Maximus plan was to give Lucy a headstart and then send the Brotherhood to attack Moldaver, they thought she was the bad guy. The plan worked. And the thing about ghouls... there is not one theory of how it works. Just in Fallout 4 you have Ghouls that age and go feral, Ghouls that have to eat and others a hundred years old that never have a bite (kid in the fridge). Ghouls that get randomly created (Hancock) and manufactured Ghouls (Eddie Winter). Every explanation the show could give is both true and false 🤷🏻♂️ PS: Lucy's mother didn't die in a famine, that's the story his father used to cover her leaving
A lot of people get the time line wrong; Todd had to go out on social media and say outright that the bomb did NOT fall in 2277 but a few months after the end of Fallout NV. (Edit: and yes I immediately recognized the city but only because I have played NV like 8 times despite it not being my favorite Fallout. Otherwise you get the hints if you pay close attention at the end credits, it rolls past a few signs saying "New Vegas", but they could have made it more obvious).
I know, I saw. I feel like a conspiracy theorist thinking they’re just trying to cover up a mistake 😂 I think if that was true the chalkboard would say the fall of Shady Sands was 2281, and Lucy wouldn’t say her mom died in ‘77
@@IfThenCreateLucy is an unreliable narrator as she doesn't have clear memories of being outside the vault as she was a young child at the time she doesn't even realise her memories of being in a field are outside the Vault until the final episode. Which means that Lucy and Norm were taken out of the vault by their mother in 2277 after discovering the vault's water being syphoned, her father invented the famine to put the vault dwellers in isolation to lockdown the vault so he could go after them, he was obviously able to retrieve the kids in 2277 but not their mother who presumably refused to return and remained with Moldaver. Then Henry fed his kids the lie that she died in the famine of 77 to explain why she wasn't in the vault with them. This would leave the destruction of Shady Sands event to happen after the fall of Shady Sands explaining the -> on the chalkboard, maybe after he had acquired the resources to destroy it. Also the fall of something does not mean the instant and complete collapse for example Rome's fall took 300 years.
@@thomaswedge42 I just don’t think it makes sense that we have all that info and references to 2277, and then for some reason Hank left the vault again four years later to bomb Shady Sands. There’s no evidence supporting that in the show.
Adding to the whole “Vault-Tec has bombs” plot. A massive part of the story in Fallout 76 is Vault Tec gave the overseer a mission once Vault 76s reclamation day came. She was to secure all the nuclear bombs left in Appalachia, with the strict orders that no matter who was still there, even if it was the goverment, those bombs now belonged to Vault Tec
I think that the drug that Coop uses regularly and that healed Thaddeus's foot is the source of the super healing. I don't think the super healing is inherent to being a ghoul. Lucy's mom was so very decayed because for whatever reason she didn't get access to the drug. In Fallout 4 we see some ghouls who degenerate and some that don't. I am not aware of an in-game reason that talks about why some do and some don't, but the drug seems like a fun way to introduce that and to give Coop some abilities to have over the top fun violence but also have a weakness that he'll have to manage. I like it as a narrative device and I do think it isn't 100% faithful to the games, but I will forgive that as a necessary part of adapting to a different medium.
In the Nuka World DLC, there is a ghoul (Oswald the Outrageous) that releases radiation and heals other ghouls. Also, he has set up the Kiddie Kingdom sprayers to spray irradiated water, which heals ghouls and damages humans.
I mentioned this previously, too. I get it, but it's still not Thad-style regeneration. I think that's the pain point. Notably, Oswald's regeneration powers don't seem to work on dismembered ghouls, either. There's a point of new return.
@shockmethodx He (Oswald) brought them back from seemingly dead in his journal entries, but I don't think it would regrow a limb. So, I am not so much disagreeing, but rather pointing out where they used the ghoul healing in the game and what the limits seemed to be.
Radiation does heal them in my game of fallout 4. The base damage still damages ghouls. Your gamma gun have a base damage too. Look closely at your weapon damage. You will have more than one total for damage. I use a mod feral nights for testing it spawns a ton of ghouls at night and all of them healed with with any type of radiation damage. The guns base damage is what gets them in the end.
Yeah in terms of what Lucy 'knows' about her mom and the plague of 77, we have to take everything Lucy 'knows' with a pinch of salt. She's been lied to her whole life. The ghoul healing is an interesting one because, while General Zao may not have healed from the Gamma Gun, Feral Ghouls do seem to get healed from the rad bursts that a Glowing One makes, and Zao can be healed by a Stimpak. We know stimpaks can heal broken limbs and headwounds etc. because this happens with our protagonist. It's possible that those vial things are some kind of rad-stimpak, that just so happens to turn non-ghouls into ghouls sometimes (If that's even what the 'doctor' gave to thaddeus). I don't think they stop a ghoul from going feral though as the guy Coop and Lucy found that was reminding himself of his own name had some recently and was still going feral. I reckon Coop is just addicted to them the way some people get addicted to medication. Though I like the idea of a Fallout game where you get to play as a ghoul that needs to keep taking some kind of serum to stay alive.
The fall of Shady Sands is not the bombing, that has been confirmed. The chalkboard is a timeline: event, arrow (proceed to next), event, arrow, event - the production team have confirmed that the events of Fallout New Vegas happen, which is set post 2277, so the bombing has to happen after that and they have stated such. Hopefully they will add more clarity in the coming season as it's caused a lot of confusion. I think they left a date out to leave themselves room for future lore additions, but they need to lock it down. With ghouls they seem to be treating most named ghouls as equivalent to legendary creatures - including ghouls - in F4, which do have a healing factor, even healing crippled limbs. Yes, it's one time each in the game but that's a thing. There are also mutation syrums in the Fallout universe, there's lots of options - Thaddeus seems to be setting up a hook for next season more than anything else.
I felt like them automatically trusting Maximus enough to “form a new brotherhood” felt very akin to the decision making in other fallout games (especially the bethesda ones). It’s the leader of the group somehow automatically trusting the main character enough to put them in charge of everything. it’s a meme about skyrim how you become leader of everything with zero qualifications. it’s kinda the same for fallout! i thought it was a nod at that kind of narrative in the games!
My two favorite quotes: "To have the ultimate enemy at the end of the day just be peppy co-workers was depressing!" "When I play Fallout, it is to dance on the graves of the capitalists of Vault Tec." Absolutely amazing. Oh, and I loved your somewhat giddy reaction to that one (admittedly hot) Brotherhood member coming back. Some thoughts that aren't really in order: 1. Ghoul lore has changed from game to game and I'm not sure there's anything solid or stable. Also, gameplay doesn't always reflect lore. For example, your Gamma Gun didn't heal the one guy, but I know that glowing ones do heal ghouls around them in-game. HOWEVER, I have got to think that there's something different going on with the Brotherhood squire who became a ghoul and The Ghoul himself. 2. I'm not thinking of Vault Tec as having survived, just this one experiment because it was specifically designed to have management preserved over the centuries. It is disturbing to know they still have access to nuclear ordinance and can wipe out the center of the largest, post-war society in existence. 3. I have heard Todd Howard say that the timeline for the destruction of Shady Sands will not conflict with any previously established lore. Just barely, but there you go. 4. There are often remnants of pre-war things and people which rise up to haunt the post-apocalypse. The only other Fallout game I've played through completion (New Vegas) has this as a theme multiple times. One of the DLCs, generally considered the best one, is called "Old World Blues." You COULD think of the Institute as the same type of thing, although there is no pre-war person living there (except for Father, who doesn't really count). 5. Regarding the Brotherhood, another theme in at least one game (Fallout 3) is an offshoot/"heretic" branch that breaks off from the main mission of the Brotherhood. Actually, now that I'm thinking about it, that's another theme in Fallout: New Vegas which drives another one of the DLCs. So, if this Brotherhood Elder genuinely believed that the driving ideal of the Brotherhood should be power and the seizing of power by power, then Maximus, trustworthy or not, would seem to be evidence of that ideal. (Not really because Maximus actually is driven by other desires, including safety and wanting to protect Lucy, but still.) 6. I like that Lucy didn't say anything when confronted by her father. What was there to say? She'd had all of her deep-seated beliefs questioned or crushed. She discovered what Vault Tec was at Vault 4. She'd already been changed by the wasteland somewhat to become tougher, less trusting, more wary. And then to realize that her father was an absolute monster, the one who murdered her own mother and the destroyer of Shady Sands ... I think she'd have to feel absolute defeat at that moment. I, at least, wouldn't know what to say. I hope you continue to watch the new Fallout episodes whenever they come out because I genuinely enjoy your commentary/reactions.
🔵 Point #6 was perfectly stated. Lucy was in shock over betrayal-reveal compounded by betrayal-reveal. The entire foundation of her upbringing had been turned to quicksand and she was paralyzed by the initial hints of the implications. She couldn't even react when dear old dad said, "Can you get us out of here?", to stop Max from blowing the lock. 🔵 I also agree w/ #2. I think season two will reveal more about how much of Vault-Tec's Kⱥpitolisst wet dream survived to this point. The Ghoul is taking Lucy to "meet her makers", so he can "talk to" whoever is "behind the wheel", and find his f'n family. We can expect that story to be laid out as neat and tidily as this season; like straightening out a bag of yarn invaded by three kittens. [I'm trying to win the award for most metaphors mixed in one YooToob comment...]
I don't believe that vault tec dropped the bombs, especially because it was when Cooper and their daughter were out. I don't think her mother would have intentionally put her into danger like you said. And if she is high enough in vault tec to make the suggestion, why wouldn't she be involved in when they would be dropped? I want to know what happened right after Cooper and his daughter left on the horse because we don't see what happens to them. In New Vegas, the DLC, Lonesome Road is about that there still are live nukes that can target and be fired. So it may not necessarily be vault tec that is still in control of every nuke. I didn't get the sense that they fared better than anyone else from the show.
12:03 "Why in the world would he trust Maximus" I would say that the Elder of course does not trust Maximus, but it doesn't matter because Maximus would be their only lead at all. "This must be a trap, a stupid one" would also funny enough be what I think is what the Elder is thinking and they would be able to steamroll whatever would be there anyway.
