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The problem I foreshadow is what major labels are going to do with AI Music. We are mad at all these indie AI Music companies but what is going to happen is the major labels will end up knocking these things off so that none of us have access to them. Once the indie public AI music companies are gone then major labels can utilize the language model behind close doors, create AI generated music, collect all the royalties, and then never have to hire or sign a real artist again. The other problem is streaming services could also get in on this to recoup revenue from the streaming royalty pool.
We will always have access. It's only going to get better and better. Soon all of you will be generating entire hit albums that basically turn the serotonin of music listening into a type of heroin
Not sure about the first part but the second part about streaming services getting in on it is IMO already happening with botted playlists. Which is why everyone should leve streaming platforms with PRO RATA model becuase one has zero control over how many people will steal from you.
When Rick Beato is talking about music getting worse, he’s talking specifically about popular music that is on the top of the charts, not the latest King Gizzard Record or Justice or (insert your favorite musician here). Not sure if this was discussed in the longer version of this clip so I imagine y’all know that.
Rick Beato and Benn Jordan getting together would be awesome. Two youtubers who have a lot of credibility and have made a meaningful contribution to the topic of music production and consumption in different ways
I'm a singer, and a musician. I'm not exactly thrilled, that i've spent my whole life perfecting my voice, and now it can be analyzed by AI and reproduced within minutes. That being said; the invasian of the arts is the least of my concerns, when it comes to AI. I'm more concerned about AI being paired with robotics, and how many jobs that will be eliminated because of that. Having AI on a stationary computer or on servers is one thing. Having autonomous humanoid robots operating on AI, which will be coming soon....is something everyone should worry about. And if you want to relate it back to music; AI may be able to compose music, but it can't go out and gig. When the robotics tech gets a little bit better, that will be possible. And I'm positive, that there are people who would pay to see music and "singing" performed by machines.
People in Japan (mainly) are already watching animated characters perform, just like Hatusne Miku who "performed" at Coachella... it's like Gorillaz Mk 2. Sad that anyone can think this is a replacement for a live act but that's where we are heading unfortunately to maximise profit.
You have a edge up, being able to clone your voice and kick out songs fast and build your content. AI music does not reuse a voice to make more than 1 song aka more able to make more songs with the same voice. But that will change soon give a couple months
@@girardstudio you mean the kind that didn't rely on a database of existing music to whom it should be paying royalties? Yeah it's fun to make the songs, but it's stealing. It's not new, it's reshuffled extant material. Consider yourself lucky if you can just get away with stealing it without paying the original sources.
I'm hoping Michael is trying to be funny calling the Fisher Effect "Fisher-Price." Benn, "A terrible source of data?" It is the data. It is accurate whether it fits YOUR narrative or not. I use SUNO and my biggest complaint is vocals sound like several singers all vying to be heard above the other. That being said, I use it to see what MY lyrics sound like in different genres. So, a sketch pad basically. If someone can make a career out of Ai Music, have at it. I think there's plenty of room for everyone.
Exactly! These ppl are only upset because they wont be the ONLY ones making big money or having a seat. Most people are not using ai like the fear mongering group are claiming on the news and in these popular videos. Its a tool. Like a daw or synth…anyone can use it in anyways. The only ppl upset are the ones who are not doing the work but have had big dreams for a long time, people that truly dont know what ai is, or the ones who are at the top and dont want to share.
@@lNowHerelnot true it's not just the labels that aren't making money it's your average engineers, mixers masterers that will also be taking a major hit. As you can just type in prompt and it spits out a fully formed song. I'm more concerned with just how it's going to affect human musicians and their ability to earn a living. There are way more independent artists than there are artists on labels.
@@ThatOrkoPurists have been disarmed more and more each decade due to various technology advancements. Those who only deal with analog & acoustics need to create their own path forward (as they’re the ones being too stubborn to be more tech savvy). ListenTo by Audiomovers can be used in so many diffident ways to generate revenue. Blame yourself for your own actions (or for not taking action).
@@ThatOrko Agreed. If the AI can generate the song, it can also simulate the influence of an engineer etc. on that song. Eventually, there will be no engineers and producers left that the AI doesn't already know how to simulate.
Well, I happen to think that a large majority of music produced these days is utter trash. It's soulless, vapid and formulaic. Its humanity is quantised and pitch corrected away, and it's completely without surprise, interest, virtuosity and originality. AI generated work would be this, but doubly so. And for what? Just to make even more money for some of the worst people on the planet.
Not every artist is on a major label there are way more independent artists than major label artists. The independent artist and self-employed engineers etc are going to be hit the hardest.
Ai is crap that was built for ppl that actually don't do music. It isn't a creation tool, instruments are for that. Tech companies always lie and have not told the truth to date.
It sounds like you've not explored it fully. It is actually used by talented musicians to help improve their music further. Some of what AI can do is very creative and useful, and saves a lot of time too. AI tools can help to make great musicians/producers/engineers etc even better. It might only be used in 10% of their track, but it's helping them achieve better results. AI is used in technology in a lot of industries, it saves time and money and gives people new options. People should embrace it with both arms. Making a complete song with AI only is a different thing altogether.
@@hearmenow909 I'm not interested, I'm a musician with over 40 yrs of experience. It's a tool for theft no matter what you say. I get why most of the ppl that want it, mainly because they are not creative.
Sweet! I can't wait for the Beato collaboration. Benn and Rick getting together would be good UA-cam. From watching a bunch of Beato, he seems pretty open minded. He is at least willing to put thoughts out there and letting the good and bad comments fly without being butt hurt.
The only reason im upset is because people don't have to be good at the craft anymore. There's a level of respect when you hear a song and you know this person put in the time and has Mastered their craft.
Here's the thing, Benn and Michael - What if you're wrong and AI does cannibalize singer, songwriters and bands? The system is broken, we can agree on that. Surely we should focus on fixing the system rather than laying yet another burden on it. I don't agree with everything Rick Beato says, but I tend to agree with him that modern recording artists tend to lean on technology where once they had to lean on skills, ability and sheer talent. I see AI as an extension of that - muzak produced by technology to fill product quotas. You're talking about musicians using AI to explore boundaries, which I can agree with. But you know (and you, especially, Lady C) that that's not how labels will approach this. If they can replace the songwriters and the band with AI-in-a-box, they will (and probably already are). How do the singers and songwriters and musicians survive when the machine is cheaper and tireless. Maybe the machine can write a masterpiece (infinite monkey theory) but at what cost? And what about the fact that it has to be trained on existing music with no compensation or recognition of the people who made that music? I know, AI is the "new shiny", but I think there are serious issues for the music business to resolve before it dives headfirst.
Regarding Benn Jordan's point on Aphex Twin and how many instruments one plays, etc. I don't think everything can or should be relativised. Stuff at the extremes should not be a real world example. A person writing a prompt on a web site (not very dissimilar to performing a Google search) and getting the site spit out a (probably) shitty, generic song cannot be described as a musician. It's just common sense and this type of stuff shouldn't be put in question otherwise all this extreme relativism will make us loose sight of plain and simple, obvious common sense. Comparisons like Benn made can surely be discussed, but please, let's stay sane and agree that someone spitting songs on website is not and should not ever be classified as a musician, As a musician I find the notion abhorrent.
Humans don't even see how they're going against their own self-interests. I'm not anti-Ai but I appreciate what you're saying because not a lot of people are talking about these issues
@@maxvincent6062 Yes and no. Music triggers emotion. AI could totally make music that does that. The ratios are the ratios. Soul in music is definitely a human factor but emotion can be triggered by AI. Even if you don't like it.. still an emotion.
It's not that we don't care about music, we just don't care where we get it at the same quality. We also now have the ability to more heavily contribute directly to the artists, not their leaches.
Some drummer in the 70s/80s were complaining about being replaced by drum machine, and some musician were scared of synthsizer. At the same time people like Phil Collins embrace them, and create one of the most iconic drum roll on a track that is half "drum machine made". Others artist like New Order completly embrace the machine and made one of the most iconic drum/synth pattern, Moroder is another exemple that completly redifine music using those new tools. The same goes for sampling (which is a bit more close than the AI situation). Music evolve alongside technology, and has always been, musician 500 years ago probably were complaining about the unification of music notation or something like that, people 120 years ago were complaining about the recording creation destroying the cheet music market, 80 years ago about the live microphone destroying loud singer performence (but creating the crooner style). It's the same in every artistic domain (photo "replacing" painting, digital replacing vinyl...), most people pass a certain age stop to evolve, maybe cause they feel that they reach the right level in their field, or they don't want to see their years of practice being replace by something that make it more easy, so they complain, they're scared, because it feels better to be part of some kind of "old lost art", when in fact they just part of the previous generation of "kids don't know the real struggle", cause it always evolve and things always become easier. But what's easier is to make the same old stuff, the same way DAW make it easier to build a DJ Premier type beat, and now that this is easier for everybody, then it's the artist role to push it further. Nostalgic people can still listen to old records
Makes no sense, because analogy breaks. It might be true for a few years ..but after that will break. Even now humans are still musicians, composers. AI will just spit out endless automated music. It won't even need supervision. Companies will set it up so consumers talk to AI for generative music. In the end there will be no musician in between doing anything.
Ben is an oddball. If you “create” a song through AI, you are not an artist. He starts on a false narrative. I think there should be an AI only platform and if people want to listen to it, so be it. Keep it separate so it stands on its own and not get mistaken by being next to a real production. You should not be able to collect money, royalties etc.. because you have done no work. The record labels are right to sue AI companies.
Right on man! And the thing that makes me the angriest about this whole thing is the number of people that think they are now artists because they can type in a few prompts into an algorithm and create something out of it. What a joke! Yes, get people up on stage And see how many people stick around to see them prompt something on stage. Put them in front of a real instrument, and see what happens. They'll embarrass the heck out of themselves because all they've done is prompt stuff in. Exactly as you said. They are not an artist because they haven't done the real work. Right on!
AI will blow human artists away within 2-3 years if midjourney blew all human artists away. You want to gatekeep it cause you know this. I’d rather listen to great ai music than average human songs.
I've been a musician for a long time ( I started playing bass at 12 in 1978). I started writing electronically generated ( synth based) stuff in 1985, using a Macintosh and a Dx7. No humans were used (or harmed) in the process apart from me. 40 years later, I still use computer systems and synths to write all my music. Still no humans involved, apart from me. I don't use loops, I play and record all my drums by hand, and then play bass, keys, or guitar over those tracks live. People love the music, and it's completely 100% human created. Ai music is just about as dumb as the crap that inspires it. Ai does not have a soul. It has algorithms. Those are little lines of code that tell it 'this is important to steal, and this is not', while selecting the music it steals, oops learns, from. Humans have a similar system called a heart and feelings, and it allows us to know the difference between what is good and what is bad, based on those feelings; not algorithms. All the Ai stuff I've heard, including the stuff Beato talked about and played, did NOTHING for me. That is not music. That is just sound. I suppose if you were stranded on Mars and had a kid, and they were raised on the crap, they wouldn't know music could be anything else. But real music, created by real people with hearts and souls, will never be eclipsed by Ai. If record companies put out music by Ai to challenge real musicians, I say bring it on. I've spent the last 30 years listening to garbage being released as pop, rock, and RnB that isn't worth a bucket of pee. It's time the robots took away the financial incentives of these posers, forcing real musicians to step up and show everyone how it's done, or let music die a sad pathetic death.
Even in image generation, Prompting alone isn't gonna help you, at the end of the day, to be a good AI artist, you're doing allot of editing (inpainting) or Outpainting, even of you use 100% AI tools, the AI isn't doing it without the direction of the human, and in that way it's still art. Now, all you can do in Suno or Udio is writing your own lyrics, and song extension, but I'm sure we'll be able to edit tracks, change notes, switch instruments, and more. When that happens yes, you can call yourself an A.I. musician, not there yet with Suno or Udio, but you can do that with other tools using samples. The beauty of AI is it lets you experiment at an accelerated rate. I've made images with Stable diffusion for ideas, and then turned around and made something similar in Photoshop the standard way....but you know what? Got my workflow done fast, cause I got over a lot of creative hurtles. "But suno generates 500 songs with only 10 dollars" Yeah, but do you have any idea how many generations you have to do to get something useable? It's safe to say I made about 400 songs in the last month, don't think for a second I'd put even half of them on any streaming platform. Most of them are in my trash folder. Think I have maybe 10-15 that are good enough to get mastered. And yes, I know some will say that don't make me a musician. I heard that before when I was entering midi notes in a DAW, and never played an actual instrument.....don't care. I'll sleep well at night, cause I know I'm putting enough of my own creativity in the mix.
I play guitars and bass .. I make music on Bandlab then i take a 2 minute clip to Udio. Then it took 15 second of my 2min clip then bang i got a beautiful song that didnt cost me thousands in a studio..
I havn't seen the video yet I'm posting before I do........ Its human expression and the very soul of a human being, what we are at the core that is being ignored. A song created by a human is an inspiration , it's needless to say that the value of actual human expression is a powerful and one of our most cherished gifts. It's our duty to preserve this gift , forever. 💯💯💯❤🔥🔥❤🔥
I am all in on AI music 41 songs with ISRC numbers, and videos on channel. Your video was a good insight into Ai music . Plan B is an exclusive radio station. Also thinking of licensing tracks for virtual tubers to use .
The way I see it, recorded music runs on a cycle of counter-culture music born out of a rejection of the mainstream that gains popularity in some organic manner and is then eventually adopted by the masses, picked up by major labels and eventually becomes the mainstream thing that people eventually get sick of which spawns a new counter-culture etc etc. This cycle will probably continue into the AI era but only if AI music companies are not allowed to just immediately scoop up the newest music and incorporate it into their models.
I play piano and sing sometimes and I like to write songs. I became interested in AI generated music last year and have explored both udio and suno. They generate a lot of interesting but derivative work. Some of it is quite good but the lyrics are a usually cliche and sometimes silly. I think that this will probably improve with time and we may even enter a world where AI is capable of producing something unique and new. I don't feel the competition because I'm not on Spotify. If people are angry because AI music is competing for sales then they can always play venues. That's where we began before recording and I think for a lot of people that's where we're going to end up.
I think as creatives we live in our own world and sometimes lose touch with the common listener. When you surround yourself with other creatives, you create an echo chamber. But when you step outside of that chamber and talk to family, friends, coworkers, etc... they, more often than not, truly don't care "how" the music was made. They care about how it makes them feel. Lots of listeners don't understand the difference between melody and improvisation. Many can't identify instruments other than drums and guitars. Most have zero understanding of music theory or history... again, they just care how music makes them feel. And for many, probably a very large percentage, they like specific songs not because of the music, but because of the memories the songs are attached to. In my observations, lots of people angry about Ai don't really have any skin in the game and are just bandwagoning against tech that they don't understand.
I believe the music industry and true artists will eventually have to accept AI-generated music. Lawsuits won't make it disappear. Music generation by AI is akin to picture or computer code generation, both considered art forms. As AI methods continue to improve at a faster pace than humans, the quality of AI music, which some may currently find subpar, will also improve. We must adapt to the reality that creativity isn't exclusive to humans. Record labels currently suing AI music companies will likely use AI-generated art, such as pictures or code, in the future instead of hiring human artists or programmers. While music artists feel AI systems are stealing their work and fear for their livelihoods, this is similar to programming, where AI is trained on vast amounts of code from the web and repositories like GitHub. It’s believed that AI could replace programmers in the future, and humans will need to accept and adapt to this new reality.
