How To Use Two Guitar Amps Together [Connections, Phase, Polarity & Why Analog Dry-Through Matters]
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- Опубліковано 14 тра 2024
- Using two amps together sounds great, but how do you actually do it?
Welcome to the show. Dan and I pretty much always use two amps on the show, and very often when playing live too. It’s something that countless artists have done down the years… but how do you actually connect them?
In this video we run through the most common and easiest ways to connect two amps together. There are other ways - for example using effects loops, slave/direct outputs and so on - but that’s getting ahead of the scope of this video.
A big part of this video is to do with polarity and phase, which is the most important topic related to using multiple amps. So start by getting your head around that, and move on from there!
Finally, it really doesn't matter what two amps you use! (Erm, just make sure they're both analogue to avoid phase problems, or indeed two of the same or very similar digital amps. Mixing one analogue and one digital will give you phase problems.)
Enjoy the episode!
Please visit That Pedal Shop www.thatpedalshop.com/
If you want a specialist device to connect two amps, it MUST have these two features…
-One of the outputs is ground isolated
-One of the outputs has a polarity flip option
Examples of devices we would recommend:
• TheGigRig Humdinger (and AB Baby, G3, G3S)
shop.thegigrig.com/collection...
• Radial Engineering BigShot ABY
www.radialeng.com/product/big...
• Bright Onion Active Splitter
brightonion.co.uk/products/is...
There are others, just make sure it has an isolated second out AND a polarity flip switch. Good luck!
Pedals & Stuff in this show
• J Rockett Audio Hot Rubber Monkey V2
UK & Europe: bit.ly/47twI3L
USA: sweetwater.sjv.io/XYAOA4
• TheGigRig Humdinger
shop.thegigrig.com/collection...
• Jam Pedals Waterfall
UK & Europe: bit.ly/2MifNem
Australia: bit.ly/3nb8JzN
USA: bit.ly/3s9w21c
• Catalinbread Belle Epoch Deluxe
UK & Europe: bit.ly/3JgIyE5
Australia: bit.ly/3SKyE1p
USA: sweetwater.sjv.io/B0Jbax
• Walus Audio Mako D1 [original version, links to latest version]
UK & Europe: bit.ly/3T16ikL
Australia: bit.ly/4bA8BlY
USA: bit.ly/42HCHA7
• Source Audio Nemesis ADT
UK & Europe: bit.ly/3RXE6gX
USA: sweetwater.sjv.io/5gQYE9
• TheGigRig QMX4
www.thegigrig.com/quartermaster
Interesting bits and go-to sections
0:00 Intro playing
1:57 Why use two amps?
2:50 Four ways to use two amps
5:00 Way 2: Link The Inputs
6:15 Hum & polarity problems
8:30 Splitting the signal before the amps
9:00 One amp must be earthed/grounded
10:45 A specialist splitter device
11:35 Phase & polarity explained
15:23 Where does the polarity change happen?
15:40 Way 3: Use A Stereo Pedal To Split
17:50 A splitter on the pedalboard
20:00 Where to split on the board?
21:20 Vibrato in one amp only: chorus!
22:15 Problems with splitting the signal path
22:50 Why Analogue Dry Through Is Crucial
28:00 Polarity & analogue dry through sound examples
30:00 And with the delay sounds
31:35 Why use two amps, again?
Guitars in today’s show
• Fender Custom Shop ’63 Telecaster - Dan’s video here: • That Pedal Show - Our ...
Amps in today’s show
• Fender ’65 Deluxe Reverb with stock speaker
UK & Europe: bit.ly/2G9OnFJ
USA: sweetwater.sjv.io/Py94Qz
• Two Rock TS1 50-watt 1x12 combo with TR1265 speaker
www.two-rock.com/amps/ts1/
We hope you enjoy this episode. Please subscribe to our channel.
You can buy TPS merch to support our efforts www.thatpedalshowstore.com
We are on Patreon - crowdfunding for creatives
/ thatpedalshow
Please visit our preferred retailers!
UK & Europe: Andertons Music bit.ly/2cRvIvt
Australia: Pedal Empire bit.ly/2mWmJQf
"Why?"
