Postmil, Theonomy, Baptists, and the Moscow Mojo | Doug Wilson, Joe Rigney, & Jared Longshore
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- Опубліковано 31 жов 2023
- Welcome to the first episode of Doug Wilson & Friends. This week Doug Wilson, Joe Rigney, and Jared Longshore are talking postmillennialism, theonomy, baptists, and the Moscow mojo.
Doug Wilson and Friends is presented by Canon Press.
I’ve experienced heavy “beware of Moscow” pressure. One reason “Moscow mojo” is growing is: when our trusted and respected elders say “just trust me, watch out for those guys” we note the warning in good faith, but like Bereans we seek to see if these things are so. Once things start to not add up, we go back and push a little on the issue. The trusted elders crack, trust is broken, and it would have been better for them if they had never issued the warning in the first place.
So right! Exactly how I’ve experienced it.
I've seen people leave churches because their pastor has a handful of Canon press books that he reads affirmingly & happily. Can't have that!
Many such cases, unfortunately.
Ours refuse the usage of anything from Canon solely because DW won't recant his federal vision and view on justification. 😢
And it's a PCA Church
I’m 71 years old .. one main thing on my bucket list is to visit Moscow and meet Doug in person…..
Come see us!
Checked that off the bucket list this past August. Nothing like those who oppose our Moscow brothas have painted. Enjoyed the Logos High school football game with one of the members, also a Saturday morning rugby game with brotha Toby, lunch with brotha Gabe, and 2 recordings at the Cross Politics studios with Choc Knox, Neil and the rest of them. Had lunch with two of the elders of Kings Cross after the 10 am corporate Sunday morning worship service at pastor Doug’s church where I was able to get a picture with him. Very down to earth brotha in Christ just a normal man who loves God and more importantly lives it. And NSA is where I’ll be sending my daughter to after she graduates from our Academy here on island within the next 5 years. And we’re not Presbyterian nor are we post mil. But, still brothas in the Lord who love and live for our King because the body is One as He is. Amen thank you God for Moscow, Idaho 🤙🏾🙏🏾🇦🇸
Word of warning. I met Doug in the world and was so excited I rambled like a fool and he never got to really speak. He was very kind.
Plenty of us Baptists are watching and not one iota worried about y'all, and on the same team. Even pre-mil baptists...
@@RecalledtoLifeassuming we serve the same King - Jesus, even if you disagree on this point or that, it’s your loss.
@@RecalledtoLife go read my initial comment, slowly. I didn’t say “Doug’s team” - I just believe we are both on the same team. To imply otherwise is to imply that you do not believe that they believe the same Gospel.
@MetroplexAerials 100% agree!
@@RecalledtoLife
Hardened hearts make for soft men
@@RecalledtoLife
Dude relax 😂 stop being the word police, I think we all get what he means by "team".
If it helps you calm down "we are all part of the one body...."
See all better now eh...
Historic Premillennial, Pentecostal pastor here. I love NQN! Keep it coming!
That's great. If you would only abandon your Pentecostalism.🫣
Do you have any friends in your own denominational circles?! (I say that with a smile and a laugh)
@@theol64Ha, well I don’t think we will see eye to eye on cessationism. But I will throw out there that Pentecostalism is actually a pretty broad camp, with numerous different types of Pentecostals. A lot of the problems and heresy that you have probably seen also bother me. Many Pentecostals are nothing like Benny Hinn and Kenneth Copeland
@FortressRefuge
I can accept that! Thanks! Glad you like NQN.
Please get Joe in on more videos and other publications from Canon. I really enjoy Joe and his work. I'm also thankful for Jared's admonishment not to worry too much about being a card-carrying Moscow Man, as someone who is preparing to enter a seminary and plans to contend for his convictions, but is wondering how to go about associating ideas with individuals when people can indeed be concerned more with the individuals in a movement than the ideas it is centered on.
Another encouraging word from Jared later on as well. Look to God for truth, and understand that truth will not always win you friends. This was very encouraging to me.
It’s so sad to me when people are so caught up in the “whos” and not what’s being said. The response looks more like being triggered than a tempered and wise response to something concerning. May God give us hearts of flesh and make us receptive to truth🙏🏾
Ditto to all of that!
Postmil, covenantal, GE Theonomic, and Baptist (1689 LBC). Love you brothers and I look up to you all.
I just found out Joe Rigney resigned from Piper’s Seminary & College. Congratulations, Joe! I have criticized you for being a part of Piper’s organization; now? I love you, brother. Wish I had known months ago.
