1950s ATR Power Inverter Repair - It's a Mechanical SMPS!
Вставка
- Опубліковано 5 кві 2024
- Repair of a Mechanical Switch Mode Power Supply from the 50s! It takes 6VDC, then turns it into 110VAC, and you are the regulator! Let's make it work again. To learn electronics in a very different and effective way, and gain access to Mr Carlson's personal designs and inventions, visit the Mr Carlson's Lab Patreon page here: / mrcarlsonslab
#restoration #electronics #repairing - Наука та технологія
To learn electronics in a very different and effective way, and gain access to Mr Carlson's personal designs and inventions, visit the Mr Carlson's Lab Patreon page here: www.patreon.com/MrCarlsonsLab
What happened to the BC348Q Resto? You started it, but I never saw any videos of you finishing it. Maybe I missed them?
I have one of these exact units. It was my first electronics repair way back in 1968 at age 13. My dad had one sitting on a shelf in the garage for years. I don't know if he ever even had it operating. I asked him what it was, and when he told me, I immediately thought about using it for the amateur radio Field Day that year. But, it did not work, so I took it apart and not knowing anything about what I was doing, I found the capacitor across the AC line was bad. I replaced it with one from his stock of parts. He was also a ham radio operator, and that's where I learned about electronics, starting about age 9 by building a crystal radio. As it turned out, this unit didn't have enough capacity to run the radio equipment, but it fascinated me at a very young age, and by repairing it, I gained enough confidence to continue learning how to repair electronics and went on to have a successful career in the field of electronics, even spending a few years as chief engineer at an AM/FM radio station, all with no formal electronics training, just what I learned as a ham radio operator. I would love to see a full restoration on this unit. I would probably dig mine out and do the same for it. Thanks for this video. It brought back some very good memories of my younger days.
Thanks for sharing your story David!
Reminds me of the Honda E300 generator I came across 20 years ago. 2 stroke 50cc, 300 watt output. Got it free as a non runner, got it going, was all proud of myself, then couldn't figure out what the heck I'd want to power that ate less than 300 watts while also listening to a swarm of pissed off bees the whole time, lol.
Ended up selling it shortly after, and now that I've gotten full blown in to old cars and equipment, I really regret it.....
I’d love to see the AC waveform in this device including how clean it may be!
i had one as well back when i was 8 years old very interesting. it was when i started fixing tv's & radios in the early 70's i had a tube tester & would make regular trips to the drug store to buy tubes. this brought back good memories 😃
@davidbrittenham4631 I love this story! I'd also like to see the full restoration.
26:21 Yes, please do the entire restoration
and thanks in advance
Can you please measure the efficiency of the circuit and show the waveform on the oscilloscope ?
Yep. Thumbs-un on a total restoration. That old piece of equipment is so plainly, sheetmetalian cool. It could have been on the set of Forbidden Planet.
It at least deserves rust treatment on the binding posts and some fresh caps. To be honest the paint looks to be in decent condition, and adds to the charm.
Yes to the restoration please!
Yes on the rebuild! Also would've liked to see the AC output on a scope, loaded and unloaded.
I'd like to see it before and after recapping.
I would like to see that too.
What you would see on a scope is a dirty Square wave with some HV peaks, the capacitors are meant to tame them.
Yes, with all that arcing the wave pattern would be quite tough. I wonder if there is any filtering in the device? If did have the layer on the output wires.
Mr C will add a board and make it a near perfect sine wave. He da man! 👍
The big transformer will kill off much of the HF in the output. But the shielding is needed to help reduce HF being introduced in the cables themselves. And the capacitors are very much needed to reduce the radiation out on the 6V leads.
I would love a restoration, and then an analysis of the the output and the different settings with a scope. What a cute little contraption!
I'd say yes to an electrical restoration, but no on the outside appearance. To me, I like the old look. Thanks for showing how a vibrator tube works! Always heard them in old car radios, but never knew how they did their job.
my ex ''''she knew vibrators better than anyone''''''''
I'd like to see a full restoration. The vibrator reminds me of the old tube radio that was in my dad's 1953 Cadillac. They were always going bad. When you turned on the radio the first thing you would hear was the sound of the vibrator until the tubes warmed up and the radio came alive. Brings back memories.
I say go for it - with all this solid state stuff around, it'll be refreshing to hear the hum of something actually working instead of just sitting there like a museum display.
Appreciating the frequency of your videos lately - the winter is long and incessantly wet in my neck of the woods - a bit of Carlson bench-time is always welcome
A full restoration? Yes, please.
I vote YES on complete restoration. I love the long form videos !
Nice little handheld EMI generator you got there !
Some of today's "cheap" S.M.P.S.'s are even worse.... 😬
A portable spark-gap transmitter.
