about crossbow mercs: so i theorize that the main thing is that the crossbows themselves were likely pretty expensive. this, as well as the way crossbows function, has some knock-on effects, mainly the mercs themselves are going to be from a higher social class. They have to buy their own equipment first likely before they can join a company, and likely have been play training with smaller versions their family has been buying them throughout their lives. So you're hiring not just a trained soldier, you're paying for his horse and his crumpets and his wine. the other bit is that a crossbow soldier works best as a team, so for every shooter you're paying for you're also paying for the two guys that carry his stuff and reload his crossbows, and they're no doubt trained and equipped as warriors as well. and the final point i'd make is; consider modern fps shooter games, a pro player in such games can wipe out entire teams of average players with ease. the crossbow is a powerful force multiplier by itself, but you put a truly skilled user on one and i bet they'll be worth a whole company of ordinary shooters. if on average at x range 10 peasant archers will get 9 fatal hits out of a hundred arrows, if you have one crossbowman that can hit a fatal arrow 25% of the time at that range then that one dude is worth about 3 times as much as the ten guys.
As a kid, I used to roll pub darts off my fingers, kind of side arm/underarm, and got considerable more speed than I ever did with the standard dart throw. Did you ever try something like that with your plumbata?
No offence but can you run it back again with some trained people to give us an actual answer to how it could have happened on the field? It would be a great comparison to you two guys?
I'm from Mallorca, in the Balearic Islands, so happy you mentioned the Balearic Slingers and to know they are known arround the world. Really good video😃😃
Because of that video I bought the bloody Pyrotechnica book. And it's bloody brilliant. Not just because of the fiery weaponry stuff, but of everything else in the book what we would call today "thermal process engineering".
i love the "Roman War Darts" or plumbata! As a child, my friends and I would take long pheasant tail feathers and hammer a spent rifle shell (the brass shell) to the end, and throw them up in the air. Eventually, we would battle with them. The plumbata reminds me a lot of this - basically the same principle. A large weight on the end of a shaft of wood, but in our case the shaft was a pheasant tail feather! Makes me wonder if anyone might have used something more similar in antiquity. Replace the brass rifle shell with a sharp point, and you have a formidable and deadly weapon! I'm curious - really curious!
Regarding the humble rock, Francisco Balbi di Correggio wrote that arquebusiers at the Great Siege of Malta 1565 opted to throw stones rather than shoot their pieces at one point in order to do more damage ("mas daño") & more often ("mas a menudo"). So, under those specific circumstances of defending a high place under assault, the rock outcompeted the matchlock firearm.
Good stuff. Now do a collab with Matt Easton AND Tod about melee weapons. I find it weird that some of the best knowledge is on this thing called youtube, but Tod really does go the extra mile to test stuff. Schologladitoria also does a lot of work with similar topics.
When I was a kid , I used to make slings out of a sock and bootlacrs . This would throw a rock quite hard. Thuogh I wasn't very accurate. You yube tutorials have shown me more sophisticated methods of making slings. I have a deeper appreciation for the sling. One of the easiest to make, but onecof the hardest to learn to use. But well worthwhile to learn and one of the nost fun. What boy doesn't like to throw rocks, and the harder , the faster the better.
During the Northwest Indian wars, the tomahawk throw was very common. Usually, one side would ambush the other with muskets and then the side that came out on top would chase down the survivors with tomahawks once everyone emptied their guns. It is difficult to tell if the throw was just showboating or a last ditch attempt to get someone you couldn't catch, but it often didn't work.
I've been slinging toys for my dog for awhile now. I've shot bow and arrow, rifles, pistols, and thrown things. The sling, in terms of being stupidly simple to make and very hard to be accurate with, is at the furthest end of both extremes.
I find the sling one.of the easiest 'weapons' to get accurate with, it has a feel to it that corrects for variations in proprioception, assuming you have any reasonable proprioception, which the presenters clearly lack.
"Apperently i can swing a stick... I found my weapon" Every boy will agree that there is no better weapon than the stick he found in the woods earlier ^^
Hannibal Barca ( me ) used 2000 Balearic Slingers in my war against Rome. They were more nimble and accurate. They really were excellent for early skirmish and open battles before the heavy infantry close in
When I was 14 I was out walking my dog when he was attacked by another much larger dog (about the size of a German Shephard). I was petrified but very angry I reached down and picked up a pebble and from a distance of about 20 feet threw it at this other dog. To my surprise, the stone hit the larger dog directly in the head. I'll never forget the sound it made. It sounded more like a water melon than an actual head. He yelped, released his grip on my dog, then after a few shaky steps fell over and started convulsing. Later his corpse was found exactly where he'd fell. You shouldn't underestimate the humble stone thrown by a complete amateur. Although at the time, I did compete for my school in the "throwing the cricket ball" event (yes that was an actual sport in it's own right) and used to practice for about an hour per day so, yes I'd practiced but I was still just a kid.
I have a very strong suspicion as to why Crossbow Men were so well paid. It comes in two parts: First: If you take Knights in armour to be the break through tanks of their day, then Crossbow Men were very much the Anti-tank guns of that time. There's a direct relationship between the increase in plate and the power of crossbow. Probably the only weapon that could reliably deterr or kill armoured knights. That's their advantage. Disadvantage is that a crossbow takes a substantial amount of time to reload. So in practice they would only get one shot. That means waiting until the target is very close, and your certain of your shot. Get it wrong and your dead. Also you don't want to be captured, because you would probably be executed. Run through or beheaded if your lucky. Being hanged from the first convenient tree limb would be more likely. Slow death from strangulation. Unless they are kind enough to give you a neck breaking drop, or pull on your legs. Which probably wouldn't happen. So being a crossbow man is very high risk, therefore it has to be high reward. Second: You have to be very sure of their loyalty. Nature of the weapon means it can be used against you. Hence the high pay.
