People say he’s bad at video games, but actually he’s at expert level when it comes to splitting his attention between the two very complicated tasks of playing a video game blind and hosting a show
He's only bad at games that require a ton of focus/reading so you don't miss anything important. A simple platformer with the objective "get from point A to point B" is pretty easy for him.
It's interesting how in pre-Danny fanart, Arin was the taller/thin one of the Grumps duo. Once Jon left and Danny came on, roles swapped and Arin became the thick short one of the Grumps.
Arin briefly talked about that once they let themselves talk about Jon again. He mentions that a big part of the shift was that Arin changed the way he behaved on the show with Dan, because Jon was such a naturally goofy guy, Arin's more neutral attitude let him be the "straight man" to Jon's "fool," but since Dan is even more naturally chill than Arin is, he decided that he had to be the one to take on the role of the "fool" to keep a contrast in the commentary, otherwise it would be two chill guys just talking over video games, and there were a million of those. (Even though the episodes where it turns into just two chill guys talking over games tend to be the most loved by fans. Lol)
I love that after this people started making art of them DRASTICALLY exaggerated where Dan like, hits the roof of the room and Arin is an actual Toddler
Yeah, when I learned that Dan has unnaturally large thumbs, I just assumed the rest of his physique would be unnaturally large too. Still, i like to compare Arin to Wario
I always thought it was because of their personality. Arin's gremlin rage lends people to drawing him like a little ball of anger, while Dan's laid-back coolheaded nature makes people lean towards representing him as a towering pole-man of centered calm. There's a lot of contrasts between Arin and Dan- color, personality, fat, profession, etc. Artists are going to naturally include height when they want to represent the differences.
As a psych major, I think maybe Dan is partially right in that you prefer to not be misrepresented, but also that the other people in the art didn’t get as misrepresented as much as you. Maybe you felt like “why me”
as a fine arts in painting major, i think the ACTUAL problem isn't that Arin is so perturbed by the drawing, but more the fact that he doesn't understand why the drawing made him nonplus in the first place. i'm sure some of the reaction to the drawing comes from what Dan said, but the context seems to contain more existentialism than just that. see...you can have a thoughtful and insightful comment without needing to qualify yourself as a specialist.
@@tazmon122 But unfortunately your comment wasn't particularly insightful. This clip we all just watched features Arin explicitly and repeatedly saying his issue is with both the misrepresentation itself and his inability to understand why it bothers him. You basically just repeated half of the prompt as your answer to the prompt...? Which is kinda why Arin asked for the opinions of specialists, and why those specialists are replying as such.
Since this, has there been any fan art emphasizing their mutual tallness? Like Arin and Dan arms around each other laughing and both towering over a bunch of people lol
Not that I'm aware of, but there's at least one animator who's drawn Dan as 'everything above the knee is off screen and surrounded by clouds' and Arin as 'literally shaped like a disc with legs'.
Are you crazy? I think you can mark this as the specific point Schoocharu decided to turn Arin into some kind of horrifying dwarf any time he drew him.
I feel like for the contrast argument, the way shoocharu draws them completely solves the problem. Like arin's sort of dad bod is so perfectly represented that the contrast isn't needed as much
I don’t know if anyone cares or knows about the Kibbe body types, my theory follows this system. Arin has a shorter vertical line and has a softer, rounded bone/skeletal structure, while Dan has a taller vertical line and a sharper, more angular structure. Arin may have a Romantic body type that makes him seem shorter than he is, and Dan a more Natural or Dramatic body type making him seem taller.
nailed it. I even made myself design a duo to be the exact opposite as a challenge, bc your dead right that in most minds: soft edges = short round sharp edge = tall stick then any media /art tends to lean into it and its had just so much time to become a fixture of design in general.
Arin just has that shorter person energy, maybe it’s the anger maybe it’s the humor. But he’s just shorter than he seems it’s hard to explain honestly. But we all get it somehow.
It's weird how Arin exudes almost a superhuman amount of self-confidence in very specific areas but also has just enough insecurity in other areas that he seems under 6ft tall.
I mean, maybe it's because as a TALL MAN, he cannot be the little gremlin? He seems like he cares about his fans and I imagine it would be irksome to feel like he is somehow disappointing them. Also, I was always under the impression that the artists were using the visual contrast as a way to illustrate the contrast in their personalities, playing on the "Gentle Giant" and "Napoleon" tropes.
i love that arin says that he sees a problem with the way people represent him and takes the problem as one that HE needs to sort out, instead of going the "i offends me that you are making me short" is simple adult stuff to sort problems out like that, but is becoming so rare these days that i really liked that part of the video btw, i do think that people mostly draw arin short for contrast as arin himself say at the start. since dan is thinner, if dan was also shorter i would be a bigger fatter arin and a thinner shorter dan, which is not as appealing. also, arin is more prone to "rages" in the videos, and is funnier if the angry one is also smaller, happens all the time in other cartoons, like lucky luke and the daltons. why does it bother arin? that i cant know
arin is manipulative and you fell for it. he's drawing this out as "his problem" when he knows it isn't his, it's everybody else who needs to change. It's smart to play the martyr.
