I discovered The Book of the New Sun after googling 'books like Dark Souls'. I wanted something haunting, difficult, drenched with confusing symbolism and deeply philosophical. Gene Wolfe is now my favorite writer and I can't get enough.
By far my favorite book and have read the series twice. I'm constantly thinking about it and wanting more of it my life. I'm looking forward to my third reading.
i reckon i should be proud of myself. i breezed through Shadow and Claw utterly engaged. i just snagged Sword and Citadel to continue. i found all the archaic terms obvious and used in context. i do think young readers will have a bit of headscratching in store but if your shelf is full of science fiction and Gulliver's Travels, Robinson Crusoe, Out of the Silent Planet and The Odyssey, you will have found your bliss. the far off lands have been replaced by the stars and the travelers have brought back unfathomable wonders, along with other travelers and beasts. the society of old Urth has solidified into a rigid hierarchy, enforced with alien technology with an Autarch at the pinnacle. Our hero was taken from his mother's arms into a cloistered guild of torturers and she was tortured and killed within earshot in the same tower. he is raised to manhood in the guild and sent away due to an act of mercy. thus our story begins. it's a hard and puzzling road told from the first person by a torturer with an eidetic memory. there are no explanations and we must unravel mysteries along with him. who can resist? i would also mention The Glass Bead Game and Anathem as corollary. you have just entered an intellectual cloister on a better, older world. what do you expect?
“Sometimes driven aground by the photon storms, by the swirling of the galaxies, clockwise and counterclockwise, ticking with light down the dark sea-corridors lined with our silver sails, our demon-haunted sails, our hundred-league masts as fine as threads, as fine as silver needles sewing the threads of starlight, embroidering the stars on black velvet, wet with the winds of Time that go racing by. The bone in her teeth! The spume, the flying spume of Time, cast up on these beaches where old sailors can no longer keep their bones from the restless, the unwearied universe. Where has she gone? My lady, the mate of my soul? Gone across the running tides of Aquarius, of Pisces, of Aries. Gone. Gone in her little boat, her nipples pressed against the black velvet lid, gone, sailing away forever from the star-washed shores, the dry shoals of the habitable worlds. She is her own ship, she is the figurehead of her own ship, and the captain. Bosun, Bosun, put out the launch! Sailmaker, make a sail! She has left us behind. We have left her behind. She is in the past we never knew and the future we will not see. Put out more sail, Captain for the universe is leaving us behind…”--From Citadel
i read somewhere where wolfe has severian as a torturer because all men are torturers unless they are capable of showing mercy, which severian is and does.
I’m halfway through Shadow, no idea what’s going on or why, clueless really, but FASCINATED... Love the honest review by the way, and agree that just because art of any kind is complex, does not mean it cannot be enjoyed by us commoners 😉 I like my books like my music, like you mentioned, just depends on the day...
heck yes! glad you liked the review. its so worth it to keep going through it all the way to the end in my opinion. and it seems the consensus is that its even better the second time you read it. and then even better the third and so on. also, tons of people here on this video have recommended me the Alzabo soup podcast as a supplement to reading the books. i'm actually doing a reread myself of book of the new sun and so i'm just now starting listening to the podcast and i agree that it is GREAT! so glad everyone told me about it. They go through the books basically chapter by chapter and also bring in information from the Lexicon Urthus. So if you want i'd check that out as you read along. here's a link to their site: alzabosoup.libsyn.com/
Ive gone down the rabbit hole and made it all the way through Book of the Long Sun with Patera Silk. I understand maybe 25% of what ive read but its by far the most rewarding, hauntingly beautiful escape ive ever experienced. Keep at it, we have an amazing puzzle that will last us a lifetime.
Please read the Book of the New Sun first (including The Urth of the New Sun),followed by the Long Sun and then the Short Sun. Happy reading and R.I.P. Mr Wolfe. What a genius!