@@2adamast I've read that inflation corrected cost of a knightly armor and warhorse is roughly equal to that of a modern main battletank. There are very few countries that have thousands of MBT nowdays because those are just so expensive. Kinda shows how much of medieval economies was spent on military.
What's so interesting about almost all these weapons really is how they aren't necessarily super deadly and aren't guarenteed to kill the enemy. I think people forget that real wars and battles aren't actually about killing every single enemy. Obviously, killing the enemy will end the battle, but simply preventing or discouraging them enough to stop fighting will also win the battle and is actually easier than outright killing someone. Humans are actually kind of tough to kill, but to injure and maim is much easier, especially with these implements that have been honed into perfect tools for what they intend to achieve.
in the military, you'll sometimes hear the adage: a dead enemy is one casualty, a wounded one is three. this is because a dead soldier gets left on the battlefield, while a wounded one gets carried off by two of his friends. it's (arguably) more effective to use weapons that are more likely to wound an enemy than kill them outright.
There’s also a ton of “non-deadly” hits which are going to basically knock them out of fight instantly. My fencing teacher did toe-stabs for fun, but a rapier/smallsword through the foot, which rarely had good armor, and I could easily be done for professionally. Thighs also bleed like crazy, sure you’re going to survive, but you’ll probably also faint from blood loss unless you get a bandage on it. And wrists break easy enough, I knew a judoist who could do it to me on accident. All three also being places that tend to be lower priority for body armor. You’ll survive, but 5 minutes after you’ll basically be out of the fight.
Absolutely agree with you. A wounded person takes up the time of police, fire and ambulance. A dead person has a 90 second work up and then you move on.
Couple things about the confusion around mercenary crossbows: besides the weapon, they're often shown with shields. So the ideal crossbowman is short enough to hide behind his shield, strong enough to rapid fire all his ammo, has good enough eyes, and finally, they would definitely ask for more money if they expect to fight field battles instead of on fortifications or ships.
matthewryan7775, Right. In addition, the crossbowman was vulnerable while he was reloading his weapon even if he had some protection from a pavise. That vulnerability meant a risk that had to be compensated which is one of the reasons Italian mercenary crossbowmen commanded high wages.
@@drzander3378 All googd points, plus they were not only skilled but had invested money in good equipment and weaponry. These were wealthy bourgeois soldiers.
@@drzander3378 would they not work in pairs? One is reloading behind the pavise and the other scouting with the crossbow ready? Kind of like the same strategy the Riflemen were paired in the British Rifles in the Napoleonic Wars? Or paired with another guy with a different weapon?
@@antonioencarnacao708 They sort of did sometimes. There would be a master crossbowman with two crossbows and his apprentice. The crossbowman would shoot one weapon while his apprentice was loading the other. For reasons that are not entirely clear but might relate to space on the battlefield, they seem to have only ever used one pavise at a time, primarily to protect the crossbowman, not the apprentice who was fairly exposed.
There is a very nice and helpful slinging community spread all over the world, some in Great Britain too. They would certainly be happy to help and could probably also provide different slings and skills. Great video and good introduction to slinging.
When I was a little helian, our little gang used to make sling shots from guava trees that grew wild in my neighborhood in Miami. We used old bicycle or car tire inner tubes to propell our projectiles, which were held in a piece of leather (usually from old shoes). It was the 50s so Miami was so overpopulated. Those slingshots were deadly at close range using marbles. I took 2 slingshots to Cuba. One for me and one for my cousin (I used to spend my summers with my aunt, uncle, and cousin in Havana). They lived in a semi-rural community with several farms nearby. There were rats as big as cats. We used to put our lunch & dinner left overs for a stray dog that hung around the farms. The dogs leftovers became the bait for the rats. In one summer I killed 36 rats with my slingshot and some buckshot we borrowed from my uncle. Needless to say the farmer near our house loved our form of recreation. 😊
Medieval Roman doctrine had folks who couldn't handle a war bow or who couldn't shoot straight use darts instead. I think that this video illustrates why this worked.
About slings. Supposedly shepherds would train with them while watching their sheep since they didn't have anything better to do and could kill small game with them from a distance. So if you just have enough training you can be accurate enough to hit a rabbit from about 10 meters or however close it will let you get before it jumps away.
I just barrowed some wool from a crocheter. Braid 3 strands together to get 1 small cord, make 6 like it, take the 6 cords into groups of 2 and in 3s braid it down half way, in the middle separate 2 sets of 3 and put a fork in the road. Measure with an open fist when to reconnect it into a single cord again the rest of the way down. Test the split middle by putting a stone on it. Rock falls through so I take a piece of cloth and patch it with needle and thread. A perfectly crafted yarn sling needs no patch just as a perfectly made statue needs no wax. The patch is just for making it so the rock stays in place instead of falling through. Trim the extra bits off past when the 2 ends are knotted together or else they may get caught when you mean to release.