I like to imagine that Dan somehow changed the mic channels to make him sound more top right and Arin the bottom left, and that's why we all think he's short.
This reminds me of that one compilation I found where someone went to a bunch of male twitch streamers (their cameras on) and typed in chat "Yes we love ourselves a short king!" or something along those lines. Almost all of them laughed, immediately said they aren't short and proceeded to prove in their own way that they are tall (like stand up, say their height out loud, compare their height to someone else etc.) So it makes me think that height really does matter a lot to men and connects to their masculinity. Though personally if I was tall, I would be sad that people perceive me as smol but that would be out of pride and Arin said that wasn't an issue. Hope he figured it out cuz I wanna know lol.
It was always a subconscious source of pride and he didn't even realize it. He even comes close when he straight up says he thought it'd be cool that they're both "the tall guys". Just look at the rest of these comments, you got people straight up saying that they associate confidence with stature; I guarantee you his height helped him gain confidence a shorter guy would struggle with. Our culture has an unhealthy relationship with height and how it ties to personal worth, but since it's tied with the animal part of our brains, it ain't going away anytime soon.
@@Mentally_Will I guess it is hard to place where we put our pride in if the trait that we have is innate. I mean I never thought there was a way to take height from someone who is already tall but I guess fan art really gives the cognitive dissonance. I like to hope that society can be that one Madeline episode about height. Tall, average or short, we are all wonderfully made so no need to be insecure!
Its tiring being short I dont feel like I have the right to be mad about it because then I will be viewed as napoleon or smt like that but meh it could be worse for me atleast im healthy thats my silver lining, but seeing how it even affects a tall succesful person (idk why that affects them) makes me sad.
lmao thats interesting I'm a short guy but I'm also trans so i perfectly understand the shtick of masculinity = tall femininity = short its pretty frustrating, because like, you have to "prove" your masculinity when your short its so dumb but then i remind myself that I'm also a short mexican guy in the middle of a lot white dudes with european tall genes lmao (looking at you netherlands) theres quite a few cis guys that are shorter than me (mostly hispanic) so im not that bother anymore lmao besides there's benefits with being short!
@@reynauldwhistles2338 you know what's funny is I'm 6'2 and I think nothing when I see someone shorter than me, which is all the time. The only time my heights brought up is by other people. But when I see someone taller than me I feel almost like a bitch. Like I'm less of a man, but I never think that about shorter guys. It's so weird how our brains work. Like even I wish I was an inch taller lol
My guess is that it's the fact that Arin knows it's wrong, and he want's to just correct it in earnest, but can't because of a multitude of reasons, like there's just too much to constantly correct, he doesn't want to come across as pushy about it, that it's just not worth doing, etc.
Arin has short energy because he's the angry one. Before Dan he gave off tall energy because he was the more laid back one. The change in stage persona that he had to take on, to keep the show's dynamic the same when Dan joined, changed the energy vibe.
Today I learned that Arin and Dan are 6’2. I always imagined them shorter because us short folks learned to be funny to compensate for the lack of altitude.
...didn't Arin literally say that it's because he liked the fact that "both of them are really tall like a duo" but in the fanart that "duoness" is lost?.. (clip at 1:20)
Arin identifies himself partially based on his height but everyone hears him and he sounds like a gremlin, and they identify him as small. He feels misrepresented in people's opinion of him, and that juxtaposition of identity and representation makes him feel like there must be something wrong with him that makes people think of him as small. It's simultaneously both a matter of personal identity and insecurity. These are normal feelings and it's perfectly healthy to have strong desires regarding other people's opinion of you, especially who you identify as.
So Arin's trigger is not to be represented as a big fat slimy sludge monster in the cartoons, but to be slightly shorter than Danny, well I can't say that I know how he feels since I'm basically a midget, but I feel him in some way on how it can bother him.
Speaking as an extraordinarily tall man myself (6'8"), I find this discussion super fascinating. I've never really had to think about what it would be like to be portrayed as a smaller individual, or how that would affect me mentally.
It’s just a classic cartoon duo design: One is tall and thin, the other short and round. Bert and Ernie from Sesame St, Bob and Larry from Veggietales, Buzz and Delete from Cyberchase…
I think it's mostly that most times I've seen Arin and Dan sitting, Dan's sitting up straight and Arin is all slouched. Like when you see them next to each other but not on their feet, Arin looks significantly shorter because of his posture.
For me personally, bring short is a major factor to people thinking in younger than I am. And I get annoyed when people think I'm really young, so there's probably something to the idea of wanting to be represented as yourself.
At age 13 a 17 year old thought I was 17. At age 17 a 16 year old thought I was 17. At age 21 a 12 year old thought I was 17. I'm 5'1 and perpetually 17 years old. -_-
This reminds me of talking with my mom. I'll have a panic or grievance about something weird, be completely stumped, and she'll come in with her vastly infinite amount of experience compared to me and ease the stress. It seems so obvious after she says it, but before then I'm lost. So basically, I'm calling Dan a _withered old man._
Arin gives off goblin energy and goblin energy is always associated with being a high energy and chaotic shorty. I also think it's legitimately heavily influenced by Shoocharu's animated videos.
