though its great for open water and caves just not in the tight fitting spot. Sidemount is explore cave only for me. Open water is cool and sleek but to have a long dive means a cluster f*** of tanks and hoses. Even rebreathers. Kiss sidewinder for tight exploring caves, Kiss spirit for open water and some(many) caves. And again, to add tanks sidemount to a backmount twin system is easy peasy where side mount more sidemount tanks is a cluster. Alot to discuss with both for pros and cons but I think you pretty much nailed it minus preferring sidemount to regular dives lol. One love, no matter what the equipment is as long as it's proper and safe.
Thanks for sharing @anthonylacy4466, you are correct in regards to adding cylinders. It is definitely easier in back mount. Sidemount can be difficult at times, especially in a Dry Suit. Over the years my back has slowly degraded, constantly making it more and more difficult and causing a ton of discomfort for me. This is still why I prefer Sidemount. But as you stated, doing it properly and safely is the key no matter which way you choose.
Hello lewnance, glad you liked the video. And let me say, great question. The answer is yes it does. For single tank diving, saying in a teaching situation, I much prefer backmount. With this being said, I am headed to Cozumel late December, and will be spending a week there single tank sidemount diving. We are planning a video series showing how we do it while traveling abroad, and while having limited options on configurations and cylinder choices.
I am diving double 12 Liter steel backmount at the moment and I will stick to this system for dives where stages are needed. Stage handling is much more easy if your main system is out of the way. But I see a huge advantage in Sidemount for traveling. It is a very light system if you go by plane and very easy to get cylinders if you can’t bring your own. I love to visit wrecks and a single cylinder setup just lacks the redundancy I prefer to have. And if there is a second dive after your primary wreck dive you just take two new cylinders and off you go. Try to find a place where they have two sets of doubles for each diver as rental gear😂😢
Not sure if Tec diving is in my future but it seems like i'd probably go with sidemound just due to the ease of maneuvering tanks around. So far I haven't gone anywhere that a 100 cf wasn't enough gas. Probably the next step for me is getting used to dragging a pony bottle around. I think you've done some vids about brining a pony with you but maybee a refresh video on the setup would be nice specifically slinging it under an arm rather than mounting it to a single tank.
Hello kevindavison6019, I will be happy to make a video about mounting a pony bottle. We are preparing for a week in Cozumel, and another week in West Palm Beach, so as soon as I get back (late January), we will try to get a video out for you.
I dive back mount doubles. They’re far cheaper and don’t need a whole new certification to use them. The only con for me is the weight. I’m a small guy 5’9” and 140lbs. Carrying my own weight in dive equipment is devastating on my body especially after military service. I’d like to at least try side mount when I get the money for a whole new rig and certification.
I’ll dive sidemount without training. I never got “certified” to use a drysuit, I just did it. I never got “certified” to use a hydraulic chainsaw underwater, I just did it. I’m not against certification. You need to know when to seek it. I would never go cave diving without certification.
When I started diving sidemount I did NOT like it. I found it awkward and uncomfortable and didn’t think I would continue. Once I found a BC that I really liked and took the time to get it set up, everything felt really good and now I prefer it to backmount. I still think boat entries are easier with backmounted tanks - just one giant stride and I’m ready to go. With sidemount I have to have the tanks handed to me after I step in, and I don’t have a regulator or snorkel when I hit the water. Getting back on the boat, however, I really like being able to hand my tanks up and not having to haul my fat butt PLUS two tanks up the ladder. For shore diving with uneven and rocky entries I like the ability to drag my tanks into the water without any other gear, then donning them once I’m deep enough to not have to try to stay on my feet. Upon exit when the tanks are positively buoyant, it’s so easy to disconnect them and float them to the exit point without worrying about stepping on a rock or in a hole and twisting my ankle.
Thanks for sharing your experience with us Michael Dodge. We have a video that may help you with boat entries when handing down bottles is not an option (basically rough seas). ua-cam.com/video/uKs_i7kzPKg/v-deo.html
Hello MrBear2002, I applaud you for having the will power and physical back strength to do so. I cringe every time I have to use my short steel 80's doubled up, I couldn't imagine the 133's.
