I drove home from Inverness a journey of 465 miles the car never missed a beat. I filled up with diesel which took me less than 5 minutes before leaving it cost me £75 and when I got home I still had 1/4 of a tank left. I used my car normally without worrying about my range, I had the lights on, AC on, heated wing mirrors/ heated seats/heated rear view screen/ whippers on due to weather conditions,I used the radio most of the way also had the sat nav on some devices plugged in to charge such as mobile phones and a game consolse. We stopped at Tebay for an hour for some food and to rest without the worry of finding a charger for the vehicle before carrying on with our journey. Until I can do the same journey in a EV I will still be driving a diesel.
I also do a regular trip to Inverness, mine being 621 miles from Devon. On my own I do the trip in one, often over the speed limit? 10.5 hours driving, about 2.5 hours charging/peeing /eating etc I do it in my Kia ENiro 4+ so with a heat pump the heating or air con take less than 1to3 miles of range ? all the other things in car are 12 volt so cost next to nothing, as like a old battery charger toping up the battery from the big battery? I return a 3.5 Kw per Mile and about half the cost of the petrol Kia Sportage we had before. ( I also own 2 Classic BMWs So I am also a petrol head)
Have 2003 Volvo Estate which tows a caravan also a Leaf as a runabout. Whith the increase in electric prices the Lear is cheaper to run in summer, the diesel in winter. Reason? The heater! In the diesel the heater runs from the wast heat from the engine, in the EV the 3kW comes from the traction battery and that makes the difference.
Excellent summary, I'll keep my Defender and pass it on to my daughter when I can no longer climb into it. In that way keeping a car going and maintaining it will be better for the world than churning out new cars.
What information in the user’s manual did your loan EV come with? Regarding charging and compatibility of the car’s architecture voltage with fast chargers and the compatibility of supplied leads and the plugs to be compatible with fast chargers like at Goodwood Aerodrome you were at: there were two plug-in areas within the single socket on the charger at Goodwood. The car manufacturers must produce EVs without requiring 3 phase industrial electric systems.
I understand what you’re saying, but continuing to burn fossil fuels isn’t the answer. Ev charging will drop again once gas is phased out and people have a chance to switch to alternative methods. I 100% agree tho, I feel we should be converting current ICE cars to electric rather than buying completely new cars as the waste from ice cars will be crazy.
Totally agree and I’m doing the same. Buying a mini electric for short and local journeys m but keeping my ICE for longer trips and holidays. Definitely not going fully electric!
Great explanation on EVs. I briefly owned one this year and it was a nightmare charging as no home charger. For now I'll keep my 2.2 litre diesel that can do 600 miles on a 5 minute fill up.
But you *did* actually have a home charger Eddie. There are usually a few in each room in the house.....plus you *have* to sleep, so that would be the ideal time to charge.
@@Brian-om2hh there needs to be a change of language as the charger is onboard unless you're lucky enough to have a DC charger installed at home. Anything AC is simply a supply. A supply limited by the phase or the onboard charger. This is part of the confusion and why I scratch my head at PIH 4kW Max plugged into 22kW supply at 48p pkWh when the 7kW is available at 28p.....
I owned a 2003 Volkswagen Jetta TDI get 50 miles per gallon. It’s been paid for for over 18 years now long time. That car makes so much sense to me and it’s so good that I recently purchased another one that I am also restoring because I’ve become very proficient in maintaining and working on these cars. The high cost of Evies is ridiculous. My diesel Volkswagen, the second one I purchased cost me $1000 to purchase.
But due to the criminal manufacturer we call Volkswagen the atmosphere is a much dirtier place. No one in Volkswagen has ever been penalised for their criminality and its a total disgrace. I have owned several VW GTI's but NEVER again will I buy Volkwagen or any GERMAN car for that matter. Rogues and criminals the lot of them.
Exactly. And if people REALLY cared about the planet instead of using it as an excuse to buy EVs (although that's what the hype tells them so to a point you can't blame people for being dumb and ignorant), they would buy an old car that will save the equivalent of 70,000 miles of emissions because it's already been built. EVERY old car that is scrapped and replaced with a new EV means tons more emissions that would not have occurred if people ran those cars for another 50000 miles instead of scrapping them. But you've no chance trying to convince the EV brigade of that.
When Toyota Prius’s and Nissan leafs were the darlings of the eco warriors it was calculated that a diesel car was far more eco friendly over its lifetime allowing for creation and scrapping of the cars. I’m not against them if fact some are quite awesome for instance the Audi e-tron GTS. But I’m just not convinced they are better for the environment. As you noted a pre built car has already had its build carbon paid for. Cheers from NZ
This is probably an appropriate video to update my EV experience. I bought my EV a Hyundai Kona Electric 64kWh towards the end of July. I do relatively high mileage, but it is evenly spread, so my daily usage is 40-100 miles, rather than having longer, less frequent journeys. Most of my mileage is around town, where EV's are at their most efficient. With that in mind, during the warmer months, I would usually average over 6 miles.kWh and the car would say I had upwards of 350 miles at full charge. It is a very different story in the colder weather with AC on, heated seats, heated steerign wheel, etc. During the recent cold snap, I remember being stuck in traffic, whilst it was -6°C and my car said I was getting 0.4 miles/kWh, which would equate to a total range of 25.6miles. To be fair, I had just started driving, the battery was cold and my average would always end up much higher than that. At that point I had also not had much time to experiment with the AC and see how I could use it most efficiently, so it was just full power, demist and everything on. Having had a little more time to figure things out, it appears that fan speed is probably the biggest draw on power from the AC. My fan has settings from zero to eight and five is the minimum require to keep the windows from misting up. Once I had all of my settings sorted I was tending to average between 2.8 - 3.2 miles/kWh during the coldest weather, so about half the range I was seeing during the summer, although because the car uses historical data to calculate range I never actually saw my reported range drop below 270 miles at full charge. Now, with temperatures back between 5-10°C most of the time, I'm getting around 4 miles/kWh with the same AC settings and with the heated seat and steering wheel on most of the time. Strangely, I've just done a 60 mile round trip on faster A roads and averaged 4.5 miles/kWh. Prior to that my highest recorded average in my journey history was 4.4 miles/kWh on 30th November, which was my normal town driving. This seems counter intuitive, given that EV's are more economical round town, but the reasons are likely to be that today's journey was a single trip, so the battery stayed warm, whereas my normal round town mileage is made up of several shorter journeys. Also today there was no sitting in traffic, which is fine in warmer weather, because there is very little drain on the battery while stationary, but when the AC, etc. are running, there is still quite a lot of drain while stationary. Another thing to bare in mind with the lower economy is that charging will take that much longer, because you will have used a lot more charge for the same mileage. I only use the slowest 2.2kWh charging and during the summer it would take 4-10 hours to recharge 40-100 miles of driving. In the recent cold weather, due to my efficiency being halved, the charging would take twice as long. This could have been a potential issue for me if my mileage was consistently at the higher end, because I would not have had time to fully recharge before the following day. Fortunately, that is an unlikely scenario for me, although there were odd days when the car wasn't fully charged. It also meant that I had to be a lot more careful about doing any extra unexpected journeys. On the whole things are still working out well. I was aware when I bought the car that the colder weather would have this effect, which is why I chose a car that appeared to have much higher range than I would need on a day to day basis. It also helps to allow for the unexpected.
So in belgium 1kwh is 50 eur cent So 2t eur cent per mile 1 kwh from fossil gen is 750 grm co2 from coal or 650 frpm nat gas In the worst case cold with all acc on my ford is 7 liter per 100 km Best case 4.5
Great video, I have been enjoying the EV debate (mainly courtesy of utube) for a couple of years now. I run a small petrol engined Volvo XC40 but have two electric bicycles which I love using, are simple to charge and can be pedalled if (they never have) run out of power! My motivation and decision to move to an EV car seems further away than ever as the subsidies get withdrawn and the economic case gets even more questionable. Yes I like to do my bit for the environment but even that is less convincing for the EV on a personal basis. I’ll stick with the small engined petrol car thanks.
Thanks for this info. The prices of the Kona EV are really coming down now (2nd user). Do you know if you can preheat the interior from the battery only as I cannot charge at home (legally)? I was considering a 28kwh Ioniq but for a few thousand more I could get an okay milage '19 or '20 plate Kona with that much bigger battery! We are a 1 car family so it has to do everything and the public chargers here in North Wales aren't great - but thanks to Elon for opening up his Superchargers! I'd love an E-Niro but the prices are a bit higher than the Kona and I'm a Golf driver at the moment but the E-golf has a smaller battery and (not that rapid) rapid charging.
@@computerbob06 My 69 Reg doesn't support the Hyundai app, so I can't pre-heat the battery or do anything else remotely. A colleague at work had a lower spec 21 model, which does support the app, so I'm not exactly sure which model year was first to support it. I find it strange that my 69 plate doesn'y have app support, because the Veloster worked with the app from somewhere around 2013 and it's obviously a more useful feature for an EV, as there is more that an app can do with an EV.
A big factor that needs to be taken into consideration is depreciation. I am retired and do low mileage and run as a daily driver a 42 year old classic car that has no road tax, cheap insurance and possibly little or no depreciation. Good video/info.
Another big factor that most EV proponents never talk about is the much higher level of EMF (Electro Magnetic Field) radiation inside the cabin of an EV compared to a Petrol/Diesel vehicle. Long term exposure to high EMP radiation can lead to cancer. It’s a price that I’m not willing to pay.
IMO this is the best video on this topic available on UA-cam. My diesel car is going to become a cuban car and will be restored for the next 30 years (if I live that long).
I will be keeping my 63 plate C4 115bhp 50 mpg diesel no tax and no problems in the past 8 years since bought, still looks and runs like the day I bought it.
Thank you for this video, I've not considered buying an electric car so didn't know much about the different types of chargers etc and the necessary infrastructure. So I learnt a few things about what you might encounter with EV ownership despite having a background working with aircraft batteries and regular vehicle batteries in the RAF. Nothing I learnt has convinced me to go out and swap my diesel Golf for an EV but it has made me realise just how much I take for granted the 500 mile range and convenience of filling up quickly. This 500 mile range doesn't half in the winter too.
Excellent video! I'm looking at my first EV possibly MG4 as a company car and have been doing all the learning about range charging cost etc. I currently have a Prius Hybrid (non plug in) for the past 3 years and have averaged 56mpg over 40K miles. MyBIK on an EV will drop to 2 percent from prob what will be 27 percent on a new Hybrid model so this the obvious appeal and will pay for the cost of a home charger in a year. My big issues are range I may need, having to use a rapid charger at much higher cost and being able to get an EV home energy tariff at a reasonable rate. These may give you cheaper overnight charging at 12p per kwh but the day rate is higher than the norm. I'm really not sure if the compromises that have to be made are going to be worth it for me, particularly in winter. Still sat on the fence.
£1000 for a home charger, more to run expensive than a diesel, and there's the public charging at horrendous rates, and the limited range in the cold. Really sells EVs, how marvelous.
My 2022 ID4 is about 15% of the total operating costs of my 2014 Touareg X TDI (including, tires, maintenance, windshields, wear and tear, etc), charging level 2 at home, occasional DC Fast Charge, charging level 2 at work. At 6750 miles on the ID4, I've saved $1250 in diesel over my TDI. 3.2miles/kWh long term average so far. I burn about 13% battery each leg of my commute, I charge every 2.5 days, maybe one more time over the weekend if I go anywhere. My record all surface streets, same work commute, I reached 4.9miles/kWh. Lead footed, never below 2.8 miles/kWh. With the cold, it takes longer to charge. Coldest it has been here in Phoenix so far this year is 37F. It hasn't been in the deep freeze just yet.
Thank you well explained and informative. Snag is , the more videos I watch, and articles I read, about electric cars the more I’m put off them ! It’s not possible for me to charge at home , like millions of other people in terraced housing, flats, rented accommodation etc , cars will only be for the wealthy with driveways and garages . I enjoy driving , often on a whim, and will always look for alternative routes than the way I’m supposed to go , I will not use satnav , and to consider where I can charge on route is absurd. Breaks are taken at a picturesque spot, not an awful motorway services. Almost all petrol cars will do an easy 400 miles on a 5 minute stop . I’m not tempted to swap my 2.4 Accord for anything electric, even if I had the 50 grand plus needed for something comparable.
Great video Pete. The time and effort you go to making apparently complicated things very simple is really appreciated. I've watched many ev videos from many "youtubers" over the years, and this is by far the best. Top job sir 👍
Very very good video. The charging/ efficiency/range/power nomenclature all explained in a clear and practical way. I run a Skoda Enyaq which I’ve had since July and I’m still learning stuff the whole time. One thing I should add on the subject of cold weather efficiency is yes it reduces a lot especially on short journeys where the battery pack doesn’t get a chance to warm up, but if you’re going a bit further, once you get over about 30 miles and the batteries have warmed up (providing you’re being careful with speed of course), it improves. A tip is to spec heated seats and steering wheel if you can. That way you don’t need to heat the cabin as much as they use less power than the heater. Great vid!
Another great & clear informative video from PP. This video shoul be broadcast as a Public Information Film on Ev's. It explained a lot about EV ownership, which I really didn't understand at first, but I better understand now, thanks to PP. You really should have a full time TV program reviewing the Pro and Cons of alternative fuel for vehicles, your presentation is so very professional, I can't fault it, and much better than some I could mention on TV car shows. please keep up the good work PP. 👍
You never thought....how much electricity will cost . .and what will happen in case of black outs (gov announced) like in case of water usage during summer ☀️??
A good attempt but surprising several points not mentioned. For AC charging, anything above 7kW will need your EV be capable for taking 11 or 22kW. Most now do 11 very few do 22. And you’ll need a type 2 cable with the extra wires (unlike the one he showed at the beginning).
DC charging he mentioned 800volt systems can charge faster; true but only if the EVSE (charger) is capable (most are not). Price compared to diesel; very unfair not to mention that most EV owners opt for a discounted night rate, many don’t inflate the day time rate but provide highly discounted night rate, 7.5p is common. For a moderately efficient EV that’s 2.08p per mile for the first journey each day (for those that can charge at home)
Been saying for ages that’s why fuel prices are still so high at the moment because if the price of fuel was where it should be around £1.20 a ltr but if they did that then it’s cheaper to use petrol or diesel as charging on a public charger would cost more and that goes against what the government want… Also transport companies have been very quiet about the cost of fuel. A few years ago when it was £1.50 a ltr they were up in arms about it… Because they use fuel cards they get it at a reduced cost closer to the price it should be…..
You make some really interesting points. I totally agree. Some other points to consider: We've already crossed the £2.00 Per lire threshold in 2022. Prices are "quite reasonable"? right now, but over the course of time we will stealthily be right back up there again. This time the backlash wont be so severe as we've already tasted it. 2nd point. I'm seeing a 20p ish difference between diesel and Petrol Per litre. My reckoning is that this gap will widen in a bid to make diesels more and more undesirable.
Here is a challenge - make a video that even slightly convinces me to buy an ev. But bearing in mind I'm 70 it is going to be an uphill challenge 👍. 3 speed charging, only one speed petrol, diesel and no need for an app 👍👍
I chose to go non-EV last year in favour of a diesel BMW. Glad I did TBO having seen the issues with EV charging over XMAS. My beemer will do 640 miles on a tank at proper UK motorway speeds thank you !
Really good honest video - thank you. There are a couple of important points to add. 1. Not all electric cars can accept 22Kw AC charging (and on some cars it's an option). 2. The charge curve is an important consideration. Manufacturers quote peak charging rates - but this can be misleading because different cars have different charging curves. It's also not possible to conclude that a car with a higher peak charging rate must charge up faster. It's also not correct to state that double the charging speed means half the time eg if you are charging a battery starting with 90% charge, it won't matter if you plug into a 100Kw or 150Kw charger outlet - the car will throttle the charge back anyway. 3. The 20/80% rule is meant for daily use - you can charge your car to 100% for a road trip. Also the 20/80 rule is for lithium batteries. Manufacturers of Ion Phosphate batteries (LFP) recommend charging to 100%, and you should charge to 100% at least once per week.
Yes - these are critical points that really ought to be corrected and clarified in a follow up video. The thought of another million or so views of this video with people being told about rapid charging EVs to “full” and working out it will take 2 hours for a 100 kWh battery at a 50 kW charger fills me with horror! This is not an efficient use of the charging network, and is just a waste of everyone’s time which would just lead to even more queues.
