Simon was right. TT got me and my boy into modelling (usual story of having had a train set as a kid). The big decision point was when my father in law got out his father in law's trains. This was tin stuff from the 50s or whatever. So me him and my sone, all had a wonderful few days putting it together. I thought... what else gives four generations pleasure like that? So I sold a load of computer games that had baffling gone up in value and bought about £800 worth of TT. The layout is coming along. Hornby stock problems though!
Some excellent insights from Mr K. You got the best out of him by asking a question & allowing him to answer in an expansive way. He does know - and love - the hobby.
Enjoyable interview - thank you! Simon strikes me as a great guy - he clearly loves the hobby but also understands business realities which are easy to forget when you're an enthusiast. Had the pleasure of speaking with Simon at Gaydon just prior to the TT:120 launch, and he was receptive, intelligent and enthusiastic about the scale, taking the time to have a real conversation with me as a [prospective] customer. It would be super to see some more manufacturers coming on board with TT over the next couple of years, and now Hornby has the support of the retail trade, there's likely to be more "push" on the ground to get it out there. That said, the state of retail generally and model shops in particular would suggest Hornby and Peco still have to drive market development as no retailer is a safe bet anymore. Keep fighting the good fight, Greg! 👍
Thanks Pete. Yes the enthusiasm for the hobby together with the awareness of business realities is something most of us don't really have to worry about - except when businesses struggle and close like Hatton's. And yes, not in my strength, but will seek to do just that! Thanks!
I really enjoyed the interview. Simon understands what makes our hobby tick, and without someone worrying how to make a profit, it wouldn't be a sustainable hobby. He is to be thanked for giving his time here. I hope you can get his views again in the future.
Don't know if your read these comments, Mr K, but if you do I wish you well for the future and look forward to whatever contribution you choose to make to the hobby in the coming years.
Like him or loathe him, he’s an interesting fellow. While at Hornby, he always had time for people, regardless of how busy he was. I miss seeing him at exhibitions but things change, we move on, and that’s that. Personally, I’ve a lot of respect for him.
Sincere best wishes to Simon who was the one sensible and intelligent person who averted a "Royal Scot" rotting disaster! It was a pleasure getting to know him, albeit by 'phone and e-mail. I wish him well in health and future endeavours... 🙂
Nice to see Simon on screen again. Like the comment about going back to improve things on your layout. My layout is 22ft long, DC and I am just rewiring it for the 3rd time in 22 years! Look forward to your book and website Simon. Good luck for the future!
Great to see Simon in good form. Absolutely agree 100% with the concept of showing and encouraging, that’s my mission for High Fell going forwards, 2024 has been well received so far 😁 Great interview technique Greg. The 10th tankers are absolutely very ‘draggy’ I’m chasing down the cure, a new plan is under development! it’s not microns though 🤣
HighFell - really appreciate your positivity - yes, we can all enjoy the hobby - and work away. I look forward to a masterclass on how to sort the 10t tankers!
Poor poor Peachy - never did no one no harm.... Hope you're well - you must be due a new video yourself soon? Looking forward to it. Thanks for watching/commenting. Really appreciate it.
Hattons. Mr Kohler, and Warley...and used prices of stuff for sale going thru the roof...lots of change...Really makes u wonder if the activity wil eventually become the hobby of Kings only. Anyway, good interview...very interesting.
That is certainly the fear. I think that in some ways loads of good models have never been more accessible, through eBay etc, but the brand new stuff with all bells and whistles (literally!) is eye watering. Thanks for watching!
Great interview and Simon was in top form. I do wonder what Richard Davies (Hattons MD and 79% owner) will do next. Perhaps a return to software as this is more profitable than retail and was his original route into Hattons.
I was an employee of Hattons. Speaking from the inside, the whole situation could have been avoided. Richard Davies was putting himself first and not thinking about anyone else (hobby, customers, or staff) he wasn't interested in any ideas on saving the company. I truly hope it is the last we've seen of him. He will only end up ruining someone else's company and making bad business decisions.
@@randygoodall6229 Thanks for popping on and sharing your thoughts. I hope you are able to find another job relatively quickly. May I ask - what do you think was the main reason that he decided to wind the company up? And why buy MB Klein in the USA and close it down so quickly?
@andrewgrave as my understanding is(and i could be wrong, i am going by what other higher-ups have said). MBK was a bad investment, one of many. He closed while he still got some money for himself. Otherwise, he would walk away with nothing. Everything must benefit him in some way. There was a deal with hornby, but which would have saved the company and its people. That much i do know. But it wouldn't have benefited him as hornby already have their own high ups, so he turned it down. allowing the staff to lose their jobs and the company and it's legacy to end. He closed Hattons as it was the only option to benefit him personally in a financial sense
I was an employee of Hattons. Speaking from the inside, the whole situation could have been avoided. Richard Davies was putting himself first and not thinking about anyone else (hobby, customers, or staff) he wasn't interested in any ideas on saving the company. I truly hope it is the last we've seen of him. He will only end up ruining someone else's company and making bad business decisions.
Interesting interview. From my point of view the most frustrating thing about Hornby was that when they released a new locomotive or rolling stock, it was only available in a limited range of eras or liveries, for example the two or three admitted by Simon. Inevitably none of these would match my requirements. Other manufactures (Bachmann/Accurascale/Dapol etc) do this much better, making a wide choice of variants available, so that you can choose which versions suit you best. Simon thinks that they do this to maximize the return on the tooling. In my opinion they do they this because that is exactly what the customers long for. The evidence for this is that Accurascale (for example) sell out quickly on most of their range, despite the long waits for delivery, and I believe that Bachmann would as well if they had more realistic upfront pricing.
I can see both sides here to be honest. For example, I got the Blue 08, when what I really wanted was a green one. And now I'm trying to resist the urge to get the green one...! Thanks for watching.
Always love his openness. I’d buy that book! Not sure I’d agree with the assessment about Hornby fishplates. Getting them on Peco track is a bit of a challenge!