Thank you for asking Stormblessed. It is still here. I am currently waiting on a heart monitor, which puts me out of the water for 2 weeks. My doctor believes everything is stress induced, but my cardiologist believes my atriums (the upper chambers of your heart) are mis-firing, causing the skipped beats and PAC's (Premature Atrial Contractions). Both are suggesting the heart monitor for a two week period to see when the mis-firing is happening the most. Other than being extremely lethargic at certain times, I haven't really had to change anything throughout the day. The PAC's are really prevelent at night, and I wake up several times throughout the night from the pounding in my chest. PAC's are actually normal in a lot of people, however, mine seem to be happening more frequently than most. Worst case scenario, I am looking at very minor heart surgery (if there is such a thing), to fix the PAC's from occuring. If my doctor is correct and its stress induced, then treating the stress will hopefully fix the problem. Once I have a monitor, we should have more answers.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts with us dive addict 6885. Several of the divers here in our area prefer doubles as well. I spent all day yesterday wearing doubles as well. As I am preparing for a trip to Mexico to do some Sidemount Diving, I had to make sure all of my Sidemount gear is dry. Thus, the dive I made required extra gas, so doubles were neccessary.
I just want a sidemount BCD that has leg loops instead of a crotch strap. Why do NO manufacturers offer this!?!?! With all the thought and development going into the design of sidemount BCD’s, the crotch strap is the best they can do?!? I refuse to pay big money for a dumb crotch strap!!
Hello @E_Clampus_Vitus. Adding leg loops to a Sidemount BCD is a very simple process. That is the great thing about Sidemount, you can set you specific system up in a manner that suits your needs. Happy diving.
@ Do you have any information on how this process works? It seems to me that the leg loops must be sewn on. This is also making alterations to a piece of equipment that your life depends on. Seems sketchy to me. I rather buy something that was produced specifically with leg loops. Just seems so bizarre that the year is now 2024 and the “crotch strap” is still standard.
Great question. Let loops are more common than you realize. They are attached in the same manner as a standard crotch strap, and can be added with simple hardware that the majority of Divers Shops carry in stock. I would encourage you to visit your local training center to get assistance in how to add leg loops.
@I can go to the major manufacturers website and look for leg loop options. I see none. I get that I could probably ‘Frankenstein’ together some type of rig that would work. My point is this, I don’t want to spend $800 on something that I need to go and modify so it works better. For $800 I think leg loops should be standard but at least an option. I would suggest leg loops on a sidemount BCD is not common at all. Very few videos about it on UA-cam. I found one and it was a complete grope on the dark. I’m not going to spend $800 on a BCD I need to alter in order to fit my needs. I’ll wait. I might not get back into diving, TBH. Since Covid, my lung function has diminished. 🥲 Going back to diving now, with diminished lung function is probably not a good idea. Thank you US government for producing such a vile disease in that lab in Wuhan. Where’s the outrage?!? 😡
![How I Setup Sidemount Bottles {[Doubles vs Singles]}](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/xpoNfSiBJJw/mqdefault.jpg)
![How I Setup Sidemount Bottles {[Doubles vs Singles]}](/img/tr.png)
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
For a video, you said was going to be "biased"; I found it to be very informative. You outlined the pros & cons of both, very well. Thank you for that. As you stated, the job, dictates the tool.
As I do most all of my tech/wreck diving from a boat, I use back-mounted doubles. They sit nicely on my back, and my trim is easy to set and maintain.
As I am contemplating getting my cave diving certification after many years of "no frackin way!", I do see myself also being a side mount diver in the near future, because, that will be the proper tool for the job.
Thank you for a complete, non-biased video.
Dive safe. 🙂
Glad you liked the video sammoyers905. Though I prefer Sidemount, I encourage all divers to use the system that suits their needs, and the system they feel the most comfortable with.