@@davelowets you say that ,but i live in one the crappiest third world countries of the world & we get absoulute worst quality products including smps , but i havent encountered any horrible EMI from them . Also , we dont even have earth ground in our homes , we only have neutral & live
Around 1970 a girl in my car asked what the buzzing was and I said my heart, now 54 years later the buzzing is in my ear. ! It was of course the vibrating oscillator in my car radio common at the time. It was annoying so I found a radio with the 12AD6 etc valve set with 12v anodes and built a transistor output stage, glad to say the music plays on. Thanks, a real trip down memory lane as these contacts were a continual source of bother.
Space charge tubes are cool... 😎
Back in the 1950's I filed the points on dozens of the automobile radio vibrators-most built before 1940. Contrary to some comments, these circuits were well shielded and filtered. Switching power supply designers haven't learned a thing when it comes to supressing interference. The hardest part was removing the power supply from the car which was usually located in a difficult to access location. Interested in learning about the function of the voltage regulator rotary switch.
Of course we would like to see the Restauration!
Now I want to find a mechanical inverter! That's was awesome Paul! Would love to see this get a well deserved restoration.
You could make your own pretty easily with a d.p.d.t relay, a transformer, and a few capacitors. Getting the frequency tuned to 60hz without the help of an external oscillator circuit to power the relay would be really hard, but it would work nontheless.
The manual "regulation" comment reminds me of something that was often said when we were studying electronics at technical college: the output will remain constant when adjusted to do so
When I saw that pendulum swing and saw that blue spark, all I could think of was "beautiful!"
Thank you Mr Carlson, I’m 70 and had a short career in the uk learning, building and repairing equipment, most I learnt getting hands on and you get the ahhh moment and get a happy customer. I get great joy in knowing you are so knowledgeable and enjoy your videos. Thank you ❤
All by myself
Yes please! A restoration would be most interesting - these sort of electro-mech devices show the ingenuity designers had before everything could be done 'solid state'!
In the early 1970's I was a soldier with the US Army. After my year in Nam, I was stationed with the 3rd ACR communications secion. We had radio teletype van that ran on both 24 volts for the radios and 110 for the teletype machines. To get that 110 while on the road or temparorily parked we could turn on two rotary inverters, when we sat up for a long time we started up the 2 110 volt generators that we hauled behind the rig on a trailor. The HQ would tap in to our generators for electrical power in their tents. The generators were 10 KW and ran on motor fuel (gas),
Thanks for sharing your story Jerry!
Absolutely would love to see this given some new guts and a new coat of paint. What a charming little device.
Absolutely yes, please, on the full restoration of the ATR power supply.
Thank you!
Coming from a car Hot Rodding Family, I learned about vibrators years ago. A switch on the dash to turn them on, and off, two in the trunk wired to two seperate ignition coils and condensers that had the high voltage ran out to a spark plug welded into each exhaust pipe. Set the carb to run rich, rev it up, flip the switch, and you had twin flamethrowers out of the exhaust. Pretty awesome when you’re a kid!
And, of COURSE we want to see you restore it. We ALWAYS learn something new from you, and your attention to detail that will serve us well on a completely unrelated project we’re working on.
Yes, I remeber that well. Foot to the floor, car ignition shuts off and tailpipe plugs turn on. Those are hot flames, perfect mixture!
Definitely do a complete restoration! Very cool device. Back in the 50s and 60s I used a Ford Model T spark coil to provide the spark to my Dyna-Jet pulse-jet engine for control-line speed flying. The coil stepped-up 6 volts to about 20kv with a set of vibrating points. Worked great!
I wish they still made these simple machines!
I'd really love to see the waveform that comes out of that outlet and an analysis of what devices would be safe to power with it. Thank you for another excellent video.
I think the wavefor is very clean, the big transformer is a lowpass filter. Not so sure about the frequency maybe a little unsteady...
I've got an old late 40s or 50s military aircraft radio think rx/tx, with the same electro/mechanical power supply.
It's built for the military, so it's better constructed, and it's aluminium.
It also has on the back of the valve electronics several big frequency crystals.
I would have used an even softer cleaning device. Good job it was built when things were meant to last or the contactor would have been damaged, plating, or surface damaged.
Yes, please do a complete restoration.
I find you are very knowledgeable, thorough and it can be passed on to your viewers.
Thanks for the video.
This brought back a memory. Back in maybe 62 found a radio that was in a similar box at a trash dump. I remember the sound when I connected it to a battery. OK, I was 8 and stupid. Probably a 6 volt, but connected to a 12 volt battery. The one that he has looks great. The one that I played with, the case was all rust.
I would certainly like a full restoration of this.
Hey Mr. Carlson... Yes an full restoration would be fun and educational to watch. Meanwhile since a 6 volt vintage car radios also use the vibrator oscillator system, a revival of an old radio would also be nice to see.