Thanks Damian - didn't;t get much out of him for your question I'm afraid, but thats fair enough - he can't give away all his other projects. Appreciate the comment. Re fishplates - I do find the peace ones more fiddly, but then again my eyes aren't what they once were...!
Some people say the quality has improved is down to him leaving. I doubt if that is 100% correct as am sure it would take a lot longer than the 9 months he has been away for.
Hornby loosing Simon and Montana is a massive mistake. Good business sense had a great direction for Hornby. Hornby will pay for loosing these 2 people. Enjoyable interview Simon was Honest and diplomatic. Good interview 👍
Montana Hoeren was a marketing manager and entirely replaceable, she had very little prototype knowledge. Kohler whether you like him or not has a vast knowledge of the industry and a huge amount of experience.
@@F40Sean And he made terrible decisions and was shown the door for the second and last time. It's more about the fool who re-employed him given the mess he made that crashed Hornby the first time...
A vey interesting interview with Simon... I believe that Hornby have missed a trick when in comes to gauges, instead of introducing TT120 they should have moved into O gauge. There has been over the last few years, a large movement into this larger scale, eg , ACE Trains, ETS etc Many railway modellers are of an ‘older disposition’ and dexterity and failing eyesight can be a problem. Most modellers would love to get their hands on O gauge and when they get their pensions they have means for big locomotives and rolling stock. Hornby have reintroduced their Dublo brand which is a good example of recognising that die cast models are the way to go for the nostalgic older modeller who has always recognised that Hornby Dublo was the best OO system that beat the pants off If I recall correctly, it was as a boy, Simon was introduced to Hornby Dublo.
I think that you are on to something. Yes O does become appealing for many modellers as they get older and have more space at home and perhaps even a little more disposable income. But from what I understand the intent of TT is to attract in new modellers entirely. Only time will tell if this works. Thanks for watching 🎉
Morning - thanks for watching - I'm still learning, but yes time stamps would be a good idea. Will look into it. Thanks again for commenting. Much appreciated.
Shame Hornby didnt continue their partnership with Arnold and release more N and HO scale US locomotives. I model N and the 4 locomotives I have are great runners with lots of detail.
Instead of Play Trains Hornby should have made a wooden railway range with all their brand staples. Smokey Joe, APT, etc. that’s how you get your brand in front of kids eyes.
Great interview. But the Isle of Man has a VAT sharing agreement with the UK so there should be no difference between sending a parcel from Margare to Manchester or the Isle of Man. Nothing has changed between the UK and Isle of Man since before or after Brexit.
The stock saturation is a concern, just running through my HO 2024 supplier price lists I am at 7,230 items of rolling stock ( That's just 6 of the manufacturers). 350 O gauge from one manufacture, 200 from another. Add to this TT120 and you see the issue. Now throw in chaos of a 7 year back-order.
To be fair I have dropped all the manufacturers whose locos wouldn't meet that requirement - I will look at the age of a model and use that to slim down the multitude@@mactrains
I haven’t listened to the whole interview , but the influence Phoenix Asset management has had since holding by far the largest majotity of Hornby shares has been disastrous.
I recall an initial investment that was notifiable back in 2007 , they have ended up with well over 70 per cent of the shares and since being able to pull the strings I would suggest their management changes/impositions have largely been with entirely the wrong types in as much they didn’t get it is a small niche business not running like The much larger companies they all came from. I recall having a conversation with one of the drafted in finance people and shaking my head when we had finished , that selection of management didn’t last too long , just enough to do damage though .
I think that manufacturers forget that a loco is not a train. What goes behind a loco makes a train and if you like trains a loco in isolation is silly. Wagons and coaches should be where money is made because of the amount of them neeeded to make a train. Coaches are often made in batches and then not made again for years. Or at worse never again. TT is a great guage and I have always thought the best but at the moment it is a train set system. You can't madel a theme yet and you may never be able too simply because the investment in the range of say GWR or Southern would be huge and the argument might be that the age group who would model the big four is already extinct. My view also is that DCC has made the hobby to techy. One could argue it always was but it hasn't become less techy and because it is more techy products don't run for as long. There are Hornby Dublo locos that are 70 plus years old still running but I have locos that are less than 10 years old that are no longer running and that is a shame. Super detail v good sustained running. I am fo the latter. I hope the future has model trains in it for a long time.
Interested by his Brexit and Australia comment. From The Guardian in May23 "The move means that from Wednesday tariffs on all UK goods exports to Australia and New Zealand will be removed, access to these markets for services unlocked and red tape slashed". Are model trains treated differently?
I regret that I cannot easily comment on this with any sense of authority! However I would note that Simon left Hornby at the same time as this article - May 23 - and so presumably his comments relate to the situation prior to that - in the "post-Brexit-but-pre-Trade-deal" window. Sorry can't be more helpful - thanks for watching and commenting.
Thank you. But I assume (maybe wrong, please correct me) but GST was around before Brexit. Simon states one of the reasons Hattons closed was Brexit causing increase costs to Australia, but infact Brexit has made it cheaper to sell to Australia. As an aside,I also see GST is 10%, the VAT we pay is 20%.@@jeffmcadam3370
Great Interview overall, diplomatic for sure especially his comments of "flooding the market" Hornby refused to take my money for GWR opens and vans for years until Rapido UK jumped in, I was close to resorting to kits until they were announced.
Once again the cost of shipping is mentioned. There is an easy answer to that and that is (As I have said many times before bring Hornby back home where it should be. Ok, I agree that they would have to train new staff to make locos, coaches and rolling stock. The ladies of Margate will soon pick things up and the advancement in technology means there are more machines available to do more of the work than before the move to China. Ok, there will be a lot of training involved, but you can still use China before the complete move to Margate. Hornby is a British company and that is where it belongs. As for playtrains. We never had cartoon locomotives and rolling stock. We had (And still have. ) models of real trains. Ok, they did not have cab glazing and nothing fell off of them. An S-class southern tank loco number 748. Of which there was only one prototype made. Yes, It was a clockwork engine before someone had the bright idea of fitting an XO3 Electric motor, I now have the original one with me and one that has been modified to run on the Hornby Nickle track. (My Diesel Railcar will not run on modern track because of Secratted power car wheels. Martin. (Thailand)
I'd love to see this done, perhaps just one a small scale (no TT pun intended) to begin with and see how it goes. It's interesting that Peco can manage it, albeit with what I imagine are smaller volumes than Hornby. Maybe thats a question for next time!