@itsbillN I assume by your comment you are not an EV driver? Most EV drivers are sensible enough to know you don’t ever try charging your EV to 100% while you are out and about. When it drops to 30% head to a supercharger and top up to 80%. You are on your way in 16 to 20 minutes . The worst I had was this recent spell of cold in the UK where it took 40 minutes to do it.
A few modern small engined petrol cars get similar efficiencies to a very frugal diesel car, so these will make sense for a lot of people too. Thank you for your very helpful video.
@@PetrolPed Indeed, a very good point. And with the ICE fuel price differential stacked heavily in favour of petrol (for now) this point is even more relevant. I've just swapped from a 12 year old C class diesel to a 3 year old petrol Honda Jazz, both auto's. The Jazz (not turbo, not hybrid) appears to run on fresh air, fuel economy is brilliant !! My priority is running costs, the Jazz is an absolute winner and it is a versatile little car to boot !!
@@jeta1f35 The Honda Jazz was claimed to achieve 60mpg but in some tests it came out at 73mpg. Still more expensive than an EV, especially a 'free charging for life' Tesla.
Wow! What an excellent explanation, on costs to run an EV. Enough said, like when I commented on your towing a caravan video, I for one will be staying on diesel for as long as I possibly can! The car I have is fully paid for, something I couldn't do with a EV, it will also, probably last for many more years, before needing expensive repairs, like replacing the battery, Also just covered 368 miles over this weekend, only took 5 minutes to fill up, still has half a tank left, and I've been able to be as warm as toast all the time I was driving in very cold weather, with all the electric creature comforts, and safe driving aids on, like heated windows, mirrors, Satellite navigation and the like!
Great video. Travelling back home from holiday I charged my ipace to give me 40 miles left when I got home, but doing 70 mph on the motorway it became obvious I wasn’t going to make it, I slowed down to 50mph and got home with more than 40 miles range left.
Nice video Ped. I feel like you could also add a few more details. 1. Anyone with an EV, who would expect to charge at home, would likely sign up to an EV plan with their electricity supplier. If you were with Octopus Energy the Octopus Go tariff you could charge at 12p/kWh between 00:30 - 04:30 every night. 2. How about servicing costs? How much is a simple yearly oil change now? On my VW diesel family car, the oil cost £60 alone without filters, cleaners or labour costs. You also save on brake wear, through regen braking. 3. Mechanical reliability. There are no cam-belt changes required. No water pump/fuel pump/injector or alternator failures. I have suffered all of those in my time motoring. No exhaust repairs required. 4. I've also suffered catalytic converter theft. My neighbour has been targeted twice in as many years. I'm sure owning an EV can be trying at times, but I'm beginning to see the benefits, and am looking forward to the day when I can afford to change to one.
To be fair, though, if an electric car (or a hybrid) does suffer a significant fault, a lot of the time God himself wouldn’t be able to fix it, and if he could, he’d barely be able to afford it. I’m long-standing friends with the owner of a very busy, high end independent workshop and some of the stories (and there are many) are hair raising.
Great video and good explanation to anyone thinking of buying an EV. On a personal level I will not be joining the EV revolution for another couple of years. The reasons being :- 1/ current pricing of a new EV is much too high , 2/ there’s not really any tested data on residual resale values, 3 / what is the real life of the batteries on an EV I.e will these become like old apple iPhones and not hold the charge as long and what would be the cost of maintenance, and 4 / you mentioned it already and that is tax, which initially part of the attraction of moving to an EV. Thanks as ever for a great insight.
I had a Leaf24 bought for £9500 in 2018 traded in this year 2022 for £7500 . No road tax for 4 years my old car was £250 a year tax, most of my charging was on the free chargers. So realistically I have saved £1300 a year on fuel so them 4 years £6000+ in savings.
@@neilmaddox8745 i agee, but many EV drivers are obsessed by those numbers what you say, trying to maximize the proof of an owning an EV. In a conventional car u don't care so much. just how good its, comfort, and liability. resale value its also a strong nightmare soon for EV. not all of us are rich to throw away a whole car.
This is the best summary for EVs I’ve watched. For me, they are not the future unless the infrastructure significantly improves and the range improves. I also read that, to protect the batteries you should never fully charge them and never let them go below 20% of charge meaning you are only using 60% of the battery. I tow a large caravan with my Volvo XC60 2.4 diesel. The last trip was around 330 miles which we did on one tank of fuel with a couple of stops just to stretch our legs. ThAt would not be possible in an ev when you would need extended stops to charge. It just wouldn’t be practical. I thought of buying one to replace a 12 year old Aygo for my wife but the cost new of an ev is prohibitive so I just bought another Aygo. Definitely not for me.
you can happily use the 99% of the battery, you should just never leave them standing with very low charge or very high charge states. So use it down to 1% (if youve got nerves of steel!) and charge to 100%, but make sure if you run it down extremely low that it goes on a charger straight away to bring it back up above 20% and if you need the full 100% range then charge it to 100% but schedule it to finish charging to 100% just before you depart. My car has done 34k miles in 11 months using lots of DC high power charging (around 40% of my charging) and 60% AC at home....... often using 100% charge and taken it down to as low as 4% charge when arriving at home or at a fast charger (low charge states like this = max charge speed for Ultrafast chargers) and my degradation on the battery is 2.36%...... so I have lost 1.8kwh of storage. Degradation is fastest in the first 12 months. Lots of misinformation out there, but your spot on about the XC60 and the caravan
Why this obsession? What's wrong with 300 miles? As Tom Malhoney ( State of Charge channel) suggested, don't worry too much about range. Concentrate on charging instead. Hardly anyone will drive over 200-250 miles without stopping. But, those chargers are SHIT. But, I'd still prefer FCEV. Onsite Hydrogen electrolysis at the gas station. They already exist in COMMIEFORNISTAN around L.A.
Great stuff m8. A number of things I would like to add. Firstly, a lot of utility providers give significant reduction on charging during the night/morning. I am currently paying 7.5p per kilowatt hour from 12.30 to 4.30 am. so I can put 28kws into my ev from a 7kwh charger = £2.10 = 21%. I have also had solar installed and can produce 5kwph in the summer and intend to set up free ev charging to local ev owners in my road during excess production days.
Yeah Octopus Go has been great but cheap rate is now up at 12p/kWh with the rest of the day at 44.35p/kWh. I think the standing charge is also up with the highest tariff option.
Re efficiency: as you say Peter, the most influential factor is miles per charge and the outside temperature plays the card here. Our Renault Zoe in the summer gets a 200 mile range. When the temperature falls in the spring and autumn the range drops to about 150-160 miles. During this cold spell recently the range dropped further down to 120 miles, so thats nearly a 50% reduction in range. What is also not mentioned is with rapid charging, the more rapid charging you put your battery through, the bigger toll it takes on your battery's life, so don't expect it to last very long if your regularly sticking 50Kw to 100Kw into it. Much better to be charging it at home on a 7Kw charger and this should give the battery a much longer life.
@@johnhutchinson635 It is the case. Like any battery, it starts degrading from the day it was made and is made worse by very rapid charging. For every fast charge you should do at least 5-6 normal charges to help equalise the cells. As one of the guys on one of the other youtube channels said months ago, "only buy an EV when you absolutely have too..."
@@grahamtricker4103 It's not quite as simple as that, a lot depends on the architecture of the battery and its capacitance and like engines, not all batteries have the same properties , charge capacity and degradation. Often you will now find that whilst the battery pack is quoted there is a 'usable' % as well, i.e. the non useable part is for systems purposes but also factors in the life cycle degradation. Most higher end EV's now have a 10 year battery performance and integrity warranty. As for your quote from another UA-cam channel, I recall the same being said when the switch from leaded to unleaded and when when diesel cars came on the scene, there's always a reticence to change exacerbated this time by hype over the Government 'imposing' this on the people.
Not all EV are created equal. My BMW i3 has a very good BMS (battery management system) to ensure that the battery doesn't get cooked by charges. These days I do much more 7kw charging than 50kW but for a while it was living on pretty much nothing but 50kW rapid charging practically every day. It's 8yrs old and the battery capacity is no worse than 90% of when it left the factory.
I would like to use a new term I have invented ‘ socket hogger ‘ the guy who drives 10 miles to work , plugs in his BMW EV ( as it is free ) and leaves it plugged in 8 hours whilst he is working no one else can use it ! He doesn’t even need the charge . A lady rang in Jeremy Vine TV show ( article on EV ) boasting how she plugs her EV in at local supermarket swipes her supermarket app walks home and comes back next day and has never paid anything SOCKET HOGGER , this will become more common as people will find free charge points .
This is a very very informative video. I picked up two things which are incidental to the video. The first is that the incentives at the moment go buy an EV are being reduced and second is that the majority of people are choosing hybrid when buying an EV rather than pure plug in electric which they are often charging for free at work for free. This reduces range anxiety but it is also still possible to use on a 2kW 'granny charger' at home without shelling out £1000 for a 7kW charger. I get the sense a lot of people now only see the incentive to get an EV is to avoid congestion and emission charges in urban areas and then only doing top up charging at the supermarket or at home or completely free at work and still using the petrol engine a lot of the time. In 2030 that is going to change. Sales of ICE will be banned and then hybrid sales will be banned in 2035. I think we will see a lot of resistance to going full EV in 2035, especially if the price of electricity is higher than diesel/petrol. A lot of people I know have a hybrid for urban driving and commuting to work (where they often get free charging) and they can buy on company car scheme. However, they do also have an old diesel 4 x 4 for long distance driving which they intend to run until the wheels fall off. I think it would be very interesting to interview EV all-electric and hybrid owners to see how they see the real incentives and how they really use their EV car. I think it is a lot different from what Govt would have us believe.
In December 42284 new Battery only cars were registered in the UK......PHEV 8367, HEV 13743, MHEV 13293, MHEV Diesel 4678.....even adding up all the different varaints of hybrid , they still dont match the total number of Battery Only cars sold. BEV were incidently the biggest segment of cars sold......Diesel werent even 1/10th of the sales at 4006, and petrol was a close second to the BEV with 42091 sales. So BEV 32.9%, Petrol 32.8%, HEV (non plug in) 10.7%, PHEV 6.5%, MHEV Diesel 3.6% and at the bottom Diesel at 3.1%. So basically all segments dropped on previous years apart for full Battery EVs which grew from 25.5% of the market to 32.9. Petrol dropped for 38.7% to 32.8% and diesel dropped from 4.8%to 3.1%. Full diesel only will be gone from sale within two years as nobody is buying them anymore!
Thank you, Pete explained very concisely ( no waffle just straightforward sound advice ) which even I as an ordinary layman can understand 👍👍 I still think listening to you and the AA I will stick with my BMW diesel which is less than 3 years old and gives me an average fuel consumption of 55 miles per gallon and costs considerably less than an EV.
I did wonder myself, I have a pool car, 6 years old, Merc A180D 1.5 Peugeot diesel engine in it. Fortunately I regularly achieve 950 miles to a tank and once 1150 before I had to fill up. If I do less than 900 I lose money on every work trip. The WLTP for the car says it can only do 800 miles. On that basis my light foot will either transfer to the EV when it comes... or the situation will be even worse.
lets do the numbers stevie, at the current £1.72 p/l then you're paying 14.2 pence per mile on fuel alone, given the current cap at 34 p pKwh an EV would have to be doing less than 2.2 miles per Kwh to make your "understanding" valid
Great piece. I've had an Audi ETron since September and I'm not convinced with it. The range is awful... 190miles in good weather fully charged and 160 miles or less depending on heating etc in cold weather. On a positive note the car is great to drive but I part ex a 3lt Q8 for the ETron and am seriously thinking of changing back to the oil burner. Public charging network is becoming very expensive.
The Audis seem rather inefficient Tom. Before you rush to swap back to diesel, try something like the Ioniq 5 or Polestar. Or perhaps even a Genesis or Kia EV6. These are notably more efficient than the Audi..... You need to subscribe to the charging networks you regularly use (maybe you already did?). This does keep the cost down a bit. Any new Kia/Hyundai or Genesis EV gets a preferential charging rate at Ionity chargers for 5 years Tom. Something like 30 to 40% off the usual rate, I think......
Very good. As someone that has just ordered (possibly) my last diesel (FPace D300 following your review) I have not been looking forward to being forced into an EV. This video made me feel slightly more enthused and maybe in 4 years or so time the infrastructure will be better! Keep up the good work.
I could not dream of being able to run my life and business with a EV. It’s just not possible, we need a mix of fuels for our transport. My recycled diesel is far more environmentally friendly than a new EV and can do everything i ask of it, refuelled to 600 miles range in a few minutes. I can find a PHEV to do the job but looking at the emissions they produce it is far worse than my diesel. This country has gone nuts. EV’s have a place but so do others, banning petrol and diesel is the most stupid thing to do. Your math will be altered if you turn your heater on or in cold weather. Still for shorter journeys EV’s have a place, I just can’t see my customers paying me to sit and drink coffee for 2-4 hours a day waiting for the car to charge. I would go out of business. Great video…👍👍
Great video. As a side note, 2 pin plugs in the USA is a thing of 50 years ago at best. Our hundred year old house has a couple but a ground electrode is common. Also, all homes have single phase 240V service, however electric company transformers also supply a split phase neutral to each home that allows for 110v to be utilized. Home AC charging to 12kw (50A) is not unusual.
There are many US videos on YT that only mention and show a 2-pin plug. I'm aware that 240v is possible but my understanding is that it's 110v that's commonly used. All appliances made for the US seem to be 110v.
@@PetrolPed um what? You mean like an adapter to plug your shaver in or something? That's your metric for the US power grid? Electric stoves, water heaters, clothes dryers, central air conditioning, arc welders, RV hookups, pool and spa pumps all require 240v. Most commercial areas have 3 phase.
@@PetrolPed Yup. Intended for nonmetallic low power items. Things like a table lamp or a wall wart will likely only have two pins. Also 110 is a thing of the 1950s too, 120 has long been the standard, usually pushing 125. We have standard outlets for 240V items like a range or dryer, the newer ones have four blades. Search NEMA electrical...
Just found your channel from Detroit - Excellent! I've been involved with the motor industry for 50 years - During your cost comparison here, you talk about "getting a cup of coffee" while your car charges - For a long charge, you may also decide to get a meal - With petrol, you may or may not choose to do so at a fuel stop, but you are more likely to when charging an EV - To me, it's an oversight to not include these food/beverage costs into total cost of driving - You could apply a 50% discount factor to compensate for choosing to buy food/beverage, but to truly evaluate "all-in" costs, food/bev while waiting should be added - In addition, I have never heard anyone discuss "gross" cost out of a driver's total, after-tax total income budget - That is, I pay about 40% tax for federal, state, social security and hospitalization - Therefore, driving costs are actually a much higher amount because I must first pay income tax on every dollar I keep and spend on driving.
Really informative video, but I am unconvinced about EV tech/practicality for on-street parkers and will hang on to my 1.6 litre, 55+mpg, 500+mile range diesel Toyota for absolutely as long as possible just for its sheer convenience
As he says at the start of the video “if you don’t have your own EV charger.” I do and at £5 for around 180 miles I’ll take that over diesel. VW Passat to Hyundai Ioniq I’m quids in Great video 👏👍
I have had a 30 kwhr leaf for nearly 7 years now. I have tried to use it longer distance but the charging infrastructure has always been bad but is getting worse because of the greater car / charger ratio now. I use mine only for journeys within my tethered home charger range and a diesel vehicle ( we have two of 600 and 650 miles range brimmed ) with no anxiety of any kind on long journeys. The leaf has lost 3 battery bars now but even so, for what we use it for will be invaluable for the vast majority of our more local journeys, being charged now at 5 p per kwhr still, going up to 12 p per kwhr in Feb, on overnight charging, on Octopus go. It is very cheap motoring, more so because our car was less than £22k when we bought it with the then £5k gov grant and grant for the dumb charger as well, which i still use. I can charge this smaller battery car even to it's max from empty, within the 4 hour cheap overnight rate. I truly believe that we have the best combination. It is horses for courses as far as I am concerned. We generally both drive the Leaf as a first, cheaper option, saving us a lot of money now. Not only that, having an electric car gives us the right to have Octopus go and we not only use the night time cheap electricity for the leaf, it also allows us to use the high cost washing machine, dish washer and tumble drier in the low electricity price period also. I now also have an eco flow on order, primarily for off grid high consumption ac items when I am in the camper van but I will be charging it overnight also and using it during the day at home as well, to limit consumption of electricity at the 40 p day rate after feb ( 12.89 p per kwhr now ) As far as gas is concerned, I like you am getting a wood burning stove. I have a farmer in the family, who gets 25 pallets a week delivered, who just burns them in the field. I know where they are going to be burnt in the future, to emeliarate the cost of my gas consumed on the central heating.
