How this machine transformed our capability overnight
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- Опубліковано 24 тра 2024
- Recently, we parted ways with our Tormach PCNC 1100 and progressed to a completely new machine that will dramatically increase our CNC machining capability: the new Tormach 1500MX. This video gets into the details behind this machine, how it's already helping us make parts for the DarkAero 1 prototype, and how it will carry us into making production parts for kits.
DarkAero Careers - darkaero.com/careers
DarkAero 1 Aircraft - darkaero.com/aircraft
DarkAero Courses - darkaero.com/courses
DarkAero Services - darkaero.com/services
DarkAero Apparel - darkaero.com/shop
If you enjoyed this video and would like to see more of this type of content, follow along as we work to engineer the fastest, longest-range aircraft you can build in your garage!
0:00 - Intro
1:00 - DarkAero 1 Prototype
1:53 - 1500MX Specs, Features
3:55 - Machining Demo
7:16 - The Key Advantage of this Machine
9:58 - Final Thoughts
More information on DarkAero can be found on our website and other social media accounts:
www.darkaero.com
/ darkaeroinc
/ darkaero-inc
/ darkaeroinc - Наука та технологія
Visibly vibrating with excitement as he shows us this machine. LOL
So awesome.
Start keeping track of parts and versions on spreadsheets, once you start machining stuff yourself, you need a good way to keep track of all the stuff you forgot you made. You never know when a previous version can help you out in the future.
Often I look at previous work with current eyes and I get new insights looking at what I did. It helps when you know why you do something because you were the one that did it.
Spreadsheets are not a good way to do this. It isn’t that hard to start out with a real database that is much more capable, reliable and provides much greater query and reporting tools.
For this size of manufacturing a spreadsheet is fine. For medium and large scale you are right.
Good advice. But this is not they're first machine. I'm pretty sure they have a process nailed down.
@@triedproven9908 i would suggest using something like git as a versioning database . should be as easy to use as a spreadsheet even for small scale manufacturing.
Take a look at the documentation on their website for this kit. They are leagues ahead of any other kit manufacturer for how they are handling things like this.
Just my 2 cents worth: Just because you can do incredibly complex machined parts doesn't mean you need to, or should. You can't make money making the most expensive, elegantly designed and complicated parts. Pretty much all the metal parts I see here could be made cheaper and easier. Production engineering is reigning in the design engineer who has been given a blank check!
Thank you for checking out the video and thank you for sharing your thoughts!
Agreed! Machined parts shouldn't be overly complicated and should be designed for manufacturing. We have discussed this topic in a number of our videos. A few here:
ua-cam.com/video/ehC9oUf9Fm0/v-deo.html
ua-cam.com/video/sbl6N2MUux8/v-deo.html
ua-cam.com/video/HyOscBDsxjo/v-deo.html
ua-cam.com/video/psVpeic0oOY/v-deo.html
Many of the machined components we show probably look more complicated than they really are. Remember that we machined all of our prototype parts on an entry level CNC mill, which should serve as a indication of how challenging they are to manufacture.
Nice to be able to make prototype parts and verify them first though. Even if you end up casting them or extruding them or forging them later.
I would remove the probe from the machine before machine. We ruined a probe as it wasn't waterproof.
Totally agree. I've seen some 3-setup parts on this channel that could easily be turned into 1-setup parts... but hey that comes with experience 🙂
the fact that we can see what's going on every step of the way is awesome!
As a Haas user I'm happy to see some local competition move up-market. Haas nickel and dime me to death to turn on software features and they generally don't care unless your shop runs many large machines.
Keep it up, Tormach! Make Haas worry.
Perhaps they need to end their Haas F1 funding to improve their service?
@@abel4776 Haas was doing this before F1.
congrats on the new 1500mx Tormach. wicked machine!
I am happy for any process improvements you guys have made and will make. It’s exciting to watch.
Very happy for you, guys! Great asset. Make good use of it!
Very cool stuff you've got going on! Looking forward to one day owning our own machine someday. Thanks for the video!
Nice work guys!!
Super cool that you guys have the first one!
Awesome upgrade!
Sweet machine! I'm been following machining YTbers for 5+ years and I can really appreciate what you have! Grimsmo did tours of Miltera and TORNOS and those machines were sick...you guys definitely upped your game with the changer, tool offset and more efficient cleaning. [Your] tolerances and parts uniformity will be on point. Happy for you guys, team, and families.