I mentioned these books to a coworker who I had met at our lunch break. I noticed that he was a fantasy/science fiction fan. He always had a book to read at our lunch break. The next day he told me that he was putting it on his Christmas list to read. I think he will be pleased:)
I've read the entire Solar Cycle twice. I can honestly say it was worth it. The ending is very satisfying. For now, don't worry about the Lexicon Urthus. That's for Lap 2+. I also would recommend the Alzabo Soup podcast. Those guys are great. They're just to the end of The Urth of the New Sun ( Book 5 of 12). Read Chapter 1 of Shadow and listen to their 1st episode. Cheers, mate. Hope to see you on the other side.
I just started their podcast this morning! I've been really itching to read more wolfe the last couple days. I think i'm gonna start with a re-read of book of the new sun to refresh and then go into Urth of the New Sun and then hopefully the whole rest of the solar cycle! I'm loving the podcast so far! I'll probably read along with it as i go.
this is a great “review”. I actually really enjoyed not fully comprehending everything in the text. I would go back and read a paragraph over again, but have no interest in re-reading these books, within the same decade at least. Everything about the book is so strange, the world and characters, so that even if a weird image in my head isn’t what the narrator intended... eh... that’s the magic of literature that I think Gene would appreciate.
Do it. You can tell that the dudes who made Warhammer 40,000 drew a ton of influence from this book. Might go with ebook sense it would be easy to look up the meaning of archaic words?
Also I'm kind of moderately familiar with this book (by which I mean I've studied it extensively for like two years) so yeah, hit me up if you want if you're still interested.
Yes you should read this series . It will raise your IQ 50 points. You may need an Oxford unabridged dictionary , my mother was an English teacher ,Wolf uses words I've never seen befor. The book takes place in a time when man as a species is exhausted and starting the slide down to extinction. There is no allegory in the series, like a lot of these sites the speaker likes the sound of there own voice . Read the books and don't listen to talking heads. If his insight is valid then he should write a book ,if not ignore the man with alcohol in hand.
I was aware of these in the 80s as the book covers were so striking. I then read them in the 90s, got both hooked and confused...so I found the Lexicon Urthus and the Solar Labyrinth and went...Ahhhhhh... They're not for everyone, but the Books of the New Sun are awesome, for us..the Initiate. I'd also add that I bought the Audible versions and it's excellent if read to you. But you lose the strange uses of ( the written) Latin and Greek, but it's still otherworldly.
Great video man, i was looking for a discussion of this book for awhile. I would highly recommend a better microphone. Your voice and discussion is top notch, but it gets muddied a bit with the sound quality. Looking forward to more!
Thank you! And yeah the audio is pretty low quality lol I actually had a decent mic but the settings I was using were completely wrong! I’ve since gotten much better at fixing the audio but still need a better mic eventually
The true Joyce-ian(??) science fiction novel is Dhalgren by Samuel L. Delaney which I would NEVER recommend to anyone because 90% of people who start it never finish it (it's also X-rated and has an invisible plot). But it's still burned into my mind after dozens of years as one of the most mind-blowing novels I've ever read. I actually liked Book of the Long Sun better than Book of the New Sun, which was (in my opinion) a much easier read.
Booktube Goddess I see a lot of people online recommending Long Sun and Short Sun to read after this. What about Urth of the New Sun? I was planning on having that be my next Wolfe... better to just move to Long/Short Sun?
Hmm, I honestly don't remember reading Urth of the New Sun, so I'm not sure. The Long Sun is (for me) the series of Wolfe that sticks out in my mind the most.
@@PintsAndPaperbacks Read Urth of the New Sun as it concludes the story of Severian the Torturer. Then if you want to read another story in the same universe with different characters read Long Sun.
i've only read the Book of the New Sun books so far. but I'm going to read Urth of the New Sun this year! do you have any recommendations for more Gene Wolfe?
@@PintsAndPaperbacks The Long Sun Quatrology and Short Sun Trilogy are just as good as The Book of the New Sun. Latro in the Mist (a two book compilation you can get cheaply off Amazon) is amazing, with an unreliable narrator like Severian but for a very different reason. Peace is one of his sneakiest books but also a flat-out masterpiece.
