_Please note: volume levels have been lowered during the "test tone" sections, but return to normal outside of those specific instances._ Also, some receivers don't feature a "dB" or decibel volume mode and instead have a volume scale going from 0-99. Setup will still be relatively the same, you can just leave the front left channel's trim level at 0dB and adjust the volume until it reads 75dB on the SPL meter while using the tone generator in REW. Then you can adjust all the speaker trim levels to match the front left (along with the subwoofer as well). If you'd like a video tutorial covering that type of speaker level matching, leave me a comment below and let me know.
I actually haven’t covered level matching in REW, only when discussing subwoofers really. I also tried to explain the process more in depth and also why you may want to set the tone generator to -30dBFS.
I have watched this video several times over, and it still isn't making any sense how you are adjusting the sub trim level using the Front Left speaker output in REW. When I do that, it only outputs from the Front Left speaker. Nothing outputs from my subwoofer. Would you kindly elaborate and/or explain what you're doing in that step? Are you physically unplugging the Front Left speaker?
Great REW series. You can open the receiver’s management settings by entering the IP address in a browser on the computer, and change the level settings that way. It eliminates going back, and forth with REW and the receiver’s On Screen Settings.
May not be "optimal", but for atmos speakers. you could plug them into say, the left front speaker, calibrate distance/crossover and such, then plug it back in to its normal output and set the calibrated numbers. Its something I've done and it worked out ok for me.
The problem is by doing that, you are using the left front speaker audyssey correction in your Atmos speakers, so you could end up with a much worse result than not doing a calibration at all. Imaging you have in your front left speaker a huge dip at 200hz and a huge null at 300hz. Audyssey will try to correct that, and now imagine you have the opposite in your Atmos speakers. Leveling spekeras with your method will riun everything.
Approached level setting a bit different. I use REW to set the L to 75db and then use the Dolby 7.1.4 TrueHD-Atmos pink noise demo video you can find on most Dolby demo download sites to calibrate the rest of the speakers. It plays about 3db louder than REW on the calibrated L channel using my HTPC media player so I walk through each speaker on the demo and calibrate the other speakers to 78db which should put them all at REW's 75db including Atmos speakers. On a similar thought, I also leave Dynamic EQ on since I do use it. Two advantages are that levels are calibrated for Atmos and my HTPC which is my primary source for content with Atmos being my primary mode of listening to it.
Great idea. Thanks. BTW, it doesn't matter if you leave dinamic EQ, becouse with dinamic EQ does, is to set subwoofer frecuencies rise to reference level when you play content Belpre reference levels, but when you do the calibration, you are doing calibration, your Avr is set to 0, wich is reference level, and at that level, dinamic EQ is not doing anything.
The sub level matching using the left speaker might not be accurate, especially if you don’t have a seamless crossover from the sub to your speaker. I would actually suggest using the 4th output in REW. It’s the LFE channel and it is typically 10db hotter than other channels. So you could level it to 85db or lower the input volume from -30dbfs to -40dbfs and go for the 75db target.
Look forward to the new tutorial I was like a fish out of water watch the old one then my new Mini DSP 2x4 HD arrived this console popped up and to be real honest I was flummoxed . Old 76 yr old guy trying to set up my subs
This video is great. Few questions: 1. Can we match levels at a lower volume, like 65-70dB. Reason is I live in an apartment building and 75dB was quite loud. 2. If we run Audyssey post level setting, won't this change the levels that we set? 3. I could be doing something wrong, because to match my sub at 75dB, I had to set the receiver to +9dB and was quite high on the sub volume. This doesn't seem right. (My sub is connected via LFE) Thanks!
1) Since it's a Denon AVR, should we be boosting the gain on the subs/input to the miniDSP to get something that's more in the negatives? Like below -6 to ensure there's no clipping from the AVR? 2) Should we level match before deciding on the best crossover frequencies since if they're off a few dB from the AVR calibration, then there might not be as smooth of a response if we decided the crossovers first? 3) If we have the +10dB house curve from your previous videos, would setting the subwoofer to 75db technically make it not really go from 85-75dB? So maybe another reason to keep it a few dB higher?
Thanks for these instructions - I've ordered a UMIK-1 a couple of days ago, and these instructions will definitely be of use in the coming days/weeks/months. ;)
Hello and best regards from Austria 🇦🇹 (Europe). Thanks for your tips, very helpful! But there is no ASIO for MAC OS, what else can I use? Thanks very much,
Hi Dan, as far as I’m aware Mac OS already has multichannel output built in whereas windows doesn’t, hence the need for Asio. On Mac OS, just select what channel you want in REW, L C R SR etc. Just make sure your output is set to your AVR and connected via hdmi. I don’t own a Mac, it’s just what I’ve seen from other videos.
I have a onkyo pre pro. Its internal test tones are played at reference level. The master volume does not allow to increase or decrease the test tone volume. So u need to reach the 75db mark by adjusting the trim level by measuring from ur seating.
Great video love your channel! My problem is I've used multiple hdmi cables From my 4090 to receiver and it won't connect. So I guess I'm stuck using RCA input. I think it's a Windows 11 thing.