"Because it's Awesome!"
Roll credits...
Really, today's question is, "How can you NOT use two amps?".
You are joking?
This is kind of a full circle video for me. The only reason I found you guys was because I searched UA-cam for a video on how to use two amps about 5 years ago. I had absolutely no idea about effects pedals, other than something like a zoom 505 or a digitech rp100. I had a pod xt live at the time and when I found you guys, it completely changed my life. Here it is 5 years later and I’m such a gear nerd, I have over 40 pedals, 9 guitars, 7 amplifiers, and I am so much more educated on everything guitar and gear related. You guys are and have always been the best guitar and gear related channel out there, bar none. Love you guys, and keep on doing what you’re doing!
I only play in the house, and have always used two amps. When people ask "why"?, I answer "Why not? I've got 'em!". And yes...such a big sound with minimal volume! Someone went through all that trouble to make the amps...we should use them!
What two amps do you use?
Same here. I actually have three amps, but one isn't turning on right now. Hope it's just a fuse. But to your point, two amps sound huge! I'm currently playing a tweed deluxe clone and a handwired AC15 split, and I'm only just over 2 on the deluxe volume and less than halfway up on the AC15 and that's plenty lound for a rehearsal with drums, bass, and keyboards. Almost too loud. It's crazy how big it sounds for two small amps.
@@jamiebarr9810 I have a different basic rig that I call the Cerberus. There's other stuff, the Brotary and the Echo Array and cetera, but the basic Cerberus is one small amp running a little Vibrato, and two larger amps running dry through a Panning Tremolo. ATM I have a little bedroom rig with one twenty Watt Virtuoso and two thirty Watt Conquerors. Sometimes I run different sorts of Amps off the Tremolo, I am getting a UL760 that will sort of match Tremoloing against one of my Defiants, over a wet Conqueror. And the farm is hopefully about to thaw out enough to get out there and hook up the big iron. 👍
@@joeschlicht Yep! I really look forward to Alone Time in the house as, yes, the volume gets significant quite early....and that's before boosted with a compressor!
2 amps is great for multi layer looping as well around the house.
I went from a tps wet dry 2 amp setup to a 3 amp tps wdw, and now I’m tinkering with a 6 amp monster wet wet dry dry wet wet setup with different effects going to different wet amp combinations and different drives to the dry amps, what a rabbit hole I stepped into
Once you figure out the polarity and the ground lift to have no hum. There's nothing better than ( I call it ping ponging) a good chorus, delay, or an ambient type of effects. But it can be difficult. You must educate yourself. It's incredible. You guys did a great job.
I've always avoided the ground/earth loop by having both amps plugged into the same power strip/bar so that they are on the same ground potential. My understanding is that the hum actually comes from two amps being connected to different grounds which usually have slightly different ground potentials, and then when the loop is made, current will flow from one ground to the other through the amps, and that gets amplified as hum. Having them on the same ground greatly reduces this so that I haven't had hum problems by just using a pedal to split the signal. I happen to be lucky that what comes out of both amps is in polarity too.
Your right about everything plugged into 1 socket. They don't mention it maybe because they won't sell as many humdingers? Lol
You've flipped my understanding polarity and got my thinking in phase! Cheers Dan and Mick!!
I just purchased a VOX AC15 C2 and a Roland JC 40 to do this. you are bad for my personal finances.
Just wait….. it gets worse. 😂
I did something similar but with a vox mini superbeetle (can’t afford the real thing and has it before getting the jc40). Best part is you can setup the jc40 as stereo for a WDW setup
Gustavo Cerati (from Soda Stereo) used that combination of amps, beautiful. Listen to the song Adios, I love the guitars in that song. Can be seen in the mtv unplugged too.
You can also go wet/dry/wet with that combo:
Use a humdinger or similar to split after drives and any mods you want to go everywhere. Send the dry to the AC15 and the isolated out of the humdinger to your wet effects, running stereo into the JC40. I prefer to kill fry into the wet amp but see what you like more!