TT has been a good success and Hornby and its sister companies Scalextrics, etc produce great models abeit (unfortunately cross the board - Bachmann, etc) very expensive; a big barrier for newbies and existing hobbyists to get into / carry on
I am a little ambivalent when it comes to price. Yes there is lots and lots I cannot afford, or even if I could afford, cannot justify, but then at the same time I think - what other recreational activity is there that is comparable but cheaper? Hard to know! Thanks for watching - greatly appreciated.
I recall him coming into our business on I believe his first day out as a Hammant and Morgan rep . I believe the manufacturers contributed to the downfall of Hattons with both Hornby and Bachmann imposing restrictions on supply to Hattons , add that to the overseas issue and Hattons , who needed volume , lost too much volume , end of story .
I definitely know that look on the special guests face, when the light went off and we all shuddered. No, it wasn’t to save energy. When the landlady calls time, a wise man knows it’s time to sup up. Anyone who ever doubted Simons passion for the hobby, the answer is right there. 💡 In our home we have an agreed term for it. I was in my box again and once that line has been crossed the emotional fallout can be worse than an Accurafail, the spiralling cost of a Bachmann or a Hornby Basher on steroids 😂
I recall TT in the early 60s. My dad bought me my first TT train set and i enjoyed the experience. Trouble was all my friends had OO gauge so I could not play with them train set wise . I believe TT has no future . I hope im proved wrong. You see a driver in every real train yet not in a Hornby train. Time for change?
How much do you think the older retirement age set by government affects the lack of 50, 55, 60... year olds to take up positions of commitment in clubs, societies across all hobbies? I think the whole heritage movement could suffer because of the increased retirement age ...?
Thats a very valid observation and not one I had considered before. Whether we like it or not the trends of society will impact the hobby, as every other area of life. Thanks for the input.
Hi VAT has no relevance in Austrailia They use GST And there import duty on good contaiong electronics has all way been high,also the cost of drop shipping from China to Auz which is the most cost effective way to move goods unless Hornby are shipping to U.K first then back to the Asia which would be maddness for none british goods and none of this has anything todo with Brexit as goods are manufactured in China.
I don't doubt that you know way more of this stuff than I do ken - all this sort of trade arrangements is something I have never looked into to be honest. Thanks for watching and taking the time to comment.
Kohler's tenure at Hornby was marked by terrible treatment of their retailers. If Hornby are still making TT in five years time I'll eat my hat. It will go the way of the OO gauge live steam, and the Steampunk stuff and Playtrains.
If I was your hat, I'd be very nervous Andrew! Thus far the indicators are all positive. Its gotten new folk into the hobby, it sells as much as they can make, and the quality (whilst not perfect) for first generation product, is generally excellent.
@@LNER985 They really were - orders reduced or cancelled, leaving retailers unable to supply their customers, as Hornby want people to buy direct (at higher prices) from their website.
Parents fault init, not the kids, parents set the rules around screens and make the purchasing decisions and decide how much time to sit down and spend with their kids engaging in different activities. Then they go "oh but if it was cheaper all the kids would be into it"... really suspect this is just some parents way of using their kids as leverage to try get lower prices in place for themselves to have more, doubt it would actually result in any more kids being involved just more trains for dad or mum to play with while the pesky brats are absorbed into their screens still. 😅
Glad Simon left Hornby, got too big for his boots, lost all respect for him when he said ""we aren't here to make friends, we are here for business"" also as a Modern Image modeller Simon had no knowledge or interest, he bashed on about the APT.... It was modern 40yrs ago!! he is out of touch.
Perhaps you maybe know Simon more than I do, though I do wonder why watch an hour long interview with him in that case? Anyway - thanks for watching. It does the channel no harm...
Towards the end of his tenure he was arrogant towards the retailer's and the consumers and it was all about money and falling standard's. Since quality has vastly improved
Sorry, if you are a business, you have to take running the business seriously. Any business has to make a profit or it won't stay around. A business like Hornby has to decide where it positions itself. You may not like that decision, but others will (or there will be no profit).
That's exactly the kind of sentiment you want if you're gonna leave your business in someone elses hands... a business here to make friends is a charity. They don't have to make the things you specifically want to succeed in the world. If you try to please everyone you end up rather like one of those restaurants on kitchen nightmares that has 500 menu items rather than focusing on a sort of core focus of things. You end up with a kitchen full of stuff to make a menu most of which people only ever want in once in a blue moon and a business that has no direction and is a mess.
@@davidchilds9590 Towards the end of Simon Kohler's tenure he went out of his way to provoke the retailers. Hattons with the Class 66 by releasing a grossly inferior model. Rails Of Sheffield with the Terrier releasing a competition model fully aware. Ah but Hornby came unstuck using Kohler's approach when the Hornby 'inspired by' Titfield Thunderbolt was halted which was a celebration that Rapido stuck to their guns. Kohler had very public televised disagreements with both Rails Of Sheffield and Hattons in both cases being arrogant to the extreme. Treating retailers with contempt by cancelling deliveries after orders had been placed and making them only available from Hornby at full RRP. Since Kohler has left TT:120 is now available from retailers which what it should have been from the first place. Kohler was more about quantity not quality and the quality since his departure has vastly improved. This may come across as character assassination but Hornby are better since he left.