Awesome Brad...Just 1 question. Should I turn off the reference in the audyssey eqxt32 Before doing level calibration or leave it on reference? . I just saw that you mentioned at minute 6:50 of this video that you had Audyssey enabled so I guess keep it eqxt32 on reference mode....Thanks again
Sorry for the delayed response. That's something I failed to mention here, and will actually posting a follow-up video soon that goes over things that I forgot to cover in this video.
Hi you do know why the ch 4 aka subwoofer channel is hot right ? This is because of the +10 db lfe boost that is meant to be ! So minus 30 equals 75 db on all speakers except sub - here you should have 85 db. The question in doing this how precise is the mic vs subwoofer tones - fluctuating up and down. In my mind you should never use internal tones since they are stripped from eq and does not give you correct read out. Use testtones from REW or dvd with test tones. Then you get tones after eq and is correct. Btw internal test tones reads 75 db on all - also sub since here they have removed the boost.
@@discostu668 that gives same ! You leave MV at 0.0 normal channels equals e.g 75 db and sub 85 db or you turn MV 10 db down for ch 4 only to get the 75 db. No matter how you turn this - lfe ch has been boosted 10 db and that is something invented long time ago. As I recall something with bandwith during recording Removed and then needs to be restored during playback. Sure you can google this and find reason behind this.
If I understand the video correctly, he is using REW's test tones, not the AVR ones. In Denon AVRs like he was using (I have a Denon, too), in order to see/adjust the individual speaker dB levels you have to listen to the AVR test tones. That's why he was going back and forth: hitting Play on REW's generator, observing the result on REW's SPL meter, hitting stop on REW's generator, going into the AVR's levels setting, adjusting the level, going back to REW, etc.
Thanks for great tips.. 😁 I must try your tip for sub level using front left channel.. 😁 What I did before this video, was. - measure each channel like you suggested.. BUT.. use full range pink tones option and unplug the subwoofer prior to tones... So bass is not steered to sub at same time. I set all levels to 75 like you suggested.. Now for sub, I use same full range pink noise and select lfe channel amd and set to 75db.. This method won't have the hot sub levels like you get if you used the sub pink noise option.. I then bump up subs like you said aprox +4db.. For atmos, your suggestion is great😁 And as an alternative, if you have the atmos demo disc, it has test tones on it.. Take a reading from left channel with its tones, (make sure to unplug sub again so no bass is steered to it). turn up master volume on stereo to get 75db as a reference.. Now goto test tones for atmos channels on disc, and make them also 75db.. Now turn back on sub and good to go. 😁
Hi, great set of videos. Thx! I was able to level match the speakers, but not sure how to generate tone for the Subs. I am using ASIO4All and High Definition Audio 1 w Sub Call pink noise. Should I be using High Definition Audio 4? Do i need todo any changes to the SPL setup?
Hi Brad thanks again for your hard work. I'm revisiting the video because i made some changes to my home theater system. I have two subs so when i level match them to 75db, do i turn one off and the other on and viceversa or do i leave them both on? Thanks in advance!
Hey Brad: In the video, you mention that the generator should be set to "Pink PN" (Pink Periodic Noise) in non-beta REW, yet it appears you're doing your measurements with "Pink Random", which equates to the "Pink Noise" setting in the non-beta REW generator. Which one should we be using when level matching?
Can you explain how you were able to adjust your subwoofer trim through your left channel speaker? When I tried that method in the video, the sub cal tone played through my left front speaker, not the sub, so there was no way to adjust the subwoofer trim this way for me. I had to drop the MV by 10dB (since the sub cal via the LFE channel in REW runs 10dB hotter), select the LFE channel, with the sub cal test tone, and adjust using that method.
I'm confused as hell with the switching between the internal AV test tone and the pink noise from REW. Why are you doing that and what is being adjust when switching berween the two tones? I just understood level matching is to have an SPL meter, run internal AV test tone for each speaker and increase individual speakers to achieve 75dB at zero master volume.
The reason for using the REW pink noise is because the internal test tones of your receiver bypass any room EQ (like Audyssey or Dirac), which basically makes level matching using the internal tones not too accurate if your already run room correction. However, for height channels there weren’t really any options at the time for level matching, so I suggested using the internal tones for the height channels ONLY. Things have changed a bit since then (this video was released in September of 2021 after all), so I’m planning on doing an updated guide going into 2025.
Thanks Brad... So any adjustments to the individual speakers is done whilst playing the pink noise from REW and ignore the results from the internal test tones if my system has had room correction applied? Cheers
Another great video! A few questions. Why is there a big difference in level between using this method or using Audyssey? Audyssey sets level almost to 0db maybe +.5 or +1 and with REW is +3 even +5. If you choose the REW level matching would that mean that the AVR amps will be working harder to produce those high dbs?
How is your denons setup menu opaquely overlaid ontop of your pc's on screen input? I have my PC fed to my denon s760h and when I hit setup on the denon remote it cuts my PC video input and switches to denons setup menu (I dont see both overlaid) Is this a setting I can make for this to happen or did you overlay the 2 video sources in editing of this video? Thanks
Awesome video Brad and thank you for the content! I'm a super slow learner and you've made it simple to implement. In terms of level matching for dual subs do i follow the same concept but adjust the sub levels for both subs? Or is it a different setting in REW?