I just finished this book after reading several different recommendations for fans of the dark souls games. I gotta say i dont get it; its a fine novel for sure, but it doesnt even come close to scratching that itch i was hoping it would. Dark souls games are so solitary and somber and the atmosphere is kind of like the main character. This novel just pairs the protagonist with on person or party after another.
That's not what dark souls is about at all. Dark souls is a multiplayer game. Both have subtle underlying themes and story that needs careful consideration. Dark souls doest spoon feed u the story
I too made that decision at first , then gave it a Shot anyway and started to read the book with expectations that i would not understand the bigger picture and the subtleties,but to my surprise it did not need that much attention and work if you just continue to read all will become clear eventually (For Example) in the first book he was greeted by the Brothel Manager ,if you pay-attention you will notice that Severian describe his strange eyes but does not Give it a much though right away it might seem like for him as a minor thing , but for the Reader that man is a Cyborg /Android Severian describe things as best as his mind can interprate things,For example he Raped and abused a woman in a bout but via his eyes she did not mind it In Fact he later Tells himself that she asked for it.Anyway Read the Book it is Easy to read and the new Dictionary is Useless the Words translation have a different meaning in the book although it is a clue of their origin. Example The dictionary translate the word ARMIGER -a person entitled to heraldic arms. But the Book uses that word as Armiger =Knight so you will learn the new lexicon by it's use . Have Fun it is Really good book one of the Best Like Reading the Thoughs of God Emperor Leto the 2
not pretentious at all! thanks for the advice. Blood Meridian is probably the book that has been on my to-read list for the longest time. i've tried to read it several times but that book really gets to me every time idk what it is about it. hopefully this channel will help me finally get that one done
@@PintsAndPaperbacks It's a harsh novel. I'm a giant fan of Hotline Miami and I still consider Blood Meridian the goriest piece of art I've ever consumed. Like when infants have their brains dashed on rocks and that's a direct reference to the old testament, that is definitely a novel that isn't fucking around. As much as I adore it, it is absolutely a lot.
yes, thank you! okay, so I considered that little bit about the picture of the 'warrior' actually being the photograph of the apollo 14 moon landing an amazing little easter egg type thing. so my question: what in the book was the most mind blowing one to you?
@@PintsAndPaperbacks The hidden story behind it. Make no mistake, this novel does not have a simple picaresque story. There is a complex story underneath it and all the allegorical elements serve it - the novel does not have allegorical elements and symbols just to give a political/theological message. Instead all these layers servr the hidden story behind the surface. Getting to that story is tricky and definitely requires rereads. But the story is just as clear as reading a novel with a regular plot, when you uncover it. Reading the Urth after New Sun will make the hidden story raise to the surface.
"...one seamless story.." What a crock! You should review what you just said and "hear" if it makes sense. That is, if you can detect coherence! You cite inane allusions and assert "plot"? Melville has ideas. Does Gene Wolfe make you think about issues of the human condition in a new or enlightening way? Can you cite one idea in Wolfe that is not better written about by others? Maybe your confusion is a hint. Not that you're dumb, but that you're smart!
I discovered The Book of the New Sun after googling 'books like Dark Souls'. I wanted something haunting, difficult, drenched with confusing symbolism and deeply philosophical. Gene Wolfe is now my favorite writer and I can't get enough.
lol! 'the dark souls of books' is a pretty good description for it. i think that should be the tag line on the next edition they put out
@@PintsAndPaperbacks Souls-like is the next fantasy/sf sub genre😆
The Alzabo Soup podcast has an hour breaking down each chapter of the book. A great asset for a deep dive.
Hey thanks! I will definitely check that out
I thought they only do Book of the Long Sun?
@@gilgamesh2832 The haven't started Long Sun yet. They've been working through New Sun for years.