Love Doug Wilson & Friends!!! Thank you so much!!! Oh this month is going to be just GLORIOUS!!! 🔥🔥🔥🔥❤❤❤❤
Amen Sister Susan
May YHWH Bless n Keep You n {HIS} Your's!!-)
Please make a video clip of the part where Jared says while Presbyterians were busy writing books on CN, the Baptists snuck in their "Christian Prince". So good!
Where is and or who is the Standard Bearer? That's my question
I have no idea who that is… 😬
For some reason, volume is low and no options for closed captions. Please work on options for hard of hearing folks. TY. You all are doing good work.
Joe, thanks for asking these clarifying questions. Love this kind of auxillary thing.
Last year's burn video has been your best by far!
It’s not that Postmill believe that the Kingdom comes through the government, it’s that the secular humanists believe the state is their kingdom, so that is why we spend so much time discussing the sins of the current government and replacing it with something 1,000 times smaller.
It doesn't seem fair to argue that theonomy would make the government smaller. It just changes its shape.
@@daltonbrasier5491 The real key is understanding that the state is a target not the weapon. I Christian society eventually has an impact on all of culture including the state. The state is not the driver.
i'm a post mill presbyterian and agree with you guys!
Cheers!
Is there any way to bump up the volume on your end? I've got everything turned all the way up, and I'm straining to hear. 🙂
Same here. Seemed it was mostly a problem w/Pastor Doug's microphone. Hopefully they can edit the video and increase volume. Great video!
I second this! Hard to hear.
I’m kinda Reformed Baptipresby lol, meaning I’m not sure where to stand in regards to infant baptism but everything else sounds right, ie. post-mill, Calvinism, etc. But I’m 1,000% on board with everything y’all do. And this year’s NQN is gonna be lit 🔥😎
Learn more about covenant theology, it will help with the baptism question. David Chilton has a 2part talk on youtube, it's my go to resource.
That's for the tip I'll look that up
read Balthasar Hubmaier. That'll get you straightened out.
See I'm on board with the post-mil, about 95% there on paedo-baptism/communion but the ULI in the middle is the hang up for me, ha ha.
I think presby baptism is wrong but I respect the reasoning. Its not some baseless or ignorant tradition, it has merit.
love it!
Former protestant, current Catholic here. Just wanted to say that I'm really enjoying your discussion. This is a very important topic that Christians need to discuss today.
"By their fruits you will know them". This is so very important, and if more Christians wake up we can win so big and restore so much, defeat so much of this evil that has taken over. It will be literally glorious. We who see the truth and have woken up are the minority in most of our denominations but I pray not for long. We are growing fast. This is more important than denominational differences, that's why "by their fruits you shall know them" must be our mantra. We have more in common than many in our own denominations and that's what is important. I'm not Catholic, but you are indeed a brother.
@@JCK712By Christ.
Yes! Can’t wait till the next one
Thanks for watching!
Just a point to clarify, in the PCA Officers state or declare their 'differences' with the standards which may come up in an examination and the Session/Presbytery will find if you have 'exceptions' to the standards during that examination.
"We think these things matter....." What a dynamic truth Joe Rigney pointed out. Joe is also an amazing bridge between the RBs and RPs.... truly God's work (lol).
Is this on/going to be on spotify?
Trying to get my head around Postmill-thoughts after many years of historic millenialism...
watch the documentary On Earth As It Is In Heaven!
@@kylej.d. That is an excellent documentary!
This is like a new Reformation.
Semper Reformanda
Reconstructionist here,
I insist that Christ's hegemony is solely through evangelism and education, not by force or coercion.
Through evangelism and education, we hope that the people of the world will gradually become Christianized as people believe in Christ and willingly submit to love.
At this point, they will engage the politics.
Never said that evangelism through politics.
Correct. And most of these "Reconstructionists" are statists, showing that for all the good they see, they're missing the mark entirely in the end. Rothbard was right, that Rushdoony just can't be trusted.
I thought the free books were free for a week... but I went to get Covenant Household today and it's not free anymore.
But also, last year, I thought we went to the Canon shop to get them. The link on the website took me to amazon.
Free for 5 days -- It went from Wednesday to Sunday.
Go Canon Press! support from Australia
Balanced. Helpful. Energizing. Onward Christian soldiers….
Im definitely a deep water Presbyterian, in the sbc, in the anti reformed capital (probably) of the world, Tulsa Oklahoma.
What about NQN suppressors? Possible?
Possible!
54:50 so true
Always enjoy NQN.
Is there an audio available for this? Thanks!
Would you open a church in Paraguay?
He burned Larry? Did I miss it???
It was definitely the Little Mermaid.
@@Meg_Davis that’s what I thought, Larry would have been awesome though 😀
Mere Christendom
Psychotherapy is something that's "coming for our families," and that includes Bowen's Family Systems Theory.
imho
how do you feeEEEeeeeeeeEEeel about Romans 13?