Brad another great video! I do have an issue when it comes to the subwoofer. You mentioned to use High Definition Audio 1 and then pick Sub Cal. No matter what I do the sound continues to play out of my left main instead of the sub. Any suggestions?
I have a question about sub volume. I have an SVS pro sub that comes with an app where I can control the volume of the sub from my phone. Should the app level be set to a certain level when calibrating to the 75 DB? Should I set the app to 0 as well if this is my receiver reference volume?
Guys, need a help.. it may be a dumb question but want to get clarified. Should we set the distance of speakers first before we start the level matching? I set the cross over of all speakers to 80hz but have a question on the distance of speakers.
Maybe stupid question, but If you do adyssey etc room correction For My understanding that allready Do that speaker levels "adjustment". Or am i wrong? P.s. Thanks For awesome videos.
I have a 5.1 running through and older yamaha receiver that does not do individual test tones for each channel. It rotates through each channel every couple of seconds. If i level all of my channels to 75db through REW, do i need to double check the levels with the yamaha test tones and adjust again?
How do I know what reference level is for my Maestro X7 - when movies play Im usually listening at about 60 on the volume level which seems to go from 0-100. Not like your AVR which goes to 0....Thanks again for this super helpful REW vid!
Can I use YAPO instead of Mike. How to do it with YAPO connecting with laptop n HDMI with laptop to AVR HDMI. Pl suggest. I received YAPO so with the help of this I can set speakers level. Pl reply.
im confused. so i plug in the microphone into the computer, download the files and software. i click the "play" button in the REW software (once i select either sub or speaker) and then i play test tones through my speakers to find out 75db? is this right?
What’s the point of using the tone generator in REW, instead of simply using the tone output while using the receiver’s speaker setup menu (like what you did for the Atmos channels)? I went thru on my Onkyo to manually set speaker trim levels, using REW as an SPL meter, and it worked fine (I think!?). Also, I set everything to 65dB, because it was less annoying to my dog during the process. I figure as long as they all match, it shouldn’t matter. Am I correct?
Any room correction like Audyssey will be disabled while using the AVRs internal test tones. Notice when he set the Atmos channels he set them to what the FL was reading not to 75dB. I think it comes down to personal preference on what to set the speakers at. As all the speakers are playing at the same dB it should be fine. You just might have to turn up the volume a bit more than someone who calibrated at 75dB.
I can't get rew to play the lfe sound. It can play the other speakers just fine. I can get lfe sound with avr internal testtones and when running measurement sweeps in rew
You may be limited to just stereo if that is the case. You'd probably need a 3.5mm stereo-to-RCA cable to get sound into your receiver from your PC/laptop.
@@HomeTheaterGamer no sir iam having denon avr x1600h in that when you click movie mode button in remote control it doesn't shows multi channel in? Thats why iam asking whenever we level matching the speakers which mode is better
Sorry if this wasn’t clear in the video. The receivers built in tones disable Audyssey and EQ, so what you get could be an inaccurate reading on the SPL meter when using the internal test tones, causing you to possible set the speaker level too high or too low. Using REW’s tone generator ensures that Audyssey or EQ is applied, and we can make adjustments to the EQ’d speaker level.
@@HomeTheaterGamer interesting… I just assumed, on my Onkyo at least, that the speaker trim levels were set during the automated procedure (the distances and level adjustments are reflected in the menus as if I’d set them myself), and that I can change them as I wish afterward. So… you’re attempting to correct the levels that Audissey prescribed? Yeah, I’m confused :)
As an experiment, could you try ALSO taking SPL readings from the built-in test tone generator, and compare them with the readings you got with REW’s test tones? Maybe I’m the only one hung up on this, but a comparison would be a good basis for further explanation of the process you were describing in this video.
@@BeefyMon I've got a Denon X3700H, and I've always used the internal test tones to set volume levels. I use the REW SPL meter to set levels, and I own a UMIK-1. I gave Brad's method a shot, using MultiChannel In, with Audyssey, Movie Sound Mode enabled, and using REW's pink noise generator. I immediately noticed that the REW test tones were 2 dB higher across the board than the AVR internal test tones. So, it does appear that the sound modes + room correction do make a difference.
@@david_anonymous3885 I believe my Onkyo sends its test signals out unadulterated by its room correction EQ. Assuming that’s true, does it matter if they’re + or - a few dB, as long as it’s consistent across all speakers?
I can't for the life of me remember how to get the Denon receiver menu to overlay on the tv so you can see what you are doing on the pc while adjusting settings on the receiver. Is there a setting I'm missing?
If you can’t find it listed on the network sidebar on your PC (or if you are on MacOS), you can access it by typing in the IP address from your receiver into your web browser. Just go into the Denon’s settings under Network. I think it’s called “Network Information” or something along those lines.
Hi, so when I set my receiver at 0db and the tone generator in rew at -30.00, the SLP meter only reads 61db. And I don't think it's good to ad 10db to the speakers. So what could be the problem here and should I maybe aim for another ref level, because tbh, my ears can't even take 61 db.