1:23 He says "aw yeah, we're the tall guys," and took pride in that, minutes later at 3:05 he says he never took pride at his height like never saying "aw yeah, I'm the tall guy."
That doesn't read as pride to me. I'm quite tall and so is my best friend. The "oh haha we are the tall boys" thing is less about pride and more about sharing an experience, especially since we are surrounded by short people and our height comes up a lot
i think it's more that he's being part of the duo with dan, and he may be concerned that he'd be construed as the lesser of the two when he'd rather be portrayed as an equal. height tends to be the shorthand for that (excuse the pun)
One factor that might be appart of it is that weight is a taboo subject in our world, whereas, height typically isn't. So when people look at two people, they can't see them or see only part of them, their minds fills in information. And the brain naturally wants too have two people next to eachother be roughly the same mass. So people's lizard brain make Danny taller, and Arin shorter, mentally.
I can't say for sure how Arin is in real life, but i feel like so many people only cling to the 'always angry, chaotic, loud and funny' type and they forget how empathic, gentle and introverted he actually is. Besides i totally get why it would suck to be just as tall as your friend and thinking that is cool, only to be drawn and seen as 'the fatter shorter one' of the duo
What's funny is Arin for years was drawn as the tall lean one in fanart and animations when Jon was his co-host, but then when Danny came in suddenly the roles were reversed.
Could be that Arin was always drawn as the tall skinny one when Jon was on the show, and when Dan joined, the roles have been reversed. So people did view Arin as tall at one point, and the fan's perception of him changed over time.
I imagine the idea of Arin being shorter came from the game grumps animated videos. I’ve seen a lot of those where Dan is a tall skinny chill dude, and Arin is a short fatter angry gremlin man. Obviously that isn’t accurate but it’s how they are depicted a lot of times in those videos so I’m sure that has subconsciously changed how people see Arin (specifically his height)
Despite the confusion on this, it's clear Arin's been through some soul searching and likely some therapy. I honestly really appreciate hearing him approach these things with some emotional maturity. Arin is really healthy and out there with thoughts and feelings sometimes and it can be overlooked when just viewing him as the clown. Proud of you :) I also agree that the artists are likely doing it out of the "short guy tall guy comedy" ingrained in the zeitgheist.
I never really thought arin was short, its just that everytime I hear him on game grumps I imagine him doing a goblin squat because he has more chaotic energy then dan.
for a dude that makes fart jokes and does generally childish things for the sake of entertainment, Arin is jarringly mature about his feelings. I feel like a lot of us could learn from him
this is always funny to me bc back when it was him and jon arin was always depicted as “the tall one” and then danny joined it that whole dynamic just flipped lmao
I once read that how we graphically represent ourselves is related to our self esteem. If you have a very positive view of yourself you represent yourself bigger, you can actually see that in people’s signatures. Very stoic and extroverted people tend to have bigger signatures than more concealed or shy people.
ooh I bet he just has had the image in his head that they are equal is being challenged and it brings his resentment feelings back like a PTSD kinda way
I mean most of the grump animations show Arin kinda shorter, but I think it's character design based. Arin has circle/square energy and Dan has Rectangle energy. Because we all see those drawings and animations we assume they are true lol
I think that there's a societal implication that height equates to potence, so when you are being portrayed not just as short, but specifically as shorter than someone you are already closely compared to (like your comedy partner), I think it feels like an automatic comparison of potency
I think due to Arin and Dan being mostly seen by fans through the game grumps animations, since everyone tends to draw them with Dan being taller than Arin, I think what's bugging him is that people associate Arin with being shorter, and that's what bugs him. I'm not sure if this is the right kind of comparison, but it's like, say you're a fan of a certain show, like a huge fan, but many reviews and memes on the internet or something say the show sucks and that it's trash, and because of that, everyone just associates that show with being trash, even those who have never actually watched it call it that, and it upsets you that someone who has never watched it says it sucks. I feel like that's how it is for Arin. People think he's short due to his voice and build, but he's not, so it gives him an identity that isnt him.
These guys are rarely on camera, and when they are, they're sitting down, so I don't blame fan art for not checking their sizes first. Also, pop culture shows that people with cartoonish anger management issues aren't usually that tall. Wario and Waluigi. Gumball and Darwin. Mac and Bloo. Alvin and Simon. The more chaotic character is always at least slightly shorter while the calmer nicer character got them lanky legs. Pop culture just works that way.
if anything it's understandable to me that bc arin has been online for so long and also been a really well known person on the internet- maybe the idea of seeing himself misrepresented in art can be kinda hurtful, kinda like when a family member forgets about a serious food allergy and then they make it for christmas dinner like, 'i thought you knew me, and i thought this thing (a physical part of me) was unchangeable and well known in anyone's mind' that can feel weird coming from anyone esp if its coming from hundreds of fans a day and esp if he values his height, i dont think there's a simple answer, i personally believe its natural for humans to be a lil selfish when other ppl try and represent them without any of the original person's input
It's because it's an undeniable fact that many people get wrong on a consistent basis. That's annoying with any detail, especially one being made about one's self.