According to the actual showrunners, Shady Sands was not destroyed in 2277, but several years after that (not long after the end of Fallout New Vegas in 2281). You also have to consider unreliable narrators like Lucy. She may THINK her mom passed away in 2277 - but she was a small child then. Maybe that's when her mom left the vault to go live in Shady Sands and daddy(?) blew the place up later? Not sure where you are getting that all ghouls have super regeneration - I don't remember seeing that (but maybe I missed something). I just assumed Coop had "Player character toughness/plot armor." Plus ghouls CAN take damage that would kill a normal human - even if you remove a limb or two they can still come at you. There was even a ghoul in Fallout 3 that complained he's always losing parts of himself. Re: Maximus saying Thaddeus is a ghoul - I mean the guy doesn't know basic stuff like how sex works - what the hell does he know? The brotherhood's education seems to be pretty poor, aside from "kill nonhumans on sight" or "that's a toaster". Thaddius is probably some kind of mutant now - maybe not of the "Super" variety, but he wouldn't be the first mutated human in the Fallout Universe. Barb Cooper saying that VT will drop the bomb themselves. Did she mean literally? Then why is her daughter caught outside of the vault when they actually dropped? And in the games - why are other vault unfinished or were caught with their pants down? Again - unreliable narrator. Just because someone says something in the show - that's just what they think. It's not necessarily the truth.
Ghouls are people, people are biologically complicated. For instance, when it comes to treating infections, some people can use penicillin while others can't. My theory is that the ghoulification process varies based off of Health, genetics, type of radiation, and possibly the elements used in the bomb. This is how different areas of the Commonwealth could have ghouls that have different features, needs, and even healing abilities.
Follow-up comment: I had no thought that Barb was low-level. I thought she had leveraged Coop's fame and her own smarts to propel herself (and family) as far forward into the Vault-Tec family as soon as it could, so that they were put into a 'good vault'. She dragged him into being Vault-Boy. He was a very successful actor beforehand, and wanted to retire. Barb was petrified, and her world was small -it was her, her daughter, and (possibly) Coop, even if they were separated. I like small stories, so I hope it gets picked up in future seasons.
Did you see that season 2 is in the works already? They want to put it out as soon as humanly possible!! So hopefully they can answer some of the questions they left!
The Ghoul is maxed out on Charisma. He literally talked his way through the ordeal with The Governmint. He was tied up with no trigger finger. He convinced them to cut the ropes, let him sew on his trigger finger, and he convinced the President to disarm the guy who was about to shoot him in the head. He also has the bloody mess perk, night vision, and maxed out luck. Maximus put all his intelligence points into perception and endurance. We saw Bobbleheads... do we REALLY want them to give buffs to intelligence and medical skills? I think we're better off leaving them as decorations.
I did recognize new vegas immediately. The walls around freeside and the big tower is the lucky 38 casino where Robert House is. Now the question is what happened to new vegas after the game. Because it looks really rough and the credits showed destroyed virtibirds, House securitrons and deathclaw skeletons. There's a lot of different endings and this show takes place years later. Is Hank going there to meet Mrs House? Is House even alive in the canon of the show? Or is Hank going there for something else? We don't know.
So my thought about Vault 31 is that they’re all clones of the original ones, coming from the stem cells or whatever tissue (I’m no scientist lol) is remaining. But who tf knows! I kind of cracked up at your reaction 😂 at least you saw the car!!!
My read is that the fall of shady sands was when brahmin barons took power in the NCR. I mostly think that because of in game details about the NCR between 2 and new Vegas. What happened between 'the fall' and blowing up is fertile narrative soil for season 2 flashbacks I don't agree that starved mea s died. Primarily because Hank also starved and survived. I inferred that vaults 32 and 33 came up with a scheme to trap and eat surface dwellers without telling Bud. I'm not sure how well that tracks tho If Thadius didn't become a ghoul, then I don't know of any other examples of ghouls healing any better than anyone else. Coop took out the town because he's the fastest gun in the west. Coop did not regenerate a finger. Also there maybe was a super mutant in episode two. When ziggy is taking puppy dogmeat thru a checkpoint, he had to wait as a huge corpse with a muscular, green hand sticking out from under the sheet passed by Titus was killed by a Yao guai The brotherhood elder is a cultist who ferishizes power and hates weakness. I expect him to have as much rationality of an MRA Podcaster and his actions meet my expectations of him That mini car is so delightful. I bet it had floor drains for when the rain got in Barb would not be in the position she is in at the world's largest company if she wasn't willing to take risks and ignore reality. I think vault tec makes more sense in the context of US history. JD Rockefeller was way happier using an old and train monopoly to bully the entire economy than he was when he made more money as a shareholder in many smaller oil and train companies. The capitalists don't want to always have more than they had before, they want to always have more than you. They will lock themselves in golden cages if it means everyone else has nothing If vault 32 was regular in the last trienial trade, then it could not have fallen more then three years ago. In my read they tried the cannibalism plan again, maybe they needed to or maybe they just liked it. Either way it didn't work. No one told bud becuase every defrosted person from 31 was a junior executive with no real experience who's never getting gout of the vault. They freaked out and hid everything from their idiot boss who's still making choices based off of two hundred year old slogans. Who cleaned up vault 32? Robots probably. I know that's weak, but it's what I got. The language may not change as much as you think. They have holotapes preserving pronunciation, and if there's a disagreement, then you ask someone who went to the better school in vault 31 I ultimately agree that I like it better when vault tec are victims of their own hubris and America killed everyone for the chance at a spaceship My take on the brotherhood includes the idea that their constant attempts to preserve their traditions leads them to constantly, drastically change as time passes, like in "A Canticle For Liebowitz" ❤
Before the show, I never questioned "who dropped the bombs?" because it's a pointless question that doesn't require an answer! The reveal that Vault-Tec not only destroyed Shady Sands, but started the Great War in the first place, definitely stinks of "tv writers felt the need to have One True Big Bad Who Does All The Bad Things because it's easier than nuance". I find it all rather hacky, to be honest. EDIT: I also just wanted to add that I discovered your build videos about a week ago and they've been very nice!
IMO it’s still ambiguous- Vault-Tec was prepared to drop the bomb themselves, but the timing of when it happened makes me think they ultimately didn’t. Why would Barb be OK with her daughter being at a birthday party with Coop when the bombs were gonna drop? She seemed pretty high up at vault tec given how much secret knowledge she seemed privy to, so I’m sure she’d know when it would happen ALSO ok so when they’re in that secret evil meeting, at one point she looks at her pip boy then up toward the ceiling. She KNOWS her pip boy is broadcasting, but not to where. I don’t think she realized her husband was spying on her, I think she thought it was maybe someone higher up at VT, that she was being appraised and that she needed to prove herself or something. Cause I believe she loves Janey and Coop, and is prepared to back VT in whatever they do if it means keeping them safe. So I’m even a lil suspicious that it was entirely a performance, that “by dropping the bomb ourselves” is fully a lie to reassure those other companies that vault tec is in control
I think there's a version of events where Lucy understood the nature of her mother's demise accurately. Her mother could have died from a plague in '77 that coincides with the fall of Shady Sands. The NCR is in a bad way. You really get a sense of the scope and scale of their desperation throughout New Vegas. Bases not getting supplies, a thriving black market, pressure from raider gangs, the lack of training. I think Lucy's mom dying of a plague could be the thing that prompts her father to nuke. The conspiracy theorist in me thinks that the Legion getting the dam is the canonical ending, hence the fall. Bethesda/Todd can only say "the bombs didn't drop in '77" without giving too much away if that's the case. I do think the show is establishing fiduciary responsibility as an antagonistic force to give our heroes something to overcome down the line (so it's ironic that this show is on Amazon then. But capitalism's greatest trick is to subsume its criticisms and sell the Good Fight to us). Oh, and there is somewhat of an Enclave presence in New Vegas. Could be interesting to see how it plays out. The most disappointing thing in the show for me was seeing cold fusion. It's the most boring of sci-fi MacGuffins. It could've been launch codes or payload locations. Something more relevant. Moldaver sacrificed literally everything from her morals to her life to empower the Brotherhood? Seems silly. And you turned me around on the ghouls. I quite liked the lore drift and I felt like it tied a lot of the different depictions of ghouls together. Moira and Hancock being a big example, but, yeah, you're right. We do see regeneration as a game mechanic, but ghouls aren't re-growing limbs. An arrow to the neck ought to mean what an arrow to the neck usually means.