I say this as a fan.. Couple of things with these type of "testing" videos, "ballistics" dummies are made for high speed testing to show such things as cavitation to the human torso when hit with a projectile traveling at 1900 ft per second not slow moving objects. And "ballistic" gelatin does not model the tensile strength of muscles or the structures of the body such as skin and bones, gelatin simulates flesh which cuts far easier than skin reinforced by bone and muscle, which ultimately produces inaccurate results. Plus, the lack of clothing and or armour. But again, thank you for the great video😊
The sling can be simplified by using a simple overhand throw like with the staff sling. You do lose some power, but it is still a longer lever than when hand thrown (thus increasing velocity) and it improves accuracy quite a bit.
a couple of thoughts - the italian crossbowmen. Endurance in the fight. How does spanning a Genoese crossbow compare to shooting a warbow? I would suspect, as well as being better fitted out in case of entering melee, I'd suspect they will be far less fatigued when they had to/chose to get stuck in. Training is time and money - so the longbowmen spent so much time training that, less time training for melee, etc. the Genoese Mercenaries could obviously train to be as good as possible with the crossbows, but also they are far more incentivised and have the time to train melee fighting as a job. Also didn't have to farm 6 days a week. Also Veterancy a Mercenary company is self-selecting to be made up of people with real experience and a comfort in battlefield challenges, because they chose to go back to it. So their total battlefield proficiency could have been a lot higher than a Longbowman. Bolt Flights and understanding of lift dynamics - this has been something stuck in my mind for some time. Sails produce lift the same way, and by the middle ages, sailing rigging, and methods was very advanced, and clearly understood how to place the sails to produce the desired thrust. So I think the rote and applied understanding of such shapes must necessarily have been better understood than what surviving writings let on.
52:47 One point on this Crossbows were more costly but were very cheap to maintain Both through low strength requirement And Cheap ammo Your bolts dont need to bend Your bolts dont need horn inserts Your bolts dont need glued and chordage and good quality fletching You just needed a metal point of sorts and a shaft, you could make the wooden fins from the same piece of wood Longbow was low cost weapon but higher cost ammo and high cost shooter Crossbow was higher cost weapon but low cost ammo and low cost shooter This is why crossbows were more common
Peltasts were actually named after the small shield they carried, called a pelte. They didn't throw stones, they were armed with javelins and used as light infantry and skirmishers. Cool video.
Many years ago I bought a throwing axe... the guy called it a french hawk. kinda looks like the one Tod throws but with a longer tapered handle that is easy to replace. I LOVE it still.
Always love me some @tods_workshop content, also only 5 mins in currently and yeah could you imagine getting hit in the noggin with a stone of that size. Thanks for the video gentlemen
With a sling faster is not better. You want to feel the moment all through your power stroke, and you accelerate that as you move toward your release. Faster spinning often leads to much worse aiming and lower power. Your whole body should be involved, not just your wrist. Yes, the sling is about 1 meter long, but when you get your body and full length of your arm involved that becomes closer to 3 meters you're rotating the stone about. I find that spinning multiple times it is not really useful, I do basically most of a single circle from the sling held still to full extension.
Yep. All in the speed of the last revolution. Driving forward with the rear leg, rotating the hips, then shoulders and arms and wrist. I have learned a lot from watching baseball pitching tutorials. I usually throw with 3-4 spins before release; I find it uncannily allows my brain to assess the weight of the projectile, particularly when throwing rocks of varying weight
The rock reminds me of stories from WW2 US soldiers that were baseball players (amateur I'm sure) that were fighting on the front lines throwing grenades just like baseballs. Fast, far, and with enough accuracy to hit an enemy directly or get through windows and opening. The would be incredibly scary enough before it explodes... so a roman solider with a good arm could of ruined the day of many men much further away then any person who just picked it up and been a force to be reckoned with.
Dads: violence in society is a menace Also dads: so I got this incendiary chemical weapons arrow from my warbow simulator flame grilling a dummies chest cavity with acrid smoke and oozes coming out
As an evolutionary anthropologist, I took an entire course and have even published a paper on the evolution of humans and projectile weapons. Their is strong evidence that humans evolved to throw objects very hard and accurately. Our highly mobile and flexible shoulders combined with flexible wrists and elbows allow us to put way more torque in a throw than any ape could.
Our lower limbs also play a role, giving us a stable tall base to aim and throw from; there is a lot of torque in the lower legs. When the infant is in the womb, the palmar surface of the foot starts off as a mirror of the hand, with the sole facing upwards and what will become the big toe facing outwards in the same way as the thumb in the anatomical position. The whole foot twists round during normal development and you can see the visible torque in the normally developed leg. This allows a lot of energy to be stored in walking, and also in throwing, when the knees and hips come into play.
I saw a video of an Asian female throw a mostly full water bottle at a chimp in a zoo. The chimp picked up the water bottle and threw it back smacking her butt first in the face. It didn't appear to do any real damage but she did cry.
@@brianhowe201 So that's not true, spears for throwing were created about 330kya. We evolved the ability to throw things like rocks for at least 2 million years as Homo Erectus from the neck down was basically a modern human.
When I was in 2nd grade, another 2nd grader spun a rock off my head requiring 11 stitches. I bled like a stuck hog. It was pure carnage and horror. I had to look like a victim in a slasher movie. It doesn't even take a highly practiced soldier to make the rock work out for you.
So fascinating!!! Thank you so much! I had no idea that some of these weapons even existed. The creation is so simple and the thought that went in to making some of them easier to use for untrained soldiers is genius! I understand that the creation and evolution took centuries, but still…
The plumbatae was actually a common toy for children in the Americas back when I was young. You would put a ring out in the yard and throw them up in the air to try to fall down onto the ring. The game of lawn darts was quite fun at BBQs, but they stopped selling them because too many kids impaled their friends with them.
I came for Tod 😀 Just some small points of correction. That 450lb crossbow, with metal prods produces 48-54j, Tod tested it on his channel. That is more akin to a 70-75lb Yew Longbow. But in essence, the point made is 100% accurate. Increasing the power of the crossbow is not going to increase the skill cap. So using a 650-700lb steel proded crossbow will simulate that 100lb warbow and you will be just as good at using it as you were the 450lb one.
I can say from personal experience that a Rock hurts when thrown at my eye. Kids in my day had rock wars and b-b gun wars. There was always one jerk that would load his snow balls with rocks for the neighborhood snow ball fight.
I think there's another thing that about the chest wounds. You're poking holes in the pectoral muscles. A few of those, and moving your arm out in front of you is going to start hurting, and and require more look from less muscle fiber.