I drive EV's at work. The XC 90 volvo which is £90k by the way is less than a year old and the battery will do a hybrid run of about 25 miles. The 2yr old one does 12. 12 miles. We drive the whole day with the battery charging all the while hauling all the battery weight around.
Theyre not EVs, theyre PHEV. EVS are vehicle with one fuel source - electricity, PHEVs are plug in Hybrid Eelectric vehicles... engine with battery help or can run in pure ev but decimates range. The full electric version of the XC90 has only just been released for sale and its called the EX90. The XC90's you have are XC90 recharge models and theyre £72k to £82k not £90k as you stated. No customer has taken delivery of the all electric EX90 yet and wont until March 2023
Charging Station prices will seek to match the cost of Gas/Diesel .. because they can get away with prices like that. In the USA.. many such stations charge 2-4X the going electric rates.
Apparently civil engineers are looking at the likelihood of reducing the capacity of older multi storey car parks by making the bays wider because the extra weight of EVs will overstress them. (Hoorray! We'll be able to open the doors properly when getting in and out😊) Excellent post BTW very informative. Just subscribed.
Sensationalist nonsense from the Daily Fail. ICE vehicles like the BMW X5 or a Mercedes GLE already weigh 2.5 tonnes so if the claim that car parks can't take the strain of the likes of a a 2.27 tonne Mustang Mach e is true we certainly shouldn't be parking big petrol or diesel SUVs in them.
Modern Fiesta is bigger in all dimensions than a 1970s Maxi. Golf Mk1 is a fraction of the size and weight of a current Golf. Changing space sizing is way overdue.
Oddly though, despite Norway having the largest take-up of EV usage anywhere in the World - at 56% of the population - I haven't heard of any multi-storey car parks collapsing there.
Thanks for a great video. I will now definietily be keeping my Peugeot diesel which was cheap to buy second hand, under 2k, less than 10 minutes (inc paying at the kiosk) for a 600 mile fill up. When an EV reaches this price and range I may consider it.
Thomas, you don't drive 600 miles all in one go. And the big downside (which you'll see within the next year or two) are lots of upcoming Clean Air Charging zones. These will typically add £30 to £40 per week onto the cost of running an older cheapie car if you need to drive into a town or city regularly. I actually spend less time plugging and unplugging my car in on my drive, than you do *driving* to petrol stations to fill up. And even a cheapie diesel won't have per mile running costs of 3.5 to 4p per mile.
At last an (EV) owner telling the truth about EVs. Keep up the good work. I live off grid & have to use petrol generators as it's too windy for wind generators(2 dead) and PV solar panels are extremely limited(12.2 kw array). I use every way possible to power my life but I have serious reservations about EVs as a automotive engineer even before haw you get the electricity to charge the battery.
That was really well explained and some new EV owners don't realise the difference between AC and DC charging. The only thing I would have liked to have seen is a bit more explanation of the charging curve for DC charging. You mentioned it a little bit later in the video and the 20 to 80% thing. Personally, if I am on a long journey I will charge it at home to 100% and the lowest I have been when I have got to a charger is 7% and I don't think that is an issue. I usually then charge to anywhere between 80 and 90% depending when the charge rate starts to drop and that is different for each car so you can't really put a % on it. The charge rate on a rapid charger can drop to less than the speed of an AC charger which I don't think some drivers realise.
When the battery is above 85% I've seen Rapid chargers drop to speeds lower than a 7kw destination charger. These things are all nuanced. People who compare broad conditions to each other won't get accurate results. You have to compare like for like. For example, a car with only 90 miles of range may take an hour to fill from 5%. A car with 300 miles of range would only have to top up to 30% to get 90 miles of range and therefore should not experience any reduction in charging rate. The two cars will acquire 90 miles at very different speeds even if the charger was rated at the same level and both cars could accommodate the charger's maximum speed. The Devil is in the detail.
DC charging will never drop BELOW the equivalent rate of AC charging because the maximum battery charging current is calculated independantly of source! The maximum battery current is calculated by the battery management system based on a large number of parameters (most important are State Of Charge (SoC) and maximum battery cell temperature (Tbatmax). That maximum limit is continously sent to th charging control strategy and is used to limit the maximum charging current from any source to under that value. Realistically even at 7kW max charge current is unlikely to be limited for AC charging until very high SoC values as the current is really quite low (eg 7kW at 350Vnom is 20 amps, which is 0.3C for a 60kWh battery pack) AC charging limitation is actually much more likely to be simply to allow cell voltage balancing enough time to occur, and this is pretty in-frequent with a healthy battery pack
7 years into my X5 40D ownership and I feel that I am just at the start of ownership! Can't justify changing it for either a new diesel (possibly problematic), petrol (uneconomical) or ev. The only realistic alternative, at least for me, would be a Toyota Rav4 or Highlander but even then I think that I would miss the X5! Oh yeah, forget to mention that 600+ miles on a tank of diesel is easily achievable on a motorway journey.
Compliments the first so well and covered everything. Thanks for these videos, they are great. Only 2 things I would add based on my experience. Charge rates, I’ve seen one or two public charge points with rates now over £1/kw 😮. Other thing is that I sometimes find people park in charge points which can be annoying and cause significant delays from time to time. Otherwise brilliant video and anyone thinking of buying electric has to watch this!
So called 'Iceing' is a big thing in US so I'm told, usually by pickup owners. seen a couple of YT vids with a Tesla slowly dragging an F150 or Ram out the way (don't know if a set up or not) but just funny to watch.
Look into Elli and their subscription packages. The free ones give you a slight discount, all the way upto the £12.99 package for which ionity is .29 per kwh and DC charging is .35p
Tesco were doing free charging via pod point until recently. Think my local one is now charging 28p a unit so cheaper than a single rate domestic price guarantee at the moment.....
Excellent video, very CLEAR & CONCISE information around the EV subject. Will help a lot of people understand the various in & out's of EV ownership etc... Keep up the good work.
Excellent video…only pedantic comment is when you talked about having 10% ‘power’ left in a battery pack. Batteries store energy not power as you know…many people would make the same mistake of course without realising it. Thanks again for a very informative piece of work.
Show what torque is by putting your right foot down for someone that will not see a RV for a good number of years. I enjoyed your blog. Your diction and accent is very easy to understand.
Very interesting, at last a simple explanation about the EV problems that governments and manufacturers gloss over. We have a £15k four seater car that always returns 50+ mpg which gives us an easy 450 mile range, important for us when travelling from Yorkshire to Bedfordshire.
@@fradaja well it was a 420 mile round trip which we did without refuelling or range anxiety in cold weather, with lights, heater all on. But then, we live in the real world.
Nice one Pete, very enjoyable and informative. I have had an electric car for two years now, it takes a lot of thought regarding range and ensuring the battery isn’t over/under charged and kept between 30 - 80%. We have solar panels so it keeps the cost down considerably. I love driving the car, the power and instant torque is amazing.
@@pauldougall8385 Management systems that try to keep them between 30 to 80% charge. There's no magic solution here. Lithium batteries charged over 80% or discharged below 30% significantly reduces their lifespan.
BRILLIANT! I'm talking about sound level. Wife just said to turn it down. Even louder than the adverts I clicked to skip. So many YT essays are recorded at low level so I can hardly hear them. You are clear in volume and enunciation
great video. Have a 730d, which gives 41mpg (motorway mileage), full tank circa600 plus miles and as at Dec 2022 fuel costs 23 pence per mile driven. No brainier, on cost alone EV's can wait another decade for me. But we need to get past all these companies milking early adopters before the average Jo will move over to EV
Well done Peter. That was well thought out and explained. I am surprised that people are having difficulties understanding how to protect the battery when we have been the owners of mobile phones and should have been charging them with the same idea of not hammering the battery every time we charge the phone. I would also like to see alarm systems for fire and smoke in the garage. There is always the issue of the Lithium going into run away fire.
Great summary of the numbers and how they relate to each other when it comes to EVs. The only thing I thought might be worth covering is the topic of battery life and the impact of different charging regimes on the life of batteries and their longevity and ability to hold a charge for longer.
Exactly apparently you need to keep the battery between 80% and 20% for optimum battery life !!. Would you want to buy a second hand EV not knowing how the previous Owner has charged the battery ?.
@@colingregson8653 Depends how you buy the car, perhaps not sensible to buy privately unless you know the owner. If through a (reputable) proper dealer, they should be able to accurately determine the state of health of the battery.
Best presentation I've seen regarding the whole concept of how EV's operate. I think I'll need to watch again to better understand. What is my conclusion? I reckon this is not the way forward and our so called 'Leaders' are completely clueless, (as always), so the future looks grim for drivers. However, for those of you that understand the desired intentions of the world's leaders, ( I can't mention them without my post disappearing), non of the issues we encounter will be a problem as they don't intend us to retain ownership of cars going forward. Ownership of anything, in fact.
This episode was brilliant. I am buying my first EV and it now makes it easier to talk the talk✔️. Love your episodes and don’t worry about dumbing it down, I am good scientist and struggled to get EV lingo.
What a mistake to make. EVs are a massive con trick. They make no difference to climate change, in fact probably accelarte it due to the new mines being dug to get the lithium
It should be noted, that there were 2-6 hour waiting times at tesla chargers over christmas. If it takes 12 hours to charge at home, but 30 minutes at a tesla charger, then waiting 6 hours if youre low might be your only choice. So because rapid chargers are rare, they usualy have a waiting time to use them.
Great summary. One point . You used the term throttle. Where accelerator would be more appropriate. . The cost of an EV has to be put into context. Most of keep a car of minimum of 3 to 5 years . So the long term running and maintenance cost of both new and used EVs has to be a realistic set of data. Without this kind of data the general car buyer can’t make a logical choice
The most informative post I have seen, having now watched a lot of your posts I’m sticking with my diesel BMW. I work for a National company which is just about to begin the change over to full EV vehicles but having looked at the charging networks can see issues. I will keep you updated how this plays out in the near future.
I owned a Skoda enyaq 80x, (now returned) 300 miles in summer, 160 in winter. Drove like a granny, didn’t use the heater. Cost about £15 to charge at home… but also cost over £600 per month to buy with a big deposit which most reviews forget to mention is the purchase price is normally many £1000’s more. Given that fuel and electricity costs are getting closer I don’t think EV cars are much cheaper and I also found less convenient than ice. It’s a hard choice but for my larger mileages I’m going to try self charging hybrid petrol, though I have had diesel for years now. Another problem I found was lack of (useable) chargers - due to breakage and the increase of EV take-up….. the discussion continues.
An excellent and comprehensive summary. Whilst I’m still not entirely sold on having an EV as my daily, I’m a lot clearer on the realities and considerations of owning one as opposed to basing any decision on blind ignorance and speculation. Very helpful.
a lot of it isnt correct though. An EV si way cheaper to run than those figures suggest and theres lots of mistakes in the video that are heavily in favour of the ICE cars
It’s both and it’s all of it combined. How did U.K. Gov, nee a certain Johnson, think that 24 million homes in the U.K. could or would have private electric charging capabilities? IMHO, it’s incredible the Gov can even think of pushing EV when, guessing, probably 60-70% of these 24m homes won’t be able to have private charging….how can leaders of Gov push EV but not understand how awkward and expensive this is going to be. I suspect the car manufacturers know this hence why they are only making hyper expensive models for the rich and swanky folk!
What happens when many more people have EV’s, it’s all very well as shown in your video, you have one to hand. What about being out and about and you need to charge your car and there is a queue? What about the range if you are towing for instance? What about tyre pressures, not many people look after their tyres, how much does it affect the range if you are down a couple of psi. Excellent video by the way!👍🏻
Living in cold Switzerland and after 3 diesel powered vehicles in the last 12 years i started moving to E.V.... but stoped at P.H.E.V. world. Daily comuting is a 12 kilometers máx. At the moment i can charge for free 3 days per month at work in underground parking. And for my long (30km+) back and forth journeys petrol motor save the day!!
It staggers me how little some people know even after they have purchased an EV so thanks for that concise description. There are two aspects which I think you failed to cover fully and which may help people when choosing their first EV. 1/ Different models of EV's charge at different rates. My eTron 55 will will charge up to 150kw, whereas some may be a lot less (city cars) and some will be higher such as the Taycan, eTron gt, Ioniq 5 etc This will be important for those travelling longer distances and wishing to use public chargers. 2/ The charging curve varies depending on the car you purchase. Again, my eTron 55 has a fairly level charging curve at a reliable 134kw (on an appropriate charger) up to 80%, around 50kw to 70kw thereafter, whereas when I hired a Tesla model 3 in the US recently, it was significantly slower at Tesla Superchargers, sometimes around 35kw - which shocked me. Range, charging curve and charging level ability are the three factors you should consider when reviewing charging. A few general points. ICE cars use more fuel when travelling in town and also at 70 on the motorway, they are also affected by a heavy right foot, their manufacturers figures are hardly ever achieved either and they are also affected by temperature so criticisms of EV's also apply to ICE to some degree. Also you don't normally run them to zero, as I would never run my EV to zero (I wouldn't do that with an ICE car either). Lowest I have been is around 3% but that was when my destination was my home charger and I knew it would work. 13.25p per mile in a diesel, equates to around 61mpg (high street prices), not sure a car that does that is the size, performance and comfort that the Mach E has. Don't forget that fuel prices on the motorway (where rapid and ultra fast chargers are) is at least 10% higher than high street also. IMO, don't buy an EV if you haven't got home or workplace charging. The infrastructure is "OK" (for me anyway and I use home charging and the public charging for my 25,000 a year). My home charging costs me 2.75p per mile and my public charging (Ionity 150kw) costs me 11.6p per mile (in a relatively inefficient EV, 2.6 miles per kw average over 42,000 miles, when compared with some). Both journeys cheaper than the diesel example (not sure what diesel the AA were using fo comparison, I assume it was similar size car with equivalent performance) and any long distance trip usually consists of at least 200 miles at the lowest rate bringing the cost of a 400 mile trip down to 7.175p per mile (splitting it 50/50) so overall not bad and much better than the diesel example given. OK, so maybe the purchase price was higher but I would have bought an Q8 or Q7 anyway so I would have spent just as much in my case.When I include the lower BIK, road tax and corporate tax concessions (admittedly not everyone can get this) that apply at the moment, it is significantly cheaper than an ICE car. whilst I appreciate this will change, I've been taking advantage of these savings for almost 2 years now and will continue to do so until the government changes the taxation. The sooner people get into EV's the more they are likely to save. Especially if they can charge at home. I have a V8 convertible for those nice days (winter and summer) but having had 16 ICE cars over the years, my EV is the best car I have ever owned. I'll be ordering an EV replacement soon.
I’m so grateful somebody has finally mentioned the fact that 80% charge means 80% range. Can you please tell all the car mags to bear that in mind, too. I like being nice and toasty in the car in the winter. Heating, heated seats and heated steering wheel all roaring away. Being asked to compromise on this holds no appeal whatsoever, and never will.
What you are missing out on the cost per mile calculation is the initial purchase price. I recently rented a DS4, it was a petrol model which I liked a lot. Looking into the prices of the various models the pure electric vehicle was in round figures £10,000 dearer, which all adds to the CPM.
Motorway diesel costs about £1.73 per litre or £7.89 per gallon( £1.43 in urban areas). At motorway speeds, consumption is about 40 miles per gallon so for 250 miles that is 6.25 gallons = £49. At Gridserve, charges at a Rapid Charger regardless of rate is £0.79 per kWh. My car has 60kWh battery and would do 250 miles on full charge = £47. So pricing is similar. If I charged at home for the first part of the journey the price for first 250 mile drops to £0.09 pence per kWh. The charge time for me to get an 80% (48 kWh) charge at a rapid charger is based on the maximum my car can take which is 130 kW per hour. So that would be about 22 minutes. Time for a pee and a coffee.
For fuel alone, which I guess this comparison is, my 13 year-old oil-burner (with ECU map) does @65mpg making it run for 12p per mile. I'll stay with her for a while yet!
