Sometimes geniuses are not good at describing the elements that go into what they do, but thankfully Thile is also a great communicator, and a humanist that avoids pretention. Thanks for this, Chris.
Not a parody at all! To a self-taught mandolin player this is incredibly useful. The simple act of relaxing my picking hand and loosening the wrist has made my playing improve. They are the sort of fundamental things no-one tells you about in most online tutorials...
I don't play the mandolin but the guitar, but this is equally applicable to guitar playing in my book, at least regarding relaxation and loose pick grip. I also experience a better tone with more treble with a loose grip thanks to the increased friction against the string.
Thanks for sharing your tips. I have just started out playing with/on the mandolin, and your advice is helpful. I feel also privileged to have witnessed your employment of what must be a remotely operated robot camera. In earnest, since you focus on a small thing like that pick, the camera should, too, otherwise I as the viewer am left with a somewhat vague idea of how to grip and hold the pick.
Many thanks for this. I have been trying forever to get someone to explain right hand technique. Never did subscribe to the 'whatever works for you' theory. Please pass on my thanks to Chris for a wonderful tutorial.
One thing he doesn't mention (but is doing) is the putting the pick to the string at an angle. I played for a long time with the pick hitting the strings straight on, not realizing that an angle will help getting through both strings easier. The raised head of the mando with his forearm and pick parallel to the floor create this angle.
I like the fact that this doesn't just zoom in on the hands but provides a whole body view, highlighting the importance of considering larger muscle groups.
9:20 “Hey, Allen! How are ya? ... Good, good-and I’m well thanks! Hey, you have any plans tonight? ... I was wondering if maybe you wanted to come over? Maybe have a few beers, and you can hold my pinky down for me?”
You and Mike Marshall were very inspiring to see at Saint Louis' fine venue, the Sheldon. Wow. I am self-taught, though I have taken lessons, and continue to play my old Martin every day. I really liked how both of you teach people the important basics, and continue to endorse our favorite instrument.
And I thought viola/violin bow technique was difficult after 40+ years of study. Switching to picking is a whole different animal, especially on a flat bridge. I struggle to get a bearing on what string I’m playing on a flat bridge. A lot of what you are teaching here is completely applicable to violin/viola.
More people need to apply these basics, but there are a few that will not...the proof is in the performance. Listening is an art. Following advice of a virtuoso is hardly foolish.
I don't play the mandolin but the guitar, but this is equally applicable to guitar playing in my book, at least regarding relaxation and loose pick grip. I also experience a better tone with more treble with a loose grip thanks to the increased friction against the string.
The important point for me here is to remember not try to drag the pick up with the thumb on upstrokes. Consciously use the index finger, supported by the middle finger and anularis (ring finger).
A super mandolinist I hot some tips from, Misha Sheynkman, told me to keep my fingers close to the fretboard just as Chris is doing. None of that fingers in the air stuff.
Not such a parody IMO. I think it's really useful. I listen to this on my coffee breaks at work as a kind of reminder to my sub-conscience. Keeps me up to scratch :)
Great tutorial :) What I felt is video is not close enough to understand what you're saying for the new bees. Close up shot of the camera matters a lot!! Lots of love from INDIA :D
What EVERYONE always misses out is the direction the pick is pointing. Sure you can drop it in your hand comfortably but if it is turned too far in the wrong direction you have to turn your whole hand and arm to make it line up right, which will feel wrong, so you will be forced into bad habits. Is point tip on the fingertip? is it between the thumb and finger? is it supported by the knuckle? or the side of the finger tip? or the underside? is it supported by the thumb pad? the thumb joint? the thumb tip? nobody EVER talks about this stuff, it could be anywhere, and that's why people find it so hard, especially when it is not their dominant hand. .
Regarding left hand position, it looks like you use something resembling a classical violin position, except that the thumb it positioned a little bit more to the back of the neck than to the side compared to a violinist. Is that right?.
What can I do? My forth (little) finger is really short, i.e. it reaches only to the second phalanges of the third finger. Should I try to aviod playing with the forth finger (practise playing with 3 fingers) or just live with a shorter forth finger and work it out referring at least its strength? THe 7th fret is not easy for me to reach.