Also check out the death sentence podcast. They are just starting
By far my favorite book and have read the series twice. I'm constantly thinking about it and wanting more of it my life. I'm looking forward to my third reading.
i reckon i should be proud of myself. i breezed through Shadow and Claw utterly engaged. i just snagged Sword and Citadel to continue.
i found all the archaic terms obvious and used in context. i do think young readers will have a bit of headscratching in store but if your shelf is full of science fiction and Gulliver's Travels, Robinson Crusoe, Out of the Silent Planet and The Odyssey, you will have found your bliss. the far off lands have been replaced by the stars and the travelers have brought back unfathomable wonders, along with other travelers and beasts. the society of old Urth has solidified into a rigid hierarchy, enforced with alien technology with an Autarch at the pinnacle. Our hero was taken from his mother's arms into a cloistered guild of torturers and she was tortured and killed within earshot in the same tower. he is raised to manhood in the guild and sent away due to an act of mercy. thus our story begins. it's a hard and puzzling road told from the first person by a torturer with an eidetic memory. there are no explanations and we must unravel mysteries along with him. who can resist?
i would also mention The Glass Bead Game and Anathem as corollary. you have just entered an intellectual cloister on a better, older world. what do you expect?
“Sometimes driven aground by the photon storms, by the swirling of the galaxies, clockwise and counterclockwise, ticking with light down the dark sea-corridors lined with our silver sails, our demon-haunted sails, our hundred-league masts as fine as threads, as fine as silver needles sewing the threads of starlight, embroidering the stars on black velvet, wet with the winds of Time that go racing by. The bone in her teeth! The spume, the flying spume of Time, cast up on these beaches where old sailors can no longer keep their bones from the restless, the unwearied universe. Where has she gone? My lady, the mate of my soul? Gone across the running tides of Aquarius, of Pisces, of Aries. Gone. Gone in her little boat, her nipples pressed against the black velvet lid, gone, sailing away forever from the star-washed shores, the dry shoals of the habitable worlds. She is her own ship, she is the figurehead of her own ship, and the captain. Bosun, Bosun, put out the launch! Sailmaker, make a sail! She has left us behind. We have left her behind. She is in the past we never knew and the future we will not see. Put out more sail, Captain for the universe is leaving us behind…”--From Citadel
You think that one was fun? Now its time to go headfirst into book of the long sun, and have fun with that one
i read somewhere where wolfe has severian as a torturer because all men are torturers unless they are capable of showing mercy, which severian is and does.
I’m halfway through Shadow, no idea what’s going on or why, clueless really, but FASCINATED...
Love the honest review by the way, and agree that just because art of any kind is complex, does not mean it cannot be enjoyed by us commoners 😉
I like my books like my music, like you mentioned, just depends on the day...
heck yes! glad you liked the review.
its so worth it to keep going through it all the way to the end in my opinion. and it seems the consensus is that its even better the second time you read it. and then even better the third and so on.
also, tons of people here on this video have recommended me the Alzabo soup podcast as a supplement to reading the books. i'm actually doing a reread myself of book of the new sun and so i'm just now starting listening to the podcast and i agree that it is GREAT! so glad everyone told me about it. They go through the books basically chapter by chapter and also bring in information from the Lexicon Urthus. So if you want i'd check that out as you read along. here's a link to their site: alzabosoup.libsyn.com/
Pints And Paperbacks thanks for the link! I think that a book that begs to be started again immediately upon finishing it is a darn good book...
Ive gone down the rabbit hole and made it all the way through Book of the Long Sun with Patera Silk. I understand maybe 25% of what ive read but its by far the most rewarding, hauntingly beautiful escape ive ever experienced. Keep at it, we have an amazing puzzle that will last us a lifetime.
Please read the Book of the New Sun first (including The Urth of the New Sun),followed by the
Long Sun and then the Short Sun. Happy reading and R.I.P. Mr Wolfe. What a genius!
I mentioned these books to a coworker who I had met at our lunch break. I noticed that he was a fantasy/science fiction fan. He always had a book to read at our lunch break. The next day he told me that he was putting it on his Christmas list to read. I think he will be pleased:)
I've read the entire Solar Cycle twice. I can honestly say it was worth it. The ending is very satisfying. For now, don't worry about the Lexicon Urthus. That's for Lap 2+.