@@chrishill7797 When I was in the Army, they taught us about the value of injuring someone, as then 3 people are out of combat... the injured soldier, and two people to pull him out.
Slings can throw 1kg stones if they can accommodate them in the pouch, but a slinger would generally prefer 30-500gram projectiles depending on the situation. I haven't seen a staff-sling achieve greater distance or speed than a simple sling except for modern material staff-slings that look more like fishing poles. I can see how medieval staff-slings would be preferred over slings in sieges in which you are in crowded places throwing heavy stuff over a wall.
Also a practiced slinger needs only a single rotation. The sleed doesn't come from a fast twirl, but pretty much the last split second of the throw. They were a quick weapon with a lot of versatility. Also, incendiaries were a thing, so there's that.
I've made a sling, and it works great, but I've had problems with 1 end of the string still being attached to my hand when I tried to let go of it to loose the stone. So I've tried trimming off the extra bits that go past when I knot it off so they don't get caught when I try to release, that problem should be fixed. Next I'm going to try painting the rocks with a glow in the dark paint so I can just wait until night so I can find them.
@RachDarastric2 That idea of the flourescent paint sounds amazing, I hadn't known such things existed. I've been trying to figure out how to video slinging in the dark - one of the great advantages of the sling I feel. Brilliant! The Practical Paracord sling is another level than the ones I'd made myself. Granted I haven't gotten seriously intp weaving my own, but I am looking to do so this fall. Definitely makes a responsive and predictable sling. Not particularly fond of the oversize whip on my sling. While I do appreciate the aesthetics, i like a quick whip that I can catch and throw again quickly. You can still have a bit of tassle, but it should be small. The Acroballists LP1 and LP4 are amazing in that regard.
@RachDarastric2 i see what you're saying about that extra cordage, it is confusing. My last sling stretched, so I got used to holding it just above the knot, so it's extra weird. I agree I should fiddle with it.
Legions would have auxilia troops - archers, slingers and calvary. The middle Rome legion (gladius, scutum, testudo) wins against all pre-gunpowder armies and military units except heavy calvary. There was a Roman general Ventidius who invented the most OP army form, but unfortunately he disappeared from history and his invention forgotten. The army form is middle Rome legion with all auxulia being slingers with lead bullets, which solves the heavy calvary problem. If his side won, a 'ventidian' Rome would have conquered the world basically.
stones and slings are also better for volleys compared to the archery, where you have a lot of power loss and endurance concerns when doing volley fire. good point!
Love it when a guy that has no clue how a weapon works writes a book. Problem is people like him, read that garbage. At least he has the will to learn. Learn first all about it, experience it first hand, then write the book.
Thanks guys, I had a great day and a real pleasure to work with Matt again.
about crossbow mercs:
so i theorize that the main thing is that the crossbows themselves were likely pretty expensive. this, as well as the way crossbows function, has some knock-on effects, mainly the mercs themselves are going to be from a higher social class. They have to buy their own equipment first likely before they can join a company, and likely have been play training with smaller versions their family has been buying them throughout their lives. So you're hiring not just a trained soldier, you're paying for his horse and his crumpets and his wine.
the other bit is that a crossbow soldier works best as a team, so for every shooter you're paying for you're also paying for the two guys that carry his stuff and reload his crossbows, and they're no doubt trained and equipped as warriors as well.
and the final point i'd make is; consider modern fps shooter games, a pro player in such games can wipe out entire teams of average players with ease. the crossbow is a powerful force multiplier by itself, but you put a truly skilled user on one and i bet they'll be worth a whole company of ordinary shooters. if on average at x range 10 peasant archers will get 9 fatal hits out of a hundred arrows, if you have one crossbowman that can hit a fatal arrow 25% of the time at that range then that one dude is worth about 3 times as much as the ten guys.
It's just practice getting it up Tod😂
1:06:03 You did not have to stick your fingers in joe like that!!😫😨 dirty man
As a kid, I used to roll pub darts off my fingers, kind of side arm/underarm, and got considerable more speed than I ever did with the standard dart throw. Did you ever try something like that with your plumbata?
No offence but can you run it back again with some trained people to give us an actual answer to how it could have happened on the field?
It would be a great comparison to you two guys?
Just from the intro alone, I think that ballistics dummy is going to have to become a town guard after all those knee shots.
lol. I used to be an adventurer like you …
@@kingerikthegreatest.ofall.7860let me guess? Somebody stole your sweet roll?
@@sillygoose7646 lol .
Oh, ha ha. But in all seriousness, really?😤 That joke has been done to death.
@@fredfry5100 Some jokes never really die. Like Skyrim releases.
I'm from Mallorca, in the Balearic Islands, so happy you mentioned the Balearic Slingers and to know they are known arround the world. Really good video😃😃
"Let's find out." Is the epitome of Tod, and why I love him so much.
I thought the same thing!
I'm a simple man. I see a video with Tod in it, I watch it. And I was not disappointed.
My favourite video ever watched on youtube was Todd's video on fire arrows. Love his stuff and always learn something new.
Because of that video I bought the bloody Pyrotechnica book. And it's bloody brilliant. Not just because of the fiery weaponry stuff, but of everything else in the book what we would call today "thermal process engineering".
*IM DEEPLY ENVIOUS* of Tod's garden - it is very beautiful.
It's also under water for a quarter of the year 😅
@@bl4cksp1d3r My garden and drive in the Uk was under water for 3 years - 2005-2008
@@bl4cksp1d3r Sweet.
i love the "Roman War Darts" or plumbata! As a child, my friends and I would take long pheasant tail feathers and hammer a spent rifle shell (the brass shell) to the end, and throw them up in the air. Eventually, we would battle with them. The plumbata reminds me a lot of this - basically the same principle. A large weight on the end of a shaft of wood, but in our case the shaft was a pheasant tail feather! Makes me wonder if anyone might have used something more similar in antiquity. Replace the brass rifle shell with a sharp point, and you have a formidable and deadly weapon! I'm curious - really curious!