Your channel has bee of much help to me over the past 5 or 6 years or so in my learning form you what a capacitor is. In the meantime I have resorted a few vintage German radios.
The cool kids in the 50´s I imagine ran a nice beach party with this. Park the Caddie aside, idle running, open hood, the buzzer with a long ac lead to power a turntable and a radio.
Not so much a restoration but a time correct demo (like I mentioned) I´d like to see. Let´s listen to some RocknRoll for a change...
Mr Carlsons lab your antique atr power inverter is awesome from 1950s
Mr. Carlson, you are a gift to the technically minded. keep up the good work.
Great find mr. Carlson. I love to see hammer finish this thing... As a matter of fact it was just a question in a german forum of how to do that. Not worth metion actually.
Always enjoy your videos and thanks for taking your time doing this stuff. We love you! Stay healthy man!
The museum quality collection of working antique electro-gizmos never ceases to amaze.
Definitely do a complete restoration and show what the output looks like on an oscilloscope!
Would really enjoy the full restoration of this device. 👍
Yes please restore it
Hi Paul, I really want to see the continuation of the Grand Receiver Restoration Series. So that's my vote. Keep up the inspiring work! I know its very time-consuming.
No doubt, Paul. Make this goodie shine again! Great video, as always!
Nicely done Mr C, the tubing cutter solution was one I hadn't thought of to be honest. Maybe an electronic restoration leaving the exterior as is would be plausible. This is a unique piece meant to be seen and demonstrated, not necessarily used. Another great video down memory lane, much appreciated. Thanks.
YES! Please restore! Maybe scope it so we could have a before-and-after look?
Paul. Please do a video on restoration of your HP141T Spectrum Analyzer. Keep em coming. Another great video. Thanks for sharing your knowlege.
Many of the old vacuum tube car radios of the 50's had a mechanical vibrator device to use as part of the circuit to step up 6 or 12 volt electrical systems to a working voltage for the vacuum tubes. It was a plug in cylindrical device that you could actually hear vibrating if you put your ear close to.
Mr Carlsons lab you are good at restoring antique radios and alignment of antique radios my friend
That's pretty nifty Paul. Thanks 🙂
Thanks for stopping by Dave!
The mecanical oscillator overswing - smart - when it does not functions it do not draw current overheating the transformer 👍😎👍
Please do the restoration, awesome video as always 👍👍👍😎
Definite yes on the full restoration of this gem. Nice to see more old ATR equipment around ! They were certainly durable devices. I have and still use my fathers old filtered "battery eliminator" from the late '50s; model 610C-ELIF. The AC line bypass capacitor has been replaced but the two original "computer grade" filters (4k mfd 15 volt each) are still going strong as are the original disc rectifiers. I use it in servicing automobile radios, portable TVCR / DVD combos, etc... Though it's been a few years since I scoped its output, its always been very smooth and reliable. The single only issue nowadays is the accuracy of the meters. But, I monitor that with separate meters. I don't think it has an internal calibration adjust but haven't looked. I'm reluctant to pull it apart when it still works so well. ATR certainly wanted their equipment to be long lived and it shows. Also, thanks for the demonstration of how you service vibrators. I haven't used that method of entry before but certainly intend to. Great job 👍
I'd love to see the waveform that device outputs, as it'll definitely be pretty unclean. I really enjoyed this video, thanks Mr Carlson!
Would love to see a restoration of this inverter along with analysis displaying the characteristics.
A full restore video and looking at its output waveform on a scope would be awesome!
Absolutely would like to see a full restoration with some additional testing/loads etc.on this unit, thank you Professor Carlson.
Would love to see a restoration on that!
What a neat piece. Restoration video would be great!
Takes me back to high school in the 60's. I fixed one of those in the electronics lab, same issue.
Thanks for sharing and yes I'd like to see a full resto.
Oh great oldest electronic stuffing I really enjoyed .
Glad you enjoyed it
Fantastic inverter I never know something like this was present.. I have seen a single ferrite rod inverter my father had 20 years ago the oldest inverter I ever know.. but this is awesome
22:10 that is so cool :D
Basically if you want to use a relay to make pwm
Yes please do a full restoration of this lovely little unit :D
And I would love to see some measurements of the output :)
Hey Mr Carlson good job of explaining how macnical power supplies work 🤠😁👍👍👍👍✌️👏👨
Great mechanical inverter, I never thought that Mechanical inverter have been exist
Restoration please Mr Carlson 🙂👍
The restoration would be much appreciated!!
Great video, always nice to see some older stuff get fixed, rather than dumped.
I want to see the spark show when that vibrator is running with the case off round back, please...
Things back then had beautiful aesthetics.
Entire resto job on it!! Yes please!!