I have been a musician for over 20 years and collecting instruments for a decade. I never saw music as a means of making money, but rather as a means of expression. Maybe that's why using AI doesn't make me afraid or uncomfortable, it's just a way to have other perspectives on music. Call me crazy, but what makes me uncomfortable is seeing other musicians and humans showing a side as ugly as hatred, prejudice and irrationality. Also, I understand that music is taken as a job, but not that it is naturalized to the point that it is as if without payment, human music has no future. I think it is even contradictory if one is supposed to defend human art, and its rich history.
Thank you so much for saying this! I have been an animator for series television for 20 years and we're going through a similar situation with AI. I've seen a lot of colleagues express their opinions, majority negative, about AI. I can understand, no one wants their work stolen but I am struggling to see the difference between an AI making something different but based on an existing design and a person doing the same thing - which is how most young artists learn. I don't feel threatened by AI art because I have used the tools and think that it's a fascinating jumping off point, if you will, instead of an engine to replace people. Personally, I see AI music much like AI art, it's a jumping-off point, a tool. Maybe AI will help a stuck musician with a chord progression or refine their lyrics? Perhaps it can help that kid get into music who never had a hope in hell because they didn't grow-up in a system which taught music or had parents who could afford it? As I've stated earlier in another comment, the most generous, talented, and humble artists (with massive portfolios who have worked with the BIGGEST studios), have always been kind to new talent and encouraging. If this is a new tool to help people out, why not use it?
As an artist who has been in the scene for nearly a decade, and has recently seldom used AI as an assistive tool to help me get ideas for my compositions, but never to *generate* anything that would remotely make it into my final production, I think the problem with AI and people's sentiment is threefold: - People are scared of losing the human factor. Part of what makes music, music, is the fact that a human being - a person we can relate to - has put in the work and their style, feelings and/or life experiences are reflected in that work, no matter how good or bad it may sound. - AI can be great in the right hands, but really dangerous in the wrong ones. You can be sure companies and big labels WILL make use of AI in unethical ways if that means they can maximize profit. People fear the music landscape may become flooded with samey/soulless computer-generated content that far overshadows human creations. - And then there's the whole issue with AI datasets and the apparent impunity with which artists' music is being taken for training models without being notified, without their consent, and without any clear form of opt-out. We often do not know our music is being used for these purposes - and most of us will never find out until it's too late.
Thanks for the reply. You have some great points. Please join us at a YT LiveStream tonight at 5 pm PST; we love having considerate, serious musicians along for the ride.
Like every new thing that comes out. There will be both good and bad uses for this new tool. I try to always see the positive side of things. AI can revolutionize the music industry.
I would say that tech companies being tech companies have relatively unlimited opportunities of what they can do (besides for art/music), since there are unlimited problems in the world which AI can potentially solve. Artist on the other hand, being artist, have only art to make, and if that opportunity is taken away from them, they'll be in serious trouble. Also, the fact that AI companies are focusing their investments with art, is perhaps serving as a distraction, or rabbit hole, and preventing them from developing things which can solve serious problems, and be of real service to humanity, (and ultimately benefit themselves as well)
The role of the artist remains crucial in this process, as they are the ones who take these new tools and technologies and use them to create something fresh and innovative. As you pointed out, while digital tools like DAWs have made it easier for anyone to create music, it's up to the artist to push the boundaries and explore new sonic territories. In conclusion, the relationship between music and technology is a complex and ever-evolving one. While nostalgia for the past is understandable, it's essential to recognize the potential and opportunities that new technologies bring to the world of music. Embracing these changes can lead to exciting and groundbreaking creations that shape the future of music.
@@TopMusicAttorney Def not signing with a major label, doing the independent route, but I believe until myself, or anyone figures out the video part of it, it's not going to be noticed.
Just a couple months ago, I was knee deep in AI research. Even with the most basic models (not music related), I could train a model on two different concepts, and interpolate and extrapolate between the two to come up with something "new," despite it not being new but just a mixture of the data points to generate something not seen. I'm not too familiar with what's going on in AI for music, but that means that I can pretty much generate any AI-based music with the right amount of data, controls, testing, and so forth. If music data is free/easy to get, I don't need to compensate artists for it, and there's no real way right now to track when something is generated by AI. Would it be a nice tool to have to rapidly create music? Yes. Would it be problematic and unethical? Yes. It requires training on data that was generated through blood, sweat, and tears, to reproduce the same original work with modifications in milliseconds, where the artists aren't necessarily properly getting compensated for. We need to fix the data issue first before everyone starts flocking to AI willy-nilly, otherwise every artist will soon be out of a job. You may not think that's a possibility, but these AI companies will monopolize on this industry and suck the little money that's left right out of artist hands.
Models need to get big before they actually get any intelligence, as the intelligence is emergent. ChatGPT was used to develop new nuclear reactor designs. Not the most practical, but new ideas. It also has a theory of mind. Best guess is that the music AI is using a tokenized CNN with a transformer network. The publicly available tools only mono, so they have done some coding on that.
There are two key problems with Generative AI. One is legal: are all the artists who's music is being extracted and fed to the AI so it can learn giving their permission for such use, and whether given permission or not, are they sharing in the profits made from such AI? Secondly generative AI is only a mechanism for mashing up and regurgitating what already exists in its data set. It has no ability to be creative in the context of adding innovative content and ideas. If people were to stop creating new innovative music, AI would have no new content to learn, and its output would stagnate. As a result, I think a more appropriate use of AI is for individuals to train AI for their own use with their own catalogue. This also allows the user of the AI to inject that added human aspect to create really unique content from a mashup of what the AI is producing for them, and their own talents. I don't think anyone would have an issue with that since the artist is the source. Spotify et al's approach to AI as a panacea of generating music without having to pay artists is wrong on so many levels, and their attack on external AI companies is only to clear a way for them to control that themselves. I think rightfully, artists should push back and force companies like Spotify to share any profits made from music generated based on their catalogue. There should be no free lunch - particularly for these middle-man companies.
Are those artists sharing their profits with the other artists who's music they consumed to learn from? "Secondly generative AI is only a mechanism for mashing up and regurgitating what already exists in its data set." You are hallucinating. There are weights in a neural net, but it has no access to music data. New music genres are being made with the AI.
@@abram730 What new genres? I haven't heard anything from AI that isn't derivative. Also, we've seen cases where people use melodies / riffs from successful artists in their own music, and end up getting sued and losing. So the point isn't what you've learned from a skill perspective (e.g. arpeggios, scales, muscle memory/skills with instruments), it's the idea of the level of derived content used from the original. Look at case law on this subject between humans - and I think it will be instructive for what we see coming down the courts in the near future for AI. AI does not have the ability to really be creative like a human can, and until it does, it will be open to legal challenge for derived works.
@@lodragan Go to Suno and click explore. You will see some new genres. "melodies / riffs from successful artists" They likely have copywrite checking software as part of the training process The AI certainly doesn't have an understanding of law. That software probably ignores producer tags for instance as that would false flag new songs by the producer. That creates a hole in training so it will directly try to reproduce them if prompted to do so. The first step of training is basically forgery, as the AI attempts to turn static it is given into the original. Only after it can do that do you move on to making pastiche works in training. One would use copywrite checking software to ensure that the AI is making pastiche works, rather than forgeries. Vast amounts of listening is required to get an understanding for genres, and gain the ability to be original. This is because the AI gets no formal education, rather it is required to become a an idiot savant at music.
3:30 really interesting point. We quanify success and payment based on time (plays, views, streams). Now AI rights would be based on some % of influence on the model.
@topmusicattorney, if you’re serious about that roundtable, please include Ted Gioia in the mix. His predictions are spot on when it comes to music and the economics around it. ❤
My favorite part about this argument is that there's a whole bunch of people who think that music dies once in their personal economics die. As every video that has ever been made about the industry on the internet likens it to satanic pedophilia minstrelism.
One argument against AI is that AI can't understand human emotions, and thus can't express them as it lacks the life experience. I created an account on Suno and gave it a try. "Broken Echoes" is purely a prompted song and I include the prompt in the description. I then wrote a song called "Gone for Good" The goal was expressing raw emotion with AI, and I essentially wrote a song for my own prompt. I figured a young woman expressing the loss of her first love to another woman would be quite raw. I uploaded both songs. How would you compare them? Would you consider them emotionally expressive? Note: I missed a typo in my lyrics and cause a skip on the word choked, so please ignore that.
Sorry, that might have seemed a bit flip. I realise you're doing a legitimate experiment, but I don't like the sound of the result. I have not yet heard an AI voice that can compete with a human.
@@nzlemming Perfectly fine, I'm looking for feedback. I personally hate autotune myself. I got a tip about changing the genre to synthwave to get rid of the autotune. No autotuning in that genre.
I just made two Ai songs and two music videos for a film festival this week. It's on the channel "Neural Net Theater" on here. I can tell you that it took a lot of iterations, but the Rap and beat I made with it in an hour is wild. The Post Punk track is even more wild. And the music video, which would have been thousands was free with two days of editing and getting the shots using another Al. All I have to say is if this is the "demo", Artists and Producers better make sure this stays open to everyone, because if only the studios have access than they can pump out a hundred thousand albums an hour in any genre and we are toast. The reality of all this is that nothing said here or so far by anyone is going to make this magically go away because the ai genie is already out of the bottle with this tech. So like it or not we have to accept "best case scenario" is that the public and the labels all get the same access and advantages in using it. Otherwise it's over. If they monopolize this through regulations, that they themselves are exempt from, then it's over. There will be no “market”. Over.
I’m not trying to be rude, or a smart ass, but would you be comfortable saying instead “ I just prompted AI to make two songs and two music videos for a film festival” and “the rap and beat I prompted AI to make in an hour is wild” ?
@@josemelrose5465 However if we want to be specific we could most accurately say that I have a writing credit on the lyrics, and edited the music video, and animated like over 6000 still frames into a complete stop motion video. We could say Ai is the “performer” that actually performed those lyrics, and Ai recorded the “Master”. That’s if we are being pedantic. But Pedantic is fine with me. Music consists of two separate parts in the legal sense, the composition and the recording. And a third in this case for the visual media. In which to achieve this form of multi media the human must engage in all three.
@@TopMusicAttorney A week ago, none. Now that I have a workflow the goal has become to have a portfolio of ai “artists” in various genres in order to have a reel put together to offer Ai music video services for “real artists”. I can put together the visuals for an ai music video in a few days that would cost an artist thousands or tens of thousands to shoot in real life, and I can do it in a few days, by myself, and for a few hundred dollars. So for right now I am using it as a portfolio. Although if I can monetize the channel that’s another avenue. And ultimately in the future it gives me a library of samples in different genres that i never have to worry about clearing if I want to make tracks later. But really at this point it’s crazy fun to make obscure Japanese City Pop and K-Pop and Afro Cuban tracks. I just found out it can do different languages so that’s really fun.
Hello, I'm from the future. An implant was installed in me that helps me compose music. The implant is connected to the internet and transmits information from there to my brain. With this new tool, I can create several new songs every week. Thanks to the implant, I can finally express myself. Long ago, someone wanted to ban such tools.
I'm personally perplexed on this topic - I actually understand both sides (perhaps more so on behalf of the AI users). I sing, write lyrics, melodies, can't play guitar, but can play other instruments (flute, drums, cajon, piano). As a singer, I took total offense to AutoTune (and actually still do with one exception - Cher's Do You Believe In Life After Love, probably because it was so obvious, not being hidden). But then when DAW/MIDI/etc became readily available, I recall the same argument being made - you're using technology to create what is in your mind and not necessarily the specific drum beat etc. At some point I expect we will be able to use our voice to "play" guitar, drums, etc, get AI to put music to a melody in our head (with or without lyrics or making the lyrics/melody even better). The PROBLEM I see, from pro/anti AI perspectives is HOW do we get listeners, get paid correctly, and ensure our Copyrights aren't violated (I accidentally as a kid wrote lyrics to the melody of a song my Dad recognized, but not from someone I ever had heard - when he showed me I was shocked). I think those are the hurdles we should be focused on at this time. The rest will eventually fall into place IMO. Afterall AutoTune, DAW, Midi, etc have all found their place and are now widely acceptable tools.
@@ReigneNation Whether you’re Pro AI, Against AI, or don’t care …. It really doesn’t matter. We all have our opinions but the “PROBLEM” paragraph didn’t have anything to do with AI if you really think about. AI isn’t going to help with you any of that. The 3 main sources of revenue for music groups are Events, Music Retail, Merch (Sync & Endorsements are honorable mentions). How is AI going to affect any of that? Events: Host your own traditional concerts and when you’re off the road: livestream to venues: Zoom Workplace + ListenTo by Audiomovers + Venue IRL = ‘Moment House’ concerts for a LIVE audience You can also use ListenTo by Audiomovers to host silent popup music performances. All you need is a Laptop w/ a stable internet connection, an audio interface and your instrument of choice. Use social media, Social Phone by Distrokid, or have a QR Code at the table so ppl can Scan To Listen. Use Linktree to share your LIVE audio, tickets, retail, socials, etc. It’s a great way to get out into the real world to market yourself. There’s so many Web2 tools to help you already but Web3 will help a lot more with music retail & protecting your music. You gotta have a more forward thinking mindset. Shift your focus. Create music that resonates with you and use technology to improve your categories of revenue. You gotta be more tech savvy and more forward thinking.
So are you ok with platforms being flooded with tens of thousands of tracks per day that were created in their entirety in a matter of minutes? You don't think that affects real musicians chances at discovery on these platforms? Not to mention the years they have spent learning their instrument(s) and songwriting artistry? I think it dilutes music to the point where the only musicians that will exist are "creators" which is incredibly sad.
@@JonsGuitarGarageSo “shelf space” is a concern again? Welcome to problems from the pre-internet days. Yep, the internet is severely saturated, that was bound to happen eventually. But anywho, I don’t need to copy & paste - this comment section is small asf rn. Learn how to read, resources are right in front of you. You’re just as lazy as those you’re complaining about. Sad asf LOL!
@@JonsGuitarGarageif you are dependent on platforms that were not paying you much anyways then ai is not your problem. If youre making great music and utilizing all tools available to you to connect and build a community for your music you are not concerned about what ai is doing on spotify because you are busy with what you are cresting and connecting with current and new community members. You just want to be mad to be mad. If you were really doing the work you would have nothing to be mad about.
Why are we mad? Because it's being developed by and for powerful companies but they could never do it without illegally taking the work of artists that might have never seen a penny thanks to the streaming platform's models! Is it that difficult to understand?
The biggest difference is this. people create music for their soul and hoped people could relate, then it turned into making music strictly for money which is why there is AI now. No soul, no creativity, just market share.
I don't believe that is the case for all independent artists. That may be the idea for major labels. And of course if this is what people are trying to do for a living and be their soul source of income they're going to run it like a business. That's the dream isn't it to make money from your art and not have to work a regular 9:00 to 5 job and just do what you love and make money.
Ai isnt just affecting the music though.. Using ai to write.. or compose? Why even bother.. the ai just took the job. It shows just how useless the human who used the ai, actually is. Cant form words? Why be a writer? "Oh, the ai will do it for me.." thats fraud.