While the show does deviate from game lore on ghouls, I really want to point out that every ghoul we see in the show is using that drug-like liquid that also isn't present in the game. I don't quite agree that ghouls are dead (real life living human beings can have necrotic tissue and still be alive, and this is more believable given the planet is irradiated and the ghouls' cells feed on it, and also if stimpaks can heal entire limbs then why not? And also, maybe feral ghouls are dead - braindead - but 'human' ghouls are not? I HAVE THOUGHTS.) but I think the fact that when we meet Coop, he's buried and being drip-fed that liquid is noteworthy. It's not FEV but I wouldn't be surprised if someone's figured out how to *make* a ghoul, and if that also brings the bonus of addiction-or-feral then it's a good (if extremely unethical) business model for the wasteland. Thaddeus takes the liquid from the snake oil salesman. Why not just a stimpak to heal his foot? I feel like so much of the show has been so loyal to the games, so accurate to the games, that an inaccuracy this big might be a clue in itself. In regards to Max, he's terrified. He's buying time but he really, really, *really* doesn't want to die. I think that's the extent of it. He's saying what he can say to avoid being executed. All of his actions in the show have been borderline impulsive - he doesn't plan ahead, he acts on now, and his entire personality will adjust as a survival mechanism. He thanks the priest for giving him an opportunity to die for the Brotherhood in the first episode, not because he means it, but because that's what he needs to say to stay alive. He tells Lucy about the RadAway because he wants to get out of the suit. The only times he doesn't behave this way is when he's adventuring with Lucy, I think because she gives him the feeling that maybe it's not all survival, but on his own, Max is very keenly aware that he is alone and must do whatever he can to stay alive. I feel like Quintus knows this. He knew it in the first episode, too. He doesn't see Max as some ideal of the Brotherhood, he sees him as someone weak and very easy to manipulate to his own ends. The cool ghoul in the observatory garden is focused on because she says "That's her!" That ghoul recognises Lucy. I feel like a lot of the messaging of the show can't be taken on face value. The settlement is slaughtered because the Brotherhood's claim of collecting technology to save humanity from itself is ultimately bullshit. They're like Vault-Tec, they're like the Enclave, they're power-hungry and dogmatic about it. They will slaughter whatever challenges their worldview, and people peacefully sharing and coexisting is a threat to them. Why let everyone have power when the Brotherhood can have power absolute? My theory re: Vault-Tec is: I don't think Vault-Tec has power anymore, in the show. I think Hank got his hands on a big bomb, sure, but this is a game where you have mini-nukes as ammo. I don't think it's that far-fetched. I also feel like.. I'm not sure how to word it, but I guess, Bud's Buds are just people living in a bubble playing Barbie with actual living human beings. They can keep secrets from people they have specifically bred and groomed not to ask those questions. I think the list of people 'active' from the cryopods is just those who are currently out - there's nothing to say they don't activate and then return to the pods. Like I said before, so much of the show is immaculate, the attention to detail is excellent, it's hard to believe that these plot holes aren't intentional. I don't think Vault 31 has any contact with overarching Vault-Tec. Vault-Tec fell with the rest of them and 31 is just a relic, like all the other vaults. It just happens to be a relic with some very well preserved antiques in it. I don't think Barb knew the bombs were going to be dropped when they were. I feel like the thing with Vault Tech is that it screws everyone over, including its own employees, regardless of their station. We saw that with the scientists, we saw that with... what's his face from Fallout 4, the one who gives you your stats and name menu. If Barb had a boss (and it's clear she did) that boss would have tossed her under the bus with the rest of them if it was more convenient. That said, I don't think it was Vault-Tec (or maybe, not just Vault-Tec) dropping the bombs. What, like America has the patent on megalomania and psychopathy? Or even then, like Vault-Tec is the only power thinking this way? People with money don't want money because they need money. They want power. Money buys more power. Vault-Tec offers them vaults to play with, offers them power over the outcome of the human race, and money stops mattering. Everything in Barb's pitch wasn't about business of the future of humanity. She was saying what she knew she needed to say, wrapped up in shiny business speech, to play on the ego and the desires of people who crave power, to fund the vaults. "Give us money, and we'll give you playthings." All of this felt very much like commentary on the real world. I mean, of course it was, you can't remove any text from its real-world context, but we live in a world where billionaires play with space and use powerless people for experimentation or a disposable workforce and do things like buy massive social media empires just to spite their ex. The people funding the vaults aren't *companies.* They're *people*, and people who have built their empires on exploitation. Hell, we're seeing in real time right now how people will explain away the deaths of 30,000 people. Everything in the show is just observations on human behaviour: from wanting to have a peaceful home, to distrust of the Other, to being valiant around the ones you love and a coward on your own, to the realities that sometimes you can't escape, sometimes it's not safe, sometimes communications break down. That sometimes a man will hunt down the woman who left him and kill her, and anyone with her. Moldaver's message to Max isn't just for Max, it's for the audience too. There are bobbleheads in the show! They're all over the place, you just have to spot them. The most obvious ones are usually acknowledged by vault dwellers like Lucy and Hank. There's a deathclaw skull in the final scene with Hank just before they show him approaching New Vegas. I felt like the little developments like Lucy gaining new armour, her new finger, Thaddeus gaining the Ghoulish perk, and yeah Coop's gory destruction were all nods to levelling up and gaining perks. All of your questions are valid, and I'm hoping a lot of them get answered in season two. I'm especially interested to see if the broken water chip forces the walls between 31-32-33 to break down a little more, or send the inhabitants out into the wasteland.
As Tim Cain always says, lore shifts. The shady sands thing did upset me, but I get that lore shifted for the TV show. My major takeaway from the show is that the Ghoul is the main character, the story is about him, and if some people dont see that, then they missed the point.
20:14 While I agree with you about the physical portrait of Mr House, let's not forget that he didn't know when the bombs were going to fall and his plans were to create an "iron dome" to save a city, so his addition to the scene is dubiously on terms of lore, but great service to the fanbase. My second concern is that becuse if what you mentioned about 2277 (I'm waaay more pissed than you about the lore break) tied to showing the Strip in the las scene, makes me fear a total destruction of FNV lore in season 2.
If you didn't recognized the Strip (New Vegas' skyline) means you haven't started a Fallout New Vegas playthrough. You can find in YT many playthroughs, but yes, you should definitely should play more games.
They changed ghoul lore when they introduced the need for one specific chem to keep ghouls from turning feral. That's not really how it works in any of the games. It's still not clear to me how "Don Pedro" had The Ghoul dug up once a year and cut pieces off of him. How does that work?
At around 18:20 you say Bud doesn't make sense. And honestly, YEAH, but unfortunately he's just like tons of real world businessmen lol. In Fallout 1 ghouls are a lot more necrotic than in 4 or the show, that's for sure. The lore has definitely changed over time between the various games. In regards to Thaddeus possibly becoming an odd new ghoul &/or mutant; Harold from Fallout 1 was a "ghoul" who was technically a mutant; you see him again in Fallout 2 & one final time in Fallout 3. It could be neat if Thaddeus is a special type like Harold was! Vault-Tec having *some* ordinance post-war isn't an unheard of concept; there are malfunctioning missile silos in DC from Fallout 3 you can (unsuccessfully) try to launch; & iirc 2 separate orbital bombardments you can call down as well! Also the Lonesome Road DLC of Fallout New Vegas is all about the legacy of nukes on the wasteland, & culminates in a silo that has been restored to semi-working order complete with at least 2 missiles ready to launch! That all being I hope Vault-Tec (nor the Enclave!) don't have very many left or accessible at all because like you said, it certainly undermines our "do-goodery" if a group like that can just nuke the map after the player is done. As far as Coop & his daughter being out on bomb day goes; it's entirely possible he ran away with her, or forced Barb to accept his turn at custody as an incentive to NOT "drop it first". But irregardless, judging by the incomplete Vaults across the barious games, I think Vault-Tec was caught off guard like everyone else, & that was merely an option they considered; narratively it serves to hammer home how despicable, deranged, & controlling the pre-war conglomerates really were to a new audience. With any luck the water chip issue will reappear in season 2 as a driving force for new Vault plot-threads! You mentioned in the video wanting to play more of the Fallouts for their lore; I know the gameplay of 1 & 2 aren't for everyone but I highly recommend at least watching some lore vids on them. Imo Fallout 1 has the best *story* out of all of them. Also if you install Fallout 3 & FNV with all their DLCs you can install the Tale of Two Wastelands mod which really is the best "vanilla" way to experience both games in my opinion; certainly the best way to play Fallout 3 in modern times. Thank you for your lovely thoughts on the show! It seems most of us loved it as a whole but have many questions & semi-dissatisfaction with the finale
The story of every Vault in games is always how Vaultec and other companies fail in their plans, despite all the technology. The TV show downplays this somewhat.
Im the one who said even rich and famous artists will put on private shows for richer people and while that's true, upon a closer second watch, I heard the bit about Coop struggling financially. Sorry if I cam across pushy or anything. Overall I found myself pretty confused about so many things on this show. I need to pay better attention I guess, maybe watch it earlier in the evening. I am aware that the devs have made statements that this show does match up with the game so there should not be gigantic differences but seems like there actually are? I'm one of those weirdos who is watching the show but has never played any of the mainline games so things like ghouls are not strange to me, Im accepting tham as thery're being shown to us but from what you're saying these ghouls are not like the game ones? I mainly enjoyed the show. I felt like they have not yet really nailed the tone as it swings from really goofy to really gory and scary, I think they could find a bit better balance. I loved all the sets, costumes and props and some of the actors (I dont like Walter Cogins or Aaron Moten -Maximus/Titus) so it was a real mixed bag for me. I hope they do a better job with God of War (whomever is doing that one).
The supercharged healing ability at 6:48 is just the stimpack. Stimpack is used in the show to regrow the BOS foot; restores limbs in-game. Zao even uses a stimpack in the end of your video.
No, it’s not. I’m referring to the supercharged healing ability ghouls display in the show (Thaddeus’ foot healing, neck healing, Coop’s resistance to bullets, finger being sewn back on, etc). That is not what we see in games. Zao uses a stimpack, he doesn’t have the innate ghoul super healing we see in the show.
ive only played Fallout new vegas once but i immediately got the reference! Very excited :) i don't think vault tec dropped the bombs, but they did want it to happen. also i thought ghouls healed w damaged skin until they were fully ghoulified and then thats when they start falling apart?
As other people are mentioning it was discussed from Bethesda that the bomb did not drop in 2277 on shady sands. I haven't finished the whole video but from what I'm reading from other comments in the game ghouls cans sporadically heal from radiation. I'm a little confused on why Maximus thinks Thaddeus is a ghoul but I'm thinking it's just a new kind of ghoul. I'm placing bets on whatever this new chem is... Probably a form of that is what was keeping muldaver (sp?) alive but it obviously doesn't make her immortal unless she regenerates after the events of the show. I'm looking at it like this was the preseason opener and that the real story is going to start happening in season 2. And since I'm commenting I want to say how much I love your content and I watch your videos normally but then you have such a soothing voice that I will also turn on one of the longer videos like the sanctuary build and it's relaxing enough that I go to sleep! Okay I probably should watch the rest of the video before I comment anything else.
I'm starting with an overall statement about current tv: I think the answer to a lot of your (very valid) criticisms are best explained by the 8 episode drop, vs. the 22 season. Bottle episodes and "filler" episodes used to provide so much subtle backstory during a fun one-off show. It is not happening anymore (any Buffy fan: Hush (one of the best hours of tv ever) never would have happened today). Back to episode 8: Max was a TERRIBLE student. Thadeus was a much better student. He was turned ghoul, not a super mutant... the ghoul vs super mutant is also VERY CLEAR. There is NOTHING about FEV in the show (and I love Thadeus - he's basically Oded Fehr's Mummy character - smart but craven, and will probably die to his own hubris sometime in the future). I look forward to him being the 'fake Titus' or fake 'The Ghoul' shaking down wasteland townsfolk for protection money. Based on what we've seen - The Ghoul is REALY old compared to other ghouls. He's held off insanity with drugs and cannibalism. (the drugs also being based on cannibalism- what have you actually been trading for, Daisy (Goodneighbor)?). This is fine. (I like to work with small worlds tv or movie experience - so that what you see on the screen is only stressed by things that happen on screen) To continue... We are still reinterpreting modern history, so the Shady Sands stuff bothers me 0%. We now have multiple 1st person experiences, so it happened in 2277. The show is cannon. any variation is because of any historical interpretation that will be corrected in 10-150 years. To wind back a bit, the way that ghouls work changes from game to game, so I'm much less bothered than you are. I'm much more irritated but how Hank and Moldaver don't actually know who each other are in the first scenes. That really bothers me. (they are from the same time - there is NO REASON Hank wouldn't have known who Moldaver was when she was the 'leader' of the anti-VaulTec coalition in LA. Hank not knowing her is... hubris? maybe? In the 1st episode The Ghoul is playing with Maximus. He's so used to winning, that he wants a bit of push back.. so he toys with Maximus. He very quickly realizes that Max is a noob and not a fair fight. Finally - I COMPLETELY agree that Barb would not have voluntarily let her daughter be out in the open when the bombs fell if she knew about the timing... I really want more on that in season 2.