Let's be fair, Mick and Dan are just really bad people aren't they? My wife hates the pair of them. 😂
Learned everything I know about two amps from this show. Biggest mistake I made was flipping polarity on the gig rig to get the amps in sync and then going into a stereo reverb pedal (Boss RV500). Since the two signals going into the pedal were out of phase, the reverb volume was almost non existent. I thought something was wrong with the pedal. Once I figured it out, my best results came from doing everything on the board including going into stereo pedals and then putting a humdinger on one of the stereo outputs only. That way I could kill hum and flip polarity if necessary. Have a great weekend.
This was so over my head, but there is nothing better than two people being passionate, educational and funny!
Struggled with an old nemesis doing wet dry setup at one point. No one could explain what was going on. Was dealing with the latency because it wasn’t dry through. Glad they fixed that.
Another great show. So well done. Nothing left out.
As someone who IS into this, it WAS gold! Thanks, gentlemen!
Thanks so much for taking the time to explain this so thoroughly. Much appreciated guys.
Absolute Gold! Confusing topic explained (and demonstrated) as clearly as possible
Great vid! I had learnt most of this from your previous videos but it was great to have this as the focus, and to cover everything in one video. Really enjoy your guys' videos! Keep up the great work!
Really interesting video. Mick and Dan always explain complex matters in clear and understandable terms. The examples really help to illustrate the points. Well done, guys!
Thanks guys. That’s really helpful and informative. May have to give it a couple more run throughs to get my head around it fully!
Now I just need two amps. But watching you guys nerd out is endless fun. Thanks for this one!
Outstanding. I think I just about stayed with you guys to the end on that!... thanks - this had been an area not yet explored...
One of the best practical videos on the topic... Thanks!!
oh boy, that Dan's smile always make the world a better place, at least to me. Epic tones!
Thanks for my T Shirt folks. You could not have made the experience any more pleasurable. Not to spoil any of the surprise details, but the best packing ever and the handwritten note was lovely. The shirt is such good quality too. Thank you.
Excellent episode once again chaps. For anyone hasn't tried this, it's a game changer. Another thing - the more diverse sounding amps you use, the wider the sonic spectrum - for example I use a Roland JC120 with a Kustom 100. Another thing - as Mick rightly mentioned - it doesn't have to be TPS wet/dry e.g. I use separate fuzzes on each signal path - wet/dry fuzz is a new dawn! Cheers :)
And another thing! lol
thanks oh so much. been thinking about trying a two amp set up and what you have discussed has been an eye opener. keep up the great work.
YES THANK YOU. Ive been curious about this for so long
The EQD Swiss things is great for this and it's got a boost pedal built in a long with 2 loops. Such a handy piece of kit.
Hi Mick, hi Dan. I've recently been watching your episodes on wet/dry and wet/dry/wet rigs, so this episode has come at the right time and is the icing on the cake. Definitely going to try it out. I've pretty much always had a couple of amps, but only ever used one or the other as my "Go to amp"... but from now on it will be... "Go two amps!!"
Fantastic video, learnt loads, I was a bit confused on polarity and phase, not any more! Thanks guys
This was one of your best vids, guys! I really liked the instructional asides.
Moo
Looking forward to this. After I get back from shopping with the lovely lady of the house. I run two amps after your videos. Awesome!
Love the fact that while this isn't solely focused on bedroom playing, it does add an amazing depth to the sound that is hard to otherwise come by! My biggest issue here though is both my amps are solid state (not inherently bad, bear with me!) with lots of headroom. I boost into a low gain drive, and instead of more gain, I get more volume (and a bit more gain). I'm not driving the amp, pedals have high headroom, it's a an interesting "bedroom headroom" problem (to sort of steal Orange Amp's coined terms).Would love to see some episodes exploring bedroom tones (there have been a few over the years...)
This was very helpful, even after watching you guys since you started. I'll have to watch a few more times to consider each of several pedals in my chain, and if they are holding me back from greatness.
I’ve always run stereo, just in digital. I recently got a tiny terror and it changed my life and I’m looking for another similar small amp right now! Thanks for the video!
Great video! I’m excited to see more! Well done.
Mick! Nailed the intro. Loved the TL;DR, but I’ll go ahead and watch the whole thing. 😊
Well, don't I feel dumb. You mean to tell me I could've been doing this the whole freaking time? I just tried that amp to amp method and Holy Shit it works. Thank you so much guys! I guess I got super lucky. No phase problem and no hum.