Congrats on the new capital! It's so exciting to see this project progress
I really enjoy watching your videos. I am following your progress and videos make it so much more engaging. My desire to put a deposit down increases with each new one that comes out.
Effing serial number ONE !!! (Personally, I would have held out for S/N 007…)
You guys have clearly made a 3-point landing pulling that off. Congratulations!
Nothing a Sharpie can't fix.
I've actually been informed that Dark Aero does have SN: MI10007. So technically it is 007. Maybe time to buy some tuxedos.
@@tormachinc well now you're going to have to make it to James Bond special, lol.
@@tormachinc I am humbled that your official account responded to such a flippant comment. Hopefully one of these days I’ll get my nascent channel off the ground and be doing cool enough stuff to warrant buying one of your machines.
@@tormachinc This is an awesome idea. Tuxedo for the test pilot’s first flight, and tuxes for all three brothers on their first flights! Will Tormach be there for the big day?
Very cool, I think tormach makes some really nice entry-level units. Nice to see they're making some bigger more commercial units as well now.
Thanks! We're getting there.
Congratz guys! Very exciting!
Thank you Max!
Nice, looks like a great machine for you guys, keep us posted on how it's working for you
Like to add many years ago I ran a very large Milling Centers and came up with an Idea to safe One hour milling time. So Dark Aero when you up and ready for Production. Add more vises to you Lathe and number them 1 Vise 2Vise 3Vise then you ready to Save Time and make Money. Also for your coolant and air also to help chips removing. Riley take care miss chatting. Peace Brothers. Greg of Ohio
Would love to hear more about the state of ground testing and your plans for flight testing!
Currently setting up the main gear drop test. We are excited to share more on that soon!
This project is going great! I love your motivation and dedication to push forward!
General aviation hasn't changed much in the past 50 years or so,m and I hope people like you help shape a brighter future for GA.
Many people have failed, but some did succeed (Take Van's for example). History is not meant to be repeated.
I give you the best of luck (and my support) to succeed!
Its been a while, great to see new content. EDIT: I just bought some merch from a group of guys in the US making an amazing aircraft, as thats all I can afford to help you all on your project. I so wish I was in a position to order a kit, perhaps someday : )
Congratulations.
Excellent! :)
Congratsssss!
It's great that you are obviously well-funded, which will help ensure you reach your goals. Can't wait to read about the flying aircraft.
Nice! You guys are cruising now.
At 25:00 “It looks like we cracked it.”
My Canadian heart drops into my stomach…
Oh as in “crack on!”
LOL
This new 1550 Tormach s one sweet machine. Looking forward to seeing you guy making lots of chips.
Definitely an upgrade for Tormach. Very impressed with your resourcefulness and ability to produce high quality assembly components with a simple style VMC. As Dark Aero grows and progresses, a few 5 axis machines from perhaps the large names (DMG Mori / Mazak / Matsuura) will increase your capabilities further. Keep it up.
Cool beans! Slowly, methodically approaching that first flight.
That landing gear reminds me a lot of an automatic bimini top on a boat. The fuse is interesting, it's design to pop and then resets after a few seconds.
Very nice. Congratulations on the upgrade. What are you using to generate toolpaths from Onshape CAD?
Fun good luck 🎉guy's
Make sure to keep an eye on your coolant concentrations. With thru spindle coolant things can get clogged up pretty easily. Keeping your coolant concentrations at the right levels helps keep things from gumming up.
I'd love to see you guys do a Mike Patey collaboration! Tormach looks awesome.
That's a nice cnc. Looks like they really streamlined it.
Serial number 1. Nice.
you lucky lucky dawgs.
Interesting choice with the Tormach. I haven't read a lot of happy comments from owners of their CNC equipment
You must not be watching or reading much. I can find 20+ in 30 seconds that are perfectly happy with their machine.
There are generally two sides, the ones that scraped enough together to start a business or hobby machine and are perfectly happy, or the other side that work for someone that’s spent 6 figures on machines for them to use and think they are gods gift to machining.
There’s no shame in running a Tormach
Who does your CAM for the machine? Great looking stuff and such a good investment.
I hope to be able to buy one of your kits in the coming 2 to 3 years :)
Wish Y axis had 18 inch travel too! For large round parts.