In terms of playing other Fallout games beside FO4: as a game developer you may struggle with FO1 & 2 mechanics and UI, but I don't fight those who say FO2 is the best game in the series (story wise). FO3 was the first by Bethesda and introduces us to the West Coast ; I like it a lot but it's as buggy as Bethesday could get away with it. FNV is my personal favorite (and I'm far from being the only one here) in terms of companion design, side stories etc. but the developer, Obsidian, didn't have the budget or time and some factions are rushed so sometimes the game feels finished (starting with the lack of tutorials - either play FO3 or try to adapt from what you know in FO4). I know I'm leaving behind Fallout Tactics but that's another story.
You opened the floodgate to spoilers so just a quick lore recap (which is summarised so don't at me with your "ackshually"s). Shady Sands was a settlement in the California mountain ranges (so the location in the series is wrong). When you arrive there, you're told that the Vault you were supposed to go to was overran by raiders and the survivors joined Shady Sands - but the majority are surface dwellers so they lack e.g. the knowlege about crop rotation. From that point until the enf of Fallout 2 other cities join Shady Sands into the New California Republic. By the start of Fallout New Vegas, this Republic spans from northern Mexico to the South to beyond North California, and from the coast to ... well, when they enter the Mojave Desert they find the same skyline as in the end of season 1, while in the search of Hoover Dam (that's 2274). In 2277 the NCR army wins the 1st Battle of Hoover Dam but its power plant is under House's control. They reach an agreement so the NCR doesn't conquer the Strip, but it's pretty much allowed to take over the rest of Nevada (they cannot because of their opponents in that battle). You play as the main character of Fallout New Vegas in 2281, and you learn that House didn't care about Vaults (tried to protect the city itself) and didn't know when the bombs were going to fall. The NCR (capital - Shady Sands) is still there with a working army etc. A bomb on Shady Sands on 2277 is a stupidiy beyond salvation, so now the producers and misguided fans are backtracking / retconing.E.g. what they told you that 2277 is the year of decline not the actual bomb is non-sensical, that's the year the NCR won a battle on a different state with a working army and working (albeit almost overstrecthed) supply lines. That's not something a town of 30K population can do. That's something a working civilization /country can do. Which leads to my personal point. The 2277-2281 NCR was so large that the mere idea than a single bomb on their capital would revert everything to pre-FO1 levels is puerile. If the showrunners would have decided to split the NCR into warring states, or taken over by the Brahmin Barons innto a neo-feudal society, or just simply moved the capital to another town / state within NCR territory I would have been fine with it. Also from the FNV lore: NCR fought the BoS in 2076 and the Mojave chapter of the BoS routed and was forced to flee. It's beyond reason that there would have been a working chapter close enough to Shady Sands for the "Shady Sands rescue mission", and that the rescue mission wasn't carried bt the NCR army itself. That's just the tip of the iceberg: incompatible (and internally inconsistent) ghoul lore, lack of supermutants, bizarre devolution of the BoS into a fairy-tale-medieval level, etc. makes this series funt to whatch if you turn off your brain and just want some fanservice and good music. As I mentioned elsewhere, I'm very fearful of what more of the lore they're going to destroy in season 2 given the glimpse of New Vegas in the ending scene, and the paradoxical appearance of House in the meeting with Vault-Tec pre-war.
I know you adore Fo4, I definitely do as well, but while I was waiting for Fo4 to release I played through 3 which was good and Fallout New Vegas. I definitely recommend New Vegas.
@@IfThenCreate It's also "viewer's license" to notice and mull over any issue you enjoy, as the viewer. And to participate in any issue discussions you like. 👉 I think michael's initial comment falls under the "Stop liking what I don't like!" meme.
Overall i enjoyed the show. I think it was good that i came in with low expectations. It's a tv show and especially a tv show based on a games series so I didn't have high hopes. However i don't think it's worth only complaining about changes now if you didn't criticise the changes in the games. It's not like the TV show started changing things. Fallout 2 chnaged things from the original as Tim Cain and Chris Avellone have both admitted and they worked on Fallout 2. Tim Cain is the creator of Fallout. He enjoyed the show and he said he didn't agree with everything in the show but still liked it. That's how i feel too as a fan of the games. I think people are expecting all the answers to be revealed in 1 season. Just be patient and wait for more seasons. It doesn't mean next season will answer everything but it will answer some things. We only had 8 episodes this season so i wouldn't expect everything explained in 8 episodes. It would be like expecting episode 1 to reveal everything. That's something people advise writers to not do. So things people are asking questions about are things yet to be revealed. I don't think Vault-Tec is behind everything and I don't think they dropped the bombs first but they wanted to. There is more to the story than that. Funny because I don't agree with Mr House being there in that scene as i habe played New Vegas but i am not going to throw a fit over it. Also Sinclair looks nothing like Sinclair from the posters in Dead Money. He is the other character from the game New Vegas. He is seen representing Big MT for some reason. But then again a lot of tv shows have characters who look different from the onesel from the original source so it's not fair to single one show out when most shows and movies do it. Some characters have the different eye colours or hair from books for example. However Bethesda took over Fallout and began their first Fallout with Fallout 3 which made huge changes to the lore. So that's why i do think if people are only going to complain when the show does it then they should have said something when the games themselves were doing it. I am not talking of the old fans as they were the ones who complained. Fallout: New Vegas got a lot of praise but it took years because i remember it getting hate at first. Now people praise it. Mainly because the people who worked on it had worked on Fallout 1 and 2 or the cancelled Van Buren project. New Vegas had more in common with the old games than Fallout 3 did. Fallout 4 would also make changes and while it had new factions like minutemen, they didn't feel s fleshed out as the ones in older games and NV. The tv show did a great job but I don't think it was ever going to be perfect and because the fanbase is so divided, they can never please everyone. I had things i didn't fully agree with but i liked the show overall. If i spent most of my time lingering onto small things then i wouldn't have been able to enjoy the show. I think those who focus on that only are harming themselves as they're just going to have nothing but complaints. It was great to have an original story than a retelling of a story from the games. Even if they did do a retelling, people still would complain as we live in a culture of complaining about media. It's impossible to make a show be 100% perfect as a show has a limited run time and has to divide things into episodes which are limited and budget which is limited. Tim Cain enjoyed the show and i saw him in a stream talk of those who are like "i didn't like this thing so therefore it's all bad" which is an attitude some have. You're never going to enjoy anything if that is how you see things. Good stuff can still have flaws. Fallout 3 and Fallout 4 have their own flaws too. TV show already has a better story than them both. Those games also have questions we never got answered so the show shouldn't be singled out for things the games and other tv shows do themselves. There's definitely room for improvement and i am looking forward to season 2. If i had not enjoyed the show, i would not be watching it anymore as i don't waste my time watching things i don't like. Same with games and other forms of media.
I... hated this show. The first episode is wonderful. The rest of the show is just bad choice after bad choice. On the subject of ghouls having Deadpool levels of healing; go back to the first fight with Coop in the town. He takes several bullets from the settlers and just shrugs them off. It wasn't called out then but it definitely happened and I was wondering how he was just ignoring the hits.
When I first finished the show, I was mostly satisfied, like I'd say 7.5/10. But the whole show, from the very beginning, the way they depicted ghouls just BUGGED me. And the more I thought about it, the more a lot of little things bugged me lol. At this point I'd give it a 6/10.
I think Thaddeus being a ghoul is a red herring. Maximus isnt a reliable narrator, and as far as we know, his only actual interaction with ghouls is Cooper. And the brotherhood arent experts on ghouls or care to be beyond "shoot on sight." When i was watching, i thought the medicine was fev or similar. The audience hasnt seen super mutants yet except for a blink and you miss it moment in ep 2. The showrunners even said that there simply wasnt enough time to squeeze decades of lore into 8 episodes. But that theyll eventually come around it certain things later. So they tease if possible instead, like deathclaws. Anyway, im in the camp of Thaddeus being a mutant.
You believe Maximus, the brotherhood, Thaddeus, and what we as the audience has seen of ghouls having super healing, all of that is unreliable and incorrect? And based on nothing we’ve seen in the show, you believe super mutants will have the same super healing?
The last episode was very disappointing. None of the “answers” made sense. To top it off, it made me rather uninterested in returning for next season. I mean, I am sure I will but it was really one WTF moment after another.
Maximus plan was to give Lucy a headstart and then send the Brotherhood to attack Moldaver, they thought she was the bad guy. The plan worked. And the thing about ghouls... there is not one theory of how it works. Just in Fallout 4 you have Ghouls that age and go feral, Ghouls that have to eat and others a hundred years old that never have a bite (kid in the fridge). Ghouls that get randomly created (Hancock) and manufactured Ghouls (Eddie Winter). Every explanation the show could give is both true and false 🤷🏻♂️
PS: Lucy's mother didn't die in a famine, that's the story his father used to cover her leaving
A lot of people get the time line wrong; Todd had to go out on social media and say outright that the bomb did NOT fall in 2277 but a few months after the end of Fallout NV. (Edit: and yes I immediately recognized the city but only because I have played NV like 8 times despite it not being my favorite Fallout. Otherwise you get the hints if you pay close attention at the end credits, it rolls past a few signs saying "New Vegas", but they could have made it more obvious).
