Dorkfest Part 1! My Studio Workflow: The Hardware
Вставка
- Опубліковано 3 лип 2024
- How is all this stuff rigged up? Find out and/or fall asleep :)
be sure quality is set to 1080p. Best viewed Fullscreen.
0:00 Yo!
0:47 First Rule of Dorkfest
1:18 Workflow #1 - Composing
5:04 Workflow #2 - Prelay Transfers (wtf is this??)
8:00 Workflow #3 - Mixing in the box
8:16 Workflow #4 - Synthesizer Sound Design
9:46 Part 1: The Computer
11:31 Part 2: Controllers
11:56 Part 3: Audio Interface
13:56 Part 4: Monitoring
16:32 Super Amazeballs Composer Tip!
17:08 Part 5: Analog Summing and Outboard
19:23 Part 6: Synthesizer Mountain
21:15 AVID MTRX Nutty I/O with various expansion cards
22:28 Part 7: Streaming, Conferencing and Educational
23:26 I/O Recap
25:20 Almost the end
25:58 Final Thoughts
I may or may not be in the minority, but for me this is the LEAST boring kind of video. Thanks Neil!
This is amazing I wish everyone would do studio tours with this implemented in them
I'm 4 seconds into this video and I already know I won't understand a single word of it, but I'm staying in the hope of a random Googy cameo. Happy Holidays etc, Neil. :)
Hehe damn... no kitty in this one!
LOL 5,300 people don't think this is boring. A lot of us are looking for ways to optimize our setups and videos like this help us mentally work through the turd research to get things resolved.
Engineer is one more task that a musician nowadays needs to know. Holy cow.
and its a little dificult to the universities to see that, but now, with covid and online class, the need to learn how to record yourself began more important and the students are seeking for courses on how to record and mix yourself.
@@nikolasgomesf Yeah, but what I seen in conference calls some very basic things like not sitting in front of a window, using some headphones with a microphone would be enough to have most problems solved :D
Amazing EVERYTHING you are doing, and thanks for sharing. The detail and over-arching theory are missing from most other channels.
We setup a somewhat similar system, although we dropped PT and Logic in favor of Reaper and moved over to a bunch of 500 gear (WesAudio, Cranborne, etc) and Flock Audio Patch and Dante for glue. Our engineer was actually able to work from home to setup and modify for several sessions during the lockdown, which went even better than we had hoped. He supported the intern remotely. Such a great day and age.
This is the best fucking info on the planet. My god, thank you. I bet there’s 17 million other people like me who just said “how the hell did you know every question I ever had about workflow and how to make it un-terrible.” And except for the modulars and the Psycho Billy Cadillac of conversion and digital you’ve set up (meant with the highest respect!) I have at least some comparable version of equipment for most of your total layout. But I would have no idea how to best integrate it into a system without a tutorial like yours. And to get it with your straight-shooting approach is a bonus. You’re a great teacher. Thank you thank you thank you.
Thanks Randall!!! Glad it’s been of help! :) :)
Good Grief this is OUTSTANDING! You are such a benevolent, smart guy. Usually smart guys are knowledge hoarders. I know I'm late to the party but this has truly given me such a unique & useable perspective from a working pro that I can apply to my own studio build. You've saved me a ton of heart-ache and $. If I pour big glass of whiskey, I won't be able to see/hear part 2. Thank you!
Hey thanks!!! I seriously had no idea how much people would like this one.. :)
It’s been 84 years since we asked for a workflow! JK in all seriousness this is THE sauce we’ve been waiting for. Totally worth the wait as it’s a lot more complex than I thought, very nicely laid out and explained! Thanks! (AVID should sponsor you for the MTRX)
Hah that would have been nice. Thanks for the kind words!
Love these videos!! Keep them coming please 👏🏼
thanks for this. It was incredibly fun to watch.
Thanks Neil, your videos are awesome. You're awesome.
Merry Christmas. Awesome video.
Really impressive, great job! 👏👏
Man, thanks for that!! I found it really interesting and I can’t wait for the next vid!!! Cheers!!
Great in depth video. Keep up the great work
This is an absolutely awesome video. You are a genius. :)
Whew, super informative! gotta watch it again for sure :)
You're living the dream man 😁
Thanks for sharing- inspirational
great job neil!
This was a great overview. Thanks for sharing. Really interesting for us gear heads.
Thank you Neil! I love how detailed you go over everything, you are truly an awesome dude and an inspiration !