I love this show! I’ve watched every two amp show you’ve made and I learn something new each time. I’ve run wet/dry for about a year due to TPS. Analog dry through explains an issue I have with the Strymon Flint. The reverb is analog dry through but the tremolo isn’t. So when I use the reverb, it sounds great, but the tremolo always sounds off! Thank you!
Lastly, I have the Humdinger and it is awesome. I had a Lehle Little Duel II, which was nice, but the Humdinger takes up less space, is less expensive and its buffer adds a clarity that the Lehle didn’t. I also have a Wetter Box coming in a day or two for more fun.
Thanks again for your shows!
Great stuff....been using 2 amps since forever. I think I got it right but this vid really clarifies a lot of stuff.
Thanks
THIS WAS SO HELPFUL, DAN WORRALL FANCY CHIPPING IN TO HELP THE COMMUNITY OUT? NO PRESSURE DAN, YOUVE DONE ENOUGH TO HELP US ALL
Very clear explanation guys, thanks!
Gold indeed! I've been asking this question for some time with no definitive answer...till now. Cheers mates!
Great episode. I've been using your videos for a long time to play around with my own hybrid stereo and wet/dry/wet rigs in my spare bedroom studio. While I was aware of issue of polarity and phase, this really helped me understand some problems inherent in different pedals and why issues of signal routing might not always be as simple as flipping the polarity. Thanks for sharing your wealth of knowledge with us.
Beautiful work boys!!!!!
Yes, this video is absolute gold! I'm an EE and and an old guy and have been playing guitar for 50+ years. What I really think is great is your clarification of polarity versus phase. The terminology is mixed up in many peoples understanding and how products don't always use the terms consistantly. And in this world of awesome digital effects pedals, the analog dry through issue is now becoming a common issue. I recently bought an Eventide H90, which I think is quite incredible. But in a recent episode, I heard Mick say the lack of analog dry through made it a non-starter. I now understand why this does not work in a "TPS Dual Amp config". The H90 is still awesome, but not in all configurations. Eventide claims that they had more phase problems with with analog dry through and therefore did not implant this in the H90... Super great episode!
Indeed. And there’s merit in Eventide’s argument when you get into some of the incredible stuff it does - pitch shifting especially. But exactly as you say it’s all about context.
Really great explanation of all this. Makes a lot more sense now.
It's official, many of us are unphased by this video. Such good work is likely the result of having a secret Lab!
Been running 2 amps out of the back of my boss ME 80 for couple years , love it !
I am still very much an Absolute Beginner on this, after watching the really in-depth vids, I really needed this! Next trick - find a suitable amp for home playing to match with a Blues Jr and add a Humdinger to my board!!! Much love, guys.
A great, succinct video on how to get joy from running two amps, I wish someone had explained it so thirty years ago.
Great explanation re phase/polarity!
Brilliant explanation. I was familiar with the basic earth loop and phase issues caused by using 2 amps but had never considered phase issues caused by digital latency. Nice one chaps!
Beautiful video. I do not know how you packed all of that knowledge into 35 minutes.
Fantastic process to clearly demonstrate the pitfalls, and the audio clearly reveals the problems with the "out of phase" sounds. An epiphany moment for me with regards to analogue dry-through.
cool episode!
another big difference between phase and polarity is:
polarity is not frequency depending. everything is just mirrored on the time-axis.
out of phase is frequency depending. if the latency is i.e. 10ms which eaquals 100Hz, everything that is n*100Hz is amplified and everything that is 2n/(n+1/2)*100Hz is eliminated.
Excellent lesson guys!!!
Great episode as always. You're the best
Mark Knophler was around Billy Gibbons once wanting to know how he got his fat tone so he could use some special sauce on Money For Nothing. So Billy would not tell Mark. So what Mark did is he had one bad ass amp he put in a soundproof box and he mic’d it up and ran that signal through his board and to his other amp. Then later on Billy Gibbons asked Mark Knophler how he got a fatter tone than his and Mark wouldn’t tell him!!! 😂
It is gold. Thank you for taking the Time to put this into proper Phase in my brain :^)
Great SPIRITUAL discussion guys 🎉
Brilliant ! Thanks for the education - I needed that !