A collab with Tod? Hell yeah!
Regarding the humble rock, Francisco Balbi di Correggio wrote that arquebusiers at the Great Siege of Malta 1565 opted to throw stones rather than shoot their pieces at one point in order to do more damage ("mas daño") & more often ("mas a menudo"). So, under those specific circumstances of defending a high place under assault, the rock outcompeted the matchlock firearm.
I love these modern translations and collaborations. Very interesting. Thank you!
Good stuff. Now do a collab with Matt Easton AND Tod about melee weapons. I find it weird that some of the best knowledge is on this thing called youtube, but Tod really does go the extra mile to test stuff. Schologladitoria also does a lot of work with similar topics.
When I was a kid , I used to make slings out of a sock and bootlacrs . This would throw a rock quite hard. Thuogh I wasn't very accurate. You yube tutorials have shown me more sophisticated methods of making slings. I have a deeper appreciation for the sling. One of the easiest to make, but onecof the hardest to learn to use. But well worthwhile to learn and one of the nost fun. What boy doesn't like to throw rocks, and the harder , the faster the better.
Todd is a wealth of knowledge as usual, and he has the most perfect way of explaining himself. Absolute national treasure.
Fascinating experimental archaeology - the enthusiasm (and occasional disappointment) was palpable! Thank you and well done.
During the Northwest Indian wars, the tomahawk throw was very common. Usually, one side would ambush the other with muskets and then the side that came out on top would chase down the survivors with tomahawks once everyone emptied their guns.
It is difficult to tell if the throw was just showboating or a last ditch attempt to get someone you couldn't catch, but it often didn't work.
Always a treat to see Tod take the range with a variety of fun implements of death and destruction. He brings a distinct charm to it.
I didn't know of this collaboration until just now! Neat!
Two extremely likeable guys casually throwing around brutal medieval weapons.
I've been slinging toys for my dog for awhile now. I've shot bow and arrow, rifles, pistols, and thrown things.
The sling, in terms of being stupidly simple to make and very hard to be accurate with, is at the furthest end of both extremes.
I find the sling one.of the easiest 'weapons' to get accurate with, it has a feel to it that corrects for variations in proprioception, assuming you have any reasonable proprioception, which the presenters clearly lack.
great appearance from Tod. Great channel, great content provider.
"Apperently i can swing a stick... I found my weapon"
Every boy will agree that there is no better weapon than the stick he found in the woods earlier ^^
Hannibal Barca ( me ) used 2000 Balearic Slingers in my war against Rome. They were more nimble and accurate. They really were excellent for early skirmish and open battles before the heavy infantry close in
Tod is a true Legend, his Knowledge is stunning. 👏🏻👏🏻🏆
When I was 14 I was out walking my dog when he was attacked by another much larger dog (about the size of a German Shephard). I was petrified but very angry I reached down and picked up a pebble and from a distance of about 20 feet threw it at this other dog. To my surprise, the stone hit the larger dog directly in the head. I'll never forget the sound it made. It sounded more like a water melon than an actual head.
He yelped, released his grip on my dog, then after a few shaky steps fell over and started convulsing. Later his corpse was found exactly where he'd fell. You shouldn't underestimate the humble stone thrown by a complete amateur. Although at the time, I did compete for my school in the "throwing the cricket ball" event (yes that was an actual sport in it's own right) and used to practice for about an hour per day so, yes I'd practiced but I was still just a kid.
Damn! Have been watching you and Tod for years - great to see you together!
Loved this, subbed to Tods channel right away, more stuff like this please.
So fun to see collabs with people like Tod from Todsworkshop.
He is awesome, you are both
I have a very strong suspicion as to why Crossbow Men were so well paid. It comes in two parts:
First: If you take Knights in armour to be the break through tanks of their day, then Crossbow Men were very much the Anti-tank guns of that time. There's a direct relationship between the increase in plate and the power of crossbow. Probably the only weapon that could reliably deterr or kill armoured knights. That's their advantage. Disadvantage is that a crossbow takes a substantial amount of time to reload. So in practice they would only get one shot. That means waiting until the target is very close, and your certain of your shot. Get it wrong and your dead.
Also you don't want to be captured, because you would probably be executed. Run through or beheaded if your lucky. Being hanged from the first convenient tree limb would be more likely. Slow death from strangulation. Unless they are kind enough to give you a neck breaking drop, or pull on your legs. Which probably wouldn't happen.
So being a crossbow man is very high risk, therefore it has to be high reward.
Second:
You have to be very sure of their loyalty. Nature of the weapon means it can be used against you. Hence the high pay.
You underestimate the cost of heavy cavalry.
@@2adamast I've read that inflation corrected cost of a knightly armor and warhorse is roughly equal to that of a modern main battletank. There are very few countries that have thousands of MBT nowdays because those are just so expensive. Kinda shows how much of medieval economies was spent on military.
Tod's Workshop is the greatest.
Tod is a great chap , very knowledgeable.
this is awesome! I'd love to see a round 2 looking into some melee weapons. Especially some of the weirder ones like the hussite flail.
What's so interesting about almost all these weapons really is how they aren't necessarily super deadly and aren't guarenteed to kill the enemy. I think people forget that real wars and battles aren't actually about killing every single enemy. Obviously, killing the enemy will end the battle, but simply preventing or discouraging them enough to stop fighting will also win the battle and is actually easier than outright killing someone. Humans are actually kind of tough to kill, but to injure and maim is much easier, especially with these implements that have been honed into perfect tools for what they intend to achieve.
in the military, you'll sometimes hear the adage: a dead enemy is one casualty, a wounded one is three. this is because a dead soldier gets left on the battlefield, while a wounded one gets carried off by two of his friends. it's (arguably) more effective to use weapons that are more likely to wound an enemy than kill them outright.