I think he meant volume on REF Level of 0 meaning when the scale goes Positive and Negative numbers no 0-100 numbers. You need to change the settings in your AVR to have the volume displayed as either 0-100 scale or like he has here in POS/NEG numbers which is how you know 0 is reference (85 dB loud) like they use in the studios for mastering discs
Why would you not use L+R mode for sub level matching. Why would you just tune it with one? And for that matter all other speakers are tuned individually. Why not use L+R and unplug front speakers to only here the sub and bring it up to 75dB?
Good video however a lot has changed in last 3 years....software, umik1 ... This is a lot of info squeezed into 1 vid. Do u plan to make some new videos and break em down into chunks. Seems all the UA-cam videos are old. Im guessing these days most people AVR HDMI and usb mic
i've never really understood that why subs need to be at the same level with the other speakers...i have two 15" subs and if i put those subs to same level with all the other speakers, there will be WAY too much bass..especially if there is loud explosion or something like that in the movie...as funny (or wrong)as it seems, i've always set the bass like 20dB less than other speakers..and still there is so much bass that the couch is shaking...
That could be an option, in a 5.x.2 setup, but not 7.x.2 or higher. Someone suggested just to connect the Atmos speakers to the front left, one by one, adjust the level, then connect the Atmos speaker back to the right connection, and put in the value from the measurement.
Omg what are you talking about...what are you doing.. Why on earth are you using the test tones of the avr?? Sorry but you clearly have no idea what you doing! Work only with the tone generator and change db on AVR remote via option - channel level that's is for Marantz and Denon receivers. That way Audyssey in enabled! All avrs have such an option on remote!!
I’m familiar with the option menu. However, the issue with using the “Option” method is that it is NOT a global adjustment and only applies to the input you’re currently on. Also, I was not using the internal test tones to obtain the SPL reading for each speaker outside of the Atmos height speakers; I was making adjustments inside that menu to the individual trim levels, then backing out so the tones played through REW would come through while Audyssey’s EQ is engaged. Hence why I said it’s a “back and forth” doing it this way.
@@HomeTheaterGamer Use a demo disc from dts or dolby for atmos that has pink noise for every speaker. As far as the Option button goes: you can simply make the changes for every input after you find the desired db at the first one.
I mean you could, but why would you if you don’t need to? Put those numbers you got with the Option method into the internal trim levels, zero out the Option channels for that input and you’re done. Every input now has the same channel levels and gets you the exact same result, and you only had to do it once. For the record, I did explain that using the internal test tones disables EQ/room correction when I was going over setting the Atmos height channel levels and that it isn’t ideal (around 7:35 in the video). Once I find an affordable Atmos or DTS:X setup disc, I’ll buy it. They’re difficult to come by as I’m sure you know.
_Please note: volume levels have been lowered during the "test tone" sections, but return to normal outside of those specific instances._
Also, some receivers don't feature a "dB" or decibel volume mode and instead have a volume scale going from 0-99. Setup will still be relatively the same, you can just leave the front left channel's trim level at 0dB and adjust the volume until it reads 75dB on the SPL meter while using the tone generator in REW. Then you can adjust all the speaker trim levels to match the front left (along with the subwoofer as well).
If you'd like a video tutorial covering that type of speaker level matching, leave me a comment below and let me know.
Why is this video is different from your last video of level matching of REW? Is that because of new info? A little confused 😕
I actually haven’t covered level matching in REW, only when discussing subwoofers really. I also tried to explain the process more in depth and also why you may want to set the tone generator to -30dBFS.
@Home Theater Gamer , appreciate for more this video from the REW series.👌💪
Can you please clarify, when to set tone generator to - 12 or - 30dBFS?
I have watched this video several times over, and it still isn't making any sense how you are adjusting the sub trim level using the Front Left speaker output in REW. When I do that, it only outputs from the Front Left speaker. Nothing outputs from my subwoofer. Would you kindly elaborate and/or explain what you're doing in that step? Are you physically unplugging the Front Left speaker?
Yes i like n thanks for reply.
Great REW series. You can open the receiver’s management settings by entering the IP address in a browser on the computer, and change the level settings that way. It eliminates going back, and forth with REW and the receiver’s On Screen Settings.
Had no idea this was a thing!!! Thank you!! 🙌🏽
May not be "optimal", but for atmos speakers. you could plug them into say, the left front speaker, calibrate distance/crossover and such, then plug it back in to its normal output and set the calibrated numbers. Its something I've done and it worked out ok for me.
The problem is by doing that, you are using the left front speaker audyssey correction in your Atmos speakers, so you could end up with a much worse result than not doing a calibration at all.
Imaging you have in your front left speaker a huge dip at 200hz and a huge null at 300hz. Audyssey will try to correct that, and now imagine you have the opposite in your Atmos speakers. Leveling spekeras with your method will riun everything.