Doesn't sound like your little finger is that unusual. Everyone has moments where they think there is something wrong with their hands that will prevent them from playing, but unless you have a major deformity it's usually not true. Practice using your little finger as much as you comfortably can, and practice stretching. Learn a four finger G chord and then go up the neck where the frets get closer together until you find a spot where you can achieve the chord comfortably. Gradually work your way down the neck over time, so that you are increasingly stretching your fingers as the frets get farther apart. Combine this with four finger scales,up the neck at first, then work your way down. Over time two things will happen, your handspan will increase, and you will learn wrist/hand angles that better allow you to reach farther on the fretboard. There is no shortcut for this, and it can't be rushed. It can only be achieved through dedicated practice and patience. Hope that helps.
I love Thile's playing for sure. And I'm also sure there was a lot of useful information here. I just couldn't get past the 3:49 mark. Way too hard to watch. Chris is a very quirky guy that gets sidetracked easily. Choppy flow. How the info is taught is as important as the info itself IMO. Fantastic player nonetheless.
True, but if there's gold in an area it's worth the dig. Gotta put in some effort for this free gold we have here. That effort is is simply listening and being patient.
A tiny bit more patience and you probably would have made it through the video just fine with some basic but very good information that isn't always easy to convey.
I mean this in a good way, but if you can’t focus on something for even 4 minutes, then maybe you and Chris both share some sidetrack issues... :) I have ADHD but this guy’s lesson was worth the 3 times I had to watch it. (My fault, not his..l) I now keep the link and review often. Give it a go. The guy is a genius and although he loses track a tad at the 3 min part, he gets right back in it by 5:00. It’s not often we get a free lesson from a guy like this :)
marbelizer1 LOL so true...but that buckle rash will someday part of what made it “Thile’s Loar”, sort of like Monroe’s with the carved out Gibson inlay and other examples of his possession. I guess when he’s so unlikely to ever part with that instrument buckle rash just makes it his own. But man the smallest nick in my instruments makes me crazy...
This is an old comment and I don't know where you are in your musical journey, but I would advise you to look up Sierra Hull and Johnny Hiland. Sierra has very small, thin hands, whereas Johnny has massive meaty paws. Both would seemingly put a player at a disadvantage, but both are masters of their instruments. As a music instructor, I can tell you that hand anatomy is often cited as a concern by most players starting out. In reality, unless you have a major deformity, your hands aren't likely to limit your potential in music.
@@TheRamsberg Very good point. Django has always been a favorite of mine, and his mastery of the guitar was so complete that I honestly forget that he didn't have a fully functional left hand.
First let me say that I am not a musician, but with a good stunt double and creative camera work, I know I could play one in a movie. At first I thought this was only humor, and pretty good stuff at that. Kinda like early Andy Kaufman. Then I realized that Chris was actually giving some really great advice to novices, such as I if I'd actually take up playing an instrument. Regardless, Chris is great, and I love Nickel Creek!
I left a pick on the corner of a high cupboard - by some incomprehensible mean some liquid dripped on to it from no possible place...but it was a disgusting brown sticky substance...much like discolored soft drink. I suddenly realized how benificial thid was to retaining a very loose relaxed but stabilized and aligned plectrum. 😄
Hey the best musicians were always pretty high or drunk I've played my best music on drugs and alcohol (LSD had the coolest and craziest effect on my music back when I did things like that) and alcohol made me good at singing the blues and folk I can belt out my notes in just a different way, now I just smoke weed and it just makes music sound more full I hear a shit load of over and under tones I used to not notice as much before I started smoking weed and when ever I stopped I couldn't hear em' and it definitely effects the way I play when I improvise.
But does your audience hear the same thing you're hearing? We've all been to a bar where a drunk want's to get onstage and play. Doesn't mean they can when they're fucked up. Not being critical but that's how your mind processes things under the influence. Been there done that.
I can't speak for people with that IQ level, but somehow I don't think that's true. When you are that intelligent you tend to notice things other people don't. Even the simplest things are, in reality, filled with rich complexity. I don't consider myself as particularly "smart," but I am naturally very curious and that is something that I notice about the world. Very little is actually boring.