There’s also a ton of “non-deadly” hits which are going to basically knock them out of fight instantly. My fencing teacher did toe-stabs for fun, but a rapier/smallsword through the foot, which rarely had good armor, and I could easily be done for professionally. Thighs also bleed like crazy, sure you’re going to survive, but you’ll probably also faint from blood loss unless you get a bandage on it. And wrists break easy enough, I knew a judoist who could do it to me on accident. All three also being places that tend to be lower priority for body armor. You’ll survive, but 5 minutes after you’ll basically be out of the fight.
Even just being in a crowd or a demonstration that turns nasty...all that stuff being chucked about is terrifying
Absolutely agree with you. A wounded person takes up the time of police, fire and ambulance. A dead person has a 90 second work up and then you move on.
Absolutely an education
Couple things about the confusion around mercenary crossbows: besides the weapon, they're often shown with shields. So the ideal crossbowman is short enough to hide behind his shield, strong enough to rapid fire all his ammo, has good enough eyes, and finally, they would definitely ask for more money if they expect to fight field battles instead of on fortifications or ships.
matthewryan7775, Right. In addition, the crossbowman was vulnerable while he was reloading his weapon even if he had some protection from a pavise. That vulnerability meant a risk that had to be compensated which is one of the reasons Italian mercenary crossbowmen commanded high wages.
Yeah, they definitely weren't paying them that much for kindness, but necessity.
@@drzander3378 All googd points, plus they were not only skilled but had invested money in good equipment and weaponry. These were wealthy bourgeois soldiers.
@@drzander3378 would they not work in pairs? One is reloading behind the pavise and the other scouting with the crossbow ready? Kind of like the same strategy the Riflemen were paired in the British Rifles in the Napoleonic Wars?
Or paired with another guy with a different weapon?
@@antonioencarnacao708 They sort of did sometimes. There would be a master crossbowman with two crossbows and his apprentice. The crossbowman would shoot one weapon while his apprentice was loading the other. For reasons that are not entirely clear but might relate to space on the battlefield, they seem to have only ever used one pavise at a time, primarily to protect the crossbowman, not the apprentice who was fairly exposed.
There is a very nice and helpful slinging community spread all over the world, some in Great Britain too. They would certainly be happy to help and could probably also provide different slings and skills. Great video and good introduction to slinging.
@schlingellore258 i agree, wondering why you dodn't call in a seasoned slinger.
When I was a little helian, our little gang used to make sling shots from guava trees that grew wild in my neighborhood in Miami. We used old bicycle or car tire inner tubes to propell our projectiles, which were held in a piece of leather (usually from old shoes). It was the 50s so Miami was so overpopulated. Those slingshots were deadly at close range using marbles.
I took 2 slingshots to Cuba. One for me and one for my cousin (I used to spend my summers with my aunt, uncle, and cousin in Havana). They lived in a semi-rural community with several farms nearby. There were rats as big as cats. We used to put our lunch & dinner left overs for a stray dog that hung around the farms. The dogs leftovers became the bait for the rats. In one summer I killed 36 rats with my slingshot and some buckshot we borrowed from my uncle. Needless to say the farmer near our house loved our form of recreation. 😊
Medieval Roman doctrine had folks who couldn't handle a war bow or who couldn't shoot straight use darts instead. I think that this video illustrates why this worked.
About slings. Supposedly shepherds would train with them while watching their sheep since they didn't have anything better to do and could kill small game with them from a distance. So if you just have enough training you can be accurate enough to hit a rabbit from about 10 meters or however close it will let you get before it jumps away.
Also for scaring off predators from the flock.
I just barrowed some wool from a crocheter. Braid 3 strands together to get 1 small cord, make 6 like it, take the 6 cords into groups of 2 and in 3s braid it down half way, in the middle separate 2 sets of 3 and put a fork in the road. Measure with an open fist when to reconnect it into a single cord again the rest of the way down.
Test the split middle by putting a stone on it. Rock falls through so I take a piece of cloth and patch it with needle and thread. A perfectly crafted yarn sling needs no patch just as a perfectly made statue needs no wax. The patch is just for making it so the rock stays in place instead of falling through.
Trim the extra bits off past when the 2 ends are knotted together or else they may get caught when you mean to release.
Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me. But that crossbow, it scares me
I don't know about that. They also say that the pen is mightier than the sword.
@@hypothalapotamus5293 except if you’re in medieval times
I say this as a fan.. Couple of things with these type of "testing" videos, "ballistics" dummies are made for high speed testing to show such things as cavitation to the human torso when hit with a projectile traveling at 1900 ft per second not slow moving objects. And "ballistic" gelatin does not model the tensile strength of muscles or the structures of the body such as skin and bones, gelatin simulates flesh which cuts far easier than skin reinforced by bone and muscle, which ultimately produces inaccurate results. Plus, the lack of clothing and or armour. But again, thank you for the great video😊
The sling can be simplified by using a simple overhand throw like with the staff sling. You do lose some power, but it is still a longer lever than when hand thrown (thus increasing velocity) and it improves accuracy quite a bit.
Fabulous bit of filming here. I'm a fan of anything Tod.. and to see an average bloke try stuff out? well, wish I could volunteer for that! :)
Fantastic collab
Saw the preview and just thought to myself: "This is Tod'sGarden!"
And yes, it was Tod's garden!!!
The Medieval Cinematic Universe rides again!
The sling still holds up as an incredibly powerful ranged weapon.
