This dressing gown changed fashion forever : the feminist history of going out in loungewear
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- Опубліковано 14 кві 2022
- Historical women would fight the patriarchy by wearing loungewear in public! Dressing gowns have a fascinating role in fashion history. On pajama days, I've enjoyed hanging out on Quilt! Join me for Jenell's Conscious Coffee on 4/19 at 7am PST by downloading here: bit.ly/SnappyDragon_Quilt
Yes, the iconic robe francaise, the French court gown we think of at Versailles, was a fancy dressing gown. Loungewear outfits for wearing in public may feel like a very modern fashion, but they're at least 300 years old. There are so many historical loungewear looks we're familiar with-- we just don't know that they were daytime pajamas, or how proto feminist women wore them to fight sexism! This story begins with the 17th century court ladies who rejected uncomfortable dresses and instead made high-fashion gowns called mantuas out of a bathrobe. Women dressmakers who made those gowns fought for the right to have their trade recognized, and suddenly women had a career option that would give them equivalent status and income to male tailors working in the same industry. The mantua spawned several other loungewear style dresses, including the robe volante and the robe a la française. Even after fashion changed, Victorian women were still the subject of much debate when they chose to go out in Mother Hubbard dressing gowns! Men simply couldn't stand the sight of women wearing clothes that weren't designed for the male gaze, and there are a treasure trove of incensed letters in newspapers, very much like a Victorian list of Fashion Trends Men Hate. Some towns even went as far as outlawing the Mother Hubbard dress! So anytime you wear loungewear for work, or spend the whole day in a fancy dressing gown, know that you are fighting the patriarchy in a way that many women before you have.
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“It has cats on it” has the same energy as “thanks, it has pockets”
They have pockets too 😃😃😃
@@SnappyDragon
I feel that pockets explicitly mark them as Definitely Made For More Than Just Sleeping In.
We all get compliments when we have cute visible pockets, don't we? Pockets are wonderful.
@@ragnkja My Mom used to say they were for Kleenexes.
@@SnappyDragon I too have cat pajama pants with pockets, but the cats on mine are doing science.
Walking outside in your bonnet is a similar thing for black women today. It's too much effort to do a twist out every time we want to go to Walmart, so we wear our bonnets for errands that aren't as important. Men, especially older men, call this "ghetto". I call it practical. And honestly, someone that gets mad over a hat can go sit on a pin.
Go sit on a pin, indeed! Perhaps a hatpin if they're especially rude.
Smh 🤦🏾♀️
I may be a clueless white person, but 'practical' does seem like a much more accurate assessment 😁
There are also.hats & continental African + S+N Americas African Americans. ?
especially in Gouadeloupe + Martinique, Surinam. etc. See videos + books.
I will now be incorporating "sit on a hatpin" into my regular conversation 🙃
One of the (mixed) advantages of being elderly is the virtual invisibility to the demands of the male gaze. Grannies tend to wear what we like, whether it be “too casual”, “too dressy”, or “too costumey “. Plus men, at least younger ones, tend to jump to our aid, particularly if you live where the dominant culture is family oriented. It’s kinda refreshing, after all these years, to have them carry my groceries rather than hit on me.
I suspect the first women to wear dressing gowns or mother hubbards in public may have been elderly.
The name “Mother Hubbard” certainly implies that it was originally worn by more “matronly” women and not necessarily so much by the youth.
That is something that came up in the "Searching for Mother Hubbard" paper!
I remember turning 40 and discovering that I had developed the super power of invisibility. It is so darn freeing (except when trying to get a bartender's attention).
I feel something similar as someone who's slightly butch, but not butch *enough* to get negative attention for being butch. I don't attract attention for being "pretty" nor do I attract attention for being "ugly." Most of the time I just get to exist. I can only imagine that it'll be even more freeing when I get older. (Of course there's the possibility of weird transphobic or homophobic harassment, but apparently I'm the Baby Bear's Porridge of not being harassed, which I'm sure is just luck. I in no way think I'm doing something better or behaving better than people who do get harassed, because in the end that's all on the harassers.)
Unless you're over the age of 40 and are wearing a skirt with a length above the knee, that's apparently not okay. I don't personally like shorter skirts but once I hit 40 and discovered how "acceptable" my previously "too frumpy" styles became, I was really glad I defended my older friend who still looks amazing in short skirts! And should have the right to wear them if she likes whether she looks amazing in them or not.
My sister just turned thirty and had the same realization I had when I turned thirty: straight men are either mad at us because they are attracted to us or mad at us because they are not attracted to us with little variation. Something about turning thirty.
Or mad at you because you aren't attracted to them.
Can confirm, the age of thirty bring wisdom in this regard for the small price of most or all of our F-cks to give. ❤️
Weird how we're "bitches" either way, right? I just turned 40 and I find that I can just give The Look to shut most of those fellas down. My husband says it's actually frightening to be on the receiving end of said Look 😂
I didn't realize that until I was in my mid 40's but I look younger than my actual age. Lol I realized the power of my inner bitch and decided to embrace it instead of shy away from it because of fear of being seen as a"Karen". A term that I completely think that was invented by a man who was realizing that the word "Bitch" had slowly been loosing its power to control middle aged women. And let's face it the whole world might collapse if middle aged women aren't kept in their place and actually not be afraid to stick up for themselves and others and make any real changes in the world.
Thank goodness that I've realized that already in my 20's. If any guy gives me a funny look, I just give them a soulless look of "I will delete your knees" and they usually keep to themselves.
It's really funny that if I made a tea gown now and wore it to the store everyone would be like "what are you so dressed up for?"
Well, it has a big skirt, so by modern standards it must be fully formal!!
(Maybe I'll do this when I have a tea gown 🤣)
The amount of work a woman "keeping house" did in the past is phenomenal. I have read studies that it required at least 40 hours a week just to keep a family fed. There were no shortcuts. This also included processing the harvest, putting up the food. Because there is more to it then just cooking. Now add to that keeping the family dressed, raising and teaching the children. By Victorian times you could by fabric to make clothes, you didn't have to prep the fibre, spin it and weave it before you could make a garment. Oh and you do this while pregnant and nursing. But remember to make yourself look good to all the random men when going out.
*this entire paragraph* is basically a list of reasons that no, no I do *not* want to "live back then".
@@SnappyDragon yes seriously. Whenever I see people eulogizing the past it is always as rich men and women. I love the sca but the reality of life for 99% is not enviable. When I was younger I tried a lot of this stuff because I had friends who were into homesteading and basically decided life as an urban tech person was way more pleasant then these "wholesome life" concepts.
@@lenabreijer1311 I love that I have the freedom to choose to do some of these BECAUSE I want to, not because I have to. Being middle class in the developed world is fabulous! I love weaving, spinning, embroidery, knitting, and ESPECIALLY crochet. I can a couple of things each year. But I do not have to provide all these skills for my household every day, just to survive, which is amazingly liberating.
@@MaidMirawyn yes same here. I love cooking the occasional fancy meal, I don't want to cook 3 meals a day for a bunch of people every day. I love fibre crafts but I don't want to do the equivalent of sweat shop labour every day. I don't think doing that somehow makes you a better or more wholesome person.
All of this. I'm about to spend the day cooking a gigantic meal with things in the garden next to my house, but oh my goodness I am so glad I don't do this every day.
I am exceptionally privileged in being a white, educated woman of a certain age, who took up a non-traditional career as well (electronics technician). I was once asked why I didn't wear dressier clothing "like the office staff" (all women).
I replied that between crawling under computer desks, climbing onto equipment to run cables or install sensors, and soldering wires and connections, skirts and/or melty fabrics were impractical. Besides, I wore exactly the same type of clothing as the male technicians wore.
Thank you for the centuries-spanning lesson, I loved it.
"You try doing this job in those outfits." I love it!
That's how I feel at work... I mean... I'm a painter, so the uniform is whites and a t-shirt, but... problem there is that it is a male-dominated career... and they just don't make women's whites the same way they make the men's: the fabric is thinner, the cut is tighter, the waist-line is lowered...
I'm swimming in men's painting whites at the waist, they're tight in the butt, but... I can wear a pair of them for a year or two before they start wearing thin.
Women's, if they don't wear thin and rip in a matter of months, then I'm still worrying about plumber-butt every time I crouch.
I don't care that I'm a woman, my primary identity at work is 'painter', so I'd really like it if women's whites reflected that I'm there to work, not look stylish. Yes to having pants fit, but no to lowered waist, more fitted leg cut, or thinner 'flex' fabric... it's just not practical or durable enough.
It frustrates me so much how much womenswear clothes makers can't seem to tell the difference between "clothes that fit one's body" and "clothes that fit *ornamentally* "
I've got a few friends perhaps a little older than "a certain age", one who had exactly that job, crawling around under desks etc, and her boss at the time (I think in the 70s) tried to make her dress according to women's dress code, heels and skirt, and the other, who worked in a machine shop (I think in the 80s) and was presented with ill-fitting (because hips) men's or downright dangerous women's (you do NOT wear polyester around things that spark!!) coveralls, both of them had an uphill battle to be able to wear the clothing appropriate to the job.