I know, I saw. I feel like a conspiracy theorist thinking they’re just trying to cover up a mistake 😂 I think if that was true the chalkboard would say the fall of Shady Sands was 2281, and Lucy wouldn’t say her mom died in ‘77
@@IfThenCreateLucy is an unreliable narrator as she doesn't have clear memories of being outside the vault as she was a young child at the time she doesn't even realise her memories of being in a field are outside the Vault until the final episode.
Which means that Lucy and Norm were taken out of the vault by their mother in 2277 after discovering the vault's water being syphoned, her father invented the famine to put the vault dwellers in isolation to lockdown the vault so he could go after them, he was obviously able to retrieve the kids in 2277 but not their mother who presumably refused to return and remained with Moldaver.
Then Henry fed his kids the lie that she died in the famine of 77 to explain why she wasn't in the vault with them.
This would leave the destruction of Shady Sands event to happen after the fall of Shady Sands explaining the -> on the chalkboard, maybe after he had acquired the resources to destroy it.
Also the fall of something does not mean the instant and complete collapse for example Rome's fall took 300 years.
@@thomaswedge42 I just don’t think it makes sense that we have all that info and references to 2277, and then for some reason Hank left the vault again four years later to bomb Shady Sands. There’s no evidence supporting that in the show.
Adding to the whole “Vault-Tec has bombs” plot. A massive part of the story in Fallout 76 is Vault Tec gave the overseer a mission once Vault 76s reclamation day came. She was to secure all the nuclear bombs left in Appalachia, with the strict orders that no matter who was still there, even if it was the goverment, those bombs now belonged to Vault Tec
I think that the drug that Coop uses regularly and that healed Thaddeus's foot is the source of the super healing. I don't think the super healing is inherent to being a ghoul. Lucy's mom was so very decayed because for whatever reason she didn't get access to the drug. In Fallout 4 we see some ghouls who degenerate and some that don't. I am not aware of an in-game reason that talks about why some do and some don't, but the drug seems like a fun way to introduce that and to give Coop some abilities to have over the top fun violence but also have a weakness that he'll have to manage. I like it as a narrative device and I do think it isn't 100% faithful to the games, but I will forgive that as a necessary part of adapting to a different medium.
In the Nuka World DLC, there is a ghoul (Oswald the Outrageous) that releases radiation and heals other ghouls. Also, he has set up the Kiddie Kingdom sprayers to spray irradiated water, which heals ghouls and damages humans.
I mentioned this previously, too. I get it, but it's still not Thad-style regeneration. I think that's the pain point.
Notably, Oswald's regeneration powers don't seem to work on dismembered ghouls, either. There's a point of new return.
@shockmethodx He (Oswald) brought them back from seemingly dead in his journal entries, but I don't think it would regrow a limb. So, I am not so much disagreeing, but rather pointing out where they used the ghoul healing in the game and what the limits seemed to be.
@@melodyfinch1357 Fully agree! Glowing Ones can do it, too.
Radiation does heal them in my game of fallout 4. The base damage still damages ghouls. Your gamma gun have a base damage too. Look closely at your weapon damage. You will have more than one total for damage. I use a mod feral nights for testing it spawns a ton of ghouls at night and all of them healed with with any type of radiation damage. The guns base damage is what gets them in the end.
Yeah in terms of what Lucy 'knows' about her mom and the plague of 77, we have to take everything Lucy 'knows' with a pinch of salt. She's been lied to her whole life.
The ghoul healing is an interesting one because, while General Zao may not have healed from the Gamma Gun, Feral Ghouls do seem to get healed from the rad bursts that a Glowing One makes, and Zao can be healed by a Stimpak. We know stimpaks can heal broken limbs and headwounds etc. because this happens with our protagonist. It's possible that those vial things are some kind of rad-stimpak, that just so happens to turn non-ghouls into ghouls sometimes (If that's even what the 'doctor' gave to thaddeus). I don't think they stop a ghoul from going feral though as the guy Coop and Lucy found that was reminding himself of his own name had some recently and was still going feral. I reckon Coop is just addicted to them the way some people get addicted to medication. Though I like the idea of a Fallout game where you get to play as a ghoul that needs to keep taking some kind of serum to stay alive.
The fall of Shady Sands is not the bombing, that has been confirmed. The chalkboard is a timeline: event, arrow (proceed to next), event, arrow, event - the production team have confirmed that the events of Fallout New Vegas happen, which is set post 2277, so the bombing has to happen after that and they have stated such. Hopefully they will add more clarity in the coming season as it's caused a lot of confusion. I think they left a date out to leave themselves room for future lore additions, but they need to lock it down.
With ghouls they seem to be treating most named ghouls as equivalent to legendary creatures - including ghouls - in F4, which do have a healing factor, even healing crippled limbs. Yes, it's one time each in the game but that's a thing. There are also mutation syrums in the Fallout universe, there's lots of options - Thaddeus seems to be setting up a hook for next season more than anything else.
When Barb said that they could drop the bombs themselves i took it more like "We could if we wanted to" not that they actually did it.
I felt like them automatically trusting Maximus enough to “form a new brotherhood” felt very akin to the decision making in other fallout games (especially the bethesda ones). It’s the leader of the group somehow automatically trusting the main character enough to put them in charge of everything. it’s a meme about skyrim how you become leader of everything with zero qualifications. it’s kinda the same for fallout! i thought it was a nod at that kind of narrative in the games!
I love this take
I immediately recognized New Vegas at the end of the episode, but New Vegas is my favorite fallout game so that skyline is burned in my brain lol
My two favorite quotes:
"To have the ultimate enemy at the end of the day just be peppy co-workers was depressing!"
"When I play Fallout, it is to dance on the graves of the capitalists of Vault Tec."
Absolutely amazing. Oh, and I loved your somewhat giddy reaction to that one (admittedly hot) Brotherhood member coming back.
Some thoughts that aren't really in order:
1. Ghoul lore has changed from game to game and I'm not sure there's anything solid or stable. Also, gameplay doesn't always reflect lore. For example, your Gamma Gun didn't heal the one guy, but I know that glowing ones do heal ghouls around them in-game. HOWEVER, I have got to think that there's something different going on with the Brotherhood squire who became a ghoul and The Ghoul himself.
2. I'm not thinking of Vault Tec as having survived, just this one experiment because it was specifically designed to have management preserved over the centuries. It is disturbing to know they still have access to nuclear ordinance and can wipe out the center of the largest, post-war society in existence.
3. I have heard Todd Howard say that the timeline for the destruction of Shady Sands will not conflict with any previously established lore. Just barely, but there you go.
4. There are often remnants of pre-war things and people which rise up to haunt the post-apocalypse. The only other Fallout game I've played through completion (New Vegas) has this as a theme multiple times. One of the DLCs, generally considered the best one, is called "Old World Blues." You COULD think of the Institute as the same type of thing, although there is no pre-war person living there (except for Father, who doesn't really count).
5. Regarding the Brotherhood, another theme in at least one game (Fallout 3) is an offshoot/"heretic" branch that breaks off from the main mission of the Brotherhood. Actually, now that I'm thinking about it, that's another theme in Fallout: New Vegas which drives another one of the DLCs. So, if this Brotherhood Elder genuinely believed that the driving ideal of the Brotherhood should be power and the seizing of power by power, then Maximus, trustworthy or not, would seem to be evidence of that ideal. (Not really because Maximus actually is driven by other desires, including safety and wanting to protect Lucy, but still.)
6. I like that Lucy didn't say anything when confronted by her father. What was there to say? She'd had all of her deep-seated beliefs questioned or crushed. She discovered what Vault Tec was at Vault 4. She'd already been changed by the wasteland somewhat to become tougher, less trusting, more wary. And then to realize that her father was an absolute monster, the one who murdered her own mother and the destroyer of Shady Sands ... I think she'd have to feel absolute defeat at that moment. I, at least, wouldn't know what to say.
I hope you continue to watch the new Fallout episodes whenever they come out because I genuinely enjoy your commentary/reactions.
🔵 Point #6 was perfectly stated.
Lucy was in shock over betrayal-reveal compounded by betrayal-reveal. The entire foundation of her upbringing had been turned to quicksand and she was paralyzed by the initial hints of the implications. She couldn't even react when dear old dad said, "Can you get us out of here?", to stop Max from blowing the lock.
🔵 I also agree w/ #2.
I think season two will reveal more about how much of Vault-Tec's Kⱥpitolisst wet dream survived to this point. The Ghoul is taking Lucy to "meet her makers", so he can "talk to" whoever is "behind the wheel", and find his f'n family. We can expect that story to be laid out as neat and tidily as this season; like straightening out a bag of yarn invaded by three kittens.
[I'm trying to win the award for most metaphors mixed in one YooToob comment...]
I don't believe that vault tec dropped the bombs, especially because it was when Cooper and their daughter were out. I don't think her mother would have intentionally put her into danger like you said. And if she is high enough in vault tec to make the suggestion, why wouldn't she be involved in when they would be dropped?
I want to know what happened right after Cooper and his daughter left on the horse because we don't see what happens to them.
In New Vegas, the DLC, Lonesome Road is about that there still are live nukes that can target and be fired. So it may not necessarily be vault tec that is still in control of every nuke. I didn't get the sense that they fared better than anyone else from the show.
12:03 "Why in the world would he trust Maximus"
I would say that the Elder of course does not trust Maximus,
but it doesn't matter because Maximus would be their only lead at all.
"This must be a trap, a stupid one" would also funny enough be what I think is what the Elder is thinking and they would be able to steamroll whatever would be there anyway.
According to the actual showrunners, Shady Sands was not destroyed in 2277, but several years after that (not long after the end of Fallout New Vegas in 2281). You also have to consider unreliable narrators like Lucy. She may THINK her mom passed away in 2277 - but she was a small child then. Maybe that's when her mom left the vault to go live in Shady Sands and daddy(?) blew the place up later?
Not sure where you are getting that all ghouls have super regeneration - I don't remember seeing that (but maybe I missed something). I just assumed Coop had "Player character toughness/plot armor." Plus ghouls CAN take damage that would kill a normal human - even if you remove a limb or two they can still come at you. There was even a ghoul in Fallout 3 that complained he's always losing parts of himself.
Re: Maximus saying Thaddeus is a ghoul - I mean the guy doesn't know basic stuff like how sex works - what the hell does he know? The brotherhood's education seems to be pretty poor, aside from "kill nonhumans on sight" or "that's a toaster". Thaddius is probably some kind of mutant now - maybe not of the "Super" variety, but he wouldn't be the first mutated human in the Fallout Universe.