Love it. Now that is organisation to the max.
This was an interesting watch, especially having rewatched the studio tour earlier in the day. Can't wait to see the next part.
best studio routing youtube video for synth nutters EVER!
Wow, this is amazing to see! Thanks for sharing, really interesting to see all your gear and how you have it interconnected!
Dude! you've worked on some of my favorite cartoons and movies.. Its amazing to see how much tech it takes to get it done. Much love and happy holidays!! :)
well explained. super logical and actually pretty brilliant.
Awesome content... love your deep level of knowledge and how you cross domains so eloquently from the analog to digital realm...Peace....
Thank you so much for this video! I am currently in the process of mapping out my studio setup and this is helping me tremendously. Very much appreciated!!
Thanks, that is gold right there
Thank you for sharing
Dude...that is insane.
This was a fantastic video! I do not have nearly as much gear as you, but I am all about efficiency and this kind of stuff is just fascinating to me.
YES!!!! I'm gonna watch this AgAIN!!! Here we GOOOOOOOoooooooo........ !
Thanks Neil, you rock man!
yeah sorry about that.. i was just as baffled... hahaha... turns out a final cut update defaulted my share resolution to VHS resolution... because.. of course I'd want that spec in 2020... :0
@@NeilParfittMusic the VHS quality is the retro style to go with that Mac SE in the background!
@@NeilParfittMusic Yeah right! I felt like I got kick out of 2020 back to 85, and landed on a Flux Capacitor! :O ! Thanks for the re-post, as this is just AWESOME. I look forward to the rest!
Thank you Neil! - I was saving this for a quiet moment after the holidays and I'm glad I did. Your illustrations of workflow have given me some ideas of how I might deal with some workflow issues with my current system (albeit my current system is a tiny fraction of what you're working with!) Lots of great content here. I'm looking forward to the next Dorkfest! :-)
awesome! Glad it sparked some ideas! :)
This is indeed probably the most boring video I've ever watched. Thank you for doing this!! :)
Wow invaluable
Thanks Neil :). I will be watching for the software part. I have now completed my setup, after the 828ES came back with the TB2 port now working :). AVB is very exciting for me, the 2 studio rooms can talk back and forth easily. I just need to tackle VEP and probably 2 instances of Studio Pro One in my case :). I also need to think if I can get away with running the Yamaha Montage off it's USB out at the same time as my Motu Midi Express.... Ahh the joys. I am so glad to see you enjoying your setup I know what it's like to shrink and save time!.
I just import my stems into Pro Tools I'm gonna have to reconsider everything now.
Thank you for taking the time to explain. Very efficient, very pro!
If you have a flow that’s working for you, carefully weigh the pros and cons of “rocking the boat” if it’s all smooth sailing :)
amazing.
That was dope! Love seeing how other artists do their crazy work! Looking forward to see how it looks under the desk. Curious to see the mountain of wiring it takes for that to work.
Well that’s just it - synths aside - very little mountain!
Here’s the rear wall of synths:
instagram.com/p/B_vMyr1gfOE/?igshid=zg2rngjzpgro
I’m thinking how could anyone think this guy works at McDonald’s.... great video!!! Thanks for sharing.
I didn't understand 99% of the tech, but I like your thinking to be as efficient and productive as possible, even if you have to spend a bit more money. Looking forward to seeing it all in action. And yes, it was some of the more riveting UA-cam content I've seen lately. :) Happy Holidays to you!
Cheers Pete!
Man, this was amaaaazing to watch, maybe I´m to nerdy? wahtever, thx very much for this content, amazing job with the diagrams! I already shared the video with a friend to motivate us! ehehhe thx again!
Thanks Neil, very enlightening. I found it fascinating... but then I'm just another studio nerd running around here on UA-cam.
Love the disclaimer! lol. Great channel awesome insight into studio ownership.
What software are you using for your flowchart?
@@FishingITGuy omnigraffle
"Until Apple drops the Mac Pro M processor and fucks me up.." Oh man I feel your pain. I'm simultaneously very excited about the performance potential they show but I'm terrified of messing with my workflow.
Given how many issues even software developers (like myself) have on M1 right now, any audio stuff is going to break terribly I expect.
Fairdinkum Fantastic!..
Loved it.. Thanks so much for the insight of your workflow....
I used to commission rigs for Studios and Film post (Long time ago) and I can see the time and effort its taken to find that right piece of gear.