As an actual psych major, my guess based on nothing but this conversation is that Arin has a bit of body dysphoria when he is being viewed as short when he is actually tall. It would be the same thing as when people see themselves in photos after usually seeing themselves in mirrors. Its like “that’s not me”
I can definitely say the reason for the difference in the art is because people want that "tall chill guy + short temperamental guy" dynamic. Arin may not be short, but he really acts like the short one.
The reason why people draw Arin as short probably has to do with the fact that when he’s angry, he sometimes just sounds like a little gremlin guy trying to shank your shins with a stick.
I think it's sweet that Arin was once intimidated by Dan and worried he was cooler. Like in retrospect of course, this guy is a lot older, he's a rockstar, he's had experience with Mondo Media, yknow yeah.. but most of our POV was more like Dan's, like hang on, we like that Jon guy, is this guy gonna live up to that? oh good, he did.
One of my favorite bands, The Milk Carton Kids, are a very similar duo. Joey is beanpole very tall with frizzy hair, and Kenneth is also quite tall (though a bit shorter than Joey) and has a thicker build. And in an interview Kenneth said he doesn't read anything about himself on the internet anymore, because one time, under an article about them, a comment said "the tall one is leagues funnier than the squat one" and it ruined him 😂
I totally understand what he’s talking about. He has shown himself online. Artists have a frame of reference. I definitely wouldn’t like people drawing me as a short person.
I vividly remember a discussion they had, but can't find the clip of it, of Arin talking about how they are shown in animated stuff. That he's often times represented as a tiny little gremlin man and how it annoys him, obviously for the same height reason.
It makes me mad that Arin isn’t shorter. he really didn’t commit to the bit with his genetics here
I didn’t actually know he was 6 foot thought I heard he was shorter than me lol.
@@rovertgamehead 6’2”, he’s very large
He committed to the "large fat man" bit though and not being a small petite little boi
@@olimar243 and we should all send him clothes sized as such
@@Aaronborrmann Yeah, I'll send him cloths meant for my grandfather who's 5' 3" 😂
Arin's personal grievances are nothing compared to the need for one banana shaped man and one orange shaped man.
I would describe Arin as more of a mango.
matt and ryan? from supermega?
@@gctypo2838 A pear
IRL Bert and Ernie
a lemon and a bill, perhaps?
im astonished by how well arin was able to play mario maker while talking about that
People say he’s bad at video games, but actually he’s at expert level when it comes to splitting his attention between the two very complicated tasks of playing a video game blind and hosting a show
@@Noah-wx7fm It’s that ADHD making an appearance.
He's only bad at games that require a ton of focus/reading so you don't miss anything important. A simple platformer with the objective "get from point A to point B" is pretty easy for him.
You just jump most of the time, it's a simple game. Come on
To be fair that wasn't a difficult level. It was just long.
The answer is simple. On a spiritual level, Arin is Donald Duck while Dan is Bugs Bunny.
Oh my God you're right
Surely you mean daffy
That's funny cuz those two are also the same height
Wait Donald or Daffy?
Daffy and bugs 10000%
It's interesting how in pre-Danny fanart, Arin was the taller/thin one of the Grumps duo. Once Jon left and Danny came on, roles swapped and Arin became the thick short one of the Grumps.
Arin briefly talked about that once they let themselves talk about Jon again. He mentions that a big part of the shift was that Arin changed the way he behaved on the show with Dan, because Jon was such a naturally goofy guy, Arin's more neutral attitude let him be the "straight man" to Jon's "fool," but since Dan is even more naturally chill than Arin is, he decided that he had to be the one to take on the role of the "fool" to keep a contrast in the commentary, otherwise it would be two chill guys just talking over video games, and there were a million of those.
(Even though the episodes where it turns into just two chill guys talking over games tend to be the most loved by fans. Lol)
@@Hey-Its-Dingo Where'd he say that?
@@MetaKaios It was in an episode of their Pokemon Fire Red playthrough, I don't remember which.
There must always be a Grump
Arin has a deeper voice and Dan has a higher voice, higher voiced people tend to be perceived as long and thin in media
I love that after this people started making art of them DRASTICALLY exaggerated where Dan like, hits the roof of the room and Arin is an actual Toddler
as an armchair psychologist I believe the problem is that Arin is an armchair
Oh my god it all makes sense now!
excellent diagnosis, doctor
At least the Zoidberg lips and quintuple chins in most fanart isn't a problem for him.
I like to imagine that they aren’t drawing Arin short, but are actually drawing Danny really tall
this is kind of what I imagined tbh
Yeah, when I learned that Dan has unnaturally large thumbs, I just assumed the rest of his physique would be unnaturally large too. Still, i like to compare Arin to Wario
lol
I met both of them in 2015 and can confirm, Arin is a large person lmao. Dan is just as tall as we think LOL.