Awesome - congrats - good timing on the purchase - serial number 1! Haha. I had thought you might go to a haas to get some chip removal and automation if needed.
pretty sure they are sponsored and I doubt they spent a penny on it. They deserve it though, showing how such a machine can be used in the hands of capable individuals. If they aren't sponsored, they should be.
@@UHLASKAGUY907 It's not a sponsorship. They're beta testers. We'll be going over to test the accuracy of the parts. Plus it helps that we're big fans and proud of their Wisconsin business.
@@tormachinc My bad on the mis info. I figured they had to be, and again, I think they should be. I found their channel because I was looking for a tip on producing a part on a tormach several years ago. Been following ever since. Thanks for setting the record straight. Used to run a 770 for years, and I would love to own a 1500 one of these days when my space and budget allow. Love your products.
can't wait to build my DA1
I'm sure we will see a fair few older model Tormach Mills hitting the market as many would be wanting to upgrade.
The new machine seems to have everything that was missing from previous models.
Decent size travels, and through spindle coolant is a big plus.
A few other things have also been improved on including an easier way to remove chips from inside the machine.
It looks like a nice machine that many guys out their will be dying to get their hands on 👍
Will you buy an autoclave too? Or is the advantage minimal compared to an oven?
Pretty cool machine, curious if you guys looked at syil before this choice
I personally would like to hear more about the authoring software you use. Does it still use M-Code and G-Code? Are you using ACAD or the software that comes with the system? It is really a nice looking setup. Specs about fluid wash/lube, etc. would be good. I guess I could look it up. You might want to get into race cars as well instead of just planes. Then eventually, you can build (me) a boat. ;). To get more into it, some cutters require a "cut in" path on every pattern due to devices like plasma cutters needing a hot start and then cut process.
wait what!!!! hell yeah, so excited, I'm in the market for a new machine and I will have to check this out
How much longer til this is flying…?
Do you need static dischargers on an aircraft with a carbon shell?🤔🤔
Great question!
Most likely…
A want vs. need.
My plane’s surfaces are painted… so the static build up is mostly paint rubbing air…. Won’t change much what is under the paint.
Where the static really builds…. Is flying through clouds and snow…
Used to be able to hear the effects of static in the radios…. (Back in the day).
I have No idea how sensitive GPS antennas are to static build up/discharge…
😃
Would like to see your team involved in a STEM program. I know things are busy for you at present, but something to consider.
Not the machine i was expecting but all the better. Showing quality parts can be made on machines in the realm of smaller companies 👍🏼🤛🏼
Nice machine!
How is taxi testing going?
Wasn't that almost 2 years ago? Maybe they weren't comfortable with something they found and needed to make some changes. Or maybe it was just bare bones and the kinks needed working out. Better safe than sorry
now the question of the question: can you activate TSC with a tool that doesn not have TSC functionality? Heidenhain for example has 8 Bits for each tool that i can set and one bit tells the control that the tool is TSC capable. If the tool has this bit set to 0 and i want to activate TSC it wont let me.
OK...more questions...How do you do quality control? That camera feature sounds like a start, but I am guessing you micrometer a lot of stuff. Is it the engineers or do you have a second set of eyes that develop their own processes for QA? Could the camera be used part of QA and used with AI to ensure quality?
What did that setup cost? That is in my future
Great stuff! Hope they gave you a cut to be their beta tester.
Need a trunnion table
And a pair of lathe spindles at each end and a way to get them changed with the table kind of like a pallet changer with different functions
Surprised you didn't look at a Syil - best bang for the buck machine out there these days it seems!
That's very cool! I'm looking at building a small one for making guitar parts from wood in my small shop. It uses an off-the-shelf small router as the cutter. It's like an antique version of this one. LOL --gary
As a guitarist, I am psyched that CNC is used in building guitars more and more. The precision and repeatability have really made for some great and affordable instruments.
@@tomcoryell I agree 100% I'm 72, and I started playing guitar in the 60's. I learned quickly that my first acoustic was terrible. LOL I have a lot of stories about the old days. 8) I'm glad young people have such good choices today, from US and overseas makers. After 50 years I don't gig too much anymore. I hunt for 100+ year old wood to make a few special guitars. I love my collection of old tools (and guitars!), but a CNC might be a nice "helper". Thanks! Peace --gary
Are you getting .0002" tolerance?
If my wife ever dies, this is going in the living room.
I like how these videos are just a little bit different from the early releases on the paid plan. Now I get to watch it a second time… 🤣
I have a low serial 1100m. Love it
What do you make with your 1100M?