I’ve been doing both for 6 years and recently started ccr P2. I agree with everything you said, I have the steel 80 bm and it’s heavy. I’m 6’2” and 200 lbs. the side Mount feels so much easier in and out of the water…
Hello William Sweet. I agree, sidemount feels way more comfortable for me as well.
It's great to see and hear finally a video covering this subject with frankly the truth.
Glad you liked the video JURASSIC DIVER UK.
Great video!
As an Sidemount Instructor and Intro-to-Cave Diver I personally prefer Sidemount, but it is very difficult when in troubles seas.
Glad you liked the video Felipe C H Bertin. Here is a video you may find interesting that may help you out with boat entries in rough seas while diving sidemount. ua-cam.com/video/uKs_i7kzPKg/v-deo.html
Thank you buddy!! Been looking for a vid like this for a while!! Blessings!!
Glad you liked the video CubanazoJB.
Hi Bryan! Thanks for the video. I almost always enjoy watching your videos and find them interesting. This was a good topic. I’m also an instructor and I teach on both twin sets and sidemount, and I agree that both have their uses/strengths. You mention that there’s no “standard” sidemount set up, which is absolutely true. I would bet that a lot of people would like to learn about how you set up your sidemount and tips and tricks. I would also bet that you’ve got similar tips and tricks for settings up reels/spools, which type of lights are better, recreational long hose set up, and many other set up and “hacks” that you know from your long diving experience that would really help divers level up.
Hello Charles Cox, we have made several videos in the past showing how I set up my Sidemount bottles, and we even have a new one coming out on December 16th, showing both my double and single Sidemount set ups. We are traveling down to Cozumel at the end of December, where I will be spending a full week sidemount diving while using one cylinder. Our goal is to make a series of videos on single tank sidemount diving covering topics on balance, trim, and buoyancy control. I will also be adding an accessory series on how I personally set up my reels and SMB's. Starting in 2023, our video format will be changing to more of a series based system, instead of just individual videos. Each topic will be covered over a series of videos, instead of just one video here and there. Stay tuned.
I did backmount twins first and loved it, although an old shoulder injury does make it very hard for me to manipulate the L/H valve. I'm now concentrating on sidemount and find it more comfortable and, as you say, getting perfect trim is so easy. It's like lounging on a sofa rather than perching on a bar stool. Yes it's a pain to keep the tanks in balance rather than just breathing both down together. But as a plus I find if I'm not breathing them down to minima on Dive 1 I can work it to get away with just a single fill and still have enough for an hour or more in Dive 2. I think having both skill sets makes you a better diver and allows you to pick what's best for you on any given dive.
I agree completely Tim Gosling, be efficient in both methods, makes you a more well rounded diver.
Ha Byran, getting many side mount skills here in the Philippines, hope to visit you fall of 2023,keep up the great work👍🏽
Hello @user-kr9ev6jp6w, come see us. We will take you diving on the lake sometime.
Thanks for sharing this topic and how timely for me. I literally in the lats two days just built my first twins set. I went with back mount Halcyon steel backplate and wing running two steel 100. After five years of diving single steel 100 I came to a need for extended bottom time. Quire a few of my lost item searches are multiple days long consuming larger areas of search or at deeper depths still within recreational no decompression dive limits. That is my need and at first was focused on side mount then landed on back mount considering the type of underwater work I will primary be using the system for. Believe me not looking forward to hauling that added weight of doubles but it should open the opportunity for extended search time under water for me is certain situations. Literally as a bottom feeder woking search patters inch by inch over the floor in marine and cold nasty silty lake bottoms the back mount will likely work for me.
I say this now and fairly convinced that I'm not at this time at all interested in tech or cave diving. The diving I will be using twin back mount for will have no over head or penetration. I do see how tossing two side mount cylinder on a tether over the edge of my 14 foot inflatable kayak "rib" would be so much easer than a twin set. However working the bottom having fixed cylinders on back mount is likely a better configuration. That all being said well see how it works out. Believe me diving single steel 100 will still be my go to unless the extended dive time is truly needed. What ever it is we do we have to try some things and be honest with ourselves if its sustainable and suitable for our body type and back... If the back mount turns into too much of a pain for hauling purposes I can easily setup a proper side mount rig and give that a go. Fortunately I still have decent dexterity of my arms so operating my valves should not be problematic for me. Fortunately I have some great dive shop support in my area. One focused on tech and back mount and another shop a long time fan of side mount.