He isn't large, he's a skinny legend
@@wasbear he got me quaking
@@wasbear arin aint skinny lmao
@@xCodeXANA no he's a skinny LEGEND
@@xCodeXANA boy slim thicc
I always thought it was because of their personality. Arin's gremlin rage lends people to drawing him like a little ball of anger, while Dan's laid-back coolheaded nature makes people lean towards representing him as a towering pole-man of centered calm. There's a lot of contrasts between Arin and Dan- color, personality, fat, profession, etc. Artists are going to naturally include height when they want to represent the differences.
Arin does have angry short guy energy. This is coming from an angry short gal
That's 100% accurate.
Yeah I think it has to do with his maturity compared to dan
As a psych major, I think maybe Dan is partially right in that you prefer to not be misrepresented, but also that the other people in the art didn’t get as misrepresented as much as you. Maybe you felt like “why me”
Also the expectation in his image of "the two tall guys!" and probably other expectations around it, he could've felt rejected in a sense.
as a fine arts in painting major, i think the ACTUAL problem isn't that Arin is so perturbed by the drawing, but more the fact that he doesn't understand why the drawing made him nonplus in the first place. i'm sure some of the reaction to the drawing comes from what Dan said, but the context seems to contain more existentialism than just that.
see...you can have a thoughtful and insightful comment without needing to qualify yourself as a specialist.
@@tazmon122 i think they mentioned their qualifications because Arin asked for a psych majors' opinion 😅
@@tazmon122 But unfortunately your comment wasn't particularly insightful. This clip we all just watched features Arin explicitly and repeatedly saying his issue is with both the misrepresentation itself and his inability to understand why it bothers him.
You basically just repeated half of the prompt as your answer to the prompt...? Which is kinda why Arin asked for the opinions of specialists, and why those specialists are replying as such.
hoes mad
Big guy little guy is a truly inescapable dynamic in art.
Since this, has there been any fan art emphasizing their mutual tallness? Like Arin and Dan arms around each other laughing and both towering over a bunch of people lol
Not that I'm aware of, but there's at least one animator who's drawn Dan as 'everything above the knee is off screen and surrounded by clouds' and Arin as 'literally shaped like a disc with legs'.
@@CaptainSpycrab so the literal opposite of what I was thinking 😅
Are you crazy? I think you can mark this as the specific point Schoocharu decided to turn Arin into some kind of horrifying dwarf any time he drew him.
The animator Sherbies draws them pretty equally
I feel like for the contrast argument, the way shoocharu draws them completely solves the problem. Like arin's sort of dad bod is so perfectly represented that the contrast isn't needed as much
I don’t know if anyone cares or knows about the Kibbe body types, my theory follows this system. Arin has a shorter vertical line and has a softer, rounded bone/skeletal structure, while Dan has a taller vertical line and a sharper, more angular structure. Arin may have a Romantic body type that makes him seem shorter than he is, and Dan a more Natural or Dramatic body type making him seem taller.
nailed it. I even made myself design a duo to be the exact opposite as a challenge, bc your dead right that in most minds:
soft edges = short round
sharp edge = tall stick
then any media /art tends to lean into it and its had just so much time to become a fixture of design in general.
So truuuu
Arin just has that shorter person energy, maybe it’s the anger maybe it’s the humor. But he’s just shorter than he seems it’s hard to explain honestly. But we all get it somehow.
It's weird how Arin exudes almost a superhuman amount of self-confidence in very specific areas but also has just enough insecurity in other areas that he seems under 6ft tall.
Speak for yourself, that shit makes absolutely no sense to me lmao.
Not really
Edward Elrick vibes
Short-tempered
I mean, maybe it's because as a TALL MAN, he cannot be the little gremlin? He seems like he cares about his fans and I imagine it would be irksome to feel like he is somehow disappointing them.
Also, I was always under the impression that the artists were using the visual contrast as a way to illustrate the contrast in their personalities, playing on the "Gentle Giant" and "Napoleon" tropes.
i love that arin says that he sees a problem with the way people represent him and takes the problem as one that HE needs to sort out, instead of going the "i offends me that you are making me short"
is simple adult stuff to sort problems out like that, but is becoming so rare these days that i really liked that part of the video
btw, i do think that people mostly draw arin short for contrast as arin himself say at the start. since dan is thinner, if dan was also shorter i would be a bigger fatter arin and a thinner shorter dan, which is not as appealing. also, arin is more prone to "rages" in the videos, and is funnier if the angry one is also smaller, happens all the time in other cartoons, like lucky luke and the daltons. why does it bother arin? that i cant know
arin is manipulative and you fell for it. he's drawing this out as "his problem" when he knows it isn't his, it's everybody else who needs to change. It's smart to play the martyr.
@@mikemath9508 dude, get a life lmfao on some pseudo intellectual shit thinking youre psychoanalyzing someone you dont even personally know
@@mikemath9508 you sound like you're being pretty grump about this whole situation, you should try being not so grump instead
@@aldar8240 he's got a point tho
@@Paperkutchy does he?
I like to imagine that Dan somehow changed the mic channels to make him sound more top right and Arin the bottom left, and that's why we all think he's short.