I have a friend that participates in a WWII club. He rebuilds old troop transports and Jeeps. They have meet ups. I repaired his Echophone EC1 and his vibrator. He puts the old radio on the tailgate of the vehicle and runs it with the vibrator. He has allot of fun with it.
I remember repairing vibrator driven tube car radios way back when. Loved the odd rubbery smell inside the vibrator when dissembled
An old fashion doorbell with extra contacts driving a transformer.
I put one in on my motor cycle once to run my hand made QRP mobile rig in India. Oh about 60 years ago! Love it, Thanks..
The emergency rescue radios carried by WW2 airmen had a word kind of smps built in that was very simple, almost just a relay and a capacitor, when charged the capacitor de-energises the coil in the relay.
Yes please - full restoration please!
Your bench is awe inspiring. It keeps me mindful of my own space, and I find myself organizing more after one of your videos.
Great stuff! I’d like to see quality of the AC under load. And see the effects, if any, of replacing the caps. It would be great to also hear how an AC powered AM radio sounds on this thing to see how well the shielding really performs. What sort of load could this handle? It would be interesting to see what sort of devices could run off a 6 volt car battery, and the effect of the regulator switch. Thanks again! It’s great to see this older technology up and running!
Yes, as a new electronics enthusiast, I would love to see you restore that.
Great video Mr Carlson sir and I happy old inverter seed. I think big relay used on inverter contacting voltage amp and battery connection over and under voltage ⚡️ but this model vibration is on when current and voltage generated but old is gold sir never ever fails and thanks for sharing this video sir nice 😊❤❤
Yes, absolutely....lets restore this interesting part of history. Thank you kindly, Greg.😀
Oh absolutely. Full resto please Sir😀 A great channel with brilliant content as always Paul. Wishing and yours well - Best regards from the western Isles of Scotland
I wouldn't mind watching the entire restoration of this ATR unit.
I cant believe I haven't found your channel yet! Instant subscribe! Im going to build my own vibration oscillator small inverter.
Greetings from McMurdo Station Antarctica 😊
Welcome aboard!
What's the network latency like down there?
Me too - full restoration. Love to see you tackle the non-electronic parts (eg. soldering the can and painting the case) .
100% for the complete restore, please. This thing deserves it.
Yes, please do the entire restoration
Definitely interested in seeing the full resotration of this unit.
It would also be really interesting to see how much noise was on the supply and how good the shielding works.
This really shows that technology may change the components used, but the actual principles of operation have not changed much over time.
Very nice 👍 my old boss told me about these when we were talking about a power supply I was working on for some equipment. Never actually saw one in the wild, but he did say they were very unreliable. Cool to see one working, same principal as the old door bells.
Cheers,
Jake
I would like to see a full restoration. What a cool device
Yes, a complete restore, as well as scope analysis at various points. I am glad to see more things than radios (not that I am complaining about radios).
Yes, a restoration would be nice to see.
- Thank you
This was the standard way of doing things even into the 60s...I used to find these vibrator type converters well into the 1970s gathering dust around.
We would enjoy seeing a restoration of this vintage inverter
What an interesting piece of hardware! Great work bring this to your channel and absolutely a full restore would be awesome, especially showcasing the soldering of the vibrator can. Thanks for your work!
I have heard one of these running when I was a kid but have never seen inside it...very cool!
Would love to see this restored too.
Mr.Carlson, you have changed your format and as a viewer I so enjoy it Keep up the great videos! Yes, please!
A Complete restoration would be excellent, With perhaps a deeper dive into support components and methods used to refine wave form and frequency would be most welcomed. Over the top would be a compare and contrast with how this device compares to a currently produced inverter in terms of longevity and stability. As always ❤ your through treatments and tidbits, thank you for making the efforts!
YES do the full resto!
In the 1950's a toy train manufacture American Flyer used those tubes for their model trains to generate a 600 cycle tone to mimic the sound of a diesel locomotive air horn. It sounded awful but it was able to superimpose the tone onto track power and play through a speaker in the engine. This video is super helpful for me so I know how to repair those generator tubes. Main difference is the ones for the trains are 4 pin.
I still have my AF set
.!!!
The first contact was very far gone. However, if the contacts aren't *that* bad (the 4 round contacts are not something that i would've used sandpaper on), first use a piece of ordinary printer paper soaked in contact cleaner. After that, repeat the cleaning with dry paper.
Sometimes, the contacts are coated with something and you want to avoid removing that coating as much as possible. This also goes for relay contacts, switch contacts etc.
Silver. You are correct using paper. I'm guessing with these however there's no silver on the contacts because it wouldn't survive the high arcing.
That is a beautiful old inverter. Thank you for sharing this with us! I have always liked the old vibrating reed devices like this. Would like to see how well the frequency remains stable across different loads an supply voltages.