Still costly compared to s typical family EV, which if charged at home on 12p per kwh, can have a per mile cost of 3.5 to 4p. Plus you've got an upcoming increase in fuel duty of 20% plus..... And if you've still got that car in another couple of years, watch out for those Clean Air zone charges.......
@@neilwiddison6529 Many don't buy anymore, they lease or go for a PCP agreement. It isn't for everyone, but that way you get to drive a car that's always under warranty, plus you eliminate any concerns regarding depreciation.....
Excellent video, well done. I would dare to suggest that when comparing combustion engined cars to electric it would be helpful to compare available thrust at the driving wheels divided by vehicle weight relative to road speed rather than specific power and torque figures. Add this data to measured mileage per kWh charge input would give a much better comparison.
Hi Peter, A very comprehensive breakdown of the cost of charging. The one thing you may have missed, although you did touch on it, is the extra time involved to plan an electric journey, and aĺso the charging time. It probably takes about 5mins to refuel and be on your way, stopping anywhere on route in an ice vehicle. The extra planning involved with ev cars plus the extra time at the charger ( hard to quantify what peoples time is worth obviously) at lets say minimum wage of £10.42 per hour, makes ev vehicles ridiculously expensive surely.
Burning wood for heating if you have a super efficient wood burner, gasification type, also, you need to be sure that the wood burner if of sufficient capacity. Do not scrap your diesel boiler it is a great back-up for when you are away. //////// In north America domestic power is 240V split phase, 120V on each leg. However we can and do have 240 wall sockets capable of 10kW. I run my welders on a 6kW plug. Our clothes dyer is 5kW!!
I regularly watch various videos regarding EVs and I am a million miles away from ever being interested in an EV. This because I drive to Scotland four or five times a year, usually in Winter and a drive to Edinburgh is on a tank of diesel and when I need to fill up it only takes a few minutes. In total with a twenty minute stop at a motorway services, it takes about seven hours. If I buy an EV and get a Winter range of about 160 miles it’s going to take three stops for charging adding almost four hours to my drive, if there are available chargers and all with range anxiety. So from just over seven hours to taking almost 11-12hours to get there is a complete non starter for me.
I live in Central Scotland near perth and travel to my office every second month....... 1 stop to fill at 30 mins approx at either Leeds or Bolton Ionity and I arrive in roughly the sametime as you....and no i dont have the time to sit at 50mph the whole way....70mph the whole way, no issues....... VW with 77kwh battery.I also drive to the replublic of ireland 4 times a year and can do my house to Dublin with 80 miles left in the battery ...... winter range of 160 is only the case if you buy a car with small battery, drive above the speed limit and have the heat sat at 25 degrees. Drive at 70, heat at 18/19 and get a car with a heat pump
That's what, a 400-450 mile trip? If you left your house with a near-full charge (assuming you didn't get a garbage EV) that's about 180 miles of range in the winter. My Tesla gets 180 miles going from 90 to 10% in winter here. But looks like your lows hover around 0c on average. Our core winter months are rarely above -5c for a high, -10 for a low. So you'd likely get ~200mi on that charge from home. About what I get at 0c. Most likely you'd have to stop 2x to charge to ~75% to get to your destination. On a decently fast charging car, that's about 20 minutes. Remember, fast charging will heat up the battery for a while, getting you quite a few miles of summer like efficiency. Even if you had to stop for a 3rd charge at your destination to get back, you're looking at a total of an hour of charging one-way, and 40 minutes on the way back. definitely nowhere near 4. In the summer time, that's an easy single 20-25 minute charge stop to get 400 miles from home. Longer than ICE, but not dramatically so. Especially if you're like me and like to stop for 10-15 minutes every few hours anyway. Of course I live in the US where electricity is cheap. Even supercharging is 1/2 - 2/3 the cost per mile over ICE. Most of my charging is at home, where it's about 1/4 of the cost right now. Electric could be a bit more expensive if you have really high rates.
Great video. I was considering a Tesla model 3 last year but they are stupidly overpriced, then looked at an ID4 but that had a lead time of over a year. Ended up buying an Audi A6 TDI and that is very economical to run. I’ll stick with that for a while and see what happens I think.
No matter what the government, or electric vehicle manufacturers say the infrastructure is just not there to keep these vehicles rolling. Also, I am yet to be convinced that from sourcing of basic materials to build, through to end of serviceable life use. That EVs are any more beneficial to the planet and it's inhabitants than any other vehicle. I will be sticking with my 65 mpg Suzuki Vitara diesel with it's range of over 600 miles, and a complete lack of any range anxiety. Furthermore, has anyone done a survey of, once EV owners have owned their cars for the vehicles 3/4/5 years owning span, how many go out and buy/ lease another one ?
Hi, Thankyou so much for this first class video, you have explained all the answers to questions the dealers are 100% hopeless at. Thanks again and Merry Christmas & Happy New Tear.
Superb video. For me, the one thing that is never explained is not so much the range on it's own, but the length of time it is going to take to "fill up" once you run out. There's a huge difference between being able to drive 300 miles and fill up with fuel in 5 minutes, and drive 300 miles and then be effectively stuck where you are until you recharge the batteries. Most EV fans that don't actually have an EV don't seem to realise some of the shortcomings like the range/charging time issue, the fact that (ideally) you can't use the full range of the battery, the big difference in range that occurs when you use power hungry functions like the heaters and so on.
The proportion of people regularly driving 300 miles is small, and the proportion driving 300 miles without a break is even smaller! Charging more often at "comfort breaks" for shorter periods of time is better during, what for most people, are rare long journeys. EVs not yet totally suitable for the small proportion of people who drive more than 300 miles every day (without stopping), and don't have time for the charging.
@@salokin1 They're not suitable for a wide range of people, not just those who drive long distances. A plumber I know bought one last year and the battery wasn't lasting the day. That's without him leaving town. He's sent it back. That's why they're not selling in huge numbers (the hype would have you believe otherwise). People do not want to drive 100 miles then stop for an hour or more to charge, and unless you have (more expensive) fast chargers available, that could become several hours. Few people except the retired have a lot of time on their hands these days, and those who do don't want to spend it sat around waiting for their car to charge, or even worse, waiting hours for a charger to become available. The media hype will talk about record sales and the like, but in the UK there are still less than 1 in 10 people buying electric vehicles which is hardly a revolution. That figure also includes businesses like Amazon, Royal Mail and other companies who make up a significant number of the sales, especially those who are getting their vehicles paid for by the public.
@@severnsea3924 That plumber must have a small one (battery, I mean!). And only travelling 100 miles before re-charging is also referring to a car with a small battery and therefore not suited to long distance journeys.
@@salokin1 Mercedes Vito van costing over £30k. Was promised by the dealer it would do 150m per charge. Most people will want at least the ability to travel some distance without having to worry if there's a charger available at some point, such as days out or holidays. I would imagine it's chaos on an Easter weekend! Point is, as it stands they're not fit for purpose in the same way that an ICE vehicle is, they're not as flexible and are therefore limited in what they can do, so why should people may considerably more for an EV than for an equivalent ICE vehicle? The emissions savings are somewhere between minimal and negligible (if they exist at all, which is becoming less and less clear). It makes no sense at all.
Good video Pete.....However, all it's done is confirm my doubts about EV ownership. There are just too many variables to driving these things. I own a 21 plate RSQ3, just the right size, range and performance for my needs. In order to get the same 360 to 400 miles I get on a tank, I would need to buy a larger EV because of the battery size I would need to give an equivalent range....and that depends on the weather and if I want to stay warm and get somewhere quickly. When my RS's tank is empty, it will take me 5 minutes, every time, to fill from a standard pump with one type of 'connector'. The EV? I would have no idea how long it will take to charge because it would depend on what charge rate is available and if there's one free.......but at least an hour (just hanging around). I don't do many miles, but a vast majority of those I do, are long motorway round trips of about 300 miles once a month, and I just need to refuel on the next supermarket run. Home charging would help, but if I'd just plugged my 'empty' EV in at home and then needed it in a hurry, it's of no use at a all. There's nothing to convince me that an EV is a good investment for my needs now or in the future.
I think you are panicking too much. Most EV's can do over 200 miles on a charge and I would imagine in 300 miles you would need to stop for a coffee or loo break. During your 20 minute coffee break the car would have more than enough range to complete the 300 mile journey. EV's are much nicer to drive and you would be much more relaxed and the journey would be much kinder to the environment. I've had an EV for three years and wouldn't go back especially in this cold weather, when I preheat from home and go into a nice warm car with heated seats and steering while on while neighbours are still scrapping theirs.
@@jimf4748 It's 150 miles each way to see our little Granddaughter for the day. No charging available at their house. I'd rather have the charging time with my family than sat around at a charger. Kinder to the environment? Very debatable!
Spot on. An RS3 in my country is only 10% more than a gt line Kia EV6, which is slower, drives like an SUV, and has an awful interior. Price proposition gets even better when Kia is compared to an AWD 310hp Formentor which is 2/3rds the cost too!
I switched from a diesel to a small EV after the number of days I need to be in work changed to 2-3 per week. I went for something small and low cost to see if I could live with public charging. It turns out I can and will likely buy something with a larger battery soon. Probably the MG4 long range. In terms of cost it really depends what prices for public charging the AA are working off. I am in Scotland and with Chargeplace Scotland we have many 7kw, 22kw and a few 50kw chargers that are still free to use. However outside of those the cost ranges usually from 16p/kwh to 35p/kwh. So cost here is definitely lower than driving a fossil fuel vehicle. My monthly bill is usually £20-25.
But you overpaid many thousands for the EV version over the fossil fuel version. Your car will also lose more depreciation the closer you get to the end of life for your battery as this will cost you or the next owner anything around 8 to 10k for a new battery. The maths don’t seem to workout in the long run. Not to mention here in the UK over the last 10 years petrol went up roughly 1.5x and electricity 5x
Had a Kona 64Kwh EV for 3 years now. Can''t imagine going back. I'm in the highlands - north of Inverness. I use the Scottish 'public charging network' for trips, doing maybe 200km/week. No át home charging'. 95% of my charging is on slow 7Kw ones, we have one 2 mins from my house. It costs 20p/kwh. At home .... it would be 52p per kwh. Comparisons with diesel are a full of holes, most notably the maintencance and mess cost. My last service, I was warned my brake discs were a bit rusty - the EV regen saves on using them a lot. My last car, a diesel, was a pile of X/Y/Z problems, typically filters, oil, exhaust issues (it was getting old - but this was from service 1). In Scotland you can buy an EV interest free via the ScotGov loan scheme. As a simple calculation, my drive to my mums in the central belt would in diesel would cost (before the massive rises) about 130 return - more in cold weather. Its pretty much a 60mph for 90% of that journey. The EV cost is 27 quid - more in cold weather.
Really very interesting, Many thanks. Clear explanations of what can be a confusing set of 'new' numbers. We have two petrol cars - a 9 year old 1.2l Yeti (42K miles) and a 5 year old 1.4L VW Tiguan (40K miles). Given our personal 'mature' ages, the plan is to keep these until the bottom(s) fall out! Theirs or ours! A bit cheaper - we hope - than buying an EV, installing a charger and stressing over the range esp in the winter.
Thanks heavens I drive both a diesel and a petrol and when their tanks are full (takes a couple of minutes) I don't worry what I do with the heater on or off etc until I have to fill up again !! Seems like a luxury and as I'm not a coffee drinker I don't have to sit in Costa or similar in some strange place for an hour or more waiting to charge before getting home and the possibility 2 hours later than planned as the 1st charger isn't working and the 2nd was full of cars waiting
Hi ped. Excellent vlogs as always. I’m one of those who will probably never buy a electric car. Can’t quite get the idea of waiting in a supermarket car park for however long, but each to there own. But here’s a thing. I was watching a couple mid twenties with a bmw ix3 on charge in a local supermarket car park. Both dressed nice clothes ect. The chap unplugged his car from the charging point and proceeded to fight with the 10 ft snake of a cable and also got his hands hoodie tracksuit bottoms covered in all sorts of gubbins off the car park floor. Why can’t the manufacturers or theses electric cars have a retractable cable so it’s never won the floor and stores neatly inside the flap where you charge. It would save a lot of faffing and getting ya hands clothes dirtied up. Love ya thought’s on it. Happy new year 👍👍👍
the DC chargers have cables attached, but they aren't retractable as many of the higher powered cables are liquid cooled . If the cable is being detached at both ends and the person is taking it with them then these are AC chargers (same as home at 7kw sometime 22kw), and to be honest unless they're free and your going for dinner and the cinema for quite a few hours then they're not worth the hassle for 1 hour in Tesco to put 7 kwh in your car!
Perhaps it might have been interesting to get a little into battery degradation at higher charge rates, especially so as the cost of replacement batteries being so high.
It is actually a 3 pin for the US, believe it or not, most all outlets here in the US have a ground pin in addition to the standard two for power. A lot of household items only use 2 of the pins, but many use all 3, including, based on images, the Ford Mach-e charger.
Your films are very informative and a cobalt powered vehicle is simply unaffordable for us. Thank you. The problem is that ALL electricity substations need upgrading to cope with home EV charging and that will take a minimum of 15 years and for rural areas possibly never. Nothing is being done about this and we are already 10 years behind.
I drove home from Inverness a journey of 465 miles the car never missed a beat. I filled up with diesel which took me less than 5 minutes before leaving it cost me £75 and when I got home I still had 1/4 of a tank left. I used my car normally without worrying about my range, I had the lights on, AC on, heated wing mirrors/ heated seats/heated rear view screen/ whippers on due to weather conditions,I used the radio most of the way also had the sat nav on some devices plugged in to charge such as mobile phones and a game consolse. We stopped at Tebay for an hour for some food and to rest without the worry of finding a charger for the vehicle before carrying on with our journey. Until I can do the same journey in a EV I will still be driving a diesel.
I also do a regular trip to Inverness, mine being 621 miles from Devon. On my own I do the trip in one, often over the speed limit? 10.5 hours driving, about 2.5 hours charging/peeing /eating etc I do it in my Kia ENiro 4+ so with a heat pump the heating or air con take less than 1to3 miles of range ? all the other things in car are 12 volt so cost next to nothing, as like a old battery charger toping up the battery from the big battery? I return a 3.5 Kw per Mile and about half the cost of the petrol Kia Sportage we had before. ( I also own 2 Classic BMWs So I am also a petrol head)
and poisoning people! well done..
Have 2003 Volvo Estate which tows a caravan also a Leaf as a runabout.
Whith the increase in electric prices the Lear is cheaper to run in summer, the diesel in winter.
Reason? The heater! In the diesel the heater runs from the wast heat from the engine, in the EV the 3kW comes from the traction battery and that makes the difference.
That is exactly the reason that the current ev range are a joke. I'm with you 100%
This is the concern I have with paying per minute to use the EV charger. Spending as much as a tank of fuel but it takes hours to charge.
Excellent summary, I'll keep my Defender and pass it on to my daughter when I can no longer climb into it. In that way keeping a car going and maintaining it will be better for the world than churning out new cars.
Good idea but the car will become too expensive to maintain
I TOTALLY AGREE, WILL BE DOING THE SAME THING.
What information in the user’s manual did your loan EV come with? Regarding charging and compatibility of the car’s architecture voltage with fast chargers and the compatibility of supplied leads and the plugs to be compatible with fast chargers like at Goodwood Aerodrome you were at: there were two plug-in areas within the single socket on the charger at Goodwood. The car manufacturers must produce EVs without requiring 3 phase industrial electric systems.
I understand what you’re saying, but continuing to burn fossil fuels isn’t the answer. Ev charging will drop again once gas is phased out and people have a chance to switch to alternative methods. I 100% agree tho, I feel we should be converting current ICE cars to electric rather than buying completely new cars as the waste from ice cars will be crazy.
Totally agree and I’m doing the same. Buying a mini electric for short and local journeys m but keeping my ICE for longer trips and holidays. Definitely not going fully electric!
Great explanation on EVs. I briefly owned one this year and it was a nightmare charging as no home charger. For now I'll keep my 2.2 litre diesel that can do 600 miles on a 5 minute fill up.
But you *did* actually have a home charger Eddie. There are usually a few in each room in the house.....plus you *have* to sleep, so that would be the ideal time to charge.
I have more than 20 chargers in my house.
@@Brian-om2hh
They didn't state what sort of house they live in, so it may have not be practical for a 3pin .
Then also the 3pin is ridiculous slow.