Why not show IN A CLOSE-UP SO WE CAN EASILY SEE IT AND DON'T HAVE TO GUESS, the exact position of the pick where it contacts each of the two fingers? Is the index finger bent? If so, how much? How much of the index finger is in contact with the pick, and where on the finger, exactly, is the contact? What's the shape (outline) of Chris' pick and how is the pick itself oriented with respect to the fingers? Where on the perimeter of the pick does it hit the strings? At a (or the) point? Next to a point? Does it matter? Then draw the camera back and show the rest. Sorry to yell (caps) , but this is all so obviously needed, yet not provided. Frustrating.
How to avoid musculoskeletal disorders, by a master mandolin player. Pay attention and you'll never need a masseuse. Unless you date one of course 😉. Thanks Chris, now I know how to say your last name.
HIs thumb is long enough to give him that angle!! NO FAIR! My thumb is not quite so long to hang over the other fingers like that. Frustrating. My brain is ready... relative finger lengths are not.
Ian Huffer - huh? Not reading any arrogance in his demeanour or lesson at all. Some eccentricity and definite nerves - and attempts at humor to overcome them, but he seems v down-to-earth here and in all other videos I’ve seen him in...
@@Shelsight I don't know what I saw in his demeanor three years ago, but I don't see it now. Him being a bit uncomfortable seems more likely now that you mention it- I definitely confused the two. Love his stuff, and he's definitely a down to earth dude
I found this to be all TALK and no SHOW. I could not understand any real and useful information to help. He did not help a beginner player. So, as a communicator, he took forever to communicate how to hold and perform the movement of a pick.
Sometimes geniuses are not good at describing the elements that go into what they do, but thankfully Thile is also a great communicator, and a humanist that avoids pretention. Thanks for this, Chris.
Not a parody at all! To a self-taught mandolin player this is incredibly useful. The simple act of relaxing my picking hand and loosening the wrist has made my playing improve. They are the sort of fundamental things no-one tells you about in most online tutorials...
I don't play the mandolin but the guitar, but this is equally applicable to guitar playing in my book, at least regarding relaxation and loose pick grip. I also experience a better tone with more treble with a loose grip thanks to the increased friction against the string.
He's got an instructional DVD he made when he was like 14 and it's also amazingly helpful haha
This video is golden for us mandolin players, thanks Chris and Sheldon!
"I feel like i'm doing a parody of a tutorial" hahahaha
I wonder if he ever really got over it?
Those pants are stunning. It doesn't hurt that they are donned by one of the finest musicians in the world. Thank you for sharing your technique.
Thanks for sharing your tips. I have just started out playing with/on the mandolin, and your advice is helpful. I feel also privileged to have witnessed your employment of what must be a remotely operated robot camera. In earnest, since you focus on a small thing like that pick, the camera should, too, otherwise I as the viewer am left with a somewhat vague idea of how to grip and hold the pick.
Many thanks for this. I have been trying forever to get someone to explain right hand technique. Never did subscribe to the 'whatever works for you' theory. Please pass on my thanks to Chris for a wonderful tutorial.
One thing he doesn't mention (but is doing) is the putting the pick to the string at an angle. I played for a long time with the pick hitting the strings straight on, not realizing that an angle will help getting through both strings easier. The raised head of the mando with his forearm and pick parallel to the floor create this angle.
Great point, and thank you for that clarification.
I like the fact that this doesn't just zoom in on the hands but provides a whole body view, highlighting the importance of considering larger muscle groups.
This really helped me master the leg-placement component of my pick grip.
I liked this lesson in music thile. There are many thiles about how to hold the pick.
So enjoyable.! His attempt to explain his mastery results in some great humor-
9:20
“Hey, Allen! How are ya? ... Good, good-and I’m well thanks! Hey, you have any plans tonight? ... I was wondering if maybe you wanted to come over? Maybe have a few beers, and you can hold my pinky down for me?”
😂
I don’t even need to watch this video but his voice and demeanor are just plain therapeutic
Love the pointers on the "up-stroke"! Thanks for sharing.