Always used 2 amps live, Hot Rod Deville for clean and a peavey classic 20 combo on the preamp out from the fender to add some natural valve overdrive on top of the clean and have the sound engineer blend them on the PA. Best sounding guitar tone I've ever had.
Excellent video guys . Super helpful.
You finally convinced me to play with my polarity even though I thought I was in phase all the time. Well.. Turns out I was wrong! I used the inverter module on my zoia to flip the polarity, but once I found out I had to flip it I just swapped the two ends of the cable to my speaker.
You are not alone!
I stared using two amps a couple of years ago after watching you guys for awhile. I can't recommend it enough. As an audio engineer I love having a ton of control over the mix of my wet effects in my overall sound. I paired a Goodwood Audio Interface (sorry Dan) with my board to allow me to go to two amps without any of the gremlins that come form running two amps. But it also lets me run my signal in mono if I want to just use one amp.
Best video on this subject. Thank you so damn much
This! Hi D&M! The 2024 content is stellar! Ty!
Thanks for revisiting this chaps.
I don't have two amps, but i do have an amp with an attenuated output and i run it alongside a plugin "amp". My version of wet/dry, but a bit more attainable 😊
Guys, I really needed this show, ‘cause I’m setting up a new rig! You guys are life savers!
Cheers.
P.S.: Mick, still can’t get over the fact you had to part ways with that Pelham Blue SG, such a great fit, sounded amazing in your hands, those instances where one bonds deeply with an instrument are quite rare.
Gentlemen, very well done! This is how all of your shows should be. Concise, unlike my comment. This felt much shorter than 35 minutes and I re-watched a few parts. I'm now subscribed. I've been running two amps for years with the Fulltone True Path ABY switcher. It has a "Phase" switch. Nope, it's polarity. Thanks for the clarification. I work for an electric company in the US and have studied phase and I never realized it was actually polarity. Now you need to explain to everyone vibrato vs tremolo. I had that wrong for years too.
This was incredibly helpful, especially as the owner of a Belle Epoch Deluxe! Currently on a gear-purchasing hiatus but I could see both dual mono and wet/dry both being investigated fairly early on once the acquisitions start flowing again. Cheers guys!
So educational. Thank you for everything.
I clicked on the video thinking « an other video about this subject you covered so many times »
but no, you really achieve something new in this video because your sound examples are so thoughtful and good sounding I could clearly hear the impact on the dry tone on all the examples !! A masterclass in that domain ;)
Leo
In a world of super high end boutique gear, the magic box that makes TPS wet/dry possible is really affordable,I have a Humdinger on ( actually hiding under)both of my boards ,and can say that I expect them to stay there despite every other Pedal getting swapped out over time- many thanks👍🎸
I thought my supro delta king 12 and marshall jtm studio sounded great out of my ua golden until I got a humdinger. Turns out that they'd been out of polarity all along but still sounded better than one amp on its own. Now they sound fantastic I've had to dial back the bass though. Thanks Dan for your brilliant splitter and thanks to both of you for all of the priceless advice.
Yes! This! Mick here.
Excellent explaination, and thumbs up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Perfect explaining technical, keep it up!
Sounds angelic when connected properly 👍🎛️🎼. Thank you for sharing
I’ve learned som new things again, thanks guys!
Great ep., thanks lads. Wonderfully pragmatic but still entertaining. I was running my Custom '68 Deluxe RI and SV20H at the rehearsal studio the other day and hit the polarity switch on my Radial AB/Y just for the hell of it only to be met with more output. I thought I was stupid for not hearing it in the first place so it's reassuring to be told by the gear aficionados that it could've happened to anyone.
I play at really low volumes at home and honestly having 2 amps is a great solution. Lush full sounding vibes at lower volumes. Right now I am using the HX Stomp to manage it but before that it was a Radial Twin City which is a GREAT pedal.