I also would recommend the Alzabo Soup podcast. Those guys are great. They're just to the end of The Urth of the New Sun ( Book 5 of 12).
Read Chapter 1 of Shadow and listen to their 1st episode.
Cheers, mate. Hope to see you on the other side.
I just started their podcast this morning! I've been really itching to read more wolfe the last couple days. I think i'm gonna start with a re-read of book of the new sun to refresh and then go into Urth of the New Sun and then hopefully the whole rest of the solar cycle!
I'm loving the podcast so far! I'll probably read along with it as i go.
I thought it was really great, also his Soldier of the Mist books
this is a great “review”. I actually really enjoyed not fully comprehending everything in the text. I would go back and read a paragraph over again, but have no interest in re-reading these books, within the same decade at least. Everything about the book is so strange, the world and characters, so that even if a weird image in my head isn’t what the narrator intended... eh... that’s the magic of literature that I think Gene would appreciate.
Yea ill have to pick it up in one format or another
Do it. You can tell that the dudes who made Warhammer 40,000 drew a ton of influence from this book.
Might go with ebook sense it would be easy to look up the meaning of archaic words?
I love the imagery and the lexicon.
Also I'm kind of moderately familiar with this book (by which I mean I've studied it extensively for like two years) so yeah, hit me up if you want if you're still interested.
I had a feeling that Homer would come into it.
A good book is one I remember.
Yes you should read this series . It will raise your IQ 50 points. You may need an Oxford unabridged dictionary , my mother was an English teacher ,Wolf uses words I've never seen befor. The book takes place in a time when man as a species is exhausted and starting the slide down to extinction. There is no allegory in the series, like a lot of these sites the speaker likes the sound of there own voice . Read the books and don't listen to talking heads. If his insight is valid then he should write a book ,if not ignore the man with alcohol in hand.
I was aware of these in the 80s as the book covers were so striking. I then read them in the 90s, got both hooked and confused...so I found the Lexicon Urthus and the Solar Labyrinth and went...Ahhhhhh... They're not for everyone, but the Books of the New Sun are awesome, for us..the Initiate. I'd also add that I bought the Audible versions and it's excellent if read to you. But you lose the strange uses of ( the written) Latin and Greek, but it's still otherworldly.
Great video man, i was looking for a discussion of this book for awhile. I would highly recommend a better microphone. Your voice and discussion is top notch, but it gets muddied a bit with the sound quality. Looking forward to more!
Thank you! And yeah the audio is pretty low quality lol I actually had a decent mic but the settings I was using were completely wrong! I’ve since gotten much better at fixing the audio but still need a better mic eventually
I've read all three at least 3 times.
Whoa, not sure if this book's for me. But this was a great review!
Check out the podcast Alzabo Soup. Great place to find out more.
The true Joyce-ian(??) science fiction novel is Dhalgren by Samuel L. Delaney which I would NEVER recommend to anyone because 90% of people who start it never finish it (it's also X-rated and has an invisible plot). But it's still burned into my mind after dozens of years as one of the most mind-blowing novels I've ever read. I actually liked Book of the Long Sun better than Book of the New Sun, which was (in my opinion) a much easier read.
Booktube Goddess I see a lot of people online recommending Long Sun and Short Sun to read after this. What about Urth of the New Sun? I was planning on having that be my next Wolfe... better to just move to Long/Short Sun?
Hmm, I honestly don't remember reading Urth of the New Sun, so I'm not sure. The Long Sun is (for me) the series of Wolfe that sticks out in my mind the most.
@@PintsAndPaperbacks Read Urth of the New Sun as it concludes the story of Severian the Torturer. Then if you want to read another story in the same universe with different characters read Long Sun.
Definitely got Urth of the new sun next on my list. I kind of want to read the whole 'Solar Cycle' eventually though.
Dhalgren is trash.
What do you want to know about the book?
It's been one of my favourite books since I first read it about 15 years ago. Have you read any of his other books?
i've only read the Book of the New Sun books so far. but I'm going to read Urth of the New Sun this year! do you have any recommendations for more Gene Wolfe?