Approached level setting a bit different. I use REW to set the L to 75db and then use the Dolby 7.1.4 TrueHD-Atmos pink noise demo video you can find on most Dolby demo download sites to calibrate the rest of the speakers. It plays about 3db louder than REW on the calibrated L channel using my HTPC media player so I walk through each speaker on the demo and calibrate the other speakers to 78db which should put them all at REW's 75db including Atmos speakers. On a similar thought, I also leave Dynamic EQ on since I do use it. Two advantages are that levels are calibrated for Atmos and my HTPC which is my primary source for content with Atmos being my primary mode of listening to it.
Great idea. Thanks.
BTW, it doesn't matter if you leave dinamic EQ, becouse with dinamic EQ does, is to set subwoofer frecuencies rise to reference level when you play content Belpre reference levels, but when you do the calibration, you are doing calibration, your Avr is set to 0, wich is reference level, and at that level, dinamic EQ is not doing anything.
Brad, thank you!! I sure wish that AVRs would take in the REW setting directly. The internal factory room cal systems often do more harm than good.
The expensive AVRs do.
The sub level matching using the left speaker might not be accurate, especially if you don’t have a seamless crossover from the sub to your speaker.
I would actually suggest using the 4th output in REW. It’s the LFE channel and it is typically 10db hotter than other channels. So you could level it to 85db or lower the input volume from -30dbfs to -40dbfs and go for the 75db target.
Look forward to the new tutorial I was like a fish out of water watch the old one then my new Mini DSP 2x4 HD arrived this console popped up and to be real honest I was flummoxed . Old 76 yr old guy trying to set up my subs
This video is great. Few questions:
1. Can we match levels at a lower volume, like 65-70dB. Reason is I live in an apartment building and 75dB was quite loud.
2. If we run Audyssey post level setting, won't this change the levels that we set?
3. I could be doing something wrong, because to match my sub at 75dB, I had to set the receiver to +9dB and was quite high on the sub volume. This doesn't seem right. (My sub is connected via LFE)
Thanks!
Absolutely 💯 the best explanation yet!
I appreciate that!
Thanks for the tip. Best regards from Poland ;)
1) Since it's a Denon AVR, should we be boosting the gain on the subs/input to the miniDSP to get something that's more in the negatives? Like below -6 to ensure there's no clipping from the AVR?
2) Should we level match before deciding on the best crossover frequencies since if they're off a few dB from the AVR calibration, then there might not be as smooth of a response if we decided the crossovers first?
3) If we have the +10dB house curve from your previous videos, would setting the subwoofer to 75db technically make it not really go from 85-75dB? So maybe another reason to keep it a few dB higher?
Thanks for these instructions - I've ordered a UMIK-1 a couple of days ago, and these instructions will definitely be of use in the coming days/weeks/months. ;)
Hello and best regards from Austria 🇦🇹 (Europe). Thanks for your tips, very helpful! But there is no ASIO for MAC OS, what else can I use? Thanks very much,
Hi Dan, as far as I’m aware Mac OS already has multichannel output built in whereas windows doesn’t, hence the need for Asio. On Mac OS, just select what channel you want in REW, L C R SR etc. Just make sure your output is set to your AVR and connected via hdmi. I don’t own a Mac, it’s just what I’ve seen from other videos.
@@silverstone4435 Thanks for the info
I have a onkyo pre pro. Its internal test tones are played at reference level. The master volume does not allow to increase or decrease the test tone volume. So u need to reach the 75db mark by adjusting the trim level by measuring from ur seating.
Love your TShirt! Thanks for the video!
Now you can use external test tones with the new Spears and Munsil or the Spatial Audio Calibration Toolkit. I use SACT and it works fantastically.
Great video love your channel! My problem is I've used multiple hdmi cables From my 4090 to receiver and it won't connect.
So I guess I'm stuck using RCA input. I think it's a Windows 11 thing.
Doing this settings than Audessey after will stuff all your calibration? I always thought you do Audessey first than alter after?
When measuring , if I have high back recliner, should I recline so mic is not influenced by the back of chair at ear level?
Yes.
Awesome Brad...Just 1 question. Should I turn off the reference in the audyssey eqxt32 Before doing level calibration or leave it on reference? . I just saw that you mentioned at minute 6:50 of this video that you had Audyssey enabled so I guess keep it eqxt32 on reference mode....Thanks again
Sorry for the delayed response. That's something I failed to mention here, and will actually posting a follow-up video soon that goes over things that I forgot to cover in this video.
@@clone1008 here you go: ua-cam.com/video/Lv3PsNK0z-A/v-deo.html
Hi you do know why the ch 4 aka subwoofer channel is hot right ? This is because of the +10 db lfe boost that is meant to be ! So minus 30 equals 75 db on all speakers except sub - here you should have 85 db. The question in doing this how precise is the mic vs subwoofer tones - fluctuating up and down. In my mind you should never use internal tones since they are stripped from eq and does not give you correct read out. Use testtones from REW or dvd with test tones. Then you get tones after eq and is correct. Btw internal test tones reads 75 db on all - also sub since here they have removed the boost.
U are right!
This was mentioned to me a while ago - that you just drop the MV volume by 10dB when level matching your sub trim via REW.