Like many McDonald Professionals, It doesn't matter how much gear or its cost, its all in the workflow... Solid.
(Geez.. That Avid MTrx would've saved me so many headaches !!)
Thanks Again.
May the year 2021 be most excellent to you and all here intrigued at the Diagrams ~!
Beers and Cheers from Down under. 🍻
Merry Xmas !
Thx Matt!!
Love it! Been doing this as an assistant composer myself. Also love that you integrate your analog gear\outboard like this. I've also been doing that.
awesome! Anything on IMDB to take a peek at?
@@NeilParfittMusic bha. Looks like I can`t post url/links..
@@Ryanfilmscores w h a t a b o u t l I k e t h I s : )
@@NeilParfittMusic No, it wont! I have tried 4 times now..
Living the dream, this helps SO much. I’d love to know how you manage your day to day VEP templates and legacy templates. I find it very difficult to refine my template without shooting myself in the foot with backward compatibility.
That MTRX config is just paradise man!!!! I hope to get there someday!
Thanks for the re-up, was really hard watching that first upload at 320p.... 🤟🤩☑️
yeah i can only imagine... final cut tossed my share setting after an update... *sigh*. VHS foreva!!!
I found that extremely interesting...so I guess I’m a dork. :-)
Neil - this is absolutely fascinating.
I have always dreamed of setting up such a rig and it was so interesting to see how this all fits together.
As you say, you just want to push buttons and the sound just is there - no faffing around with Signal paths and such.
Do you colour code the physical cables - it soon starts to look like a pile of spaghetti once all of these things are connected up.
Thanks for the video.
This needs to be looked at again and again...:-)
Cheers.
thanks! At this point, no, no colour coding. I have a trusty brother label maker. I know where stuff has to go (and once wired doesn't change) so ie: for the 6 AVID digilink cables, I just label them A to F so they're easy to trace between computer and the MTRX. Same goes with MADI and so on. The synths are in 8ch clumps with DB25 cables. (ward-beck.com/collections/qtp-audio-routing/products/qtp-db25y)., so they're wired in physical order top down so it's easy to remember. All the analogue gear is on CAT6 in 4ch clumps that accommodates 2 pieces of stereo rackmounts. These are all labeled from 1-32 which match up with the 32 ch of ports on the Flock Patch and also line up in software when defining them... so as an example, in the software patch control, my BAX EQ is ch1/2, which is on ports 1/2 of the PATCH and I/O 1/2 on the cable harness... but of course, now that everything is configured, all I have to think about is choosing the BAX EQ and everything is just automatic!
Neil I am SOOOOO happy that you got the MacPro Rack and the Avid MTRX to tie all of this together.
Now that I have looked at that block diagram, that question I had a few weeks ago about MADI is ALL cleared up.
I was wondering what interface(s) you used a the OTHER end of the pipe, and the Ferrofish A32 / A16 are the answer, so thank you there.
Kudos on using the MTRX as the Sync clock and using Big Ben in slave mode to redistribute the LTC to the rest of the rig. For an older piece, Apogee made an incredible unit there! This was a PLEASURE to watch again in HD, and I can't thank you enough for clearing up the MADI mystery. I hope it's as elegant and efficient to work with as it is complex and feature rich! Thanks again!
Thanks!!
One thing to clarify: The Big Ben is redistributing the Word Clock (WC) , LTC is an audio signal from Logic (RME MADI FX) headphone out to the sync HD's LTC input. I'm sure you meant WC.. but just in case :). Also, the A16 I believe is the MkII version.
I'm definitely having the Part 2 and onwards covering all the flows in a 'real world' way.. so it should be more interesting as these static images hehe
@@NeilParfittMusic This was FASCINATING. There is no WAY you or anyone this side of a sheet of LSD could pull this off with a top spec Windows 10 machine. No fucking WAY! This is gonna be the best series to watch EVER man!
A gift indeed! Dude, this is a masterclass. That flock patchbay is the coolest piece of tech in here that I hadn't known about. OMG that thing is killer. Anyways, thank you for this rundown and the work that went into it. This is pure studio porn. edit: The MTRX is godly, but I knew about it already
Thanks Aaron! Happy holidays! :)
You have a wealth of I/O!! Sufficiently Jealous. Thanks for the insight, looking forward to your next walkthrough. My studio is about 1/10th the size of your ;) Alas I'm not the professional you are.