@@Brian-om2hh there needs to be a change of language as the charger is onboard unless you're lucky enough to have a DC charger installed at home. Anything AC is simply a supply. A supply limited by the phase or the onboard charger. This is part of the confusion and why I scratch my head at PIH 4kW Max plugged into 22kW supply at 48p pkWh when the 7kW is available at 28p.....
Never did I realise I could be this pedantic but that's the EVlife
I owned a 2003 Volkswagen Jetta TDI get 50 miles per gallon. It’s been paid for for over 18 years now long time. That car makes so much sense to me and it’s so good that I recently purchased another one that I am also restoring because I’ve become very proficient in maintaining and working on these cars. The high cost of Evies is ridiculous. My diesel Volkswagen, the second one I purchased cost me $1000 to purchase.
But due to the criminal manufacturer we call Volkswagen the atmosphere is a much dirtier place. No one in Volkswagen has ever been penalised for their criminality and its a total disgrace. I have owned several VW GTI's but NEVER again will I buy Volkwagen or any GERMAN car for that matter. Rogues and criminals the lot of them.
You can't beat a VW or it's variants.
Exactly. And if people REALLY cared about the planet instead of using it as an excuse to buy EVs (although that's what the hype tells them so to a point you can't blame people for being dumb and ignorant), they would buy an old car that will save the equivalent of 70,000 miles of emissions because it's already been built. EVERY old car that is scrapped and replaced with a new EV means tons more emissions that would not have occurred if people ran those cars for another 50000 miles instead of scrapping them. But you've no chance trying to convince the EV brigade of that.
When Toyota Prius’s and Nissan leafs were the darlings of the eco warriors it was calculated that a diesel car was far more eco friendly over its lifetime allowing for creation and scrapping of the cars. I’m not against them if fact some are quite awesome for instance the Audi e-tron GTS. But I’m just not convinced they are better for the environment. As you noted a pre built car has already had its build carbon paid for. Cheers from NZ
Miles per gallon is no information for some people 😅 like me)
This is probably an appropriate video to update my EV experience. I bought my EV a Hyundai Kona Electric 64kWh towards the end of July. I do relatively high mileage, but it is evenly spread, so my daily usage is 40-100 miles, rather than having longer, less frequent journeys. Most of my mileage is around town, where EV's are at their most efficient. With that in mind, during the warmer months, I would usually average over 6 miles.kWh and the car would say I had upwards of 350 miles at full charge.
It is a very different story in the colder weather with AC on, heated seats, heated steerign wheel, etc. During the recent cold snap, I remember being stuck in traffic, whilst it was -6°C and my car said I was getting 0.4 miles/kWh, which would equate to a total range of 25.6miles. To be fair, I had just started driving, the battery was cold and my average would always end up much higher than that. At that point I had also not had much time to experiment with the AC and see how I could use it most efficiently, so it was just full power, demist and everything on. Having had a little more time to figure things out, it appears that fan speed is probably the biggest draw on power from the AC. My fan has settings from zero to eight and five is the minimum require to keep the windows from misting up. Once I had all of my settings sorted I was tending to average between 2.8 - 3.2 miles/kWh during the coldest weather, so about half the range I was seeing during the summer, although because the car uses historical data to calculate range I never actually saw my reported range drop below 270 miles at full charge.
Now, with temperatures back between 5-10°C most of the time, I'm getting around 4 miles/kWh with the same AC settings and with the heated seat and steering wheel on most of the time. Strangely, I've just done a 60 mile round trip on faster A roads and averaged 4.5 miles/kWh. Prior to that my highest recorded average in my journey history was 4.4 miles/kWh on 30th November, which was my normal town driving. This seems counter intuitive, given that EV's are more economical round town, but the reasons are likely to be that today's journey was a single trip, so the battery stayed warm, whereas my normal round town mileage is made up of several shorter journeys. Also today there was no sitting in traffic, which is fine in warmer weather, because there is very little drain on the battery while stationary, but when the AC, etc. are running, there is still quite a lot of drain while stationary.
Another thing to bare in mind with the lower economy is that charging will take that much longer, because you will have used a lot more charge for the same mileage. I only use the slowest 2.2kWh charging and during the summer it would take 4-10 hours to recharge 40-100 miles of driving. In the recent cold weather, due to my efficiency being halved, the charging would take twice as long. This could have been a potential issue for me if my mileage was consistently at the higher end, because I would not have had time to fully recharge before the following day. Fortunately, that is an unlikely scenario for me, although there were odd days when the car wasn't fully charged. It also meant that I had to be a lot more careful about doing any extra unexpected journeys.
On the whole things are still working out well. I was aware when I bought the car that the colder weather would have this effect, which is why I chose a car that appeared to have much higher range than I would need on a day to day basis. It also helps to allow for the unexpected.
Thanks for this 👍
So in belgium 1kwh is 50 eur cent
So 2t eur cent per mile
1 kwh from fossil gen is 750 grm co2 from coal or 650 frpm nat gas
In the worst case cold with all acc on my ford is 7 liter per 100 km
Best case 4.5
Great video, I have been enjoying the EV debate (mainly courtesy of utube) for a couple of years now. I run a small petrol engined Volvo XC40 but have two electric bicycles which I love using, are simple to charge and can be pedalled if (they never have) run out of power!
My motivation and decision to move to an EV car seems further away than ever as the subsidies get withdrawn and the economic case gets even more questionable. Yes I like to do my bit for the environment but even that is less convincing for the EV on a personal basis. I’ll stick with the small engined petrol car thanks.
Thanks for this info.
The prices of the Kona EV are really coming down now (2nd user). Do you know if you can preheat the interior from the battery only as I cannot charge at home (legally)? I was considering a 28kwh Ioniq but for a few thousand more I could get an okay milage '19 or '20 plate Kona with that much bigger battery!
We are a 1 car family so it has to do everything and the public chargers here in North Wales aren't great - but thanks to Elon for opening up his Superchargers! I'd love an E-Niro but the prices are a bit higher than the Kona and I'm a Golf driver at the moment but the E-golf has a smaller battery and (not that rapid) rapid charging.
@@computerbob06 My 69 Reg doesn't support the Hyundai app, so I can't pre-heat the battery or do anything else remotely. A colleague at work had a lower spec 21 model, which does support the app, so I'm not exactly sure which model year was first to support it. I find it strange that my 69 plate doesn'y have app support, because the Veloster worked with the app from somewhere around 2013 and it's obviously a more useful feature for an EV, as there is more that an app can do with an EV.
A big factor that needs to be taken into consideration is depreciation. I am retired and do low mileage and run as a daily driver a 42 year old classic car that has no road tax, cheap insurance and possibly little or no depreciation. Good video/info.
Thanks 👍
Another big factor that most EV proponents never talk about is the much higher level of EMF (Electro Magnetic Field) radiation inside the cabin of an EV compared to a Petrol/Diesel vehicle. Long term exposure to high EMP radiation can lead to cancer. It’s a price that I’m not willing to pay.
@@petersmith2040 do you have a mobile phone by any chance? :)
Surely a 42yr classic will be either gaining value, or kind of keeping its value relative to inflation
IMO this is the best video on this topic available on UA-cam. My diesel car is going to become a cuban car and will be restored for the next 30 years (if I live that long).
Thanks 🙏🏻
I will be keeping my 63 plate C4 115bhp 50 mpg diesel no tax and no problems in the past 8 years since bought, still looks and runs like the day I bought it.
Thank you for this video, I've not considered buying an electric car so didn't know much about the different types of chargers etc and the necessary infrastructure. So I learnt a few things about what you might encounter with EV ownership despite having a background working with aircraft batteries and regular vehicle batteries in the RAF. Nothing I learnt has convinced me to go out and swap my diesel Golf for an EV but it has made me realise just how much I take for granted the 500 mile range and convenience of filling up quickly. This 500 mile range doesn't half in the winter too.
You’re welcome 👍
Excellent video! I'm looking at my first EV possibly MG4 as a company car and have been doing all the learning about range charging cost etc. I currently have a Prius Hybrid (non plug in) for the past 3 years and have averaged 56mpg over 40K miles. MyBIK on an EV will drop to 2 percent from prob what will be 27 percent on a new Hybrid model so this the obvious appeal and will pay for the cost of a home charger in a year. My big issues are range I may need, having to use a rapid charger at much higher cost and being able to get an EV home energy tariff at a reasonable rate. These may give you cheaper overnight charging at 12p per kwh but the day rate is higher than the norm. I'm really not sure if the compromises that have to be made are going to be worth it for me, particularly in winter. Still sat on the fence.
A salesman recently bulshited me that putting the heater on doesent affect range. Must have thought I was stupid.
So you continue to trash the planet and produce NOx and particulates.
@@nathansmith7153 good luck in future then when you're priced off the Rd... You will own nothing and be happy.
Keep spreading the hysteria 👌
£1000 for a home charger, more to run expensive than a diesel, and there's the public charging at horrendous rates, and the limited range in the cold. Really sells EVs, how marvelous.
My 2022 ID4 is about 15% of the total operating costs of my 2014 Touareg X TDI (including, tires, maintenance, windshields, wear and tear, etc), charging level 2 at home, occasional DC Fast Charge, charging level 2 at work. At 6750 miles on the ID4, I've saved $1250 in diesel over my TDI. 3.2miles/kWh long term average so far. I burn about 13% battery each leg of my commute, I charge every 2.5 days, maybe one more time over the weekend if I go anywhere. My record all surface streets, same work commute, I reached 4.9miles/kWh. Lead footed, never below 2.8 miles/kWh. With the cold, it takes longer to charge. Coldest it has been here in Phoenix so far this year is 37F. It hasn't been in the deep freeze just yet.
Thank you well explained and informative. Snag is , the more videos I watch, and articles I read, about electric cars the more I’m put off them ! It’s not possible for me to charge at home , like millions of other people in terraced housing, flats, rented accommodation etc , cars will only be for the wealthy with driveways and garages . I enjoy driving , often on a whim, and will always look for alternative routes than the way I’m supposed to go , I will not use satnav , and to consider where I can charge on route is absurd. Breaks are taken at a picturesque spot, not an awful motorway services. Almost all petrol cars will do an easy 400 miles on a 5 minute stop . I’m not tempted to swap my 2.4 Accord for anything electric, even if I had the 50 grand plus needed for something comparable.
Me too, very well said and sensible and honest👍 !
This is the first time I've seen or heard the whole quagmire of EV numbers explained in such a clear and concise way. Excellent summary.
Glad it was helpful!
most if not all of the charging costs are misleading, it costs way less to run an electric car even if you dont have the driveway charger.
Had my lotus for 20 years and does 45 mpg by me keeping it will save the planet more than any EV will ..
👍
Great video Pete. The time and effort you go to making apparently complicated things very simple is really appreciated. I've watched many ev videos from many "youtubers" over the years, and this is by far the best. Top job sir 👍
Thanks mate 👍
Very very good video. The charging/ efficiency/range/power nomenclature all explained in a clear and practical way.
I run a Skoda Enyaq which I’ve had since July and I’m still learning stuff the whole time. One thing I should add on the subject of cold weather efficiency is yes it reduces a lot especially on short journeys where the battery pack doesn’t get a chance to warm up, but if you’re going a bit further, once you get over about 30 miles and the batteries have warmed up (providing you’re being careful with speed of course), it improves. A tip is to spec heated seats and steering wheel if you can. That way you don’t need to heat the cabin as much as they use less power than the heater.
Great vid!
Thanks Andrew 👍
Another great & clear informative video from PP. This video shoul be broadcast as a Public Information Film on Ev's. It explained a lot about EV ownership, which I really didn't understand at first, but I better understand now, thanks to PP. You really should have a full time TV program reviewing the Pro and Cons of alternative fuel for vehicles, your presentation is so very professional, I can't fault it, and much better than some I could mention on TV car shows. please keep up the good work PP. 👍
Well said 👍
Thanks mate. That’s 24 years as a technology trainer coming through 😜👍
You never thought....how much electricity will cost . .and what will happen in case of black outs (gov announced) like in case of water usage during summer ☀️??
A good attempt but surprising several points not mentioned. For AC charging, anything above 7kW will need your EV be capable for taking 11 or 22kW. Most now do 11 very few do 22. And you’ll need a type 2 cable with the extra wires (unlike the one he showed at the beginning).
DC charging he mentioned 800volt systems can charge faster; true but only if the EVSE (charger) is capable (most are not).
Price compared to diesel; very unfair not to mention that most EV owners opt for a discounted night rate, many don’t inflate the day time rate but provide highly discounted night rate, 7.5p is common. For a moderately efficient EV that’s 2.08p per mile for the first journey each day (for those that can charge at home)
Been saying for ages that’s why fuel prices are still so high at the moment because if the price of fuel was where it should be around £1.20 a ltr but if they did that then it’s cheaper to use petrol or diesel as charging on a public charger would cost more and that goes against what the government want…
Also transport companies have been very quiet about the cost of fuel. A few years ago when it was £1.50 a ltr they were up in arms about it…
Because they use fuel cards they get it at a reduced cost closer to the price it should be…..
You make some really interesting points. I totally agree. Some other points to consider: We've already crossed the £2.00 Per lire threshold in 2022. Prices are "quite reasonable"? right now, but over the course of time we will stealthily be right back up there again. This time the backlash wont be so severe as we've already tasted it. 2nd point. I'm seeing a 20p ish difference between diesel and Petrol Per litre. My reckoning is that this gap will widen in a bid to make diesels more and more undesirable.
Here is a challenge - make a video that even slightly convinces me to buy an ev. But bearing in mind I'm 70 it is going to be an uphill challenge 👍. 3 speed charging, only one speed petrol, diesel and no need for an app 👍👍
I chose to go non-EV last year in favour of a diesel BMW. Glad I did TBO having seen the issues with EV charging over XMAS. My beemer will do 640 miles on a tank at proper UK motorway speeds thank you !
Really good honest video - thank you. There are a couple of important points to add. 1. Not all electric cars can accept 22Kw AC charging (and on some cars it's an option). 2. The charge curve is an important consideration. Manufacturers quote peak charging rates - but this can be misleading because different cars have different charging curves. It's also not possible to conclude that a car with a higher peak charging rate must charge up faster. It's also not correct to state that double the charging speed means half the time eg if you are charging a battery starting with 90% charge, it won't matter if you plug into a 100Kw or 150Kw charger outlet - the car will throttle the charge back anyway. 3. The 20/80% rule is meant for daily use - you can charge your car to 100% for a road trip. Also the 20/80 rule is for lithium batteries. Manufacturers of Ion Phosphate batteries (LFP) recommend charging to 100%, and you should charge to 100% at least once per week.
Yes - these are critical points that really ought to be corrected and clarified in a follow up video.
The thought of another million or so views of this video with people being told about rapid charging EVs to “full” and working out it will take 2 hours for a 100 kWh battery at a 50 kW charger fills me with horror!
This is not an efficient use of the charging network, and is just a waste of everyone’s time which would just lead to even more queues.
@itsbillN I assume by your comment you are not an EV driver?
Most EV drivers are sensible enough to know you don’t ever try charging your EV to 100% while you are out and about.
When it drops to 30% head to a supercharger and top up to 80%.
You are on your way in 16 to 20 minutes .
The worst I had was this recent spell of cold in the UK where it took 40 minutes to do it.
A few modern small engined petrol cars get similar efficiencies to a very frugal diesel car, so these will make sense for a lot of people too. Thank you for your very helpful video.
Great point!
@@PetrolPed Indeed, a very good point. And with the ICE fuel price differential stacked heavily in favour of petrol (for now) this point is even more relevant. I've just swapped from a 12 year old C class diesel to a 3 year old petrol Honda Jazz, both auto's. The Jazz (not turbo, not hybrid) appears to run on fresh air, fuel economy is brilliant !! My priority is running costs, the Jazz is an absolute winner and it is a versatile little car to boot !!
You are probably correct.
@@jeta1f35 The Honda Jazz was claimed to achieve 60mpg but in some tests it came out at 73mpg. Still more expensive than an EV, especially a 'free charging for life' Tesla.
@@trevorberridge6079 But Tesla is not a typical EV deal and is not agood comparison. Isn't this video about diesel now being cheaper than EV?
Wow! What an excellent explanation, on costs to run an EV. Enough said, like when I commented on your towing a caravan video, I for one will be staying on diesel for as long as I possibly can!
The car I have is fully paid for, something I couldn't do with a EV, it will also, probably last for many more years, before needing expensive repairs, like replacing the battery, Also just covered 368 miles over this weekend, only took 5 minutes to fill up, still has half a tank left, and I've been able to be as warm as toast all the time I was driving in very cold weather, with all the electric creature comforts, and safe driving aids on, like heated windows, mirrors, Satellite navigation and the like!