@@discostu668 that gives same ! You leave MV at 0.0 normal channels equals e.g 75 db and sub 85 db or you turn MV 10 db down for ch 4 only to get the 75 db. No matter how you turn this - lfe ch has been boosted 10 db and that is something invented long time ago. As I recall something with bandwith during recording Removed and then needs to be restored during playback. Sure you can google this and find reason behind this.
If I understand the video correctly, he is using REW's test tones, not the AVR ones. In Denon AVRs like he was using (I have a Denon, too), in order to see/adjust the individual speaker dB levels you have to listen to the AVR test tones. That's why he was going back and forth: hitting Play on REW's generator, observing the result on REW's SPL meter, hitting stop on REW's generator, going into the AVR's levels setting, adjusting the level, going back to REW, etc.
Thanks for great tips.. 😁
I must try your tip for sub level using front left channel.. 😁
What I did before this video, was.
- measure each channel like you suggested.. BUT.. use full range pink tones option and unplug the subwoofer prior to tones... So bass is not steered to sub at same time.
I set all levels to 75 like you suggested..
Now for sub, I use same full range pink noise and select lfe channel amd and set to 75db..
This method won't have the hot sub levels like you get if you used the sub pink noise option..
I then bump up subs like you said aprox +4db..
For atmos, your suggestion is great😁
And as an alternative, if you have the atmos demo disc, it has test tones on it..
Take a reading from left channel with its tones, (make sure to unplug sub again so no bass is steered to it).
turn up master volume on stereo to get 75db as a reference..
Now goto test tones for atmos channels on disc, and make them also 75db..
Now turn back on sub and good to go. 😁
Is it true you don’t need asioforall anymore for all channels ?
Hi, great set of videos. Thx! I was able to level match the speakers, but not sure how to generate tone for the Subs. I am using ASIO4All and High Definition Audio 1 w Sub Call pink noise. Should I be using High Definition Audio 4? Do i need todo any changes to the SPL setup?
Hopefully I'll get a chance to work with this and dirac live more tonight. So far, I'm lost.
Hi Brad thanks again for your hard work. I'm revisiting the video because i made some changes to my home theater system.
I have two subs so when i level match them to 75db, do i turn one off and the other on and viceversa or do i leave them both on?
Thanks in advance!
Is it good to have all the speakers in postive values? I've hear that doing that you are introducing unwanted noise into the signal.
When matching the speaker levels whats about audyssey status? is it turned on or off?
On.
Hey Brad: In the video, you mention that the generator should be set to "Pink PN" (Pink Periodic Noise) in non-beta REW, yet it appears you're doing your measurements with "Pink Random", which equates to the "Pink Noise" setting in the non-beta REW generator. Which one should we be using when level matching?
Good catch
So is it pink periodic or pink random?
@@elongatuspiranha It's Pink Random.
why you dont select the multicannel output via Windows so you can select directly in REW every speaker cannel ?
Can you explain how you were able to adjust your subwoofer trim through your left channel speaker? When I tried that method in the video, the sub cal tone played through my left front speaker, not the sub, so there was no way to adjust the subwoofer trim this way for me. I had to drop the MV by 10dB (since the sub cal via the LFE channel in REW runs 10dB hotter), select the LFE channel, with the sub cal test tone, and adjust using that method.
Sub Cal plays 30 to 80Hz. If you are getting tone out of your main it would be playing below 80Hz.
@@split0909 Except it was only coming out of my mains, nothing was emanating from the subwoofer.
@@discostu668 what is the crossover setting in your AVR?
@@split0909 This was a year ago, and a different system than what I have now, but it was probably 90 or 100Hz.
I'm confused as hell with the switching between the internal AV test tone and the pink noise from REW. Why are you doing that and what is being adjust when switching berween the two tones? I just understood level matching is to have an SPL meter, run internal AV test tone for each speaker and increase individual speakers to achieve 75dB at zero master volume.
The reason for using the REW pink noise is because the internal test tones of your receiver bypass any room EQ (like Audyssey or Dirac), which basically makes level matching using the internal tones not too accurate if your already run room correction. However, for height channels there weren’t really any options at the time for level matching, so I suggested using the internal tones for the height channels ONLY. Things have changed a bit since then (this video was released in September of 2021 after all), so I’m planning on doing an updated guide going into 2025.
Thanks Brad... So any adjustments to the individual speakers is done whilst playing the pink noise from REW and ignore the results from the internal test tones if my system has had room correction applied? Cheers
Another great video! A few questions.
Why is there a big difference in level between using this method or using Audyssey? Audyssey sets level almost to 0db maybe +.5 or +1 and with REW is +3 even +5.
If you choose the REW level matching would that mean that the AVR amps will be working harder to produce those high dbs?
FWIW my AVR with Audyssey set all 11 of my speakers to -dB's.
@@split0909 it depends of the speaker sensitivity.
How is your denons setup menu opaquely overlaid ontop of your pc's on screen input?
I have my PC fed to my denon s760h and when I hit setup on the denon remote it cuts my PC video input and switches to denons setup menu (I dont see both overlaid)
Is this a setting I can make for this to happen or did you overlay the 2 video sources in editing of this video? Thanks
Try setting your PCs video output to either 4K 60Hz or 1080p 60Hz just while calibrating and see if it pops up as an overlay. That’s why I do.
