Matt Wenning Comparing Different Squat Techniques
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- Опубліковано 9 лют 2025
- In this Power Bite, Matt Wenning, Mark Bell, Nsima Inyang, and Andrew Zaragoza talk about different squat techniques.
Check out the full episode:
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Matt Wenning Comparing Different Squat Techniques
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When I first started squating for strength I used squat shoes and let my knees travel way past my toes. It was easy right away and I was able to make solid progress. Within a year, I could not squat due to knee pain. I could not even walk up a flight of stairs without being in immense pain. So much pain I didn't even want to train the squat anymore. After watching Wennings content I realized where I missed up. I started opening my hips or "taint" and sitting way back while keeping a vertical shin angle with flat shoes. Since then I've had no knee pain. Not sure if he'll ever see this, but Matt Wenning you kept me from quiting lifting. Listen to this man, he's been around long before all of us and will still be around long after we're all gone.
Love them giving polite clarification on Ben’s stuff and not just letting that slide. Not that Wenning is necessarily incorrect but that he was unintentionally misrepresenting someone else & the convo was better for it being corrected. This is way too rare in these spaces. And this is what I wanted to see when CWS & Wenning sat down way back when but alas… anyways good stuff from Wenning, good stuff from y’all
What I appreciate the most about Mark's podcast is that he's really open-minded when it comes to training and nutrition. You've got to have an open mind to keep learning and growing in the gym and life. Cheers
I appreciate this clip a lot. Very professional. No unnecessary digging on either side. Opinions were addressed on both sides, challenged, and resolved very well. Great episode.
I love listening to these different perspectives. I see both sides and I like to have a one on one with both explaining their point more. Also the emphasis on body type and how to incorporate both styles. Huge fan of your podcast. Thanks 👍 for the great content as always.
Doing ATG movements has improved my deadlift, squat, press and bench. Has increased my ROM in my hamstrings and quads.
1.Pepper in some of the movements
2. Train them for strength
3. Profit?
People are built differently. I like the way Coan says it - if you’re getting stronger, not getting hurt, it’s ok.
"Dr" Wenning 😂
Squatting wider uses more muscles, more hamstring, more adductor etc, plus less ROM, more stretch reflex at the bottom, etc, etc
Some need to squat toes forward, some need to squat toes out, some need to stop around paralles, some need to squat really deep, some need to squat really wide. Some coache sunderstand squat depth and technique are based on an individuals anatomy, mobilit, injury, history and goals. Matt Wenning is not one oft hem. Good coaches don´t make statements that everyone should squat the same way because some simply can´t and shouldn´t attempt to. Good coaches understand how to analyze those factors to find the best squat for the individual while alos giving them tools to work on to enhance their lifts and find whats most optimal in the long run. This dude sitll believe that there is one size fits all, shins straight, over arched back and so on. Embarassing in the year of 2022
agree. I asked about his opinion on kneesovertoesguy and he blocked me like a little kid. on the other side he claims he hast no followers which obviously is no wonder
@@shub9008 stop power fantasising that knee guy
This is the truth. NASM actually let this guy do a lecture and he just wouldn't shut up about the straight shin thing. It was embarrassing for the sport
If you want to squat to just move weight, follow what this guy says, If you play football & run track for example, you need to have your knee over toe. Ben Patrick emphasizes more for sports performance rather than just moving a barbell with weight.
your welcome.
Huge difference between picking up a weight and playing an explosive sport
@@kevivarma2759 100%
@@kevivarma2759 I would like to add, if Sam Darnold were too execute the movement this man is explaining coming off the line instead of K.O.T, he'd get pancaked by the O-Line man everytime, running backs going through holes would be leveled off there feet. I believe that box squatting has benefits for sports performance because it provides safety to execute a heavy movement and or it's a good cue for breaking 90% to pop back up instead of having to go lower when not neccessary.