TT 1:120 - POTENTIAL MADNESS ??? A non standard scale for Britain, which works out at roughly 2.5mm to the foot. When British TT HAS ALWAYS BEEN 1:100 or 3mm to the foot. So none of the equipment produced for British TT3 is interchangeable with this Hornby "squashed" version of supposed TT ! Something I think is a major mistake in Hornby's thinking, and may just come Home to haunt them. Especially as Hornby are in a serious financial pickle (again). Indeed launching a "Non Standard scale" could end up being the final nail in Hornby's coffin !!!
What complete rubbish. TT120 finally gives UK modellers an accurate scale/gauge combination unlike the horrendous combinations of 1/148&9mm, 1/100&12mm, 1/76.2&16.5.mm and 1/43.5 and 32mm that the UK enthusiast has been dumped with for technical reasons that no longer apply. Those who want a proper scale model railway love TT120, or in my case - HO scale - because I couldn't stomach OO and when I made my choice no accurate British outline alternative was available rtr.
I can imagine that for those dedicated to TT3, the launch of TT120 has been deeply frustrating - so close and yet so far! However I think that Hornby launching a new range of out of scale railways where the gauge and scale don't match would have been mocked mercilessly, and a total non-starter with those looking for anything halfway serious. Thanks for watching.
Can't comment on their 66s, but I did get their P-Class, which I think is a tremendous little model. If they felt the retail was struggling I can see why they tried their hand for a few years at production. Certainly not good of the hobby to see them close. Thanks so much for watching!
@georgeconna32 Disagree. What would say about hornby launching its own generic 6 wheeled coaches, launched after and delivered before hattons genesis range which surely would have eroded the number of units hattons could do.
@@xylicable the product announcement date isn't that indicitive of when the idea was floated or action taken to make it. For all we know hornby could have been working on that idea before hattons announced, the quick turn around from announcement to production would suggest it had been in the pipeline for a while. There's also the fact that the idea of a generic old looking coach you can shove multiple liveries on is not at all new, hornby had been doing it already for years with a few carriage toolings. It's easy to make up a narrative around something when the facts of the matter are lacking, hattons certainly did a good job of drumming up the sympathy for their business(maybe with the help of some favourable people in the press around the hobby influencing opinions) End of the day neither hornby nor hattons are your mates, both are businesses, both want your money in exchange for models. That's their one purpose for being.
I was an employee of Hattons. Speaking from the inside, the whole situation could have been avoided. Richard Davies was putting himself first and not thinking about anyone else (hobby, customers, or staff) he wasn't interested in any ideas on saving the company. I truly hope it is the last we've seen of him. He will only end up ruining someone else's company and making bad business decisions.
@@randygoodall6229 I was wondering if the purchase of the American business was some kind of way for someone to gain a visa to move over there, it's about the only logical reason I can see for having done so if it was known privately ahead of time that the intention was the shut the british business but who knows.
Great interview and fair play to you Greg for continuing to entice Simon in for a chat! Keep up the good work 🙂
Simon is most affable, and doesn't require much enticing! Thanks for watching and commenting. Appreciate it.
Simon was right. TT got me and my boy into modelling (usual story of having had a train set as a kid).
The big decision point was when my father in law got out his father in law's trains. This was tin stuff from the 50s or whatever. So me him and my sone, all had a wonderful few days putting it together.
I thought... what else gives four generations pleasure like that? So I sold a load of computer games that had baffling gone up in value and bought about £800 worth of TT. The layout is coming along. Hornby stock problems though!
Thats a great story personal story! Exactly the sort of thing that there hobby is always meant to be about. Thanks for watching!
Some excellent insights from Mr K. You got the best out of him by asking a question & allowing him to answer in an expansive way.
He does know - and love - the hobby.
Well said!
Enjoyable interview - thank you!
Simon strikes me as a great guy - he clearly loves the hobby but also understands business realities which are easy to forget when you're an enthusiast.
Had the pleasure of speaking with Simon at Gaydon just prior to the TT:120 launch, and he was receptive, intelligent and enthusiastic about the scale, taking the time to have a real conversation with me as a [prospective] customer.
It would be super to see some more manufacturers coming on board with TT over the next couple of years, and now Hornby has the support of the retail trade, there's likely to be more "push" on the ground to get it out there. That said, the state of retail generally and model shops in particular would suggest Hornby and Peco still have to drive market development as no retailer is a safe bet anymore.
Keep fighting the good fight, Greg! 👍
Thanks Pete. Yes the enthusiasm for the hobby together with the awareness of business realities is something most of us don't really have to worry about - except when businesses struggle and close like Hatton's.
And yes, not in my strength, but will seek to do just that! Thanks!
I really enjoyed the interview. Simon understands what makes our hobby tick, and without someone worrying how to make a profit, it wouldn't be a sustainable hobby. He is to be thanked for giving his time here. I hope you can get his views again in the future.
Thanks Richard - he has been very generous with his time, and I do hope to get him back again sometime.
Don't know if your read these comments, Mr K, but if you do I wish you well for the future and look forward to whatever contribution you choose to make to the hobby in the coming years.
It has been known for Simon to cast a glance at them - thanks for the positive tone - much appreciated!
Like him or loathe him, he’s an interesting fellow. While at Hornby, he always had time for people, regardless of how busy he was. I miss seeing him at exhibitions but things change, we move on, and that’s that. Personally, I’ve a lot of respect for him.
I think this is indeed a real strength for Simon - that readiness to engage. It's vital in a hobby like this one. Thanks for the comment.
Great interview. Thanks for organising it with Simon. I'm sure a great many would have enjoyed this.
Glad you enjoyed it, and thanks for taking the time to comment - and reply to other comments too ; ) !!
Sincere best wishes to Simon who was the one sensible and intelligent person who averted a "Royal Scot" rotting disaster! It was a pleasure getting to know him, albeit by 'phone and e-mail. I wish him well in health and future endeavours... 🙂
His enthusiasm is very infectious - I can see why him getting on board for the Royal Scot would have helped tremendously. Thanks for watching!
Thanks for doing this interview. I enjoyed it and respect to Simon to taking part.