Which is why I'm thankful that my lack of hips lets me wear men's clothng for work (I do property maintenance so if it's not paint, drywall mud and caulking, it's grass stains, sawdust and mud), men's cargo pants have decent pockets and last about three times longer than anything I can find in the women's department (which don't fit me well anyways, they're always too tight in the waist with acres of extra fabric in the hips), and men's tshirts are also better quality and often lower price. And I don't need them to be sexy tapered cut, not only am I a brick with boobs, I'm also inevitably going to ruin them anyways. And I've always been more comfortable in work clothes than office clothes, not gonna lie. I snag my skirts on everything, when I'm not tripping over them or accidentally showing more than intended, depending on the length of the skirt!
My bee suit, however, is clearly designed for a man with a long torso and short legs, my mom and I both have the same fit issues on our suits. I'm going to try stitching in a little elastic where our actual waists are, to make them look a bit less like we're wearing droopy diapers!!! Also, when the crotch is down by your knees and you need to climb up on a stepstool to get into a tall hive, or ... oh, say, suddenly need to run from crabby bees? I dunno, could happen... it's a liability!!!
When my daughter got a co-op position in a foundry first thing we did was make sure she had good quality non-flammable or at least non-melting clothes for work. Trying to find boots in her size was a treat had to find a store with a men’s 4 1/2 or 5! Finally found a pair they said they were giving her a student discount but judging from the dust on the box it was a get these things out of inventory discount!! She finished that course and continued on to become a foundry engineer. She still works there. She still has problems getting boots her last pair involved months of them not being shipped to her. Then a four hour drive to a store that had them while ranting about the man keeping women down!
I love the idea that the Hubbard wrapper was designed to be practical and did not care about patriarchal preferences.
Also the phrase "we'll hold your hats" as the C19 equivalent of a "hold my beer" ally.
I know, right! The level of snark in 19th century newspapers makes me so happy.
@@SnappyDragon I love a bit of clever snark!
It's so you can use the hat pin like a dagger, right?
Right???
@@catherinecrawford2289 or deliver a well-placed kick to the shin 😄
I love how some of the most opulent stunning queenly gowns we think of from the past were essentially fancy ass dressing robes. The more you know! I shall wear my dressing gown with pride.
If your dressing gown makes you feel good, who cares what other people think?
Fancy dressing gowns for all!
Too bad the men didn't have something similar for confort
One of my favorite things about the robes à la française, and that I didn't see mentioned, is that THEY WERE ADJUSTABLE. There commonly was a hidden lacing placket on the inside center back. Gained ten pounds over the holidays? Got cramps and bloating? Pregnant but don't feel like announcing it yet? Just let out the lacing a bit, the giant back pleats will hide it, and the front and sides can still look proper. It's genuinely genius.
I made a c. 1700 mantua a few years ago, and the back is only lightly tacked down, would be quite easy to alter it. Both styles are not only quite comfortable, but understand that, realistically, women aren't the same measurements every day.
Thanks for the video, nice to see a good overview of these kinds of styles. :)
I don't know as much about their construction so I didn't want to get too far into it (and also this video was already 28 minutes long 😵) but yes, that is a super cool feature! A lot of 18thC clothes were sliiiightly adjustable because of the pinned or laced closures, but robes française really took it up a notch. I figure if you have a gown that fancy, you want to make sure you can keep wearing it as much of the time as possible.
Amazing that men still think today that their opinions on women's dress, hair, makeup, life...let's face it, f'n everything...is needed, asked for or necessary. I love your line...'Just leave her alone'. Preach, sister!
Seriously! Unless someone directly asked you . . . they didn't ask you.
@@SnappyDragon Exactly
There’s a guy who commented on the Short she made from this opening with the whole “patriarchy isn’t real” and “you’re all bitter” and “you’re complaining about something that doesn’t exist” typical talking points.
Of course, every word of his comment proves EXACTLY what’s covered in the video. He’s the 21st century version of the outraged letters to the editor. 😂
Oh yeah I'm pretty sure I banned that dude-- but if there's another one, he'll be going the same way shortly!
While I do completely and absolutely agree and will definitely 'hold your hat' on this comment - I feel a lot of women fall into judging others for their fashion choices. I know I have and probably still do - and I'm now having to do a retake on my opinions.
I remember seeing pictures of women in the 50's and 60's shopping during the day with scarves covering their curlers. Nothing is truly new in fashion history, just constantly recycled in different ways.
So true! Same concepts, just different material details.
We didn't have blow dryers or curling irons in the 50's and 60's. Unless you had your hair done in a beauty shop, it took hours to dry it, especially if it was long.
My grandma's would do this. I remember their collections of scarves they wore over their curlers to do chores outside the house.
This brings to mind the words of my mother "What will the neighbors think?"
and my response "why do I care what the neighbors think?!"
Thanks for another insightful video
"Why are the neighbors paying such close attention to me?! Kind of creepy . . . "
My maternal grandmother, born 1898, was proper enough that she never had to sneak past her parents...and outrageous enough that she'd have come in the window simply to shock the neighbors. She was magnificent in countless ways, as awesome as Olenna Tyrell or the Dowager at Downton Abbey or any Katherine Hepburn role. You'd both have liked her! 😎
@@margaretwordnerd5210
She definitely sounds like my kind of friend. 🙂
I wonder if that is a generation experience. As a baby boomer, I do hope younger women did not have to put up with that kind of attitude from their mothers.
I am happy to report, I responded in a similar fashion to my mother's admonition about "what will the neighbors think." I added (threatened? 😉) "Maybe I should give them something really interesting to think about." She never said that to me again. 😁
Wearing loungewear out has definitely been a hard mental block for me to accept. My mom was very vocal about wearing “real” clothes out, plus I was all about What Not to Wear in my teens and early 20s. Even now I work in an office that (at least prior to the pandemic and still on the books) was very much business casual. Even though my style has gotten comfier, I still feel like it’s going to be used against me (even though there are people who wear leggings and jeans daily, and jeans are specifically called out as Friday-only in our dress code).
I did ditch makeup years ago though. My skin just Does Not like makeup.
It's tough! I absolutely do not fault anyone for doing what they have to do to deal with these stupid standards.
I know how you feel. My office spent alot of the pandemic working from home. I got dressed every morning like I was leaving my house. In t-shirts and jean instead of business casual, but still as if someone might see my "state of undress" over my camera. I have never been picky about what people choice to wear/dress, but I think I have some ingrained bias on "undress". I don't have the patience for markup and hairdos, so what is wrong with people with their hair in curls in public. Nothing really but it still feels weird....
@@elizabethpense9602 I worked from home for decades. I did the same thing, business casual. It signaled to my mind that I was in work mode. It helped make boundaries between my work life and my other life. Even if it was getting up from my desk at 5, walking across the bedroom and changing into sweat pants. It became a ritual.
My skin also hates makeup. I wear lip gloss and mascara when I feel like it. I’ve been literally told “I’m not that brave,” which shows how screwed up our expectations are when many women don’t feel they CAN skip makeup.
I do wear makeup for performance (belly dance), cosplay, and special occasions, though I still wear less than most people even then.
Hahaha! when I worked in an office (in the US) as an unruly secretary, I had the opposite problem. My boss once called me into his office and told me that there was a mold with the label 'secretary' written on it. He went on to mime fitting the various other secretaries into this invisible mold and each time pulling a face, saying "yes, she fits" and then finally, he tried to fit my name into the mold and it just didn't fit at all. He told me I needed to look the part - I dressed in all sorts of different outfits ranging from mainly jeans and t-shirt to an Aikido outfit (super comfy) and after that little conversation, I showed up with a shirt and tie and.... jeans. I did tell my boss that the only people who saw me were fellow employees. I was not a 'visible to the outside world' employee. Eventually, they moved me over to IT and I did programming. A much better fit. I think I got away with my unconventional dress and behaviour thanks to my non-American accent.
A year or so later, when I worked in an office in France, it was very interesting to see the differences between expectations of bosses and employees. Everyone wore whatever they wanted. The plant manager wore mostly a suit and tie, his secretary wore a whole range of styles depending on her mood, and the rest of the employees basically dressed 'their age'. Older people wore more dressed up attire and the younger ones mainly jeans or fashionable dresses. They were people, not just employees who had to look a certain way for their employer. It would have been unthinkable for a boss to tell his secretary how she should dress - unless, of course, the attire was offensive such as a t-shirt with a hateful image, for example.
it really annoys me that a man can answer the door ,or even pop outdoors in sleeveless t-shirt and sweat pants,but if I as a female do that I'm a slob,slag,let myself go,slapper,etc,etc!I go on my balcony/porch in my dressing gown,but I DO get glances of disapproval!
That's so ridiculous, it's *your own* balcony!
@@SnappyDragon I'm covered neck to ankle too. Thats the ridiculous thing. Cant even snatch some parsley out of my planter without being judged!