I'm limited in having one UA apollo x8p plus an apollo twin; but I did invest in a flock audio PATCH, a 24ch Neutrik patch bay, and several quality DB25 fan cables. That allows me to have 4 outboard stereo synths, 4 outboard stereo effects/pedals (as SR), and 8ch of eurorack I/O, all normalized to the I/O ports on the flock audio PATCH. The Neutrik patch bay gives the easy option to override any of the normalized inputs when needed. Thus the bulk of my workflows are configured on-demand in the PACTH APP and can be saved with each project. Well I'm really saved by the flock audio PATCH. Cheers
The PATCH is amazing. Go Canada!!
More I/o has no correlation to level of professionalism... maybe ... the level of madness? 😇
@neil parfitt, if I have a virtual audio device software called Loopback, the spiritual successor to soundflower, which you prolly heard of, and and it let’s you have up to 64 stereo channels of I/O, I’m wondering how well it would work to record in PT from LPX using the Loopback channels as busses?
@@Robert-kx8mp you could try it, and there's also Source Nexus (24ch.) depending on how wide you need to go.
www.source-elements.com/products/source-nexus/
Oddly satisfying. I'm tech nerd. Don't know sh*t about audio though, this is like watching cable management p*rn
Funny enough, the clarity M is probably my favorite piece of scoping gear, besides all of your outboard mastering gear lol
Good stuff dude! Can't wait to hear it. Would you shed some light in the next one about how you trim your HW synths - i have to keep riding the levels in Logic - maybe you have a better solution. Oh and all who pine for the good'all days of analog never had to recall a large mix-down session.
thx! The A32 and A16's have internal gain settings for each input (and you can gang stereo pairs) - so I went through synth by synth and found an appropriate level factoring master physical volume, CC7 127 and if it was clipping or not skimming around various patches.
Ordered my Flock Audio Patch today... this thing is a definite game changer... I'll be able to dedicate one whole section of it to the H9000 which has it's own matrix inside it... a nice tidy much smaller rig than yours... but my modular is 5U and a smidgen bigger... LOL
Ok so I asked a question in the second party that was basically answered in this video. Oooops. Also, as someone researching and building up a home studio. I was geeking out over this whole vid!!!
haha I guess my own vid beat me to it!
Wow, very cool setup. Will you talk a bit more about archiving/backup/documentation in the software part? Because you talked about your epic fight with Apple to get a replacement power supply I guess you have put a lot of thought into that...
Whoops - totally missed this! MY backup strategy:
Mac mini with a 48TB RAID 10 array on the network using 10G. System backs up to it daily using carbon copy cloner over the network. All machines have Backblaze running as well. Easy!
Neil - thanks for the brilliant walk through! Have you looked into using a plugin in logic to generate and send LTC instead of having to mess with that big long LTC audio track? I think Dolby has a pretty good LTC generating plugin that is used for Atmos sync, but could possibly simplify things for you.
Hey Michael, yup! I've been using the Dolby TC Generator Plugin since buying the Production Kit. It honestly made no difference in how things work, but did eliminate typing in an offset when working on difference reels for the hour changes. Cheers!
@@NeilParfittMusic Ok, great! Glad to hear that's working for you. I was curious, have you had any issues with logic and protools running at the same time on the same machine? Once upon a time, I remember PT and logic would fight when they both used core audio simultaneously.
@@michaelkramer5804 never - but I've always maintained discreet hardware for each (protools is HDX, Logic is RME). Some audio hardware handles multi-client great (RME), while others glitch out like crazy. Coreaudio on Pro Tools was brutal for a long time, but has become much better the last 5 years or so. Might be worth a test. Sample rates in sessions must be matched.
Finally got to watch this, and it's awesome ! I love how the MTRX is an amazing problem solver for that kind of workflow. It's weird Avid doesn't push it more, you don't hear about it too often. I also love how you basically use PT as a glorified tape recorder (which is where it shines IMHO). Another thing I love is how this is a very well thought-out setup, and every gear addition is either a solution to a problem or adds possibilities.That Flock thingy looks amazing too...
Dumb question btw (I've never had to deal with that many): how are your MIDI devices/channels indexed ? Interface/bank/channel ?
Thanks Nicholas! I’m working on dorkfest #2 right now coincidentally :).
Good question re midi. I did it top-down, left to right reflecting their physical positions. Each synth has a dedicated midi port so they’re all assigned channel 1 by default.