@@ThatOrko They are not even looking ;) The funny thing is that it's so easy to understand: it's called ARTIFICIAL, meaning it is a substitute, a replacement. Whatever activity was previously done by a human is now done by a machine, with or without assistance, the goal is to replace everything at all stages. The direction is pretty clear. How it will fare and how long it takes is debatable, but automation ('cause AI is just a fancy buzz word to change the mindset and be marketable to investors) has been creeping into society for a long long time, and now it can reach incredible levels in MANY areas. It doesn't matter if it's really good, in a globalised market with concentrated power, the trends are never set by the customer, nor the employee or contractor. It can even surely fail in some ways even in the short run, but jobs will be lost and wages go down anyway because companies implement these crazy ideas regardless of the consequences. Why do you think they let out the geenie for free public use in these past few years? ;)
As an organic musician with thousands of hours of practice, my opinion is that AI music lacks emotion and passion that goes into to creating and performing music that moves a person 😅
I’ve been a music producer for nearly 20 years. I think people are being a little close minded about AI. We’re so caught up in these AI generated songs, that we aren’t talking about what a great TOOL AI can be for music. I use AI to generate loops and samples, that I then build beats on top of. I do this for two major reasons, one the sample and/or loop im using in my beat can never be replicated again. It is unique to the prompt I put, and what was generated that ONE time. Only I have that sample, which makes that beat uniquely and undeniably mine. Splice is so saturated and over used, thats there nothing unique about using a Splice sample. Two I’m not taking someone else’s music and repurposing it. Im creating my own music, from that uniquely generated sample/loop. I dont need to worry about clearing anything, splitting shares, etc. I am honestly shocked there aren’t more people (specifically EDM and Hip Hop producers) thinking about AI the same way.
We exist.. we grinding just like you. Dropped a few AI Albums in the last couple months. Dropped 1 today, BKLYN BOUNCE. Anyways, It’s gonna be about creativity like you said over salty producers or incompetent industry executives, we busy creating great music.
I've been enjoying playing around with AI and frankly, if you're a musician who can't write, you can't write but if you're a non-musician who can write a good song, why not do it?
@@TopMusicAttorney it’ll be a time tested journey of quality and quantity over non talent fr. AI has helped me with everything from ideation to completion of full projects in a shorter time as prompting (text to “engineering”) will prove far more value in all domains of Ai in the future.
@@TopMusicAttorney Its hard to say, I havent been doing it long enough. I do have some people asking me where I get certain samples. I always get “wow thats interesting!” when I tell them.
Record companies/corporations are waiting until AI music is truly imperceptible to the majority of listeners. They will create '"artists" that they have complete control over and eliminate the 'human' factor. Bottom line baby. No need to shell out big money record contracts when the "artist" is completely engineered in house, pumping whatever drivel is popular at any given time. The current pop scene is already there, with some notable exceptions, and it's just a matter of time.
AI will never be able to replace human emotion and feel in music. It is a tool to help us further our artistic vision. Further more, my wife for example, always wanted to make music and always has ideas for songs but never had the time to sit and learn music production and theory...now shes super happy that she can finally let her ideas see the light of day and be creative....the music industry has been over saturated for decades...and its runned by very shady people that want to fill their packets...this puts us more in control of our art as its in our hands now. Im all for it!
@@ThatOrkoIrrelevant. Does the vocalist for Greta Van Fleet owe money to Robert Plant? Does Led Zeppelin owe money to all the blues riffs they took from previous blues musicians? Do tribute bands owe money to the band they’re paying tribute too? Are DJs finally gonna pay for the music they’re using for their shows? AI is last in line yo
The ones who will decide will be the public, I dont like it but its here and its just evolution everything changes sometimes for the better sometimes not. The real ones who are not happy are the big label's once they've worked out how to make money themselves and control things, they will be happy. Either way its here to stay it will change and find its place. It wont stop me playing my piano, guitar or singing because I can stand (sit) Infront of people AI cant -yet but I am sure one day there will be robots looking like Ed Sheeran Taylor Swift doing concerts.
I'm not in the music industry, i'm just a music lover of many years, who listens and buys a lot of music, but l am absolutely against AI being used in the music industry. il have many issues with it ,my first is that l understand the music industry do not by law ( as yet) have to declare they use AI on the tracks l buy. My other issues is what happen to the copyright when AI gleans data from human musicians and the music track becomes a best seller, unknown by the human musician. Is that fair ? No, in my opinion. l want to see that change. l brought the subject up a few years ago on a music forum and it caused quite a heated debate between musicians and those in the AI tec world. Musicians said it will kill their Art. The AI tec said it will 'improve their Art ' l listened to a AI composed Orchestra for a film sound track, and its creators ( a small team, no musicians just computors ) won vast awards. l listened to it and indeed it was really impressive. In fact it sounded perfect. But we have to realize that the AI is only as good as what it can use from human input data ( at the moment ! ) It does it fast so it's economically of benefit to whatever industry uses it. But l fear it will destroy the Music Arts eventually , as their craft will not be needed anymore,. Their human creative music Art will be replaced just like the AI Orchestra. So where will it end. Human musicians etc will be replaced, they wont be able to compete with the AI production, what ever form it takes, and what will we be left with ? Well l think we will eventually have killed the Arts , in all forms in the near future. Why do l say that. Well AI at the moment can only create from input from the data collected from humans, But i'm told by the AI tec community that the next stage of AI is/will be so advanced it will not need human creators, it will be able to do it by itself!! and those developing it , cant wait, as l had long discussions on the music forum with one of those very AI tecs. So how do we stand on this future of the music industry ? Well, unfortunately, AI is here, and we cant do anything about. But my vision of that future is AI will end up like a musical loop and totally soulless due to no more human emotional heart. AI is doing great so far as the tecs tell me , and they say it will make millions for the music industry ( which it is already doing ) but l see AI eventually destroying it. And l think its doing that already .... and we don't even realize it :(
Carpenters, metal workers, engineers, car production operativex, etc. The list is endless of very skilled, highly talented people who used to work in industries and had their jobs taken over by more efficent, lest costly nachined. Don't remember any mass protests about this from musicans or musicans unions. , nor any record labels? What makes musicans so special? Drum machines. Sequencers, midi all veen around god year's and beennused by many artists. Studio equipment and production techniques have all been improved by technical advances.
Music still matters and still is relevant, just not for the 'music business', which never cared about Music in the first place, it cared about business. Musicians, artists and normal people care about Music! Btw, more and more people around me (most of my friends!) stopped 'listen' to Music, now they just want to hear Musicians Live, as I do! ps sorry for my bad English and yes I'm a multi-intrumentalist musician. I've always said, there are two things, there's Music, and what people do with it. Take care!
It’s not about money and it’s not about musical proficiency. Most musicians and songwriters make little to zero money and will continue their work anyway. Don’t you get it - that isn’t why they are upset. Aphex Twin composed his innovative works even if he used machines, he created a sound no one had heard before. And with hip hop sampling there is an acknowledgement of the source which then creates a new sound. Creativity is at the heart of the human soul. AI is about art being hijacked by every dickhead who decides typing in a prompt makes them an artist. It’s an insult to the musicians and songwriters they are stealing from- is blatant theft. The internet is about to be FLOODED with so much fake shite music it will cancel out all of human creativity. The fact AI can rip off a song in seconds…sickening.
If it’s not about money carry on creating, recording, and performing. Music is fun! So what’s the point in arguing about the money, right? If it is about the money, umm how is AI going to keep you from hosting your own events? How is AI going to mess up your tee shirt sales? And if AI Music steals listeners from you … you desperately need to learn how to play an instrument and then follow that up with songwriting 101 LOL! Everything else is just opinions and feelings, which is subjective anyway. AI is here regardless.
@@partymarty6969 fine, so jump on your apps after your day to day job and have fun. But don’t pretend to be a musician or a songwriter and start releasing AI generated music which took 5 seconds to type in a line of text, scraping the internet of every song you ever liked, then claiming you are now an artist. All those songs that the AI are trained on - often took thousands of hours of human dedication, expression, experience, suffering, soul searching, joy, sadness, struggling…that’s why they sound good.
How would they feel if someone trai ed an ai on their content channels and then made that the norm. It's like with everything else in the western world, if it doesn't effect you personally then screw it.
For those of you who do not understand why AI is crap you need to understand that the creators of AI are using copyrighted material to train it. In other words they are infringing the authorship and copyright of the material used. Besides that little fact, AI has nothing to offer. AI simply pours all the material on a blenders and then tries a billion trillion combinations to see what sticks, and when that does not provide any entertainment then it just copies copyrighted material. So this just leads you to the question.. would you like to have a computer steal your voice? your style? your tone? your vocabulary? or all of the above? without paying you once cent? Of course the answer is... sue the AI company and that is precisely what the BMI BMG ASCAP SESAC are doing.
While I agree there is a hole in the law here. AI combine many songs before the result and for it to be copyrighted, it needs to be a copy which is not. It's like splitting 1000 pussles and put them together with pieces from all of them mixed. Also the training part, it's like humans get inspired by listening, but AI get inspired it in a massive scale very fast. A new law is needed that prevents AI from training without consent.
AI is basically micro sampling without the consent of the creators whose work is being sampled. There is no aspect of AI that is original since it is merely micro cutting and pasting to create the illusion of originality.
@@thewilythylacine Yes but is that illegal? Imagine copying 1 pixel from 100 000 images and put them together into one. Can one pixel be copyrighted? Can one "microsample" be copyrighted? It may be 10000 of a second which is probably just a sine wave.
Well AI taking over the music industry is the lease of my worries. AI is going to basically take over our jobs and our way of life, essentially. I'm a desktop engineer. I work in tech, so I know its capabilities. I want real music myself but we can't stop progrees😅
I have put my shred guitar into A.I. and it actually has replicated my leads with an even better tone with better backing!It needs more controls but pretty fun
If people cared enough to put their heart into creation rather than seeking some glory trip by hoping they get "known" or "famous" etc then AI would be irrelevant. The problem is people are making music from ego-based, selfish places and are just as willing to sell their soul for whatever. I'm angry about the lack of greatness in this golden age of tech
@urproblem i will always be on the side of the artist regardless. I'd rather know that the true artists are the ones driving the world rather than industries & egos exploiting their work. I understand why you responded that way. Wishing you well
Probably because it's all stolen content and continues to steal from real artists. The whole 'it's not music' thing is just a pointless diversion. Someone should be getting paid every time an AI song is monetized - and not the guy that wrote the prompt. I mean the artists in the database that gave AI music its voice.
What's not to be angry about? Generative AI music, means taking away artistic opportunity from humans, and handing it over to machines. I think that's quite a serious thing, and we shouldn't treat it lightly Furthermore, there's no real necessity for it to begin with. (Humans have seemingly been doing just fine for thousands of years without AI art/music.) Good AI is that which solves problems. The primary function of Generative AI art has been to cause problems rather than to solve them.
So, some artists think AI training is just using their music to make new music? That’s like saying learning to play the guitar is copying Jimi Hendrix. Training an AI is more like listening and learning patterns, not remixing existing tracks. The AI creates completely new works, not just reusing someone else's music.
I believe the big use of AI music will be used in advertisements, "TV shows," video games and movies. The maker of those products will be getting free music and they won't have to pay royalties. As far as musicians getting paid, the main source of income has been the touring. The recorded music was the promotion for the tours and some acts even lost money on the recording end such as those labels owned by the mafia.
Same thoughts but I’ll add: Learn to host your own events and then when you’re off the road, learn to livestream to venues around the world all from your home studio. Zoom workplace + ListenTo by Audiomovers + Venue IRL = ‘Moment House’ concerts for a LIVE audience Touring needs a facelift.
I agree with you sync licensing will be the most affected and especially in the earlier stages. Putting so many musicians that don't tour out of business it's really a shame. And at the end of the day it Hurts Independent artist the most. Because not every artist can afford to tour.
But what about those of us who make our music and use AI to fill in the background instruments and such? The tune is mine, the melody is mine, the lyrics are mine (meaning that I personally created them all), but I use Suno to fill in the thin music. It can't use anyone else's tunes or lyrics, or chord progressions since it is ACTUALLY using my tune, melody, and lyrics. Is there a place in the industry for that? (I have to use AI because I can't get a SINGLE PERSON to help me with my music so a song comes to fruition! My last singing partner recorded all but 20 seconds of my current song and then flaked! I NEED AI to do what all the two faced, lazy losers who promise to help me but then don't, refuse to do.) AI, used properly (not generatively) is no different than having actual people help. (And it's more trustworthy some times too!) Need an example? I can post one if you wish. BTW, as always, thank you for an awesomely informative and useful video!!!
If I was growing up now, I'd learn to be the best live musician possible. I'd have AI write my album then assemble talented musicians to take it on a tour world wide.
Touring is still the most lucrative avenue for music groups but traveling is actually more expensive than ever now. It’s actually not a good time for touring music groups right now. I’m not sure why we don’t have music groups live-streaming to venues where fans gather to enjoy the show tho (there were a lot of venues and music groups experimenting with live-streaming back in 2020). That’s the next step: ‘Moment House’ concerts for LIVE audiences. These shows can kickstart funds needed for traditional tours.
What's more important than ever is live music. AI can't do that. We need venues that pay enough so that artists can tour again without losing money. Accessible rehearsal spaces that do not eat up every penny of profit. I'm happy that gear is maybe cheaper and more accessible than ever, gear access used to be much more of a hurdle. And maybe nobody pays for digital music, but people buy records again and even cassettes again. As for making a living and long term royalties? Maybe those days are over. But at least nobody has to wait to get signed in order to move forward.
You: “We need venues that pay enough so that artists can tour again without losing money.” Me: I hear ya but ultimately all the money generated comes from the fans not the venues. And expecting music groups to live on the road like that to make most of their living is absurd & unsustainable (cost of travel is way too high now). What we need is more tech savvy/forward thinking venues & event organizers. It’s 2024, music groups should be able to livestream from their rehearsal spaces to physical venues where fans gather to experience the LIVE performance. Doing this will have lots of benefits and can help kickstart LIVE in-person shows as well creating formal touring seasons for productions (maybe LIVE in-person shows can minimize production costs and prioritize the LIVE experience oppose to wanting backing tracks to sync fireworks and extravagant light shows).
This was a bigger issue internet wide with famous & nonfamous digital artist with stabilityai and later died down when AI had tons of mistakes and watermarks (popular musicians are actually complacent or quiet- cause they know the possibilities if "they" use it). It's not really going to be illegalized for finding data for fair use. And artist make less than musicians lol. Then we have the top music companies making their own AI service.... so.... you really don't win once they own each melody, even though the melodies are in public domain (watch the TED Talk). Yet, people are still suing over melodies because melodies are limited like beats are, which aren't copyrighted. What should stay copyrighted are lyrics, obviously. You cannot copy exact words compared to music patterns. Eventually, people will simply make money off of music instead of limiting the other's creativity, or the big 3 will sue eveyone making music. This is the ultimatum you may face in the future... If we go by historical context, musicians will need to focus on fan building than trying to litigate a song "similar" to theirs.... which isn't sueable in the first place. The profit share/license idea came from the art community, but it never went anywhere. AI is not something you can easily litigate, especially if USA is in competition to improve AI against China and Russia who may use it against the states' electric grid and whatnot. If the art community were overly enraged and still are in art sites and twitter, and even stiffle each other or assume each other for AI, almost self-destructing the community due to how little artist make already, and got nowhere, music won't have a factor either, just syphoned if evern suno falls. ANother company would do the same in a less suable way. Even open source it, and that would pretty much end the argument if the source of the problem is untraceable.
I don't think fair use applies where it comes to AI anything. I will grant that it may be very hard to sue given the leeway that is giving to the AI market during this gold rush era - though I guess we can see what happens with Scarlett Johanson's suit against OpenAI.