@@pheart2381 I've forgotten myself a few times and gone out on my balcony for some basil or chives wearing a tshirt and undies. Thankfully I have reached that point in my life where I don't care, my motto when it comes to my appearance is that if you don't like it, you don't have to look.
@@bunhelsingslegacy3549 done the same thing but didnt care at all, my shirt was huge so whatevs. They can just not look
I personally don't love wearing pajamas during the day because I find it's harder for me to turn my brain into "functional" mode while I'm in pajamas or lounge wear. I do, however, have a couple of "easy" dresses that are loose or stretchy that let me feel fully dressed while still being very comfy for days when I'm in a lot of pain. I also have some pretty silk robes for when I really can't manage to get dressed.
The act of getting changed in the morning definitely helps my brain switch to “start of day” mode. It’s possible that I could get the same switch by changing into a different set of pyjamas, but I prefer my warmer daytime clothes, at least when it’s not a hot summer day.
I'm a big fan of the easy dress. It's especially funny when someone asks why you're all dressed up, and you have to decide whether to explain that a jersey dress is a T-shirt with extra floof about the bottom.
@@Eloraurora
Other person: “what’s the occasion?”
Me in a jersey summer dress: “it’s warm outside.”
I definitely relate to this! The amount of time I spend stuck in bed (where regular clothes just Are Not Comfy) just makes me more excited to Properly Get Dressed whenever I can.
I *love* dresses like this! I have a couple that are basically ankle-length t-shirts and they are my favorite things.
I'm LOVING this!
I made a walking skirt out of sweatpants material, because I cannot be bothered to exit my pajamas. To the untrained eye, it looks like a wool and the pockets hold a ton victory is mine! 😁
Yesssss cozy skirts! I feel like no one gives long skirts the credit they deserve for being comfy. Wearing a wool (or sweatpants-material) skirt over a light cotton or linen petticoat basically feels like wearing bedsheets and a blanket 😃
Genius
Wearing your pyjamas while doing your daily shopping is sort of a status sybol in certain central districts of big Chinese cities (Shanghai particularly). Being able to shop in your pyjamas means you live in the neighborhood and probably have long family ties to these fashionable and real estate desirable neighborhoods. Basically by being in your pyjamas you are flaunting your cultural and monied capital. People are very divided on if it is okey or not to do this, many seeing it as tacky and other being, why not, it is practical.
That's so interesting!
Interesting.
Something you tangentially touched on in this video is something I would love to know more about; historical maternity/postpartum clothing. I know rich people were not about to whip out a boob to feed their little darlings when they could pay someone to do it for them, but how did the average new mom of the 18th or 19th century deal with the massive size/shape changes of pregnancy, and how did one feed a small human without getting totally undressed, particularly in eras where higher necklines were in fashion? As a new mom, I can't imagine fumbling my way through God alone knows how many dress hooks multiple times per day, praying I didn't drip milk all over unwashable support garments and spend the rest of the day smelling funny.
I don't know much about historical maternity clothing, but one thing that did come up is that wrappers and later the Mother Hubbard were very popular during the later trimesters of pregnancy when more fitted clothes were just not an option.
Yea, I've been trying to figure all of this out too since I discovered historybounding around when I got pregnant, and I've really struggled with fit on pieces that I was also trying to design to have lacing and such to be more size adjustable. It takes so much more time to get in and out of clothing with laces, even if it's more adjustable. I also did not find nursing up and over stays comfortable at all
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Have a look at these videos... Maybe it helps you... There are stays and corsets that are made to work just like modern day breastfeeding bras or tank tops and some dresses have hidden openings just at the bust area for the purpose of breastfeeding without undressing.
18th century focused fashion historian here. I find the subject of 18th century maternity clothing fascinating. In all things, general 18th century clothing thought of the comfort of women and the changing of size we can do day to day rather than over time. With rare exception, most clothing could adjust 2-3 modern clothing sizes up or down. We rarely find purpose made maternity clothing in this century because your clothes as is could generally be worn to the end of pregnancy. You'd pull the petticoats over the bump (no one cared about the hemline difference), maternity stays are just normal ones with two side seams sliced open and lacing added, wear already voluminous bedgowns (not nightwear: think of it as the female t-shirt of the 18th century), and wider and differently shaped stomachers added to gowns. It really is amazing how comfortable and easy it is to adjust your wardrobe to accommodate pregnancy in the 18th century. The 19th century had maternity clothing, and it was more or less accessible. You often see clothing modified for pregnancy as well, something that can do double duty so to speak. The support garments of both centuries were washable, but generally were either cleaned with home dry cleaning or spot cleaning methods, so if you got milk on your stays or corset, no biggie. That might be a time you choose to go without those garments as well, and there were common alternatives, like using a quilted waistcoat instead of stays in the 18th century.
V. Birchwood has a video called 500 years of maternity clothing where she interviews Kass McGann on the subject, for those interested :)
I live in Korea, and I did live through the trend of wearing your curlers out. It did indeed seem to be fuelled by the very fast-paced lives people lead, so that though you wanted to curl your fringe you didn't have time to do this at home necessarily -- but also, and I do think this is important, some famous people did it first. This does seem in line with your general narrative though. =)
Thank you for filling us in!
repeat after me: "it is beneath my dignity as a woman to care if any man expresses approval or disapproval of how i look"
Or as my mother used to say "Who made it any of your business (to comment on my attire or behavior)?"
In the 90s (and it's still a thing) in Liverpool it was common to see women (especially but not limited to young women) in their "day time pyjamas" if they weren't Going Out or to work. Having your hair in rollers/curlers was also super common, and at one point having a barrel brush lodged in your fringe (bangs) was also a thing. (enormous barrel fringes were very fashionable in the late 90s early 00s). Going Out wasn't doing your chores or going to the shops (or nail salon) and things, it was going somewhere fancy or for a night out at bars and clubs. So you would put your daytime pyjamas on, set your hair in preparation for styling later, and then go about your day all comfy and casual until it was time to get ready for Going Out.
There was definitely a massive class divide going on. It became a rule that you couldn't sign on or collect your dole check (at the jobcentre/benefits office) wearing pyjamas even though they were specifically clean pyjamas that had been put on for daytime wear. Conversely, in the same period high end fashion was starting to appear in magazines and on catwalks showing "fashionable" lounge wear and "aethliesure wear". So putting on loose comfortable trousers with brand logos on was seen as ok, putting loose comfortable trousers on with a cute heart print was "common" and unacceptable. (also insert the history of negative stereotypes about Liverpool that exist in the UK here)
Er ... sorry for the wall of text. But it's a subject that has always fascinated me.
No need to be sorry, I think it's super interesting! It really does seem like "same nonsense, different day" with the rich ladies in their tea gowns.
I guess being a college student has completely altered my opinion of what is a normal and acceptable level of dress to go out into the world. I never realized that sweat pants are seen as “to informal” even when going on errands. For me like 90% of the people I see are in jeans and a tee shirt, sweats and a tee shirt, or shorts and a tee shirt. I tend to stick out the most when I dress up a bit in slacks or a dress. So I guess the concept of people getting looks for wearing “loungewear” is just foreign to me.
I do think there's a bit of a generational shift to it-- and the pandemic is probably only strengthening that.
Yep! I’m a student and i’ll wear buttondowns and slacks to school. I often out-dress my teachers.
@@mikeymullins5305 In a past life I was a professor. I'll confess that I was occasionally scandalized by what my students wore to class. That's how I realized I must be approaching middle age. 😂
I remember my college days. T shirt and pajama pants doubled as sleepwear and classroom clothes.
I'm two decades past my student days but I will go grocery shopping in PJ pants... in the Santa skull ones or the neon unicorn Xmas tree ones, and I don't care what time of year it is. I lost all will to even do business casual when I got called out where I used to work for wearing leggings when another lady in the office was wearing pants so low-cut that everyone could tell she was wearing thong underwear... they also tried to demand that I wear a bra (and were genuinely shocked when I told them I'd quit first), and men could wear jeans but women couldn't. So glad I'm not there anymore!!
It's taken me a lot to overcome my judgement (learned at mother's knee) of wearing pjs and slippers out in public... But I know it's ablest and stupid. We learn. We grow.
We learn, we grow, we stay comfy 💚
@@SnappyDragon Inside and out.
I'm studying to be a veterinarian and so there are many days when I go out and about in scrubs. I have too much social anxiety to wear pajamas out and about (except for 2 am pms-fueled Wawa ice cream runs), but let me tell you scrubs are sooooo comfy it makes me wish I could just wear them all the time. Sometimes I put them on when I wanna be comfy but I need to go out. And nobody's ever bothered me because they're scrubs.
When I was in cosmetology school, I was training alongside people in esthetician and massage therapy programs. A lot of them wore black scrubs as their uniform and I can certainly see why! (Though most of us cosmetology students were too flashy to consider it.)