@@NeilParfittMusic Haha okay, makes things simpler that way ! Definitely makes sense though, and eliminates most of the guesswork.
And great, I'm very much looking forward to dorkfest #2, I have a theory you can't do that job without being at minimum a huge nerd, especially these days (in the live audio world, we can have heated 3 hours discussions on the merits of different digital audio over ethernet implementations that leaves every "civilian" hearing it scratching his head, soooo...well) ;)
Amazing setup Neil. How did you learn all this stuff? You seem like a reasonably young guy - but clearly you have YEARS of experience here and are a master of your craft. I will look forward to seeing how you "do stuff" in the future! Be safe, Happy Holidays, and thanks for taking the time to share all this with us - WOW!
Thanks Pete! Well, 41 haha!
I went to college for music engineering 22 years ago and then tech assisted at a post facility before moving into animation music... through all this I’ve been deploying composer studios as well as sometimes teaching at a colllege (synthesis, protools). I never stop learning - love this stuff!
@@NeilParfittMusic Passion, knowledge, and that experience makes you a force to be reckoned with. Same deal in any industry. That's one reason I say that if you don't love what you do then find something else before it's too late. Life's too short.
Hey Neil! A long time ago I was set on a career in audio post-production and even did some ADR work experience (teenager internship here in UK) at some post houses in London. I never went down that path and became a software engineer instead.
Seeing your vids makes me miss that path because I spent loads of time learning Logic, Pro Tools and more when I was younger.
Is it too late to get into the audio industry? How is it now with the reduced movie/show output and what do you think will happen in the future with available jobs? And how did you get into it?
Thanks for reading. Keep the vids up, you're sharing valuable information! Nabs
p.s. my dad is called Neil 👴
It’s never too late! There’s always content being made, and that in turn will need audio post. Only difference now is it’s way easier to be setup remote! :)
So great to watch! I used to work for a composer whose setup was similar but with 4 server PC’s for the custom orchestral libraries! What software did you use to draw out your setup??? Also, got any thoughts about the new M1 macs and if you’ll be able to implement using one?
Hi Bruce! Thx! It’s called “Omnigraffle”.
Re: M cpu ... overall it was a solid move for Apple.. but I just have to wonder .. why did they even bother with the Intel Mac Pro... what’s waiting another year when already having waited 7? Weird timing. their initial offering is just a taste of the stuff to come and it’ll be amazing. I was up against the performance wall almost a year ago and had to make a move.. so .. no regrets.
@@NeilParfittMusic I think the answer is in the hardware they chose for the 7,1. The Mac Pro has massive ECC memory capacity and lots of PCIe slots. It will be a long time before there is ARM driver support for any of those add-in PCIe cards (or maybe never for some of them). The initial M1 Macs have pretty limited memory (and not upgradeable since it's on the chip). You made the right call getting into the 7,1 as it will server you for 5 to 10 years in a very stable, cool, quiet manner. Just don't chase the latest hardware/software/OS - you know those lessons. Be happy - in the best case your machine will be "boring" for many years to come. :)
OK, this is prolly too far down the rabbit hole... but in case not: Do you have a strategy for keeping your CV-controlled analog synth modules in accurate intonation? Or do they not drift? Or is the drift part of the charm of the sound? [Thanks for walking us thru your amazeballs deep flow-chart.]
the only strategy so far is to leave the system on until I've complete the patch. otherwise... yeah.. the ruckus ensues and I may have to tap on some pots to 'get it back' :)
The struggle is real!!
Well Neil, that was awesome. Most of it is overkill for what I do, but it does get one thinking about ways to optimize one’s workflow.
I can’t say enough about how awesome it is to have all of my synths on their own MIDI pairs - to that end I use daisy-chained defunct Emagic AMT/Unitor interfaces. So I have two questions for you, they’re pretty easy ...
1. Do you use a control surface to mix? I have been all too reluctant to pull the trigger on anything since my old-school Mackie Control / Logic Control units got too flaky and had to be retired. Interestingly the controls I miss most are the chunky transport buttons, the jog wheel and the zooming arrows!
2. Have you ever measured or otherwise analyzed the timing of your MIDI ports? I haven’t done so yet, but I want to know just how tight my USB-controlled MIDI interfaces are with Logic - and it’s just because the Expert Sleepers “MIDI from audio” concept seems so sexy to me.
Best regards from Brampton. Eager for your next video!