Simon has been a very good sport, and his willingness to engage is exemplary.
We’ll done for an excellent interview, also nice to see Simon being open and happy to chat.
Thanks John - appreciate the comment
Nice to see Simon on screen again. Like the comment about going back to improve things on your layout.
My layout is 22ft long, DC and I am just rewiring it for the 3rd time in 22 years!
Look forward to your book and website Simon.
Good luck for the future!
Thanks for the encouragement. We look forward to reading the book when it’s out!
@@mactrainsI enjoy watching your videos!
Great interview, Simon always good value.
Thanks drevo - I'm stick a little abashed that he was willing to be interviewed on a tiny UA-cam channel.
Great to see Simon in good form. Absolutely agree 100% with the concept of showing and encouraging, that’s my mission for High Fell going forwards, 2024 has been well received so far 😁 Great interview technique Greg. The 10th tankers are absolutely very ‘draggy’ I’m chasing down the cure, a new plan is under development! it’s not microns though 🤣
HighFell - really appreciate your positivity - yes, we can all enjoy the hobby - and work away. I look forward to a masterclass on how to sort the 10t tankers!
Without seeing Simon's brainchild of TT 120 on the TV series, I would never have got into the hobby. I and others have a great deal to thank him for.
In that case, "Welcome aboard" Trevor. The more the merrier. Thanks for watching and commenting.
Brilliant interview thoroughly enjoyed 👍
Thanks for listening
Looks like I need to buy the book then? 😂 Cracking interview, looking forward to the next one.
Poor poor Peachy - never did no one no harm.... Hope you're well - you must be due a new video yourself soon? Looking forward to it. Thanks for watching/commenting. Really appreciate it.
@@mactrains just waiting for the TTA wagons to arrive via DPD!!!!
You MUST buy the book, you bought everything else! 🤣
@@HighFell 😱
Fascinating interview. Thanks.
Glad you enjoyed it!
Great to hear from Simon, I was eager to have his opinions on the hobby.
Thank you Samar for watching and taking the time to comment.
Hattons. Mr Kohler, and Warley...and used prices of stuff for sale going thru the roof...lots of change...Really makes u wonder if the activity wil eventually become the hobby of Kings only. Anyway, good interview...very interesting.
That is certainly the fear. I think that in some ways loads of good models have never been more accessible, through eBay etc, but the brand new stuff with all bells and whistles (literally!) is eye watering. Thanks for watching!
Simon and Montana should do a weekly tv show on model railways/ scale modelling. It would be a massive hit.
Now there's a thought!
Great interview and Simon was in top form. I do wonder what Richard Davies (Hattons MD and 79% owner) will do next. Perhaps a return to software as this is more profitable than retail and was his original route into Hattons.
Yes, I was encouraged to think that Richard Davies may re-emerge with new and exciting ideas. That would be a boost for the hobby I hope.
I was an employee of Hattons. Speaking from the inside, the whole situation could have been avoided. Richard Davies was putting himself first and not thinking about anyone else (hobby, customers, or staff) he wasn't interested in any ideas on saving the company. I truly hope it is the last we've seen of him. He will only end up ruining someone else's company and making bad business decisions.
@@mactrains I doubt he will get involved in the hobby or else he might have retained some of Hattons' assets.
@@randygoodall6229 Thanks for popping on and sharing your thoughts. I hope you are able to find another job relatively quickly. May I ask - what do you think was the main reason that he decided to wind the company up? And why buy MB Klein in the USA and close it down so quickly?
@andrewgrave as my understanding is(and i could be wrong, i am going by what other higher-ups have said). MBK was a bad investment, one of many. He closed while he still got some money for himself. Otherwise, he would walk away with nothing. Everything must benefit him in some way. There was a deal with hornby, but which would have saved the company and its people. That much i do know. But it wouldn't have benefited him as hornby already have their own high ups, so he turned it down. allowing the staff to lose their jobs and the company and it's legacy to end. He closed Hattons as it was the only option to benefit him personally in a financial sense
I was an employee of Hattons. Speaking from the inside, the whole situation could have been avoided. Richard Davies was putting himself first and not thinking about anyone else (hobby, customers, or staff) he wasn't interested in any ideas on saving the company. I truly hope it is the last we've seen of him. He will only end up ruining someone else's company and making bad business decisions.
Thats not so good. I confess I know nothing about the inside operations of these businesses so cannot really comment with any intelligence.
Interesting interview. From my point of view the most frustrating thing about Hornby was that when they released a new locomotive or rolling stock, it was only available in a limited range of eras or liveries, for example the two or three admitted by Simon. Inevitably none of these would match my requirements. Other manufactures (Bachmann/Accurascale/Dapol etc) do this much better, making a wide choice of variants available, so that you can choose which versions suit you best. Simon thinks that they do this to maximize the return on the tooling. In my opinion they do they this because that is exactly what the customers long for. The evidence for this is that Accurascale (for example) sell out quickly on most of their range, despite the long waits for delivery, and I believe that Bachmann would as well if they had more realistic upfront pricing.
I can see both sides here to be honest. For example, I got the Blue 08, when what I really wanted was a green one. And now I'm trying to resist the urge to get the green one...! Thanks for watching.
Always love his openness. I’d buy that book! Not sure I’d agree with the assessment about Hornby fishplates. Getting them on Peco track is a bit of a challenge!
Thanks Damian - didn't;t get much out of him for your question I'm afraid, but thats fair enough - he can't give away all his other projects. Appreciate the comment. Re fishplates - I do find the peace ones more fiddly, but then again my eyes aren't what they once were...!
We've wanted that scale all my life , back in 71 it was wanted. It was always going to take off. Accessory companies are making scenery items now.
It's good to see the accessories coming on stream.
Some people say the quality has improved is down to him leaving. I doubt if that is 100% correct as am sure it would take a lot longer than the 9 months he has been away for.
I'd agree - Simon was not the designer, nor the Quality control guy. He was the ideas and marketing man.