They both transition to sport. The ways that Louie trained athletes worked extremely well. Hell Ben Patrick got a lot of his ideas from Louie Simmons he even admits that. There is more then one way to skin a cat and at the end of the day it’s just up to the athlete to choose what works best for them. Yes you need strong ass quads for athletics nobody doubts that. However squatting knees over toes you are going to risk a lot of wear a fear on your knees. You also neglect your hamstrings and glutes. You need strong hips and hamstrings for sports too. Matt was an extremely explosive lifter and almost every Westside guy or even guys who squatted in a similar way like Dr Squat were extremely explosive. I think it’s extremely short sighted to act as if the way Matt trains doesn’t work for athletes is not true at all. He has trained plenty of athletes and military guys with great results. Both of them are intelligent in their training approach. It’s just different in some ways.
@@CrashMetaReligion1996 you 100% right but what your missing to understand is that barbell bell squatting has different emphasizes in sports, there are different exercise that are used to specifically target the hamstrings in sports performance. When you squat 1k on your back, yes I would recommend this gentleman because hes an expert in executing a single movement in (competition) one time. Ben teaches how to execute movements multiple times, in multiple angles because sports is not 1rm single or a linear sport. also, having strong quads in football doesn't mean anything if you cant use them. lastly, try the shin angel method that hes talking about against any defensive line man and I promise hell knock you over with out any effort or even ask your gym buddy, all he has todo, is push forehead and you fall back
Fantastic conversation gents this was great to listen to
Hate how this guy just puts down Ben Patrick. He doesn’t understand that they both have different goals. A majority of people don’t care about lifting a ton on a barbell. He didn’t even do any research on KOT and starts saying you shouldn’t train that way, like WTF. I bet Ben would destroy all those squat variations this guy is talking about.
Those look like two cans of beer Wenning is drinking
Does he claim to not drink?
it's water haha, look up "liquid death".
Mountain water from the Alps. It murders thirst💪🏽🔥💯
Most power lifters come off as Aholes. He's criticizing Ben Patrick as if he's a meat head power lifter trying to break records. I will like to see him dunk a basketball. He looks like a competitive eater year round, not athletic at all
Competitive eaters are actually thin. Look at joey chestnut, kobiashi.. good point, bad analogy
he bashes those “athletes” then complaint that nobody is support his channel w without himself can barely moves. Those powerlifter are so caught up with the idea of strong without realising powerlifitng is not even a sport.
@@allenhu1763 so true
It is not criticism, it is his opinion. Ben cannot achieve records Matt's squad records. No need to compare and try to understand different perspectives. Also extremely different body types. We are different people.
I would actually like to take a stab at competitive eating. Lol.
Breakfast would be my food of choice 😋
These are the videos that should be getting the views and going viral not the steroid ones it’s crazy.
It frustrates me when they talk about style without addressing bone structure. Someone with very long legs may not be able to squat with anything close to vertical shins. Someone with forward facing hip sockets won't be able to push their knees out to the side. I would never propose to tell Matt Wenning how to squat, but not everyone should squat like Matt Wenning.
Correct yet Wenning keeps insisting his way is right regardless or femur length. If you have longer femurs and you squat with straight shins, your ass will be so far behind you that you'll just fall backwards.
I appreciate this video. I’m rehabbing my legs after severe injuries. I had a goal of being able to ATG squat.
I started with “box squats” into my chair. I did that for 6 months controlling the eccentric tension. Then I removed the chair & started pausing at the bottom ie at 90 degrees.
Not long after I started to be able to ATG squat! I love working both ATG squats & horse stance. They are both awesome.
I have a tighter squat stance with knees over toes a bit but In the same session I’m doing wide stance box squats and hitting the ham/glutes and then doing single leg lunges to focus on that knee strength. It’s worked really well for me but as Mark tends to suggest, ill throw some
Alternative secondary leg workouts to keep athleticism on point.