Print media companies warned about the power of companies like Google, Facebook, Apple, etc years ago. Spotify is the music version of that. Distribution control, fragmentation, and inability to survive financially is the common denominator. And beholden to algorithms, issues with bots, and now AI. The power of media creation and distribution has been wrested from people to these platforms where they can set the rules, and increasingly, create without the creator. Besides obvious creative issues, there’s also interference in cultural and social exchanges. We already see culture wars online, massive disinformation with bots and paid accounts, and more recently, direct interference with such interactions from the owner of the company that was once Twitter. I’m talking about Musk of course, and his direct, daily involvement in changing the political landscape on that platform, and enacting changes that move the discourse and policies to the right. Not a surprising thing considering Musk’s well known strong right-wing bias and shady business practices. Well now it is possible to create video and sound that is very lifelike. And proliferation of that kind of thing is especially rife on Twitter. This opens the door to manipulation in a way never before dreamed of. There’s a good reason why right-wing interests associated with Trump want to purchase TikTok. How will you feel about a world in which the owners of platforms with a political agenda can simply manufacture songs, videos, information, and culture that suits their worldview? As Musk once said, he wants you to take the red pill, and is willing to change Twitter to make that happen. And as privatization of education becomes more prevalent, and these platforms pushed more and more into children’s lives, how will they know the difference?
I can see how AI can be useful as a tool, however, what I really don't like is when it is used for any form of art - images, music, writing, etc. You could probably play me a melange of sounds/music and I would be hard-pressed to tell which was 'real' and which was AI generated. That makes me sad. I have a certain set of skills (though none like Liam Neeson ...) acquired over decades (I am an ex-programmer) and the idea that some 'spotty oik' could just say "hey, AI tool write me a progam that does this that and the other" kind of scares me. If memory serves a lawyer used an AI generated speech at trial, complete with quoting case l\aw .. that did not exist! There is a concept called GIGO: Garbage In, Garbage Out - if your input is not 100% good then mistakes, errors, facts will also not be 100%. Untill ALL data held for potential input can be confirmed to be 100% and onl;y usable when relevant, I am not a fan of AI. And probably not even then as I am a grumpy old git when all is said and done.
If streaming would make more money for all music. The problem would be solved. Because at this moment the Financial pressure is to high also the chance to fail. I think a streamed song should be worth 0.50 € and not the peanuts artist are getting now. I think record labels Will invest massively in AI. Because they like cheap music. And guys.. this is the problem. As a music fan, I don't give a f... if it is a human created or ai created song if I like it... It's good enough for me. By the way. Great gids!
Yes, I create songs with AI support. Many people now think that AI models could make music like humans and that many musicians would become even more without a living. Absolutely No! Creative musicians have been using technical developments for centuries (piano, organ, electronic sound generation, synthesizers, sampling, loop machines, vocoders, reverb, Dolby, DAWs, to name just a few). In the performing arts, technical material developments, chemistry, sprayers, printing technology are relevant, and for graphic artists, designers, technical draftsmen,... CG and CAD systems. If I tell a well-trained AI model: “Make me a great work of art or a piece of music!”, then it's like jumping around with a camera and just snapping away. At some point, you're sure to get a great snapshot. If the world is now flooded with “AI songs”, so what? Since the development of camera smartphones, we have been blessed with billions of images and videos. Professional photographers and videographers laugh about it and are more in demand than ever. If I use AI to write songs, to produce music, then I make the music. I decide in creative and artistic processes what my song should be like, melody, chords, lyrics, beats, instruments, style, genre,... AI is and remains just a tool, albeit a very impressive one, that can save me a lot of time. I could also create each of these songs in a day with a MIDI keyboard and a good DAW (Ableton, Logic, Pro-Tools...) - without AI. And: With AI support it only takes me: Still one day LOL ; - ) But the work processes are changing in such a way that I have much less to deal with filters, plugins, effects, sound packs,... and find more time for creative variations and experiments. If I have no idea about music - by that I mean theory and practice as a musician, composition, harmony, arranging,... - then neither a Bösendorfer grand piano, a great synthesizer or an AI like Suno or Udio are of any use. I just wanted to say that. The good musicians will always be very different from the, well, hobbyists, Tiktoks & Co., regardless of whether they use technology or are unplugged, even if many of them still suffer without a living. A doctor to a musician: “You only have three months to live!” - “From what…?”
I have a problem that probably no one cares about, I have a problem with people saying “I” wrote or “I” made when describing the music created by prompts into AI- You didn’t write it, you didn’t make it, you prompted AI to write and make it.
There used to be a market for whale oil years ago. Markets come and go. Unfortunately music is going to have no value because tech can do it all now. I left the music biz years ago because I saw what was happening. You are better off learning programming or running the AI systems than trying to make money on music these days.
a lot of musicians are angry cause their music sucks and they know it, yet feel the AI is stealing their penuts, "stealing from their music" c'mon, majority are MEDIOCRE at best
By the way I thought I'd leave one more comment on this ridiculous video of this ridiculous woman who's not a lawyer claiming she is she's got people on here who literally hate on AI and are using AI to make music and I've literally just exposed them for doing so This whole channel and the followers that follow it are all a bunch of walking contradictions
Experimental? I was just listening to this video while some experimental music was playing and it was crazy cool sounding. Can I do an overdub of this video?
Hi I’m a new fan of your channel and I think you’re pretty cool :) I have 2 questions for you if you don’t mind? 1) My stage name is Kain and I’m a one man band and it’s a dark moody tribal rock band called “KAIN’S TORMENT” and I play a homemade 18 string electric guitar which is built for my wheelchair. Since 2003 I’ve written 24-25 ish songs but I’ve only managed to recorded 9. However one of the main things holding me back is I have a speech problem as I’m disabled but luckily with metal it doesn’t matter. I’m not selling my music but is there a way to copy and paste my lyrics and paste it into a deep and gravely voice a bit like Marilyn Manson or the singer from Trypticon? That’s all I’ve ever wanted. I can cut up the voice in Logic Pro X to fit my tracks but I just need a AI voice because I just can’t find any singers to help me in the UK I’ve been looking for 18 ish years so I’m praying AI voices can finally help me to out but I have no idea where to look or start or if it’s even possible? 2) Also I’ve got a newish side project called “Kain the Easy Rider” basically I record me doing mad and funny things in my 4 wheelchairs and I usually put my favourite rock band songs as the backing tracks on my videos. As I’m in the UK I’m not bothered if UA-cam partially blocks my videos in some other country do to copyrighted music but it’s annoying especially when as my videos are free and I’m not making any money and all. I just pick my favourite band that goes with my videos etc. etc. Anyway I’ve just spent 12 hours up loading the video of one of my drives / walks and it’s the very first time my video has been blocked everywhere just because I’m using Rob Zombie’s tracks. How do I make it work with what ever music I want because technically I’m actually promoting there music for free and I’m not making and money from UA-cam because I can’t as I’m on benefits etc. One video I did try the “I don’t own to rights to any music in this video” thing but that didn’t seem to work the same way it does for my friend. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks Kain
the self obsessed musicians and other artists don't see a larger picture here... what about self driving cars, robots working in warehouses, AI customer services, self checkouts... that is just a start. AI does not pay taxes, so when you loose job to AI you won't get any help from government as there will be no money... weird nobody talks about this anywhere right?
judging by all the comments i see all throughout social media on the validity of AI music (such as emotional driven tracks) AI music is doomed to fail and we have the power to not give it notice and listen to it...Just dont listen to it and make them fail
I have a problem with this. Okay people that use AI might not be classed as musicians, I totally agree but you can write the lyrics and style the song. So it's like saying Mario Puzo can't call himself a director or actor in the Godfather. He's never tried to, however he did write it...or shall we take that from him because he wasn't in the movie? Shall we say that Bernie Taupin isn't a musician because he didn't sing on any Elton John song? So you can't call yourself a musician but isn't it fair that depending on how much you've had a creative input you could call yourself a lyricist and visual artist if you then create a video to go with these songs? So if these two feel very strongly about it, it'll be interesting to know if they've ever made music about the working class jobs that have vanished due to mechanisation, or is it fine that working class jobs can vanish but it's inappropriate when the middle class jobs start to disappear? The great musicians will always find work and sell songs because they can do something original. AI would never be able to have come up with the grunge era or The Smiths because it was something new however the music scene has been soulless and spiritless for at least the last decade because of the big corporations. These AI models are taking it away from the big corporations, the big corporations that have been shafting the musicians for decades....so maybe you should be happy at that?
If you're using AI to create something and you call yourself an artist, then why don't you call yourself a cook for just ordering at a restaurant or why doesn't Spielberg call himself a composer when he hires John Williams to do his soundtracks? You just wrote: make me this, and the machine (not you!) made it. It's as simple as that. A good prompt is just like a good brief when commissioning a job, you are still NOT doing the job.
If you use sound tax in the loops that is already made and created by someone else and you're just putting them together You're not a music card You're just a contradictive liar You see what I did there I just contradicted your contradiction
@@DarkSideofSynthAnd by the way I checked your music out You even had videos that say you use loot so you're not a music artist then yourselves So how about you shut up contradiction walking
Yes but we’re talking in regards to Pro Musicians LOL! How is AI going to keep you from hosting your events? How is AI going to mess up your t-shirt sales? And if AI music is stealing listening time from you // you desperately need music lessons and join songwriting 101 immediately after hahaha! Music groups are not even live-streaming to venues yet (sports has had PPV for decades already). And ESPN has deals with venues like COSM showcasing technology called Shared Reality. Shift your focus ya’ll smh
@@partymarty6969only lazy ppl dependent on spotify or who are not using ALL tools because they hate social media or won’t go out in their community are the people really mad about ai. Oh and the people at the top who now realize that regular people can now make better quality music faster and think money should only be for the top few in life. Plenty for everyone to eat and have fun and make art. Focus on how you are making your art snd having fun and the noise fades away. Ai it just a tool. Use it or dont. If your good and cresting people will support you regardless of ai
I just uploaded a cover of Coldplays Yellow I spent months on, did the vocals for, I put everything I had into it, few 100 views. I have 50k monthly under this name from songs I bought cheap off Fiverr or generated with Suno/Udio. Get mad all ya want, people listen to what they listen to. I am not upset my hard work didn't pay off. I wanted to make that cover for myself, and I did. Thankfully I am not stuck up and open minded enough to monetize in other ways. I get over 300,000 streams a week from Ai music. Artists hate me for it, yet it's your own potential fan base listening to it. Who are you really mad at? Most likely yourself.
People are angry about Ai music because of money. People have paid money for equipment, instruments and training and Ai generated music eliminates the significance of their investment.
No one told them to be a bunch of fools going and wasting money on a bunch of bull crap and you do know that most these people complaining use literally loop packs They're a bunch of walking contradictions and nobody makes good money from music so they're not losing out on money and all's they're doing is trying to take away a poor man's way of making music You people are a bunch of hypocrites
Tough. Its not going to revert to the way it was, so people will have to live with it. And no, the courts will not be able to prevent AI music from evolving and getting better and better.
Hey, great idea... make a video with Rick Beato's name in the title because HE has 4.X million subscribers (vs. BJ w/ 394K and TMA w/ 68K) and just made a controversial video (about AI of all things) so you're likely to snag quite a few more views than usual, right ?!?!!? Maybe pickup a few thousand more subscribers ?!?!? Sure you will, and it's a perfect time to jump on Rick's back because he voiced strong (and well qualified) opinions in a somewhat off-the-cuff video, with a few hyperbolic statements made in a state of generally elevated emotion - oh he made it so easy for you !!! Look... I'm not the world's biggest RB fan, in fact I think he often comes off as pompous and aloof - but I'll defend his right to his own very qualified opinions all day long, and I'll take him seriously when he makes serious statements - unfortunately, in the end, Rick is simply not allowed to be a human w/ flaws, and G-d forbid he should display any degree of emotion alongside his opinions as stated online - one really must be 100% flawless on YT, and make statements that no one could possible disagree with, or even friends will turn and eat you like rabid dogs, all for a few extra bucks... case in point ^^^ As for the ostensible point of THIS video, and to all those publishing AI music as their own... enjoy your moment of sunshine NOW because soon YOU will be displaced by the very systems YOU think are so great, as the platforms begin using AI to prompt ITSELF to create music based on algorithmic feedback, historical averages and trends, and social engineering by those controlling the platforms if AI doesn't need human musicians to make music, AI certainly doesn't need human prompters to make music either - was that your goal ??? are you happy now ??? sadly, some will say "yes" Support live local music - soon it may be your only option to AI's emerging dominance on streaming platforms - JM2C...
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The problem I foreshadow is what major labels are going to do with AI Music. We are mad at all these indie AI Music companies but what is going to happen is the major labels will end up knocking these things off so that none of us have access to them. Once the indie public AI music companies are gone then major labels can utilize the language model behind close doors, create AI generated music, collect all the royalties, and then never have to hire or sign a real artist again. The other problem is streaming services could also get in on this to recoup revenue from the streaming royalty pool.
People will still pay to see a real live singer/band perform .
We will always have access. It's only going to get better and better. Soon all of you will be generating entire hit albums that basically turn the serotonin of music listening into a type of heroin
@urproblemexactly so laugh as the music industry dies
Not sure about the first part but the second part about streaming services getting in on it is IMO already happening with botted playlists. Which is why everyone should leve streaming platforms with PRO RATA model becuase one has zero control over how many people will steal from you.
@urproblem I'm completely self sufficient and an independent artist. I'm saying people are still signing their life away!
When Rick Beato is talking about music getting worse, he’s talking specifically about popular music that is on the top of the charts, not the latest King Gizzard Record or Justice or (insert your favorite musician here). Not sure if this was discussed in the longer version of this clip so I imagine y’all know that.
More of the interview will be released throughout the week
Yeah, but that's just Rick's opinion. Remember what they say about opinions.
Rick Beato and Benn Jordan getting together would be awesome. Two youtubers who have a lot of credibility and have made a meaningful contribution to the topic of music production and consumption in different ways
I'm a singer, and a musician. I'm not exactly thrilled, that i've spent my whole life perfecting my voice, and now it can be analyzed by AI and reproduced within minutes.
That being said; the invasian of the arts is the least of my concerns, when it comes to AI. I'm more concerned about AI being paired with robotics, and how many jobs that will be eliminated because of that. Having AI on a stationary computer or on servers is one thing. Having autonomous humanoid robots operating on AI, which will be coming soon....is something everyone should worry about.
And if you want to relate it back to music; AI may be able to compose music, but it can't go out and gig. When the robotics tech gets a little bit better, that will be possible. And I'm positive, that there are people who would pay to see music and "singing" performed by machines.
People in Japan (mainly) are already watching animated characters perform, just like Hatusne Miku who "performed" at Coachella... it's like Gorillaz Mk 2. Sad that anyone can think this is a replacement for a live act but that's where we are heading unfortunately to maximise profit.
You have a edge up, being able to clone your voice and kick out songs fast and build your content. AI music does not reuse a voice to make more than 1 song aka more able to make more songs with the same voice. But that will change soon give a couple months
@@girardstudio, I can get a better performance doing it the old fashioned way. I'm more concerned with quality over quantity.
@@toastangler How much ai music have you listened to
@@girardstudio you mean the kind that didn't rely on a database of existing music to whom it should be paying royalties? Yeah it's fun to make the songs, but it's stealing. It's not new, it's reshuffled extant material. Consider yourself lucky if you can just get away with stealing it without paying the original sources.