👍
Great video. Travelling back home from holiday I charged my ipace to give me 40 miles left when I got home, but doing 70 mph on the motorway it became obvious I wasn’t going to make it, I slowed down to 50mph and got home with more than 40 miles range left.
Yep 👍
Nice video Ped. I feel like you could also add a few more details.
1. Anyone with an EV, who would expect to charge at home, would likely sign up to an EV plan with their electricity supplier. If you were with Octopus Energy the Octopus Go tariff you could charge at 12p/kWh between 00:30 - 04:30 every night.
2. How about servicing costs? How much is a simple yearly oil change now? On my VW diesel family car, the oil cost £60 alone without filters, cleaners or labour costs. You also save on brake wear, through regen braking.
3. Mechanical reliability. There are no cam-belt changes required. No water pump/fuel pump/injector or alternator failures. I have suffered all of those in my time motoring. No exhaust repairs required.
4. I've also suffered catalytic converter theft. My neighbour has been targeted twice in as many years.
I'm sure owning an EV can be trying at times, but I'm beginning to see the benefits, and am looking forward to the day when I can afford to change to one.
You probably wouldn't need to charge every night. Two nights on the trot usually gives my EV a full charge.
To be fair, though, if an electric car (or a hybrid) does suffer a significant fault, a lot of the time God himself wouldn’t be able to fix it, and if he could, he’d barely be able to afford it. I’m long-standing friends with the owner of a very busy, high end independent workshop and some of the stories (and there are many) are hair raising.
Great video and good explanation to anyone thinking of buying an EV. On a personal level I will not be joining the EV revolution for another couple of years. The reasons being :- 1/ current pricing of a new EV is much too high , 2/ there’s not really any tested data on residual resale values, 3 / what is the real life of the batteries on an EV I.e will these become like old apple iPhones and not hold the charge as long and what would be the cost of maintenance, and 4 / you mentioned it already and that is tax, which initially part of the attraction of moving to an EV. Thanks as ever for a great insight.
My pleasure 👍
I had a Leaf24 bought for £9500 in 2018 traded in this year 2022 for £7500 . No road tax for 4 years my old car was £250 a year tax, most of my charging was on the free chargers. So realistically I have saved £1300 a year on fuel so them 4 years £6000+ in savings.
@@neilmaddox8745 i agee, but many EV drivers are obsessed by those numbers what you say, trying to maximize the proof of an owning an EV. In a conventional car u don't care so much. just how good its, comfort, and liability. resale value its also a strong nightmare soon for EV. not all of us are rich to throw away a whole car.
An excellent no-nonsense summary of the numbers which should be of interest to all drivers, EV or otherwise. Thank you
Thanks 🙏🏻
This is the best summary for EVs I’ve watched. For me, they are not the future unless the infrastructure significantly improves and the range improves. I also read that, to protect the batteries you should never fully charge them and never let them go below 20% of charge meaning you are only using 60% of the battery. I tow a large caravan with my Volvo XC60 2.4 diesel. The last trip was around 330 miles which we did on one tank of fuel with a couple of stops just to stretch our legs. ThAt would not be possible in an ev when you would need extended stops to charge. It just wouldn’t be practical. I thought of buying one to replace a 12 year old Aygo for my wife but the cost new of an ev is prohibitive so I just bought another Aygo. Definitely not for me.
Thanks 👍
you can happily use the 99% of the battery, you should just never leave them standing with very low charge or very high charge states. So use it down to 1% (if youve got nerves of steel!) and charge to 100%, but make sure if you run it down extremely low that it goes on a charger straight away to bring it back up above 20% and if you need the full 100% range then charge it to 100% but schedule it to finish charging to 100% just before you depart. My car has done 34k miles in 11 months using lots of DC high power charging (around 40% of my charging) and 60% AC at home....... often using 100% charge and taken it down to as low as 4% charge when arriving at home or at a fast charger (low charge states like this = max charge speed for Ultrafast chargers) and my degradation on the battery is 2.36%...... so I have lost 1.8kwh of storage. Degradation is fastest in the first 12 months.
Lots of misinformation out there, but your spot on about the XC60 and the caravan
You only need more range if you drive a lot in one day.. how many of us actually do that? I believe its 8 miles per journey, on average.
Why this obsession? What's wrong with 300 miles? As Tom Malhoney ( State of Charge channel) suggested, don't worry too much about range. Concentrate on charging instead. Hardly anyone will drive over 200-250 miles without stopping. But, those chargers are SHIT. But, I'd still prefer FCEV. Onsite Hydrogen electrolysis at the gas station. They already exist in COMMIEFORNISTAN around L.A.
@@MikeGleesonazelectrics 8 miles per day? Not in North America. Many people drive 50 to 100 miles/day.
Great stuff m8. A number of things I would like to add. Firstly, a lot of utility providers give significant reduction on charging during the night/morning. I am currently paying 7.5p per kilowatt hour from 12.30 to 4.30 am. so I can put 28kws into my ev from a 7kwh charger = £2.10 = 21%.
I have also had solar installed and can produce 5kwph in the summer and intend to set up free ev charging to local ev owners in my road during excess production days.
Nice 👍
Just to clarify I assume the solar panels were foc otherwise I fail to see how it’s free charging
Yeah Octopus Go has been great but cheap rate is now up at 12p/kWh with the rest of the day at 44.35p/kWh. I think the standing charge is also up with the highest tariff option.
@@teamJJontour if you live in my neighbourhood and need to charge your car on my excess solar its free. I cannot say it any differently.
@@simongibbs3936 👍 I'm still on the old rate till May. But now have solar so not a problem when it goes to new rate. Very fortunate.
Re efficiency: as you say Peter, the most influential factor is miles per charge and the outside temperature plays the card here. Our Renault Zoe in the summer gets a 200 mile range. When the temperature falls in the spring and autumn the range drops to about 150-160 miles. During this cold spell recently the range dropped further down to 120 miles, so thats nearly a 50% reduction in range. What is also not mentioned is with rapid charging, the more rapid charging you put your battery through, the bigger toll it takes on your battery's life, so don't expect it to last very long if your regularly sticking 50Kw to 100Kw into it. Much better to be charging it at home on a 7Kw charger and this should give the battery a much longer life.
I wondered if that was the case, battery degradation is my biggest concern of moving to an EV
@@johnhutchinson635 It is the case. Like any battery, it starts degrading from the day it was made and is made worse by very rapid charging. For every fast charge you should do at least 5-6 normal charges to help equalise the cells. As one of the guys on one of the other youtube channels said months ago, "only buy an EV when you absolutely have too..."
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@@grahamtricker4103 It's not quite as simple as that, a lot depends on the architecture of the battery and its capacitance and like engines, not all batteries have the same properties , charge capacity and degradation. Often you will now find that whilst the battery pack is quoted there is a 'usable' % as well, i.e. the non useable part is for systems purposes but also factors in the life cycle degradation. Most higher end EV's now have a 10 year battery performance and integrity warranty. As for your quote from another UA-cam channel, I recall the same being said when the switch from leaded to unleaded and when when diesel cars came on the scene, there's always a reticence to change exacerbated this time by hype over the Government 'imposing' this on the people.
Not all EV are created equal. My BMW i3 has a very good BMS (battery management system) to ensure that the battery doesn't get cooked by charges. These days I do much more 7kw charging than 50kW but for a while it was living on pretty much nothing but 50kW rapid charging practically every day. It's 8yrs old and the battery capacity is no worse than 90% of when it left the factory.
I would like to use a new term I have invented ‘ socket hogger ‘ the guy who drives 10 miles to work , plugs in his BMW EV ( as it is free ) and leaves it plugged in 8 hours whilst he is working no one else can use it ! He doesn’t even need the charge . A lady rang in Jeremy Vine TV show ( article on EV ) boasting how she plugs her EV in at local supermarket swipes her supermarket app walks home and comes back next day and has never paid anything SOCKET HOGGER , this will become more common as people will find free charge points .
This is a very very informative video.
I picked up two things which are incidental to the video. The first is that the incentives at the moment go buy an EV are being reduced and second is that the majority of people are choosing hybrid when buying an EV rather than pure plug in electric which they are often charging for free at work for free. This reduces range anxiety but it is also still possible to use on a 2kW 'granny charger' at home without shelling out £1000 for a 7kW charger. I get the sense a lot of people now only see the incentive to get an EV is to avoid congestion and emission charges in urban areas and then only doing top up charging at the supermarket or at home or completely free at work and still using the petrol engine a lot of the time.
In 2030 that is going to change. Sales of ICE will be banned and then hybrid sales will be banned in 2035. I think we will see a lot of resistance to going full EV in 2035, especially if the price of electricity is higher than diesel/petrol. A lot of people I know have a hybrid for urban driving and commuting to work (where they often get free charging) and they can buy on company car scheme. However, they do also have an old diesel 4 x 4 for long distance driving which they intend to run until the wheels fall off.
I think it would be very interesting to interview EV all-electric and hybrid owners to see how they see the real incentives and how they really use their EV car. I think it is a lot different from what Govt would have us believe.
Thanks for this 👍
In December 42284 new Battery only cars were registered in the UK......PHEV 8367, HEV 13743, MHEV 13293, MHEV Diesel 4678.....even adding up all the different varaints of hybrid , they still dont match the total number of Battery Only cars sold. BEV were incidently the biggest segment of cars sold......Diesel werent even 1/10th of the sales at 4006, and petrol was a close second to the BEV with 42091 sales. So BEV 32.9%, Petrol 32.8%, HEV (non plug in) 10.7%, PHEV 6.5%, MHEV Diesel 3.6% and at the bottom Diesel at 3.1%. So basically all segments dropped on previous years apart for full Battery EVs which grew from 25.5% of the market to 32.9. Petrol dropped for 38.7% to 32.8% and diesel dropped from 4.8%to 3.1%. Full diesel only will be gone from sale within two years as nobody is buying them anymore!
Thank you, Pete explained very concisely ( no waffle just straightforward sound advice ) which even I as an ordinary layman can understand 👍👍 I still think listening to you and the AA I will stick with my BMW diesel which is less than 3 years old and gives me an average fuel consumption of 55 miles per gallon and costs considerably less than an EV.
Thanks Chap 👍
And you don't have to worry about range or whether you can find a charger that is free and working.
Me too
I did wonder myself, I have a pool car, 6 years old, Merc A180D 1.5 Peugeot diesel engine in it. Fortunately I regularly achieve 950 miles to a tank and once 1150 before I had to fill up. If I do less than 900 I lose money on every work trip. The WLTP for the car says it can only do 800 miles. On that basis my light foot will either transfer to the EV when it comes... or the situation will be even worse.
lets do the numbers stevie, at the current £1.72 p/l then you're paying 14.2 pence per mile on fuel alone, given the current cap at 34 p pKwh an EV would have to be doing less than 2.2 miles per Kwh to make your "understanding" valid
You should mention... in the uk. My EV operating costs in New Zealand are about 10-15% of any ICE
Including purchase price?…
@@techElephant "operating costs"
Great piece. I've had an Audi ETron since September and I'm not convinced with it. The range is awful... 190miles in good weather fully charged and 160 miles or less depending on heating etc in cold weather. On a positive note the car is great to drive but I part ex a 3lt Q8 for the ETron and am seriously thinking of changing back to the oil burner. Public charging network is becoming very expensive.
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The Audis seem rather inefficient Tom. Before you rush to swap back to diesel, try something like the Ioniq 5 or Polestar. Or perhaps even a Genesis or Kia EV6. These are notably more efficient than the Audi..... You need to subscribe to the charging networks you regularly use (maybe you already did?). This does keep the cost down a bit. Any new Kia/Hyundai or Genesis EV gets a preferential charging rate at Ionity chargers for 5 years Tom. Something like 30 to 40% off the usual rate, I think......
Very good. As someone that has just ordered (possibly) my last diesel (FPace D300 following your review) I have not been looking forward to being forced into an EV. This video made me feel slightly more enthused and maybe in 4 years or so time the infrastructure will be better! Keep up the good work.
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I could not dream of being able to run my life and business with a EV. It’s just not possible, we need a mix of fuels for our transport. My recycled diesel is far more environmentally friendly than a new EV and can do everything i ask of it, refuelled to 600 miles range in a few minutes. I can find a PHEV to do the job but looking at the emissions they produce it is far worse than my diesel. This country has gone nuts. EV’s have a place but so do others, banning petrol and diesel is the most stupid thing to do.
Your math will be altered if you turn your heater on or in cold weather.
Still for shorter journeys EV’s have a place, I just can’t see my customers paying me to sit and drink coffee for 2-4 hours a day waiting for the car to charge. I would go out of business.
Great video…👍👍
Great video. As a side note, 2 pin plugs in the USA is a thing of 50 years ago at best. Our hundred year old house has a couple but a ground electrode is common. Also, all homes have single phase 240V service, however electric company transformers also supply a split phase neutral to each home that allows for 110v to be utilized. Home AC charging to 12kw (50A) is not unusual.
Out adapter plugs for the US only have 2 pins 👍
There are many US videos on YT that only mention and show a 2-pin plug. I'm aware that 240v is possible but my understanding is that it's 110v that's commonly used. All appliances made for the US seem to be 110v.
@@PetrolPed um what? You mean like an adapter to plug your shaver in or something? That's your metric for the US power grid? Electric stoves, water heaters, clothes dryers, central air conditioning, arc welders, RV hookups, pool and spa pumps all require 240v. Most commercial areas have 3 phase.
If I travel to the US I need to use an adapter to convert our 3 pins plugs to fit into your domestic sockets. They have just two pins 👍
@@PetrolPed Yup. Intended for nonmetallic low power items. Things like a table lamp or a wall wart will likely only have two pins. Also 110 is a thing of the 1950s too, 120 has long been the standard, usually pushing 125. We have standard outlets for 240V items like a range or dryer, the newer ones have four blades. Search NEMA electrical...
Just found your channel from Detroit - Excellent! I've been involved with the motor industry for 50 years - During your cost comparison here, you talk about "getting a cup of coffee" while your car charges - For a long charge, you may also decide to get a meal - With petrol, you may or may not choose to do so at a fuel stop, but you are more likely to when charging an EV - To me, it's an oversight to not include these food/beverage costs into total cost of driving - You could apply a 50% discount factor to compensate for choosing to buy food/beverage, but to truly evaluate "all-in" costs, food/bev while waiting should be added - In addition, I have never heard anyone discuss "gross" cost out of a driver's total, after-tax total income budget - That is, I pay about 40% tax for federal, state, social security and hospitalization - Therefore, driving costs are actually a much higher amount because I must first pay income tax on every dollar I keep and spend on driving.
Really informative video, but I am unconvinced about EV tech/practicality for on-street parkers and will hang on to my 1.6 litre, 55+mpg, 500+mile range diesel Toyota for absolutely as long as possible just for its sheer convenience
As he says at the start of the video “if you don’t have your own EV charger.” I do and at £5 for around 180 miles I’ll take that over diesel. VW Passat to Hyundai Ioniq I’m quids in Great video 👏👍
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I have had a 30 kwhr leaf for nearly 7 years now. I have tried to use it longer distance but the charging infrastructure has always been bad but is getting worse because of the greater car / charger ratio now. I use mine only for journeys within my tethered home charger range and a diesel vehicle ( we have two of 600 and 650 miles range brimmed ) with no anxiety of any kind on long journeys. The leaf has lost 3 battery bars now but even so, for what we use it for will be invaluable for the vast majority of our more local journeys, being charged now at 5 p per kwhr still, going up to 12 p per kwhr in Feb, on overnight charging, on Octopus go. It is very cheap motoring, more so because our car was less than £22k when we bought it with the then £5k gov grant and grant for the dumb charger as well, which i still use. I can charge this smaller battery car even to it's max from empty, within the 4 hour cheap overnight rate. I truly believe that we have the best combination. It is horses for courses as far as I am concerned. We generally both drive the Leaf as a first, cheaper option, saving us a lot of money now. Not only that, having an electric car gives us the right to have Octopus go and we not only use the night time cheap electricity for the leaf, it also allows us to use the high cost washing machine, dish washer and tumble drier in the low electricity price period also. I now also have an eco flow on order, primarily for off grid high consumption ac items when I am in the camper van but I will be charging it overnight also and using it during the day at home as well, to limit consumption of electricity at the 40 p day rate after feb ( 12.89 p per kwhr now )
As far as gas is concerned, I like you am getting a wood burning stove. I have a farmer in the family, who gets 25 pallets a week delivered, who just burns them in the field. I know where they are going to be burnt in the future, to emeliarate the cost of my gas consumed on the central heating.