I like Matt and Ben. But when I was in high school football I was told to avoid letting my knees go over toes. I’m not really built for low bar as I have a relatively long torso. Last 6 or 7 years I do allow more knee travel and have solid quads. Sitting back in the squat is a way to build a massive squat but my heaviest are with a mid bar, mid foot width and some knee travel. It’s not as upright as Olympic style but not bent over as power lifting. The truth is you will get strong in The position you train. If you are a powerlifter then the most weight is what matters. Otherwise balance is key lol
Comparing Wenning and Ben's squat technique is the apples vs oranges comparison. Wenning's technique is specific for maximal weight to be lifted, I mean he's a world class powerlifter for a reason. Ben's ATG technique is specific for knee function as it pertains to improving the jumping movement pattern, because he cares about dunking a basketball.
I think Wenning's Vertical Shank style is also if not more about keeping the longevity of your knee to beable to squat overtime with no injuries as opposed to knee over toes which can most definitely cause knee pain and injuries, One of my favorite quotes from Matt is "Whoever lifts the longest gets the strongest"
It is apples to oranges yet Wenning won't acknowledge the oranges and keeps insisting it's all apples.
Ben Patrick does not train for size nor squatting but numbers. By this guys argument, why can’t he dunk like Ben?
He weighs like 260 pounds. But he is almost certainly more explosive then Ben.
Idk Louie Simmons produced some crazy explosive big guys. Dave Tate another big guy Louie trained could jump and touch 11’6 I believe he squatted 900+. Wouldn’t be suprised if this guy could dunk back when he was in his prime
@@CrashMetaReligion1996He's more explosive on the toilet- shooting out his performance enhancing drugs. 🤪
guys, this guy is for behind. don´t make the mistake and sign up for his patreon. you will get nothing
agree 100%, not worth a penny
Please articulate what you're trying to say here...it is unclear...thanks.
This guy admittedly says he hasn't done much research into Ben Patrick, yet has very strong opinions of him. That's the definition of ignorance.
Here’s the thing
Matt Wenning and Ben Patrick are both correct.
Just do both…
I follow Wenning and ATG guy thoroughly. I bet if Matt sat down with the dude he would think his style is legit. But i absolutely agree with matt as far as the need for variation. Theyre both blessings to the fitness world. PERIOD
Matt Wenning is a dinosaur stuck in 2006
Please, explain how that claim holds water?
A strong, injury free dinosaur 😂
The reason why a low bar squat is a more powerful position than a back squat in the Amount of weight that can be moved has to do with leverages. If you’re a power lifter that’s what you care about: pure numbers.
If you want to strength quads preferentially then it absolutely makes sense to have a larger lever occurring at the knee.
strong knee tendons with knee over toes
Jeffrey Wolf aka the Flexibull is going to have a field day with this one
Good topic
He has solid points but using Ben Patrick (who I don't particularly like) as an example by saying he hasn't got big legs compared to him is silly. Ben Patrick' goals are v different. He also don't take steroids, or if he does, he needs a refund and he likely doesn't eat a great deal and has never truly 'bulked'.
I prefer Matt Wenning and Matt Wenning has far better content than ATG imo.
You must not be familiar with Wenning. This is a guy who compares himself to non-roid lifters and feels good about it.
Matt uses hamstring and glutes to avoid going knees over toes.
Ben uses hamstring and glutes to absorb force as he goes knees over toes.
I'm not sure Matt really gets what Ben's goal is. Its not high level powerlifting.
Box Squats 4Life!
Kneesovertoes is about building stronger joints and connective tissue, its not a protocol yo lift the most weight possible. Its not a powerlifting thing. Trying to critique it through a powerlifting lens makes no sense.
Why are they standing
L take. Possibly the worst possible opinion on the matter. And saying Ben Patrick has small legs and trying to put him down was very slimy of him
@emZee1994 What the fuck have you done again? Oh nothing. Lol
@Whyohwhyno They are everywhere. Are you lying or stupid? Tons of professional and Olympic lifters have knee and back problems.
It's this type of shit that hinders Matt's prominence. He's just so fucking slimy sometimes.
Hard disagree. Ben Patrick DOES have small legs, he's not exceptionally strong and his methods are not special, but for some reason he's still glazed hard by the fitness industry. It's refreshing to hear Matt call a duck a duck when nobody else wants to.
Matt is plainly being humble in his opinion...don't think he is purposely abasing anyone.