I'm hoping Michael is trying to be funny calling the Fisher Effect "Fisher-Price."
Benn, "A terrible source of data?" It is the data. It is accurate whether it fits YOUR narrative or not.
I use SUNO and my biggest complaint is vocals sound like several singers all vying to be heard above the other.
That being said, I use it to see what MY lyrics sound like in different genres. So, a sketch pad basically.
If someone can make a career out of Ai Music, have at it. I think there's plenty of room for everyone.
Exactly! These ppl are only upset because they wont be the ONLY ones making big money or having a seat. Most people are not using ai like the fear mongering group are claiming on the news and in these popular videos. Its a tool. Like a daw or synth…anyone can use it in anyways. The only ppl upset are the ones who are not doing the work but have had big dreams for a long time, people that truly dont know what ai is, or the ones who are at the top and dont want to share.
@@lNowHerelnot true it's not just the labels that aren't making money it's your average engineers, mixers masterers that will also be taking a major hit. As you can just type in prompt and it spits out a fully formed song. I'm more concerned with just how it's going to affect human musicians and their ability to earn a living. There are way more independent artists than there are artists on labels.
@@ThatOrkoPurists have been disarmed more and more each decade due to various technology advancements.
Those who only deal with analog & acoustics need to create their own path forward (as they’re the ones being too stubborn to be more tech savvy).
ListenTo by Audiomovers can be used in so many diffident ways to generate revenue. Blame yourself for your own actions (or for not taking action).
@@ThatOrko Agreed. If the AI can generate the song, it can also simulate the influence of an engineer etc. on that song. Eventually, there will be no engineers and producers left that the AI doesn't already know how to simulate.
Humans will always crave human interaction. Hone your craft, develop your sound and embrace the AI.
Well, I happen to think that a large majority of music produced these days is utter trash. It's soulless, vapid and formulaic. Its humanity is quantised and pitch corrected away, and it's completely without surprise, interest, virtuosity and originality. AI generated work would be this, but doubly so. And for what? Just to make even more money for some of the worst people on the planet.
Not every artist is on a major label there are way more independent artists than major label artists. The independent artist and self-employed engineers etc are going to be hit the hardest.
Ai is crap that was built for ppl that actually don't do music. It isn't a creation tool, instruments are for that.
Tech companies always lie and have not told the truth to date.
bro you have no clue.
tf, you already use ai in nearly everything you do and have been. you sound dumb af. so scared of something you dont even understand.
It sounds like you've not explored it fully. It is actually used by talented musicians to help improve their music further. Some of what AI can do is very creative and useful, and saves a lot of time too. AI tools can help to make great musicians/producers/engineers etc even better. It might only be used in 10% of their track, but it's helping them achieve better results. AI is used in technology in a lot of industries, it saves time and money and gives people new options. People should embrace it with both arms. Making a complete song with AI only is a different thing altogether.
@@hearmenow909 I'm not interested, I'm a musician with over 40 yrs of experience. It's a tool for theft no matter what you say. I get why most of the ppl that want it, mainly because they are not creative.
@@hearmenow909 saving time is a bs complaint when no one is guaranteed a sale.
Sweet! I can't wait for the Beato collaboration. Benn and Rick getting together would be good UA-cam. From watching a bunch of Beato, he seems pretty open minded. He is at least willing to put thoughts out there and letting the good and bad comments fly without being butt hurt.
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I have to confess, I have been listening to AI generated music... for months. It's captured my attention in a way I didn't expect
Interesting! Thank you!
The only reason im upset is because people don't have to be good at the craft anymore. There's a level of respect when you hear a song and you know this person put in the time and has Mastered their craft.
yes please do a roundtable with rick and benn, that sounds like a good idea actually :) Any roundtable with benn is a good idea 😅
No AI anything for me.... I create and will continue to do so and through no fault of mine will compete w the machines....
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Keep the faith.
Here's the thing, Benn and Michael - What if you're wrong and AI does cannibalize singer, songwriters and bands? The system is broken, we can agree on that. Surely we should focus on fixing the system rather than laying yet another burden on it. I don't agree with everything Rick Beato says, but I tend to agree with him that modern recording artists tend to lean on technology where once they had to lean on skills, ability and sheer talent. I see AI as an extension of that - muzak produced by technology to fill product quotas. You're talking about musicians using AI to explore boundaries, which I can agree with. But you know (and you, especially, Lady C) that that's not how labels will approach this. If they can replace the songwriters and the band with AI-in-a-box, they will (and probably already are). How do the singers and songwriters and musicians survive when the machine is cheaper and tireless. Maybe the machine can write a masterpiece (infinite monkey theory) but at what cost? And what about the fact that it has to be trained on existing music with no compensation or recognition of the people who made that music? I know, AI is the "new shiny", but I think there are serious issues for the music business to resolve before it dives headfirst.
Regarding Benn Jordan's point on Aphex Twin and how many instruments one plays, etc. I don't think everything can or should be relativised. Stuff at the extremes should not be a real world example. A person writing a prompt on a web site (not very dissimilar to performing a Google search) and getting the site spit out a (probably) shitty, generic song cannot be described as a musician. It's just common sense and this type of stuff shouldn't be put in question otherwise all this extreme relativism will make us loose sight of plain and simple, obvious common sense. Comparisons like Benn made can surely be discussed, but please, let's stay sane and agree that someone spitting songs on website is not and should not ever be classified as a musician, As a musician I find the notion abhorrent.
Humans don't even see how they're going against their own self-interests. I'm not anti-Ai but I appreciate what you're saying because not a lot of people are talking about these issues
AI is missing one of the most important key factor of music making, and that’s SOUL, music comes from emotions, HUMAN Emotions.
@@maxvincent6062 Yes and no. Music triggers emotion. AI could totally make music that does that. The ratios are the ratios. Soul in music is definitely a human factor but emotion can be triggered by AI. Even if you don't like it.. still an emotion.
I don’t care about human soul and emotions if their music is crap.
Being angry about AI is nonsense. Artists just need to be themselves and keep writing from their hearts.
It's not that we don't care about music, we just don't care where we get it at the same quality. We also now have the ability to more heavily contribute directly to the artists, not their leaches.
Some drummer in the 70s/80s were complaining about being replaced by drum machine, and some musician were scared of synthsizer. At the same time people like Phil Collins embrace them, and create one of the most iconic drum roll on a track that is half "drum machine made". Others artist like New Order completly embrace the machine and made one of the most iconic drum/synth pattern, Moroder is another exemple that completly redifine music using those new tools. The same goes for sampling (which is a bit more close than the AI situation).
Music evolve alongside technology, and has always been, musician 500 years ago probably were complaining about the unification of music notation or something like that, people 120 years ago were complaining about the recording creation destroying the cheet music market, 80 years ago about the live microphone destroying loud singer performence (but creating the crooner style).
It's the same in every artistic domain (photo "replacing" painting, digital replacing vinyl...), most people pass a certain age stop to evolve, maybe cause they feel that they reach the right level in their field, or they don't want to see their years of practice being replace by something that make it more easy, so they complain, they're scared, because it feels better to be part of some kind of "old lost art", when in fact they just part of the previous generation of "kids don't know the real struggle", cause it always evolve and things always become easier. But what's easier is to make the same old stuff, the same way DAW make it easier to build a DJ Premier type beat, and now that this is easier for everybody, then it's the artist role to push it further.
Nostalgic people can still listen to old records
Makes no sense, because analogy breaks. It might be true for a few years ..but after that will break. Even now humans are still musicians, composers. AI will just spit out endless automated music. It won't even need supervision. Companies will set it up so consumers talk to AI for generative music. In the end there will be no musician in between doing anything.
I can see a time when consumers hire bands to perform sections of generative music they bookmark. And that will become the only use of real musicians
But in the long run future generations will choose mind upload over death. So it's all academic. Just do what you enjoy
All of those things that you mentioned have been invented to solve a problem. Generative AI is not solving a problem.
Ben is an oddball. If you “create” a song through AI, you are not an artist. He starts on a false narrative. I think there should be an AI only platform and if people want to listen to it, so be it. Keep it separate so it stands on its own and not get mistaken by being next to a real production. You should not be able to collect money, royalties etc.. because you have done no work. The record labels are right to sue AI companies.
Right on man! And the thing that makes me the angriest about this whole thing is the number of people that think they are now artists because they can type in a few prompts into an algorithm and create something out of it. What a joke! Yes, get people up on stage And see how many people stick around to see them prompt something on stage. Put them in front of a real instrument, and see what happens. They'll embarrass the heck out of themselves because all they've done is prompt stuff in. Exactly as you said. They are not an artist because they haven't done the real work. Right on!
AI will blow human artists away within 2-3 years if midjourney blew all human artists away. You want to gatekeep it cause you know this. I’d rather listen to great ai music than average human songs.
@@mattc3510 gatekeeping? YOU ARE AN ASSHOLE!
I've been a musician for a long time ( I started playing bass at 12 in 1978). I started writing electronically generated ( synth based) stuff in 1985, using a Macintosh and a Dx7. No humans were used (or harmed) in the process apart from me. 40 years later, I still use computer systems and synths to write all my music. Still no humans involved, apart from me. I don't use loops, I play and record all my drums by hand, and then play bass, keys, or guitar over those tracks live. People love the music, and it's completely 100% human created.
Ai music is just about as dumb as the crap that inspires it. Ai does not have a soul. It has algorithms. Those are little lines of code that tell it 'this is important to steal, and this is not', while selecting the music it steals, oops learns, from. Humans have a similar system called a heart and feelings, and it allows us to know the difference between what is good and what is bad, based on those feelings; not algorithms. All the Ai stuff I've heard, including the stuff Beato talked about and played, did NOTHING for me. That is not music. That is just sound. I suppose if you were stranded on Mars and had a kid, and they were raised on the crap, they wouldn't know music could be anything else. But real music, created by real people with hearts and souls, will never be eclipsed by Ai. If record companies put out music by Ai to challenge real musicians, I say bring it on. I've spent the last 30 years listening to garbage being released as pop, rock, and RnB that isn't worth a bucket of pee. It's time the robots took away the financial incentives of these posers, forcing real musicians to step up and show everyone how it's done, or let music die a sad pathetic death.
Even in image generation, Prompting alone isn't gonna help you, at the end of the day, to be a good AI artist, you're doing allot of editing (inpainting) or Outpainting, even of you use 100% AI tools, the AI isn't doing it without the direction of the human, and in that way it's still art. Now, all you can do in Suno or Udio is writing your own lyrics, and song extension, but I'm sure we'll be able to edit tracks, change notes, switch instruments, and more. When that happens yes, you can call yourself an A.I. musician, not there yet with Suno or Udio, but you can do that with other tools using samples. The beauty of AI is it lets you experiment at an accelerated rate. I've made images with Stable diffusion for ideas, and then turned around and made something similar in Photoshop the standard way....but you know what? Got my workflow done fast, cause I got over a lot of creative hurtles. "But suno generates 500 songs with only 10 dollars" Yeah, but do you have any idea how many generations you have to do to get something useable? It's safe to say I made about 400 songs in the last month, don't think for a second I'd put even half of them on any streaming platform. Most of them are in my trash folder. Think I have maybe 10-15 that are good enough to get mastered. And yes, I know some will say that don't make me a musician. I heard that before when I was entering midi notes in a DAW, and never played an actual instrument.....don't care. I'll sleep well at night, cause I know I'm putting enough of my own creativity in the mix.
I play guitars and bass .. I make music on Bandlab then i take a 2 minute clip to Udio. Then it took 15 second of my 2min clip then bang i got a beautiful song that didnt cost me thousands in a studio..
Are you going to disclose that you had AI assist you in writing it?
@@ThatOrko I always do
I havn't seen the video yet I'm posting before I do........ Its human expression and the very soul of a human being, what we are at the core that is being ignored. A song created by a human is an inspiration , it's needless to say that the value of actual human expression is a powerful and one of our most cherished gifts. It's our duty to preserve this gift , forever. 💯💯💯❤🔥🔥❤🔥
I am all in on AI music 41 songs with ISRC numbers, and videos on channel. Your video was a good insight into Ai music . Plan B is an exclusive radio station. Also thinking of licensing tracks for virtual tubers to use .
That's cool. At the moment you are in the commercial loop and getting some of the money, but in a few years, you won't be in that loop.
The way I see it, recorded music runs on a cycle of counter-culture music born out of a rejection of the mainstream that gains popularity in some organic manner and is then eventually adopted by the masses, picked up by major labels and eventually becomes the mainstream thing that people eventually get sick of which spawns a new counter-culture etc etc. This cycle will probably continue into the AI era but only if AI music companies are not allowed to just immediately scoop up the newest music and incorporate it into their models.
I agree! The next cycle will be the "real music" will be in the underground and turn "hip" and that idea will trickle into the mainstream.
I play piano and sing sometimes and I like to write songs. I became interested in AI generated music last year and have explored both udio and suno. They generate a lot of interesting but derivative work. Some of it is quite good but the lyrics are a usually cliche and sometimes silly.
I think that this will probably improve with time and we may even enter a world where AI is capable of producing something unique and new.
I don't feel the competition because I'm not on Spotify.
If people are angry because AI music is competing for sales then they can always play venues. That's where we began before recording and I think for a lot of people that's where we're going to end up.
I think as creatives we live in our own world and sometimes lose touch with the common listener. When you surround yourself with other creatives, you create an echo chamber. But when you step outside of that chamber and talk to family, friends, coworkers, etc... they, more often than not, truly don't care "how" the music was made. They care about how it makes them feel. Lots of listeners don't understand the difference between melody and improvisation. Many can't identify instruments other than drums and guitars. Most have zero understanding of music theory or history... again, they just care how music makes them feel. And for many, probably a very large percentage, they like specific songs not because of the music, but because of the memories the songs are attached to. In my observations, lots of people angry about Ai don't really have any skin in the game and are just bandwagoning against tech that they don't understand.
I believe the music industry and true artists will eventually have to accept AI-generated music. Lawsuits won't make it disappear. Music generation by AI is akin to picture or computer code generation, both considered art forms. As AI methods continue to improve at a faster pace than humans, the quality of AI music, which some may currently find subpar, will also improve. We must adapt to the reality that creativity isn't exclusive to humans. Record labels currently suing AI music companies will likely use AI-generated art, such as pictures or code, in the future instead of hiring human artists or programmers. While music artists feel AI systems are stealing their work and fear for their livelihoods, this is similar to programming, where AI is trained on vast amounts of code from the web and repositories like GitHub. It’s believed that AI could replace programmers in the future, and humans will need to accept and adapt to this new reality.
Picture and computer code generation are not considered artforms. Just because you say it doesn't make it true.
I have been a musician for over 20 years and collecting instruments for a decade. I never saw music as a means of making money, but rather as a means of expression. Maybe that's why using AI doesn't make me afraid or uncomfortable, it's just a way to have other perspectives on music.
Call me crazy, but what makes me uncomfortable is seeing other musicians and humans showing a side as ugly as hatred, prejudice and irrationality. Also, I understand that music is taken as a job, but not that it is naturalized to the point that it is as if without payment, human music has no future. I think it is even contradictory if one is supposed to defend human art, and its rich history.
Interesting take. Thanks for the contribution. What are your goals for your music career at this stage?