@@CanonPress "And everywhere we, more readily than all men, endeavour to pay to those appointed by you the taxes both ordinary and extraordinary, as we have been taught by Him . . . . Whence to God alone we render worship, but in other things we gladly serve you, acknowledging you as kings and rulers of men, and praying that with your kingly power you be found to possess also sound judgment. But if you pay no regard to our prayers and frank explanations, we shall suffer no loss, since we believe (or rather, indeed, are persuaded) that every man will suffer punishment in eternal fire according to the merit of his deed, and will render account according to the power he has received from God, as Christ intimated when He said, 'To whom God has given more, of him shall more be required.'" -Justin Martyr
Rigney, if you were postmill in 2008, what took you so long to become an entire household baptist (paedobaptist is an insufficient and stupid term)?
I like the term Covenant Baptism.
@@mkshffr4936 good term
Πρωτος
πολλοὶ δὲ ἔσονται πρῶτοι ἔσχατοι καὶ ἔσχατοι πρῶτοι
καὶ μὴ ἐπιλαθῶμεν
(I'm probably butchering the subjunctive here but that would be too much effort)
We our one in the body of Christ
How come the comments were turned off on the most recent video?
Our focus should remain on Christ as we evangelize the unbelievers, tear down the Baals and Asherahs erected by so-called Christians and unbelievers, and grow covenant communities and families across the land. Government should be limited and conformed to holy scripture. Church and family should be the primary means of shepherding and serving the individual citizens. There does need to be a mechanism whereby straying and unrepentant pastors, elders, and deacons are held accountable. There must be a reorientation of government, a reform of the judicial system, and a restoration of the church as the primary caretaker of the poor, sick, and broken.
How come Doug didn't burn UA-cam? I wonder...
😂 !
True, even though Google, UA-cam's daddy, was part of putting their foot on the scales during the last election
A scripture verse would be nice as to where does it say to evangelize the government. I noticed that you guys are all about feelings regarding your Post mill view.
"Go ye therefore, and teach all nations..." (Matt. 28:19)
"For he [the governing authority] is the minister of God to thee for good" (Rom. 13:4).
@@NFLDude100 Why do you do like the Muslims and not put the correct text of the verse, is it because it don't fit your narrative?
Matthew 28:19
(ESV) 19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.
Did you happen to notice the word disciples is in plural meaning " it is referring to multiple people for a Nation " of many Nations.
Hermeneutics is not your best. NEXT.... Like I said ALL FEELINGS, no text.
This is the Greek word : μαθητεύσατε - referring to teach individual.
Lexicon: STRONGS NT 3100: μαθητεύω
μαθητεύω: 1 aorist ἐμαθήτευσα; 1 aorist passive ἐμαθητευθην; (μαθητής);
1. intransitive, τίνι, to be the disciple of one; to follow his precepts and instruction: Matthew 27:57 R G WH marginal reading, cf. John 19:38 (so Plutarch, mor., pp. 832 b. (vit. Antiph. 1), 837 c. (vit. Isocrates 10); Jamblichus, vit. Pythag c. 23).
2. transitive (cf. Winers Grammar, p. 23 and § 38, 1; (Buttmann, § 131, 4)) to make a disciple; to teach, instruct: τινα, Matthew 28:19; Acts 14:21; passive with a dative of the person whose disciple one is made, Matthew 27:57 L T Tr WH text; μαθητευθείς εἰς τήν βασιλείαν τῶν οὐρανοῦ (see γραμματεύς, 3), Matthew 13:52 Rec., where long since the more correct reading τῇ βασιλεία τῶν οὐρανῶν was adopted, but without changing the sense; (yet Lachmann inserts ἐν).
“Why do the nations rage and the peoples plot in vain? The kings of the earth set themselves, and the rulers take counsel together, against the Lord and against his Anointed, saying, “Let us burst their bonds apart and cast away their cords from us.” He who sits in the heavens laughs; the Lord holds them in derision. Then he will speak to them in his wrath, and terrify them in his fury, saying, “As for me, I have set my King on Zion, my holy hill.” I will tell of the decree: The Lord said to me, “You are my Son; today I have begotten you. Ask of me, and I will make the nations your heritage, and the ends of the earth your possession. You shall break them with a rod of iron and dash them in pieces like a potter’s vessel.” Now therefore, O kings, be wise; be warned, O rulers of the earth. Serve the Lord with fear, and rejoice with trembling. Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and you perish in the way, for his wrath is quickly kindled. Blessed are all who take refuge in him.”