Barb Cooper saying that VT will drop the bomb themselves. Did she mean literally? Then why is her daughter caught outside of the vault when they actually dropped? And in the games - why are other vault unfinished or were caught with their pants down?
Again - unreliable narrator. Just because someone says something in the show - that's just what they think. It's not necessarily the truth.
Ghouls are people, people are biologically complicated. For instance, when it comes to treating infections, some people can use penicillin while others can't.
My theory is that the ghoulification process varies based off of Health, genetics, type of radiation, and possibly the elements used in the bomb.
This is how different areas of the Commonwealth could have ghouls that have different features, needs, and even healing abilities.
Follow-up comment: I had no thought that Barb was low-level. I thought she had leveraged Coop's fame and her own smarts to propel herself (and family) as far forward into the Vault-Tec family as soon as it could, so that they were put into a 'good vault'. She dragged him into being Vault-Boy. He was a very successful actor beforehand, and wanted to retire. Barb was petrified, and her world was small -it was her, her daughter, and (possibly) Coop, even if they were separated. I like small stories, so I hope it gets picked up in future seasons.
The cool looking white Ghoul is one of those she saved in the super duper market.
Your end rant took such a beautiful turn and I really appreciated it.
Just in case you haven't run into them before, mutated bears are in the games just like deathclaws except they're called yao guai.
Did you see that season 2 is in the works already? They want to put it out as soon as humanly possible!! So hopefully they can answer some of the questions they left!
The Ghoul is maxed out on Charisma. He literally talked his way through the ordeal with The Governmint. He was tied up with no trigger finger. He convinced them to cut the ropes, let him sew on his trigger finger, and he convinced the President to disarm the guy who was about to shoot him in the head. He also has the bloody mess perk, night vision, and maxed out luck.
Maximus put all his intelligence points into perception and endurance.
We saw Bobbleheads... do we REALLY want them to give buffs to intelligence and medical skills? I think we're better off leaving them as decorations.
I did recognize new vegas immediately. The walls around freeside and the big tower is the lucky 38 casino where Robert House is.
Now the question is what happened to new vegas after the game. Because it looks really rough and the credits showed destroyed virtibirds, House securitrons and deathclaw skeletons.
There's a lot of different endings and this show takes place years later. Is Hank going there to meet Mrs House? Is House even alive in the canon of the show? Or is Hank going there for something else? We don't know.
So my thought about Vault 31 is that they’re all clones of the original ones, coming from the stem cells or whatever tissue (I’m no scientist lol) is remaining. But who tf knows!
I kind of cracked up at your reaction 😂 at least you saw the car!!!
My read is that the fall of shady sands was when brahmin barons took power in the NCR. I mostly think that because of in game details about the NCR between 2 and new Vegas. What happened between 'the fall' and blowing up is fertile narrative soil for season 2 flashbacks
I don't agree that starved mea s died. Primarily because Hank also starved and survived. I inferred that vaults 32 and 33 came up with a scheme to trap and eat surface dwellers without telling Bud. I'm not sure how well that tracks tho
If Thadius didn't become a ghoul, then I don't know of any other examples of ghouls healing any better than anyone else. Coop took out the town because he's the fastest gun in the west. Coop did not regenerate a finger. Also there maybe was a super mutant in episode two. When ziggy is taking puppy dogmeat thru a checkpoint, he had to wait as a huge corpse with a muscular, green hand sticking out from under the sheet passed by
Titus was killed by a Yao guai
The brotherhood elder is a cultist who ferishizes power and hates weakness. I expect him to have as much rationality of an MRA Podcaster and his actions meet my expectations of him
That mini car is so delightful. I bet it had floor drains for when the rain got in
Barb would not be in the position she is in at the world's largest company if she wasn't willing to take risks and ignore reality. I think vault tec makes more sense in the context of US history. JD Rockefeller was way happier using an old and train monopoly to bully the entire economy than he was when he made more money as a shareholder in many smaller oil and train companies. The capitalists don't want to always have more than they had before, they want to always have more than you. They will lock themselves in golden cages if it means everyone else has nothing
If vault 32 was regular in the last trienial trade, then it could not have fallen more then three years ago. In my read they tried the cannibalism plan again, maybe they needed to or maybe they just liked it. Either way it didn't work. No one told bud becuase every defrosted person from 31 was a junior executive with no real experience who's never getting gout of the vault. They freaked out and hid everything from their idiot boss who's still making choices based off of two hundred year old slogans. Who cleaned up vault 32? Robots probably. I know that's weak, but it's what I got. The language may not change as much as you think. They have holotapes preserving pronunciation, and if there's a disagreement, then you ask someone who went to the better school in vault 31
I ultimately agree that I like it better when vault tec are victims of their own hubris and America killed everyone for the chance at a spaceship
My take on the brotherhood includes the idea that their constant attempts to preserve their traditions leads them to constantly, drastically change as time passes, like in "A Canticle For Liebowitz"
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I recognized the New Vegas reveal right away. The Lucky 38 casino tower is iconic. It was our goal, visible in the background during most of the game.
Before the show, I never questioned "who dropped the bombs?" because it's a pointless question that doesn't require an answer! The reveal that Vault-Tec not only destroyed Shady Sands, but started the Great War in the first place, definitely stinks of "tv writers felt the need to have One True Big Bad Who Does All The Bad Things because it's easier than nuance". I find it all rather hacky, to be honest.
EDIT: I also just wanted to add that I discovered your build videos about a week ago and they've been very nice!
I totally agree
IMO it’s still ambiguous- Vault-Tec was prepared to drop the bomb themselves, but the timing of when it happened makes me think they ultimately didn’t. Why would Barb be OK with her daughter being at a birthday party with Coop when the bombs were gonna drop? She seemed pretty high up at vault tec given how much secret knowledge she seemed privy to, so I’m sure she’d know when it would happen
ALSO ok so when they’re in that secret evil meeting, at one point she looks at her pip boy then up toward the ceiling. She KNOWS her pip boy is broadcasting, but not to where. I don’t think she realized her husband was spying on her, I think she thought it was maybe someone higher up at VT, that she was being appraised and that she needed to prove herself or something. Cause I believe she loves Janey and Coop, and is prepared to back VT in whatever they do if it means keeping them safe. So I’m even a lil suspicious that it was entirely a performance, that “by dropping the bomb ourselves” is fully a lie to reassure those other companies that vault tec is in control
I think there's a version of events where Lucy understood the nature of her mother's demise accurately. Her mother could have died from a plague in '77 that coincides with the fall of Shady Sands. The NCR is in a bad way. You really get a sense of the scope and scale of their desperation throughout New Vegas. Bases not getting supplies, a thriving black market, pressure from raider gangs, the lack of training. I think Lucy's mom dying of a plague could be the thing that prompts her father to nuke.
The conspiracy theorist in me thinks that the Legion getting the dam is the canonical ending, hence the fall. Bethesda/Todd can only say "the bombs didn't drop in '77" without giving too much away if that's the case.
I do think the show is establishing fiduciary responsibility as an antagonistic force to give our heroes something to overcome down the line (so it's ironic that this show is on Amazon then. But capitalism's greatest trick is to subsume its criticisms and sell the Good Fight to us).
Oh, and there is somewhat of an Enclave presence in New Vegas. Could be interesting to see how it plays out.
The most disappointing thing in the show for me was seeing cold fusion. It's the most boring of sci-fi MacGuffins. It could've been launch codes or payload locations. Something more relevant. Moldaver sacrificed literally everything from her morals to her life to empower the Brotherhood? Seems silly.
And you turned me around on the ghouls. I quite liked the lore drift and I felt like it tied a lot of the different depictions of ghouls together. Moira and Hancock being a big example, but, yeah, you're right. We do see regeneration as a game mechanic, but ghouls aren't re-growing limbs. An arrow to the neck ought to mean what an arrow to the neck usually means.
While the show does deviate from game lore on ghouls, I really want to point out that every ghoul we see in the show is using that drug-like liquid that also isn't present in the game. I don't quite agree that ghouls are dead (real life living human beings can have necrotic tissue and still be alive, and this is more believable given the planet is irradiated and the ghouls' cells feed on it, and also if stimpaks can heal entire limbs then why not? And also, maybe feral ghouls are dead - braindead - but 'human' ghouls are not? I HAVE THOUGHTS.) but I think the fact that when we meet Coop, he's buried and being drip-fed that liquid is noteworthy. It's not FEV but I wouldn't be surprised if someone's figured out how to *make* a ghoul, and if that also brings the bonus of addiction-or-feral then it's a good (if extremely unethical) business model for the wasteland. Thaddeus takes the liquid from the snake oil salesman. Why not just a stimpak to heal his foot?
I feel like so much of the show has been so loyal to the games, so accurate to the games, that an inaccuracy this big might be a clue in itself.
In regards to Max, he's terrified. He's buying time but he really, really, *really* doesn't want to die. I think that's the extent of it. He's saying what he can say to avoid being executed. All of his actions in the show have been borderline impulsive - he doesn't plan ahead, he acts on now, and his entire personality will adjust as a survival mechanism. He thanks the priest for giving him an opportunity to die for the Brotherhood in the first episode, not because he means it, but because that's what he needs to say to stay alive. He tells Lucy about the RadAway because he wants to get out of the suit. The only times he doesn't behave this way is when he's adventuring with Lucy, I think because she gives him the feeling that maybe it's not all survival, but on his own, Max is very keenly aware that he is alone and must do whatever he can to stay alive.
I feel like Quintus knows this. He knew it in the first episode, too. He doesn't see Max as some ideal of the Brotherhood, he sees him as someone weak and very easy to manipulate to his own ends.
The cool ghoul in the observatory garden is focused on because she says "That's her!"
That ghoul recognises Lucy.
I feel like a lot of the messaging of the show can't be taken on face value. The settlement is slaughtered because the Brotherhood's claim of collecting technology to save humanity from itself is ultimately bullshit. They're like Vault-Tec, they're like the Enclave, they're power-hungry and dogmatic about it. They will slaughter whatever challenges their worldview, and people peacefully sharing and coexisting is a threat to them. Why let everyone have power when the Brotherhood can have power absolute?