Awesome video Brad and thank you for the content! I'm a super slow learner and you've made it simple to implement. In terms of level matching for dual subs do i follow the same concept but adjust the sub levels for both subs? Or is it a different setting in REW?
Brad another great video! I do have an issue when it comes to the subwoofer. You mentioned to use High Definition Audio 1 and then pick Sub Cal. No matter what I do the sound continues to play out of my left main instead of the sub. Any suggestions?
Set a high croosover in your front speaker before playing that test tone.
The sound should go to your subwoofer.
Do we do this before or after Audessey through MulEQ?
Audessey is it's own EQ. Save Audessey on preset 1 and your own REW on preset 2.
I have a question about sub volume. I have an SVS pro sub that comes with an app where I can control the volume of the sub from my phone. Should the app level be set to a certain level when calibrating to the 75 DB? Should I set the app to 0 as well if this is my receiver reference volume?
Guys, need a help.. it may be a dumb question but want to get clarified. Should we set the distance of speakers first before we start the level matching? I set the cross over of all speakers to 80hz but have a question on the distance of speakers.
Yes the distance should be set first before level matching the volume
When doing this should audyssey be turn off?
I had that question and view the video 3 times and at 6:50 minutes of video Brad mentioned he had Audyssey reference mode on the receiver
Maybe stupid question, but If you do adyssey etc room correction For My understanding that allready Do that speaker levels "adjustment". Or am i wrong? P.s. Thanks For awesome videos.
I have a 5.1 running through and older yamaha receiver that does not do individual test tones for each channel. It rotates through each channel every couple of seconds. If i level all of my channels to 75db through REW, do i need to double check the levels with the yamaha test tones and adjust again?
I get sound in my left channel also when trying to run Sub Cal on L. Is this correct? AVR set to Multi channel in and Crossover is at 80hz.
How do I know what reference level is for my Maestro X7 - when movies play Im usually listening at about 60 on the volume level which seems to go from 0-100. Not like your AVR which goes to 0....Thanks again for this super helpful REW vid!
Look into the settings on your AVR. There should be another choice for volume called Relative Scale.
Hi gamer, thanks for your explanations. you made it simple for a diy. Please, I will like to know, can REW be used in a live sound set up?
Thanks! And I've never tried to use REW in a live sound setup, but I don't see what it couldn't be!
Can I use YAPO instead of Mike. How to do it with YAPO connecting with laptop n HDMI with laptop to AVR HDMI. Pl suggest. I received YAPO so with the help of this I can set speakers level. Pl reply.
im confused.
so i plug in the microphone into the computer, download the files and software.
i click the "play" button in the REW software (once i select either sub or speaker) and then i play test tones through my speakers to find out 75db? is this right?
What’s the point of using the tone generator in REW, instead of simply using the tone output while using the receiver’s speaker setup menu (like what you did for the Atmos channels)? I went thru on my Onkyo to manually set speaker trim levels, using REW as an SPL meter, and it worked fine (I think!?). Also, I set everything to 65dB, because it was less annoying to my dog during the process. I figure as long as they all match, it shouldn’t matter. Am I correct?
Any room correction like Audyssey will be disabled while using the AVRs internal test tones. Notice when he set the Atmos channels he set them to what the FL was reading not to 75dB. I think it comes down to personal preference on what to set the speakers at. As all the speakers are playing at the same dB it should be fine. You just might have to turn up the volume a bit more than someone who calibrated at 75dB.
I can't get rew to play the lfe sound. It can play the other speakers just fine. I can get lfe sound with avr internal testtones and when running measurement sweeps in rew
Probably your crossover setting. It needs to be maxed out when you play the tones or else it won't crossover to the subwoofer.
@@Mudcat3434 thanks but it was an adapter issue. I’m on Mac and use a usb c to hdmi adapter and Iit worked with a new model
If some av receivers doesn't have multi channel in then whats the solution for that?
You may be limited to just stereo if that is the case. You'd probably need a 3.5mm stereo-to-RCA cable to get sound into your receiver from your PC/laptop.
@@HomeTheaterGamer no sir iam having denon avr x1600h in that when you click movie mode button in remote control it doesn't shows multi channel in? Thats why iam asking whenever we level matching the speakers which mode is better
Genuinely curious why you opt for the REW tone generator instead of the one built in to your receiver.
Sorry if this wasn’t clear in the video. The receivers built in tones disable Audyssey and EQ, so what you get could be an inaccurate reading on the SPL meter when using the internal test tones, causing you to possible set the speaker level too high or too low.
Using REW’s tone generator ensures that Audyssey or EQ is applied, and we can make adjustments to the EQ’d speaker level.
@@HomeTheaterGamer interesting… I just assumed, on my Onkyo at least, that the speaker trim levels were set during the automated procedure (the distances and level adjustments are reflected in the menus as if I’d set them myself), and that I can change them as I wish afterward.
So… you’re attempting to correct the levels that Audissey prescribed?