This reminds me of that one compilation I found where someone went to a bunch of male twitch streamers (their cameras on) and typed in chat "Yes we love ourselves a short king!" or something along those lines. Almost all of them laughed, immediately said they aren't short and proceeded to prove in their own way that they are tall (like stand up, say their height out loud, compare their height to someone else etc.) So it makes me think that height really does matter a lot to men and connects to their masculinity.
Though personally if I was tall, I would be sad that people perceive me as smol but that would be out of pride and Arin said that wasn't an issue. Hope he figured it out cuz I wanna know lol.
It was always a subconscious source of pride and he didn't even realize it. He even comes close when he straight up says he thought it'd be cool that they're both "the tall guys". Just look at the rest of these comments, you got people straight up saying that they associate confidence with stature; I guarantee you his height helped him gain confidence a shorter guy would struggle with. Our culture has an unhealthy relationship with height and how it ties to personal worth, but since it's tied with the animal part of our brains, it ain't going away anytime soon.
@@Mentally_Will I guess it is hard to place where we put our pride in if the trait that we have is innate. I mean I never thought there was a way to take height from someone who is already tall but I guess fan art really gives the cognitive dissonance.
I like to hope that society can be that one Madeline episode about height. Tall, average or short, we are all wonderfully made so no need to be insecure!
Its tiring being short I dont feel like I have the right to be mad about it because then I will be viewed as napoleon or smt like that but meh it could be worse for me atleast im healthy thats my silver lining, but seeing how it even affects a tall succesful person (idk why that affects them) makes me sad.
lmao thats interesting
I'm a short guy
but I'm also trans
so i perfectly understand the shtick of masculinity = tall
femininity = short
its pretty frustrating, because like, you have to "prove" your masculinity when your short its so dumb
but then i remind myself that I'm also a short mexican guy in the middle of a lot white dudes with european tall genes lmao (looking at you netherlands)
theres quite a few cis guys that are shorter than me (mostly hispanic) so im not that bother anymore lmao
besides there's benefits with being short!
@@reynauldwhistles2338 you know what's funny is I'm 6'2 and I think nothing when I see someone shorter than me, which is all the time. The only time my heights brought up is by other people. But when I see someone taller than me I feel almost like a bitch. Like I'm less of a man, but I never think that about shorter guys. It's so weird how our brains work. Like even I wish I was an inch taller lol
As one might say, Arin has “goblin energy”
My guess is that it's the fact that Arin knows it's wrong, and he want's to just correct it in earnest, but can't because of a multitude of reasons, like there's just too much to constantly correct, he doesn't want to come across as pushy about it, that it's just not worth doing, etc.
Arin has short energy because he's the angry one. Before Dan he gave off tall energy because he was the more laid back one. The change in stage persona that he had to take on, to keep the show's dynamic the same when Dan joined, changed the energy vibe.
After watching them for years I am only now learning that Arin is not short and Dan is only 6'2
Today I learned that Arin and Dan are 6’2. I always imagined them shorter because us short folks learned to be funny to compensate for the lack of altitude.
...didn't Arin literally say that it's because he liked the fact that "both of them are really tall like a duo" but in the fanart that "duoness" is lost?.. (clip at 1:20)
Its still a duo but instead of a duo by similarity its a duo of contrast. It alters the dynamic
Arin identifies himself partially based on his height but everyone hears him and he sounds like a gremlin, and they identify him as small. He feels misrepresented in people's opinion of him, and that juxtaposition of identity and representation makes him feel like there must be something wrong with him that makes people think of him as small. It's simultaneously both a matter of personal identity and insecurity. These are normal feelings and it's perfectly healthy to have strong desires regarding other people's opinion of you, especially who you identify as.
So Arin's trigger is not to be represented as a big fat slimy sludge monster in the cartoons, but to be slightly shorter than Danny, well I can't say that I know how he feels since I'm basically a midget, but I feel him in some way on how it can bother him.
after his Creator Clash Fight, no one can call him short... he is big tall man!
I honestly respect that Arin can speak his insecurities out to the world. That cannot be easy
i think it’s less that people think arin is short, it’s more that everyone just thinks dan is a tall giant😂😂
I hope everyone starts making art where Arin is an absolute unit in comparison to Dan, and in turn this frustrates Arin even more.
The image of Arin being short and angry is funny; Arin being big and angry is just scary.
Speaking as an extraordinarily tall man myself (6'8"), I find this discussion super fascinating.
I've never really had to think about what it would be like to be portrayed as a smaller individual, or how that would affect me mentally.
I absolutely get why Arin FEELS like the short one, but I think Dan's got the best guesses as to why it bugs him that he's portrayed that way.
I love these "just genuine conversation" grump clips. So fun to listen to.
It’s just a classic cartoon duo design: One is tall and thin, the other short and round. Bert and Ernie from Sesame St, Bob and Larry from Veggietales, Buzz and Delete from Cyberchase…
This is literally the most perfect Arin gameplay in super Mario maker that I have ever seen.