Yes I loved the Mackie control!! But.. too big. These days no, I’m either mousing or using something like the logic remote on my phone. Tempted by the avid dock.. as it has the transport and dedicated automation buttons... but it’s huge and fugly.
Timing for synths seems to be fine as it’s all point to point. Modular feels like outboard synth hardware as well. I haven’t done any measurements but you know, I’ll give that a go over the holidays.
@@NeilParfittMusic I too was curious about midi timing. What model is the 16 port usb hub if you don't mind me asking? Thanks for the video!
Please can you please post all the diagrams somewhere the diagrams to download, it would be great!!! Tks again for your time !!!
Drop me a mail on my site: Www.Neilparfitt.com
Neil this is next level! Bad ass. Quick question: what application did you use to build these visualizations. I’ve been looking into different cad programs for making system drawings of a large analog room I work in and this looks perfect! Thanks in advance!!
Hi Eli thanks!
The App is called Omnigraffle:
www.omnigroup.com/omnigraffle
What's the advantage of the Flock over using another MADI audio interface with the same number of ins and outs? Just trying to understand what the Flock is adding specifically. Amazing video, super helpful and funny, as always.
Good question! It’s routing all the analog gear in the analog domain, avoiding:
Additional dedicated adc/dac for all the analog gear
Avoids complicated delay compensation issues
Avoids the gear being reliant on a certain daw
I’ll get into it on part 2 :)
I've dived into this in Dorkfest #2 that I posted last night :)
Hi Neil ) OK I get that you need the 192 outputs for your prelay work. I guess you know a lot of composers that use Logic, For your composing work, do you mix in surround, and how many channels of protools do you send to post production? ... or do you mix into stereo? Also, I thought you used VEP on the same computer the MacPro? in your video you said VEP has its own audio interface? How does that work? I completely understand that you had built a template in VEP before and continue to use it, in many cases it saves time, Thanks again.
I'm assuming you're talking about how many stems I'll send down the line to the dub? It varies depending on what it's for... and I'll get into it when I get my workflow videos sorted.
But for now... if I'm scoring cartoons... I'm in stereo and dealing with stereo mixes (no stems) but alternate mixes for various cues removing the most offending elements that would stomp on dialogue depending on the intensity of the scene. Because cartoons are so frantic in the music editorial, having all the stems would be absolutely chaotic.
For lower budget TV.. usually it's stereo and 4-6 stems. For higher budget we're getting into 5.1 stems and maybe 8-12 (or more). For film Stems.. it really depends on the movie.. but surround... and it's anywhere from 8 to 20+ depending on what's up.
If I'm working on a film composers score and it's high budget/mixing somewhere else (Like Fox, WB, Abbey Road etc) ... that's where those super wide prelay mixouts come into play as everything gets into the protools session in one shot saving a boatload of time.
Do you have backup hardware in the event that any one component goes bad?
That woudl be an endless dumptruck of money...:9. .. Luckily, I live in a major city centre with a strong music/post gear availability, so if I was in a Jam, there's a solution. I do have spare PSU and GPU on hand for the Mac Pro though.
Hey Neil ) As always , very imporessed with your enthusiasm and knowledge. I have a lot of questions, I hope you don't mind. 1. why use VEP when you can do it all in Logic Pro?? and .... Why do you need 192 audio outputs? Do you do. all the post production? Do you send your stems to a post house that does the final mix? I understand that most composers send their tracks on protools to post and dubbing. I just wonder about your workflow and how you interface with the post production side of things, whether its tv, film or animation? It would be an interesting vifdeo if you ever have the time. Many thanks for your you tube videos ! ))
Oh I'll be getting into it!
Heya! I just posted workflow #2 if there's an interest. It doesn't get into the wide output uses - but it does get into Pro Tools running in tandem... I'll be getting to that ultra wide scenario though..
Neil, that was nuts!!! LOL ... but awesome! Couple of questions for ya ... what make and model 16 port USB hub are you using? and also, what adapter do you use for your ilok and VEP dongles? Thanks mate
Ah Hrmm .. I’ll have to dive under the desk tomorrow - I forgot both hahah
@@NeilParfittMusic Ha! Don't sweat it mate... I actually meant the one you have inside your Mac Pro as well so that'll be a pain in the arse.... Maybe next time you have the machine open. I know it has one USB port in there but I think you had an adapter so you can have two dongles hidden in the machine. You said dongle .. he he. :)
May have missed this in the video, apologies if I did, but what software are you using here? Something I really miss on MacOS is Visio from MS, and this looks like it could fill that gap for me. Thanks in advance to anyone that knows :)
It’s called omnigraffle. macOS. I love it!