Yeah, I’m confused :)
As an experiment, could you try ALSO taking SPL readings from the built-in test tone generator, and compare them with the readings you got with REW’s test tones? Maybe I’m the only one hung up on this, but a comparison would be a good basis for further explanation of the process you were describing in this video.
@@BeefyMon I've got a Denon X3700H, and I've always used the internal test tones to set volume levels. I use the REW SPL meter to set levels, and I own a UMIK-1. I gave Brad's method a shot, using MultiChannel In, with Audyssey, Movie Sound Mode enabled, and using REW's pink noise generator. I immediately noticed that the REW test tones were 2 dB higher across the board than the AVR internal test tones. So, it does appear that the sound modes + room correction do make a difference.
@@david_anonymous3885 I believe my Onkyo sends its test signals out unadulterated by its room correction EQ. Assuming that’s true, does it matter if they’re + or - a few dB, as long as it’s consistent across all speakers?
I can't for the life of me remember how to get the Denon receiver menu to overlay on the tv so you can see what you are doing on the pc while adjusting settings on the receiver. Is there a setting I'm missing?
If you can’t find it listed on the network sidebar on your PC (or if you are on MacOS), you can access it by typing in the IP address from your receiver into your web browser. Just go into the Denon’s settings under Network. I think it’s called “Network Information” or something along those lines.
At what volume should i set my PC volume? Should it set it to 100?
That’s what I always do (set volume to 100 on my PC).
should i switch off audyssey first? thank you
I would recommend leaving Audyssey on as EQ can impact level adjustments.
Tried this, why is my speaker trim so high? Eg +10db, +9db. Is this normal?
Hi, so when I set my receiver at 0db and the tone generator in rew at -30.00, the SLP meter only reads 61db. And I don't think it's good to ad 10db to the speakers. So what could be the problem here and should I maybe aim for another ref level, because tbh, my ears can't even take 61 db.
Same. Doing this I'm in the high + with my speaker trims.. eg +10db. That can't be good. But I see he doesn't really reply. :(.
A possibility that may work, calibrate to 70db then add 5db from the options button on your remote?
Clear as mud.
Master volume 0 on AVR no sound effect. So what to do. What Master volume?
I think he meant volume on REF Level of 0 meaning when the scale goes Positive and Negative numbers no 0-100 numbers. You need to change the settings in your AVR to have the volume displayed as either 0-100 scale or like he has here in POS/NEG numbers which is how you know 0 is reference (85 dB loud) like they use in the studios for mastering discs
Why would you not use L+R mode for sub level matching. Why would you just tune it with one? And for that matter all other speakers are tuned individually. Why not use L+R and unplug front speakers to only here the sub and bring it up to 75dB?
LR would be stereo. Bass should be mono. Use RMS meter in master. VU in tracks.
are u owner of minidsp?
Good video however a lot has changed in last 3 years....software, umik1 ... This is a lot of info squeezed into 1 vid. Do u plan to make some new videos and break em down into chunks. Seems all the UA-cam videos are old. Im guessing these days most people AVR HDMI and usb mic
i've never really understood that why subs need to be at the same level with the other speakers...i have two 15" subs and if i put those subs to same level with all the other speakers, there will be WAY too much bass..especially if there is loud explosion or something like that in the movie...as funny (or wrong)as it seems, i've always set the bass like 20dB less than other speakers..and still there is so much bass that the couch is shaking...
Why not just tell your AVR your atmos speakers are surround speakers and level match them that way then flip it back when you're done?
That could be an option, in a 5.x.2 setup, but not 7.x.2 or higher.
Someone suggested just to connect the Atmos speakers to the front left, one by one, adjust the level, then connect the Atmos speaker back to the right connection, and put in the value from the measurement.
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Omg what are you talking about...what are you doing..
Why on earth are you using the test tones of the avr??
Sorry but you clearly have no idea what you doing!
Work only with the tone generator and change db on AVR remote via option - channel level that's is for Marantz and Denon receivers.
That way Audyssey in enabled!
All avrs have such an option on remote!!
I’m familiar with the option menu. However, the issue with using the “Option” method is that it is NOT a global adjustment and only applies to the input you’re currently on.
Also, I was not using the internal test tones to obtain the SPL reading for each speaker outside of the Atmos height speakers; I was making adjustments inside that menu to the individual trim levels, then backing out so the tones played through REW would come through while Audyssey’s EQ is engaged. Hence why I said it’s a “back and forth” doing it this way.
@@HomeTheaterGamer Use a demo disc from dts or dolby for atmos that has pink noise for every speaker.
As far as the Option button goes: you can simply make the changes for every input after you find the desired db at the first one.
I mean you could, but why would you if you don’t need to? Put those numbers you got with the Option method into the internal trim levels, zero out the Option channels for that input and you’re done. Every input now has the same channel levels and gets you the exact same result, and you only had to do it once. For the record, I did explain that using the internal test tones disables EQ/room correction when I was going over setting the Atmos height channel levels and that it isn’t ideal (around 7:35 in the video).
Once I find an affordable Atmos or DTS:X setup disc, I’ll buy it. They’re difficult to come by as I’m sure you know.
Did you even watch his video? Obviously not.