Not interested in model railways, but like to listen to Simon Kohler.
He's a very experienced guy - glad you found it worth listening to! Thanks for the comment.
Hornby loosing Simon and Montana is a massive mistake.
Good business sense had a great direction for Hornby.
Hornby will pay for loosing these 2 people.
Enjoyable interview Simon was Honest and diplomatic.
Good interview 👍
Changes happen all the time in business, but I too was surprised. Maybe one day we will find out more. Thanks for watching!
Simon crashed Hornby before, and nearly did it a second time, Montana was just middle management and no interest in product.
Montana Hoeren was a marketing manager and entirely replaceable, she had very little prototype knowledge. Kohler whether you like him or not has a vast knowledge of the industry and a huge amount of experience.
@@F40Sean And he made terrible decisions and was shown the door for the second and last time. It's more about the fool who re-employed him given the mess he made that crashed Hornby the first time...
A vey interesting interview with Simon...
I believe that Hornby have missed a trick when in comes to gauges, instead of introducing TT120 they should have moved into O gauge.
There has been over the last few years, a large movement into this larger scale, eg , ACE Trains, ETS etc
Many railway modellers are of an ‘older disposition’ and dexterity and failing eyesight can be a problem. Most modellers would love to get their hands on O gauge and when they get their pensions they have means for big locomotives and rolling stock.
Hornby have reintroduced their Dublo brand which is a good example of recognising that die cast models are the way to go for the nostalgic older modeller who has always recognised that Hornby Dublo was the best OO system that beat the pants off
If I recall correctly, it was as a boy, Simon was introduced to Hornby Dublo.
I think that you are on to something. Yes O does become appealing for many modellers as they get older and have more space at home and perhaps even a little more disposable income. But from what I understand the intent of TT is to attract in new modellers entirely. Only time will tell if this works. Thanks for watching 🎉
Great interview, Could you add time stamps? trying to find the heljin part of your chat is a bit of a challenge.
Morning - thanks for watching - I'm still learning, but yes time stamps would be a good idea. Will look into it. Thanks again for commenting. Much appreciated.
Shame Hornby didnt continue their partnership with Arnold and release more N and HO scale US locomotives. I model N and the 4 locomotives I have are great runners with lots of detail.
They still are partnered with Arnold I think, but as for N and HO - thats not my field at all I'm afraid.
I dearly would love to model Era-1, while I can make many things, engines and rolling stock are to difficult.
You and me both! But 3d printing is making ham-fisted chaps like myself dream the impossible!
I've just completed the prototype of my Liverpool and Manchester Railway "Cattle Wagon", as per the Ackermann prints. You may see it in my Shorts.
great to here simon super interview
Many thanks kitchen ham - appreciate viewers and those who take the time to comment something kindly!
Instead of Play Trains Hornby should have made a wooden railway range with all their brand staples. Smokey Joe, APT, etc. that’s how you get your brand in front of kids eyes.
Thats a very interesting idea. Certainly worth watching whatever they do next in the kids space.
Great interview with Simon kohler.
Thanks Ali - Simon makes it easy - just prompt him once or twice and leave him to it!
@@mactrains I've alway got on with sk and his always been honest with me
Keep safe ARP
Great interview. But the Isle of Man has a VAT sharing agreement with the UK so there should be no difference between sending a parcel from Margare to Manchester or the Isle of Man. Nothing has changed between the UK and Isle of Man since before or after Brexit.
Thanks! Thats not an area I know anything about - worth asking Hornby now if they have any issues maybe?
The stock saturation is a concern, just running through my HO 2024 supplier price lists I am at 7,230 items of rolling stock ( That's just 6 of the manufacturers). 350 O gauge from one manufacture, 200 from another. Add to this TT120 and you see the issue. Now throw in chaos of a 7 year back-order.
A few excellent locos will always trump a whole heap of shoddy ones. Smooth silky running that neither stalls nor derails - thats the aim for me.
To be fair I have dropped all the manufacturers whose locos wouldn't meet that requirement - I will look at the age of a model and use that to slim down the multitude@@mactrains
I just want a few 060 gwr locos
An 0-6-0 steamer would be great. Hopefully soon!
I haven’t listened to the whole interview , but the influence Phoenix Asset management has had since holding by far the largest majotity of Hornby shares has been disastrous.
Thats an area out of my ken I confess. How long have they been involved?
I recall an initial investment that was notifiable back in 2007 , they have ended up with well over 70 per cent of the shares and since being able to pull the strings I would suggest their management changes/impositions have largely been with entirely the wrong types in as much they didn’t get it is a small niche business not running like The much larger companies they all came from.
I recall having a conversation with one of the drafted in finance people and shaking my head when we had finished , that selection of management didn’t last too long , just enough to do damage though .
I think that manufacturers forget that a loco is not a train. What goes behind a loco makes a train and if you like trains a loco in isolation is silly. Wagons and coaches should be where money is made because of the amount of them neeeded to make a train. Coaches are often made in batches and then not made again for years. Or at worse never again. TT is a great guage and I have always thought the best but at the moment it is a train set system. You can't madel a theme yet and you may never be able too simply because the investment in the range of say GWR or Southern would be huge and the argument might be that the age group who would model the big four is already extinct. My view also is that DCC has made the hobby to techy. One could argue it always was but it hasn't become less techy and because it is more techy products don't run for as long. There are Hornby Dublo locos that are 70 plus years old still running but I have locos that are less than 10 years old that are no longer running and that is a shame. Super detail v good sustained running. I am fo the latter. I hope the future has model trains in it for a long time.
Thats plus one from me - I'ds take silky smooth running over hyper detail all day long.
Interested by his Brexit and Australia comment. From The Guardian in May23 "The move means that from Wednesday tariffs on all UK goods exports to Australia and New Zealand will be removed, access to these markets for services unlocked and red tape slashed". Are model trains treated differently?