My theory re: Vault-Tec is: I don't think Vault-Tec has power anymore, in the show. I think Hank got his hands on a big bomb, sure, but this is a game where you have mini-nukes as ammo. I don't think it's that far-fetched. I also feel like.. I'm not sure how to word it, but I guess, Bud's Buds are just people living in a bubble playing Barbie with actual living human beings. They can keep secrets from people they have specifically bred and groomed not to ask those questions. I think the list of people 'active' from the cryopods is just those who are currently out - there's nothing to say they don't activate and then return to the pods. Like I said before, so much of the show is immaculate, the attention to detail is excellent, it's hard to believe that these plot holes aren't intentional. I don't think Vault 31 has any contact with overarching Vault-Tec. Vault-Tec fell with the rest of them and 31 is just a relic, like all the other vaults. It just happens to be a relic with some very well preserved antiques in it.
I don't think Barb knew the bombs were going to be dropped when they were. I feel like the thing with Vault Tech is that it screws everyone over, including its own employees, regardless of their station. We saw that with the scientists, we saw that with... what's his face from Fallout 4, the one who gives you your stats and name menu. If Barb had a boss (and it's clear she did) that boss would have tossed her under the bus with the rest of them if it was more convenient. That said, I don't think it was Vault-Tec (or maybe, not just Vault-Tec) dropping the bombs. What, like America has the patent on megalomania and psychopathy? Or even then, like Vault-Tec is the only power thinking this way?
People with money don't want money because they need money. They want power. Money buys more power. Vault-Tec offers them vaults to play with, offers them power over the outcome of the human race, and money stops mattering. Everything in Barb's pitch wasn't about business of the future of humanity. She was saying what she knew she needed to say, wrapped up in shiny business speech, to play on the ego and the desires of people who crave power, to fund the vaults. "Give us money, and we'll give you playthings."
All of this felt very much like commentary on the real world. I mean, of course it was, you can't remove any text from its real-world context, but we live in a world where billionaires play with space and use powerless people for experimentation or a disposable workforce and do things like buy massive social media empires just to spite their ex. The people funding the vaults aren't *companies.* They're *people*, and people who have built their empires on exploitation. Hell, we're seeing in real time right now how people will explain away the deaths of 30,000 people. Everything in the show is just observations on human behaviour: from wanting to have a peaceful home, to distrust of the Other, to being valiant around the ones you love and a coward on your own, to the realities that sometimes you can't escape, sometimes it's not safe, sometimes communications break down. That sometimes a man will hunt down the woman who left him and kill her, and anyone with her. Moldaver's message to Max isn't just for Max, it's for the audience too.
There are bobbleheads in the show! They're all over the place, you just have to spot them. The most obvious ones are usually acknowledged by vault dwellers like Lucy and Hank.
There's a deathclaw skull in the final scene with Hank just before they show him approaching New Vegas.
I felt like the little developments like Lucy gaining new armour, her new finger, Thaddeus gaining the Ghoulish perk, and yeah Coop's gory destruction were all nods to levelling up and gaining perks.
All of your questions are valid, and I'm hoping a lot of them get answered in season two. I'm especially interested to see if the broken water chip forces the walls between 31-32-33 to break down a little more, or send the inhabitants out into the wasteland.
As Tim Cain always says, lore shifts. The shady sands thing did upset me, but I get that lore shifted for the TV show.
My major takeaway from the show is that the Ghoul is the main character, the story is about him, and if some people dont see that, then they missed the point.
The timing! I just finished the rest. So excited!
20:14 While I agree with you about the physical portrait of Mr House, let's not forget that he didn't know when the bombs were going to fall and his plans were to create an "iron dome" to save a city, so his addition to the scene is dubiously on terms of lore, but great service to the fanbase. My second concern is that becuse if what you mentioned about 2277 (I'm waaay more pissed than you about the lore break) tied to showing the Strip in the las scene, makes me fear a total destruction of FNV lore in season 2.
If you didn't recognized the Strip (New Vegas' skyline) means you haven't started a Fallout New Vegas playthrough. You can find in YT many playthroughs, but yes, you should definitely should play more games.
People who haven't played New Vegas: Why is the Space Needle in the desert?
Apparently people don't know the Strat tower casino exists in Las Vegas.
I don't know why people skip New Vegas. Especially if you played Fallout 3 which has the same gameplay minus the iron sights.
Regarding who dropped the bomb: I'm partial to theories that take into consideration what P.A.M knows.
They changed ghoul lore when they introduced the need for one specific chem to keep ghouls from turning feral. That's not really how it works in any of the games. It's still not clear to me how "Don Pedro" had The Ghoul dug up once a year and cut pieces off of him. How does that work?
At around 18:20 you say Bud doesn't make sense. And honestly, YEAH, but unfortunately he's just like tons of real world businessmen lol.
In Fallout 1 ghouls are a lot more necrotic than in 4 or the show, that's for sure. The lore has definitely changed over time between the various games. In regards to Thaddeus possibly becoming an odd new ghoul &/or mutant; Harold from Fallout 1 was a "ghoul" who was technically a mutant; you see him again in Fallout 2 & one final time in Fallout 3. It could be neat if Thaddeus is a special type like Harold was!
Vault-Tec having *some* ordinance post-war isn't an unheard of concept; there are malfunctioning missile silos in DC from Fallout 3 you can (unsuccessfully) try to launch; & iirc 2 separate orbital bombardments you can call down as well! Also the Lonesome Road DLC of Fallout New Vegas is all about the legacy of nukes on the wasteland, & culminates in a silo that has been restored to semi-working order complete with at least 2 missiles ready to launch! That all being I hope Vault-Tec (nor the Enclave!) don't have very many left or accessible at all because like you said, it certainly undermines our "do-goodery" if a group like that can just nuke the map after the player is done.
As far as Coop & his daughter being out on bomb day goes; it's entirely possible he ran away with her, or forced Barb to accept his turn at custody as an incentive to NOT "drop it first". But irregardless, judging by the incomplete Vaults across the barious games, I think Vault-Tec was caught off guard like everyone else, & that was merely an option they considered; narratively it serves to hammer home how despicable, deranged, & controlling the pre-war conglomerates really were to a new audience.
With any luck the water chip issue will reappear in season 2 as a driving force for new Vault plot-threads!
You mentioned in the video wanting to play more of the Fallouts for their lore; I know the gameplay of 1 & 2 aren't for everyone but I highly recommend at least watching some lore vids on them. Imo Fallout 1 has the best *story* out of all of them. Also if you install Fallout 3 & FNV with all their DLCs you can install the Tale of Two Wastelands mod which really is the best "vanilla" way to experience both games in my opinion; certainly the best way to play Fallout 3 in modern times.
Thank you for your lovely thoughts on the show! It seems most of us loved it as a whole but have many questions & semi-dissatisfaction with the finale
The story of every Vault in games is always how Vaultec and other companies fail in their plans, despite all the technology. The TV show downplays this somewhat.
Im the one who said even rich and famous artists will put on private shows for richer people and while that's true, upon a closer second watch, I heard the bit about Coop struggling financially. Sorry if I cam across pushy or anything. Overall I found myself pretty confused about so many things on this show. I need to pay better attention I guess, maybe watch it earlier in the evening. I am aware that the devs have made statements that this show does match up with the game so there should not be gigantic differences but seems like there actually are? I'm one of those weirdos who is watching the show but has never played any of the mainline games so things like ghouls are not strange to me, Im accepting tham as thery're being shown to us but from what you're saying these ghouls are not like the game ones? I mainly enjoyed the show. I felt like they have not yet really nailed the tone as it swings from really goofy to really gory and scary, I think they could find a bit better balance. I loved all the sets, costumes and props and some of the actors (I dont like Walter Cogins or Aaron Moten -Maximus/Titus) so it was a real mixed bag for me. I hope they do a better job with God of War (whomever is doing that one).
The supercharged healing ability at 6:48 is just the stimpack. Stimpack is used in the show to regrow the BOS foot; restores limbs in-game. Zao even uses a stimpack in the end of your video.
No, it’s not. I’m referring to the supercharged healing ability ghouls display in the show (Thaddeus’ foot healing, neck healing, Coop’s resistance to bullets, finger being sewn back on, etc). That is not what we see in games. Zao uses a stimpack, he doesn’t have the innate ghoul super healing we see in the show.
@@IfThenCreateI’m months late lol but I don’t think he’s a ghoul. I think the poor dude got injected with FEV
ive only played Fallout new vegas once but i immediately got the reference! Very excited :)
i don't think vault tec dropped the bombs, but they did want it to happen. also i thought ghouls healed w damaged skin until they were fully ghoulified and then thats when they start falling apart?
As other people are mentioning it was discussed from Bethesda that the bomb did not drop in 2277 on shady sands.
I haven't finished the whole video but from what I'm reading from other comments in the game ghouls cans sporadically heal from radiation. I'm a little confused on why Maximus thinks Thaddeus is a ghoul but I'm thinking it's just a new kind of ghoul.
I'm placing bets on whatever this new chem is... Probably a form of that is what was keeping muldaver (sp?) alive but it obviously doesn't make her immortal unless she regenerates after the events of the show.
I'm looking at it like this was the preseason opener and that the real story is going to start happening in season 2.
And since I'm commenting I want to say how much I love your content and I watch your videos normally but then you have such a soothing voice that I will also turn on one of the longer videos like the sanctuary build and it's relaxing enough that I go to sleep!
Okay I probably should watch the rest of the video before I comment anything else.
I'm starting with an overall statement about current tv: I think the answer to a lot of your (very valid) criticisms are best explained by the 8 episode drop, vs. the 22 season. Bottle episodes and "filler" episodes used to provide so much subtle backstory during a fun one-off show. It is not happening anymore (any Buffy fan: Hush (one of the best hours of tv ever) never would have happened today).
Back to episode 8: Max was a TERRIBLE student. Thadeus was a much better student. He was turned ghoul, not a super mutant... the ghoul vs super mutant is also VERY CLEAR. There is NOTHING about FEV in the show (and I love Thadeus - he's basically Oded Fehr's Mummy character - smart but craven, and will probably die to his own hubris sometime in the future). I look forward to him being the 'fake Titus' or fake 'The Ghoul' shaking down wasteland townsfolk for protection money.
Based on what we've seen - The Ghoul is REALY old compared to other ghouls. He's held off insanity with drugs and cannibalism. (the drugs also being based on cannibalism- what have you actually been trading for, Daisy (Goodneighbor)?).