This is one thing I realized…if at home you’d first think two amps will be double loud. But in reality having say 2 Roland Jc or whatever…you can get the volume very low, while still enjoying it! Also not bother anyone as much as pushing one single all louder. I don’t do stereo in the studio, but I like running stereo at home on two small amps! It’s quiet and just like listening to a stereo at home at tv volumes. Fuller and less volume to turn up.
I run a stereo rig and did understand about Polarity being matched so the speakers move as one, but I never knew that the pedals could cause a shift. My rig sounds awesome as-is, but now I wonder if it couldn't be even better ? You took an extremely confusing topic and made it much easier to understand..... Well Done !
Great explanation!! very helpful. thanks guys
Great video. I want to try to do a wet dry setup, but it has always seemed too much for me to deal with at the very outset because I don't understand polarity and phase. This is the exact kind of video I needed to give this a shot and feel like I have a chance at success.
Love this..
I have a fender and a black star combo and was thinking about running the two.
Now I know how to do it properly.
I’ve heard there can be issue, but no details about the issues..
Thanks guys!!
I swear I was just thinking about how to do this last 2 days! TAHNK YOU SO MUCH GUYS!
So glad I chose a Strymon Volante and Red Panda Context 2 for my TPS Wet/Dry rig before I understood the problem. Dumb luck! Thanks for the clear and concise explanation guys!
Cool video. I traveled with two identical amps in case one went down. So I used them both. I just created the split out the Yamaha SPX90. With the polarity settings in sync I don’t recall ever having any serious issues. But that was a while ago. Back in the rack days.
Ive bought and sold a few really nice amps over the past few years (only ever owned one at a time) amd recently got "the amp", a Hamstead Artist 20 and have been very happy with it. Now after seeing Dan demo a 2 amp set up at Pedal Empire in Brisbane in December and now this video, im on the lookout for another amp 🤦♂️🤣 I have a UA Golden which has analogue dry through so guess ill try that method first.
Thanks Dan and Mick for spreading the word of the lord (the tone lord)
Another top video. Line out to input not mentioned as another possible way to link.
Super video guys! Two amps is a must for me. Earvana…
My favorite episodes are the ones where you guys take time to teach the fundamentals. You always do it in such a clear and effortless way.
This is all soooo nerdie…. I love every minute of it !!!
A well timed video. I just bought a Vox AC15C2 and I already owned a Fender GTX50. I was wondering how to use them together. A lot of this went over my head but at least I know what pitfalls to look for. I’ll check out your other videos to see if a deeper dive makes it click for me.
Great video. thanks for the lesson!!
Great vid fellas! Love that Jam vibrato! Been a dual amp guy for a long time, wouldn’t pay any other way.
Long time viewer first time commenter, so thankful for y’all and your highly informational and educational videos. I’ve learned so much and have been able to put it into effect in my gigging rig. This video comes at a very fortuitous time as I’m in the process of yet another pedalboard makeover. Will definitely be digging into the specs of any potential pedals to join the party. I’ve yet to jump into playing out with a wet/dry or stereo rig but I love the idea of it, so keeping it as a potential option is always at the front of my mind.
Once again, many thanks for your years of service. So much incredible knowledge offered up to us and I’m so very grateful. Cheers!
You’re so welcome, thanks for watching
Massively useful! Thanks chaps
Boys, you can reverse the polarity of one cable too. Needs a specially made cable where you switch +/- polarity on the cable end of one side. I must add, sorry, that this can happen with manufactured cables and you'll be chasing your tail trying to find the problem . . . until you use another cable that you KNOW is wired properly. You can then mark that cable as reversed polarity and use it to remedy reversed polarity issues where a single cable would make it an easy fix.
Most excellent lads--thanks so much for this! Not much to add, other than to note a friend's righteous rock rig from his mid-late 90's band (since defunct). He routed through a Lehle device (can't recall which one), into a late 70's mv Marshall 100w half-stack + a Matchless DC-30 (sort of poor man's Dean DeLeo rig, if you will), but Gods, what a massive tonal tsunami that was! All best & keep up the excellent show offerings!
Great show LEG END'S , you've explained it so well that I can understand it , have a cracking day, see you for V.C.Q . PEACE AND LOVE TO EVERYONE ❤❤
Great video!! Recently bought the Orange Detonator , now I know why!