Arin's got that short person anger, and i think, as an angry short person, we just embraced him as an honourary short person
I think it's mostly that most times I've seen Arin and Dan sitting, Dan's sitting up straight and Arin is all slouched. Like when you see them next to each other but not on their feet, Arin looks significantly shorter because of his posture.
For me personally, bring short is a major factor to people thinking in younger than I am. And I get annoyed when people think I'm really young, so there's probably something to the idea of wanting to be represented as yourself.
At age 13 a 17 year old thought I was 17.
At age 17 a 16 year old thought I was 17.
At age 21 a 12 year old thought I was 17.
I'm 5'1 and perpetually 17 years old. -_-
This reminds me of talking with my mom. I'll have a panic or grievance about something weird, be completely stumped, and she'll come in with her vastly infinite amount of experience compared to me and ease the stress. It seems so obvious after she says it, but before then I'm lost.
So basically, I'm calling Dan a _withered old man._
Arin has short-king energy, he is just a short king in a tall king's body
Alt title: Both of the grumps attempt to gaslight us into thinking they're tall
Arin gives off goblin energy and goblin energy is always associated with being a high energy and chaotic shorty. I also think it's legitimately heavily influenced by Shoocharu's animated videos.
1:23 He says "aw yeah, we're the tall guys," and took pride in that, minutes later at 3:05 he says he never took pride at his height like never saying "aw yeah, I'm the tall guy."
I think its more that he likes being similar to others and fitting in or belonging, not so much being tall itself
That doesn't read as pride to me. I'm quite tall and so is my best friend. The "oh haha we are the tall boys" thing is less about pride and more about sharing an experience, especially since we are surrounded by short people and our height comes up a lot
i think it's more that he's being part of the duo with dan, and he may be concerned that he'd be construed as the lesser of the two when he'd rather be portrayed as an equal. height tends to be the shorthand for that (excuse the pun)
One factor that might be appart of it is that weight is a taboo subject in our world, whereas, height typically isn't. So when people look at two people, they can't see them or see only part of them, their minds fills in information. And the brain naturally wants too have two people next to eachother be roughly the same mass. So people's lizard brain make Danny taller, and Arin shorter, mentally.
I can't say for sure how Arin is in real life, but i feel like so many people only cling to the 'always angry, chaotic, loud and funny' type and they forget how empathic, gentle and introverted he actually is. Besides i totally get why it would suck to be just as tall as your friend and thinking that is cool, only to be drawn and seen as 'the fatter shorter one' of the duo
now lets talk about Arin's multiple chins.
love how it ends with Dan doing a quick armchair evopsych reading lol "masculinity is tied to height and dick size"
What's funny is Arin for years was drawn as the tall lean one in fanart and animations when Jon was his co-host, but then when Danny came in suddenly the roles were reversed.
I have mad respect for both of you, very good introspection
Could be that Arin was always drawn as the tall skinny one when Jon was on the show, and when Dan joined, the roles have been reversed. So people did view Arin as tall at one point, and the fan's perception of him changed over time.
Amusing this conversation takes place during a game of Mario: the ultimate short king Everyman franchise
I imagine the idea of Arin being shorter came from the game grumps animated videos. I’ve seen a lot of those where Dan is a tall skinny chill dude, and Arin is a short fatter angry gremlin man. Obviously that isn’t accurate but it’s how they are depicted a lot of times in those videos so I’m sure that has subconsciously changed how people see Arin (specifically his height)
It was because of this episode, when I made a game grumps animated I made SURE Dan and Arin were the exact same height
Despite the confusion on this, it's clear Arin's been through some soul searching and likely some therapy. I honestly really appreciate hearing him approach these things with some emotional maturity. Arin is really healthy and out there with thoughts and feelings sometimes and it can be overlooked when just viewing him as the clown. Proud of you :)
I also agree that the artists are likely doing it out of the "short guy tall guy comedy" ingrained in the zeitgheist.
I never really thought arin was short, its just that everytime I hear him on game grumps I imagine him doing a goblin squat because he has more chaotic energy then dan.
Dan’s “Who says that?”, as jokey as it was, could’ve easily been murderous.
for a dude that makes fart jokes and does generally childish things for the sake of entertainment, Arin is jarringly mature about his feelings. I feel like a lot of us could learn from him
I’ve been grumping since 2015 and I JUST learned that they are the same height.
this is always funny to me bc back when it was him and jon arin was always depicted as “the tall one” and then danny joined it that whole dynamic just flipped lmao
Honestly, I can understand why people think Arin is short. He has mad chihuahua energy, especially when he gets mad/upset.
I once read that how we graphically represent ourselves is related to our self esteem. If you have a very positive view of yourself you represent yourself bigger, you can actually see that in people’s signatures. Very stoic and extroverted people tend to have bigger signatures than more concealed or shy people.
ooh I bet he just has had the image in his head that they are equal is being challenged and it brings his resentment feelings back like a PTSD kinda way
It just reminds me of Ian and Mickey from Shameless. The short angry one and the gentle giant.