Thank you so much for saying this! I have been an animator for series television for 20 years and we're going through a similar situation with AI. I've seen a lot of colleagues express their opinions, majority negative, about AI. I can understand, no one wants their work stolen but I am struggling to see the difference between an AI making something different but based on an existing design and a person doing the same thing - which is how most young artists learn. I don't feel threatened by AI art because I have used the tools and think that it's a fascinating jumping off point, if you will, instead of an engine to replace people.
Personally, I see AI music much like AI art, it's a jumping-off point, a tool. Maybe AI will help a stuck musician with a chord progression or refine their lyrics? Perhaps it can help that kid get into music who never had a hope in hell because they didn't grow-up in a system which taught music or had parents who could afford it?
As I've stated earlier in another comment, the most generous, talented, and humble artists (with massive portfolios who have worked with the BIGGEST studios), have always been kind to new talent and encouraging. If this is a new tool to help people out, why not use it?
I’m not angry about AI Music. Good music has stopped being produced for the past 15 or 10 years. AI music is just a relief these days.
As an artist who has been in the scene for nearly a decade, and has recently seldom used AI as an assistive tool to help me get ideas for my compositions, but never to *generate* anything that would remotely make it into my final production, I think the problem with AI and people's sentiment is threefold:
- People are scared of losing the human factor. Part of what makes music, music, is the fact that a human being - a person we can relate to - has put in the work and their style, feelings and/or life experiences are reflected in that work, no matter how good or bad it may sound.
- AI can be great in the right hands, but really dangerous in the wrong ones. You can be sure companies and big labels WILL make use of AI in unethical ways if that means they can maximize profit. People fear the music landscape may become flooded with samey/soulless computer-generated content that far overshadows human creations.
- And then there's the whole issue with AI datasets and the apparent impunity with which artists' music is being taken for training models without being notified, without their consent, and without any clear form of opt-out. We often do not know our music is being used for these purposes - and most of us will never find out until it's too late.
Thanks for the reply. You have some great points. Please join us at a YT LiveStream tonight at 5 pm PST; we love having considerate, serious musicians along for the ride.
@@TopMusicAttorney 5 PST is a little late for me! 2 AM here in Spain 😅I'll be sure to check some highlights though!
Like every new thing that comes out. There will be both good and bad uses for this new tool. I try to always see the positive side of things. AI can revolutionize the music industry.
I would say that tech companies being tech companies have relatively unlimited opportunities of what they can do (besides for art/music), since there are unlimited problems in the world which AI can potentially solve. Artist on the other hand, being artist, have only art to make, and if that opportunity is taken away from them, they'll be in serious trouble. Also, the fact that AI companies are focusing their investments with art, is perhaps serving as a distraction, or rabbit hole, and preventing them from developing things which can solve serious problems, and be of real service to humanity, (and ultimately benefit themselves as well)
The role of the artist remains crucial in this process, as they are the ones who take these new tools and technologies and use them to create something fresh and innovative. As you pointed out, while digital tools like DAWs have made it easier for anyone to create music, it's up to the artist to push the boundaries and explore new sonic territories.
In conclusion, the relationship between music and technology is a complex and ever-evolving one. While nostalgia for the past is understandable, it's essential to recognize the potential and opportunities that new technologies bring to the world of music. Embracing these changes can lead to exciting and groundbreaking creations that shape the future of music.
Great points. Where do you plan on taking it personally with your music?
@@TopMusicAttorney Def not signing with a major label, doing the independent route, but I believe until myself, or anyone figures out the video part of it, it's not going to be noticed.
Just a couple months ago, I was knee deep in AI research. Even with the most basic models (not music related), I could train a model on two different concepts, and interpolate and extrapolate between the two to come up with something "new," despite it not being new but just a mixture of the data points to generate something not seen. I'm not too familiar with what's going on in AI for music, but that means that I can pretty much generate any AI-based music with the right amount of data, controls, testing, and so forth. If music data is free/easy to get, I don't need to compensate artists for it, and there's no real way right now to track when something is generated by AI. Would it be a nice tool to have to rapidly create music? Yes. Would it be problematic and unethical? Yes. It requires training on data that was generated through blood, sweat, and tears, to reproduce the same original work with modifications in milliseconds, where the artists aren't necessarily properly getting compensated for.
We need to fix the data issue first before everyone starts flocking to AI willy-nilly, otherwise every artist will soon be out of a job. You may not think that's a possibility, but these AI companies will monopolize on this industry and suck the little money that's left right out of artist hands.
What will you do now with your knowledge of AI music and experimenting for a bit?
Models need to get big before they actually get any intelligence, as the intelligence is emergent. ChatGPT was used to develop new nuclear reactor designs. Not the most practical, but new ideas. It also has a theory of mind.
Best guess is that the music AI is using a tokenized CNN with a transformer network. The publicly available tools only mono, so they have done some coding on that.
There are two key problems with Generative AI. One is legal: are all the artists who's music is being extracted and fed to the AI so it can learn giving their permission for such use, and whether given permission or not, are they sharing in the profits made from such AI?
Secondly generative AI is only a mechanism for mashing up and regurgitating what already exists in its data set. It has no ability to be creative in the context of adding innovative content and ideas. If people were to stop creating new innovative music, AI would have no new content to learn, and its output would stagnate.
As a result, I think a more appropriate use of AI is for individuals to train AI for their own use with their own catalogue. This also allows the user of the AI to inject that added human aspect to create really unique content from a mashup of what the AI is producing for them, and their own talents. I don't think anyone would have an issue with that since the artist is the source.
Spotify et al's approach to AI as a panacea of generating music without having to pay artists is wrong on so many levels, and their attack on external AI companies is only to clear a way for them to control that themselves. I think rightfully, artists should push back and force companies like Spotify to share any profits made from music generated based on their catalogue. There should be no free lunch - particularly for these middle-man companies.
Thanks for commenting. Great take on using AI for personal music.
Are those artists sharing their profits with the other artists who's music they consumed to learn from?
"Secondly generative AI is only a mechanism for mashing up and regurgitating what already exists in its data set."
You are hallucinating. There are weights in a neural net, but it has no access to music data. New music genres are being made with the AI.
@@abram730 What new genres? I haven't heard anything from AI that isn't derivative.
Also, we've seen cases where people use melodies / riffs from successful artists in their own music, and end up getting sued and losing. So the point isn't what you've learned from a skill perspective (e.g. arpeggios, scales, muscle memory/skills with instruments), it's the idea of the level of derived content used from the original.
Look at case law on this subject between humans - and I think it will be instructive for what we see coming down the courts in the near future for AI. AI does not have the ability to really be creative like a human can, and until it does, it will be open to legal challenge for derived works.
@@lodragan Go to Suno and click explore. You will see some new genres.
"melodies / riffs from successful artists"
They likely have copywrite checking software as part of the training process The AI certainly doesn't have an understanding of law. That software probably ignores producer tags for instance as that would false flag new songs by the producer. That creates a hole in training so it will directly try to reproduce them if prompted to do so.
The first step of training is basically forgery, as the AI attempts to turn static it is given into the original. Only after it can do that do you move on to making pastiche works in training. One would use copywrite checking software to ensure that the AI is making pastiche works, rather than forgeries. Vast amounts of listening is required to get an understanding for genres, and gain the ability to be original. This is because the AI gets no formal education, rather it is required to become a an idiot savant at music.
3:30 really interesting point. We quanify success and payment based on time (plays, views, streams). Now AI rights would be based on some % of influence on the model.
The already struggling independent artist is going to suffer most.
@topmusicattorney, if you’re serious about that roundtable, please include Ted Gioia in the mix. His predictions are spot on when it comes to music and the economics around it. ❤
My favorite part about this argument is that there's a whole bunch of people who think that music dies once in their personal economics die. As every video that has ever been made about the industry on the internet likens it to satanic pedophilia minstrelism.
Rick got mad and made a video cussing him out in his thumbnail before changing it. Lol
One argument against AI is that AI can't understand human emotions, and thus can't express them as it lacks the life experience. I created an account on Suno and gave it a try.
"Broken Echoes" is purely a prompted song and I include the prompt in the description.
I then wrote a song called "Gone for Good"
The goal was expressing raw emotion with AI, and I essentially wrote a song for my own prompt. I figured a young woman expressing the loss of her first love to another woman would be quite raw.
I uploaded both songs.
How would you compare them? Would you consider them emotionally expressive?
Note: I missed a typo in my lyrics and cause a skip on the word choked, so please ignore that.
I think gone for good is probably the better written song but they both sound like they've been autotuned to death.
Sorry, that might have seemed a bit flip. I realise you're doing a legitimate experiment, but I don't like the sound of the result. I have not yet heard an AI voice that can compete with a human.
@@nzlemming Perfectly fine, I'm looking for feedback. I personally hate autotune myself. I got a tip about changing the genre to synthwave to get rid of the autotune. No autotuning in that genre.
I just made two Ai songs and two music videos for a film festival this week. It's on the channel "Neural Net Theater" on here. I can tell you that it took a lot of iterations, but the Rap and beat I made with it in an hour is wild. The Post Punk track is even more wild. And the music video, which would have been thousands was free with two days of editing and getting the shots using another Al. All I have to say is if this is the "demo", Artists and Producers better make sure this stays open to everyone, because if only the studios have access than they can pump out a hundred thousand albums an hour in any genre and we are toast.
The reality of all this is that nothing said here or so far by anyone is going to make this magically go away because the ai genie is already out of the bottle with this tech. So like it or not we have to accept "best case scenario" is that the public and the labels all get the same access and advantages in using it. Otherwise it's over. If they monopolize this through regulations, that they themselves are exempt from, then it's over. There will be no “market”. Over.
I’m not trying to be rude, or a smart ass, but would you be comfortable saying instead “ I just prompted AI to make two songs and two music videos for a film festival”
and “the rap and beat I prompted AI to make in an hour is wild” ?
@@josemelrose5465 Have you ever written a song before? You know, the words? Have you ever edited a music video? You know, shot for shot?
@@josemelrose5465 However if we want to be specific we could most accurately say that I have a writing credit on the lyrics, and edited the music video, and animated like over 6000 still frames into a complete stop motion video. We could say Ai is the “performer” that actually performed those lyrics, and Ai recorded the “Master”. That’s if we are being pedantic. But Pedantic is fine with me. Music consists of two separate parts in the legal sense, the composition and the recording. And a third in this case for the visual media. In which to achieve this form of multi media the human must engage in all three.
What are your career goals with this?
@@TopMusicAttorney A week ago, none. Now that I have a workflow the goal has become to have a portfolio of ai “artists” in various genres in order to have a reel put together to offer Ai music video services for “real artists”. I can put together the visuals for an ai music video in a few days that would cost an artist thousands or tens of thousands to shoot in real life, and I can do it in a few days, by myself, and for a few hundred dollars. So for right now I am using it as a portfolio. Although if I can monetize the channel that’s another avenue. And ultimately in the future it gives me a library of samples in different genres that i never have to worry about clearing if I want to make tracks later. But really at this point it’s crazy fun to make obscure Japanese City Pop and K-Pop and Afro Cuban tracks. I just found out it can do different languages so that’s really fun.
Hello, I'm from the future. An implant was installed in me that helps me compose music. The implant is connected to the internet and transmits information from there to my brain. With this new tool, I can create several new songs every week. Thanks to the implant, I can finally express myself. Long ago, someone wanted to ban such tools.
I'm personally perplexed on this topic - I actually understand both sides (perhaps more so on behalf of the AI users).
I sing, write lyrics, melodies, can't play guitar, but can play other instruments (flute, drums, cajon, piano).
As a singer, I took total offense to AutoTune (and actually still do with one exception - Cher's Do You Believe In Life After Love, probably because it was so obvious, not being hidden).
But then when DAW/MIDI/etc became readily available, I recall the same argument being made - you're using technology to create what is in your mind and not necessarily the specific drum beat etc.
At some point I expect we will be able to use our voice to "play" guitar, drums, etc, get AI to put music to a melody in our head (with or without lyrics or making the lyrics/melody even better).
The PROBLEM I see, from pro/anti AI perspectives is HOW do we get listeners, get paid correctly, and ensure our Copyrights aren't violated (I accidentally as a kid wrote lyrics to the melody of a song my Dad recognized, but not from someone I ever had heard - when he showed me I was shocked). I think those are the hurdles we should be focused on at this time. The rest will eventually fall into place IMO. Afterall AutoTune, DAW, Midi, etc have all found their place and are now widely acceptable tools.
@@ReigneNation Whether you’re Pro AI, Against AI, or don’t care …. It really doesn’t matter. We all have our opinions but the “PROBLEM” paragraph didn’t have anything to do with AI if you really think about.
AI isn’t going to help with you any of that. The 3 main sources of revenue for music groups are Events, Music Retail, Merch (Sync & Endorsements are honorable mentions). How is AI going to affect any of that?
Events: Host your own traditional concerts and when you’re off the road: livestream to venues:
Zoom Workplace + ListenTo by Audiomovers + Venue IRL = ‘Moment House’ concerts for a LIVE audience
You can also use ListenTo by Audiomovers to host silent popup music performances. All you need is a Laptop w/ a stable internet connection, an audio interface and your instrument of choice. Use social media, Social Phone by Distrokid, or have a QR Code at the table so ppl can Scan To Listen. Use Linktree to share your LIVE audio, tickets, retail, socials, etc. It’s a great way to get out into the real world to market yourself.
There’s so many Web2 tools to help you already but Web3 will help a lot more with music retail & protecting your music.
You gotta have a more forward thinking mindset. Shift your focus. Create music that resonates with you and use technology to improve your categories of revenue.
You gotta be more tech savvy and more forward thinking.
I completely agree. Pitch "correction" should be used as a special effect, not as a mask for a sub-par vocalist.
So are you ok with platforms being flooded with tens of thousands of tracks per day that were created in their entirety in a matter of minutes? You don't think that affects real musicians chances at discovery on these platforms? Not to mention the years they have spent learning their instrument(s) and songwriting artistry? I think it dilutes music to the point where the only musicians that will exist are "creators" which is incredibly sad.
@@JonsGuitarGarageSo “shelf space” is a concern again? Welcome to problems from the pre-internet days. Yep, the internet is severely saturated, that was bound to happen eventually.
But anywho, I don’t need to copy & paste - this comment section is small asf rn. Learn how to read, resources are right in front of you.
You’re just as lazy as those you’re complaining about. Sad asf LOL!
@@JonsGuitarGarageif you are dependent on platforms that were not paying you much anyways then ai is not your problem. If youre making great music and utilizing all tools available to you to connect and build a community for your music you are not concerned about what ai is doing on spotify because you are busy with what you are cresting and connecting with current and new community members. You just want to be mad to be mad. If you were really doing the work you would have nothing to be mad about.
in which video was your new song? was looking for it.....Thanks
Why are we mad? Because it's being developed by and for powerful companies but they could never do it without illegally taking the work of artists that might have never seen a penny thanks to the streaming platform's models! Is it that difficult to understand?
The biggest difference is this. people create music for their soul and hoped people could relate, then it turned into making music strictly for money which is why there is AI now. No soul, no creativity, just market share.
I don't believe that is the case for all independent artists. That may be the idea for major labels. And of course if this is what people are trying to do for a living and be their soul source of income they're going to run it like a business. That's the dream isn't it to make money from your art and not have to work a regular 9:00 to 5 job and just do what you love and make money.
Ai isnt just affecting the music though..
Using ai to write.. or compose? Why even bother.. the ai just took the job.
It shows just how useless the human who used the ai, actually is.
Cant form words? Why be a writer? "Oh, the ai will do it for me.." thats fraud.