Very clear, just got my Q4 E-tron after 18 month wait and really needed this.
Great 👍
I drive EV's at work. The XC 90 volvo which is £90k by the way is less than a year old and the battery will do a hybrid run of about 25 miles. The 2yr old one does 12. 12 miles. We drive the whole day with the battery charging all the while hauling all the battery weight around.
Theyre not EVs, theyre PHEV. EVS are vehicle with one fuel source - electricity, PHEVs are plug in Hybrid Eelectric vehicles... engine with battery help or can run in pure ev but decimates range. The full electric version of the XC90 has only just been released for sale and its called the EX90. The XC90's you have are XC90 recharge models and theyre £72k to £82k not £90k as you stated. No customer has taken delivery of the all electric EX90 yet and wont until March 2023
Charging Station prices will seek to match the cost of Gas/Diesel .. because they can get away with prices like that. In the USA.. many such stations charge 2-4X the going electric rates.
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Apparently civil engineers are looking at the likelihood of reducing the capacity of older multi storey car parks by making the bays wider because the extra weight of EVs will overstress them. (Hoorray! We'll be able to open the doors properly when getting in and out😊) Excellent post BTW very informative. Just subscribed.
And so it should be. Parking bays have been far too small for the past 30 years
Sensationalist nonsense from the Daily Fail. ICE vehicles like the BMW X5 or a Mercedes GLE already weigh 2.5 tonnes so if the claim that car parks can't take the strain of the likes of a a 2.27 tonne Mustang Mach e is true we certainly shouldn't be parking big petrol or diesel SUVs in them.
Modern Fiesta is bigger in all dimensions than a 1970s Maxi.
Golf Mk1 is a fraction of the size and weight of a current Golf.
Changing space sizing is way overdue.
Oddly though, despite Norway having the largest take-up of EV usage anywhere in the World - at 56% of the population - I haven't heard of any multi-storey car parks collapsing there.
@@nealm1814 Exactly Neal. The Daily Mail is by far the biggest peddler of uninformed EV crap known to man.
Thanks for a great video. I will now definietily be keeping my Peugeot diesel which was cheap to buy second hand, under 2k, less than 10 minutes (inc paying at the kiosk) for a 600 mile fill up. When an EV reaches this price and range I may consider it.
Thomas, you don't drive 600 miles all in one go. And the big downside (which you'll see within the next year or two) are lots of upcoming Clean Air Charging zones. These will typically add £30 to £40 per week onto the cost of running an older cheapie car if you need to drive into a town or city regularly. I actually spend less time plugging and unplugging my car in on my drive, than you do *driving* to petrol stations to fill up. And even a cheapie diesel won't have per mile running costs of 3.5 to 4p per mile.
At last an (EV) owner telling the truth about EVs. Keep up the good work. I live off grid & have to use petrol generators as it's too windy for wind generators(2 dead) and PV solar panels are extremely limited(12.2 kw array). I use every way possible to power my life but I have serious reservations about EVs as a automotive engineer even before haw you get the electricity to charge the battery.
Even with charging from home a recent 288 mile trip to London cost me £12 more in the EV than it would have in my wife's diesel Fiat 500L!
including the congestion and ulez fees? I very much doubt it, unless youre paying like 50p+/unit.
Yes diesel is now about half the price compared to an EV.
With all the weight of a EV they also burn through tyres alot quicker
really my ev i charge at home off peak at 7.5p per kw....288 miles cost me a total of £5....yes five pounds
That was really well explained and some new EV owners don't realise the difference between AC and DC charging. The only thing I would have liked to have seen is a bit more explanation of the charging curve for DC charging. You mentioned it a little bit later in the video and the 20 to 80% thing. Personally, if I am on a long journey I will charge it at home to 100% and the lowest I have been when I have got to a charger is 7% and I don't think that is an issue. I usually then charge to anywhere between 80 and 90% depending when the charge rate starts to drop and that is different for each car so you can't really put a % on it. The charge rate on a rapid charger can drop to less than the speed of an AC charger which I don't think some drivers realise.
I struggled to get it all in. I think another video on charge curves and optimum charging is needed in the new year 👍
When the battery is above 85% I've seen Rapid chargers drop to speeds lower than a 7kw destination charger. These things are all nuanced. People who compare broad conditions to each other won't get accurate results. You have to compare like for like. For example, a car with only 90 miles of range may take an hour to fill from 5%. A car with 300 miles of range would only have to top up to 30% to get 90 miles of range and therefore should not experience any reduction in charging rate. The two cars will acquire 90 miles at very different speeds even if the charger was rated at the same level and both cars could accommodate the charger's maximum speed. The Devil is in the detail.
DC charging will never drop BELOW the equivalent rate of AC charging because the maximum battery charging current is calculated independantly of source!
The maximum battery current is calculated by the battery management system based on a large number of parameters (most important are State Of Charge (SoC) and maximum battery cell temperature (Tbatmax). That maximum limit is continously sent to th charging control strategy and is used to limit the maximum charging current from any source to under that value. Realistically even at 7kW max charge current is unlikely to be limited for AC charging until very high SoC values as the current is really quite low (eg 7kW at 350Vnom is 20 amps, which is 0.3C for a 60kWh battery pack) AC charging limitation is actually much more likely to be simply to allow cell voltage balancing enough time to occur, and this is pretty in-frequent with a healthy battery pack
One of the clearest and unbiased reviews on UA-cam, brilliant
Thank you 🙏🏻
7 years into my X5 40D ownership and I feel that I am just at the start of ownership! Can't justify changing it for either a new diesel (possibly problematic), petrol (uneconomical) or ev. The only realistic alternative, at least for me, would be a Toyota Rav4 or Highlander but even then I think that I would miss the X5! Oh yeah, forget to mention that 600+ miles on a tank of diesel is easily achievable on a motorway journey.
Compliments the first so well and covered everything. Thanks for these videos, they are great. Only 2 things I would add based on my experience. Charge rates, I’ve seen one or two public charge points with rates now over £1/kw 😮. Other thing is that I sometimes find people park in charge points which can be annoying and cause significant delays from time to time.
Otherwise brilliant video and anyone thinking of buying electric has to watch this!
Thanks Tim. Yeah I paid 75p/kWh the other week and nearly passed out 😂
@@PetrolPed 😂
So called 'Iceing' is a big thing in US so I'm told, usually by pickup owners. seen a couple of YT vids with a Tesla slowly dragging an F150 or Ram out the way (don't know if a set up or not) but just funny to watch.
Look into Elli and their subscription packages. The free ones give you a slight discount, all the way upto the £12.99 package for which ionity is .29 per kwh and DC charging is .35p
Tesco were doing free charging via pod point until recently. Think my local one is now charging 28p a unit so cheaper than a single rate domestic price guarantee at the moment.....
Excellent video, very CLEAR & CONCISE information around the EV subject. Will help a lot of people understand the various in & out's of EV ownership etc... Keep up the good work.
Glad it was helpful!
Excellent video…only pedantic comment is when you talked about having 10% ‘power’ left in a battery pack. Batteries store energy not power as you know…many people would make the same mistake of course without realising it.
Thanks again for a very informative piece of work.
Indeed a tad pedantic but thanks for pointing it out 👍
Show what torque is by putting your right foot down for someone that will not see a RV for a good number of years. I enjoyed your blog. Your diction and accent is very easy to understand.
Thanks 👍
Very interesting, at last a simple explanation about the EV problems that governments and manufacturers gloss over. We have a £15k four seater car that always returns 50+ mpg which gives us an easy 450 mile range, important for us when travelling from Yorkshire to Bedfordshire.
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Yes you definitely need 450 miles range for a 130 mile trip 😂🤣😂🤣😂
@@fradaja well it was a 420 mile round trip which we did without refuelling or range anxiety in cold weather, with lights, heater all on. But then, we live in the real world.
@@peterrolt6403 Good on ya Peter, the problem is - most EV supporters do not want to know about the " real world "
Nice one Pete, very enjoyable and informative. I have had an electric car for two years now, it takes a lot of thought regarding range and ensuring the battery isn’t over/under charged and kept between 30 - 80%. We have solar panels so it keeps the cost down considerably. I love driving the car, the power and instant torque is amazing.
Do you have off-street parking or do you live in a terraced street?
You really don't have to keep it between 30-80%. Modern batteries have management systems etc.
@@pauldougall8385 Management systems that try to keep them between 30 to 80% charge.
There's no magic solution here. Lithium batteries charged over 80% or discharged below 30% significantly reduces their lifespan.
BRILLIANT! I'm talking about sound level. Wife just said to turn it down. Even louder than the adverts I clicked to skip. So many YT essays are recorded at low level so I can hardly hear them. You are clear in volume and enunciation
Thanks 🙏🏻
great video. Have a 730d, which gives 41mpg (motorway mileage), full tank circa600 plus miles and as at Dec 2022 fuel costs 23 pence per mile driven. No brainier, on cost alone EV's can wait another decade for me. But we need to get past all these companies milking early adopters before the average Jo will move over to EV
Well done Peter. That was well thought out and explained. I am surprised that people are having difficulties understanding how to protect the battery when we have been the owners of mobile phones and should have been charging them with the same idea of not hammering the battery every time we charge the phone. I would also like to see alarm systems for fire and smoke in the garage. There is always the issue of the Lithium going into run away fire.
Thanks 🙏🏻
Great summary of the numbers and how they relate to each other when it comes to EVs. The only thing I thought might be worth covering is the topic of battery life and the impact of different charging regimes on the life of batteries and their longevity and ability to hold a charge for longer.
Good subject for another video 👍
Exactly apparently you need to keep the battery between 80% and 20% for optimum battery life !!. Would you want to buy a second hand EV not knowing how the previous Owner has charged the battery ?.
@@colingregson8653 Depends how you buy the car, perhaps not sensible to buy privately unless you know the owner. If through a (reputable) proper dealer, they should be able to accurately determine the state of health of the battery.
Best presentation I've seen regarding the whole concept of how EV's operate. I think I'll need to watch again to better understand. What is my conclusion? I reckon this is not the way forward and our so called 'Leaders' are completely clueless, (as always), so the future looks grim for drivers. However, for those of you that understand the desired intentions of the world's leaders, ( I can't mention them without my post disappearing), non of the issues we encounter will be a problem as they don't intend us to retain ownership of cars going forward. Ownership of anything, in fact.
Thanks Geoff 👍
This episode was brilliant. I am buying my first EV and it now makes it easier to talk the talk✔️. Love your episodes and don’t worry about dumbing it down, I am good scientist and struggled to get EV lingo.
What a mistake to make. EVs are a massive con trick. They make no difference to climate change, in fact probably accelarte it due to the new mines being dug to get the lithium
It should be noted, that there were 2-6 hour waiting times at tesla chargers over christmas. If it takes 12 hours to charge at home, but 30 minutes at a tesla charger, then waiting 6 hours if youre low might be your only choice. So because rapid chargers are rare, they usualy have a waiting time to use them.
The refilling time on my 14 year old diesel is about 3-4 minutes and that give me 700 miles of range.
Great summary. One point . You used the term throttle. Where accelerator would be more appropriate. . The cost of an EV has to be put into context. Most of keep a car of minimum of 3 to 5 years . So the long term running and maintenance cost of both new and used EVs has to be a realistic set of data. Without this kind of data the general car buyer can’t make a logical choice
The most informative post I have seen, having now watched a lot of your posts I’m sticking with my diesel BMW.
I work for a National company which is just about to begin the change over to full EV vehicles but having looked at the charging networks can see issues.
I will keep you updated how this plays out in the near future.
Interesting 👍
I owned a Skoda enyaq 80x, (now returned) 300 miles in summer, 160 in winter. Drove like a granny, didn’t use the heater. Cost about £15 to charge at home… but also cost over £600 per month to buy with a big deposit which most reviews forget to mention is the purchase price is normally many £1000’s more. Given that fuel and electricity costs are getting closer I don’t think EV cars are much cheaper and I also found less convenient than ice. It’s a hard choice but for my larger mileages I’m going to try self charging hybrid petrol, though I have had diesel for years now. Another problem I found was lack of (useable) chargers - due to breakage and the increase of EV take-up….. the discussion continues.
Good video. What you haven't included is the extra costs on coffee and pastries on those 20min ultra charging top ups. 🤣
Very true 😂
@@PetrolPed as soon as one of the charge networks cotton on to complimentary hot drinks they've corned the market 🤣
That has to be the best explanation of EV motoring I've ever heard, I already own an EV so I can verify everything you said, good job. 👍
Wow, thanks!
An excellent and comprehensive summary. Whilst I’m still not entirely sold on having an EV as my daily, I’m a lot clearer on the realities and considerations of owning one as opposed to basing any decision on blind ignorance and speculation. Very helpful.
Thanks. Glad it was helpful 👍
a lot of it isnt correct though. An EV si way cheaper to run than those figures suggest and theres lots of mistakes in the video that are heavily in favour of the ICE cars
Fantastic video Pete. To the point and telling us everything we need to know about EV ownership.
Thanks mate and Merry Christmas 🎄
The running costs are not the issue, it's the initial outlay or higher monthly lease costs which make the difference.
It’s both and it’s all of it combined. How did U.K. Gov, nee a certain Johnson, think that 24 million homes in the U.K. could or would have private electric charging capabilities? IMHO, it’s incredible the Gov can even think of pushing EV when, guessing, probably 60-70% of these 24m homes won’t be able to have private charging….how can leaders of Gov push EV but not understand how awkward and expensive this is going to be. I suspect the car manufacturers know this hence why they are only making hyper expensive models for the rich and swanky folk!
What happens when many more people have EV’s, it’s all very well as shown in your video, you have one to hand. What about being out and about and you need to charge your car and there is a queue? What about the range if you are towing for instance? What about tyre pressures, not many people look after their tyres, how much does it affect the range if you are down a couple of psi.
Excellent video by the way!👍🏻
Thanks 👍
Living in cold Switzerland and after 3 diesel powered vehicles in the last 12 years i started moving to E.V.... but stoped at P.H.E.V. world. Daily comuting is a 12 kilometers máx. At the moment i can charge for free 3 days per month at work in underground parking. And for my long (30km+) back and forth journeys petrol motor save the day!!
It staggers me how little some people know even after they have purchased an EV so thanks for that concise description.
There are two aspects which I think you failed to cover fully and which may help people when choosing their first EV.
1/ Different models of EV's charge at different rates. My eTron 55 will will charge up to 150kw, whereas some may be a lot less (city cars) and some will be higher such as the Taycan, eTron gt, Ioniq 5 etc This will be important for those travelling longer distances and wishing to use public chargers.
2/ The charging curve varies depending on the car you purchase. Again, my eTron 55 has a fairly level charging curve at a reliable 134kw (on an appropriate charger) up to 80%, around 50kw to 70kw thereafter, whereas when I hired a Tesla model 3 in the US recently, it was significantly slower at Tesla Superchargers, sometimes around 35kw - which shocked me.
Range, charging curve and charging level ability are the three factors you should consider when reviewing charging.
A few general points.
ICE cars use more fuel when travelling in town and also at 70 on the motorway, they are also affected by a heavy right foot, their manufacturers figures are hardly ever achieved either and they are also affected by temperature so criticisms of EV's also apply to ICE to some degree. Also you don't normally run them to zero, as I would never run my EV to zero (I wouldn't do that with an ICE car either). Lowest I have been is around 3% but that was when my destination was my home charger and I knew it would work.
13.25p per mile in a diesel, equates to around 61mpg (high street prices), not sure a car that does that is the size, performance and comfort that the Mach E has. Don't forget that fuel prices on the motorway (where rapid and ultra fast chargers are) is at least 10% higher than high street also.