You and Mike Marshall were very inspiring to see at Saint Louis' fine venue, the Sheldon. Wow. I am self-taught, though I have taken lessons, and continue to play my old Martin every day. I really liked how both of you teach people the important basics, and continue to endorse our favorite instrument.
And I thought viola/violin bow technique was difficult after 40+ years of study. Switching to picking is a whole different animal, especially on a flat bridge. I struggle to get a bearing on what string I’m playing on a flat bridge. A lot of what you are teaching here is completely applicable to violin/viola.
I love Chris's instructional videos!
More people need to apply these basics, but there are a few that will not...the proof is in the performance. Listening is an art. Following advice of a virtuoso is hardly foolish.
Thank you for every little bit, Maestro!
He’s a great instructor. I’d take lessons from him any day
Absolutely the best advice on the topic for (flatpicking) guitarists too.
Awesome lesson from one of the best mandolin players of all time!
Crisp Clear Concise instruction It's all here. Thank you!
"Ideally you just practice things with these two fingers"
It's one of my life's ambitions to alarm a masseuse.
I did that today
I do every time I roll back on to my stomach
Lol it ain't hard do let me tell you
Pure gold. Thanks so much!
Thank you for uploading this!
Merci Beaucoup. That helped me not to massacre any more the strings of my mandolin
I don't play the mandolin but the guitar, but this is equally applicable to guitar playing in my book, at least regarding relaxation and loose pick grip. I also experience a better tone with more treble with a loose grip thanks to the increased friction against the string.
Thank you Chris. Sound advice.
Literally
Very useful and thanks for breaking it down to understandable simplicity
Thank You for sharing invaluable details of your extremely respected insight,
God Bless you Chris
The important point for me here is to remember not try to drag the pick up with the thumb on upstrokes. Consciously use the index finger, supported by the middle finger and anularis (ring finger).
A super mandolinist I hot some tips from, Misha Sheynkman, told me to keep my fingers close to the fretboard just as Chris is doing. None of that fingers in the air stuff.
0:15 “also a plucked instrument”? So if I play the dead chicken I should be ok?
Not such a parody IMO.
I think it's really useful.
I listen to this on my coffee breaks at work as a kind of reminder to my sub-conscience.
Keeps me up to scratch :)
He’s so weird😂 such a genius though and his playing is heavenly
Yo keeping that pinky is the hardest thing to keep down, I'm gonna keep working on that 🤟🏻
Great tutorial :)
What I felt is video is not close enough to understand what you're saying for the new bees. Close up shot of the camera matters a lot!!
Lots of love from INDIA :D
What EVERYONE always misses out is the direction the pick is pointing. Sure you can drop it in your hand comfortably but if it is turned too far in the wrong direction you have to turn your whole hand and arm to make it line up right, which will feel wrong, so you will be forced into bad habits. Is point tip on the fingertip? is it between the thumb and finger? is it supported by the knuckle? or the side of the finger tip? or the underside? is it supported by the thumb pad? the thumb joint? the thumb tip? nobody EVER talks about this stuff, it could be anywhere, and that's why people find it so hard, especially when it is not their dominant hand. .
I would love for one of these guys to explain what it’s supposed to FEEL like.
My pick keeps getting stuck in the strings. Looks like I am too tense and trying to force it and need to be more relaxed...Good lesson. Thank you.
This is ridiculous and still a good lesson
this lesson is awesome!
Is that a painting behind him or a real room? Looks like a stage set backdrop. (Yes, of course this is important. Why would you ask?)
Judging by the acoustics, it’s definitely real
Regarding left hand position, it looks like you use something resembling a classical violin position, except that the thumb it positioned a little bit more to the back of the neck than to the side compared to a violinist. Is that right?.
Acts like a magician, great
Excellent lesson, thanks!
Pick-hold-o. 😊 An ancient wind instrument.
What can I do? My forth (little) finger is really short, i.e. it reaches only to the second phalanges of the third finger. Should I try to aviod playing with the forth finger (practise playing with 3 fingers) or just live with a shorter forth finger and work it out referring at least its strength? THe 7th fret is not easy for me to reach.