All this cold water heavy gear diving here in the PNW compared to holiday diving in Hawaii with an AL80 in a 3 mm shorty in clear 80 F waters is like a walk in the park... 🤣
Well check back in down the road for an update and see how twin back mount has worked for me. Cheers, #SeattleRingHunter
I agree 100% Seattle Ring Hunter, backmounted doubles is a much better option for search and recovery compared to Sidemount.
A third option is independent backmount doubles. This provides most of the advantages of both backmount and sidemount systems. Here are several videos on the subject of independent backmount doubles: ua-cam.com/play/PLsuQ0CssSs-cYTmQ4RD82EtS0cCO3exIw.html
Thanks for sharing the videos with us Dive Zone Scuba, we will definitely give them a watch.
Good point, years ago I used to use independent doubles for ice diving or solo wreck diving, when I started using nitrox I ran independent doubles with EAN32 and air and all the new tech divers admonished me on how unsafe that configuration was, the sidemount became the big fad for all the kool kids and gory are essentially independent doubles. Yes, I know the valves are easier to reach but the gas management is another task loading. Now days I use manifolded doubles with isolator for Deep wreck diver and doubles and/or sidemount for cave diving.
Would like to add about side mounted cylenders on land:
While it is a bit more awkward and you have to set up boltsnaps and DRings to mount the necks to y our harness vs just bungee looping them, there is a benefit that the weight of the cylenders is moved central and to your hips. This puts the load only on the knees and hips (like a squat at the gym), vs having the load of doubles pulling backwards on your spine, and having to compensate by leaning forward and straining your back. Ergonomically this puts quite a bit less stress on your body, especially if you are a petite diver trying to shlep big steel high pressure tanks around.
You make a great point David Maruca. When I walk with Doubles, I can definitely feel more stress in my spine. With Sidemount cylinders, the stress is a lot less. For my personal Sidemount system, I get more stress in my upper shoulders, as my harness tends to dig in more. It all depends on how high I have my lower attachment points set. Mine measures out to 14 1/2 inches, which means the weight is pretty balanced between my waist strap and my should D-rings. Thankfully, most places I go Sidemount diving, my walks are very short.
Great video, my answer is a little skewed as I do backmount rebreather and sidemount rebreather. But pros and cons are very similar to OC. For me its what's the best tool for the job. I usually do backmount for deep dives as my sides are open for more bailout gas. Overhead, especially restrictive overhead I use sidemount, also airplane travel with sidemount is easier.
Hello Stefan W, we agree, using the best tool for the job (the dive), is the best option. Personally, though I prefer one over the other, I try my best to be proficient with both, so that I can be prepared for any given situation.
Hello Brian, for me definitely Sidemount. Due to football, my knees and back cant handle the weight of doubles. Also, there’s something to say about two independent systems. I prefer the redundancy. As always, thanks for the great videos!
Glad you liked the video francis bevacqua. The ease of the redundancy system is what does it for a lot of our divers here locally. The ability to see a problem and fix the problem in front of them versus having the problem occur behind their back is what they like the most.
I struggled with this concept, and still do, regarding sidemount vs. backmount. Ultimately for me, because I don't really have any health issues (back, knees, stamina), I chose backmount twinset because it offered a logical step towards carrying a rebreather. I do plan on taking the sidemount course, and getting properly trained to use that toolset, but it seemed that if I am accustom to wearing a lot of weight on my back in the first place, a rebreather will not be any extra physical challenge. Sidemount also comes into play later in the rebreather game, as multiple stage bottles are often required for some types of dives. Since the rebreather takes up tank space on ones back, the stage bottles will have to be sidemounted. Also, I don't typically do small space penetration dives, but rather stay in one area for an extended period of time, extra gas and simplicity of setup made more logical sense personally for me. I already own a backplate, so purchasing a larger wing is no big deal. Finally, I do believe it is up to the individual diver and their needs. Dress for where you are going, utilize the tools available for a successful dive. I am happy to help out other dive buddies in sidemount situations, but I will just about always have doubles on my back.