@@PintsAndPaperbacks The Long Sun Quatrology and Short Sun Trilogy are just as good as The Book of the New Sun. Latro in the Mist (a two book compilation you can get cheaply off Amazon) is amazing, with an unreliable narrator like Severian but for a very different reason. Peace is one of his sneakiest books but also a flat-out masterpiece.
great review!
Thank you!
Yes.
👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Read 'em all....and stil got the same opinion....make no sense!!
I just finished this book after reading several different recommendations for fans of the dark souls games.
I gotta say i dont get it; its a fine novel for sure, but it doesnt even come close to scratching that itch i was hoping it would. Dark souls games are so solitary and somber and the atmosphere is kind of like the main character. This novel just pairs the protagonist with on person or party after another.
That's not what dark souls is about at all. Dark souls is a multiplayer game. Both have subtle underlying themes and story that needs careful consideration. Dark souls doest spoon feed u the story
This books sounds like to much work to read. I will have to pass:(
I too made that decision at first , then gave it a Shot anyway and started to read the book with expectations that i would not understand the bigger picture and the subtleties,but to my surprise it did not need that much attention and work if you just continue to read all will become clear eventually (For Example) in the first book he was greeted by the Brothel Manager ,if you pay-attention you will notice that Severian describe his strange eyes but does not Give it a much though right away it might seem like for him as a minor thing , but for the Reader that man is a Cyborg /Android Severian describe things as best as his mind can interprate things,For example he Raped and abused a woman in a bout but via his eyes she did not mind it In Fact he later Tells himself that she asked for it.Anyway Read the Book it is Easy to read and the new Dictionary is Useless the Words translation have a different meaning in the book although it is a clue of their origin. Example The dictionary translate the word ARMIGER -a person entitled to heraldic arms. But the Book uses that word as Armiger =Knight so you will learn the new lexicon by it's use . Have Fun it is Really good book one of the Best Like Reading the Thoughs of God Emperor Leto the 2
Dimitry Romanov Wrong the brothel owner is not an Android. He is a Eunuch
pleb
@@Pantano63 lol
At the risk of sounding pretentious, if you're going to compare a work to Moby Dick, I think Blood Meridian would be a more fruitful comparison
not pretentious at all! thanks for the advice. Blood Meridian is probably the book that has been on my to-read list for the longest time. i've tried to read it several times but that book really gets to me every time idk what it is about it.
hopefully this channel will help me finally get that one done
@@PintsAndPaperbacks It's a harsh novel. I'm a giant fan of Hotline Miami and I still consider Blood Meridian the goriest piece of art I've ever consumed. Like when infants have their brains dashed on rocks and that's a direct reference to the old testament, that is definitely a novel that isn't fucking around. As much as I adore it, it is absolutely a lot.
Have you read TBotNS? If so then you know the many homages to Moby Dick Wolfe included.
I know a lot about this book. Ask :)
yes, thank you! okay, so I considered that little bit about the picture of the 'warrior' actually being the photograph of the apollo 14 moon landing an amazing little easter egg type thing. so my question: what in the book was the most mind blowing one to you?
@@PintsAndPaperbacks The hidden story behind it. Make no mistake, this novel does not have a simple picaresque story. There is a complex story underneath it and all the allegorical elements serve it - the novel does not have allegorical elements and symbols just to give a political/theological message. Instead all these layers servr the hidden story behind the surface. Getting to that story is tricky and definitely requires rereads. But the story is just as clear as reading a novel with a regular plot, when you uncover it. Reading the Urth after New Sun will make the hidden story raise to the surface.
"...one seamless story.."
What a crock! You should review what you just said and "hear" if it makes sense. That is, if you can detect coherence! You cite inane allusions and assert "plot"? Melville has ideas. Does Gene Wolfe make you think about issues of the human condition in a new or enlightening way? Can you cite one idea in Wolfe that is not better written about by others?
Maybe your confusion is a hint. Not that you're dumb, but that you're smart!