Psalm 2:1-12 ESV
Can hardly get clearer I think. Moreover…
“He said therefore to the crowds that came out to be baptized by him, “You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come? Bear fruits in keeping with repentance. And do not begin to say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ For I tell you, God is able from these stones to raise up children for Abraham. Even now the axe is laid to the root of the trees. Every tree therefore that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.” And the crowds asked him, “What then shall we do?” And he answered them, “Whoever has two tunics is to share with him who has none, and whoever has food is to do likewise.” Tax collectors also came to be baptized and said to him, “Teacher, what shall we do?” And he said to them, “Collect no more than you are authorized to do.” Soldiers also asked him, “And we, what shall we do?” And he said to them, “Do not extort money from anyone by threats or by false accusation, and be content with your wages.””
Luke 3:7-14 ESV
Notice, both Tax Collectors and Soldiers were addressed. Historically, both had political association to the degree that they were viewed as offices as it were. Hence, many tax collectors were despised as traitors who were in league with Rome. Additionally, it is critical to highlight that the instruction he gave them dealt precisely with their earthly vocation. That’s remarkable because tax collectors and soldiers very well may have also been husbands, fathers, brothers, who had sin in other areas of their lives. They may have been adulterers, liars, and things the like; but rather than taking that route with these groups, he chose to identify them with their public offices and called them to bear fruit in those areas of their lives. Repentance was not just to be shut up to their home life, external religious life, etc. it was to be so sincere that it would encompass their political/public vocation also. Furthermore, he never called them away from such vocations. No. They were to bear fruit in keeping with repentance in those offices. Finally, let me say this, the whole context of John the Baptists ministry is extremely crucial. Because he was preparing the way of the Lord. This is the straight path he paves for the Lord among these people (see Lk 3:4). Remember John the Baptists proclamation is described as “a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins” (v.3). Therefore, since this is the context of his ministry, it is entirely relevant to our understanding of repentance and the Kingdom of God.
Coming in hot there Mr. Greengateacreshomestead4324. I think you'll find that Doug's most frequently asked question is "what does the Bible say". With regard to your accusation about feelings, I find it unpersuasive (most likely due to your lack of evidence to prove it).
Ground Zero isn’t a podcast. The world is a jungle filled with jackals. Get out there and preach and you will find out it isn’t the way people present the world to be.
As a catholic i have no idea what everyone in the comments is talking about lol. Sounds like you guys agree with Catholics on a lot of subjects.
🤍🤍🤍
Christopher Hitchens
Dougie the Gluttonous can't undo truth
What idiots
Post mil thinking blah blah blah blah
Eve is alive and doing good while you forge war by intellectual word salad
It's not just Postmil:
Paedo/Credo
2nd or 1st and 2nd table
Confederacy sympathy
Who is going to restrain the state from committing blasphemy, Doug? A people who are not willing to obey the 1st table will never obey the 2nd. Blasphemy laws FIRST!
Agreed.
A Christian culture will demand it. A transformed culture will transform the leadership.
Do please remember too, that there are indeed blasphemy laws now; it’s not whether, but which. Our society’s current ‘blasphemy law’ calls wicked righteous and holds that which is righteous as blasphemous. The alligators are already in the boat.
@TheSmeac We're talking about blasphemy laws concerning the Triune God.
@@JR-rs5qs Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. Blasphemy laws are blasphemy laws whether Christian, Islamic, Pagan, or Statist. It is not whether but which.
“Is it about politics?”
“Absolutely false”
…goes on to explain how both the end goal and the means to that goal is actually politics, despite not having sparked the revival they claim to put first…
Wondering what revival looks like apart from obedience to God's word? What if revival looks like Christians becoming serious about their convictions regarding morality, starting with their own? Not sure what you're asking for here...
not interestedmeow in listening it seems
“Oh noes, my kids are learning about climate change and trans people!”
You guys are still statists, though, so still not getting it.
I'm almost 20 minutes in and am have heard nothing substantive from any one of you.
It's like 3 good old boys just a yakkety yakking and accomplishing nothing...
Sorry Jim Tween Ten 2586
This is why I can never watch stupid podcasts
Well, you've chosen well, not many better to hear yakkety yakking than these three men.
Wilson Ego. His pseudo intellectualism is exploitive of God, not a instrument of God as he presents.
If you listen ling enough to this SPEAK which is ABUSE you will totally musunderstand the founding father's intent.
Ego, gluttony, self-righteousness. The state should acknowledge Jesus and the word? This is in DIRECT contridiction of the US constitution founded on personal religios freedom ie freedom FROM religion if you choose. These men's interpretation is valid to THEM but is not TRUTH
The biggest blasphemers ate people like Doug Wilson.