I just wanted to add that French Couturière Guild (seamstress/mantua maker) wasn't the first opportunity for woman to be part of a trade in France and owning their business. The Lingère Guild (linen traders/linen workers) were there since the Middle Ages, having monopoly on everything made of linen. They were making and selling woman chemises, caps, aprons, fichus, removable lace garnitures on dresses, man shirts and cravats, baby diapers and clothes, children clothes, priest shirts and altar linens, etc. Also all the house linens, bed linens, wash clothes, table clothes, towels, etc. They were the only authorized sellers of linen fabric and lace in Paris. But they were hard to join, the exclusive trade was mainly kept among the families of those who were already master lingère. You can refer to Gasrsault's book "L'art de la lingère" to know more about that trade.
And also French women could join the guild of the painters/sculptors, the fillassières (thread makers/traders), the bouquetières/chapelières de fleur (bouquet/flower hat makers) and the Grainiers (grain traders). The marchandes de mode was also a woman guild, but you had to be the wife of a tailor to become a member. And every trade open to both man and woman in 1776, even though widows were normally able to join the guild of their late husband and practice his trade before that date.
With the pandemic I feel the opposite, I want o dress up for going grocery shopping or because I’m going to buy something from the hardware store, because I just don’t dress up anymore. But I also find I gravitate toward fancy but comfortable clothing even then. Bras, shoes, and fabrics, especially. Looser cuts, etc. Very interesting video btw!
I totally relate to this. I'll take pretty much any excuse on a nice day . . . but when it's 55, foggy, and I'm going to physiotherapy, nothing will stop me wearing sweats 🤣
I feel like we should be able to dress up ANY TIME WE WANT. If it’s fulfilling for you to dress up, go for it!
There's a German-language musical called Elisabeth that is about the final empress of the Austro-Hungarian empire. In some productions, she is show in hoop skirts, but in most productions, she spends the majority of the show in a dressing gown--even when those around her are in hoop skirts. That choice makes so much more sense now! I mean, I understand the choice as a practical one for stage performance. But it also makes sense if the hostess is allowed to be in her home clothes while everyone else has to be dressed up to be around her.
That's such a cool staging idea! I'm not familiar with the play but I'm guessing it must add a lot to the storyline, portraying such a grand figure in her at-home clothes rather than her perfectly put-together public look.
@@SnappyDragon Totally!! The character arc is like wild child to depressed person who can't handle formal court life. She spends a lot of time being told that she doesn't get up early enough in the morning and she isn't proper enough etc. Her struggle with mental illness is really central to the show. It makes so much sense!!
I was a State investigator for 20 years and wore jeans and a top the whole time. Dressing up put me at risk of harm. I was happy though when I went to court because I could wear a full suit or dress. I am now disabled and need to wear loose clothing and overall am very comfortable doing so outside. My husband came home from the store last week stating he saw a woman shopping in a regular bathrobe and he was stunned. Our are of the country doesn't look upon that as ok. It was ok for her though and isn't that what really matters.
Props to you for dressing as you needed too-- and to the lady who shopped in her bathrobe. I figure if that's what one needs to do to make their day work, it's worth it.
I will fully admit to liking tea-gowns, my favorite is from 1915... the same year as my model 66 singer. I also love 1940s house dresses and quilted robes.
This reminds me of the summer of 2015; I was painting our garden shed in the manner of Van Gough's Starry Night, so... I was wearing an old pair of soccer shorts, a ratty t-shirt, an apron (so I'd have pockets), and a sun hat.
I got to a stopping point where I needed colors to dry before I could put on the next layer of colors, so I went in for lunch... and was like 'I have library books that need returned today!'
So I grabbed my books and ran to the library to return my books, intending to run right back and continue painting... and some dude said 'wow, you really need to shave your legs.'
First off, no I don't, secondly I am perfectly hygienic, thirdly did he not see that I was wearing painting clothes? Fourth...ly look at yourself before you judge me dude, or I will tie you up with your own ankle-length dreads.
All that to say... that I decided that he was stupid, that shaving is stupid, that society's beauty standards are stupid, that my legs don't dry out so much when I'm unshaved, that it's really no business of anyone's if I decide not to shave, etc. etc. So yeah... down with shaving.
In contrast, one of my best memories of going to the library... I was wearing really baggy pants and a t-shirt... and I was reading one of the books I'd just checked out as I walked home... and this little girl, probably 5-7 years old... told me I was beautiful.
This dude can go sit with all of the Historical Men Who No One Asked!
You painted Starry Night on your garden shed and told Mr. NobodyAsked where he could stick it? How are we not best friends? 😄
The curlers segment brought back to memory a French town in the sixties. There were American army families housed in a building next to where we lived. The American women shocked the French women by walking around all day with curlers in their hair, under a headscarf. The American women wore these all day and only took them off in time for when their husbands came home. The French women would not have been caught dead in public with curlers on. According to my mother, at the time, American women only felt the need to be pretty/presentable/attractive for their husbands, whereas the French women were pretty/presentable/attractive because that is simply what a person is. They wore much less make-up than the American women, wore less revealing clothing and behaved quite differently. I know this because I used to be standing in line in the grocery shop with my mother as the ladies ran their comparisons. Obviously, this was the sixties and the American women were predominantly between mid-twenties and mid-thirties, whereas the age range of the French women was much broader. The cultural differences were obvious even to me as a small child. I received from this the idea that American women cater much more to men than what French women do, culturally. The "I have to look good for my man" is something I have never heard (and cannot even imagine) a french woman say, not even in french, hahahahah!
Analyzing all the standards gets so interesting! The idea of having to look good only "for my man" strikes me as just as sexist as the idea that women should constantly be performing prettiness, but from a different angle.
@@SnappyDragon Totally agree. It reminds me of the women who were against women's voting rights back in the day.... not quite the same, but same mindset, in a way.
I wear the color red for safety, I live on a street where I have to cross a major and poorly visible road to get home and people whip through cross walks and don't stop or look. so my go to dresses when outside bright vibrate fire engine red. I find they are more likely to stop if they see my red dress than a green or blue one.
I'd never thought about it, but that makes so much sense!
@@SnappyDragon i essentially mimic a stop sign
I wear really loud colours when I go jogging, nobody can claim they didn't see me that way!
I own neon yellow athletic tops (short & long sleeve) for precisely this reason
Seeing your reference to Arts and Crafts style, the V&A recently did a strand on Instagram how a lot of the Arts and Crafts type designs are a straight steal from traditional Persian/Islamic designs!
Ooh, I gotta check that out! It would be a nice change to see an English museum actually discussing Orientalism properly-- if they do it properly.
Link?
@@idrisa7909 Hi Idris, unfortunately it was only one of the stories on Instagram, so not a thing I can link to.
Another wonderful video, thanks. When I was living in Japan I bought a loungewear dress. It was made of T-shirt material and had a little lace on the collar. Love it. Wore it outside, didn't care. That dress has inspired my style of loungewear ever since. I wear comfy simple cotton knit dresses, that I may or may not wear a bra with, and yeah I'll wear them at home and I'll wear them out. I just find I get down in the dumps if I wear sweats/yoga pants too often.
Love love love lounge dresses!
I'm really glad you mentioned the connection between mood and what we wear. I'm disabled and mostly bedbound, so I'm in nighties the vast majority of the time. And boy did that really get me down! But just switching from plain/ugly/heap looking nighties to pretty ones made a massive difference. I made myself a pretty summer wrapper from old floral cotton bedsheets, and it became the perfect hing to throw on if someone was coming around (like deliveries, support workers, cleaners, so it happens pretty often), and I want to look pretty bit without going to the effort of getting dressed (which is a LOT of effort). I'm also slowly building a collection of historical/vintage/just plain pretty nighties to wear. I'm working up the courage to cut into this gorgeous navy silk I managed to pick up at a 2nd hand haberdashery for $4/m to make a 1940s style long slip/nightie, and then also a long dress version of the silk pj sets that have the piping (there was 4.5m of the silk, it was the best find!)
But all of this has really helped. There's nothing worse than being stuck in bed, in ugly and cheap pjs, all day every day. It really does a number on your mood. I'm pretty sure Jessica Kellgren-Fozard has extolled the virtues of pretty pjs as well. Huge difference!
Her pajamas are *so* pretty! They're very different from what I'd find comfortable, but she looks great.
I was given two long-sleeved, calf-length, cotton knit nightgowns when I was in my early 20s. At the time I was working full-time in childcare, so winters meant I would be in very warm classrooms and cold, snowy playgrounds, on and off the floor, cleaning behind toilets, and rushing to prepare and serve hot foods for several classrooms or dealing with steam and splashed food boogers from commercial dishwashers. I have sensory issues which make it very uncomfortable for me to wear pants, leggings, or tights for more than a few hours at a time, and tend to get rashes and skin infections if I wear synthetic fabrics or blends with more than 5% synthetic fibers. I stitched ribbon sashes onto each nightgown and called them dresses. I could throw a cardigan over them and quickly pull on leggings under the longish skirts for warmth without disrupting my day, and however I had to scrunch, stretch, or spot-clean them during the course of a day, they returned to their original shape With a necklace (usually a pendant-style watch, as aforementioned sensory issues also means wristwatches were impractical), they looked professional enough for a school-marmish vibe, which was appropriate in that context. The MOST comfortable clothing for me, I have discovered, is a calf-to-full-length chemise with a variation of late 1700s or early 1800s stays (which is a whole other level of loungewear as daywear), but I didn't see that as an option back then, and those nightgowns got me through a few winters beautifully.