I regret that I cannot easily comment on this with any sense of authority! However I would note that Simon left Hornby at the same time as this article - May 23 - and so presumably his comments relate to the situation prior to that - in the "post-Brexit-but-pre-Trade-deal" window. Sorry can't be more helpful - thanks for watching and commenting.
Many thanks for the reply. Certainly explains his knowledge@@mactrains
Tariffs are removed but GST in Australia still applies
Thank you. But I assume (maybe wrong, please correct me) but GST was around before Brexit. Simon states one of the reasons Hattons closed was Brexit causing increase costs to Australia, but infact Brexit has made it cheaper to sell to Australia. As an aside,I also see GST is 10%, the VAT we pay is 20%.@@jeffmcadam3370
Great Interview overall, diplomatic for sure especially his comments of "flooding the market" Hornby refused to take my money for GWR opens and vans for years until Rapido UK jumped in, I was close to resorting to kits until they were announced.
I think Simon has had plenty of practice in honing his own brand of diplomacy. Thanks for watching!
Once again the cost of shipping is mentioned. There is an easy answer to that and that is (As I have said many times before bring Hornby back home where it should be. Ok, I agree that they would have to train new staff to make locos, coaches and rolling stock. The ladies of Margate will soon pick things up and the advancement in technology means there are more machines available to do more of the work than before the move to China. Ok, there will be a lot of training involved, but you can still use China before the complete move to Margate. Hornby is a British company and that is where it belongs. As for playtrains. We never had cartoon locomotives and rolling stock. We had (And still have. ) models of real trains. Ok, they did not have cab glazing and nothing fell off of them. An S-class southern tank loco number 748. Of which there was only one prototype made. Yes, It was a clockwork engine before someone had the bright idea of fitting an XO3 Electric motor, I now have the original one with me and one that has been modified to run on the Hornby Nickle track. (My Diesel Railcar will not run on modern track because of Secratted power car wheels. Martin. (Thailand)
I'd love to see this done, perhaps just one a small scale (no TT pun intended) to begin with and see how it goes. It's interesting that Peco can manage it, albeit with what I imagine are smaller volumes than Hornby. Maybe thats a question for next time!
I really like TT120.
No argument from me - thanks for watching!
TT has been a good success and Hornby and its sister companies Scalextrics, etc produce great models abeit (unfortunately cross the board - Bachmann, etc) very expensive; a big barrier for newbies and existing hobbyists to get into / carry on
I am a little ambivalent when it comes to price. Yes there is lots and lots I cannot afford, or even if I could afford, cannot justify, but then at the same time I think - what other recreational activity is there that is comparable but cheaper? Hard to know! Thanks for watching - greatly appreciated.
I recall him coming into our business on I believe his first day out as a Hammant and Morgan rep .
I believe the manufacturers contributed to the downfall of Hattons with both Hornby and Bachmann imposing restrictions on supply to Hattons , add that to the overseas issue and Hattons , who needed volume , lost too much volume , end of story .
Thats a good memory! It's interesting that he clearly still has a very high opinion of both Hatton's and its boss.
I definitely know that look on the special guests face, when the light went off and we all shuddered. No, it wasn’t to save energy. When the landlady calls time, a wise man knows it’s time to sup up. Anyone who ever doubted Simons passion for the hobby, the answer is right there. 💡 In our home we have an agreed term for it. I was in my box again and once that line has been crossed the emotional fallout can be worse than an Accurafail, the spiralling cost of a Bachmann or a Hornby Basher on steroids 😂
That sounds like the pained voice of experience there! lol!
You know what they say, takes one Mac to know another
Lol Accurafail...my Dektic exactly that.
Have you an ebay link?
Thanks postman - presently I don't have any coal loads or uncouplers printed - what is it you're looking for?
@@mactrains was interested in both
Thanks postman - you can use the email associated with this UA-cam account and we can get it sorted - gmactrains@gmail.com
I recall TT in the early 60s. My dad bought me my first TT train set and i enjoyed the experience. Trouble was all my friends had OO gauge so I could not play with them train set wise . I believe TT has no future . I hope im proved wrong. You see a driver in every real train yet not in a Hornby train. Time for change?
I do like to see a driver added - for me it's an easier and more noticeable piece of detail than much of the underside bits and bobs. Thanks.
How much do you think the older retirement age set by government affects the lack of 50, 55, 60... year olds to take up positions of commitment in clubs, societies across all hobbies? I think the whole heritage movement could suffer because of the increased retirement age ...?
Thats a very valid observation and not one I had considered before. Whether we like it or not the trends of society will impact the hobby, as every other area of life. Thanks for the input.
You learn from making mistakes but there is a better one by somebody else's mistakes. By watching UA-cam.
Had a good laugh at this - thanks Steven
Interesting interview, but I wonder how much SK actually contributed to decreasing revenue at hattons and then the eventual closure?
Thanks for watching! The answer tot hat question is not one I have any inside info on I confess - above my pay grade - and Simon's too I suspect...
Hi VAT has no relevance in Austrailia They use GST And there import duty on good contaiong electronics has all way been high,also the cost of drop shipping from China to Auz which is the most cost effective way to move goods unless Hornby are shipping to U.K first then back to the Asia which would be maddness for none british goods and none of this has anything todo with Brexit as goods are manufactured in China.
I don't doubt that you know way more of this stuff than I do ken - all this sort of trade arrangements is something I have never looked into to be honest. Thanks for watching and taking the time to comment.
Kohler's tenure at Hornby was marked by terrible treatment of their retailers.
If Hornby are still making TT in five years time I'll eat my hat. It will go the way of the OO gauge live steam, and the Steampunk stuff and Playtrains.
If I was your hat, I'd be very nervous Andrew! Thus far the indicators are all positive. Its gotten new folk into the hobby, it sells as much as they can make, and the quality (whilst not perfect) for first generation product, is generally excellent.
Retailers weren't treated terribly by Hornby.
@@LNER985 They really were - orders reduced or cancelled, leaving retailers unable to supply their customers, as Hornby want people to buy direct (at higher prices) from their website.