I like how you worded it JayYoung, "Dress for where you are going, utilize the tools available for a successful dive." This is a great piece of advice.
Very good video. Application does depend upon a persons mission. If you will, the only variable that you did not visit would be limited visibility and possible entanglement could happen when it comes to doubles versus side mount
Glad you liked the video @Scuba8907.
I didn’t feel it was biased since you really gave fair good points on both. Actually this makes quite interested in learning side mount diving. I live in Australia but will be coming to the US in February to visit my mom. Where are you guys located and do you teach this specialty? I’d love to finally meet you guys other than on UA-cam. Thanks for all the teachings during my almost two years diving your channel has been a great source of knowledge.
Hello EnLaOllaTv, we do teaching the Sidemount Course. Send me an email, and I can give you details on the course. bryan@lakehickoryscuba.com.
Did you try it? If so how did you like it?
I started diving sidemount after I broke a vertebra in an accident. Having tanks on my back was just painful. Even though my back has healed I stayed with sidemount due to its streamline and comfort in the water. It can be a bit more work on the surface.
Now that I'm a full cave diver I'm happy I took this path, since it's allowed me to enter more and tighter caves. It's great. Mounting one or more stages is also just an extension of sidemounting.
I definitely see the benefit of a twinset on a boat with choppy seas but I'm rarely in that situation so I doubt I'll switch to them. Maybe I'll do GUE fundies some day to at least have experience with both.
I rarely walk with my sidemount tanks on to the water. Instead I carry one or two tanks to the shore or cave before dressing up, just like you'd do with a scooter.
Hello Yggdrasil42, thanks for sharing your experience with us. I too suffer from back issues, and much prefer Sidemount for all the same reasons. Unfortunately, at the end of the day, I still have to wear doubles from time to time, so I try to stay proficient with them as well.
Hey bud I have a very similar set up , just a question how’s the small medical shears attached to your inflator hose
Hello craigblanch2767, here is a video explaining how we attach the shears to our BCD. ua-cam.com/video/em3FMku0bQM/v-deo.html
The Shears we use are the Lifeguard Systems. lakehickoryscuba.com/products/lifeguard_shears_sheath
@@LakeHickoryScuba thank you very much
Would back mount steel doubles be a lighter setup overall compared to twin aluminum? Feels like we need more lead with the al80s
Hello Lars Dennert, it all depends on the cylinders you choose. My steel 80's are only slightly heavier than my aluminum 80's. Also, a diver can choose between soft, aluminum, steel, and heavy steel back plates, which helps with weight distribution as well. Just as a frame of reference, with a 3mm, I rarely use any weight in freshwater, and only 8 pounds in saltwater. With double steel 80's, my weight would be more than needed in a 3mm. Since the buoyancy charatoristics change in aluminum 80's, when diving sidemount in a 3mm, my weight requirements never change. I personally use both soft plates, and steel plates, depending on what my weight requirements are. During work related dives when I need the extra gas, and I choose to use doubles, I am 9 out of 10 times using a Drysuit, with very buoyant undergarments. Thus, the extra weight of the double steel cylinders helps out as you stated. But in a 3mm, I would simply be pinned to the bottom.
@@LakeHickoryScuba Thanks, interesting outcome. Sounds like a warm water 3mm sidemount AL80 with no extra lead and a cold water steel doubles set up with no extra lead might not be that different in total weight, especially if a CF or Kidex plate is used. I realize accessories and other gear may play a part depending on the dive, such as needing Jets with a drysuit over say Quattros with 3mm, but forgetting that.
if I'm teaching an OW course, I'll go backmounted single with a jacket BCD. when I'm conducting an AOW couirse or diving for fun, I dive single-cylinder sidemount with long hose. with single-cylinder sidemount, my air consumption is better due to better hydrodynamics and I can get a little closer to marine life
Hello @vmartinez71, thank you for sharing your experience with us. We enjoy Sidemount diving as well.
when was the clip on you guys at Lake Pheonix taken?