I love this! A friend of mine also has sensory issues that mean no trousers or leggings, and does a similar thing : she has the most lovely collection of jersey dresses. They're all super soft and super pretty and she always looks so nice!
I enjoy wearing dresses more and more and don't currently own a pair of jeans that fit me or aren't ripped and may not ever again, and one time when I wore a dress to a friends' house, her daughter asked if I was dressed up to go somewhere and I said no, it was just comfortable. I have worn out several dresses that are comfortable enough to be nightgowns and often are worn as nightgowns.
I'm the same with sensory stuff, I got rid of my last pair of pants a few years ago, and am loving wearing skirts every day, Its like always wearing a blanket :D
LOve this! I've been wearing two flannel nightgowns I made myself (medieval panels and gores construction) as house dresses and I've worn them out a few times too, sometimes as an underdress, sometimes just as a dress. Nobody knows it's flannel unless they get closer than one needs to be for plague-times!!
I bought an oversized polyester nightgown from a thrift store awhile back. The cut was ugly, but the fabric had the colors I wanted. It had been there for awhile so while I don't normally buy pieces to downsize, this was clearly a piece that not many people would be interested in wearing out as was. I cut out the zipper, downsized it, and shortened it. now It's one of the pieces I get the most compliments on. I also made a dress out of ribbons, lace, and a set of pillow cases.
Salem Tovar talks about this a little bit in one of her videos where she talks about how in a lot of Latinx families, you have to be dressed up to go anywhere because of the double standards presented to us; my mom would always inspect us to see if we "looked homeless" before we would as much as go grocery shopping, we would always go to Ross, or Burlington, or wherever before the new school year, stuff like that. Even as an adult, but especially as a trans Mexican woman in a predominantly white part of the city, I still feel the pressures to look like a good little token minority for safety concerns despite my claims to not care. I still like dressing up though, and I think for me the best compromise on the days I can't be bothered to "dress up properly" either because depression, lethargy, whatever, and to keep the dysphoria demons away (because sweats/leggings are still a nightmare for me) was to just invest in knit dresses and shirts and some cute socks so even if I'm just doing my writing or going to grab groceries I can just throw something on and call it a day *and* still get compliments. One of these days I am totally gonna sew myself some nice tea gowns though~
I'll have to watch that video! Thanks for recommending it 💚
Growing up (white, in France) I always had the idea of black woman being more elegant than white women, because of that extra care that I didn’t know about. Even now I’m still very impressed by the stark contrast between the average white women in the subway versus average black woman, especially at rush hour.
I agree with you. Being trans, we want to blend in but also make an effort to help our dysphoria…dressing up to go to the shops is a choice and our pleasure and make us feel better. Take care in your part of the world…Remember your are beautiful.
@@nikkipackham2234 It’s always the struggle between reducing dysphoria and not looking crazy. I’ve just started leaning in to the crazy.
I have chronic fatigue and 7 other disabilities. Another of them is migraines and back and knee issues. Some days I spend days in bed. I love your idea s especially with the loom. Your history discussions on textiles are great part of my textiles studies too. Thank you
Aww, thank you! wishing you many easy health days.
Total shock when you mentioned the Holuku, a lovely dress form still honored in dance competitions. It will have sleeves, a high cut neckline, and a train.
comfort in clothing is why i started sewing - i was fed up with buying things that did not fit and were uncomfortable as a result. then nothing in the store was really my style or just didn't look the way i wanted it to. making my own bespoke clothing gives me all the control in the world over design, materials, and fit. although it does mean it takes longer to put on and doesn't really follow the simple and comfortable idea hahahahaha-but it's what works for me ("for me" being the operating phrase here)
I think that's what got a lot of us into sewing, the experience of having store-bought clothing just not work no matter what.
@@SnappyDragon agreed-store bought clothes fit my shoulders and hips and are too big everywhere else, and i dont personally enjoy wearing stretch type stuff (obvi i support others wearing what they want lol)
the stuff i make is complicated (esp since i draw inspo from multiple sources and use historical construction techniques, none of which have a pattern lol) but comfy, even the stuff meant to be worn to work bc it looks and fits how i want it to (and i learn more everytime i make something)
This entire video is pure genius and super fascinating! I looove the humor you've sprinkled in there V, I couldn't help but grin at various points when I watched it.
Re: men not keeping their opinions to themselves.
I had a lovely late 20's or early 30's fellow almost raising an eyebrow when I walked down the street to the supermarket earlier today. Me wearing my striped woolen walkingskirt, modern fastfashion lightweight "edwardian esque" sweater and antique tonbi/inverness coat (open, not wide enough to wear closed without stress on the buttons with 4m skirthem).
It felt awesome to look them dead in the eye and immediatly see their gaze turn away. 😇😌
🤣🤣🤣 I should start paying more attention to people's reactions when I go out in historical clothes. Sounds like excellent people-watching!
@@SnappyDragon can recommend. A dude almost fell of his bike staring at me, sometime last year. (I was wearing a cloak)
@@SnappyDragon Absolutly! Please do! I tend to let my eyes wander, observing the area around me instead of activly looking at people to see their faces. It's only when they activly stare that I look them dead in the eye.
I've found that most looks are just curiosity whilst other people do really stare XD Kids responses are too cute sometimes haha I'll let them touch coat, cape, skirt or whatever if they want to :)
I've found that as a wheelchair user, I tend to more easily "get away with" wearing eccentric clothing. There's some not great reasons for that, having to do with ableism, but I will at least use it to my advantage. Like, I'm almost finished crocheting myself a lap blanket to wear out in winter. Because what's one of the great things about being a wheelchair user if not being able to wear a blankie in public and not have anyone raise a brow?
@@SnappyDragon i bought a bunch of doctor who coats and cloaks for my sanity's sake (i was being spread too thin and needed to do SOMETHING) just as the pandemic hit...so i did costumed constitutionals in them...my neighbors love them! of course i love them, too--so swooshy! :D
This has been on my mind a lot lately since I just transitioned from a very casual college to The Workforce (specifically a municipal government). Suddenly I have to worry about whether my bra straps are showing, which I haven't even thought of since I was 14 😒
Oh dear. Good luck!
I have endometriosis and clothes that are as beautiful as they are comfortable are what sent me down the costube rabbit hole in the first place!
Welcome welcome! We do love our fancy cozy clothes here.
Not Korean, but I lived in Korea for 5 years during the whole curler phase. Even some of my 6th grade students did it. I never thought of it being a "cultural" thing, but just a trend where these one kind of bangs were popular with the younger girls/women and these curlers helped keep them in the same shape throughout the day, if they hadn't their bangs would've fallen flat or become twisted because of their hair texture. I'm convinced that when I saw my 5th and 6th graders (11 and 12 year olds) do it it was because they saw the middle and high school girls do it and wanted to look cool and older. They would not wear them in class, but would between class and to and from school, even on the bus. Occasionally I saw uni students doing it, but rarely, and I never saw anyone over 22 do it. I do remember one girl I knew that wore one that quickly took it out and ruffled her bangs when a boy she liked was about to walk by, lol. The curlers I never felt were used like pieces of hair accessories, but those velcro hair patches used to hold back hair definitely were, especially by 11 year olds, lol
Several years ago there was a trend in my hometown of college guys going out in their pajama pants and t-shirts. There was even an interview with a guy (my neighbor) and he said he just didn't see the need to get fully dressed to go to the grocery store (or wherever). This trend lasted several months, until it snowed, and didn't come back in the spring. And no girls/women were ever seen in pajama pants. But "lounge wear" especially from VS, was acceptable. As long as they "looked cute", it was fine.
sigh
Nope, no double standards at all, nothing to see here! -_-
Plenty of college women, (2002) wore plaid pj pants and a t-shirt or hoodie to classes. If they lived in residence and could use the tunnels to get to classes, and it wasn’t a lab, they’d be in sandals or flip flops year round too.
Not my personal preference for “comfy clothes” but if it means you get to class on time, I absolutely support it.
Did the guys or teachers whine about it? Other than to observe “clearly you live in rez”… I don’t really remember it. Which either means I had my head up my arse thinking I was better than them, and failing to see the misogyny - or there wasn’t any.
This of course also being of the era when we were merely glad if we never saw a guy’s underwear or bum.
LOL I still go shopping in my unicorn pj pants, if it's cold out I throw cargo pants on over them when I leave the house, "outer pants" for the win. In university I was wearing sweat pants to school (late 90s) because I was doing a physical labour job before or after classes and no good place to change in between, and by half a semester in engineering, you realize that precisely nobody but perhaps your mother cares what you're wearing to class.
@@bunhelsingslegacy3549 I had an old pair of sweat pants I wore to my early classes in the late 90s. Living in the dorms was nice.