Eggs benedict for breakfast?!
Ah but what makes you think it was breakfast time...?
Kids only want to play computer games, very few want to use their hands to make anything! It's very sad! We are loosing skills!
Parents fault init, not the kids, parents set the rules around screens and make the purchasing decisions and decide how much time to sit down and spend with their kids engaging in different activities.
Then they go "oh but if it was cheaper all the kids would be into it"... really suspect this is just some parents way of using their kids as leverage to try get lower prices in place for themselves to have more, doubt it would actually result in any more kids being involved just more trains for dad or mum to play with while the pesky brats are absorbed into their screens still. 😅
I think kids do enjoy modelling - but it's about giving them the opportunity to try it so often.
Glad Simon left Hornby, got too big for his boots, lost all respect for him when he said ""we aren't here to make friends, we are here for business"" also as a Modern Image modeller Simon had no knowledge or interest, he bashed on about the APT.... It was modern 40yrs ago!! he is out of touch.
Perhaps you maybe know Simon more than I do, though I do wonder why watch an hour long interview with him in that case? Anyway - thanks for watching. It does the channel no harm...
Towards the end of his tenure he was arrogant towards the retailer's and the consumers and it was all about money and falling standard's. Since quality has vastly improved
Sorry, if you are a business, you have to take running the business seriously. Any business has to make a profit or it won't stay around. A business like Hornby has to decide where it positions itself. You may not like that decision, but others will (or there will be no profit).
That's exactly the kind of sentiment you want if you're gonna leave your business in someone elses hands... a business here to make friends is a charity.
They don't have to make the things you specifically want to succeed in the world. If you try to please everyone you end up rather like one of those restaurants on kitchen nightmares that has 500 menu items rather than focusing on a sort of core focus of things. You end up with a kitchen full of stuff to make a menu most of which people only ever want in once in a blue moon and a business that has no direction and is a mess.
@@davidchilds9590 Towards the end of Simon Kohler's tenure he went out of his way to provoke the retailers. Hattons with the Class 66 by releasing a grossly inferior model. Rails Of Sheffield with the Terrier releasing a competition model fully aware. Ah but Hornby came unstuck using Kohler's approach when the Hornby 'inspired by' Titfield Thunderbolt was halted which was a celebration that Rapido stuck to their guns. Kohler had very public televised disagreements with both Rails Of Sheffield and Hattons in both cases being arrogant to the extreme. Treating retailers with contempt by cancelling deliveries after orders had been placed and making them only available from Hornby at full RRP. Since Kohler has left TT:120 is now available from retailers which what it should have been from the first place. Kohler was more about quantity not quality and the quality since his departure has vastly improved. This may come across as character assassination but Hornby are better since he left.
TT 1:120 - POTENTIAL MADNESS ???
A non standard scale for Britain, which works out at roughly 2.5mm to the foot. When British TT HAS ALWAYS BEEN 1:100 or 3mm to the foot. So none of the equipment produced for British TT3 is interchangeable with this Hornby "squashed" version of supposed TT ! Something I think is a major mistake in Hornby's thinking, and may just come Home to haunt them. Especially as Hornby are in a serious financial pickle (again). Indeed launching a "Non Standard scale" could end up being the final nail in Hornby's coffin !!!
What complete rubbish. TT120 finally gives UK modellers an accurate scale/gauge combination unlike the horrendous combinations of 1/148&9mm, 1/100&12mm, 1/76.2&16.5.mm and 1/43.5 and 32mm that the UK enthusiast has been dumped with for technical reasons that no longer apply. Those who want a proper scale model railway love TT120, or in my case - HO scale - because I couldn't stomach OO and when I made my choice no accurate British outline alternative was available rtr.
I can imagine that for those dedicated to TT3, the launch of TT120 has been deeply frustrating - so close and yet so far! However I think that Hornby launching a new range of out of scale railways where the gauge and scale don't match would have been mocked mercilessly, and a total non-starter with those looking for anything halfway serious. Thanks for watching.
Hatton git greedy. Class 66 and the o gauge locos were poor. Should of stuck to selling stuff. Leave making stuff to the right people.
Can't comment on their 66s, but I did get their P-Class, which I think is a tremendous little model. If they felt the retail was struggling I can see why they tried their hand for a few years at production. Certainly not good of the hobby to see them close. Thanks so much for watching!
@georgeconna32 Disagree. What would say about hornby launching its own generic 6 wheeled coaches, launched after and delivered before hattons genesis range which surely would have eroded the number of units hattons could do.
@@xylicable the product announcement date isn't that indicitive of when the idea was floated or action taken to make it. For all we know hornby could have been working on that idea before hattons announced, the quick turn around from announcement to production would suggest it had been in the pipeline for a while.
There's also the fact that the idea of a generic old looking coach you can shove multiple liveries on is not at all new, hornby had been doing it already for years with a few carriage toolings.
It's easy to make up a narrative around something when the facts of the matter are lacking, hattons certainly did a good job of drumming up the sympathy for their business(maybe with the help of some favourable people in the press around the hobby influencing opinions)
End of the day neither hornby nor hattons are your mates, both are businesses, both want your money in exchange for models. That's their one purpose for being.
I was an employee of Hattons. Speaking from the inside, the whole situation could have been avoided. Richard Davies was putting himself first and not thinking about anyone else (hobby, customers, or staff) he wasn't interested in any ideas on saving the company. I truly hope it is the last we've seen of him. He will only end up ruining someone else's company and making bad business decisions.
@@randygoodall6229 I was wondering if the purchase of the American business was some kind of way for someone to gain a visa to move over there, it's about the only logical reason I can see for having done so if it was known privately ahead of time that the intention was the shut the british business but who knows.
Simon is as boring during this interview as he was in the TV series. A minute of watching this and I'm switching off. Lol. Snore bore Simon as always
Hi Mark - can't please all the people all the time. Feel free to skip ahead and past it next time.