This is fine.
(I like to work with small worlds tv or movie experience - so that what you see on the screen is only stressed by things that happen on screen)
To continue... We are still reinterpreting modern history, so the Shady Sands stuff bothers me 0%. We now have multiple 1st person experiences, so it happened in 2277. The show is cannon. any variation is because of any historical interpretation that will be corrected in 10-150 years.
To wind back a bit, the way that ghouls work changes from game to game, so I'm much less bothered than you are. I'm much more irritated but how Hank and Moldaver don't actually know who each other are in the first scenes. That really bothers me. (they are from the same time - there is NO REASON Hank wouldn't have known who Moldaver was when she was the 'leader' of the anti-VaulTec coalition in LA. Hank not knowing her is... hubris? maybe?
In the 1st episode The Ghoul is playing with Maximus. He's so used to winning, that he wants a bit of push back.. so he toys with Maximus. He very quickly realizes that Max is a noob and not a fair fight.
Finally - I COMPLETELY agree that Barb would not have voluntarily let her daughter be out in the open when the bombs fell if she knew about the timing... I really want more on that in season 2.
In terms of playing other Fallout games beside FO4: as a game developer you may struggle with FO1 & 2 mechanics and UI, but I don't fight those who say FO2 is the best game in the series (story wise). FO3 was the first by Bethesda and introduces us to the West Coast ; I like it a lot but it's as buggy as Bethesday could get away with it. FNV is my personal favorite (and I'm far from being the only one here) in terms of companion design, side stories etc. but the developer, Obsidian, didn't have the budget or time and some factions are rushed so sometimes the game feels finished (starting with the lack of tutorials - either play FO3 or try to adapt from what you know in FO4). I know I'm leaving behind Fallout Tactics but that's another story.
You opened the floodgate to spoilers so just a quick lore recap (which is summarised so don't at me with your "ackshually"s). Shady Sands was a settlement in the California mountain ranges (so the location in the series is wrong). When you arrive there, you're told that the Vault you were supposed to go to was overran by raiders and the survivors joined Shady Sands - but the majority are surface dwellers so they lack e.g. the knowlege about crop rotation. From that point until the enf of Fallout 2 other cities join Shady Sands into the New California Republic. By the start of Fallout New Vegas, this Republic spans from northern Mexico to the South to beyond North California, and from the coast to ... well, when they enter the Mojave Desert they find the same skyline as in the end of season 1, while in the search of Hoover Dam (that's 2274).
In 2277 the NCR army wins the 1st Battle of Hoover Dam but its power plant is under House's control. They reach an agreement so the NCR doesn't conquer the Strip, but it's pretty much allowed to take over the rest of Nevada (they cannot because of their opponents in that battle).
You play as the main character of Fallout New Vegas in 2281, and you learn that House didn't care about Vaults (tried to protect the city itself) and didn't know when the bombs were going to fall. The NCR (capital - Shady Sands) is still there with a working army etc. A bomb on Shady Sands on 2277 is a stupidiy beyond salvation, so now the producers and misguided fans are backtracking / retconing.E.g. what they told you that 2277 is the year of decline not the actual bomb is non-sensical, that's the year the NCR won a battle on a different state with a working army and working (albeit almost overstrecthed) supply lines. That's not something a town of 30K population can do. That's something a working civilization /country can do.
Which leads to my personal point. The 2277-2281 NCR was so large that the mere idea than a single bomb on their capital would revert everything to pre-FO1 levels is puerile. If the showrunners would have decided to split the NCR into warring states, or taken over by the Brahmin Barons innto a neo-feudal society, or just simply moved the capital to another town / state within NCR territory I would have been fine with it.
Also from the FNV lore: NCR fought the BoS in 2076 and the Mojave chapter of the BoS routed and was forced to flee. It's beyond reason that there would have been a working chapter close enough to Shady Sands for the "Shady Sands rescue mission", and that the rescue mission wasn't carried bt the NCR army itself.
That's just the tip of the iceberg: incompatible (and internally inconsistent) ghoul lore, lack of supermutants, bizarre devolution of the BoS into a fairy-tale-medieval level, etc. makes this series funt to whatch if you turn off your brain and just want some fanservice and good music. As I mentioned elsewhere, I'm very fearful of what more of the lore they're going to destroy in season 2 given the glimpse of New Vegas in the ending scene, and the paradoxical appearance of House in the meeting with Vault-Tec pre-war.
I know you adore Fo4, I definitely do as well, but while I was waiting for Fo4 to release I played through 3 which was good and Fallout New Vegas. I definitely recommend New Vegas.
I don't think her mother died when she was locked out of the vault I think her father killed her but had already said she was dead to his kids.
The creators have said that what you’re saying is wrong
And what evidence did they put in the show to support that?
Interms of the timeline
A bit more than casual Fallout fan, thought the show rocked.
I think people need to quit worrying about the small details it's a TV show. It's called artistic license.
Sorry, but, you clicked on a 45 minute video called “an angry rant” and didn’t expect it to talk about details?
@@IfThenCreate didn't mean you in particular was talking about people in general, I enjoy your content immensely.
@@IfThenCreate It's also "viewer's license" to notice and mull over any issue you enjoy, as the viewer. And to participate in any issue discussions you like.
👉 I think michael's initial comment falls under the "Stop liking what I don't like!" meme.
Is it weird that I would have liked the show more if I didn't like Fallout?
Overall i enjoyed the show.
I think it was good that i came in with low expectations. It's a tv show and especially a tv show based on a games series so I didn't have high hopes.
However i don't think it's worth only complaining about changes now if you didn't criticise the changes in the games. It's not like the TV show started changing things. Fallout 2 chnaged things from the original as Tim Cain and Chris Avellone have both admitted and they worked on Fallout 2. Tim Cain is the creator of Fallout. He enjoyed the show and he said he didn't agree with everything in the show but still liked it. That's how i feel too as a fan of the games.
I think people are expecting all the answers to be revealed in 1 season. Just be patient and wait for more seasons. It doesn't mean next season will answer everything but it will answer some things. We only had 8 episodes this season so i wouldn't expect everything explained in 8 episodes. It would be like expecting episode 1 to reveal everything.
That's something people advise writers to not do. So things people are asking questions about are things yet to be revealed.
I don't think Vault-Tec is behind everything and I don't think they dropped the bombs first but they wanted to. There is more to the story than that.
Funny because I don't agree with Mr House being there in that scene as i habe played New Vegas but i am not going to throw a fit over it. Also Sinclair looks nothing like Sinclair from the posters in Dead Money. He is the other character from the game New Vegas. He is seen representing Big MT for some reason. But then again a lot of tv shows have characters who look different from the onesel from the original source so it's not fair to single one show out when most shows and movies do it. Some characters have the different eye colours or hair from books for example.
However Bethesda took over Fallout and began their first Fallout with Fallout 3 which made huge changes to the lore. So that's why i do think if people are only going to complain when the show does it then they should have said something when the games themselves were doing it. I am not talking of the old fans as they were the ones who complained.
Fallout: New Vegas got a lot of praise but it took years because i remember it getting hate at first. Now people praise it. Mainly because the people who worked on it had worked on Fallout 1 and 2 or the cancelled Van Buren project. New Vegas had more in common with the old games than Fallout 3 did.
Fallout 4 would also make changes and while it had new factions like minutemen, they didn't feel s fleshed out as the ones in older games and NV.
The tv show did a great job but I don't think it was ever going to be perfect and because the fanbase is so divided, they can never please everyone.
I had things i didn't fully agree with but i liked the show overall. If i spent most of my time lingering onto small things then i wouldn't have been able to enjoy the show. I think those who focus on that only are harming themselves as they're just going to have nothing but complaints.
It was great to have an original story than a retelling of a story from the games. Even if they did do a retelling, people still would complain as we live in a culture of complaining about media. It's impossible to make a show be 100% perfect as a show has a limited run time and has to divide things into episodes which are limited and budget which is limited.
Tim Cain enjoyed the show and i saw him in a stream talk of those who are like "i didn't like this thing so therefore it's all bad" which is an attitude some have. You're never going to enjoy anything if that is how you see things. Good stuff can still have flaws. Fallout 3 and Fallout 4 have their own flaws too. TV show already has a better story than them both. Those games also have questions we never got answered so the show shouldn't be singled out for things the games and other tv shows do themselves.
There's definitely room for improvement and i am looking forward to season 2. If i had not enjoyed the show, i would not be watching it anymore as i don't waste my time watching things i don't like. Same with games and other forms of media.
It’s been confirmed by the writers that the bomb did not fall in 2277.
I mean… if I accidentally wrote a plot hole I’d deny it 😅
@@IfThenCreatehahahahaha very true!!
I... hated this show. The first episode is wonderful. The rest of the show is just bad choice after bad choice. On the subject of ghouls having Deadpool levels of healing; go back to the first fight with Coop in the town. He takes several bullets from the settlers and just shrugs them off. It wasn't called out then but it definitely happened and I was wondering how he was just ignoring the hits.
When I first finished the show, I was mostly satisfied, like I'd say 7.5/10. But the whole show, from the very beginning, the way they depicted ghouls just BUGGED me. And the more I thought about it, the more a lot of little things bugged me lol. At this point I'd give it a 6/10.
Completely agree!! The more I let it simmer the more questions I have 😂
I think Thaddeus being a ghoul is a red herring. Maximus isnt a reliable narrator, and as far as we know, his only actual interaction with ghouls is Cooper. And the brotherhood arent experts on ghouls or care to be beyond "shoot on sight." When i was watching, i thought the medicine was fev or similar. The audience hasnt seen super mutants yet except for a blink and you miss it moment in ep 2. The showrunners even said that there simply wasnt enough time to squeeze decades of lore into 8 episodes. But that theyll eventually come around it certain things later. So they tease if possible instead, like deathclaws.
Anyway, im in the camp of Thaddeus being a mutant.
You believe Maximus, the brotherhood, Thaddeus, and what we as the audience has seen of ghouls having super healing, all of that is unreliable and incorrect? And based on nothing we’ve seen in the show, you believe super mutants will have the same super healing?
The last episode was very disappointing. None of the “answers” made sense. To top it off, it made me rather uninterested in returning for next season. I mean, I am sure I will but it was really one WTF moment after another.