Your comment just helped me notice a huge class divide in clothing at my high school. Wearing VS loungewear pants to school was perfectly acceptable, or even fashionable. Meanwhile, people who wore cheaper printed pajama pants to school were harshly judged. Both were basically the same physical shape, just with different materials, patterns, and branding. People were expected to give excuses for wearing printed pajamas (I’m sick, I was up late last night, etc), but never for pricey-looking loungewear.
So I suppose the implication was that you could only be that comfortable at school if you performed some level of wealth.
I personally don’t like staying in pyjamas all day, but that’s more about me preferring to wear more layers during daytime whereas to sleep I mostly just care if my shoulders are kept warm. I certainly don’t dress all that differently if I’m staying home all day compared to if I’m going somewhere, because I don’t wear pretty clothes for anyone but myself and those I actually care about.
I definitely do this too! Sometimes when I need to sit at home and write/research/edit I'll put on a nice dress and fun makeup just to motivate myself.
@@SnappyDragon
It’s also a lot less effort to not have to consider whether a particular outfit is “appropriate for leaving the house” rather than “do I want to wear this?”
So, this is kind of an aside, but talking about how some women have always been looking to reject dressing for the male gaze (consciously or by simply not prioritizing it) has gotten me thinking about how that's a bit of a privilege of cishet women, isn't it? In that some non-cishet women often have to seek refuge in the male gaze to pass and non-het women often have case to consider dressing for the female gaze without giving themselves away to The Straights. I don't know that I've ever seen discussion of that, only discussion on how mlm have coded their dress for the mlm gaze or discussion about the female gaze being either entirely platonic or directed only towards men.
Anyway, lots of people look at each other and that makes things very complicated, doesn't it?
Ooh, interesting. I hadn't considered this, and it adds a whole new layer of complexity to it all.... 🤔 Thank you for sharing! 💙
For sure! I feel like the moment you add another variety of marginalization onto being female-assigned, be it race or gender or anything else, the standards get exponentially more complex.
When I was living in south India, there was a type of simple robe, often embroidered at the neckline, that was used exactly as the tea gown is (including as hostess), and these were called "house robes" (using English, translated). When I first learned about tea gowns and wrappers, I was like, "Ah. I see. Colonialism."
This was a really interesting video!! Sad that as a black woman things have not changed much! It’s interesting how quickly something becomes “ghetto” when we wear it 😏
Same crap, different century 😵
I am currently wearing leggings and a dress made from Sweater fabric. I couldn’t be more comfortable. And yet it passes as „proper“ clothes for me, just because of the cut. Standards are weird. 😄
Thanks for the video, thinking of all these fancy robes as bathrobes made me grin.
Standards are *so* weird!
AFAB millennial with chronic pain, here. I swapped my entire wardrobe for softer, comfier things that don't put pressure on my painful spots (hips, knees, back.) This includes a lot of ponte pants and yoga leggings, tunics/short dresses, sweater dresses, and men's dress shirts. I've been making some of my own clothes to add to this. Full skirts with enormous pockets are generally my go-to errand wear so I don't need to carry a purse (but not too full or I'll knock things over.) I'm slowly developing a pattern for non-stretch shorts and plan to make a couple for the upcoming summer, as well as some loose, 1930's-style pants.
On the subject of leaving the house in your actual pajamas, I'm sorry, but I CAN'T. It's not a comfort thing or an I-want-to-look-cute thing. I have cute/pretty pajamas because I realized I spend a fair amount of time in them and should be happy with the way I feel and look for the sake of my mental health. I like to look put-together, even in a casual setting. I can't really explain it other than to say "It's how I like to look."
THAT SAID, I don't extend those rules to others, because what others wear is none of my business (unless it puts me or third parties at risk.)
Full skirts with giant pockets are the BEST. I think my walking skirt pocket actually holds more than my purse . . .
I am glad you included mention of the Pre-Raphaelite aesthetic garments, themselves historical nods to classic Greek and Roman silhouettes. I am also reminded that some of the men of the literary world in the Tea-Gown era also affected this "Oriental" wear, in wearing paisley dressing gowns, fezzes, and even full Chinese like gowns while entertaining or lounging at home. I work in an office where members of the public also pay a municipal bill and often do so in their comfies and there is often commentary made on it. One only has to drop into the comments of any classic television offering on UA-cam to hear the Grandpas extol these television actresses who were clothed by the studio for being Real Women Who Cared How the World Saw Them. Wonderful video, thank you!
So true! Those circles may have produced some lovely art but they really were messes of Orientalism.
@@SnappyDragon they really were, appropriation AND colonialism!
Patriarchy smashing, comfortable nightgowns, history and you! Oh my Goddess! Thanks for making my day with another of your delightful illuminating posts! 😍
You're so welcome! 😊
I’ve always worn ‘crazy’ house dresses. I lived in Singapore for 3 years and was glad to pop one on when I’d finished a morning teaching. I was lucky there, I bought fabric, sketched what I wanted and nipped to the tailoress down the road, et voilà, another crazy creation. Read Samuel Pepy’s Diary - washing day. His wife and female servant got up at 3a.m on Monday to get started, sometimes a couple of neighbours would go over to help out.
And this is why I am, so, *so* glad that I do not have to deal with laundry day in the past!
The robe a la francaise evolved from the robe volante, but they’re super different. I’m not sure wealthier women (in the 18th century) would go out in a casual robe too often so as to avoid wearing the same things as people from the middling or lower classes.
The lower classes rarely wore a long gown anyways. They usually just wore a bed gown or short gown for everyday wear. For church or a special occasion they might wear a long gown.
I have a rainbow jumpsuit/onesie that is almost offensively bright and I love the 6 weeks or so of autumn and spring when the temperature's right to wear it outside. Fortunately, as a fat wheelchair user, I'm already removed from the category of 'woman' most of the time, so I can pretty much get away with wearing whatever I want to without getting any more dirty looks than if I make an effort to confirm to overcultural beauty norms; it sucks to be objectified as disabled and fat before anything else, but I'll be damned if I'm not going to milk it for all the rainbow wearing side benefits I can!
Thank you for always providing such wonderful commentary on intersectional issues! I grew up with a mom who abhorred sweats and pj pants in public, but who now wears leggings lol
I find it so funny that sweatpants = nope, not dressy enough, but leggings are 🤣
My favorite historical lounge wear has to be 1930's beach pajamas. They just look both cute and comfy. And the second favorite is 1910's harem pant suits. Actually made one for a presentation for a History class presentation. That thing was so comfy.
If you want to hear a funny thing about men and their funny, unwanted opinions, read up on Paul Poiret and his hobble skirt. The Pope literally told priests to not give absolutions to any woman wearing one. Women in hobble skirts saw women in the comfy harem pants and tried to chase them out of the park, but were obviously "hobbled" by their skirts to do much of anything. The 1910's were wild when it comes to fashion.
Looooove 1930s lounge styles! Give me all the wide-leg trousers, pls.
Oh my goodness, the 1910s 😵💫 I love hearing all the ridiculous stories because I don't actually like the clothes all that much. My interest in fashion evaporates around 1908 thanks to Poiret and the super-straight silhouette, blips back in the 30s for things like beach pajamas, and disappears entirely in 1960 😅
Had to leave a second comment. I too, suffer greatly from Fibromyalgia. Right now I'm wearing loose, soft pajama bottoms, a loose light tank, with a light flannel short robe. Furthermore, I plan to wear my comfy garments all day, and yes, I'll be going out in them to the post office!
I live in a poorer area of the UK, and lots of people go out with pyjamas on, though I wouldn't do it because getting dressed is sometimes the most fun thing in my day, it feels nice to look nice even when I'm at home- more for me than anyone else of course. But wearing pyjamas out is quite common in the 'rougher' areas of the UK
It's the same in the US.
Due to sensory issues and other stuff related to ADHD it really depends on the day what I feel like wearing and how much energy I have to look put together. However, due to my wardrobe being by now a fun hybrid of 1950's-1970's inspired stuff a lot of the time a low effort look is just throwing on a dress and some stockings. I get compliments and feel good while spending little energy on styling or figuring out if I can tolerate multiple layers of stuff that day. Some days its a shapeless frock to hide in, other times its a flattering gown but they all just require throwing on and then socks or stockings. I very much get the just go out in the robe movement, I'm sometimes tempted to just live in a thin wrapped gown that's just slightly to short to be proper.
People always act like wearing a dress is automatically more work, and it's usually less! I love having dressed that can just be thrown on and boom, instant fun outfit.
I always hated the addage that because you are dressed up or wearing makeup, you want attention. No, I felt crappy this morning and this pretty dress and winged eyeliner made me feel a little better!
So true! I used to feel more comfortable wearing my favorite makeup in my house than in public, because I didn't want to deal with people's assumptions about red lipstick. [sigh]
The articles by men about the Mother Hubbard wrapper was hilarious!!! The entirety of this video was *epic* Thank you! 😎😘
19th century newspapers are *so funny*. I kept getting distracted and cackling madly at the other things on the pages I was looking at
The entire time of this video I just could not stop thinking about if this is what "historically accurate" womens robes in Harry Potter is like. Now the only question left in my head is, what does "historically accurate mens robes look like?