Hello @hanscap. This specific video was made over several trips to Lake Phoenix. We frequent there quite often. Most of our videos are produced several months in advanced prior to them going live on UA-cam. I truly do not remember when we filmed these segments.
Hi Bryan, I've been looking at switching to sidemount for a bit now. Thank you for the video. I had a quick question about keeping the sidemounts balanced: other than losing the obvious benefits of having two standalone systems, could you not connect the sidemounts similar to the doubles but with a hose system, and breathe them down together (for recreational diving purposes)?
Hello @FFAdventuresOriginal. UTD actually makes a manifolded system that allows you to manifold Sidemount cylinders. www.utdscubaequipment.com/product-page/isolatable-manifold
I think much of the internet is biased towards sidemount due to it being the cool new thing that's big in social media... If you asked me which I thought was better before I had tried either I would have confidently said sidemount... Now I'm not so sure.
I've recently started backmount steel twins. As soon as I was able to actually reach the valves (this is the worst thing about twins!) I found them satisfactory and it definitely opened up diving to a completely new level for me. Backmount may be old-school but I don't think it's going anywhere because for most things it just works, no fuss, and it's easy to get into because there's not too many extra skills and the standardisation really helps make things clearer.
Although I don't have any experience stage handling with sidemount, I'm pretty sure it's easier to do with backmount. Stage handling is something I have to do relatively frequently so it makes sense to optimise for that.
I'm headed towards cave diving so sidemount is definitely in my future, don't get me wrong. I know I still have a few years before I really do anything particularly tight - so it's twins and all their advantages for me in the meantime.
Hello @harambeexpress, there are pro's and con's to each. Even though I have my preference, both Sidemount and Back Mount are tools a diver can use depending on what the dive calls for. Thankfully, a lot of my dives, both systems work great, and I can choose either one based on personal preference and not out of necessity. I encourage divers who can use both tools to continue to practice with both, so they will be prepared to dive that system when the time comes.
To a man with a hammer, every problem is a nail... 🤣Why pick? It all depends as you say, on what the task is... having options is a beautiful thing! I actually dive BOTH sidemount and DOUBLES, but with a twist: I don't use manifolded doubles, I use INDEPENDENT doubles! I refuse to be limited by other people's biases. Sidemount is wonderful on shore dives, and on calm waters. Donning and doffing tanks in the water is a dream! Doubles are great on choppy waters, and when its time to get back on the boat. I like doubles when I'm digging in a wreck or grabbing lobsters. Not having stuff restricting my arms range of motion is very convenient. And yes, getting on trim on sidemount is a dream. I have an independent doubles adapter that allows me to slap those babies on a backplate as fast as the doubles. Advantages: same regulator switching technique in both setups, I can use the same exact tanks and regulators, and I don't have to schlepp those heavy bastards on and off my truck, to the dive shop and on and off a boat. Best of both worlds!
I agree elejaces, why pick, just be proficient with both. This will always make you prepared for any situation you find yourself in.
I do both I started with back mount twins after a couple years I took side mount. Each one has it plus and minus getting to valves and donning doffing to me is more difficult. Sidemount switching regs regularly is something I have grown accustomed too but it’s more customizable
Thanks for sharing Ivory Johnson. That is one of the things we hear a lot from new Sidemount divers. They struggle with changing second stages on normal basis. After a little bit of practice, it becomes second nature to them.
What kind of tin bottels is he carrying ? twins 6 liter ?
Hello @user-bo8cj7io3b, the cylinders featured in this video are, 2 Aluminum 80's, and 2 Steel 80's.
I like backmount twin for the freedom of movement, easy to add tanks to the side for long dives and more. Cons, heavy asf and a pain to put together sometimes. Once set though its great for open water and caves just not in the tight fitting spot.