It's more like humans are not realizing that they're going against their own self-interest. They're just looking at the short game.
Hey, what up Mr. Roboto.
No.. it's ok, you can say it.. "greed"
No need to complicate your point.
@@ThatOrko They are not even looking ;) The funny thing is that it's so easy to understand: it's called ARTIFICIAL, meaning it is a substitute, a replacement. Whatever activity was previously done by a human is now done by a machine, with or without assistance, the goal is to replace everything at all stages.
The direction is pretty clear. How it will fare and how long it takes is debatable, but automation ('cause AI is just a fancy buzz word to change the mindset and be marketable to investors) has been creeping into society for a long long time, and now it can reach incredible levels in MANY areas. It doesn't matter if it's really good, in a globalised market with concentrated power, the trends are never set by the customer, nor the employee or contractor. It can even surely fail in some ways even in the short run, but jobs will be lost and wages go down anyway because companies implement these crazy ideas regardless of the consequences. Why do you think they let out the geenie for free public use in these past few years? ;)
Love conversation.
open your eyes everyone....the future is coming..
As an organic musician with thousands of hours of practice, my opinion is that AI music lacks emotion and passion that goes into to creating and performing music that moves a person 😅
I’ve been a music producer for nearly 20 years. I think people are being a little close minded about AI. We’re so caught up in these AI generated songs, that we aren’t talking about what a great TOOL AI can be for music. I use AI to generate loops and samples, that I then build beats on top of. I do this for two major reasons, one the sample and/or loop im using in my beat can never be replicated again. It is unique to the prompt I put, and what was generated that ONE time. Only I have that sample, which makes that beat uniquely and undeniably mine. Splice is so saturated and over used, thats there nothing unique about using a Splice sample. Two I’m not taking someone else’s music and repurposing it. Im creating my own music, from that uniquely generated sample/loop. I dont need to worry about clearing anything, splitting shares, etc. I am honestly shocked there aren’t more people (specifically EDM and Hip Hop producers) thinking about AI the same way.
We exist.. we grinding just like you. Dropped a few AI Albums in the last couple months. Dropped 1 today, BKLYN BOUNCE. Anyways, It’s gonna be about creativity like you said over salty producers or incompetent industry executives, we busy creating great music.
I've been enjoying playing around with AI and frankly, if you're a musician who can't write, you can't write but if you're a non-musician who can write a good song, why not do it?
How has including AI work progressed your music career?
@@TopMusicAttorney it’ll be a time tested journey of quality and quantity over non talent fr. AI has helped me with everything from ideation to completion of full projects in a shorter time as prompting (text to “engineering”) will prove far more value in all domains of Ai in the future.
@@TopMusicAttorney Its hard to say, I havent been doing it long enough. I do have some people asking me where I get certain samples. I always get “wow thats interesting!” when I tell them.
Record companies/corporations are waiting until AI music is truly imperceptible to the majority of listeners. They will create '"artists" that they have complete control over and eliminate the 'human' factor. Bottom line baby. No need to shell out big money record contracts when the "artist" is completely engineered in house, pumping whatever drivel is popular at any given time.
The current pop scene is already there, with some notable exceptions, and it's just a matter of time.
AI will never be able to replace human emotion and feel in music. It is a tool to help us further our artistic vision. Further more, my wife for example, always wanted to make music and always has ideas for songs but never had the time to sit and learn music production and theory...now shes super happy that she can finally let her ideas see the light of day and be creative....the music industry has been over saturated for decades...and its runned by very shady people that want to fill their packets...this puts us more in control of our art as its in our hands now. Im all for it!
Exactly
⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️
Are you planning on charging for the music that you create with AI or do you believe that everything should just be free now?
@@ThatOrkoIrrelevant. Does the vocalist for Greta Van Fleet owe money to Robert Plant? Does Led Zeppelin owe money to all the blues riffs they took from previous blues musicians? Do tribute bands owe money to the band they’re paying tribute too? Are DJs finally gonna pay for the music they’re using for their shows?
AI is last in line yo
@@ThatOrko I pay for ai tools to create music, I don't charge for my music, it's a hobby for me, just like creating and putting stuff out
The ones who will decide will be the public, I dont like it but its here and its just evolution everything changes sometimes for the better sometimes not. The real ones who are not happy are the big label's once they've worked out how to make money themselves and control things, they will be happy. Either way its here to stay it will change and find its place. It wont stop me playing my piano, guitar or singing because I can stand (sit) Infront of people AI cant -yet but I am sure one day there will be robots looking like Ed Sheeran Taylor Swift doing concerts.
I'm not in the music industry, i'm just a music lover of many years, who listens and buys a lot of music, but l am absolutely against AI being used in the music industry. il have many issues with it ,my first is that l understand the music industry do not by law ( as yet) have to declare they use AI on the tracks l buy. My other issues is what happen to the copyright when AI gleans data from human musicians and the music track becomes a best seller, unknown by the human musician. Is that fair ? No, in my opinion.
l want to see that change. l brought the subject up a few years ago on a music forum and it caused quite a heated debate between musicians and those in the AI tec world. Musicians said it will kill their Art. The AI tec said it will 'improve their Art ' l listened to a AI composed Orchestra for a film sound track, and its creators ( a small team, no musicians just computors ) won vast awards. l listened to it and indeed it was really impressive. In fact it sounded perfect.
But we have to realize that the AI is only as good as what it can use from human input data ( at the moment ! ) It does it fast so it's economically of benefit to whatever industry uses it. But l fear it will destroy the Music Arts eventually , as their craft will not be needed anymore,. Their human creative music Art will be replaced just like the AI Orchestra. So where will it end. Human musicians etc will be replaced, they wont be able to compete with the AI production, what ever form it takes, and what will we be left with ?
Well l think we will eventually have killed the Arts , in all forms in the near future. Why do l say that.
Well AI at the moment can only create from input from the data collected from humans, But i'm told by the AI tec community that the next stage of AI is/will be so advanced it will not need human creators, it will be able to do it by itself!!
and those developing it , cant wait, as l had long discussions on the music forum with one of those very AI tecs.
So how do we stand on this future of the music industry ? Well, unfortunately, AI is here, and we cant do anything about. But my vision of that future is AI will end up like a musical loop and totally soulless due to no more human emotional heart. AI is doing great so far as the tecs tell me , and they say it will make millions for the music industry ( which it is already doing ) but l see AI eventually destroying it.
And l think its doing that already .... and we don't even realize it :(
Carpenters, metal workers, engineers, car production operativex, etc. The list is endless of very skilled, highly talented people who used to work in industries and had their jobs taken over by more efficent, lest costly nachined. Don't remember any mass protests about this from musicans or musicans unions. , nor any record labels? What makes musicans so special? Drum machines. Sequencers, midi all veen around god year's and beennused by many artists. Studio equipment and production techniques have all been improved by technical advances.
Music still matters and still is relevant, just not for the 'music business', which never cared about Music in the first place, it cared about business.
Musicians, artists and normal people care about Music! Btw, more and more people around me (most of my friends!) stopped 'listen' to Music, now they just want to hear Musicians Live, as I do!
ps sorry for my bad English and yes I'm a multi-intrumentalist musician. I've always said, there are two things, there's Music, and what people do with it. Take care!
It’s not about money and it’s not about musical proficiency. Most musicians and songwriters make little to zero money and will continue their work anyway. Don’t you get it - that isn’t why they are upset. Aphex Twin composed his innovative works even if he used machines, he created a sound no one had heard before. And with hip hop sampling there is an acknowledgement of the source which then creates a new sound. Creativity is at the heart of the human soul. AI is about art being hijacked by every dickhead who decides typing in a prompt makes them an artist. It’s an insult to the musicians and songwriters they are stealing from- is blatant theft. The internet is about to be FLOODED with so much fake shite music it will cancel out all of human creativity. The fact AI can rip off a song in seconds…sickening.
If it’s not about money carry on creating, recording, and performing. Music is fun! So what’s the point in arguing about the money, right?
If it is about the money, umm how is AI going to keep you from hosting your own events? How is AI going to mess up your tee shirt sales? And if AI Music steals listeners from you … you desperately need to learn how to play an instrument and then follow that up with songwriting 101 LOL!
Everything else is just opinions and feelings, which is subjective anyway. AI is here regardless.
Sometimes I get very worried about the future of art. What's going to be squeezed out of the equation.
@@partymarty6969 fine, so jump on your apps after your day to day job and have fun. But don’t pretend to be a musician or a songwriter and start releasing AI generated music which took 5 seconds to type in a line of text, scraping the internet of every song you ever liked, then claiming you are now an artist. All those songs that the AI are trained on - often took thousands of hours of human dedication, expression, experience, suffering, soul searching, joy, sadness, struggling…that’s why they sound good.
Ai has control. You are joining the painters, and other artists, book writers, and more. You just made the list.
Jobs have been getting eliminated by computers at least since the 1980s.
How would they feel if someone trai ed an ai on their content channels and then made that the norm.
It's like with everything else in the western world, if it doesn't effect you personally then screw it.
For those of you who do not understand why AI is crap you need to understand that the creators of AI are using copyrighted material to train it. In other words they are infringing the authorship and copyright of the material used. Besides that little fact, AI has nothing to offer. AI simply pours all the material on a blenders and then tries a billion trillion combinations to see what sticks, and when that does not provide any entertainment then it just copies copyrighted material. So this just leads you to the question.. would you like to have a computer steal your voice? your style? your tone? your vocabulary? or all of the above? without paying you once cent? Of course the answer is... sue the AI company and that is precisely what the BMI BMG ASCAP SESAC are doing.
While I agree there is a hole in the law here. AI combine many songs before the result and for it to be copyrighted, it needs to be a copy which is not. It's like splitting 1000 pussles and put them together with pieces from all of them mixed. Also the training part, it's like humans get inspired by listening, but AI get inspired it in a massive scale very fast.
A new law is needed that prevents AI from training without consent.
AI is basically micro sampling without the consent of the creators whose work is being sampled. There is no aspect of AI that is original since it is merely micro cutting and pasting to create the illusion of originality.
@@thewilythylacine Yes but is that illegal? Imagine copying 1 pixel from 100 000 images and put them together into one. Can one pixel be copyrighted? Can one "microsample" be copyrighted? It may be 10000 of a second which is probably just a sine wave.
@@jenstornellit's not just one pixel per image though, otherwise it'd have no basis for comparison.
@@johnbigelson7471 I can agree on that. Then how many pixels is required for it to be a copyright infringement? Instead of just being inspired?
Well AI taking over the music industry is the lease of my worries. AI is going to basically take over our jobs and our way of life, essentially. I'm a desktop engineer. I work in tech, so I know its capabilities. I want real music myself but we can't stop progrees😅
I have put my shred guitar into A.I. and it actually has replicated my leads with an even better tone with better backing!It needs more controls but pretty fun
Do you plan on releasing the music or are you using AI as a kind of video game for fun?
Because it is supplementing your inferior product with better content created by others.
@@thewilythylacine silly 🤡
If people cared enough to put their heart into creation rather than seeking some glory trip by hoping they get "known" or "famous" etc then AI would be irrelevant. The problem is people are making music from ego-based, selfish places and are just as willing to sell their soul for whatever. I'm angry about the lack of greatness in this golden age of tech
@urproblem I hear ya and concur. It's a vital issue you raise
@urproblem i will always be on the side of the artist regardless. I'd rather know that the true artists are the ones driving the world rather than industries & egos exploiting their work. I understand why you responded that way. Wishing you well
@urproblem but I believe truly skilled artists can and do make a living even in this realm
Probably because it's all stolen content and continues to steal from real artists. The whole 'it's not music' thing is just a pointless diversion. Someone should be getting paid every time an AI song is monetized - and not the guy that wrote the prompt. I mean the artists in the database that gave AI music its voice.
Interesting points. Thanks for contributing.
What's not to be angry about? Generative AI music, means taking away artistic opportunity from humans, and handing it over to machines. I think that's quite a serious thing, and we shouldn't treat it lightly Furthermore, there's no real necessity for it to begin with. (Humans have seemingly been doing just fine for thousands of years without AI art/music.) Good AI is that which solves problems. The primary function of Generative AI art has been to cause problems rather than to solve them.
So, some artists think AI training is just using their music to make new music? That’s like saying learning to play the guitar is copying Jimi Hendrix. Training an AI is more like listening and learning patterns, not remixing existing tracks. The AI creates completely new works, not just reusing someone else's music.
I believe the big use of AI music will be used in advertisements, "TV shows," video games and movies. The maker of those products will be getting free music and they won't have to pay royalties. As far as musicians getting paid, the main source of income has been the touring. The recorded music was the promotion for the tours and some acts even lost money on the recording end such as those labels owned by the mafia.
Same thoughts but I’ll add: Learn to host your own events and then when you’re off the road, learn to livestream to venues around the world all from your home studio.
Zoom workplace + ListenTo by Audiomovers + Venue IRL = ‘Moment House’ concerts for a LIVE audience
Touring needs a facelift.
I agree with you sync licensing will be the most affected and especially in the earlier stages. Putting so many musicians that don't tour out of business it's really a shame. And at the end of the day it Hurts Independent artist the most. Because not every artist can afford to tour.
Great point. Thanks for contributing.
But what about those of us who make our music and use AI to fill in the background instruments and such? The tune is mine, the melody is mine, the lyrics are mine (meaning that I personally created them all), but I use Suno to fill in the thin music. It can't use anyone else's tunes or lyrics, or chord progressions since it is ACTUALLY using my tune, melody, and lyrics. Is there a place in the industry for that? (I have to use AI because I can't get a SINGLE PERSON to help me with my music so a song comes to fruition! My last singing partner recorded all but 20 seconds of my current song and then flaked! I NEED AI to do what all the two faced, lazy losers who promise to help me but then don't, refuse to do.)
AI, used properly (not generatively) is no different than having actual people help. (And it's more trustworthy some times too!) Need an example? I can post one if you wish.
BTW, as always, thank you for an awesomely informative and useful video!!!
Interesting point.
'BASED OFF MY MUSIC' - - - - no it isnt. YOUR music is based on ALL OTHER MUSIC......you were inspired by OTHERS. so - you stole their ideas..'')
If I was growing up now, I'd learn to be the best live musician possible. I'd have AI write my album then assemble talented musicians to take it on a tour world wide.
Touring is still the most lucrative avenue for music groups but traveling is actually more expensive than ever now. It’s actually not a good time for touring music groups right now.
I’m not sure why we don’t have music groups live-streaming to venues where fans gather to enjoy the show tho (there were a lot of venues and music groups experimenting with live-streaming back in 2020).
That’s the next step: ‘Moment House’ concerts for LIVE audiences. These shows can kickstart funds needed for traditional tours.
What's more important than ever is live music. AI can't do that. We need venues that pay enough so that artists can tour again without losing money. Accessible rehearsal spaces that do not eat up every penny of profit.
I'm happy that gear is maybe cheaper and more accessible than ever, gear access used to be much more of a hurdle. And maybe nobody pays for digital music, but people buy records again and even cassettes again.
As for making a living and long term royalties? Maybe those days are over. But at least nobody has to wait to get signed in order to move forward.
You: “We need venues that pay enough so that artists can tour again without losing money.”
Me: I hear ya but ultimately all the money generated comes from the fans not the venues. And expecting music groups to live on the road like that to make most of their living is absurd & unsustainable (cost of travel is way too high now).
What we need is more tech savvy/forward thinking venues & event organizers.