I just came across your channel and it's freakin' amazing. I'm gonna have to go and watch it all from the beginning. It's so refreshing to see someone willing to discuss fashion and not be afraid to add the multiple layers of race, feminism, class, etc. After all, it's not like fashion was created in a vacuum.
I truly appreciate your authenticity, thoroughness, and sincerity, as well as your presentation style. Thank you for being you, and thank you for caring for yourself and resting when your body steals your spoons.
And finally, thank you for yet another engaging and entertaining educational video!
This was interesting! LM Montgomery has her main character complain about being seen wearing a Mother Hubbard while scrubbing the floor in Emily of New Moon, and I've always wondered what it was! Also, I love the artistic tea gowns with Watteau backs
I do love a good tea gown! Eventually I'll have to make one to round out my collection of Fancy Bathrobes.
And the fabulous Miss Cornelia who's introduced in Anne's House of Dreams shows up to call on Anne in a blue and brown rose-printed wrapper, completely comfortable doing so even though it's not considered appropriate visiting clothing.
Excellent video! I nearly shot my ice cream through my nose when you referred to Arts & Crafts Movement as 19th-century cottagecore. 😂 I devoted years of my life to academic pursuits regarding some of the offshoots outside England and I unashamedly confess it is one of my favorite design eras in spite of all the controversial philosophy behind it. (Some really did try, they were just, well, clueless.) One thing I do want to remark on is the "scandalous" bared breast. It really depends on who/when/where for an image. Some were meant to signal a likeness to the pure beauty of Greco-Roman goddesses, especially in the 18th century. Others are a comment on noblewoman X's maternal virtues---she is such a devoted mother that she breastfeeds her children herself instead of getting a wet nurse. And, yes, sometimes it was simply meant to be titillating (bad pun intended), especially when it is a portrait of someone high ranking male's mistress. So, like a lot of things in history, more complicated than at first glance. Keep rocking your awesomeness!
I promise to forewarn you to not be eating ice cream when I do an entire video about old cottagecore movements and their biases?
100% right on the bared breast thing-- IIRC a lot of Lely's portraits were of high-ranking mistresses? I don't personally find it all that "shocking", but UA-cam is a bit of a prude 🤣
@@SnappyDragon I know he was a court painter, but I'm not very familiar with his work. Most court painters wound up painting mistresses' portraits at some point. 😉
This was a lot to digest! Before the pandemic a had a medical need to stop wearing bras, but because they had been imposed on me for so long I felt uncomfortable going out in public without one. Winter was great, as I felt I was wearing enough layers no one could tell whether or not I was wearing a bra. I started wearing a light jacket in the summer instead of causing myself pain by putting on a bra. Coupled with the fact I was going out less, I got so used to not wearing one I can now go out in just a t-shirt and not care who notices! I have held on to a couple comfier bras "just in case" but haven't felt the need to reach for them at all 😊
Lolita fashion has a similar story to the history you shared as well, it was started in Japan by people wanting to break the standards being pushed on them by society. The difference is that instead of being comfy clothes it would more likely be considered "overdressing" which of course gets just as many comments as being underdressed.
I am so ready to leave society's standards behind and dress the way I want to please myself, and NO ONE ELSE! ❤
That fancy turquoise bathrobe looks amazing! I love it!
Thank you! Found it in an antique shop, it's from the late 40s or early 50s (I think).
This went a totally different direction than what I was expecting and I am here👏for👏it👏
surprise, social history time!
I have an android, so sadly the app isn't available for me yet, but I'm so excited about something like this existing. Being an extroverted, talkative, friendly person with chronic pain and chronic fatigue it is so isolating.
Yeah, I'm excited for when it comes out of beta and I can have it on my phone!
The flipside of this is that you can also dress up just for yourself/to make yourself feel good! I'm sitting around at home today but I ironed a shirt because I like wearing all my shirts. I didn't do it to be presentable to society.
Obligatory comment about bras. My work uniform was changed last year and the new shirt was...considerably more seethrough (I guess they probably didn't survey anyone other than cis men when it came to their comfort in wearing a slightly more seethrough shirt :/ a lot of my cis male colleagues weren't into it either!) I had to buy a whole bunch of beige "fake bras" (crop tops or whatever you want to call them) because I could no longer wear anything in any other colour or it would be visible through the shirt. Which also raises the question of why I wear bras. I do get some nipple chafing sometimes, but I'm small on top so I have significantly less need for bras than a lot of other people with breasts. So yes, it's probably about 50% nipple chafing and 50% Extremely Strong Desire To Not Have People Staring At Or Not Making Comments About My Breasts. Because it's not socially acceptable to see a woman (or someone perceived as a woman's) nipples through their shirt, whereas it's not even considered an issue for cis men to have nipples visible through their shirts, so much so that I doubt many people would even think about it.
What an oversight by your workplace! 😡
I wear mostly leggings cause it's easier for me to put on stretchy bottoms with my chronic joint pain but I love the idea of a dressing gown to wear.
Can I ask where you got the little bed tray/table you have? It looks perfect for when I'm stuck in bed.
The table is from Amazon (not my favorite company but when leaving the house is hard, you do what you gotta do)
Mantua Makers - the CONCISE version! Thank you!
I just finished sewing myself a pirate/poet shirt from an old sheet that my dog chewed a hole in and honestly it's the most comfortable thing I own now. I'm going to the mall today in it and it's amazing
I'm currently preparing my new apartment for moving day in a few weeks. So I go from my old (still lived in) apt to the hardware store in sweatpants buy a toilet seat and back to my new place. I also have the audacity to install said toilet seat while wearing my sweatpants. And everything while having XX chromosomes! The city I live in is not very fancy but I still get the side-eye from strangers I've never met.; occasional even the astonished "You are a woman? Or one of those other genders?!?" facepalm moment of my life thank you very much I just try to live my life and run my errands of buying toilet seats and light fixtures.
[gasp] how shocking!!!
I can still hear my grandmother tell me to change as we were going to town. She always told me I didn’t want to look like a rag-a-muffin. I found myself saying that to my grandson. He of course asked what that was and I couldn’t tell him. I only know I wasn’t supposed to look like one. It’s has just occurred to me that this may be a rude cured and socially unacceptable comment that I have no understanding of. I always took it as not being presentable. I’m sorry if it’s an unacceptable comment I didn’t mean any offence. Anyway the point is that I have only just started to wear sweats out in public my grandmother would have been horrified! But then she was horrified that people were calling serviettes napkins! Napkins were feminine hygiene products and serviettes were for the table! There were a lot of lectures about this. Along with talks about inappropriate commercials on tv! The 60’s and 70’s were very hard on her. My other grandmother didn’t lecture about conformity but continued to dye her hair and powder her face till the day she died. Her father broke her out of a residential school in the early 1900’s she continued to hide or at minimum try to look more “white” her entire life. She dyed her hair brown which I was often told was a nice respectable colour! I was encouraged to do that too. I refused then as I refuse to colour my grey hair now! I earned every one of these grey hairs! Well isn’t funny I can say that but not wear pjs in public!
Sorry for the long rambling message. Apparently there’s a lot to unpack from my childhood that I now see in a different light!
Thank you for sharing this!
What a great video. I really appreciate this channel. I love the way SnappyDragon puts such care into providing historical context (without ignoring the role of colonialism), love learning the way people in the past dealt with many of the same things we deal with now, love learning about fashion history from someone I can trust to not leave out the working class when talking about "what people wore". I also now want to have all of the cute comfy historical dresses/robes/wraps described in this video (except ideally without the culturally appropriative orientalist influences, although I know that's always going to be a part of the history of some of these garments) because they look super cute and comfy
Aww, thank you so much! Highly recommend incorporating historical loungewear into one's daily life. I till start my day in the 18thC wrapper I made in 2020 and it's the best!
Not only do I enjoy learning about historical fashion on your channel, but I genuinely enjoy the comments section, too! Thank you for this fun community where we get to learn things ❤️
Thank you! I make sure to keep this as nice of a place as possible because I want y'all to be able to hang out here.
I wear knit dresses to sleep in… I also wear them outside, I don’t care what you think if you see me hair in bonnet, doing yard work. Or at the grocery store wearing the same. I’m comfortable and I hope you are too.
So true!
My current favorite lounge wear is an outfit I made myself from cotton double gauze. The tunic is pale green trimmed in cream cotton lace and the gathered poofy pants are dark gray with rainbow stripes. And yes, the pants have generous pockets.
I like the cat PJs.