Sidemount is explore cave only for me. Open water is cool and sleek but to have a long dive means a cluster f*** of tanks and hoses.
Even rebreathers. Kiss sidewinder for tight exploring caves, Kiss spirit for open water and some(many) caves. And again, to add tanks sidemount to a backmount twin system is easy peasy where side mount more sidemount tanks is a cluster.
Alot to discuss with both for pros and cons but I think you pretty much nailed it minus preferring sidemount to regular dives lol.
One love, no matter what the equipment is as long as it's proper and safe.
Thanks for sharing @anthonylacy4466, you are correct in regards to adding cylinders. It is definitely easier in back mount. Sidemount can be difficult at times, especially in a Dry Suit. Over the years my back has slowly degraded, constantly making it more and more difficult and causing a ton of discomfort for me. This is still why I prefer Sidemount. But as you stated, doing it properly and safely is the key no matter which way you choose.
Great Video Bryan! Do any of the metrics change when considering single tank dives?
Hello lewnance, glad you liked the video. And let me say, great question. The answer is yes it does. For single tank diving, saying in a teaching situation, I much prefer backmount. With this being said, I am headed to Cozumel late December, and will be spending a week there single tank sidemount diving. We are planning a video series showing how we do it while traveling abroad, and while having limited options on configurations and cylinder choices.
I am diving double 12 Liter steel backmount at the moment and I will stick to this system for dives where stages are needed. Stage handling is much more easy if your main system is out of the way. But I see a huge advantage in Sidemount for traveling. It is a very light system if you go by plane and very easy to get cylinders if you can’t bring your own. I love to visit wrecks and a single cylinder setup just lacks the redundancy I prefer to have. And if there is a second dive after your primary wreck dive you just take two new cylinders and off you go. Try to find a place where they have two sets of doubles for each diver as rental gear😂😢
Hello markus Knorr, that is a universal struggle I have had in the past. Trying to find doubles to rent in the tropics is always difficult.
Definitely back mount in open water and partially rough seas getting on or off the boat👍😎
Thanks for sharing your experience with us Joseph dracula. That seems to be the general conscensus with rough seas.
Not sure if Tec diving is in my future but it seems like i'd probably go with sidemound just due to the ease of maneuvering tanks around. So far I haven't gone anywhere that a 100 cf wasn't enough gas. Probably the next step for me is getting used to dragging a pony bottle around. I think you've done some vids about brining a pony with you but maybee a refresh video on the setup would be nice specifically slinging it under an arm rather than mounting it to a single tank.
Hello kevindavison6019, I will be happy to make a video about mounting a pony bottle. We are preparing for a week in Cozumel, and another week in West Palm Beach, so as soon as I get back (late January), we will try to get a video out for you.
I dive back mount doubles. They’re far cheaper and don’t need a whole new certification to use them. The only con for me is the weight. I’m a small guy 5’9” and 140lbs. Carrying my own weight in dive equipment is devastating on my body especially after military service. I’d like to at least try side mount when I get the money for a whole new rig and certification.
Hello akant74, max depth was around 12 feet.
I’ll dive sidemount without training. I never got “certified” to use a drysuit, I just did it.
I never got “certified” to use a hydraulic chainsaw underwater, I just did it.
I’m not against certification. You need to know when to seek it. I would never go cave diving without certification.
@E_Clampus_Vitus diving drysuit without certification can be dangerous and life threatening. Its not something to be rushed or taken lightly
When I started diving sidemount I did NOT like it. I found it awkward and uncomfortable and didn’t think I would continue. Once I found a BC that I really liked and took the time to get it set up, everything felt really good and now I prefer it to backmount. I still think boat entries are easier with backmounted tanks - just one giant stride and I’m ready to go. With sidemount I have to have the tanks handed to me after I step in, and I don’t have a regulator or snorkel when I hit the water. Getting back on the boat, however, I really like being able to hand my tanks up and not having to haul my fat butt PLUS two tanks up the ladder. For shore diving with uneven and rocky entries I like the ability to drag my tanks into the water without any other gear, then donning them once I’m deep enough to not have to try to stay on my feet. Upon exit when the tanks are positively buoyant, it’s so easy to disconnect them and float them to the exit point without worrying about stepping on a rock or in a hole and twisting my ankle.
