Good call getting a pro in for the mini-split install. I installed a mini-split in my guest house when I build it, and I should have called a pro. A lot of them come precharged, so even if you were able to braze additional line to reach the ground and vacuum out the lines, you would now not have enough refrigerant anymore in the precharge, requiring a service call anyways. Just easier to let them handle those kind of issues from the start.
Yeah it worked out well having somone else finish the installation. I think if I had done more reaserch into the line sets we would have been alright. But with the contractor we were able to move it down to the ground and we didn't have to worry about the vacuum and freon! Thanks for watching!
I would love to do geothermal but it would have been too expensive for us. With the amount of rock we have out here just the excavation for the loops would have been two or three times our cost for this system. Maybe for the next house!
I don't think a geothermal system would necessarily be more efficient for them, even if it wasn't cost prohibitive to excavate for ground loops. Mini-split systems with variable refrigerant flow and inverter compressors have come a long way in efficiency. Flagstaff has a design temp of 8F (99% of all hours of an average year are >= 8F), and the average yearly temp is around 45F. Their heat pump should have an operating COP of around 3.2 at design temp and around 4.0 at average temp (source: www.greecomfort.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/GREE_MULTI21_C_SUBMITTAL_24MBH_090319.pdf - not sure if this is the exact model they have). A ground source heat pump might be around 4.0 year-round (for heating), so there would be no difference in energy consumption for most of the year and slightly less energy in the peak heating / cooling seasons, the equipment would cost more, it would likely require ductwork (I don't know of any ductless models), and they would need to dig and lay ground loops. Ground source starts to make more sense in even colder climates, where the COP of heat pumps starts to decline rapidly below ~0F, but some 'cold climate' heat pumps can operate efficiently down to the negative teens fahrenheit. One downside to air source though is that output heat drops with efficiency (as input power is fixed and output power varies with COP), so the output of the heat pump goes down as outdoor temperature goes down while the heat load of the building goes up as outdoor temperature goes down, so at some point the heat pump can't handle the load even if it can operate efficiently. At some point it's cheaper to use electric heaters for a few nights a year instead of oversizing the system to handle them.
@@apalrd8588 I went to NAU way back when. I understand the use of averages for system sizing, but I've been through some really cold winters in Flagstaff. Definitely need backup sources of heat. I think geothermal is still the way to go if you have the land and are not dealing with too much rock.
@@PootsPastures thanks. I have an older MULTI that is twice the size of yours and weighs a ton. Plus your SEER rating is much higher. You found a good deal.
Happy New Year!
Happy new year!!
Good call getting a pro in for the mini-split install. I installed a mini-split in my guest house when I build it, and I should have called a pro. A lot of them come precharged, so even if you were able to braze additional line to reach the ground and vacuum out the lines, you would now not have enough refrigerant anymore in the precharge, requiring a service call anyways. Just easier to let them handle those kind of issues from the start.
Yeah it worked out well having somone else finish the installation. I think if I had done more reaserch into the line sets we would have been alright. But with the contractor we were able to move it down to the ground and we didn't have to worry about the vacuum and freon! Thanks for watching!
It’s just a water heater😁 Not a hot water heater
Haha I know I know! I think about that every time but just can't stop saying Hot Water Heater!
All the best for 2021
Thank you! We've got some big plans coming up. Happy new year!
what was cost of installation by contractor?
We paid $800 for the installation.
Did you consider geothermal heat pump with ground loops? I am very tempted to do something like that for my cabin build.
I would love to do geothermal but it would have been too expensive for us. With the amount of rock we have out here just the excavation for the loops would have been two or three times our cost for this system. Maybe for the next house!
I don't think a geothermal system would necessarily be more efficient for them, even if it wasn't cost prohibitive to excavate for ground loops. Mini-split systems with variable refrigerant flow and inverter compressors have come a long way in efficiency.
Flagstaff has a design temp of 8F (99% of all hours of an average year are >= 8F), and the average yearly temp is around 45F. Their heat pump should have an operating COP of around 3.2 at design temp and around 4.0 at average temp (source: www.greecomfort.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/09/GREE_MULTI21_C_SUBMITTAL_24MBH_090319.pdf - not sure if this is the exact model they have).
A ground source heat pump might be around 4.0 year-round (for heating), so there would be no difference in energy consumption for most of the year and slightly less energy in the peak heating / cooling seasons, the equipment would cost more, it would likely require ductwork (I don't know of any ductless models), and they would need to dig and lay ground loops.
Ground source starts to make more sense in even colder climates, where the COP of heat pumps starts to decline rapidly below ~0F, but some 'cold climate' heat pumps can operate efficiently down to the negative teens fahrenheit.
One downside to air source though is that output heat drops with efficiency (as input power is fixed and output power varies with COP), so the output of the heat pump goes down as outdoor temperature goes down while the heat load of the building goes up as outdoor temperature goes down, so at some point the heat pump can't handle the load even if it can operate efficiently. At some point it's cheaper to use electric heaters for a few nights a year instead of oversizing the system to handle them.
@@apalrd8588 I went to NAU way back when. I understand the use of averages for system sizing, but I've been through some really cold winters in Flagstaff. Definitely need backup sources of heat. I think geothermal is still the way to go if you have the land and are not dealing with too much rock.
Not sure if you mentioned it before, but what model # is that Gree unit? Thanks.
I put a link to the product in the description for ya! Thanks for watching and let me know if you have any other questions!!
@@PootsPastures thanks. I have an older MULTI that is twice the size of yours and weighs a ton. Plus your SEER rating is much higher. You found a good deal.