Doesn't sound like your little finger is that unusual. Everyone has moments where they think there is something wrong with their hands that will prevent them from playing, but unless you have a major deformity it's usually not true. Practice using your little finger as much as you comfortably can, and practice stretching. Learn a four finger G chord and then go up the neck where the frets get closer together until you find a spot where you can achieve the chord comfortably. Gradually work your way down the neck over time, so that you are increasingly stretching your fingers as the frets get farther apart. Combine this with four finger scales,up the neck at first, then work your way down. Over time two things will happen, your handspan will increase, and you will learn wrist/hand angles that better allow you to reach farther on the fretboard. There is no shortcut for this, and it can't be rushed. It can only be achieved through dedicated practice and patience. Hope that helps.
Depth and angle??? A beginner who needs to refresh the basics before they become bad habits. Thank You!
Thanks 😊... Good advice
I love Thile's playing for sure. And I'm also sure there was a lot of useful information here. I just couldn't get past the 3:49 mark. Way too hard to watch. Chris is a very quirky guy that gets sidetracked easily. Choppy flow. How the info is taught is as important as the info itself IMO. Fantastic player nonetheless.
True, but if there's gold in an area it's worth the dig. Gotta put in some effort for this free gold we have here. That effort is is simply listening and being patient.
A tiny bit more patience and you probably would have made it through the video just fine with some basic but very good information that isn't always easy to convey.
I mean this in a good way, but if you can’t focus on something for even 4 minutes, then maybe you and Chris both share some sidetrack issues... :) I have ADHD but this guy’s lesson was worth the 3 times I had to watch it. (My fault, not his..l)
I now keep the link and review often. Give it a go. The guy is a genius and although he loses track a tad at the 3 min part, he gets right back in it by 5:00. It’s not often we get a free lesson from a guy like this :)
However you hold your pick, don't EVER wear a belt buckle like that while you are playing your sweet old Lloyd Loar signed F-5. Great lesson.
marbelizer1 LOL so true...but that buckle rash will someday part of what made it “Thile’s Loar”, sort of like Monroe’s with the carved out Gibson inlay and other examples of his possession. I guess when he’s so unlikely to ever part with that instrument buckle rash just makes it his own. But man the smallest nick in my instruments makes me crazy...
He's using a ToneGuard on the back of the instrument so I would suggest that the buckle would not get to harm it.
It might also help if my fingers weren't half the length of his.
This is an old comment and I don't know where you are in your musical journey, but I would advise you to look up Sierra Hull and Johnny Hiland. Sierra has very small, thin hands, whereas Johnny has massive meaty paws. Both would seemingly put a player at a disadvantage, but both are masters of their instruments. As a music instructor, I can tell you that hand anatomy is often cited as a concern by most players starting out. In reality, unless you have a major deformity, your hands aren't likely to limit your potential in music.
@@bobthabuilda1525 And even you one does have a major deformity, people like Django show how that can be incorporated into a unique style of playing.
@@TheRamsberg Very good point. Django has always been a favorite of mine, and his mastery of the guitar was so complete that I honestly forget that he didn't have a fully functional left hand.
First let me say that I am not a musician, but with a good stunt double and creative camera work, I know I could play one in a movie. At first I thought this was only humor, and pretty good stuff at that. Kinda like early Andy Kaufman. Then I realized that Chris was actually giving some really great advice to novices, such as I if I'd actually take up playing an instrument. Regardless, Chris is great, and I love Nickel Creek!
I like letting my three picking fingers hang. I hate the feeling of the strings touching my knucles. I feel like I'm rubbing them against sand paper.
Is it the camera angle , is he in a small room or is he just one tall dude?
Thank you
A word is coming to mind.............eccentric.....yah that's it.
He's very much so. Takes time getting used to at least for me.
I left a pick on the corner of a high cupboard - by some incomprehensible mean some liquid dripped on to it from no possible place...but it was a disgusting brown sticky substance...much like discolored soft drink. I suddenly realized how benificial thid was to retaining a very loose relaxed but stabilized and aligned plectrum. 😄
I came to learn to pronounce his name properly. Tbh, i preferred my version. Lol.
I'm gonna need 41 hours a day to get near his skill though. 😬
Are his pants on backwards?