Thanks for sharing your experience with us Michael Dodge. We have a video that may help you with boat entries when handing down bottles is not an option (basically rough seas). ua-cam.com/video/uKs_i7kzPKg/v-deo.html
I have steel 133s. Imagine that as a twin set on your back
Hello MrBear2002, I applaud you for having the will power and physical back strength to do so. I cringe every time I have to use my short steel 80's doubled up, I couldn't imagine the 133's.
How's your heart condition Brian?
Thank you for asking Stormblessed. It is still here. I am currently waiting on a heart monitor, which puts me out of the water for 2 weeks. My doctor believes everything is stress induced, but my cardiologist believes my atriums (the upper chambers of your heart) are mis-firing, causing the skipped beats and PAC's (Premature Atrial Contractions). Both are suggesting the heart monitor for a two week period to see when the mis-firing is happening the most. Other than being extremely lethargic at certain times, I haven't really had to change anything throughout the day. The PAC's are really prevelent at night, and I wake up several times throughout the night from the pounding in my chest. PAC's are actually normal in a lot of people, however, mine seem to be happening more frequently than most. Worst case scenario, I am looking at very minor heart surgery (if there is such a thing), to fix the PAC's from occuring. If my doctor is correct and its stress induced, then treating the stress will hopefully fix the problem. Once I have a monitor, we should have more answers.
@@LakeHickoryScuba that's rough. Hope you get well soon
high energy music to 2 fat guys walking down a trail. This is going to be hilarious
Hello @brodefinefortraiture446, we are glad you found our video entertaining.
I can dive both side mount and doubles. I prefer doubles easier to dive
Thanks for sharing your thoughts with us dive addict 6885. Several of the divers here in our area prefer doubles as well. I spent all day yesterday wearing doubles as well. As I am preparing for a trip to Mexico to do some Sidemount Diving, I had to make sure all of my Sidemount gear is dry. Thus, the dive I made required extra gas, so doubles were neccessary.
I just want a sidemount BCD that has leg loops instead of a crotch strap. Why do NO manufacturers offer this!?!?!
With all the thought and development going into the design of sidemount BCD’s, the crotch strap is the best they can do?!?
I refuse to pay big money for a dumb crotch strap!!
Hello @E_Clampus_Vitus. Adding leg loops to a Sidemount BCD is a very simple process. That is the great thing about Sidemount, you can set you specific system up in a manner that suits your needs. Happy diving.
@ Do you have any information on how this process works?
It seems to me that the leg loops must be sewn on. This is also making alterations to a piece of equipment that your life depends on. Seems sketchy to me. I rather buy something that was produced specifically with leg loops.
Just seems so bizarre that the year is now 2024 and the “crotch strap” is still standard.
Great question. Let loops are more common than you realize. They are attached in the same manner as a standard crotch strap, and can be added with simple hardware that the majority of Divers Shops carry in stock. I would encourage you to visit your local training center to get assistance in how to add leg loops.
@I can go to the major manufacturers website and look for leg loop options. I see none.
I get that I could probably ‘Frankenstein’ together some type of rig that would work. My point is this, I don’t want to spend $800 on something that I need to go and modify so it works better. For $800 I think leg loops should be standard but at least an option.
I would suggest leg loops on a sidemount BCD is not common at all. Very few videos about it on UA-cam. I found one and it was a complete grope on the dark. I’m not going to spend $800 on a BCD I need to alter in order to fit my needs.
I’ll wait. I might not get back into diving, TBH. Since Covid, my lung function has diminished. 🥲
Going back to diving now, with diminished lung function is probably not a good idea.
Thank you US government for producing such a vile disease in that lab in Wuhan. Where’s the outrage?!? 😡