G,day Keegan from Sydney Australia. Are you recycling waste aluminium or is there not enough?
That is some very impressive technology for your manufacturing process.
🌏🇦🇺
The chips are at best worth 50cents a pound ,and nobody will pick up small quantities.
It has been very interesting to see the development of the plane over time, but it has been more than 5 years now and it is time to stop playing with tools and get the thing flying.
How much have you donated?
Can u make things,that make sense,as yet another Plane?
Happy exitinction everybody❤
🆒😎🤘!
If you ever run a real cnc machine you will be blown away by the difference, Tormach and Syil are toys. If you want cheap then a used high quality machine that is still supported is the best bang for the buck.
Im surprised that a Tormach has a higher feed rate and bigger table size then the SYIL that Titans of CNC are promoting.
Looks like Tormach is similar to a Haas VF2 now.
VF-2 is 30 hp...
VF-2 has almost 8× more HP.
lmao...no.
Okay, let's get realistic here. Not 30 HP, but no slouch either. The 1500MX has 4 HP with a Max of 6 HP BT30 Spindle, that is also Through Spindle Coolant ready. But, unlike the VF2, runs on single phase power, and is designed to fit in most garages. It's a tiny beast. ua-cam.com/video/s2PfIHf9lOk/v-deo.html
Maybe a TL1.
When will the aircraft fly?
When it's ready.
How much $?
You don't have google?
Videos do not *NEED* music added to them. Give us ambient sound instead.
That’s totally almost as good as flying the airplane
one main thing i dont like is it still used the old ATC. syils is way better
Jealous, I have a couple 1100mx and am eyeing this 1500mx....very cool
You get it for free? I like the products and the company (I had an Series 3 1100MX), but this machine makes no sense vs. a HAAS at that cost.
It's a good deal cheaper, Haas nickel and dimes you for everything, much of which is standard on this machine. Add an RPC, rigging, etc and you're easily $15k deeper into anything with a Haas nameplate (including their DC1 which is nothing but an alibaba machine with a Haas control). Pathpilot is also easier to use, replacement parts are cheaper, etc. Haas isn't all sunshine and rainbows. We have a 2022 VF4SS with 4th axis...its a good machine but there are reasons why they aren't used at the elite level. For machines in the sub $50k bracket, the way you'd actually want them equipped and delivered, you have Syil, Tormach, or a completely stripped out China "Haas".
In aviation… everyone says never fly the A model…. They never mention that serial number 001 may be better for a competitor to have…. 😃
Looks like the Tormach is an awesome machine!
The A model Mooney, M20A, (1958) had wooden wings and tail… the M20B was all Aluminum… the M20J took a leap into composites with fiberglass cowling and wing tips… (mid 70s)
By the time they got to M20U… they moved up to composite skins on a small portion of the fuselage…. (2010s)
Team DarkAero has done a nice job of not repeating some of the old history….!
Go DarkAero!
😃
Coool. So, are you guys still building a plane? Is it ever going to fly?
I'm sure you built your plane from nothing but an idea in half the time 🙄
yeah yeah yeah - TURBO
You young men have created a program that is not only enjoyable, but very informative. With that being said, my greatest enjoyment is: you speak in complete sentences and don't say LIKE every third word.
Air Traffic Control? No, Automatic Tool Changer.
When will it fly ??
Its a good machine but at its price a haas vf1/2 or a syil x7 or x5 are 10x better
Your opinion. Maybe it meets their needs perfectly. Go buy you one of the others
Get a DMG Mori next
Looking for flight test data. Time to fly the bird
Nice video but Jesus is that 1500mx overpriced. The new super minimill a much better deal for not alot more way more capable.
I'm sure you're use to path pilot but it's so horribly priced id feel ripped off.
I'm sure you understand they got really good deal on it. The video is basically an ad.😂
Great to get updates though.
Oh yeah I knew that from the get go even 10k I wouldn't waste my money on it though.
I've been looking forward to the flight for months. Why don't you start flight testing yet? What would be the reason.
you can't possibly be that dumb... it will fly when it is ready to fly
given its price, it better make a good cappuccino too.
Darn, so not an upgrade to jet engine :)
TurbAero or TurboTech
You never want the first machine that is made.
An absolute beauty ! @Tormach you should show Europe they work great over here to, by sending 002 to me :P