Interesting watch indeed. Two questions: 1) did this setup grow and evolve piece by piece out of necessity, or did you plan it all out from the start? 2) have you ever estimated the total cost of that whole thing?...at least on a big scale figure...
1) evolved over time as I settled into my preferences. Conceptually it’s been the same since 2009... just a wider pipeline for everything, and now the MTRX eliminating a ton of external equipment and noisy avid interfaces.
2) 🤢 I’d have to plot it out.
@@NeilParfittMusic cool, that's what I thought, I imagine it must've been a lot of troubleshooting to work all the kinks out and have it running so smooth that the technology is actually invisible...
Hi Neil, if you're running this all on the same machine is there any reason you don't look to switch to VEP + IAC drivers to slave pro tools to logic instead of all the hardware? I realise it's likely because you've been doing this a while and been a HDX user for a while, but you can achieve the same results in software too
I have my template rigged up to allow it vep and iac to work vs separate hardware (both are in place for moving forward and opening up the old). That doesn’t change my protools prelays/stem out requirements though... that’s a completely separate process.
Do you shut anything down? Monitors, display monitors, racking gear, etc???
Yep! Modular, synths, speakers, outboard are on sep switches so I can power that stuff off ans leave the computer on without having to cold start
I have a question... just watched this again, are you running VEP on the new Mac Pro or is it running stand alone on a separate machine and Cat5'd into the Mac Pro... I think I missed that or misunderstood... I know you've said you are running VEP "stand alone".... just curious as to "where".... the video is great, and helps a great deal... so thanks for that!
all in the same machine. I have VEP running 2 ways... Standalone using a discreet interface (was an HDSPe MADI, but now DANTE as a test) and then the server/host crap.
The standalone is mimicking old second (and third) computer templates that were just on 24/7. All my current writing templates are using serve/plugin... but can work with either method.
Any way we can get a hi-res PDF of the full setup flow?
contact me at www.neilparfitt.com and I'll send it over :)
I would love a PDF file à of this. Juste to print It in A3 and read it all day XD. Its flabergasting
Drop me a message at www.neilparfitt.com - I can emai you the pdf :)
Neil, thank you for this! Truly a graceful and wonderful system you've constructed. I have one big question I'm really hoping you might find a few minutes to respond to:
I have a somewhat similar synth mountain, being sequenced from Logic, out via midi on an RME Raydat to the modular and synth modules, back into Ferrofish A16s, going via lightpipe to the Raydat and back into Logic. But I've been having a hell of a time dealing with Midi latency. How have you resolved this? I can see you're using Midiexpress's to control the synth modules (I'll leave out the adat to ES modules for the modular, because that isn't totally relevant to my setup--I've got my modular controlled via midi to a Hermod).
How did you settle on the Midiexpress, and was this a solution that you settled on due to other midi units giving you problems? Do you experience any per-note midi latency? Clock isn't much of an issue for syncable things like drum machines, but basic latency when I press a key on my master controller or send a note from Logic's midi roll is really inconsistent and almost always enough to be audible (and thus break the workflow). It's not reliably late or early, so setting up note delays in Logic midi sends hasn't been particularly helpful, at least not in a way that works consistently each time I open a new project from my template. I've tried setting up midi sends via external channels via environment (like I used to before Pro X), and also via the External Instrument plugin. the EIP seems to be slightly tighter than the old way, but still pretty unreliable, beyond the scope of simple midi jitter, which I would happily accept.
Sorry for the lengthy question, but I haven't found anyone else talking about a similar arrangement, and I'm dying to know how you've solved these kinds of problems. Thanks for everything you've contributed to the community already!
Hey thx!! What's your actually MIDI interface? Are you connecting point to point or daisy chaining multiple via thru? The actual latency of the outboard should always be the same - in my case it's the same as triggering an internal VI (approx 6ms so it feels no different than anything else). If your notes are triggering inconsistent, that's more worrisome. Is your MIDI interface on the hub? I cant imagine RME's MIDI being flakey - but I haven't used it in years. The A16/ADAT/RAYDAT won't introduce latency issues (beyond your host DAW's buffer/monitoring latency) . Lemme know.