The wrapper gown/Mother Hubbard style was introduced to Yup'ik and Inupiaq communities along with Euro-American shirts and pants by Christian missionaries. I'm sure in the missionaries' minds this was entirely altruistic, but they also thought we were what i could only describe as "huge sluts" because we didn't really have a nudity taboo, especially in our own homes. "Why would tundra dwelling people be nude or close to nude in their own homes?" you may be asking. Traditional Inupiaq and Yup'ik houses were build to be so well insulated that a single oil lamp could keep them warm. Traditional fur clothes were also meant to keep you incredibly warm. So wearing the warm clothes in a warm house could be a bit stifling.
So having gotten used to these casual gowns so moms could be by the heat source of a house meant to hold onto heat so her own kids didn't have to see her boobies, they would make their own version. This version followed the silhouette and length of the traditional parka rather than one dictated by Euro-American fashion and often had a hood. As fabric became more and more accessible, it would also become standard to have large pockets on the center front. This was the woman's version of a garment called a kuspuk and may have taken equal inspiration from gut parkas worn as waterproof over layers or flour sack parkas worn in warmer weather and made of materials obtained through trading (though i'm not sure how old those are in comparison to the kuspuks we know today so they could have been made at about the same time). Men's kuspuks were similar though often had less trim, simpler prints, and were more shirt length than dress length. They would be worn as smocks over the fur parka or on their own in the warmer seasons. They are now considered an icon of Alaska Natives in general and are sometimes worn by non-Natives to honor and pay homage to their Native neighbors. Perhaps most importantly, quilting cotton and thread can be bought at any craft store, and fairly cheaply. So even those of us who don't live in the villages and aren't able to hunt or send anyone to hunt for us to provide skins can still make regalia.
Thank you for sharing this! It seems like this is a similar pattern as what happened with the holoku in the Pacific Islands; I read several times that the Indigenous folks adopted and modified the style to fit their own tastes and values and now it's considered traditional or national dress.
I love to dress "super fem" with dresses and my hair braided into pretty styles and wear perfume and jewelry, I am a poultry farmer and when I am at work (usually from morning til evening) I wear my work outfit: big brown or black cargo pants with a billion pockets, no bra and a loose T shirt
And when people see me out of my "work outfit" they always go out of their way to tell me how I should dress like this all the time because it makes me look pretty and not so rough, I answer how the heck is a floral dress covered in bird shit and dirt a fem look?? (not to mention my birds would steal all my precious jewelry)
as for home alone relaxing time I'm often just nude and If I have to cover up I put on a giant maxi dress and I am good to go
I am a huge fan of leggings and a knit tunic. I also own a pair of black velvet elastic waist pants that I have worn for evening. Then again one of the great joys of being a gray haired little old lady is not caring what other people think of my attire.
It's a great look! (both leggings and a knit tunic and silver hair. i'm so hoping I go solid silver one day!)
YES V!! OMG I LOVE THIS!! Perfect timing for figuring out what to wear for another Zoom Pesach.
Cozy clothes for the win.
Chag pesach kasher v'sameach V!
💖
Thank you! 💚 I'm actually having people over for real this year (rapid tests for all! 🎉) and I have a super comfy fluffy cotton dress in mind. When better to wear fancy loungewear then a dinner when you are literally commanded to recline on cushions?
@@SnappyDragon Gahh that's super exciting!! We moved recently so no close friends or family nearby for in person seder, so zoom it is for us! Only means I have to get half dressed lol.
I'm not sure if I invert or play these standards straight! I buy nice pretty clothes that are comfortable enough for me to sleep in, and often wear 'outside clothes' as pajamas! Right now, I'm in bed in a blouse and pants that I could also wear to a church function or an interview... because the cuts and fabric are just that comfortable.
At a certain point, who cares? They are your clothes, they make you happy. But I do so love finding that sweet spot where something both looks fancy and feels super comfy.
@@SnappyDragon YES!!!
I can relate so much Re chronic pain as an introvert (with anxiety too). Sometimes I feel like I’m sinking into a void. But your energy, humor, and brilliance always make me smile 😀
Also, contrary to popular belief, skirts are actually more comfortable to wear in the winter than in the summer. First, because you can wear leggings under it without risk of over heating, protecting the legs from chub rub (I am only slightly overweight, but I accumulate most of my body fat in my inner thighs), with the second layer of fabric, the skirt providing ventilation and heat conservation.
My best guess why skirts were so prevalent in Europe was a mixture of hygienic and heat-conservation reasons. One, pants and panties worn by us ladies would require a lot of washing because of our privy fluids that flow near constantly, thus requiring anything that touches the crotch to be washed regularly. By wearing multiple layers of petticoat, it means minimizing the amount of time the crotch touches fabric, which would allow to space out washings. Second, skirts just circulate air better than pants, especially tight ones.
My favorite lounge wear at the moment are my "Paca-llama Jamas." I have two pairs of them made in soft, stretchy, microfiber fabric. They, of course, have cute depictions of alpacas and/or llamas on them. (My husband named them, by the way; he approves of me being comfortable.) I have worn them to the store. Close kin are my "Pacchyderma Pants," made of the same fabric, but leggings style, which feature elephants. (We get quite a chuckle over these punny names.) I wear those out all the time.
Best garment names! I gotta up my pajama pant print game.
My wardrobe now consists of Jersey bra tops (to stop painful wobble and excessive sweat underneath rather than social conformity) stretchy pants, stretch or roomy tops or dresses. All that are literally a print or fabric choice away from nightwear and I am sooooo much more comfortable! Thank you for the historical content and highlighting the crap women put up with then and still do today. It's not just from men though. Women have been brain washed to be judgmental about dress and appearance so I love your call to "leave her alone" sadly this message won't hit everyone. I now feel inspired to do a bit of craft based message graffiti around town! Thank you for giving me a mission x
I started buying exclusively maternity dresses and tops because trying to acquire two full wardrobes requires too much money and space, but we know we want more children. To be clear we have the money, spending on my self just makes me too anxious. I have been very happy to be comfy and cute basically all the time.
That makes a lot of sense!
I had a hard time finding maternity dresses near me. What is up with that?
@@mjbe Target has one or two cute dresses each season, which is fine if your building over time, but not great if you’re trying to do it all at once.
@@megankuchta9145 Target near me doesn't have a maternity section, but if I get pregnant again I may take a shopping trip to a bigger town.
I knew about Mother Hubbards from reading "Emily Climbs" by L. M. Montgomery ("Anne of Green Gables" author) but I never realized its history. I love this video!
Oh yay! I love filling in those gaps for people 😊
your videos are a delight, V, and your descriptions draw me in to a topic that I would not have expected to be so interesting.
Rubs her eyes of pandemic induced stupor, takes a look towards the dresser.. "ahh, yes, the reason I have not worn anything but pajamas/lounge wear for the last 2 years is to smash the patriarchy... Yeah.. that's it."
😆💚
Why not both? 🤣
As always, you are a joy to watch and learn from. Thank you for sharing this with us.
V, your meticulous attention to how you analyze and speak to the issue is amazing. Thank you for being so careful!
I do my best! The nice thing about working from a script is that I can spend as long as I like flipping through a thesaurus 🤣
I go out so rarely, that i put on nice clothes every time. So i can wear all those nice things that i sew for myself. ^^" But i sew things that are comfy and looking nice soooo...
I do love when you can check both boxes with one garment!
@@SnappyDragon life goals!!
My lounge wear is my slightly old, slightly worn and faded Victorian walking skirt, and any random tank top. I wear this combo to work regularly. But usually not on days when dressing up would be beneficial to my tips. Lol.
Iv been dealing with another UTI, so currently rocking the lounge wear! Until I feel better and more like an actual person! 😓
I only knew of the term Mother Hubbard from some old novel, referring to a woman, someone's mother or aunt, as 'pulling out her Mother Hubbards to wear' the younger character, a girl, was mortified at the unfashionableness and couldn't understand why the older woman was doing so, but later figured out the cycle of wearing them, or not, seemed to have something to do with the timing of children born to the woman. So I always thought they WERE maternity clothes of the era.
personally I'm old enough to remember my mother telling me never to go out in hair curlers back when washing and setting your hair once a week was a thing. though I also remember her talking about in her teenaged years going out with just other girls to a matinee while their hair was up in curlers all day in preparation for a big dance, like homecoming or prom. They wouldn't normally do it, going to the grocery or anywhere like that in curlers was absolutely tacky. but in the way of teenagers, somehow the usual tacky thing was cool in this specific context.
I am sitting here after watching your video and I love all of your videos I’ve seen so far i’m trying to get my self motivated to do some sewing for work while dealing with several of my disabilities including migraines including one that’s not responding to my medicine right now. Before my health deteriorated I would dress up for just about anything when leaving the house. Now I spend most of my time in pajamas and or leggings and very comfortable tops if I need to head out of the house. Except for those times when I decide to wear a corset to help with back pain while sewing. Oh and thank you for sharing information about Quit, because I too am a very social extroverted person Who is stuck at home most of the time because of my health.
It's so tricky to balance needing comfy staying-in-bed clothes with the mood boost of dressing up!
@@SnappyDragon Luckily this weekend I get to dress up and help a friend at her booth at a local Faerie Festival and I think that the work required of me will be reasonably within my limits due to my health.