No. But your brain is😊
Thilde is crazy wild when watch him ply I am afraid he is going to strain muscles in his back\
Still waiting to find someone to come hold my fingers down while I play!
... now i just need a tutorial for the other hand...
i could help you there
The sound of that Loar ticking against his belt is slightly painful to listen to..
+Lars Hanssen maybe ear plugs would protect you?
Lars Hanssen I’m pretty sure there was some honest play wear before he got his mitts on it.
Wow🤷🏻♂️
Nice one , Chris, now, go and have a good sleep, you look as though you have been up for 3 days!!
Masseese?
👍
Is it just me or has he had a few before filming? Great lesson nonetheless... just a hunch
Hey the best musicians were always pretty high or drunk I've played my best music on drugs and alcohol (LSD had the coolest and craziest effect on my music back when I did things like that) and alcohol made me good at singing the blues and folk I can belt out my notes in just a different way, now I just smoke weed and it just makes music sound more full I hear a shit load of over and under tones I used to not notice as much before I started smoking weed and when ever I stopped I couldn't hear em' and it definitely effects the way I play when I improvise.
cool story bro
kungfuasgaeilge then he must have ALWAYS had a few lol this is normal Chris to me.
But does your audience hear the same thing you're hearing? We've all been to a bar where a drunk want's to get onstage and play. Doesn't mean they can when they're fucked up. Not being critical but that's how your mind processes things under the influence. Been there done that.
I can't speak for people with that IQ level, but somehow I don't think that's true. When you are that intelligent you tend to notice things other people don't. Even the simplest things are, in reality, filled with rich complexity. I don't consider myself as particularly "smart," but I am naturally very curious and that is something that I notice about the world. Very little is actually boring.
Why not show IN A CLOSE-UP SO WE CAN EASILY SEE IT AND DON'T HAVE TO GUESS, the exact position of the pick where it contacts each of the two fingers? Is the index finger bent? If so, how much? How much of the index finger is in contact with the pick, and where on the finger, exactly, is the contact? What's the shape (outline) of Chris' pick and how is the pick itself oriented with respect to the fingers? Where on the perimeter of the pick does it hit the strings? At a (or the) point? Next to a point? Does it matter? Then draw the camera back and show the rest. Sorry to yell (caps) , but this is all so obviously needed, yet not provided. Frustrating.
No matter how much I relax, I still suck at the Mandolin. 😞
Hey just like with the pick-hand you gotta relax, go easy on yourself. Everyone sucks when they start, but you'll get better
How to avoid musculoskeletal disorders, by a master mandolin player. Pay attention and you'll never need a masseuse. Unless you date one of course 😉. Thanks Chris, now I know how to say your last name.
Good thing Eddie Van Halen never watched this, he would have seen he was doing it all wrong.
That belt buckle hitting the back of that valuable instrument is disturbing
Thile has a Tonegard fitted which stops direct contact.
HIs thumb is long enough to give him that angle!! NO FAIR! My thumb is not quite so long to hang over the other fingers like that. Frustrating. My brain is ready... relative finger lengths are not.
You don't need a long thumb. People of all hand sizes have become accomplished musicians.
i never knew, to a certainty, what it means to overthink something? but that was then and this is now :)
I will say first that he is truly a virtuoso in many regards, but have some humility man...
What did he say?
I would like to know that as well. Plenty of people complaining about his attitude but I'm not really seeing this issue.
Ian Huffer - huh? Not reading any arrogance in his demeanour or lesson at all. Some eccentricity and definite nerves - and attempts at humor to overcome them, but he seems v down-to-earth here and in all other videos I’ve seen him in...
@@Shelsight I don't know what I saw in his demeanor three years ago, but I don't see it now. Him being a bit uncomfortable seems more likely now that you mention it- I definitely confused the two. Love his stuff, and he's definitely a down to earth dude
You’re so witty I’m sure you will get over yourself eventually.
I found this to be all TALK and no SHOW. I could not understand any real and useful information to help. He did not help a beginner player. So, as a communicator, he took forever to communicate how to hold and perform the movement of a pick.
And you had to complain. Didn't help anything. Get over yourself 😊