I was running 4 x Unitors but they got super flakey with the new machine so the MOTU's happened as some various music friends were unloading them cheap. That being said, if you're using multiple 8x8's - DONT use the MIDI express unless you have a USB hub you can sequence up in an exact order every time. Otherwise, Audiomidi setup will sometimes connect the wrong 8x8 to your defined midi stuff. It's a nightmare. The 128 has no internal memory for which USB address it was connected to. The XT on the other hand, has a battery backup that remembers that stuff - so If I was doing this again - I would have used 5 x XT's to skip the headaches! :)
ah I just saw the MIDI out part on the RAYDAT comment. So - you're using the 2 ports to drive how much gear? If you're cascading using midi thru on multiple devices, each loop through will induce latency for anything after it.. so this can cause some mega MIDI timing slop vs point to point on a 1 synth per port on an 8x8 or bigger.
@@NeilParfittMusic Thank you so much for the responses! Yes, I'm using the midi ports on the Raydat itself since I figured MIDI over PCIe was about as fast as I could hope for (though I might be mistaken there). I'm not daisy chaining any of the midi via thru ports -- instead I've got the MIDI outs of the raydat going to a Kawai MAV-8 MIDI router, which allows me to route 4 MIDI sources to 8 destinations. Your comment has me thinking it's possible the Kawai unit is introducing latency, but I haven't noticed that happening with the other sources I sometimes use through it (e.g. an MPC)--though that doesn't mean it isn't the culprit. I'll have to A/B going direct to a synth versus through the Kawai.
Ultimately, this may be something going wrong on the computer's end, and not a hardware issue -- it may be down to how much effort my old but suped up 2012 Mac Pro has to expend during playback, combined with the inherent low CPU priority for MIDI. I can't really think of anything else! If you have any other ideas, I'm all ears!! Thanks again for taking the time to respond!
I think I may have figured it out, so I figured it might be worth adding here, in the event that others stumble upon this with the same problem.
My big mistake was the way I was using the external instrument plugins in Logic. While it made logical sense (pun intended, Apple, take notice) to use the midi tracks with the EIPs only as MIDI sends without designating an audio input, and then create corresponding audio tracks set to record the respective audio input of the external hardware -- this apparently messes up everything about the way logic sends external MIDI. Instead, I had to designate the audio input within the EIP plugin, then route the output of the track with EIP to a bus. Then, after deleting the automatically created Aux for that bus, I created an audio channel with its input set as the bus to which the EIP track was sending. I then repeated this routing scheme for all other EIP sends in my template.
After doing this, things appear to be staying in time and reacting effectively to MIDI notes sent from Logic (knock on wood it stays this way). I could immediately feel a difference, both with the respective hardware instruments, but also with the project as a whole (e.g., clock appears tighter on other instruments with internal sequencers and modular sequencers, etc.). It's as if the simple (and logical!) routing I was doing initially was sending the whole MIDI engine into quiet chaos behind the scenes. I have no idea why Apple engineers would have designed things this way without making this bug (feature?) known to the public, but alas.
Thanks, as always, Neil, for all the help -- I hope this helps someone else that is having a similar problem!
This might be cleared up in the next video, and tbh I've seen your other videos and you probably already said why and I'm just not remembering. Logic and protools.. is that just a personal "I learned logic but the industry needs pro-tools output and I'm not going to relearn every bit of a different DAW for it" issue?
Protools is the standard for post production audio deliverables.
Logic is my personal preference for composing.
I could write in protools, but I’m not a fan of the midi editing within.
Yooo. Huge mouse on screen...
1:30 :)
Which app did you use for making the diagrams?
It’s called “Omnigraffle”
Thanks Neil, happy holidays!
I thought dorkfest was in October
I nearly failed Audio Engineering because of signal flow. If they presented this to me I would have put down the pen and walked out.
General Rule of thumb... unless it’s networking or computer peripherals .. signals only go one direction regardless if it’s audio, midi, clocking, digital audio (aes, madi) etc
Letting someone else be first, probably....maybe?
Neil, you're a very smart fellow, and your studio setup is truly stunning! IMHO, you should lose the cartoon characterization. It is demeaning to you...
Hrmmm my mom doesn’t like it either 😎
With that beard and hair you look like there were-nerd! lol
Cause and effect of lockdowns hahaha
This mouse pointer is the size of the butt of people who complains about dumb things in youtube videos
Hahahaha!