A collab between History Hit and Tod Cutler AND it's over an hour? I'm in heaven!
thoroughly enjoyed this video and learnt alot, thank you both
I would LOVE to have a go at throwing one of those giant dart-spear things
a couple of thoughts - the italian crossbowmen. Endurance in the fight. How does spanning a Genoese crossbow compare to shooting a warbow? I would suspect, as well as being better fitted out in case of entering melee, I'd suspect they will be far less fatigued when they had to/chose to get stuck in. Training is time and money - so the longbowmen spent so much time training that, less time training for melee, etc. the Genoese Mercenaries could obviously train to be as good as possible with the crossbows, but also they are far more incentivised and have the time to train melee fighting as a job. Also didn't have to farm 6 days a week. Also Veterancy a Mercenary company is self-selecting to be made up of people with real experience and a comfort in battlefield challenges, because they chose to go back to it. So their total battlefield proficiency could have been a lot higher than a Longbowman.
Bolt Flights and understanding of lift dynamics - this has been something stuck in my mind for some time. Sails produce lift the same way, and by the middle ages, sailing rigging, and methods was very advanced, and clearly understood how to place the sails to produce the desired thrust. So I think the rote and applied understanding of such shapes must necessarily have been better understood than what surviving writings let on.
26:00 "I used to be an adventurer like you. Then I took a throwing arrow in the knee..."
38:22 🤣
I was just about to post that myself. Haha
Thank you for this interesting documenatation❤
Truly fascinating, thank you 👍👍
The Greek stories have numerous examples of named characters getting injured or killed by rocks and stones being thrown at them - Illiad etc
I see plumbata in the thumbnail, I see Tod tagged in the title, I click
52:47
One point on this
Crossbows were more costly but were very cheap to maintain
Both through low strength requirement
And
Cheap ammo
Your bolts dont need to bend
Your bolts dont need horn inserts
Your bolts dont need glued and chordage and good quality fletching
You just needed a metal point of sorts and a shaft, you could make the wooden fins from the same piece of wood
Longbow was low cost weapon but higher cost ammo and high cost shooter
Crossbow was higher cost weapon but low cost ammo and low cost shooter
This is why crossbows were more common
Peltasts were actually named after the small shield they carried, called a pelte. They didn't throw stones, they were armed with javelins and used as light infantry and skirmishers. Cool video.
I'm sure they threw stones too, but yeah, that was a bit inaccurate.
Many years ago I bought a throwing axe... the guy called it a french hawk. kinda looks like the one Tod throws but with a longer tapered handle that is easy to replace. I LOVE it still.
Nice Collab love seeing Tod on the show
Nicely done gentlemen!
Awesome work!
Always love me some @tods_workshop content, also only 5 mins in currently and yeah could you imagine getting hit in the noggin with a stone of that size. Thanks for the video gentlemen
With a sling faster is not better. You want to feel the moment all through your power stroke, and you accelerate that as you move toward your release. Faster spinning often leads to much worse aiming and lower power. Your whole body should be involved, not just your wrist. Yes, the sling is about 1 meter long, but when you get your body and full length of your arm involved that becomes closer to 3 meters you're rotating the stone about.
I find that spinning multiple times it is not really useful, I do basically most of a single circle from the sling held still to full extension.
Yep. All in the speed of the last revolution. Driving forward with the rear leg, rotating the hips, then shoulders and arms and wrist. I have learned a lot from watching baseball pitching tutorials. I usually throw with 3-4 spins before release; I find it uncannily allows my brain to assess the weight of the projectile, particularly when throwing rocks of varying weight
Finished with a flaming longbow arrow through the heart - brilliant!
Great video, love Tode's Workshop and HH!
The rock reminds me of stories from WW2 US soldiers that were baseball players (amateur I'm sure) that were fighting on the front lines throwing grenades just like baseballs. Fast, far, and with enough accuracy to hit an enemy directly or get through windows and opening. The would be incredibly scary enough before it explodes... so a roman solider with a good arm could of ruined the day of many men much further away then any person who just picked it up and been a force to be reckoned with.
In 2024 most of these weapons are still being used in the U.K.
Dads: violence in society is a menace
Also dads: so I got this incendiary chemical weapons arrow from my warbow simulator flame grilling a dummies chest cavity with acrid smoke and oozes coming out
"Find a peaceful solution, don't fight. Good talk son, I'm gonna go make some war axes in the garage foundry now."
As an evolutionary anthropologist, I took an entire course and have even published a paper on the evolution of humans and projectile weapons. Their is strong evidence that humans evolved to throw objects very hard and accurately. Our highly mobile and flexible shoulders combined with flexible wrists and elbows allow us to put way more torque in a throw than any ape could.
Our lower limbs also play a role, giving us a stable tall base to aim and throw from; there is a lot of torque in the lower legs. When the infant is in the womb, the palmar surface of the foot starts off as a mirror of the hand, with the sole facing upwards and what will become the big toe facing outwards in the same way as the thumb in the anatomical position. The whole foot twists round during normal development and you can see the visible torque in the normally developed leg. This allows a lot of energy to be stored in walking, and also in throwing, when the knees and hips come into play.
Considering apes arm strength and the horror of their attack, we must be really more OP than we can imagine.
Its crazy to think we've had spears so long that we literally evolved to use them better.
I saw a video of an Asian female throw a mostly full water bottle at a chimp in a zoo. The chimp picked up the water bottle and threw it back smacking her butt first in the face. It didn't appear to do any real damage but she did cry.
@@brianhowe201 So that's not true, spears for throwing were created about 330kya. We evolved the ability to throw things like rocks for at least 2 million years as Homo Erectus from the neck down was basically a modern human.
Imagine the tiger woods of sling shot back in the day. Like a gun I'd say
When I was in 2nd grade, another 2nd grader spun a rock off my head requiring 11 stitches. I bled like a stuck hog. It was pure carnage and horror. I had to look like a victim in a slasher movie. It doesn't even take a highly practiced soldier to make the rock work out for you.