Louie Simmons said close squat will do nothing for wide but wide squat will help your close squat
He's not thinking this through. Of course people who squat knees over toes will end up with knee pain if they HAVEN'T STRENGTHENER THEIR KNEES IN THOSE POSITIONS, whch is what Ben's training is all about!
Pushing weight v sport’s performance how about implementing both. Or do we choose one over another and become biased, you pigeon hole yourself just saying.
Why does Tom Platz have bigger quads than Matt nobody is the better question
Him bragging about his thigh size while he has 40% body fat is fucking hilarious.
I remember when people aksed Matts opinion about carnivore diet，he replied never seen any carnivore benched over 500. With that being said，Matts diet is pure shit because we never seen any vertical diet people dunk from free throw line or play in NBA or is the Highest level of athlete. LMAO. He is so into powerlifting lol.
To be fair, diet and nutrition is talked about more with power lifters. The two questions people ask are "what's your program?" and "what's your diet?"
Nutrition isn't as visible in basketball. Everybody knows that Larry Bird shot 100 free throws after practice and that Kobe Bryant practiced 4 hours more than everyone else. But no one was asking what they ate.
The most visible nutrition person I can think of in sports is Tom Brady. The main idea around his diet is to be antiinflammatory, which is a big component of vertical diet.
Love this channel ......until they hit you with the ads. Wtf bro?
how do you expect this show to continue without some sort of monetary support?
I kinda agree with matt
Yeah but Ben can dunk, Wenning will never dunk.
Ego is a bit much 😮 it's always I or I'm. I'm noticing, and I have heard matt say he has never had injuries repeatedly yet he says both his legs were broke, anyway how is occasional like every 6 weeks a balance doesn't seem like a balance to me, I don't think ben favours anything I think he says not to ignore things 🤔
Very deceptive box squat. Box squats will defentely wean people off squats and lunges like nicorete gum!! Lool. I'm sticking with squats
Get analytical with it sound like an over educated devil. But I'm not falling for it!!! Loool
I understand being open minded about different training styles. Is Ben Patrick sponsoring this podcast? Give me a break. All of his followers, more power to you. Commercial gyms are overcrowded with this type of stigma. I'll stick with Matt Wenning and Dave Tate for my training direction. Kudos Matt. I have always been a fan of Mark Bell as well. This other guy,....pfff, go lift at Bally's with all the other douchebags.
Agreed! I'm a huge Wenning fan. His perspective on squating made me realize how weak my hamstrings were/are by widening my squat stance. It's a rough transition, but the proof is in the pudding...all of these guys you see squating a 1000+ lbs have vertical shins.
Matt is correct, hip dominant squatting recruits far more muscle (front to back). Knee dominant squatting is ONLY optimal for long torso/ short legged lifters. You must learn basic physics to understand what Matt is saying. Gents, your hips are far far more explosive and powerful than your legs. Just watch how the NFL guys perform the vertical jump in the Combine- you will never see them load into their knees with torso upright (like a high bar knee dominant squat).....Rather they always load their hips back like a low bar squat (with just a little shin lean). These are the best athletes on earth- so if you don't see this pattern you are not understanding athletic power. Also, "Power Lifting" is a misnomer- Olympic lifters generate far more 'power' with less weight due to the explosive nature of the lifts. If you don't believe it- pull out a physics book and study the equations of: Work, Energy, and Power, then apply them to the barbell (heavy squat / deadlift vs clean/ snatch). You will be shocked how much more powerful the Olympic lifts are.
If you want the quick and dirty explanation- look up the 'Force vs Velocity curve' and locate 1RM squatting vs cleans.
Note: Power = Force (times) Velocity
Bahaha buddy you have walked yourself in a hundred circles here. How would knees forward be for someone with short femurs? They can squat however they want because they have the shortest lever arm. Someone with long femurs needs to be pitched forward more to offset how far back their ass will be because the femur is so long.
Honestly where do you make this stuff up?
Ben Patrick does not train for size nor squatting big numbers. By this guys argument, why can’t he dunk like Ben?