Artist: makes cartoon
Arin: "Oh hi existentialism, when'd you get here?"
ok, but Arin has that Short Guy Energy while Dan holds the Too Tall Guy Energy. They fulfill the short guy tall guy bit with their voices.
Occam’s Razor at the end was a nice punctuation to their reflection.
Arin is Mario and Dan is Luigi, that’s all that needs to be said.
I mean most of the grump animations show Arin kinda shorter, but I think it's character design based. Arin has circle/square energy and Dan has Rectangle energy. Because we all see those drawings and animations we assume they are true lol
Love when he said, well it's like day 3 of this, ha ha ha
I think that there's a societal implication that height equates to potence, so when you are being portrayed not just as short, but specifically as shorter than someone you are already closely compared to (like your comedy partner), I think it feels like an automatic comparison of potency
If anything this feels more like a call to action for all artists to draw Arin gradually shorter with each iterative art piece
I think due to Arin and Dan being mostly seen by fans through the game grumps animations, since everyone tends to draw them with Dan being taller than Arin, I think what's bugging him is that people associate Arin with being shorter, and that's what bugs him. I'm not sure if this is the right kind of comparison, but it's like, say you're a fan of a certain show, like a huge fan, but many reviews and memes on the internet or something say the show sucks and that it's trash, and because of that, everyone just associates that show with being trash, even those who have never actually watched it call it that, and it upsets you that someone who has never watched it says it sucks. I feel like that's how it is for Arin. People think he's short due to his voice and build, but he's not, so it gives him an identity that isnt him.
I want to say it was the inaccuracy in what appeared to be an attempt at an accurate representation of the grump gang.
These guys are rarely on camera, and when they are, they're sitting down, so I don't blame fan art for not checking their sizes first. Also, pop culture shows that people with cartoonish anger management issues aren't usually that tall.
Wario and Waluigi. Gumball and Darwin. Mac and Bloo. Alvin and Simon. The more chaotic character is always at least slightly shorter while the calmer nicer character got them lanky legs. Pop culture just works that way.
if anything it's understandable to me that bc arin has been online for so long and also been a really well known person on the internet- maybe the idea of seeing himself misrepresented in art can be kinda hurtful, kinda like when a family member forgets about a serious food allergy and then they make it for christmas dinner like, 'i thought you knew me, and i thought this thing (a physical part of me) was unchangeable and well known in anyone's mind' that can feel weird coming from anyone esp if its coming from hundreds of fans a day and esp if he values his height,
i dont think there's a simple answer, i personally believe its natural for humans to be a lil selfish when other ppl try and represent them without any of the original person's input
I find it especially funny as a long time fan because I remember when Arin was the tall one in all the animations when Jon was around 😂
It's because it's an undeniable fact that many people get wrong on a consistent basis. That's annoying with any detail, especially one being made about one's self.
As an actual psych major, my guess based on nothing but this conversation is that Arin has a bit of body dysphoria when he is being viewed as short when he is actually tall. It would be the same thing as when people see themselves in photos after usually seeing themselves in mirrors. Its like “that’s not me”
As someone who's an entire foot shorter than both Dan and Arin; this conversation is sweet schadenfreude.
They figured it out so well actually
I can definitely say the reason for the difference in the art is because people want that "tall chill guy + short temperamental guy" dynamic. Arin may not be short, but he really acts like the short one.
haven't watched game grumps in years, sounds like there's some tension here lol
I will forever see Arin as the little gremlin from teh Starbomb Overwatch video...
I think his rages just comes off as Costanzaesque
For me it's projection, im short and I just think in my brain about how much I relate to Arin and so he is short in my mind
It's the anger. The anger fits make him seem smaller.
It will always be funny that Arin actually was the tall skinny guy when Jon was on.
The reason why people draw Arin as short probably has to do with the fact that when he’s angry, he sometimes just sounds like a little gremlin guy trying to shank your shins with a stick.
I was more interested in the gameplay than then conversation 🤣
I think it's sweet that Arin was once intimidated by Dan and worried he was cooler.
Like in retrospect of course, this guy is a lot older, he's a rockstar, he's had experience with Mondo Media, yknow yeah.. but most of our POV was more like Dan's, like hang on, we like that Jon guy, is this guy gonna live up to that? oh good, he did.
One of my favorite bands, The Milk Carton Kids, are a very similar duo. Joey is beanpole very tall with frizzy hair, and Kenneth is also quite tall (though a bit shorter than Joey) and has a thicker build. And in an interview Kenneth said he doesn't read anything about himself on the internet anymore, because one time, under an article about them, a comment said "the tall one is leagues funnier than the squat one" and it ruined him 😂
5:34
Underrated joke from Danny
I find it funny he is talking about duo contrast while playing as Mario (short and stout) who contrasted with Luigi (tall and thinner).
I totally understand what he’s talking about. He has shown himself online. Artists have a frame of reference. I definitely wouldn’t like people drawing me as a short person.
I vividly remember a discussion they had, but can't find the clip of it, of Arin talking about how they are shown in animated stuff. That he's often times represented as a tiny little gremlin man and how it annoys him, obviously for the same height reason.