Love seeing somebody else left handed shooting a bow!
Tod is a ledgend. Go see his channel it is great stuf.
Great video! Well done. Thank you!
Great video! Love the quiz in the title, too! I’ll have a go: the deadliest medieval weapons were the ones that hit you. 😬
This vid is well worth my time to watch.
Absolutely brilliant video guys
So fascinating!!! Thank you so much! I had no idea that some of these weapons even existed. The creation is so simple and the thought that went in to making some of them easier to use for untrained soldiers is genius! I understand that the creation and evolution took centuries, but still…
I feel like this is just a “best of” for all of Todd’s old builds. I’m here for it.
Loved the staff sling. Never seen one used before. Almost like a hand held trebuchet.
The plumbatae was actually a common toy for children in the Americas back when I was young. You would put a ring out in the yard and throw them up in the air to try to fall down onto the ring. The game of lawn darts was quite fun at BBQs, but they stopped selling them because too many kids impaled their friends with them.
I came for Tod 😀
Just some small points of correction.
That 450lb crossbow, with metal prods produces 48-54j, Tod tested it on his channel. That is more akin to a 70-75lb Yew Longbow.
But in essence, the point made is 100% accurate. Increasing the power of the crossbow is not going to increase the skill cap.
So using a 650-700lb steel proded crossbow will simulate that 100lb warbow and you will be just as good at using it as you were the 450lb one.
Balistic torso and Tod? Hell yeah brother.
01:01:35 “Arsewipes” the funniest and most British reaction I’ve ever heard to a failure 😂
Yay! Leo Todeschini!
Some one has clearly spent time on the myarmoury web site.
You made a video with Tod, yet you didnt use his Ballista/Catapult nor his trebuchet? missed opportunity!
Always love to see Tod though!
Maybe it’s in the garage?
I can say from personal experience that a Rock hurts when thrown at my eye. Kids in my day had rock wars and b-b gun wars. There was always one jerk that would load his snow balls with rocks for the neighborhood snow ball fight.
Todd and Tristan from the ancients podcast.
Has someone been peeking at my Christmas list.
This looks like a fun day out with the boys, and maybe a business opportunity. Pilums for punters?
I think there's another thing that about the chest wounds. You're poking holes in the pectoral muscles. A few of those, and moving your arm out in front of you is going to start hurting, and and require more look from less muscle fiber.
Yeah you only need to injure a soldier to get him out of the battle
@@chrishill7797 When I was in the Army, they taught us about the value of injuring someone, as then 3 people are out of combat... the injured soldier, and two people to pull him out.
@@rex8255good point, I didn’t think about that tbh, more than one guy off the battlefield with just one hit
0:10 “Aghh ass wipes” 😂😂😂
great work as always guys, i loved it
invaluable information here, thanks for this. maces and swords next?
Slings can throw 1kg stones if they can accommodate them in the pouch, but a slinger would generally prefer 30-500gram projectiles depending on the situation. I haven't seen a staff-sling achieve greater distance or speed than a simple sling except for modern material staff-slings that look more like fishing poles. I can see how medieval staff-slings would be preferred over slings in sieges in which you are in crowded places throwing heavy stuff over a wall.
Also a practiced slinger needs only a single rotation. The sleed doesn't come from a fast twirl, but pretty much the last split second of the throw. They were a quick weapon with a lot of versatility. Also, incendiaries were a thing, so there's that.
I've made a sling, and it works great, but I've had problems with 1 end of the string still being attached to my hand when I tried to let go of it to loose the stone. So I've tried trimming off the extra bits that go past when I knot it off so they don't get caught when I try to release, that problem should be fixed.
Next I'm going to try painting the rocks with a glow in the dark paint so I can just wait until night so I can find them.
A sling is a bit like an extension of your arm, if that extension was a tendril.
@RachDarastric2 That idea of the flourescent paint sounds amazing, I hadn't known such things existed. I've been trying to figure out how to video slinging in the dark - one of the great advantages of the sling I feel. Brilliant!
The Practical Paracord sling is another level than the ones I'd made myself. Granted I haven't gotten seriously intp weaving my own, but I am looking to do so this fall. Definitely makes a responsive and predictable sling.
Not particularly fond of the oversize whip on my sling. While I do appreciate the aesthetics, i like a quick whip that I can catch and throw again quickly. You can still have a bit of tassle, but it should be small. The Acroballists LP1 and LP4 are amazing in that regard.
@RachDarastric2 i see what you're saying about that extra cordage, it is confusing. My last sling stretched, so I got used to holding it just above the knot, so it's extra weird. I agree I should fiddle with it.
Wonderful introduction
Stones were probably a volley weapon. If 100 legionaries throw stones at another large group, a lot will find a rarget
Legions would have auxilia troops - archers, slingers and calvary.
The middle Rome legion (gladius, scutum, testudo) wins against all pre-gunpowder armies and military units except heavy calvary. There was a Roman general Ventidius who invented the most OP army form, but unfortunately he disappeared from history and his invention forgotten. The army form is middle Rome legion with all auxulia being slingers with lead bullets, which solves the heavy calvary problem. If his side won, a 'ventidian' Rome would have conquered the world basically.
stones and slings are also better for volleys compared to the archery, where you have a lot of power loss and endurance concerns when doing volley fire. good point!
In Greek warfare, slinging was something almost everyone could do. Peltast was a soldier who carried a "Pelte", a light Thracian style shield.
Love it when a guy that has no clue how a weapon works writes a book. Problem is people like him, read that garbage. At least he has the will to learn. Learn first all about it, experience it first hand, then write the book.
That was a lot of fun to watch awesome
So that staff sling is essentially a handheld trebuchet?