It’s 2024, music groups should be able to livestream from their rehearsal spaces to physical venues where fans gather to experience the LIVE performance.
Doing this will have lots of benefits and can help kickstart LIVE in-person shows as well creating formal touring seasons for productions (maybe LIVE in-person shows can minimize production costs and prioritize the LIVE experience oppose to wanting backing tracks to sync fireworks and extravagant light shows).
This was a bigger issue internet wide with famous & nonfamous digital artist with stabilityai and later died down when AI had tons of mistakes and watermarks (popular musicians are actually complacent or quiet- cause they know the possibilities if "they" use it). It's not really going to be illegalized for finding data for fair use. And artist make less than musicians lol. Then we have the top music companies making their own AI service.... so.... you really don't win once they own each melody, even though the melodies are in public domain (watch the TED Talk). Yet, people are still suing over melodies because melodies are limited like beats are, which aren't copyrighted. What should stay copyrighted are lyrics, obviously. You cannot copy exact words compared to music patterns. Eventually, people will simply make money off of music instead of limiting the other's creativity, or the big 3 will sue eveyone making music. This is the ultimatum you may face in the future...
If we go by historical context, musicians will need to focus on fan building than trying to litigate a song "similar" to theirs.... which isn't sueable in the first place.
The profit share/license idea came from the art community, but it never went anywhere. AI is not something you can easily litigate, especially if USA is in competition to improve AI against China and Russia who may use it against the states' electric grid and whatnot. If the art community were overly enraged and still are in art sites and twitter, and even stiffle each other or assume each other for AI, almost self-destructing the community due to how little artist make already, and got nowhere, music won't have a factor either, just syphoned if evern suno falls. ANother company would do the same in a less suable way. Even open source it, and that would pretty much end the argument if the source of the problem is untraceable.
I don't think fair use applies where it comes to AI anything. I will grant that it may be very hard to sue given the leeway that is giving to the AI market during this gold rush era - though I guess we can see what happens with Scarlett Johanson's suit against OpenAI.
Print media companies warned about the power of companies like Google, Facebook, Apple, etc years ago. Spotify is the music version of that. Distribution control, fragmentation, and inability to survive financially is the common denominator. And beholden to algorithms, issues with bots, and now AI. The power of media creation and distribution has been wrested from people to these platforms where they can set the rules, and increasingly, create without the creator. Besides obvious creative issues, there’s also interference in cultural and social exchanges. We already see culture wars online, massive disinformation with bots and paid accounts, and more recently, direct interference with such interactions from the owner of the company that was once Twitter. I’m talking about Musk of course, and his direct, daily involvement in changing the political landscape on that platform, and enacting changes that move the discourse and policies to the right. Not a surprising thing considering Musk’s well known strong right-wing bias and shady business practices. Well now it is possible to create video and sound that is very lifelike. And proliferation of that kind of thing is especially rife on Twitter. This opens the door to manipulation in a way never before dreamed of. There’s a good reason why right-wing interests associated with Trump want to purchase TikTok. How will you feel about a world in which the owners of platforms with a political agenda can simply manufacture songs, videos, information, and culture that suits their worldview? As Musk once said, he wants you to take the red pill, and is willing to change Twitter to make that happen. And as privatization of education becomes more prevalent, and these platforms pushed more and more into children’s lives, how will they know the difference?
I can see how AI can be useful as a tool, however, what I really don't like is when it is used for any form of art - images, music, writing, etc. You could probably play me a melange of sounds/music and I would be hard-pressed to tell which was 'real' and which was AI generated. That makes me sad. I have a certain set of skills (though none like Liam Neeson ...) acquired over decades (I am an ex-programmer) and the idea that some 'spotty oik' could just say "hey, AI tool write me a progam that does this that and the other" kind of scares me. If memory serves a lawyer used an AI generated speech at trial, complete with quoting case l\aw .. that did not exist! There is a concept called GIGO: Garbage In, Garbage Out - if your input is not 100% good then mistakes, errors, facts will also not be 100%. Untill ALL data held for potential input can be confirmed to be 100% and onl;y usable when relevant, I am not a fan of AI. And probably not even then as I am a grumpy old git when all is said and done.
If streaming would make more money for all music. The problem would be solved. Because at this moment the Financial pressure is to high also the chance to fail. I think a streamed song should be worth 0.50 € and not the peanuts artist are getting now. I think record labels Will invest massively in AI. Because they like cheap music. And guys.. this is the problem. As a music fan, I don't give a f... if it is a human created or ai created song if I like it... It's good enough for me. By the way. Great gids!
Yes, I create songs with AI support.
Many people now think that AI models could make music like humans and that many musicians would become even more without a living.
Absolutely No!
Creative musicians have been using technical developments for centuries (piano, organ, electronic sound generation, synthesizers, sampling, loop machines, vocoders, reverb, Dolby, DAWs, to name just a few).
In the performing arts, technical material developments, chemistry, sprayers, printing technology are relevant, and for graphic artists, designers, technical draftsmen,... CG and CAD systems.
If I tell a well-trained AI model: “Make me a great work of art or a piece of music!”, then it's like jumping around with a camera and just snapping away. At some point, you're sure to get a great snapshot.
If the world is now flooded with “AI songs”, so what? Since the development of camera smartphones, we have been blessed with billions of images and videos. Professional photographers and videographers laugh about it and are more in demand than ever.
If I use AI to write songs, to produce music, then I make the music. I decide in creative and artistic processes what my song should be like, melody, chords, lyrics, beats, instruments, style, genre,...
AI is and remains just a tool, albeit a very impressive one, that can save me a lot of time.
I could also create each of these songs in a day with a MIDI keyboard and a good DAW (Ableton, Logic, Pro-Tools...) - without AI.
And: With AI support it only takes me: Still one day LOL ; - ) But the work processes are changing in such a way that I have much less to deal with filters, plugins, effects, sound packs,... and find more time for creative variations and experiments.
If I have no idea about music - by that I mean theory and practice as a musician, composition, harmony, arranging,... - then neither a Bösendorfer grand piano, a great synthesizer or an AI like Suno or Udio are of any use.
I just wanted to say that.
The good musicians will always be very different from the, well, hobbyists, Tiktoks & Co., regardless of whether they use technology or are unplugged, even if many of them still suffer without a living.
A doctor to a musician: “You only have three months to live!” - “From what…?”
In 5 years no one will even care either way!
Let’s see!
I have a problem that probably no one cares about, I have a problem with people saying “I” wrote or “I” made when describing the music created by prompts into AI- You didn’t write it, you didn’t make it, you prompted AI to write and make it.
There used to be a market for whale oil years ago. Markets come and go. Unfortunately music is going to have no value because tech can do it all now. I left the music biz years ago because I saw what was happening. You are better off learning programming or running the AI systems than trying to make money on music these days.
The problem is Ai music isn't an interpretation it's a calculation based on others' interpretations.
a lot of musicians are angry cause their music sucks and they know it, yet feel the AI is stealing their penuts, "stealing from their music" c'mon, majority are MEDIOCRE at best
I don't think that's it at all
Take a WILD guess , Sherlock !
By the way I thought I'd leave one more comment on this ridiculous video of this ridiculous woman who's not a lawyer claiming she is she's got people on here who literally hate on AI and are using AI to make music and I've literally just exposed them for doing so This whole channel and the followers that follow it are all a bunch of walking contradictions
Experimental? I was just listening to this video while some experimental music was playing and it was crazy cool sounding. Can I do an overdub of this video?
The irony of a music person with the worst sound ever.
🙌
Hi I’m a new fan of your channel and I think you’re pretty cool :) I have 2 questions for you if you don’t mind?
1) My stage name is Kain and I’m a one man band and it’s a dark moody tribal rock band called “KAIN’S TORMENT” and I play a homemade 18 string electric guitar which is built for my wheelchair. Since 2003 I’ve written 24-25 ish songs but I’ve only managed to recorded 9. However one of the main things holding me back is I have a speech problem as I’m disabled but luckily with metal it doesn’t matter. I’m not selling my music but is there a way to copy and paste my lyrics and paste it into a deep and gravely voice a bit like Marilyn Manson or the singer from Trypticon? That’s all I’ve ever wanted. I can cut up the voice in Logic Pro X to fit my tracks but I just need a AI voice because I just can’t find any singers to help me in the UK I’ve been looking for 18 ish years so I’m praying AI voices can finally help me to out but I have no idea where to look or start or if it’s even possible?
2) Also I’ve got a newish side project called “Kain the Easy Rider” basically I record me doing mad and funny things in my 4 wheelchairs and I usually put my favourite rock band songs as the backing tracks on my videos. As I’m in the UK I’m not bothered if UA-cam partially blocks my videos in some other country do to copyrighted music but it’s annoying especially when as my videos are free and I’m not making any money and all. I just pick my favourite band that goes with my videos etc. etc. Anyway I’ve just spent 12 hours up loading the video of one of my drives / walks and it’s the very first time my video has been blocked everywhere just because I’m using Rob Zombie’s tracks. How do I make it work with what ever music I want because technically I’m actually promoting there music for free and I’m not making and money from UA-cam because I can’t as I’m on benefits etc. One video I did try the “I don’t own to rights to any music in this video” thing but that didn’t seem to work the same way it does for my friend. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks Kain
Hey! Please reach out directly to me at Krystle@topmusicattorney.com
@@TopMusicAttorney ok thanks
I just letting you know I’ve just emailed you :) I hope it’s actually you and not some scammer you often see 😂
the self obsessed musicians and other artists don't see a larger picture here... what about self driving cars, robots working in warehouses, AI customer services, self checkouts... that is just a start. AI does not pay taxes, so when you loose job to AI you won't get any help from government as there will be no money... weird nobody talks about this anywhere right?
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judging by all the comments i see all throughout social media on the validity of AI music (such as emotional driven tracks) AI music is doomed to fail and we have the power to not give it notice and listen to it...Just dont listen to it and make them fail
I have a problem with this. Okay people that use AI might not be classed as musicians, I totally agree but you can write the lyrics and style the song. So it's like saying Mario Puzo can't call himself a director or actor in the Godfather. He's never tried to, however he did write it...or shall we take that from him because he wasn't in the movie? Shall we say that Bernie Taupin isn't a musician because he didn't sing on any Elton John song? So you can't call yourself a musician but isn't it fair that depending on how much you've had a creative input you could call yourself a lyricist and visual artist if you then create a video to go with these songs?
So if these two feel very strongly about it, it'll be interesting to know if they've ever made music about the working class jobs that have vanished due to mechanisation, or is it fine that working class jobs can vanish but it's inappropriate when the middle class jobs start to disappear?
The great musicians will always find work and sell songs because they can do something original. AI would never be able to have come up with the grunge era or The Smiths because it was something new however the music scene has been soulless and spiritless for at least the last decade because of the big corporations. These AI models are taking it away from the big corporations, the big corporations that have been shafting the musicians for decades....so maybe you should be happy at that?
If you're using AI to create something and you call yourself an artist, then why don't you call yourself a cook for just ordering at a restaurant or why doesn't Spielberg call himself a composer when he hires John Williams to do his soundtracks? You just wrote: make me this, and the machine (not you!) made it. It's as simple as that. A good prompt is just like a good brief when commissioning a job, you are still NOT doing the job.
Exactly!!! There really is nothing more to say than this.
@@josemelrose5465 Thanks!
If you use sound tax in the loops that is already made and created by someone else and you're just putting them together You're not a music card You're just a contradictive liar You see what I did there I just contradicted your contradiction
@@DarkSideofSynthYour whole comments a contradiction and so are you
@@DarkSideofSynthAnd by the way I checked your music out You even had videos that say you use loot so you're not a music artist then yourselves So how about you shut up contradiction walking
I think your imagination limits your ability to see what AI soon will be able to do. For good and bad. Opportunities, but also a massive job massakre.
Yes but we’re talking in regards to Pro Musicians LOL! How is AI going to keep you from hosting your events? How is AI going to mess up your t-shirt sales? And if AI music is stealing listening time from you // you desperately need music lessons and join songwriting 101 immediately after hahaha!
Music groups are not even live-streaming to venues yet (sports has had PPV for decades already). And ESPN has deals with venues like COSM showcasing technology called Shared Reality.
Shift your focus ya’ll smh
@@partymarty6969only lazy ppl dependent on spotify or who are not using ALL tools because they hate social media or won’t go out in their community are the people really mad about ai. Oh and the people at the top who now realize that regular people can now make better quality music faster and think money should only be for the top few in life.
Plenty for everyone to eat and have fun and make art. Focus on how you are making your art snd having fun and the noise fades away. Ai it just a tool. Use it or dont. If your good and cresting people will support you regardless of ai
@@partymarty6969 , they are angry because they are afraid. Not only for them selves, but also for the future of the quality of music.
I just uploaded a cover of Coldplays Yellow I spent months on, did the vocals for, I put everything I had into it, few 100 views. I have 50k monthly under this name from songs I bought cheap off Fiverr or generated with Suno/Udio. Get mad all ya want, people listen to what they listen to. I am not upset my hard work didn't pay off. I wanted to make that cover for myself, and I did. Thankfully I am not stuck up and open minded enough to monetize in other ways. I get over 300,000 streams a week from Ai music. Artists hate me for it, yet it's your own potential fan base listening to it. Who are you really mad at? Most likely yourself.
People are angry about Ai music because of money. People have paid money for equipment, instruments and training and Ai generated music eliminates the significance of their investment.
No one told them to be a bunch of fools going and wasting money on a bunch of bull crap and you do know that most these people complaining use literally loop packs They're a bunch of walking contradictions and nobody makes good money from music so they're not losing out on money and all's they're doing is trying to take away a poor man's way of making music You people are a bunch of hypocrites
@@OfficialDJTasawennateken You sound...upset?
Cost to "upload" is too low. So flooding from free generated stuff is happening.
Tough. Its not going to revert to the way it was, so people will have to live with it. And no, the courts will not be able to prevent AI music from evolving and getting better and better.
Hey, great idea... make a video with Rick Beato's name in the title because HE has 4.X million subscribers (vs. BJ w/ 394K and TMA w/ 68K) and just made a controversial video (about AI of all things) so you're likely to snag quite a few more views than usual, right ?!?!!? Maybe pickup a few thousand more subscribers ?!?!? Sure you will, and it's a perfect time to jump on Rick's back because he voiced strong (and well qualified) opinions in a somewhat off-the-cuff video, with a few hyperbolic statements made in a state of generally elevated emotion - oh he made it so easy for you !!!
Look... I'm not the world's biggest RB fan, in fact I think he often comes off as pompous and aloof - but I'll defend his right to his own very qualified opinions all day long, and I'll take him seriously when he makes serious statements - unfortunately, in the end, Rick is simply not allowed to be a human w/ flaws, and G-d forbid he should display any degree of emotion alongside his opinions as stated online - one really must be 100% flawless on YT, and make statements that no one could possible disagree with, or even friends will turn and eat you like rabid dogs, all for a few extra bucks... case in point ^^^
As for the ostensible point of THIS video, and to all those publishing AI music as their own... enjoy your moment of sunshine NOW because soon YOU will be displaced by the very systems YOU think are so great, as the platforms begin using AI to prompt ITSELF to create music based on algorithmic feedback, historical averages and trends, and social engineering by those controlling the platforms
if AI doesn't need human musicians to make music, AI certainly doesn't need human prompters to make music either - was that your goal ??? are you happy now ??? sadly, some will say "yes"
Support live local music - soon it may be your only option to AI's emerging dominance on streaming platforms - JM2C...