IMO, don't buy an EV if you haven't got home or workplace charging. The infrastructure is "OK" (for me anyway and I use home charging and the public charging for my 25,000 a year). My home charging costs me 2.75p per mile and my public charging (Ionity 150kw) costs me 11.6p per mile (in a relatively inefficient EV, 2.6 miles per kw average over 42,000 miles, when compared with some). Both journeys cheaper than the diesel example (not sure what diesel the AA were using fo comparison, I assume it was similar size car with equivalent performance) and any long distance trip usually consists of at least 200 miles at the lowest rate bringing the cost of a 400 mile trip down to 7.175p per mile (splitting it 50/50) so overall not bad and much better than the diesel example given. OK, so maybe the purchase price was higher but I would have bought an Q8 or Q7 anyway so I would have spent just as much in my case.When I include the lower BIK, road tax and corporate tax concessions (admittedly not everyone can get this) that apply at the moment, it is significantly cheaper than an ICE car. whilst I appreciate this will change, I've been taking advantage of these savings for almost 2 years now and will continue to do so until the government changes the taxation. The sooner people get into EV's the more they are likely to save. Especially if they can charge at home.
I have a V8 convertible for those nice days (winter and summer) but having had 16 ICE cars over the years, my EV is the best car I have ever owned. I'll be ordering an EV replacement soon.
Thanks for this 👍
I’m so grateful somebody has finally mentioned the fact that 80% charge means 80% range. Can you please tell all the car mags to bear that in mind, too.
I like being nice and toasty in the car in the winter. Heating, heated seats and heated steering wheel all roaring away. Being asked to compromise on this holds no appeal whatsoever, and never will.
What you are missing out on the cost per mile calculation is the initial purchase price. I recently rented a DS4, it was a petrol model which I liked a lot. Looking into the prices of the various models the pure electric vehicle was in round figures £10,000 dearer, which all adds to the CPM.
Motorway diesel costs about £1.73 per litre or £7.89 per gallon( £1.43 in urban areas). At motorway speeds, consumption is about 40 miles per gallon so for 250 miles that is 6.25 gallons = £49. At Gridserve, charges at a Rapid Charger regardless of rate is £0.79 per kWh. My car has 60kWh battery and would do 250 miles on full charge = £47. So pricing is similar. If I charged at home for the first part of the journey the price for first 250 mile drops to £0.09 pence per kWh. The charge time for me to get an 80% (48 kWh) charge at a rapid charger is based on the maximum my car can take which is 130 kW per hour. So that would be about 22 minutes. Time for a pee and a coffee.
For fuel alone, which I guess this comparison is, my 13 year-old oil-burner (with ECU map) does @65mpg making it run for 12p per mile. I'll stay with her for a while yet!
👍
Unless you can charge at home, my Model 3 costs less than 2p per mile to run.
@@NickFoster but how much to buy the piece of junk.
Still costly compared to s typical family EV, which if charged at home on 12p per kwh, can have a per mile cost of 3.5 to 4p. Plus you've got an upcoming increase in fuel duty of 20% plus..... And if you've still got that car in another couple of years, watch out for those Clean Air zone charges.......
@@neilwiddison6529 Many don't buy anymore, they lease or go for a PCP agreement. It isn't for everyone, but that way you get to drive a car that's always under warranty, plus you eliminate any concerns regarding depreciation.....
Excellent video, well done. I would dare to suggest that when comparing combustion engined cars to electric it would be helpful to compare available thrust at the driving wheels divided by vehicle weight relative to road speed rather than specific power and torque figures. Add this data to measured mileage per kWh charge input would give a much better comparison.
Great suggestion!
Hi Peter,
A very comprehensive breakdown of the cost of charging.
The one thing you may have missed, although you did touch on it, is the extra time involved to plan an electric journey, and aĺso the charging time.
It probably takes about 5mins to refuel and be on your way, stopping anywhere on route in an ice vehicle.
The extra planning involved with ev cars plus the extra time at the charger ( hard to quantify what peoples time is worth obviously) at lets say minimum wage of £10.42 per hour, makes ev vehicles ridiculously expensive surely.
Burning wood for heating if you have a super efficient wood burner, gasification type, also, you need to be sure that the wood burner if of sufficient capacity. Do not scrap your diesel boiler it is a great back-up for when you are away. //////// In north America domestic power is 240V split phase, 120V on each leg. However we can and do have 240 wall sockets capable of 10kW. I run my welders on a 6kW plug. Our clothes dyer is 5kW!!
I regularly watch various videos regarding EVs and I am a million miles away from ever being interested in an EV. This because I drive to Scotland four or five times a year, usually in Winter and a drive to Edinburgh is on a tank of diesel and when I need to fill up it only takes a few minutes. In total with a twenty minute stop at a motorway services, it takes about seven hours. If I buy an EV and get a Winter range of about 160 miles it’s going to take three stops for charging adding almost four hours to my drive, if there are available chargers and all with range anxiety. So from just over seven hours to taking almost 11-12hours to get there is a complete non starter for me.
I live in Central Scotland near perth and travel to my office every second month....... 1 stop to fill at 30 mins approx at either Leeds or Bolton Ionity and I arrive in roughly the sametime as you....and no i dont have the time to sit at 50mph the whole way....70mph the whole way, no issues....... VW with 77kwh battery.I also drive to the replublic of ireland 4 times a year and can do my house to Dublin with 80 miles left in the battery ...... winter range of 160 is only the case if you buy a car with small battery, drive above the speed limit and have the heat sat at 25 degrees. Drive at 70, heat at 18/19 and get a car with a heat pump
That's what, a 400-450 mile trip? If you left your house with a near-full charge (assuming you didn't get a garbage EV) that's about 180 miles of range in the winter. My Tesla gets 180 miles going from 90 to 10% in winter here. But looks like your lows hover around 0c on average. Our core winter months are rarely above -5c for a high, -10 for a low. So you'd likely get ~200mi on that charge from home. About what I get at 0c. Most likely you'd have to stop 2x to charge to ~75% to get to your destination. On a decently fast charging car, that's about 20 minutes. Remember, fast charging will heat up the battery for a while, getting you quite a few miles of summer like efficiency.
Even if you had to stop for a 3rd charge at your destination to get back, you're looking at a total of an hour of charging one-way, and 40 minutes on the way back. definitely nowhere near 4.
In the summer time, that's an easy single 20-25 minute charge stop to get 400 miles from home. Longer than ICE, but not dramatically so. Especially if you're like me and like to stop for 10-15 minutes every few hours anyway. Of course I live in the US where electricity is cheap. Even supercharging is 1/2 - 2/3 the cost per mile over ICE. Most of my charging is at home, where it's about 1/4 of the cost right now. Electric could be a bit more expensive if you have really high rates.
Great video. I was considering a Tesla model 3 last year but they are stupidly overpriced, then looked at an ID4 but that had a lead time of over a year. Ended up buying an Audi A6 TDI and that is very economical to run. I’ll stick with that for a while and see what happens I think.
No matter what the government, or electric vehicle manufacturers say the infrastructure is just not there to keep these vehicles rolling.
Also, I am yet to be convinced that from sourcing of basic materials to build, through to end of serviceable life use. That EVs are any more beneficial to the planet and it's inhabitants than any other vehicle.
I will be sticking with my 65 mpg Suzuki Vitara diesel with it's range of over 600 miles, and a complete lack of any range anxiety.
Furthermore, has anyone done a survey of, once EV owners have owned their cars for the vehicles 3/4/5 years owning span, how many go out and buy/ lease another one ?
@@lynjames8790 You are deeply ignorant. Research. The future of our children depends on it.
Hi, Thankyou so much for this first class video, you have explained all the answers to questions the dealers are 100% hopeless at. Thanks again and Merry Christmas & Happy New Tear.
You are most welcome
Superb video. For me, the one thing that is never explained is not so much the range on it's own, but the length of time it is going to take to "fill up" once you run out. There's a huge difference between being able to drive 300 miles and fill up with fuel in 5 minutes, and drive 300 miles and then be effectively stuck where you are until you recharge the batteries.
Most EV fans that don't actually have an EV don't seem to realise some of the shortcomings like the range/charging time issue, the fact that (ideally) you can't use the full range of the battery, the big difference in range that occurs when you use power hungry functions like the heaters and so on.
The proportion of people regularly driving 300 miles is small, and the proportion driving 300 miles without a break is even smaller! Charging more often at "comfort breaks" for shorter periods of time is better during, what for most people, are rare long journeys. EVs not yet totally suitable for the small proportion of people who drive more than 300 miles every day (without stopping), and don't have time for the charging.
@@salokin1 They're not suitable for a wide range of people, not just those who drive long distances. A plumber I know bought one last year and the battery wasn't lasting the day. That's without him leaving town. He's sent it back. That's why they're not selling in huge numbers (the hype would have you believe otherwise). People do not want to drive 100 miles then stop for an hour or more to charge, and unless you have (more expensive) fast chargers available, that could become several hours. Few people except the retired have a lot of time on their hands these days, and those who do don't want to spend it sat around waiting for their car to charge, or even worse, waiting hours for a charger to become available. The media hype will talk about record sales and the like, but in the UK there are still less than 1 in 10 people buying electric vehicles which is hardly a revolution. That figure also includes businesses like Amazon, Royal Mail and other companies who make up a significant number of the sales, especially those who are getting their vehicles paid for by the public.
@@severnsea3924 That plumber must have a small one (battery, I mean!). And only travelling 100 miles before re-charging is also referring to a car with a small battery and therefore not suited to long distance journeys.
@@salokin1 Mercedes Vito van costing over £30k. Was promised by the dealer it would do 150m per charge. Most people will want at least the ability to travel some distance without having to worry if there's a charger available at some point, such as days out or holidays. I would imagine it's chaos on an Easter weekend!
Point is, as it stands they're not fit for purpose in the same way that an ICE vehicle is, they're not as flexible and are therefore limited in what they can do, so why should people may considerably more for an EV than for an equivalent ICE vehicle? The emissions savings are somewhere between minimal and negligible (if they exist at all, which is becoming less and less clear). It makes no sense at all.
Good video Pete.....However, all it's done is confirm my doubts about EV ownership. There are just too many variables to driving these things. I own a 21 plate RSQ3, just the right size, range and performance for my needs. In order to get the same 360 to 400 miles I get on a tank, I would need to buy a larger EV because of the battery size I would need to give an equivalent range....and that depends on the weather and if I want to stay warm and get somewhere quickly.
When my RS's tank is empty, it will take me 5 minutes, every time, to fill from a standard pump with one type of 'connector'. The EV? I would have no idea how long it will take to charge because it would depend on what charge rate is available and if there's one free.......but at least an hour (just hanging around). I don't do many miles, but a vast majority of those I do, are long motorway round trips of about 300 miles once a month, and I just need to refuel on the next supermarket run. Home charging would help, but if I'd just plugged my 'empty' EV in at home and then needed it in a hurry, it's of no use at a all.
There's nothing to convince me that an EV is a good investment for my needs now or in the future.
I think you are panicking too much. Most EV's can do over 200 miles on a charge and I would imagine in 300 miles you would need to stop for a coffee or loo break. During your 20 minute coffee break the car would have more than enough range to complete the 300 mile journey. EV's are much nicer to drive and you would be much more relaxed and the journey would be much kinder to the environment. I've had an EV for three years and wouldn't go back especially in this cold weather, when I preheat from home and go into a nice warm car with heated seats and steering while on while neighbours are still scrapping theirs.
@@jimf4748 It's 150 miles each way to see our little Granddaughter for the day. No charging available at their house. I'd rather have the charging time with my family than sat around at a charger. Kinder to the environment? Very debatable!
@@jimf4748 A RSQ3 is a better drive than any lardy EV.
@@davidperry3531 So true and it sounds great!
Spot on. An RS3 in my country is only 10% more than a gt line Kia EV6, which is slower, drives like an SUV, and has an awful interior. Price proposition gets even better when Kia is compared to an AWD 310hp Formentor which is 2/3rds the cost too!
I switched from a diesel to a small EV after the number of days I need to be in work changed to 2-3 per week. I went for something small and low cost to see if I could live with public charging. It turns out I can and will likely buy something with a larger battery soon. Probably the MG4 long range.
In terms of cost it really depends what prices for public charging the AA are working off. I am in Scotland and with Chargeplace Scotland we have many 7kw, 22kw and a few 50kw chargers that are still free to use. However outside of those the cost ranges usually from 16p/kwh to 35p/kwh. So cost here is definitely lower than driving a fossil fuel vehicle. My monthly bill is usually £20-25.
But you overpaid many thousands for the EV version over the fossil fuel version.
Your car will also lose more depreciation the closer you get to the end of life for your battery as this will cost you or the next owner anything around 8 to 10k for a new battery.
The maths don’t seem to workout in the long run.
Not to mention here in the UK over the last 10 years petrol went up roughly 1.5x and electricity 5x
Had a Kona 64Kwh EV for 3 years now. Can''t imagine going back. I'm in the highlands - north of Inverness. I use the Scottish 'public charging network' for trips, doing maybe 200km/week. No át home charging'.
95% of my charging is on slow 7Kw ones, we have one 2 mins from my house. It costs 20p/kwh. At home .... it would be 52p per kwh. Comparisons with diesel are a full of holes, most notably the maintencance and mess cost. My last service, I was warned my brake discs were a bit rusty - the EV regen saves on using them a lot.
My last car, a diesel, was a pile of X/Y/Z problems, typically filters, oil, exhaust issues (it was getting old - but this was from service 1).
In Scotland you can buy an EV interest free via the ScotGov loan scheme. As a simple calculation, my drive to my mums in the central belt would in diesel would cost (before the massive rises) about 130 return - more in cold weather. Its pretty much a 60mph for 90% of that journey. The EV cost is 27 quid - more in cold weather.
Really very interesting, Many thanks. Clear explanations of what can be a confusing set of 'new' numbers.
We have two petrol cars - a 9 year old 1.2l Yeti (42K miles) and a 5 year old 1.4L VW Tiguan (40K miles). Given our personal 'mature' ages, the plan is to keep these until the bottom(s) fall out! Theirs or ours!
A bit cheaper - we hope - than buying an EV, installing a charger and stressing over the range esp in the winter.
I love the Yeti 👌👍
@@PetrolPed Much more fun that the Tiggy in the lanes! Best gearbox since MK1 Escort. 😁
Thanks heavens I drive both a diesel and a petrol and when their tanks are full (takes a couple of minutes) I don't worry what I do with the heater on or off etc until I have to fill up again !! Seems like a luxury and as I'm not a coffee drinker I don't have to sit in Costa or similar in some strange place for an hour or more waiting to charge before getting home and the possibility 2 hours later than planned as the 1st charger isn't working and the 2nd was full of cars waiting
Hi ped. Excellent vlogs as always. I’m one of those who will probably never buy a electric car. Can’t quite get the idea of waiting in a supermarket car park for however long, but each to there own. But here’s a thing. I was watching a couple mid twenties with a bmw ix3 on charge in a local supermarket car park. Both dressed nice clothes ect. The chap unplugged his car from the charging point and proceeded to fight with the 10 ft snake of a cable and also got his hands hoodie tracksuit bottoms covered in all sorts of gubbins off the car park floor. Why can’t the manufacturers or theses electric cars have a retractable cable so it’s never won the floor and stores neatly inside the flap where you charge. It would save a lot of faffing and getting ya hands clothes dirtied up. Love ya thought’s on it. Happy new year 👍👍👍
Those cables can be a nightmare 😂
the DC chargers have cables attached, but they aren't retractable as many of the higher powered cables are liquid cooled . If the cable is being detached at both ends and the person is taking it with them then these are AC chargers (same as home at 7kw sometime 22kw), and to be honest unless they're free and your going for dinner and the cinema for quite a few hours then they're not worth the hassle for 1 hour in Tesco to put 7 kwh in your car!
I recently bought a 1.5 litre Mini Cooper D and am well happy with my MPG. I don't pay RFL either.
Excellent video and perfectly explained, i was confused with charging ports AC/DC but you explained it 100% in minutes
Perhaps it might have been interesting to get a little into battery degradation at higher charge rates, especially so as the cost of replacement batteries being so high.
Someone paid 7k for a refurb Tesla battery EVs are a car for the few as most people can not afford them
It is actually a 3 pin for the US, believe it or not, most all outlets here in the US have a ground pin in addition to the standard two for power. A lot of household items only use 2 of the pins, but many use all 3, including, based on images, the Ford Mach-e charger.
Ah thanks for that 👍
Yes, it's a good video. You just confirmed it for me unless I'm only doing town driving. I won't bother looking for one.
Glad I could help
Your films are very informative and a cobalt powered vehicle is simply unaffordable for us.
Thank you.
The problem is that ALL electricity substations need upgrading to cope with home EV charging and that will take a minimum of 15 years and for rural areas possibly never.
Nothing is being done about this and we are already 10 years behind.